BELFAST AIRPORT INTERNATIONAL

[BFS BHD]

No Problem GAZMO!

[BFS BHD]

More good news for BFS coming soon!

Graham Keddie ‏@grahamck63 4h4 hours ago
Nothing better than receiving a good news email to start the day @BelfastAirport

[West Brit]

Maybe he got a pay rise!

[GAZMO]

Maybe the third FR aircraft

[BFS BHD]

Jet2 made some changes today for Winter 16/17.

- Lanzarote operates 2 weekly all winter. Think some weeks it was only 1 weekly.

- Tenerife operates 2 weekly most of the winter, only 1 weekly for 3 weeks from 20th Dec 16 to 3rd Jan 17.

- Alicante operates all winter. 1 to 3 weekly flights.

- Faro starts early in February 2017 at 2 weekly flights.

- Palma starts 1st week in March 2017.

Looks like they are getting ready for Ryanair!

[GAZMO]

Jet2 LPA also increased. Original had gap for six weeks January to mid February now weekly throughout the year

[EI-BUD]

Jet2 certainly seem to have no fears of Ryanair!

[ILS25]

5,000 jobs for Belfast International if Heathrow expansion approved - The Irish News (http://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2016/05/19/news/5-000-jobs-for-belfast-international-if-heathrow-expansion-approved-526519/?param=ds441rif44T)

I love a good laugh now and again.

[GAZMO]

Yep.......didn't say when ........2050 ?
Agree good laugh

[panpanpanpan]

Think he may have a zero or two too many in that statement! If Aldergrove were to get 5000 new jobs alongside the other thousands that have been stated from the management team recently, that'll shut the job centres in Antrim anyway!

Out of curiosity, I wonder how many jobs are in place at Dublin airport?

[NWSRG]

5,000 jobs for Belfast International if Heathrow expansion approved - The Irish News

I love a good laugh now and again.

Very poor journalism, as seems to be the way today...the headline doesn't reflect the true content of the article. It actually suggests 5000 jobs for the province, not for Aldergrove. I'd still take that claim with a pinch of salt, but it's a lot more realistic than suggesting BFS would benefit to that tune!

[BFS BHD]

•Alicante – 12 additional flights with the Saturday flight now available throughout the year.

•Faro: 16 more flights, including February half term services.

•Gran Canaria: 6 additional flights with the weekly service now operating for the full season.

•Lanzarote: 9 additional flights with the Wednesday and Saturday flights now operating for the full season.

•Palma: 6 additional flights.

•Tenerife: 9 additional flights with the Tuesday and Friday flights now operating for the full season.

Even more winter sun for local holidaymakers | Belfa... (http://www.belfastairport.com/blog-news/2016/may/even-more-winter-sun-for-local-holidaymakers)

[BFS BHD]

MD of BFS has said this was the good news email that he got last week.

[AerRyan]

Palma operating somewhat into the winter now?

[BFS BHD]

Palma starts beginning of March instead of the end of March.

[peba]

Aer ryan,

What is the winter schedule for ryanair? Like what flights what days etc?
I presume it will be 3 ac by October and perhaps 4 for next summer.

[AerRyan]

Aircraft 1:
London-Gatwick, 4x daily

Aircraft 2:
Berlin 3x weekly- Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday 07:05-12:10

Milan 2x weekly -Wednesday, Saturday 6:20-11:55 (mostly off sale)

Wroclaw- 2x weekly. Monday, Friday 6:20-11:55

London Gatwick- Daily 12:35-15:50.

Alicante- 3x weekly. Monday, Wednesday, Friday. 16:40-23:10

Malaga- 4x weekly. Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday, Sunday 16:35-23;30

Unbased Aircraft
Lanzarote- 2 weekly. Monday, Friday

Warsaw- 2 weekly. Wednesday, Saturday

Gdansk- 2 weekly. Wednesday, Saturday

Krakow- 3 weekly. Tuesday, Thursday, Sunday

Tenerife- 2 weekly. Thursday, Monday

As seen from above, only 2 based aircraft this winter, several routes operating from other bases. Both aircraft are almost fully utilised (pending Milan)

[BFS BHD]

No break for the 2nd aircraft it will be doing the 5th LGW flight.

[AerRyan]

No break for the 2nd aircraft it will be doing the 5th LGW flight.

Oops, just noticed that. 2nd aircraft does the 12:35-15:50 rotation.

[GAZMO]

FR might hold the third aircraft until summer17. Difficult to see what winter routes will be profitable if they bring in in for October.
Are there still issues with the Milan route on the booking website?

[AerRyan]

The issue being you can't book it? Yes. I'd say it's reduced.

[BFS watcher]

Word on the street is that there is one more announcement from FR on the 3rd aircraft and this will be made by the end of June. Milan being off sale is a strange one FR still to give a proper reason although airport MD has said it is only temporary

[BFS Dude]

Could be nothing but BFS MD started following British Airways on Twitter. Done the same with Ryanair before they announced their routes from BFS.

[ESCNI]

Exhibit A, M'lud... https://twitter.com/grahamck63/following?lang=en ;)

Mind you, he does supposedly follow ~1,800 twitter accounts ... which must be somewhat time consuming!

[El Bunto]

What a mess of a Twitter account that is. "This is my personal twitter account" he states, and then humble-brags about being MD of BIA and loads the feed with work-related posts.

Perhaps he wouldn't need to follow so many other accounts if he actually kept it as his personal account and used his work account for.. work stuff. 'Work-life balance' it used to be called, probably has an edgier name now.

[mart901]

Some positive rumblings-
Air Passenger Duty: Finance Minister Máirtín Ó Muilleoir to seek review - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk (http://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/air-passenger-duty-finance-minister-mirtn-muilleoir-to-seek-review-34765391.html)

[ESCNI]

I notice that he's now following https://twitter.com/OldBelfast?lang=en

...wonder if he even realises it's a spoof account?

:rolleyes:

[cessnarocket]

These posts are getting worse!! Seems to me the MD is doing a good job and providing growth, and some folk on here are rather sore that egaa is fighting back.

This is not the place for personal attacks

[ESCNI]

Good grief ... does commenting on the number and composition of the people he follows on his Twitter account really constitute a personal attack?

[West Brit]

...wonder if he even realises it's a spoof account?

If that is not a personal attack, I don't know what is!!

[GAZMO]

Let's get back to the rumours!!
Is FR going to announce a third aircraft for the winter or not?

[AerRyan]

Not until at least summer 17.

[panpanpanpan]

My mad guess would be that the owners of Aldergrove don't really care how many twitter followers or whatever Mr Keddie has, if he continues to bring in fresh cash and attract new business then thats the important result!

Are Ryanair quietly backing a bit with the promises of massive expansion? Is it now "wait and see" as opposed to "umpteen aircraft and 50 destinations"?:hmm:

[AerRyan]

If anyone recalls my previous posts on this thread, I called it.

What Ryanair say and what Ryanair do are two entirely different things.

[BFS BHD]

Qatar Airways is considering lauching daily flights from BFS next year. Also starting from Dublin as well. Not sure I can see them operating from both airports.

Qatar Airways is also considering launching daily flights to Belfast in Northern Ireland, Al Baker said.

Qatar Airways to start flights to Las Vegas in January | GulfNews.com (http://gulfnews.com/business/aviation/qatar-airways-to-start-flights-to-las-vegas-in-january-1.1839737#.V1FhImYQzLQ.twitter)

[GAZMO]

Would be great to see any of the big three middle eastern airlines coming to Belfast

[AerRyan]

Won't happen.

[AerRyan]

I'm sure my comment will be a pure dealbreaker for Qatar.

[EI-BUD]

Interesting write up about Qatar, I hope it happens. Though suggesting that Belfast would be the place where there IAG relations operate from is the red herring obviously. Bhd can't be reached from Doha even if on 319. Even if BA were at BFS I fail to see synergies or alignment, as both would fly only East from Belfast... Unless Qatar were to do a one stop to US via Belfast...

[eastern wiseguy]

Would there be any opportunities for freight operations?

[GAZMO]

EI BUD interesting suggestion maybe one stop to west coast of USA!!!

[OltonPete]

I hope it starts quicker than the BHX service from the date of the first date the CEO went to the press!!!!!!!!!!!

NewsClips February (http://www.ms-uk.com/news-online/february06newsletter.html)

You have to scroll down to item 12 - The original article was in ABTN 2006 so it only took 10 years. The CEO also announced it again some years later and again nothing for years. I suppose he did come good eventually so maybe 2026?

Pete

[SecondDog]

Would there be any opportunities for freight operations?

Must be some. Emirates had a look round the big cargo unit a few weeks back.

[El Bunto]

TCX A321 took a whack from airstairs this morning, fair play to Thomas Cook for dialling-up Titan and paying the cash to get a sub arranged. Heading-out six hours late to Dalaman but at least they're going.

Edit: B763 G-POWD doing the sub. A bit roomier than their TCX counterparts!

[SecondDog]

TCX A321 took a whack from airstairs this morning, fair play to Thomas Cook for dialling-up Titan and paying the cash to get a sub arranged. Heading-out six hours late to Dalaman but at least they're going.

Edit: B763 G-POWD doing the sub. A bit roomier than their TCX counterparts!

Thats a bit of a nightmare weekend for MT. Had to use a sub for that aircraft on Sun then it gets bashed today? Yikes

[BFS BHD]

Are Virgin Atlantic planning on increasing Orlando for S17?

[NWSRG]

Are Virgin Atlantic planning on increasing Orlando for S17?

Apparently going twice weekly...not sure if they are extending the season at all though.

[Husky One]

Twice a week for a 4 week period during the 'NI Holidays'

[GAZMO]

Good news surprised it hasn't been posted on BFS website

[SecondDog]

Good news surprised it hasn't been posted on BFS website

Official announcements always run behind the gossip. Will have to wait and see.

[El Bunto]

Cityjet's Superjet diverted in last night due to fog in Dublin; not sure if that was because it's not Cat II rated yet or if they just haven't reached that stage of training.

Nothing about it on official airport channels but should be departing mid-morning if you fancy a gander.

Update: departed around noon.

[GAZMO]

Looks like a shuttle service to Nice in the morning?
Good luck to the NI team

[True Blue]

Any news yet from the airport on what the pax numbers were like for last month? Caa seems to have gone to sleep.

[BFS BHD]

Looking on Thomson Lakes and Mountains website it appears they will be operating to Verona two times a week instead of just one a week like this summer.

Operates Wednesdays & Saturdays in Summer 2017. Both Same times.

Lands 14:45 and departs 15:35.

[BFS BHD]

Not sure if any April passenger stats have been posted here but according to this news article BFS handled over 400,000 passengers in April up 16%.

First Trust lands Belfast International Airport airport as new client - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/news/first-trust-lands-belfast-international-airport-airport-as-new-client-34820598.html)

[GAZMO]

.......and probably record numbers in June with all the football fans

[mart901]

All positive. I believe several carriers up especially ezy domestic and UA.

[SecondDog]

The 744 due to position in tomorrow circa 1000 (Local) for any of you who want a peep. STD 1235.

[GAZMO]

Virgin have confirmed doubling of flights for summer 17. On BFS website

[mart901]

Great news GAZMO thanks for sharing

[BFS BHD]

More good news, Milan-Bergamo is back on sale for Ryanair! :)

[GAZMO]

Took them long enough. Hopefully bookings will start to flow on that route

[BFS101]

Took them long enough. Hopefully bookings will start to flow on that route

Just had a look, and the majority of the flights are a complete bargain, certainly in October. Wonder is this a consequence of now trying to get bums on the seats??

Most flights appear to be under £20, some £7.77 single!!!

[BFS BHD]

Looks like Ryanair are adding extra flights to Warsaw, Lanzarote, Malaga and Tenerife over the Christmas and New Year Holidays.

[GAZMO]

Bookings must be going well!!
Although on web don't appear to be book able yet

[West Brit]

Today saw the second departure to Orlando with VS. If the flights are weekly I would expect to see an arrival in to BFS tomorrow morning (Friday). Does anyone know if & when the first VS Orlando return flight is due?

[BFS BHD]

Easyjet announced new routes from other airports today but nothing for Belfast. I thought a few months ago there was talk of another route think it was a ski route to be announced by EZY. I'm guessing its not happening anymore?

[El Bunto]

Does anyone know if & when the first VS Orlando return flight is due?

Virgin Orlando holidays are on two-week cycles, first return due 8th July VIR162 at 07:25

[West Brit]

Virgin Orlando holidays are on two-week cycles, first return due 8th July VIR162 at 07:25

Thanks for that. So there are weekly departures but 1 week
stays not an option with Virgin Holidays.

[GAZMO]

Maybe solar powered aircraft next at BFS!!!

Belfast International Airport gets ?green? power fro... (http://www.belfastairport.com/blog-news/2016/july/belfast-international-airport-gets-green-power-from-ni-s-first-solar-farm)

[GAZMO]

From BFS website 16% increase in pax each month for last two months........still waiting on caa stats!!!
Airport ready for ?a summer like no other? | Belfast... (http://www.belfastairport.com/blog-news/2016/july/airport-ready-for-a-summer-like-no-other)

[GAZMO]

Dubrovnik now starting on wb 10th April 2017, two weeks earlier than previously announced

[True Blue]

In the press release linked above, he says there will be than a dozen new names on the departure board summer 2017. More expansion to come?

[BFS BHD]

Gatwick April stats are out. Dosn't seem to be any others out yet.

Gatwick passengers numbers where 73,197 up 84% from 39,839 in 2015.

[EI-BUD]

That is an incredible statistic, the busiest months with Flybe and Aer Lingus from BHD and EasyJet ex BFS on the Gatwick routes combined digs not reach that high! Very good indeed! And not a million. Miles from the performance on the Dublin Gatwick this time last year...

[True Blue]

I did post the April increase to Lgw back in May on this thread.

[BFS watcher]

Good to hear BFS back in the top 10 after the April CAA stats. Am hearing the June figures are stellar with LGW pax close to 80K.

[panpanpanpan]

Credit where its due to Aldergrove management and marketing departments, at least they seem capable of closing deals and growing the business. Perhaps Harbour might want to try and get a slice of the pie before its all gone.:\

[stab3.5up]

Funny you should mention that but the jungle drums or at least in East Belfast the Lambeg Drums are that a new operator is to start domestic flights from BHD. No airlines mentioned

[DC9_10]

Would it be Loganair or Stobart operating for Flybe. If it's a new airline, I would suggest they will need very deep pockets, unless they are flying to the likes of Doncaster Humberside Teeside and Swansea and maybe Norwich or maybe it is Stobart to Carlisle.

[EI-BUD]

Perhaps Stobart to Carlisle...
Not many operators left to chose from. Bmi regional (though unlikely), or else Flybe off loading some flights/ routes on existing routes to franchise partner(s)?

[Startledgrapefruit]

Perhaps Stobart to Carlisle...
Not many operators left to chose from. Bmi regional (though unlikely), or else Flybe off loading some flights/ routes on existing routes to franchise partner(s)?

The jungle drums I have heard is that it is a new airline to city and not props.

[stab3.5up]

That would be the most logical explanation

[eastern wiseguy]

The way pax figures are going at BFS it would seem logical to surmise that a once or twice a day flight from BHD to Carlisle isn't going to cause them a huge amount of grief. BTW I believe there is still a thread on Belfast City...perhaps you should post this there?

They have an interesting discussion going on about their coffee stand.

[cuthere]

They have an interesting discussion going on about their coffee stand.

You're in America, so good coffee is likely a distant memory.....as distant as the very, very similar discussions that were held on this very thread about retail units. Retail/refreshments - both part of the airport experience, no?

Anyway. Good to see the FR bounce on LGW. However, like all things bouncy, there's a down motion at some point. It'll be interesting to see when that is.

[eastern wiseguy]

both part of the airport experience, no?



Yes...but in the context of BFS .

This speculation should be moved to the appropriate thread.

[EI-A330-300]

So will will Wizz be in part or fully departing from BFS :rolleyes:

[Startledgrapefruit]

So will will Wizz be in part or fully departing from BFS :rolleyes:

Not too far down the road maybe 😃

[mart901]

Why do we believe wizz will depart in part or otherwise from BFS?

[EI-A330-300]

Why do we believe wizz will depart in part or otherwise from BFS?

Yield is about to take a nose dive ala Cork, I would give them until March or October 2017 at the latest.

Why on earth were BFS thinking when discussing those routes with FR anyway Brexit will likely put a complete stop to them in the coming years.

[DC9_10]

Don't think Wizz will be going anywhere especially BHD. Good healthy loads and comparing BFS to ORK, not even gonna go their.

[EI-A330-300]

Don't think Wizz will be going anywhere especially BHD. Good healthy loads and comparing BFS to ORK, not even gonna go their.

With fares that can't even cover APD, KTW yield is tumbling just look at forward fares....they had similar healthy loads ex Cork.

BTW when I said leave I mean out of NI not to BHD.

[DC9_10]

3 of us flew to KTW 6 weeks ago Rammed out and back. Cheap fare out andmore expensive coming back and with the add ons worked out at £127 return each. Base fare isn't really a indicator anymore especially when the so called lo cos are charging for everything else.

[mart901]

O'Leary is the grand hyperbole general. The amount of rubbish he spouts is criminal. Anyhow there is an opportunity to make money from a uk airport he will be there. People will still fly brexit or no brexit, and airlines will capitalise on it. Even if FR don't base aircraft in UK airports it won't stop them operating in such an enormous market, they would be foolish not to and would only help the competition. The UK will be looking to grow financially now, just look at the 12.5% business tax coming to NI and the 15% tax for the rest of the UK....thats the way it will rock.

[EI-A330-300]

3 of us flew to KTW 6 weeks ago Rammed out and back. Cheap fare out andmore expensive coming back and with the add ons worked out at £127 return each. Base fare isn't really a indicator anymore especially when the so called lo cos are charging for everything else.

Yes not a good base however come back in a few months and you will see.

O'Leary is the grand hyperbole general. The amount of rubbish he spouts is criminal. Anyhow there is an opportunity to make money from a uk airport he will be there. People will still fly brexit or no brexit, and airlines will capitalise on it. Even if FR don't base aircraft in UK airports it won't stop them operating in such an enormous market, they would be foolish not to and would only help the competition. The UK will be looking to grow financially now, just look at the 12.5% business tax coming to NI and the 15% tax for the rest of the UK....thats the way it will rock.

Well will Osborne have a job in September.....it's just a panic reaction to calm the waters. I will be surprised if it happens and any change will completely depend on what EU agreement they come away with as 15% tax and not been able to do x, y or z in EU market is worthless. Tax experts predict it will damage any benefit to NI of 12.5% rate.

Brexit will cause a more centralized route network to Eastern Europe by all carriers if movement is capped.

[Geekie]

I'm sure this will have been mentioned before, but it's ridiculous that the Causeway Lounge closes at 9:15pm. The usual Sunday night departure board filled with red means that lots of flights aren't leaving until after 10 now. Even if there were no delays, there are still scheduled departures until 9:55pm.

[True Blue]

So BFS - Lgw up by 103% against June 2015. About 81000 pax. Impressive growth and further evidence for me that Ezy has been restricting growth in the past.

[BFS BHD]

Wow that's some increase!

Any rumours for any new routes or airlines?

[EI-BUD]

True Blue,
I'd agree about the restricting growth, but I'd also say the sheer level of ridiculously low pricing by FR is stimulating demand to quite an extent, bring a value carrier as opposed to a low cost carrier, easyJet would never get into this space. Quite a few may well have opted to travel on impulse, for day trip, short breaks etc. The pricing FR have had on especially during the first 3 months have been cheaper than easyJet staff travel.. At 9.99, a nice bargain...

EI-BUD

[mart901]

Definitely EI-BUD, I can tell you several people who have, another benefit being EZY have cheaper fares now into LON, even EI are a bit cheaper.

[BFS BHD]

When does Ryanair normally put Summer schedules up for S17??

[FRatSTN]

Based on the last 2 or 3 years probably around September time widely, although the first few bases possibly during late August.

[BFS BHD]

Thanks FRatSTN :)

[GAZMO]

Two UA flights to Newark tomorrow. Anyone know reason for additional flight

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Today's went tech.

[BFS BHD]

Ryanair starting to release S17 flights from other airports. Hopefully BFS will follow soon. :)

[GAZMO]

....and maybe the third based aircraft?

[Waldo1]

They would be better getting existing routes bedded in before throwing more at the knobby NI public that can't see past benidorm...

[GAZMO]

Looks like third FR aircraft is going to be based at BFS next year going by article on website
?Nothing succeeds like success? | Belfast Internatio... (http://www.belfastairport.com/blog-news/2016/july/nothing-succeeds-like-success)

[BFS BHD]

I see on NI Travel News website Travel Solutions are increasing their Summer Program for Summer 2017 to Bulgaria.

Belfast-based tour operator Travel Solutions has announced an expansion in their summer 2017 programme to Bulgaria.

Managing Director, Peter McMinn, stated: "Following on from our successful winter ski programme to The Balkans, we are extremely pleased to announce that for summer 2017 we will increase capacity from Belfast."

He continued: “Our Sunny Beach programme is selling well above expectations and for 2017 we will increase the number of holidays on offer by 70 per cent. In addition we will introduce new family friendly properties, offer free child places for early bookers, and as an added bonus, increase customers checked baggage allowance by 30 per cent.”

The Summer 2017 is on sale now.

Increase in Summer Programme to Bulgaria (http://nitravelnews.com/news-stories/1984-increase-in-summer-programme-to-bulgaria.html)

[GAZMO]

Wonder if they will extend the season or just put on larger aircraft?

[GAZMO]

At long last full stats on line from CAA for April
Growth in all domestic routes. Large percentage increase in EWR, AMS and the Canary Islands
As previously reported pax up 16%

[mart901]

And yet of all EWR scrapped throughout Feb 2017

[BFS watcher]

Hearing BFS management have had enough of Flybe emergencies diverting and blocking the runway. Saw the mess on the ramp today of hydraulic oil on the stand they went to, BFS Ops team complaining spillage not even reported by Flybe engineers.

[owenc]

EWR is three times weekly in February.

[mart901]

Really pleased you are right....yesterday it was coming up unavailable from early Jan until March

[Startledgrapefruit]

Hearing BFS management have had enough of Flybe emergencies diverting and blocking the runway. Saw the mess on the ramp today of hydraulic oil on the stand they went to, BFS Ops team complaining spillage not even reported by Flybe engineers.

If I may bring myself down the petty level of the "BFS fanclub" BFS management did spearhead the campaign to stop the lengthening of the city runway and also declared themselves first preference for emergency diversions on a newspaper article

[SecondDog]

If I may bring myself down the petty level of the "BFS fanclub" BFS management did spearhead the campaign to stop the lengthening of the city runway and also declared themselves first preference for emergency diversions on a newspaper article

Perhaps the sentiment is toward the frequency of the Flybe events and lack of communication described above as opposed to their willingness to handle emergencies. Seems like a fair enough notion to me from the business viewpoint. But then this is the BFS thread so we should probably just try to get it down to the usual level as quickly as possible just so we can fill loads of pages with people's 'expert' opinion.

[Waldo1]

Does bfs get to charge any airline who have to land like this, for emergencies, for curfews etc? No one does business for nothing so I'm sure they do...so why would they complain about additional revenue? Or Is this just a complete made up yarn?...same Aldo applies to the clean up often oil spill...u do not just wash that into the drains, you deploy the hazardous spill kit, bring in the professionals, stick a hefty mark up on the cost and invoice flybe...again, additional income! Bingo, the jobs a gudun

[BFS BHD]

Ryanair S17 will be on sale soon apparently. I see ALC and AGP going daily and possibly PMI & FAO added and a few others.

[Una Due Tfc]

Once an aircraft commander declares emergency, where the plane goes is his/her call, BFS cannot say no

[Waldo1]

Instead of just replicating aer lingus and easy jet routes, what about a few different ones...paphos, Heraklion, Corfu etc etc

[BHD2BFS]

It's all good and well suggesting routes but I think we all know by now is that NI folk just seem to want their Spanish bucket and spade routes, and that's what will return the best LF and yields

[stab3.5up]

I am afraid the average joe in norn iron is a creature of habit. When they go on holidays they want the same old same old as they had last year. I doubt there are enough people in NI to support any curve ball routes unfortunately

[ESCNI]

How about Lisbon?

Good year round location ... with lots of 'bucket and spades' beaches too.

[West Brit]

I am afraid the average joe in norn iron is a creature of habit. When they go on holidays they want the same old same old as they had last year. I doubt there are enough people in NI to support any curve ball routes unfortunately

The arrogance is unreal. The fact is that with previously cheaper options south of the border and routes to every corner of Europe, people from NI will fly from Dublin. Within my social circle I could count probably 20 people (40 seats) travelling to Lisbon/Copenhagen/Toronto/Geneva from Dublin this year, and that's just the ones who have disclosed their airport choice.

With the pound vs euro the way it is at the moment, I wonder if Dublin is as cheap on similar destinations served from Belfast thinking New York? Also I wonder if Belfast is proving tempting to Southerners on a price comparison with Dublin. (Sorry Dubliners don't travel to Palma, Malaga etc as they are so sophisticated)

[stab3.5up]

They just go to Ballymena in the Sun

[stab3.5up]

They just go to Ballymun in the Sun

[canberra97]

Your comment was so humourous you had to post it twice, not bad for the first post of the day!

[BFS BHD]

I see the MD of BFS was at Ryanairs HQ today. S17 announcement due soon maybe?

[El Bunto]

I am afraid the average joe in norn iron is a creature of habit.Yet Easyjet seems to be sustaining Keflavik, for example, despite being a completely new route to somewhere even colder than Katesbridge and with competition starting later with WOW from Dublin.

Seems that the average joe in NI is a lot more adventurous than the average stereotyper thinks.

[waffler]

Probably the cast and crew of Game of Thrones keeping this route going.

[AIRPORT66]

The flight on Wednesday to Keflavik had 152 pax outbound and 148 inbound its still doing pretty well.

[cuthere]

With so many experts and people in know on here I'm amazed this slipped under the radar:

United Airlines: Rescue deal agreed to save Belfast to New York service - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-37060489)

Still. £9m well spent no doubt. Im looking forward to the outcry regarding taxpayers' money being wasted etc etc.

[owenc]

The route is performing pretty well this year? What do United want? 95% load factor?

Anytime i've flown United it's been pretty full. Perhaps low loads in winter are having an impact.

Load factor recently..
Today: 99%
Yesterday: 93%
Wednesday: 87%
Saturday: 92%
Sunday: 91%

[AerRyan]

The route is performing pretty well this year? What do United want? 95% load factor?

Anytime i've flown United it's been pretty full.

Maybe a meaningful load factor? Yield? Seriously have you ignored everything you've 'learned' on this forum. With the impact of brexit, weak routes will be chopped and cut, look at NCL for example.

[owenc]

This year so far they have carried around 21,000 passengers which is an improvement to last year.

It doesn't have the low load factors that Newcastle would have.

[cuthere]

Owen, did you read the article? The route was getting binned in two weeks. That would strongly suggest to me that it was either not making any money, or the money if was making was considered not large enough to justify the route continuing. Now, if they're being given £3m a year to keep it going, one could surmise that figure is around what it takes to make it viable.

As AerRyan says, it can be full every day of the week, but unless the yield is sufficiently high, then it'll be scrapped.

[owenc]

Owen, did you read the article? The route was getting binned in two weeks. That would strongly suggest to me that it was either not making any money, or the money if was making was considered not large enough to justify the route continuing. Now, if they're being given £3m a year to keep it going, one could surmise that figure is around what it takes to make it viable.

As AerRyan says, it can be full every day of the week, but unless the yield is sufficiently high, then it'll be scrapped.

Stats have improved this year, they introduced winter flights again so you will see passenger numbers rise. Look on CAA site.

[cuthere]

Owen, where on the CAA stats pages (which have nothing past April by the way), does it list yield?

[owenc]

https://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/CAA/Content/Standard_Content/Data_and_analysis/Datasets/Airport_stats/Airport_data_2016_04/Table_12_1_Intl_Air_Pax_Traffic_Route_Analysis_PDF.pdf

[cuthere]

Why have you posted that link?

[owenc]

That's what you asked for, Cuthere.

[cuthere]

Read my question again Owen. WHERE DOES IT LIST YIELD?!

[ILS25]

More profit utilising AC elsewhere. Simple.

[PPRuNeUser0176]

A rescue deal has been agreed to prevent US airline United ending its daily service between Belfast and New York. Financial assistance, believed to be in the region of £9m over three years, will be provided. Most of the money is coming from Stormont. The BBC has established United was set to axe the route next month, believing its aircraft could be more profitably used elsewhere.

The managing director of Belfast International Airport, Graham Keddie, said: "Two weeks ago we had lost it. "It was a Northern Ireland team effort to get it back."

Economy Minister Simon Hamilton said the rescue package had the backing of the executive. "It is public money being spent to ensure we keep this very important route in place," said Mr Hamilton.

He said the route was crucial to attracting US-inward investment.

Northern Ireland politicians lobbied their counterparts in the US as part of the effort to have United re-think its initial decision.

DUP MP for North Antrim Ian Paisley said: "Losing this route would have been a blow to the prestige of Northern Ireland. "Imagine the outcry if this had been lost." The Ulster Unionist MP for South Antrim, Danny Kinahan, added: "This is an excellent example of what can be achieved when political differences can be put aside."


United Airlines: Rescue deal agreed to save Belfast to New York service - BBC News (http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-37060489)

Using 9 million and it operating every single day over 3 years that's over 8,200 per day.

[owenc]

United Airlines: Rescue deal agreed to save Belfast to New York service - BBC News (http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-37060489)

Using 9 million and it operating every single day over 3 years that's over 8,200 per day.
Isn't it 3x weekly in winter months? I can't see there being much demand for daily winter flights.

[cuthere]

Wow. I am genuinely surprised by the lack of comment from the usual critics of every other airport on this island. Oh. Hang on. No I'm not. Pathetic. As I've been saying for years on here, a lot of those who adore BFS are hypocrites, and silence on this proves it.

Of course, we shouldn't forget the £2.4m a year it costs the tax payer to cover APD for this, and the scant other trans-Atlantic routes. I wonder how this news is going down in Emirates HQ. After all, they should be announcing their new EGAA-OMDB route....ANY.....DAY.....NOW.

[EI-BUD]

Cuthere,
Why are you surprised? I am guessing that United are doing ok on the BFS EWR (obviously without specific inside knowledge), but potentially see Dublin as way more profitable/ attractive for deployment of the daily rotation, while still possibly gaining most of the NI originating passengers. Dublin offers the potential to feed to Star partner airlines like SAS, Lufthansa, Turkish, Swiss, Ethopian, not to mention the great level of business traffic that the Dublin area brings.

Dublin has seen as we all know an amazing growth and sparkling performance in terms of Transatlantic expansion and growth, nonetheless, I hope NI can sustain its link to the US. I could see Norwegian being a good match for the market.

The downside of this subvention is that it could prohibit other airlines from join the market, as they would be expecting similar treatment....

[cuthere]

Hi EI-BUD. I'm not remotely surprised.

Everything you say makes perfect sense. Speaking of sense, hopefully this news will focus the minds of those who a) thought that BFS was in for a bonanza of international routes, and b) the minds of those who inexplicably described Brexit as an "opportunity".

[SecondDog]

Hi EI-BUD. I'm not remotely surprised.

Everything you say makes perfect sense. Speaking of sense, hopefully this news will focus the minds of those who a) thought that BFS was in for a bonanza of international routes, and b) the minds of those who inexplicably described Brexit as an "opportunity".

It would have been kept quiet if it wasn't too good a back slapper for our politicians to give themselves. (Despite the folks on the London side of things doing a lot of the work)

You say you are waiting for the pro BFS posters to comment on the BFS thread. If you only come to do a bit of negative assessment, perhaps that is just as much of the NI aviation scene's problem as the people you are baiting?

I think it is obvious that United thought they could improve their lot one way or the other and were proved correct. Everything else is just others trying to boost their agenda.

[True Blue]

Cuthere, like there are no risks in remaining? You know the great thing about capitalism, it goes where there is money to be made. And that includes doing business in the UK if there is money to be made there even if we are out of the EU. And it also includes Ryanair, regardless of what they say now.

[cuthere]

True Blue, I won't list the many, many negatives already apparent post the Brexit vote, and the U.K. hasn't even left yet. I'll instead leave you to list all the immediate benefits. I wish you luck, as even the head of the DEFEATED pro-Brexit vote in NI, good old Arlene, has signed a letter begging for the same benefits for NI as were available pre-referendum.

Still. Those who wish to live in denial will live in denial. You thought Easy "restricted" capacity before? Wake up. Smell the future.

[Una Due Tfc]

So United threatened to cut the route a couple of years ago, were given an exemption from APD.

United threatened to cut the route this year, have been given £3 million a year.

I wonder if they'll threaten to cut it again 2 years from now.....

[owenc]

So United threatened to cut the route a couple of years ago, were given an exemption from APD.

United threatened to cut the route this year, have been given £3 million a year.

I wonder if they'll threaten to cut it again 2 years from now.....
At that point I'd suggest dropping the route.

[SecondDog]

At that point I'd suggest dropping the route.

And you would be as wrong then as those whining about spending public money now. People really are clueless as to what goes on in business life here never mind aviation

[mart901]

whatever way you want to look at it aviation is a ruthless business like banking, retail, hospitality etc etc. Brexit may or may not be a partial factor but every airline represented at Bfs has played games before to get their way, FR being the most well known at playing airports one against the other and blagging subsidies. It's fairly common nowadays for airlines to seek funding for routes and government to offer subsidies to gain/keep them. As has been stated DUB is seeing big growth and BFS will probably need every assistance in getting transatlantic flights to come and stay. As is often the case their is a negative response on here but I reckon stormont has done us well, I can't imagine if there was a queue of airlines they would have committed to such a deal, we now have 3 years guaranteed service during which time other routes and carriers can be attracted.

[EGAC is Better]

Having read all the comments about the subsities this route now attracts its fair to say bravo to United Airlines, who played a commercial 'A' game.

It now costs the public purse over £5m per year to sustain this service. Reading the reported 'load factor' numbers mentioned above suggests there is no shortage of takers for seats either. I understand yield and this leads me to these conclusions. Either:

A) United played the game and knew a threat to pull the service would end this way thus increasing even further their profit; or
B) Its an admission by United that operating the B757 transatlantic services just doesn't make enough money to make them worthwhile. NCL has clearly suffered and other UK regional airports have done so in the past.

I'm very much in the A camp on this but if there is a hint of B being true, other airports need to start worrying. United are fast approaching a period whereby it will become upgauge or die. Once the B757 starts to be retired (early 2020's at this stage) they have no suitable aircraft to continue the 'thin' transatlantic routes.

[josechung]

I'll have to admit that I have mixed feeling about the UA story..

Im due to fly with them in November and if they had pulled out I would have been screwed, also as someone with 100k UA miles at least now I know I have 3 years to use them.

However, I do question the £3 million price tag. UA knows they had NI over a barrel and seem to have played their hand well. What's not clear is what they are supposed to spend it on (someone on twitter mentioned advertising for the BFS route).

[gopaisleygo]

Don't expect too much more advertising, they (UA) have generic programmes albeit tailored to a specific market.
Along with the Newcastle story, this Belfast "marketing support" lol, proves these thin routes are not necessary. Money goes straight to HQ and they'll ditch it when they want to. It simply proves that BFS is unprofitable - maybe give pensioners free flight passes, NI gov paying for it anyways!!
Oh, and btw, have to ask what their UK sales guys are up to? First ncl, now this ? Laurels, rest, arse and fat spring to mind haa haa

[stab3.5up]

What a disgusting waste of money. This madness must be stopped. If it's not working it's not working. Will this end with the airport paying passengers to use the New York service. It's different giving a deal to get a route off the ground so to speak but when you are flogging a dead donkey stop with the hand outs.

[owenc]

I'm still not sure if I agree with the idea that the route was unprofitable.

They knew Stormont would cave in if they suggested terminating the route.

[panpanpanpan]

On face value this seems a strange arrangement, surely this opens up the whole problem of "what about me" from other airlines and indeed other airports!

The bribe has been paid to keep the UA going, in the meantime what happens the cash that Aldergrove will make on the back of it? If these flights are running with high load factors then that is a lot of people parking cars, buying items within the airport etc. Will there be some sort of clawback in order to try and mitigate some of the cash?:confused:

As has been mentioned, well done to the United commercial dept!:D

[mart901]

The route is profitable according to the BBC, and it's been in growth all year. UA can make more money using the aircraft on US domestic where they can turn it round more times and no doubt attract more business pax, the harsh realities of business. There is now a 3 year window of opportunity to build the route and/or attract other routes/carriers.

[owenc]

So the route IS profitable.

[EI-BUD]

EGAC,
Interesting read your two scenarios. I'd add a third scenario.
C) the route under indexes in terms of business class passengers compared to their other routes on the Atlantic. Add no onward connectivity at BFS to UK and Europe. There are opportunities redeploy the unit to another route, while probably collecting many of the regular high value customers ex Dublin, like the poster who is a frequent flier with a large account of miles.

The 757 is a superb aircraft and very cost effective as has been well demonstrated to date. Its very discovery as suitable for TA ops has opened opportunities for UA, not just in on thin routes but on multi frequency routes. The airbus 321 neo will emerge as the replacement with a number of airlines. Then consolidation will play is part too.

The US is down to a few major carriers now after decades of losses and often a real lack of commercial reality. Now they are away from chapter 11 and must operate on a commercial basis. This will see them seek value for money and return on investment, so other airports may just feel the effects of this.

Less airlines means the airports are generally in a weaker position as airports don't have a lot of plan B options should airlines decide to pull out...

[EGAC is Better]

Very interesting point on the business class uptake EI-BUD. I did wonder how many of those seats leave empty.

In total agreement on the capability of the 757. The admission I talk about is exactly what you said, that it can be used more profitably elsewhere. Eg 3 or 4 hub to hub sectors per day internally within the USA. Couple this with the shift of a large amount of Atlantic flying transitioning to B767-300 out of EWR, its certainly seems United would prefer to use the 75's elsewhere.

An interesting point on the 321neo is that United have shown no interest whatsoever. Infact probably the opposite having ordered 100 737MAX9's which by all accounts so far don't have the capability to replace 757's across the Atlantic.

I suppose in the longer term the writing is on the wall for this service if it stays as is. In reality this £9m is just a stop gap while BFS and Stormont try to beg someone else to take on the route when United scarper.

[DC9_10]

Cannot understand why Brussels Airlines chose BHD when UA already fly to BFS and are the same alliance. Subsidy via tax payers funds maybe or fortunately for Mr Ambrose guaranteed by aunty Arlene. On the subject of subsidy, how much taxpayers money was given to KLM for the new AMS route. A route already served from Belfast. How much taxpayers money in total so far has been spent keeping LDY open. Glass Houses springs to mind.

[El Bunto]

A risky precedent set by the Executive to support a thin route that perhaps shuoldn't exist, in contrast to reaching elsewhere in North America or perhaps Mid-Eastwards. And if BA started 'pondering' again about more profitable use of their Heathrow slots or aircraft, would the Executive be able to find another £9 million to help them think it over...?

Re: KLM and Brussels, agreed that money was rather shiftily moved to them via public agencies but those are route-development funds just like UAL had many years ago. If they come back looking for more money after that then I think we can draw a parallel, but not before.

[DC9_10]

The AMS route was already developed. So why did KLM get route development funding. Why has LDY had tens of millions over the years of tax payers money on a vanity project that will never make a profit as a stand alone business. United,as a few suggested, had Stormont over a hoop and they caved in. It's probably the most profitable transatlantic 757 route now.

[SecondDog]

The AMS route was already developed. So why did KLM get route development funding. Why has LDY had tens of millions over the years of tax payers money on a vanity project that will never make a profit as a stand alone business. United,as a few suggested, had Stormont over a hoop and they caved in. It's probably the most profitable transatlantic 757 route now.

Brussels/KLM got money from Tourism Ireland in the form of advertising support (route development funds by any other name). They went to the City because that is where the chair of TI works (possibly)

UA just played a smart game given the political situation here allows things like this to happen.

LDY is another political entity which will carry on because the NW is such a remote spot currently and the local council can't afford the bad press of winding it up

The 757 really does do fine from BFS. Plus it gives a local link to all the American businesses that we have funded to come here too. We cant afford to let it go. It really is that simple.

[EI-BUD]

Pardon my spelling mistakes within my last post. This is what happens when I type fast from a mobile device and predictive text gets to work - and i don't recheck! corrected now.

DC9, very interesting commentary and when collectively summed up in one post, it is so clear the level of funds being granted to airlines and the level of subventions being paid to airports.

The question is, does the taxpayer get value for money? In most cases, I guess not. KLM gives great connectivity through AMS, but the lions share of their passengers are connecting at AMS. In many if not most cases this will be at the cost of LHR as a connecting point ( and Dublin in some cases too). If the granting bodies want to incentivise the likes of KL and SN that is all fine and well, but they need to be mindful of their LHR link. It should not be taken for granted, all too many parts of the domestic networks ex LHR have been canned, like LPL, NQY, JER, IOM, MME, BHX. We can ask reason away why these happened, but they are gone, BA bailed before. The former routes unlikely to come back soon. Bmi for its own reasons axed GLA in its last years. So the situation can be fluid. My point is there is little value to the NI taxpayer paying KL to be here. BRU, now with Brexit, the same can be said. If there is commercial viability, give them the incentives on airport costs ( available to all new routes to all airlines), but not tax payers money!

I think that strategically NI needs to have a regalar link to the US, to NYC. We need to be open for business on a direct basis. So there is some value in supporting this route. Though the question is for his long. I believe that the market may be more akin to a Norwegian type operator, with lower costs.

Ultimately, a UK outside of the EU, the shackles may come off in terms of the rules and rigour by which subventions can be paid to airlines and airports. May we see much more of this in the future?

[mart901]

it's a two way street with BRU/AMS, and I'm sure EWR. My family were taking bets catching a flight back via BRU on how few people would be on board, it was nearly full, over 90% and hardly a local accent, like AMS loads of transfer pax and nearly all foreign tourists. I have to ask how they would arrive here if at all without such links being in place. EWR also is a good hub, I know plenty of people who have holidayed in Vegas and other cities and used the route - if it costs us to build/sustain such links maybe that's what needs done, people are asking for APD removal, its basically a more targeted version. Comparing EZY to KLM doesn't work, EZY being a point to point carrier with no connections, and BHD will be the choice of airport for business passenger focussed airlines for fairly obvious reasons.

[owenc]

Airliners.net Southern Irish members implying that Dublin airport is only a 90 minute drive for most of us and that it would be relatively painless flying via there.

They forget that you have to be at Dublin airport 3 hours earlier so that means you have to leave home at least 6 hours before the flight.

The last time I flew from Dublin, I had to rise around 2am for a 10am flight. Being 170+ miles away for many of us, Dublin airport is rarely a feasible option for those of us who live further into Northern Ireland.

I paid an extra £100 per person to fly from Belfast to EWR in June to avoid going via Dublin this year and that is a choice that I personally do not regret. It was well worth it to avoid getting up at the crack of dawn and trapsing down there.

[owenc]

it's a two way street with BRU/AMS, and I'm sure EWR. My family were taking bets catching a flight back via BRU on how few people would be on board, it was nearly full, over 90% and hardly a local accent, like AMS loads of transfer pax and nearly all foreign tourists. I have to ask how they would arrive here if at all without such links being in place. EWR also is a good hub, I know plenty of people who have holidayed in Vegas and other cities and used the route - if it costs us to build/sustain such links maybe that's what needs done, people are asking for APD removal, its basically a more targeted version. Comparing EZY to KLM doesn't work, EZY being a point to point carrier with no connections, and BHD will be the choice of airport for business passenger focussed airlines for fairly obvious reasons.
The only time I would fly via Dublin would be when going via California, Middle East or using the return dayflight from JFK. Flying to the East Coast of the United States is not worth the pain that the almost 400 mile return drive would cause.

Currency exchange rates are awful for the Euro now anyway so as users of Pound Sterling we would get less value for our money.

[StoneyBridge Radar]

Fuel is still relatively cheap today, yet United require state subsidy to maintain BFS on high 80's LF..?

Subsidies, no APD, cheap fares; even Durham Teeside could fill a 757 with that level of support.

Well played United; laughing all the way to the bank.

This must be the last life support injection for what seems more and more like a vanity project. Political meddling and fiscal irresponsibility on a grand scale.

If they go, they go; leave it Norwegian or their ilk once the 737MAXs or neos come on line.

[ATNotts]

What I want to know is how this "bribe" that has been handed to UA can possibly be legal under EU law; why the Welsh assembly wouldn't insist that Westminster sanction similar action to secure long haul out of Cardiff - and when the Irish Government is going to cry foul and complain to the European Commission.

Just to remind the (minority) who voted to leave the EU in NI; the UK is still a apart of the EU, and will remain to until at least the end of 2018 - subject to the same rules as we are now.

[DC9_10]

Totally agree you you EI-BUD. The NYC route needs to be maintained and UA are aware of that, therefore they played a game and won. Regarding EZY over KLM, dident a manager from KLM say the problem with the Belfast route was a very a low percentage of people were transferring and they need to get that up. I know from experience that quite a lot of transferring passengers use EZY as a fair few landing cards were always handed out when I operated them. As for SN, not many connecting options and stats speak for themselves.

[mart901]

ATNotts

I don't think the Irish government dare say a word about state assistance when it comes to airlines. EI, love them though I do wouldn't be around now if it wasn't for bailouts even despite the EU saying they were illegal, yet of all when the Hungarian government fell foul with Europe Malev was assisted into destruction. Plenty other enhancements offered to airlines, EI is being funded to land in Hartford Connecticut for instance, also several regional French airport's have offered subsidies to FR - the same airline that cried foul about EI.

[PPRuNeUser0176]

ATNotts

I don't think the Irish government dare say a word about state assistance when it comes to airlines. EI, love them though I do wouldn't be around now if it wasn't for bailouts even despite the EU saying they were illegal, yet of all when the Hungarian government fell foul with Europe Malev was assisted into destruction. Plenty other enhancements offered to airlines, EI is being funded to land in Hartford Connecticut for instance, also several regional French airport's have offered subsidies to FR - the same airline that cried foul about EI.

EI are not been funded in Hartford but they have been offered a guarantee that if EI cannot make a certain profit % over a few years they will pay them. If you ask me they will receive little if any of it.

By the way it does not require a Goverment to complain to the EC about it, any member of the public can raise it and the EC will look and investigate if appropriate.

I really don't think EI are worried at all about it, they will still continue to fill planes ex DUB with some NI pax. They didn't raise the APD cut with Europe when I expect they would have a good case given the ruling handed down to ROI about varied APD in a State.

EI packing in BFS has left a big chip on people's shoulder ;) If EI announced they would operate a NY route for the 9 million I expect people would be only delighted.

[mart901]

Well I actually think EI did the right thing moving to BHD but what you are saying about Hartford escapes the fact they will receive 5million USD worth of fee waivers and marketing support over 2 years. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, I'm proving a point that it's now common practice and airlines are working it to their advantage, in the same way businesses get start up support or tax incentives.

[DC9_10]

So EI did the right thing by moving to BHD. The base is closing with 1 unit nightstopping in winter. That sure is excellent progress.

[SecondDog]

So EI did the right thing by moving to BHD. The base is closing with 1 unit nightstopping in winter. That sure is excellent progress.

Aye, it baffles me that so many read the press releases and believe them.

[mart901]

EI lost the LGW route against their wishes. Running a crew base for 1 aircraft in winter doesn't make sense, it would be worth looking at SNN operation to see it can work with non based crew, they are cutting costs in the light of massive competition in the LON market. They have flights on sale from BHD well into summer 2017 and they don't announce summer sun from here until about Oct normally so I wouldn't engage in too much conjecture about the unknown, and it's also worth pointing out they lost millions at BFS, and to their credit tried a lot of route options.

[EI-A330-300]

EI lost the LGW route against their wishes. Running a crew base for 1 aircraft in winter doesn't make sense, it would be worth looking at SNN operation to see it can work with non based crew, they are cutting costs in the light of massive competition in the LON market. They have flights on sale from BHD well into summer 2017 and they don't announce summer sun from here until about Oct normally so I wouldn't engage in too much conjecture about the unknown, and it's also worth pointing out they lost millions at BFS, and to their credit tried a lot of route options.

Might be out before end of the months and AFAIK BHD is unchanged as pre loaded scheduled showed it!

[mart901]

Sorry for being ignorant, what's AFAIK?

[EI-A330-300]

As Far As I Know

[mart901]

I got it !

[Waldo1]

Sorry for being ignorant, what's AFAIK?
As far as I know

[cheesymark]

Anyone know what is up with DL161

Just noted it turning back and looking to be decending towards BFS

UPDATE: Looks to be headed to Dublin

[EI-A330-300]

Believe its medical divert

[El Bunto]

Just noted it turning back and looking to be decending towards BFS

UPDATE: Looks to be headed to Dublin
Yes, flew south right over Cookstown and ignored Belfast International. Can't say I'd be too happy as a medical case when the captain decided to fly another 150 miles past a suitable long, empty strip with access to a world-class health service.

[AerRyan]

The captain didn't "decide" to cause fly an extra 150 miles just to inconvenience the medical emergency, you do realise there's several factors in the mix right?

[speedrestriction]

Is it even 100 miles? An extra 12 minutes flight time which is probably offset by the proximity of Dublin Airport to its nearest major hospital.

[True Blue]

any news yet on what the traffic numbers were like for July?

[BFS BHD]

Milan Bergamo on sale for S17 for Ryanair nothing else showing yet. 2 weekly same days and times.

[El Bunto]

The captain didn't "decide" to cause fly an extra 150 miles just to inconvenience the medical emergency, you do realise there's several factors in the mix right?I guess we'll have to disagree on that point; in my opinion there are very few factors more important than attention for medical emergencies, especially not consideration of a company handling contract. But the crew follow their company instructions and we are forbidden to question.

Also a Heathrow-bound BA B744 diverted into Dublin yesterday due to crew running out of hours. There have been instances where BA crews were heard to say that they were under company instructions not to divert to Belfast. Why? Is Belfast excessively expensive? I'm trying to understand why Shannon and, more perplexingly, Dublin are preferred.

[Gulf Julliet Papa]

I think you will find the diverts have a lot to do with ground handling. Delta do not fly to BFS, so imagine the situation of emergency landing in BFS, ambulance waiting, and no one to attach stairs to the aircraft? (YES this does happen, you would be amazed!) Let alone re-fueling aircraft, new loadsheet, removal of bags, god forbid the crew go out of hours....etc etc etc

If you know you have all of these within 200nm then DUB was a good call.

Again with BA?!? Crew going out of hours, whats your best chance of making most of the delay to your passengers? Go to an airport where you or your partners do not operate to (BFS) or where you + partners have 19 daily flights to your crew base (DUB)

[EI-A330-300]

If it was a serious emergency such as risk to life Belfast would of been chosen but when it's not the airline will pick where is best.

The BA routing was to the south of DUB/SNN so BFS would never of been considered.

As for airlines not wanting to use a particular airport as Gulf Julliet Papa is correct but cost may also play a role as the chances are a diversion by BA to Belfast would cost a lot more as they are not regular operations but it's likely they will be charged normal fees at DUB applicable to B747.

[flyboy2008]

Irish Independent story (http://www.independent.ie/business/united-getting-effective-161-per-ticket-subsidy-on-belfastus-service-34974080.html) on the BFS United deal - £139 subsidy per return ticket.

[BFS watcher]

Oh yeah I see the Southerners are now complaining about the subsidies! What about the £7 billion they got from UK taxpayers (this equates to £1600 for every Southerner) or the US$9M Aer Lingus got from US taxpayers to operate Hartford or all the subsidies they have been throwing about for years......what a bunch of hypocrites.

[EI-A330-300]

Oh yeah I see the Southerners are now complaining about the subsidies! What about the £7 billion they got from UK taxpayers (this equates to £1600 for every Southerner) or the US$9M Aer Lingus got from US taxpayers to operate Hartford or all the subsidies they have been throwing about for years......what a bunch of hypocrites.

Two points:
The UK gets the money back, NI Goverment gets nothing from UA
UK didn't have to give the money but it was because of NI they did, would also use the words stones in glass houses as the English have been bailing you for for decades.

Take the divide aside 140 pounds per passenger is outrageous considering United will probally still charge another 250 odd on top so they could be banking 390 pounds each way, passengers flying out of Belfast are probally paying highest UK-NYC fares.

UA may have a point about making more on the B752's elsewhere however it very questionable. Question needs to be asked where should NI draw the line if they come back in 3 years. Would people support more money going to it? It won't stop the flow to Dublin.

[Una Due Tfc]

What about the £7 billion they got from UK taxpayers (this equates to £1600 for every Southerner) or the US$9M Aer Lingus

7 billion pounds is how much Westminster has to subsidise NI by every 70 weeks or so. UK is ROI's largest trading partner, ROI is UK's 5th largest, 2 billion a week in trade, it was in UK's interest to stabilise ROI economy as much as possible.

And the media were reporting EI could get up to 19 million dollars for Hartford depending on performance.

Now let's stop the Willy waving eh? I personally couldn't care less if your government are spending that much subsidising UA, I just hope you're getting value for money

[cuthere]

BFS-watcher. Cobblers. I'm a Northerner and I certainly don't support this waste of money. In fact an online poll carried out by one of the local rags (or was it Slugger O'Toole?) found 75% of people don't support the subsidy.

Setting aside the stupidly of wasting so much money (£5.4m) on one route. Here's a question for the hypocrites: how can you justify the funding of this subsidy for the 48,000 seats a year the route offers, but simultaneously claim the subventions for CoDA is a waste of taxpayers' money, despite it being a quarter of the United subsidy, but supporting 275,000-300,000 pax a year?

Also, if this route was operating from BHD (theoretically), would there be the support offered for it by BFS-watcher and the rest of the Alderdump cabal?

[EI-BUD]

Well said EI-330...and Una due..

NI has a proud tradition of taking outrageous handouts from Westminster, the figures are eye watering and unsustainable. Nobody in NI can give a lecture to the south on handouts... And in ROI's defence they have bounced back amazingly from one is the worst banking crisis that any country has ever seen.

Sadly, and nor wishing to start a debate, if UA 's NI airport had some proper interlining facilties, ie a Flybe codeshare or the like, there would be a sporting opportunity to feed the UK regional airports..

EI-BUD

[DC9_10]

FR are supposed to be looking at interlining with various long haul operators apparently. Maybe Star Alliance could be the choice in order to upset the IAG airlines at DUB. Possibly opening up an opportunity for UA at BFS. Unconfirmed but apparently three UK routes on the cards for FR at BFS. Not LPL but EMA is in the runners and riders list along with Stanstead. Also hearing Madrid and Charleroi thrice weekly.

[BFS BHD]

Any idea when Ryanair are to release S17 from BFS DC9_10??

[mart901]

MAD would be amazing

[GAZMO]

Maybe LISBON as well?

[AerRyan]

Next month.

[SecondDog]

FR are supposed to be looking at interlining with various long haul operators apparently. Maybe Star Alliance could be the choice in order to upset the IAG airlines at DUB. Possibly opening up an opportunity for UA at BFS. Unconfirmed but apparently three UK routes on the cards for FR at BFS. Not LPL but EMA is in the runners and riders list along with Stanstead. Also hearing Madrid and Charleroi thrice weekly.

Sounds like a great idea but I have heard (admittedly 3rd hand) also that aircraft three is on hold indefinitely. Will hedge my bets

[NWSRG]

Just seen a (USAF?) C17 approaching BFS, right over Kells...and at quite low level. Guessing no more than 2000ft.

A C130 approached in similar fashion a few weeks back. Perhaps some of our ATC colleagues could advise if this approach is normal? Seemed low...

[CCR]

Pretty hypocritical comments from BFS watcher. northern Ireland is subsidised to the hilt, with a public sector economy akin to a modern day East Germany.

[BFS BHD]

Looking on easyJets website it looks like Gatwick will increase to 7 daily on Sundays, Mondays, Thursdays and Fridays from November 7th.
A week after Ryanair increase to 5 daily!

[Jamesair]

Is NCL still in the running as one of 3 possible domestics?

[GAZMO]

Interesting arrival tonight at BFS. Any ideas?
AMMAN. RJA62000 2:30

[AerRyan]

http://www.goqradio.com/belfast/whats-on/win-a-free-flight-with-ryanair/

Ryanair launching flights to Madrid???

[GAZMO]

Wonder if someone has made an error.......should Madrid be Milan?
Would be very happy if it is MAD

[BFS BHD]

Ryanair has put Warsaw, Wroclaw and Gatwick times etc on their website for S17. Not yet bookable but.

Warsaw - Same times but the Wednesday flights moves to Tuesdays.

Wroclaw - Moves to a non based aircraft, Lands 08:55 and departs 09:20.

Gatwick - Looks like the same as S16. (4 Daily).

[mart901]

Hope you meant LGW 4x daily, although with FR nothing would surprise me. EZY are ramping up capacity for winter so maybe this is a sign of FR ceasefire before they loose too much money

[BFS BHD]

Woops!! Now fixed!:O

[BFS BHD]

Just looking on Jet2s website wasn't Faro starting next year in February? Will now be starting in April and also Palma which i think was meant to start in March is now not starting to April.

[GAZMO]

Are numbers looking good for Berlin?


Belfast-Berlin ready for take-off | Belfast Internat... (http://www.belfastairport.com/blog-news/2016/august/belfast-berlin-ready-for-take-off)

[Seljuk22]

Generally speaking Belfast is underserved from Germany. The flight should be succesful.

[SecondDog]

Generally speaking Belfast is underserved from Germany. The flight should be succesful.

And without doubt at the prices that some of the seats have been sold at, should be a winner. Know a lot of people who booked seats.

[GAZMO]

Jet2 expansion....wonder if any new routes for BFS
Jet2.com to create almost 1,000 new jobs - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37228744)

[GAZMO]

Must be some new routes as 50 new jobs created at BFS, see BBC NI news

[BFS BHD]

O'Leary has confirmed they are expanding for the summer at BFS.
Wonder when they are announcing S17 from BFS?

However, Mr O'Leary said Ryanair will soon announce an expansion of its services at Belfast International Airport for next summer.

Seen Here: O'Leary blames DAA for Ryanair decision to cut Dublin capacity - Independent.ie (http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/oleary-blames-daa-for-ryanair-decision-to-cut-dublin-capacity-35015008.html)

[owenc]

So how many Ryanair aircraft are based at Belfast at the moment?

[mart901]

2 over winter Owen with some non based aircraft flights. I hope the expansion happens and opens up new routes and countries for us, it's worth remembering;

1) this is Ryanair, anything could happen

2) DUB and BFS are close enough to be played against each other and this is fairly common with KIR/SNN/ORK/DUB

3) FR ramped up services massively at DUB this year after a period of cutting back, so there is room for this.

4) If you look at FR's route offering at DUB it's totally disproportionate to BFS and population and tourist wise BFS could withstand a lot of extra routes, hopefully the buses which run down to DUB will be emptier......

[Jamie2k9]

2) DUB and BFS are close enough to be played against each other and this is fairly common with KIR/SNN/ORK/DUB

DUB and BFS, would you stop the daa are not one bit worried about FR and BFS....not like FR are going to move almost 30 aircraft up to Belfast because of a spat with the daa.

4) If you look at FR's route offering at DUB it's totally disproportionate to BFS and population and tourist wise BFS could withstand a lot of extra routes, hopefully the buses which run down to DUB will be emptier......

Traffic on buses is only going one way and I wouldn't expect that to change anytime soon.

Would be good to see the routes do well and they actually fly to some "new" places from BFS.

[owenc]

Milan and Berlin are new routes.

[Jamie2k9]

Milan and Berlin are new routes.

Was referring to any further announcements, i.e not Faro, Palma, Barcelona etc

[True Blue]

So just under 81000 pax on the Lgw route in June. With the movement in the exchange rate, I wonder if Bfs is benefiting from any pax travelling up from the south to take advantage of the rate?

Any feedback yet on what initial loads have been like on the new Ryanair routes launched this week?

[j636]

Rates would of been seen in June as it was only the last few days. FR have been selling lots of cheap seats like 9.99 ones and that's bound to get bums on seats. Given the very competitive fares to LON from DUB I don't see such a short flight been worth a trip than perhaps to somewhere in Spain.

FR had just under 45,500 seats for June while EZY should have more (?) as they carry around 40,000 so either have excellent LF and both are holding or one is losing a little.

[EI-BUD]

Excellent question True Blue, interestingly at BHD this morning I was going through enroute to LHR, some people were doing market research, with one question, from which country did you start your journey today, so they may well be trying to get a sample on that stat, they were surveying 1 in 5!! However, without a comparable metric from last year, the results may not answer that question!

I'm not convinced the penny had dropped re the change, and the rate is turning this week, after some changed since Brexit vote. A great indicator will be if there is an enormous pick up in shoppers going to Newry and Strabane for Grocery shopping!

[mart901]

I was at BHD a couple of weeks ago and I did notice how many southern registered cars there were in the car park, not DUB reg which are often rental vehicles but a lot of border counties. Hopefully we are benefitting.

[True Blue]

Lgw route up 102% on last year for August.

[GAZMO]

WOW great figure for LGW

[GAZMO]

14.5% increase in pax in August


Airport jobs boost on the way as August overtakes Ju... (http://www.belfastairport.com/blog-news/2016/september/airport-jobs-boost-on-the-way-as-august-overtakes-july-as-busiest-month)

[BFS BHD]

I see easyJet has put Barcelona on sale from 19th February 2017. Three weekly using a Barcelona based A320 (Mon, Fri & Sun). Was stopping in October to Summer 2017.

[GAZMO]

Wonder if this is going to be a trend using non based aircraft for bucket and spade routes or just spare capacity at BCN in the winter time.
Any date for EZY summer 17 release?

[BFS BHD]

26 Mar – 25 Jun 2017 - On sale EARLY OCTOBER 2016

26 Jun – 10 Sep 2017 - On sale MID NOVEMBER 2016

Flight schedule release dates | easyJet (http://www.easyjet.com/en/schedule-release)

[mart901]

August now busiest month for Belfast International Airport following surge in new routes - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk (http://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/news/august-now-busiest-month-for-belfast-international-airport-following-surge-in-new-routes-35026440.html)

[GAZMO]

Travel solutions doing holidays to Orlando for 2017 Assume they are using VS for flights
https://www.travel-solutions.co.uk/coach-tours/?id=109&cat=American%20Adventures

[BFS BHD]

They will be using Thomas Cook to Orlando.

[owenc]

Virgin will be offering 8 return flights. This was announced a few months ago.

I can't see there being enough demand for Thomas Cook and Virgin though. This year so far there was around 10 flights..

If Thomas Cook and Virgin both add Orlando frequencies that will bring it up to around 15 flights, how is that going to be sustainable?

Pick one airline and leave it? Surely?

[BFS BHD]

Some increases for Ryanair for S17.

Alicante looks to be going from 3 weekly to 5 weekly.
Malaga looks to be going from 4 weekly to 5 weekly.

Gdansk & Krakow stays the same. Lanzarote & Tenerife isn't on yet for S17.

[BHD2BFS]

Considering lots of people travel to Dub, MAN, GLA and LGW for flights to Orlando I recon 15 flights is sustainable I also think a few around the school holidays in October December and Easter time would also do well even if only done by a 330 by VS or TCX

[SecondDog]

Virgin will be offering 8 return flights. This was announced a few months ago.

I can't see there being enough demand for Thomas Cook and Virgin though. This year so far there was around 10 flights..

If Thomas Cook and Virgin both add Orlando frequencies that will bring it up to around 15 flights, how is that going to be sustainable?

Pick one airline and leave it? Surely?

Well considering Virgin doubled their offering, I imagine they have done their homework. Considering in previous boom years we had two, weekly for a full summer, I think we can manage the increase again.