Gulf Air Developments

[John21UK]

***rumor*** Heard there is a mass resignation wave coming up. Talking about almost 3 digits. Can't see it being that much, but even half would be painfull for Gulf Air. Especially if they want a shot at the Saudi contract next year October.

Only way to keep people would be a payrise and a big rise in allowances.

[Che Guevara]

I heard 60, from a 'good source' recently. Whether it be 40, 60 or 100....it is going to have a major impact on the operation as a whole.

Watch this space....

[WELCO]

No doubt about the major impact! The other day, I had a chat with one open-minded local chap and he has raised a valid point in this regard. He firstly shows gratitude to all expats working for the company, but he said something about what if the majority of the staff, especially the flight crew, was of Bahraini pilots? Say 80% or so.. Would they still turn their backs to GF , likewise many expats, at hard times and during the various "curve down phases" the company was/is suffering from? I guess the answer is "No, they would stay"! Some might still prefer to leave though and go somewhere else where the grass is greener. "No blame on expats here" he mentioned because they have more pressing issues and different kind of commitments to their families and to themselves. His second concern was "Could GF have done better to recruit more qualified local pilots but they didn't? Go and check how many local pilots have applied at GF and haven't had a chance. Let alone the GAA cadets crisis! Look how GF did put everybody in a deep dark hole including themselves!" he said.

He was absolutely gutted about it...and me myself too! :ugh:

[mamamia]

:Dmentioning expats pilot expat plots who started this company, Senior expat pilots who were terminated by an email after workng for GF for 35 years ,This is a bahraini company its there place,people look for a better life the reason expats are leaving it alot can give you alot of reasons good luck every body

[Landflap]

Well, if you made any sense of that, you are a lot brighter than me. Expats pilot;Expat plots; a baraini (try Bahraini) company. Yeah , expats, time to go too & leave it to Mamamia ! Also, wishing for a payrise when you have just had a pay cut shows a dreadful lack of grasp. And the big black hole was never caused by employing expats over Bahrainis. It was caused by appalling lack of Management skills when the "Locals" took over. Nothing wrong with these guys, they just were not ready and then went on to create a little club. Fatal. Here is the result.

Now, I am off to create an expat plot.

[buba]

Lol.. Here it goes again.. The 'expat vs local'

Anyways i reckon, even with an up in pay, it may appease the masses for a wee bit. Whats needed is a better all round schedule.

Regarding that 1% alot are bitchin about, if after the measley pay cut,one cant make ends meet on a $10k ++, ya seriously gat issues!

[Captain Sensitive]

Yeah, buba!

This local and expat issue will always be around, but everybody knows that locals have a lot more "informal benefits" - aka better roster and a big amount of forgiveness, to say the least - than expats...

[buba]

Dunno man, it never happens on my shift, nor would i allow it.

But true, some folks hav a few hidden benefits,Personally i rather not bare me arse to the devil.. Lol

[Landflap]

Sure. I had no intention to stir up that ole boring scenario rather than throw some humour back at Mamammia who had obviously just got home from BJ's ! Bubs, forever humorous (blimey, is that the stuff you put on your greek salad ?) but well informed, courteous & visioned. Bubs, why do you not just walk in & offer yourself for CEO. Of course you are right but any CEO needs his hands untied (to give him a free hand) and he must, also, not have sticky fingers when placing them near the till.

Cut costs (freely) even if it causes a reduction in the work force (specially from overstaffed HR).

Make GF stand alone (specially handling at BAH) Bye BAS

Kill the corruption & prosecute boldly where theft can be shown ( now there's wishful thinking eh ?)

Get the right leased aircraft for the job.777 perfect for mid/longhaul & the NG 737 perfect for short. Mixed manufacturer fleets has always been expensive.

Do the route planning right. Why on earth did we ever do AMS via CDG ?
Why on earth did we ever do MXP via Rome ?.............just plain daft. When KLM took our routes to AMS they went direct & wound up from once a week to daily. Even I couldn't get on to see my cloggy bird !

Forget the "There airline "....I think Mamma meant "Their". Make GF international again, get the right staff for the right job irrespective of colour or creed. I once applied to RBA (Brunei) and was told that it was definitely only a three year contract as they were dedicated to producing an "all Brunei" company. That was twenty years ago ! Are they " All Brunei " ?.are they heck !

Oh & Bubs, if you need a Deputy CEO..............Geees a call !!

[buba]

Landflap... Lol.. 'free hand', 'sticky fingers'.. That just conjured up rude thoughts, haa haa..

Me?CEO, we'l be broke in under a year! I'd hav wee skirts and 'fck me boots' totting down the back. I thinks ur the better man for the job

Anyway.. U hav valid points there.. But just like god, GF works in mysterious ways!

[AeroForce]

I'd hav wee skirts and 'fck me boots' totting down the back.
BUBA for CEO :ok: :cool:

[buba]

Aeroforce.. Thank you, thank you.. Your far too kind :)

Anyways back to a somber subject( i do apologise).. Heard head of cabin crew handed in his notice. The department is short by 90 odd cabin crew but no budget to train new recruits. CSM i flew with had his leave canned.

[Mephistopheles]

Things have been far to quiet. Where's the management gone? Perhaps trying to cover their asses for the next parlimentary probe! No words of wisdom from the CEO. No "thanks for working thru tough times" BS email from the COO. Not even a single deranged email from the DFO! Guess they are all too busy planning their next step.

[Albergineman]

S.N.A.F.U.

:{

[WELCO]

Might turn into S.N.A.F.U.B.A.R.by the looks of it! :E

[John21UK]

One extra flight a week to Sanaa: Gulf Air Increases Sana’a Service from late-Oct 2012 | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/09/10/gf-sah-w12/)

Source: Airlineroute.net

[mamamia]

hope every body gets their leave because the managment going to stay in bahrain no airplanes delivery no five days germany no extra pay no upgrade no fleet transfer no having days off and no and no and nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[Mephistopheles]

So the COO has taken time out of his busy shedule to address us, the hard working peasants. & what did he have to say....
...absolutely nothing! What a waste of a minute of my life reading his emailing the lack any substance.
But, it will be interesting to see if his ace management team follow his request I have requested all our management pilots to cancel their planned leaves until the end of this year.

I'm sure the first part of his email We have requested pilots and Cabin Crew to sell or defer their remaining leave in 2012 and are grateful to those who have offered to do so. Will be actioned before any of the managers family go thru the mental stress of having their family holidays cancelled!

This part some additional cancelation of leave may become necessary. will definately materialize so get ready for a rocky end of 2012.

Once again the management have outdone themselves in the lack foresight & totally disregard for human factors & employee social welfare.

I wonder if the managers will give up their weekend LHR flights(with selected crews) & help out with the real flying?

[John21UK]

What's the point of two local carriers, both in a bad shape, flying to the exact same destinations from a relatively small island?
Bahrain Air Resumes Dhaka and Kathmandu Service | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/09/11/bn-dacktm-sep12/)

[ironbutt57]

What a waste of a minute of my life reading his emailing the lack any substance.

What more can he say?? As mentioned the future plan is still under review...positive info for those awaiting their command classes..one can only pass along what one knows to be fact.....walk a mile in his shoes then we wait and see what YOU have to pass along...

[buba]

I agree with IB... But... Therz always a but ( no pun intended IB), the pilot shortage should hav been nipped in the butt a loooong time ago.

[Mephistopheles]

I'm sorry to disagree boys but the CEO, COO ,CCO & whatever other C.... we have in GF are paid big bucks to MANAGE the company. I'd happily "walk a mile in his shoes" & sit in an nice air conditioned office, collect BD15000+, ops GF003 on Friday, help my friends get positions & fly with my special friends & at the same time feed the pilot community crap. Exactly what some guys here are so eager to lap up.

Glad to see all management pilots followed the COO request & cancelled their leaves until the end of the year!
A/DFO and Fleet Manager A330/A340 is away from base on leave till 15th September 2012

[John21UK]

50 pilots 'recalled' from last years seletion batch. (20 capt + 30 f/o) Further selection/assesment will start in October IIRC.

[ironbutt57]

Yup he's on leave for a whole 3 days$!!!! Wow!!! Guess you just enjoy the negative side of things, I suspect the pilot shortage was brought on by the sudden re-opening of several markets, which is and has been out of GF control, go enjoy your misery... Things could be worse,

[buba]

IB dude, i have to disagree with you on that.. We'v been short for a few years now. We'v been short when iraq/iran was full on, we were short during the closure (having 1 pilot on stby a day, does not warrant an excess of pilots, thats from the horse's mouth),and we are short now.

A few people pissed off Yonder when the 767 was retired(2008), alot more buggered off for a better life style a bit to the east of bah, a few retired (they did'nt age overnight).. So unforseen circumstance me hairy ar$&.

The training department is running full time trying to cope(hats off to them), but folk are leavin faster than bums are being placed on seats.

Ps.. Gf has lived a cycle of shortage as far back as the 90s.. How unforseen can that be, one would be as blind as a bat on a railway track not to forsee that.

[Mr. R]

with all this said do you guys think the airline will start recruiting pilots (or maybe have the capacity to recruit) ??

[John21UK]

Read post 4487. Recruitment starts again in October.

[40&80]

A recent Gulf Air Command course question.

What should an Acting M.F.O. A340 Fleet Manager do on three days leave?

Correct Answer...

Visit Emirates and negotiate a DEC A380 position.:ok:

[Grock]

^^^^^ Like :ok:

[Landflap]

With Meph & Buba. Management are paid to manage & they have failed. In my part of the world, people are sacked for the kind of mismanagement GF has inflicted upon itself. Ironbuts, my compassioned fear is that you will get badly hurt. I just hung up my flying boots. In a fourty year career, I got badly hurt twice and a bleeding nose once. All my fault for "caring too much" like others on these forums. Your tremendous loyalty for your management group is worthy but, I fear, naive & misplaced. Be loyal to your licence, not what is painted on the side of a "Commercial" airliner. When your much admired Management Group hang you out to dry & the welfare cheques replace your salaried ones, they will not be seen for dust.
Meph & Buba together have a wealth of Gf experience. Time to listen rather than leap to the defence of a corrupt, inept, self interested group of people who are unworthy of your loyalty.

[ironbutt57]

My loyalty is bought and payed for by GF, not individuals, 30+ years in this industry for me have seen strike, airline out of business, too many pilots, too few pilots too many pilots, and the story goes on and on, the ops managers do the best they can with the cards they are dealt, the master plan is fluid to say the least, what to do?? In my past experience I'd rather be busting my hiney due to a pilot shortage, rather than wondering what will happen with too many pilots sitting around... Thats never a good position to be in...

[Landflap]

Noted. Just to confirm, my comments come from compassion for a good bloke. I wish you nothing but good things & can see that you have been round the block . But, later yesterday, I manage to grab this kid who was about to dash across the road on a red (Panda crossing). Calmed him & told him there was that nasty big truck coming his way. He burst into tears & his Dad shouted at ME ! I meant well though !

[ironbutt57]

At least one sleeps well at night..(notwithstanding my screwy roster)..:ugh:

[buba]

I see your not on the 'habibi' or the 'cannuk' list.. No disrespect to either.. Lol

[ironbutt57]

I try and avoid "lists" except my occasional assignment to the "**** list":}

[John21UK]

That one made my day! Good to go now for another nightshift..

What's up with these rumors about starting Jakarta?

P.s. What's got four wings and still can't fly? Gulf Air HQ. Couldn't resist, propably an old one... :ok:

[buba]

IB.. Think u and me both in the dunny this month lol

Well therz a rumour floating about ( not to be confused with 'floaters', altho therz plenty of that about) 2 a330 are on ther way, and mayb a few more fareast destinations

[ironbutt57]

Well the 330's will be a big boost for the boys n gals, hope it happens, more destinations is always a good sign

[John21UK]

The Airbus website shows the outstanding orders to be for A330-300's. We could use those for the BKK and MNL's to free up the -200's for longer and possibly new routes to the Far East.

[John21UK]

Here's a good read on the Iraq and Iran flights:
Gulf Daily News » Local News » Gulf Air's Iraq-Iran tickets selling fast (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=337804)

It furthermore mentions that Bahrain Air wants a crack at some of them as well but has been denied. For now...

[buba]

Now how about flights to keiv, belarus, SINgapore, honkers... For all nonpilgrims.. Eh, such a creul creul world we live in.. Lol

[showel]

GULF1765 - Direct Entry Rated Captains for Airbus A320 - Gulf Air (http://careers.sniperhire.net/Gulfairframe/VacancyDetail.aspx?VacancyID=49772)
GULF1766 - Direct Entry Rated First Officers for Airbus A320 - Gulf Air (http://careers.sniperhire.net/Gulfairframe/VacancyDetail.aspx?VacancyID=49773)

[White Knight]

A recent Gulf Air Command course question.

What should an Acting M.F.O. A340 Fleet Manager do on three days leave?

Correct Answer...

Visit Emirates and negotiate a DEC A380 position.

Maybe negotiate a 330 position bud! As an F/O..... We got our own people for the good jobs:=

PS 40 etc. I had to space the 8 and 0 'cos PPRUNE turns 80 to AMP.... BIZARRE!

[SCATANA]

Funny you mentioned that, White Knight.

Before he rejoined GF, the guy in question was already a Manager at your airline :=

[Air Tama]

Hello everyone! Does anybody know how many A320 F/O the airline is looking for and if A320 Type rated guys but no experience on it have good chance to be hire? Big thanks!!!

[buba]

Sudan airways wet lease.. I can see the boys fallin over each other tryin to score a spot for this exciting venture.. Lol

[Landflap]

Scatana & Whiteknight; I think it is called "Wasta" or something like that. Of course he will rejoin & of course he will go to A380 & of course he will wind up Fleet Boss. Reminds me of an ex fleet boss who, at the Winter annual party wound up a quick speech to say that he had to leave for a meeting where "saving jobs" was the priority. Pause for resounding applause & a few rounds of "For He's a Jolly Good Fellow". The Jolly Good Fellow forgot that he had, unwittingly, left his CV on the Company office photocopier.Look after yourselves people, no-one else will.

[Mephistopheles]

So a A330 is going to Sudan not a A340! Guess even the Sudanese don't wanna go near our A340s! Smart guys.
I gather the spots for the lucrative & fun filled KRT tour of duty are filling up fast guys so make sure you get your names down by the 20th Sept otherwise you'll never forgive yourself!
As you read this our management are scouring the earth to find more cesspits to send us to in order to show to the powers above that they are doing a outstanding job & protect their chairs for another 6 months.
Just think of the worst places on the face of this planet & you can be sure our brain storming genii upstairs are working their tails off to make it a reality.
After all what does it matter to them that WE get sent to some God forsaken s**t hole whilst they are sitting comfortable in Bahrain filling their pockets?

[buba]

My bets wer on nigeria.. Bugger, guess i lost that 10bd bet and a few rounds of drink

[John21UK]

May I propose Air Tahiti Nui for a 6 month contract, family allowed as well...?

[ironbutt57]

and we the Bahraini cadets, we dont have chance of anything.

That seems strange as Bahraini cadets are 95% of my flights.....

[John21UK]

I wouldn't go down that road mate. Your opening a can of worms. Face it, being a commercial pilot is a international business that SHOULD not have any boundries or barriers based on nationality. Experience and fit for the job/qualifications is what SHOULD count. Ready, aim, ....

[buba]

I second IB.

[SCATANA]

And 95% of members here are expats, rid3r. You're barking up the wrong tree :}

[buba]

Now, now kids.. No need to be rude to each other, kiss and make up.

[John21UK]

No green light yet for Iran operations: Bahrain's Gulf Air Yet to Receive Iran OK to Resume Flights -Report - Zawya (http://www.zawya.com/story/Bahrains_Gulf_Air_yet_to_receive_Iran_OK_to_resume_flights_r eport-ZW20120917000013/)

Iraq though has given it's approval but Iran's approval might come at the last minute...

[AeroForce]

western cadets graduate in continents like North America and Europe and get employed within 3-6 months by some low cost Airliner, after accumulating enough hours they come to Gulf Air (Gulf Air - Vacancy List (http://careers.sniperhire.net/Gulfairframe/VacancyList.aspx)) and we the Bahraini cadets, we dont have chance of anything.

the cycle moves on.

Really? How about you check your facts again.

Pilots in North America get their first Jet jobs based on MERIT my friend! Before you even get close to an airline job in North America you would have followed something like this road: Flight training, Flight Instructor, Air Taxi or similar logging THOUSANDS of hours and then if you're lucky enough maybe a commuter airline job flying small turboprops or if you're really lucky a small jet like a E145, whilst earning peanuts in the right seat before you're even considered for an airline job flying a A320.

Europe is a different story, where the dreams of many individuals are being milked by the commercial flight training organisations (like GAA has become now). After spending BD 75K plus there will only be enough jobs for about 10-25% of people finishing flight training. Waiting lists are often longer than 2 years (for those who find a job) and airlines offer jobs for those who are willing to pay for them, only offering temporary contracts on heavily reduced wages until aquiring a full ATPL.

The fact is that even without Gulf Air attracting expat pilots, GAA is training far more cadets than the local market can possibly absorb adopting the same business model as the big FTO's in Europe. Hence the cooperation with CAE/Oxford and Air Arabia.

Unfortunately P2F will become a reality for the local pilots as it already is for cadets all over the world.
The airline industry rather selects the cheapest instead of the best. Safety first, my **s. I rest my case. :ugh:

Force

[WELCO]

Face it, being a commercial pilot is a international business that SHOULD not have any boundries or barriers based on nationality. Experience and fit for the job/qualifications is what SHOULD count. Ready, aim, ....Very true! But it is understandable if the country wants to create qualified field force in different business categories for its own citizens. I personally can't see anything wrong with that IF, and only if, the local can satisfy the job requirements and create the competitive edge over the foreigner. It happens in many places of the modern world.


The fact is that even without Gulf Air attracting expat pilots, GAA is training far more cadets than the local market can possibly absorb adopting the same business model as the big FTO's in Europe. Hence the cooperation with CAE/Oxford and Air Arabia. Now here lies the problem! The GAA product does not satisfy the market demands! And let me tell you this.. The market can easily absorb those cadets but not in the very generic meaning of the word. GF, for instance, has been always short of pilots and for many years while there are plenty of poor and helpless cadets knocking the doors all the time! Can you see the gap here? GF, and likewise many airlines in the region, are ideally looking for type rated and experienced pilots who can jump in straight into the cockpit and generate money ASAP. The available cadets are nowhere near that profile and will exhaust the almighty budget and the limited training capacity/time until they are marginally ready to go. So if the business model of an FTO like GAA wanted to fill this gap, they should have at least topped up the cadets' frozen ATPL with the sought type rating and probably some good couple of hundreds of hours on type in order to qualify them to only touch the market demands and get the hiring managers excited. How brilliant would that be for an airline, a cadet and a respected FTO?! Unfortunately, they have all the resources and the infra-structure, but don't have enough of the "skull contents"!

I only can hear back my echoes!:ugh:

[ironbutt57]

It's the "catch-22" scenario all airlines in the Gulf are experiencing...short of crews so the trainers fly so no resources to train the required new crew...particularly second officers as they require more training resources than a "direct entry"...but we have here at GF a relatively steady stream of second officers going through the system at any given time much more so than any other carrier here in the Gulf...

[Mephistopheles]

Rumor has it that whilst enjoing the sun, safety & security in KRT we will operate to JED, MAD, KAN(Kanu) & NDJ(N'djamena). Nice. Basings will NOT be from the bottom of the seniority list.

[buba]

From what i hear from my mates who attended last night's pilot forum, MJ did not paint the rosiest of all pictures, but atleast he was straight forward about most stuff.

[LNAV VNAV -]

From what I understood from the meeting, a decision is expected in about 3 weeks about the future size of the company.

It also seems more than likely that the Saudi venture will go ahead.

[slowjet]

Mephistopheles, you rock. Master of sarcasm which, actually, I think is the HIGHEST form of wit, It will often, when expressed, really shake up those aimed at. I tell you what, most of the posters here are showing great resolve, fantastic humour and a tremendous desire to see the company survive. I fear, terribly, that GF will never recognise the talent displayed here.

For the Cadet situation. Easy. Restore the system that Meph enjoyed & most others in GF. Select carefully (stay away from the "Wasta"). Send trainees to a proper acadamy.Graduates remain at the College and do Airline Orientated Flight Training (sim details) after frozen ATP. Guaranteed employment as Second Officers on the most jumior fleet ( continuation of training, really in Line Orientated flight Training with Training Captains and or Senior Captains willing to pass on the skills). Make this the scheme that others will want to copy. The tough part is getting the numbers right. Currently, rapid changes in the airlines requirements would not make a Cadet scheme like this viable. BA never got it right & at one time had loads of cadets in the hold pool.

GF has to steady up, predict a future & then get the recruitment & Training to a standard that could, once again, be the envy of the airline world. Heaven knows, you guys who are on these pages deserve that.

[SCATANA]

A key issue missing here is the fact that all these Cadets were sent to Oxford AFTER signing a personal loan of BD50'000 (BD500 deducted monthly upon return - me thinks).

Adding A320 sim/rating would would rack up the cost to 70k, maybe more.

Would be too high a burden on these kids.

[buba]

It just ended up being a bussiness for some fat cats more so than a means for the local talent.

[Mr. R]

A key issue missing here is the fact that all these Cadets were sent to Oxford AFTER signing a personal loan of BD50'000 (BD500 deducted monthly upon return - me thinks).

Adding A320 sim/rating would would rack up the cost to 70k, maybe more.

Would be too high a burden on these kids.

50% of the costs were subsidized by Tamkeen so it was much less by then

[ODMEA]

Hi guys

Recently flew with you guys 4 sectors while in the Gulf and one your cabin managers said there was a rumour Sydney and Singapore may be considered again? Is this realistic or just a rumour? There was also talk of it being non stop but I dont think GF have the ac to do this. Can any version of the A330 do a non stop BAH -SYD?

Thx.

[Atebis]

ODMEA,

Answers are:

1- rumor
2- just a rumor
And.....
3- No

[Mephistopheles]

Well today is D-day for the KRT applications for those that are happy enough to blindly volunteer for a one month base & stumble into yet another colossal blunder without knowing any details of what one might be signing up for. I guess management, in their infinite wisdom, decided that we labourers were not worthy of knowing the smallest details of the wet lease agreement since we will most likely be shipped of there by force regardless.
Anyway, best of luck for those that have stuck gold & got the basing of a life time (Who knows it could be me!) & enjoy.

[Mephistopheles]

Najaf bans future GF flights
Lebanon news - NOW Lebanon -Iraq province bans Bahrain carrier flights (http://www.nowlebanon.com/NewsArticleDetails.aspx?ID=438556)
Good to see there's no politics going on here!?

[buba]

Heard iran may not grant GF approval to operate into its airports aswel

[John21UK]

See my post 4522 above. Still no green light regarding Iran flights.

[mamamia]

What happened in that meeting

[John21UK]

Iran flights postponed till 01 Oct. Waiting for Iranian CAA approval;
Bahrain's Gulf Air delays Iran flights relaunch - Transport - ArabianBusiness.com (http://m.arabianbusiness.com/bahrain-s-gulf-air-delays-iran-flights-relaunch-473752.html)

Don't think this is the end of it just yet...

[Che Guevara]

Indeed, I don't thing the fat lady is ready to sing just yet, perhaps she's off counting chickens?

[IFE]

The latest Notice to Crews

Dinosaurs are jealous that 320s have taken over EU, therefore there will be no 330 nightstop for 320/330 CCQ pilots. :=

[Mephistopheles]

IFE, it's not jealousy it's about being fair. Or do you think it's fair for juniors to night stop in CDG, FRA, FCO, CPH, COK, MAA, KTM, DAC whilst the pilots senior to you only have 3 night stops-LHR,BKK & MNL? I suppose you think you deserve those as well?

[John21UK]

This is not an issue regarding 'fairness'. The bottom line is that the right aircraft needs to go to the right place. The Gulf Air operation has changed and over time it will evolve again. It's up to commercial to get bums on seats that pay enough for you and me to have a job. Who cares who nightstops where!?

[SCATANA]

Indeed it had little to do with "fairness" and more to do with the "dinosaurs" not being fully utilised to the limit.

[ironbutt57]

whilst the pilots senior to you only have 3 night stops-LHR,BKK & MNL?

They reap what they sow....

[Xaror]

Mephistopheles IFE, it's not jealousy it's about being fair. Or do you think it's fair for juniors to night stop in CDG, FRA, FCO, CPH, COK, MAA, KTM, DAC whilst the pilots senior to you only have 3 night stops-LHR,BKK & MNL? I suppose you think you deserve those as well?

I disagree with you on that!
A330/340 share KTM and DAC nightstops along with A320 folks!
COK and MAA <---- do you realy consider those nightstops? Seriously?

CDG FRA FCO CPH thats 10+10+4+4 = 28 weekly
LHR BBK MNL thats 14+6+9 = 29 weekly

Number of flight deck operating A320 is more than twice as A330/340.

And I bet A320/330 CCQ are no more than 20 Cpts! I believe If only 1 of those 3 blocks gets rostered for a CCQ pilot, all A330/340 guys will still have plenty of nightstops left!!

[Mephistopheles]

For info 330/340 guys are regularly doing over 80hrs & it's not 48hr night stops. We seem to do doing all the Pakistan night trips, double RUH, double DXB & most in fact are being "utilised to the limit" otherwise how else would we be sitting on 900hrs?
"They reap what they sow...." lost me there?

[John21UK]

New DFO appointed. Good news/bad news?

[mamamia]

life goes on

[IFE]

Mephistopheles

Quote: For info 330/340 guys are regularly doing over 80hrs & it's not 48hr night stops. We seem to do doing all the Pakistan night trips, double RUH, double DXB & most in fact are being "utilised to the limit" otherwise how else would we be sitting on 900hrs?
"They reap what they sow...." lost me there?

80 hrs on big bus is easy. Throw in 2 MNL, 1 BKK, 2 LHR, couples of doubles GCC and your line is set. I don't mind and I'm sure CCQ guys don't mind doing 24 hr night stops at these places instead of 1-2 330 flights per month.
You should try doing 80 hrs on small bus, and you would see what is "fair".
The point is, if dinosaurs want to do nice EU night stops, why don't they do 330/320 CCQ. That would be "fair" don't you think, Meph?

[bus_aviator]

this place is starting to really suck....what kind of an airline has this become...gents the big boys upstairs have won when it gets to the point that certain pilots are kept happy while other ones are just working the plantation...and then start to fight each other...that old term divide and conquer. ironbutt amen to that brother there were days that 320 guys were looking at nice layovers with a gleam in their eyes we didn't go upstairs asking for 330 guys to do less layovers...wtf....really is that what we've become if my goat dies i want yours to die as well...i'm outta here before the winter gets really cold and us wolves start eating each other

[KK Singh]

Keep it on, happy landings.

[Mephistopheles]

IFE,"Been there, done that, got the T-shirt" for many years I have done the multi sector(6 sectors were the norm) jumping around up & down the Gulf so I, like many others, feel like it is now some one else's turn to "enjoy" that type of flying. For info CCQ A330 to A320 has been on hold for over 18 months.
This would be a non topic if the company had a completely open & fair rostering system but that is not the case & each of us must fight for what's right for them. A fully automated sytem(with no outside interference-i.e. A.A.) would be perfect but we know that any budget that was there has been blown on the wonderfully & fully functional EFB!

Xaror, you conviently forgot that CMB nightstop(I think that's around 4-5 a week) & KTM/DAC nightstops are crewed 95% by CCQ. 330/340 do the turn arounds.
Number of flight deck operating A320 is more than twice as A330/340. There are around 55*330/340 Capt's & 120*320. Check the seniority list yourself if you don't believe me.

[Chuck Y]

Ooooooooooooooooooo! Looks like some are getting their little frilly panties all in a bunch cos they haven't been getting their monthly dose of ladyboy love!

[Che Guevara]

Happy Landings! Where have I heard that before....:rolleyes:

[QUOTE][This would be a non topic if the company had a completely open & fair rostering system but that is not the case & each of us must fight for what's right for them. A fully automated sytem(with no outside interference-i.e. A.A.) would be perfect but we know that any budget that was there has been blown on the wonderfully & fully functional EFB!/QUOTE]

Totally agree, but this is not for us and quite frankly, never will be, as long as corruption is a way of life for some....end of story.


Dime con quién andas y te diré quién eres.

[buba]

Got chatting with a guy from ops, says he heard that part of our aircraft maintenance will be done in amman with some maintenance outfit there, says not enough manpower in bah.

I reckons that 'new' maintenance hanger in bah should be turned into a bar, then surely we'l be able to make a profit from that..;)

[Panama Jack]

Oh great. :yuk: Perhaps the shop that has the derelict 727's, 737-200's and L1011's parked around it?

With a very few and rare exceptions, nothing I have seen come out of Jordan (aviation-wise) has impressed me. Expect the A- series 320's to follow the lead of ER and EP. :uhoh:

[buba]

You mean the Tristar with 'RICH' plastered on its side.. Lol.. Well hopefully, like everything else in GF, the deal falls through.

[repapips]

Panama Jack wrote:

Oh great. Perhaps the shop that has the derelict 727's, 737-200's and L1011's parked around it?

With a very few and rare exceptions, nothing I have seen come out of Jordan (aviation-wise) has impressed me. Expect the A- series 320's to follow the lead of ER and EP.

...You mean the pilots? ;)

[buba]

6 lhr flights getting cancelled this month. Heard some lhr slots will be sold.

[Albergineman]

Rumors said that GF stopped selling tickets out of Europe to easter destinations... Just brilliant!

:D:D

[cheesycol]

Not sure if the decrease in LHR flights this month is indicative of a slot sale. They did exactly the same last October, I guess it's just a very quiet month for pax numbers.

[buba]

Cheesy dude.. The canning of 6 flights this month and the selling of the slots is a seperate issue.

This is what the heathrow ground staff said..'a few managers are in town, to tell us if we still hav r jobs. They'r lookin to sell six slots. Six flights are being cancelled this month'

Albergineman.. So i'v heard aswel.

[John21UK]

Some good news then: Chennai to go to double daily, every day, with immediate effect.
Source: Gulf Air increases flights from Chennai to twice daily | Global Travel Media (http://www.eglobaltravelmedia.com.au/airline/gulf-air-increases-flights-from-chennai-to-twice-daily-2.html)

[John21UK]

Also 1 extra Sana'a flight from 28OCT, bringing the total up to 5 times a week.
Source: Gulf Air Increases Sana’a Service from late-Oct 2012 | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/09/10/gf-sah-w12/)

[John21UK]

Are we still going to Entebbe, Uganda? It's not on the new GF website and it cannot be booked but there is a flight tonight for instance. It's also not showing up in the latest timetable. What am I missing? (besides the fact that I need to get out more...:ok:)

[ironbutt57]

Think Entebbe is "suspended"

[John21UK]

Ok, but are we now some sort of cover operation? I mean, if I can find that flight on Flightradar24 in 2 seconds so can the muppets...

Whats so special about Entebbe? We go to more places that ain't too friendly to some.

[ironbutt57]

We don't operate to Entebbe any longer..like Milan Kuala Lampur and others..

[SMT Member]

Gents,

According to a blog (read into that what you will) on AW&ST there's doubt as to whether the 20 x A330 ordered by GF in 2008 have been cancelled.

Gulf Air A330-300 order in doubt (http://www.aviationweek.com/Blogs.aspx?plckBlogId=Blog:7a78f54e-b3dd-4fa6-ae6e-dff2ffd7bdbb&plckPostId=Blog%3a7a78f54e-b3dd-4fa6-ae6e-dff2ffd7bdbbPost%3ac928db05-ab7b-47f8-acd2-6064d96b215b)

Does anybody here know more?

[John21UK]

Thought it was quite clear those 330's ain't coming. Especially when reading between the lines on those pilots forum notes. They use the 330 order value to get 320 family aircraft. The 787 and 321 will replace the 330-200's. there will be 2 additional A321's coming as well bringing the total to 8.

My interpretation of those briefing notes was that Gulf Air is in no way interested in spreading it's wings other than they are doing now. They can take on QR and EY with it's current product and some small adjustments. They just need to get a kick up the backside, sort a few issues out and go for it.

[Mr. R]

the whole airline is a mystery just like everything else in this country:suspect:

[showel]

Johny, did you join recently???:rolleyes:
".....sort out a few issues....." - that's a good one:D:}:E

[John21UK]

Ay, just the frustration in me talking. But I'm reluctant to just give in. (just yet)

[Che Guevara]

Ay Johnny, the eternal optimist. Good on ya!

One more rotation a week to one the World's most unstable countries, is to be celebrated? Selling a LHR slot (rumoured), to stay afloat is frightening, to say the least......that's like selling your Crown Jewels isn't it? Better off selling the Pink Palace and it's contents, I would have thought. Soon you will be doing a double daily to Sitra and Muharraq!

Are we reading the same book here, because mine keeps flashing:

EJECT EJECT EJECT in bright neon.

Good luck friend.

[buba]

Was chattin to the RUH station manager few days back, asked him bout the saudi venture, his words.. 'all domestic flights are subsidised by the government, pax pay an average of $40 and the government coughs up the rest. Currently the government has a cap price on domestic flights. Unless they remove that therz no money to be had in it'

[John21UK]

It looks like Gulf Air was identified as a customer who converted/ordered 1 A320 and 3 A321's in Airbus's October order update. I'll try and find a second source to confirm whether its a new order or a suspected outstanding A330 value conversion.

[Panama Jack]

Sounds about right, buba. A few years ago I bought a full-fare, refundable/changable round-trip ticket for travel on Saudi Arabian Airlines between Dammam and Riyadh-- cost: 150 Saudi Riyals/ 15 Bahraini Dinars = $40 USD.

I still can't believe that Sama got into this market.

[AeroForce]

It looks like Gulf Air was identified as a customer who converted/ordered 1 A320 and 3 A321's in Airbus's October order update. I'll try and find a second source to confirm whether its a new order or a suspected outstanding A330 value conversion.
No need for a second source on that one, it's obvious. Thinking small.

Now some news from our neighbours....

Etihad Airways and Air France-KLM have signed a historic agreement to codeshare on flights across the airlines’ networks, the first phase of a much larger strategic partnership which commences on 28th of current month

Etihad partners with Air France - Khaleej Times (http://www.khaleejtimes.com/kt-article-display-1.asp?xfile=data/aviation/2012/October/aviation_October16.xml&section=aviation)

For those of you wanting to escape, this is not good news. AF-KLM and AB are heavy on crews with AB already sending their cadets to EY. AF-KLM have actively been looking for secondments for their excess crews with other airlines. You do the math.

Force

[slowjet]

Damn, better get to like Rick's Country Kitchen again !

[John21UK]

After many months of doing nothing, the Parliaments verdict is out. Gulf Air stays afloat!
Gulf Daily News » Local News » GULF AIR 'YES' (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=339321)

But: "Shura Council members and MPs also agreed to hold a meeting.

They stressed that their final approval of aid package would depend on the ways the government would spend the money..."

[LNAV VNAV -]

Does this mean no downsizing?? :confused:

[John21UK]

Latest Iran schedule. Let's see if this holds up: Gulf Air Postpones Iran Service Resumption till Nov 2012 | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/09/30/gf-iran-nov12/)

Source:airlineroute.net

[John21UK]

Gulf Air is very likely to have cancelled 10 out of the original 20 A333 order. The cancellation was under a 'undisclosed customer' going back to 2010. So that leaves us with 10 A333 on order. Minus the rumored 4 that were converted to 6 x A321's. And that laves us with 6 A333's still on order. Now this October Gulf Air updated their order book to + 1 A320 and 3 A321's on the Airbus website.
I'm guessing those last A333's will be converted in due time as well to A320 family.

[Bike]

John21,

Your math sounds correct but you don't really need to do this exercise. According to SM's words in the last meeting, the preferred plan for the company is a size more or less close to with what is today, although different fleet structure. I believe he went on saying that they're thinking for circa 6 A330s and the rest being a mixture of A320s/21s. But total being about what it is as we speak. As simple as that.

Having said all that, this is upper management's wish and preference. Not necessarily the final outcome.

[John21UK]

Thats absolutely correct but if gives a small insight in what to expect in terms of nbr of A320 family arriving (related to the 333 order) between now and infinity. Other than that I was just bored when I found the info. :)

We'll see what happens now parliament gave the nod and Gulf Air needs to come up with a spending/future plan.

[MaffiFaloos]

Looks like the proverbial has hit the fan judging by this mornings GDN. Large scale redundancies and a reduction of the fleet to 20 airframes. Good luck to all....

[John21UK]

Thinking small again. It had been nice knowing you all...:sad:

[55Jay]

:mad:

Gulf Daily News » Local News » Gulf Air overhaul planned (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=339346)

[showel]

Gulf Daily News » Local News » Gulf Air overhaul planned (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=339346)

:mad:

[ferris]

"After restructuring, the airline must increase Bahrainisation to 76pc and reduce expatriate staff to around 33pc." Rubbery figures have plagued GF for a while now......

[AeroForce]

No need for a second source on that one, it's obvious. Thinking small.

Thinking small again. It had been nice knowing you all...http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/puppy_dog_eyes.gif
http:://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=339346 (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=339346)

Thinking small, smaller, smallest! I rest my case.

While our neighbours are expanding and forging alliances , Gulf Air commits commercial suicide. :ugh: The big 3 will be happy to scoop up the last pieces of business (and crews) that Gulf Air will leave in its wake.

I cannot help to think these are deliberate actions to bring GF to a halt. As it is certainly not a plan to salvage the sinking ship.

Force

[Landflap]

They don't even think this one through. Limiting the Redundancy Package to Nationals means losing the people they prefer to focus on. The leftovers will be expat heavy. Offer the deal to all & you will see every single expat leaving with a smile. Decisive execution of any plan is something the GF Management have never been known for. An end to the uncertainty must be a priority.

[ironbutt57]

@Landflap to put it simply unfortunately the "voluntary" redundancy plan for expats in most any country around the world is..here's you're notice period indemnity or whatever payout and "thanks for your services"....bye bye

[Mephistopheles]

Very sad news for us all. Wishing everyone the best of luck.
On another note nice to see that after the bomb shell announcement in the GDN that our esteemed CEO, COO & the other C***s have seen fit to address the shocked employees?! I guess their are just running around checking that they are not in the 1800 jobs to be lost!
It's the final nail in the GF coffin & all thanks to the the myriad of thieves that have been leeching of it all these years. Something had to give.
The sad thing is that the thieving managers will land on their feet in some other sweet job whilst people who worked hard & showed true loyalty for years will be left scambling for a paycheck to feed & clothe their families.

[LNAV VNAV -]

The following is the first post in this thread from 2008. Check particularly the last sentence. :D

''What is on Flight Global website:

With Gulf Air (http://www.gulfair.com/about/) not expecting its first Boeing 787s (http://www.flightglobal.com/landingpage/boeing%20787.html) to arrive until at least 2016, the airline is focusing on its efforts on developing its Airbus A330 (http://www.flightglobal.com/landingpage/airbus%20a330.html) fleet.
The Bahraini flag carrier operates six A330-200s and will take three ex-Middle East Airlines A330-200s next year on eight-year operating leases from International Lease Finance (http://www.ilfc.com/).
The carrier is seeking four additional A330s as an interim replacement for some of its A340-300s, and sent a request for proposals to lessors earlier this year. "We have offers on the table and we will announce our decision next month," says Gulf Air chief strategy officer Tero Taskila.
Gulf Air has orders for 20 A330-300s and 24 787s. The latter will be the core of its future widebody fleet, with the A330s being taken as bridge aircraft. Taskila says Gulf Air is hoping to take four A330s on six- to eight- year operating leases but lessors are now offering 10-year leases.
Gulf Air has a growth requirement of three-to-four widebodies a year during the next five years as it growing its network from 43 destinations to 60 by 2013.''

:D

[Calmcavok]

Why does the government try to run an airline? The lack of business acumen is startling. Coupled with corruption, this place is fu@ked! Why bother with a CEO when he is not allowed to run his business? Ridiculous.

[Gordomac]

And in these very unsettled times, how ghastly to read about one's future in the GDN ! Truly hope that they have got it wrong. Heartfelt best wishes to all I have been privilaged to know.

[aviator3200]

There are at least 10 skippers who already passed ready to join somewhere close In the Gulf...Guess where...

[LNAV VNAV -]

So Gulf Air is the only company in the world that has an ongoing pilot recruitment and at the same time announces redundancies?? :D

[VaniosLenos]

Apparently a few years ago, another company in a small mediterranean island was doing the same :rolleyes:.

[GF02]

And finally the islands famous milking cow is admitted to the ICU :D:D

[John21UK]

Quite appropriate by EK to bring the A380 to Bahrain today. Anyway, I'll better finish reading my kids 'once upon a time...'

[bus_aviator]

but let me get this straight we are still recruiting? hehehe been to disneyland...but this place sure beats the F#$K out of it

[John21UK]

Would not surprise me. Only weeks ago Gulf Air got special dispensation to rectruit again to get the numbers up. A dozen or so A320 crews were hired from greece. Those numbers were too low so another 'road show' was planned elsewhere. The Gulf Air careers website still has active vacancies for both seats and cabin crew. Go figure that one out...?

[buba]

Yeah read the article in the gulf daily trash and from what i gather, in my limited wisdom,a plan has been put up.. How it will be implemented remains to be seen.

John21uk.. Dude you gonna give urself a stroke mate..as they say in bangkok.. Leeeeeelaaax.

[Bike]

I will go with buba. Agreeing a plan between committee heads is one thing, allow for it to "leak" to the press is another thing and actually implementing it is a third matter. For some reason I am not that pessimistic.

[dzmeigolem]

Buba, you rule, mate!

I like the "could be" and "maybe" reports (could be rainin', but maybe not)when we talk on a serious subject like this. Info should be given only when there's a final decision, cause tomorrow there'll be a "stamping logbook" queue in the office and the poor guys will run out of stamping ink... Theeen we'll have to go stampin' by seniority, this will add up some more pressure... and the next day GDN will be: "Gulf Air pilots could be punchin' each other, which might lead to flight cancelations, according to a source"

Btw if they go for 20 airplanes (makes me laugh) better sell all slots, traffic rights etc. and shut it down, cause you'll end up doing so in a couple of years max + the losses. You wanna go to LHR? No probs, the guys next door go there 5 times a day!


Bubs:ok: I think I know who you might be, or maybe not... Cheers!

[buba]

Dzmeigolem then you must know i enjoy a drink or two ;) cheers..

[Landflap]

Yeah, Buba rocks ! I said it somewhere else, Buba for CEO. Gordomac told us too how Dick Hughes reminded him that GF was a Flying Club & not to expect too much. GM went back to baking himself at the Gulf Hotel, surrounded by chicklets & never looked back for 17 years. GDN has always been quick to headline grab and loved trashing GF whenever they could. Don't be too quick to believe what you read there but, of course, be guided. Oh & Bubs, I still want to come back but as your Deputy & Head Of Cabin Crew Recruitment. Just spoke to GM & agreed that with you as CEO, he will come back too as Head of Cabin Crew Uniforms ! Chins up Guys. Forget LHR 5 times a day; me & Bubs are going for BKK 6 times a day on the Dreamliner.

[buba]

Landflap as GM used to say..'game is on' ;))) i know what he'l kit up the cabin crew in... Cheetah print! Lol
Landflap, GM... Sawadeeeeeeeeeeee

[John21UK]

See, amongst us plenty of good ideas. Here's one; why not build two bridges for use by high speed trains and cars between Bahrain and Qatar. Let Bahrain and Gulf Air cease to excist and become a part of Qatar. (+airways) Remove the pink palace apart from car park and crewroom and lets keep GAA where it is. We stay based here to 'run' this part of the ops. And then the alarm went off...

[bond737]

Dear Colleagues,

I am sure most of you have read the extensive reports in today's local media speculating on 'downsizing' Gulf Air as a condition to receiving the required funding.

I understand the anxiety and uncertainty these reports have caused us all. The discussions between the government and parliament are ongoing with a final vote to approve the funding expected within weeks of parliament convening next Sunday.

At this stage we are waiting for official communication from our owners in this regard and as soon as it has been received I will share it with you all. Samer Majali


:ugh:

[bus_aviator]

etihad and qatar signing up with the other big boy alliances ie skyteam and one world....not a chance gents this island will be lucky if they have a national airline at the end of the day, remember national means for ie germany... munich- frankfurt flights as far as i know obbi and the airforce base is not a viable national carrier solution...i'm with john on this one sell her out while someone still wants her...on another chapter are we going to get the 3 month notice periods to leave or is it the next day sort of thing?

[AeroForce]

Some of the routes operated by Gulf Air might be interesting for one of our neighbours.

However nobody is going to touch this debt ridden sick to the core company in a take over bid. The only part of Gulf Air that is interesting for the competition are the slots and maybe some of the crew.

The whole pink palace would be obsolete overnight as any airline interested can run all those operations from their own HQ, plus they don't want to inherit Robin Hood and his merrymen that are still hiding in the woods there. Obviously a precondition for sale from the Bahrain government would be to keep the pink palace opened with all its employees. Therefore don't get your hopes up. NOBODY will touch this airline in its current form, unfortunately.

Force

[buba]

That was quick.. In today's arabic rag,'the king passes a decree to grant GF the 185 million dinars to restructure'

Did'nt mention what the'restructuring' entitled, also a decree was passed to reshuffle the ministry of transport

[Che Guevara]

Some of the routes operated by Gulf Air might be interesting for one of our neighbours

Hmm, those would be Kabul and Sanna would they not?

[ironbutt57]

Two "garden spot" destinations..:yuk:

[Mephistopheles]

A few months back a certain Sheikh from AUH had numerous meetings regarding buying into GF but his stipulation was that he wanted 51% & therefore no government corruption. His offer was quickly refused.

[Mephistopheles]

So with 50% in staff levels I take it 50% of the deat beat Directors & Senior management will be axed as well?

Yeah, just dreaming. If anthing the numbers of dead beats will increase as the funds flow in. Just another day in GF.

[Panama Jack]

A few months back a certain Sheikh from AUH had numerous meetings regarding buying into GF but his stipulation was that he wanted 51% & therefore no government corruption. His offer was quickly refused.

51% may have been undoable for numerous reasons, including that it would have affected the "nationality" of the airline and its eligibility to take advantage of the bilateral agreements between Bahrain and other states. It may have sealed Gulf Air's fate to being a GCC regional airline.

Besides, a certain Sheikh from AUH in Gulf Air's past had a corrupting influence in the airline too, from the wild stories that I've heard.

[buba]

Read an article today, says mumtalakat is looking for a way to get rid of GF future aircraft order

[gcc_]

Downsizing to a fleet of 20 will mean only maybe 2 or 3 a330s will be left.
I sense lots of guys(even bahrainis) resigning if they were put back on the 320.

[Che Guevara]

Interesting letter to the GDN today:

Expand ... don't shrink
**Posted on » Saturday, October 13, 2012

The article in the newspaper regarding Gulf Air down-sizing was very painful to read. Unfortunately, members of the government and parliament do not understand the nature of the airline business.

Reducing the fleet and destinations to half it's current size could never hit 2.2 million passengers in your wildest dreams. This shows how flawed the thinking of the consultants who worked on this proposal are.

If you do your research, you will find no airline in the world has taken a decision to down-size and stay with that strategy because it does not work.

Currently, Gulf Air is losing market share despite growing in the region due to airlines increasing their capacity and flights into Bahrain. If you do not continue to grow, even at a modest pace, you will be left behind.

The reason airlines like Etihad and Emirates are able to make money is because they are expanding, not shrinking. Operating larger aircraft is always more economical per seat than the small aircraft Gulf Air is using. Adding more and more destinations that connect to each other makes it easy to fill the flights.

Unfortunately, the reverse is also true and down-sizing means the exact opposite will happen. The 20 aircraft scenario simply will not work and will eventually lose as much as the company is losing now. It is sad that Mumtalakat continues to listen to the same consulting company which already proposed the current Gulf Air strategy three years ago that has proved unsuccessful. A J

[buba]

The consultants and comittee hav a different agenda.. But lets not go down that road

[WELCO]

Gulf air's core problem does not lie in whether to expand or downsize. It's all about the widespread corruption. Nothing will ever work in this environment without curing the roots.

[Mephistopheles]

WELCO, exactly & Gulf Air should start by taking a long hard look at what we are being charged for by BAS & those that are complicit from within that are helping hide this massive theft committed on a daily basis. All our partner companies, like BAS, continue to rape GF with the full knowledge of those with the power the stop this but as usual they probably have their fingers in the pie as well so back to square 1. It needs the total removal of ALL Chiefs, Directors, Senior Managers, etc then the corruption can be addressed. Until then nothing will change.

[buba]

HQ needs a wee bit of pruning

[LNAV VNAV -]

I understand that a meeting took place today to decide our future? :sad:

[flame_bringer]

Interesting letter to the GDN today:


Quote:
Expand ... don't shrink
**Posted on » Saturday, October 13, 2012

The article in the newspaper regarding Gulf Air down-sizing was very painful to read. Unfortunately, members of the government and parliament do not understand the nature of the airline business.

Reducing the fleet and destinations to half it's current size could never hit 2.2 million passengers in your wildest dreams. This shows how flawed the thinking of the consultants who worked on this proposal are.

If you do your research, you will find no airline in the world has taken a decision to down-size and stay with that strategy because it does not work.

Currently, Gulf Air is losing market share despite growing in the region due to airlines increasing their capacity and flights into Bahrain. If you do not continue to grow, even at a modest pace, you will be left behind.

The reason airlines like Etihad and Emirates are able to make money is because they are expanding, not shrinking. Operating larger aircraft is always more economical per seat than the small aircraft Gulf Air is using. Adding more and more destinations that connect to each other makes it easy to fill the flights.

Unfortunately, the reverse is also true and down-sizing means the exact opposite will happen. The 20 aircraft scenario simply will not work and will eventually lose as much as the company is losing now. It is sad that Mumtalakat continues to listen to the same consulting company which already proposed the current Gulf Air strategy three years ago that has proved unsuccessful. A J
Well said
It would have been better if this letter was delivered to the right people though as GDN is just a pit of propaganda that loves to bash GF whenever possible.
I hope this downsizing doesn't take place otherwise the 185 million bds will ultimately come to naught.

[buba]

Am told that therz about 450 managers in HQ... Thats almost as many pilots we got on the line..
Can i plz hav one to manage me errands then.. Plzzzzzzzzzzz.

[dr_gonzo]

Hi,

Journalist here from the GDN.

We are trying to speak to staff about the latest developments at the airline.

If anyone would like to speak to us you can message me your contact information and we will get in touch.

We have no intention of bashing Gulf Air, as someone has alluded to earlier in this thread, but are keen to keep people up to date with developments at our national carrier and speak to those who could be affected by any downsizing.

Best regards,

[CRUIZE]

Dr Gonzo,
The best guys to talk to is our 2 managers,unfortunately they are very busy wright now in cyprus water, fishing, sun turning, bbq ing G stringing drumming on the beach you name it , the names are R corbett and his asisstance by the name of Godmac sure they will be very happy to help with any question you may have regarding, BTW call them after happy hour otherwise you wont get line as too busy cheering around. so good luck and they would love to speak to GDN

[Ion-athan]

2nd time within 7 months GF is dumping successful interview pilots with starting date 1st of Nov. Bare in mind that the previous group of pilots quit their jobs to come to GF were NEVER HIRED BACK from their companies.

I suggest for those who are looking for a job AVOID GF by all means.

[Albergineman]

Typical...

:ugh:

[mamamia]

Avoid gulf Air Avoid gulf air

[Gordomac]

Cruize Dude, ease up little buddy. I was never a Manager although I offered to helpout many times because those with the titles managed only to mismanage. I would have been privilaged to assist Corbett and as his assistant, together, we would have been the dream team. Also, it is "Gordomac" as opposed to "Godmac" . Mind you, I appreciate the promotion to heavenly status. You are right about Cyprus & I see you are here too. Let's meet up at the Corfu Tavern in my Village to discuss a rescue plan. Buba is going to be CEO but Corbett & me are willing to return & I will be Head of Uniforms. No HATS ! Long hair permitted. Female cabin crew only. My list of priorities is long. Ok, off to the beach if I can drag myself away from my pool. Now, where did I place that G string ? Damn, have to wear the Leopard string thong that Buba let me buy in Patpong !

Seriously, I share the pain that will be experienced by many in GF right now. I had 17 fabbo years & was privilaged to share happy times with some serious talent. The demise was ghastly but constructed by those who hated my openess. The last three days in the Pink Palace, being booted about by those who enjoyed being bullies; the faceless wonders who gave me the Fleet Office Boy to tell me "Massalama"; having to fight every inch for three months in lieu of Notice; the horror of seing thousands docked for "Unscheduled Leave", "Sick Leave" (where none was taken) etc etc etc. Oh yeah, Cruizey Baby, bring on the GDN.................Have I got a story for you !

I have to reiterate; heartfelt BEST wishes to all who made Bahrain & GF are wonderful experience for me. Heartfelt BAD wishes to those who spoiled it but unwittingly (they never had much wit anyway) saved me from all the mess of the past three years.

Blimey, that chick going past my front door to the beach is really only wearing a G string ! Oooooooh, GAME's ON !!!!!

[Spirit]

Yo Gordo, don't you forget the white Ray-Bans...they go together with the g-string:p

[Sal-e]

A very wise man once said 'A house divided cannot stand'.

[millerscourt]

Godmac I think I prefer that to Gordomac:D Can we have a vote on that?

[mauro delpiero]

Definitely all female Cabin Crew You got that right Gordomac. The problem we have in gulf air is a bunch of old perverts as managers. From the bottom Cabin Service Managers, to Fleet Managers and Chiefs, or should I say Thiefs. I bet you if we had an all ladies mangers policy they'd run the joint much better then these baldies we have. Offcourse by ladies I'm not talking about those penguins we have in the company.

[John21UK]

Can't those people see the obvious: Gulf Daily News » Local News » BD1bn 'pumped into Gulf Air' (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=339900)

What Gulf Air loses in one day could, through calculations, help meet pensioners' financial needs for nine and half years."

This story is far from over. Unfortunately downsizing will not fix the massive leaks and sticky fingers situation.

DT is reporting all Iran flights have been suspended, again, until somewhere early next year. Inshallah.
DailyTribune - Local News (http://www.dt.bh/newsdetails.php?key=301110213450&newsid=161012213014)

[buba]

Gordomac baby.. I suspect those are your 'string' that chicka made off with.. Check ur clothes line ;))

Mauro.. What this place needs is sense of style

[Atebis]

Gulf Air Cancels Nairobi Service from mid-Nov 2012 | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/10/17/gf-nbo-w12cxld/)

There goes Nairobi....

[buba]

A chap was chattin to one of the big wigs, says the consulting agency hired by mumtalakat is the 'entity' calling the shots at the moment. Says they will concentrate more on asia and the fareast, with the possibility of keepin 6 330s on line.

[John21UK]

Same here, heard via via from one of the mumtalakat board members that what the GDN reported was just one of the options. It just happened to be the most 'spectacular.'

[John21UK]

What's so special about Najaf these days? Today there are 7 flights with 4 A321's, 1 A330 and a couple of A320's and with 3 flights leaving within 15 minutes of eachother.

[ironbutt57]

Pilgrimage to the Holy Shrine in Najaf....busy times

[John21UK]

Interesting, thanks!

Edit: just found a quote that made me laugh. It was posted on A.net as a reply to a article from Qatari's Al Baker:


Quoting g500 (Reply 3):
If Emirates and Etihad had to rely on O&D traffic alone, oh where would we be now


They'd probably be called Gulf Air, who had a head start, geographically, on the then fledgling EK, but did not have people smart enough to see where the future would lie

[John21UK]

What a surprise, all Iran flights cancelled. And they won't be resumed either.
Gulf Air Cancels Plan to Resume Iran Service due Nov 2012 | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/10/19/gf-iran-nov12update2/)

And the funniest things is that now Iran Air will start Mashdad-Bahrain twice a week in respons!
Iran Air Starts Mashad – Bahrain Service from late-Oct 2012 | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/10/16/ir-mhdbah-w12/)

So we cannot go there but they can come here?

[Calmcavok]

GF Iran flights to resume soon!

http://www.tradearabia.com/touch/article/TTN/224171

[Ion-athan]

I was reading an article in Trade Arabia about Africa being the next economic tiger and I was wondering? What do these people sitting and planning the strategy of this company have in mind. It doesn't take a lot of brains to figure out that Nairobi and general Africa is linked with China. It doesn't take a lot of brains to figure out that half of Moscow is in Dubai and obviously it doesn't take to much brains that Europeans will not fill up your aircraft with only Bangkok and Manila on your far east network.

I was talking with a friend from B.A.Company about the condition of the airport and he said that it is in a very bad shape. The bridges are ready to collapse and yet few days ago they were stacking them with 50 or more people. But the answer to all that from senior management is: "We are waiting for the expansion plan". Obviously this senior management is not aligned with reality. Because even if they start today they will probably finish in 3 to 4 years and lets just hope that tragedy will not knock our door before.

All these things show the general mentality. The comments are yours.

[John21UK]

But if all you want to do is a little bit of intra-gulf around 90mins flying then who cares about 'the world nowadays.'

[55Jay]

the shots are being called by those who hold the purse strings but not a lot of airline business accumen, yes, it does look foolish. But is it?

GF looks set to contract (we are seeing in the daily rag already). There will be turmoil and with limited routes into more complex airspace, and a surplus of local (cheaper) labor, less requirement for expats.

Nationalistic labour demands will prevail as long as the Gubment is paying the bill and/or supplement. No shortage of the former as long as the latter exists = jobs programme.

Hopefully the new model, whatever that looks like in weeks/months or possibly years to come, will result in GF managing to at least break even with smaller airframes pulling full loads to the nearish end of the envelope, and the handfull of 330's, possibly with expats up front.

Then, and only then, would expansion be warranted.

It may be too late by then, or not, you just never know. Stranger things have happened, and it's all about money, and timing.

UAE/Doha is booming but I always look at these things in a long view. Always room for a newbie or in GF's case, a refreshed up'n'comer. Maybe not good news for those who need/or need to keep a job now, and trust me I like me expats up front, but I sense contraction, suffering, rebuilding and then, if anyone has a brain, resurgence.

[dr_gonzo]

"Same here, heard via via from one of the mumtalakat board members that what the GDN reported was just one of the options. It just happened to be the most 'spectacular.'"

- As far as we (the GDN) know there were other options on the table, but the solution reported was the one chosen. Nothing has been officially approved by parliament or Shura Council yet so the situation could still change.

[cheesycol]

Perhaps the other options weren't worthy of such cataclysmic headlines?

[dr_gonzo]

"Perhaps the other options weren't worthy of such cataclysmic headlines?"


- The following article appeared on the GDN's page 1 on January 25. It seems they have gone for the downsizing option because parliament and the Shura Council refused to agree to a BD600m+ government bailout. They agreed to a BD185m handout based on a government-proposed downsizing.

This has been in discussion since January and it has taken them almost 10 months to reach a point where the government and the parliament/Shura Council are in agreement. However, both chambers must rubber stamp the downsizing plan in a vote before it is official.

"MANAMA: Radical plans for the future of Gulf Air have been drawn up that could have massive consequences for the airline and its staff.
The government has come up with four proposals: dissolve the airline altogether, sell it off and launch a new national carrier for Bahrain, conduct a downsizing of the carrier or allow it to continue in its current form with government support.
Top secret documents shown to the GDN suggest the second option, to sell off Gulf Air and build a new carrier from scratch, would cost the country BD460 million.
They estimate a downsizing operation could cost as much as BD600m, which one MP told the GDN would be the cost of cancelling international agreements and paying off employees made redundant, among other things.
A joint parliament and Shura Council committee formed on Monday has now been tasked to study the government proposals."


Gulf Daily News » Local News » Radical rethink of Gulf Air's future (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=322318)

[Romeo t]

Dr Gonzo,

I don't know why GDN try so hard to ruin gulf air reputation. Everybody knows that gulf air is used as a political instrument.

Look at the facts!

Which airline would have made a profit or break even if
1) the world media insist that the Arab spring is in Bahrain
2) embassies all over the world - urging their own citizens to avoid Bahrain
3) the cause way bridge is closed
4) 8 routes from Iraq and Iran closed - gulf air was the first serve Iraq.
5) high fuel prices
....... Much much more

Please note that while all this is happening - gulf air still had to pay the costs. Ie wages, fuel, landing charges etc etc... Please note also that gulf air still operated every flight, in which it kept the kingdom connected to the world despite what was happening around.

Please look at the facts and explain to all the citizens of Bahrain, that if the current situation is not going to stop - the whole economy and reputation of the whole country is being affected and it will take time to heal.

Whilst your neighbours are investing heavily in their infrastructure, tourism which includes a hub where you can meet people for buisness or leisure, a place where you can learn the Arab culture, a place of hostility and luxury - Bahrain citizens are fighting against each other and let the world wonder what exactly is going on. Who would invest in Bahrain with the current situation? Why would you fly gulf air as a passenger when you can fly etihad, Qatar or emirates with a better marketing and history behind their brand?

The option of downsizing will hurt gulf air as an airline, will hurt Bahraini families and the economy in general. I hope that won't be the solution. The nation need to come together and flourish an exciting future with prosperity, dignity and peace.

Looking forward to read an article that for once won't be political biased.

Romeo

[John21UK]

Basra will not be resumed: Gulf Air Shelves Planned Basra Service Resumption | Airline Route – Worldwide Airline Route Updates (http://airlineroute.net/2012/10/24/gf-bsr-w12cxld/)

So out of the planned 8 'new' destinations only 3 survived. Not a bad effort...:ugh:

[Sal-e]

I hope the GF guys and gals stationed out at KRT weren't anywhere near the factory that was bombed by four fighter bombers last night.

[EK2EYengineer]

Aircraft & crew is back in BAH on 20th

[John21UK]

Not too difficul to predict this: Gulf Daily News » Local News » Jobs dilemma for airline staff (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=340469)

[John21UK]

Heard something about a certain Manila, Jakarta, Hong Kong block late November.

[Mephistopheles]

Wonder how Gulf Air got around the 7 days max for the "Tour de Europe" block ,probably with alittle help from the friendly BCAA.
Life's good if your in with the bosses.

[Mephistopheles]

Anyway relax gentlemen I have heard that Capt M Salman & his favorite F/O are being rushed through a quick 320 CCQ course in order to do the "tour de europe" block. & why not may I ask since I know that the gentleman works harder than the rest of us so he's entitled to his easy block for a change!

[Soft Altitude]

Once again rostering at its best !
Way toooo difficult to split that block into at least 2 crew sets ...:ugh:
They are having at around 200 hours time away, that's what you get in an average flying month with 4 sector days, split duties and couple of night subcontinent flights ...
Amazing GF rostering, they just broke their own record :E

[gcc_]

Haters going to hate :confused:

[showel]

It is not about hate:} It is not really fair that some do hardly any flights except Europe, and others have to request to get one a month:ugh: Anyway, screw them all:):ok: Let them enjoy;)

[evilatp]

Showel, don't complain. :=
Since you are too cheap to buy the folks at rostering a bottle every week you should not expect to get anything good.
Tongue in cheek of course. But it seems like you have to play the game if you want a good roster. Otherwise you are at the mercy of the people upstairs

[SMT Member]

Went through FRA the other day, usual ME suspects all parked up. An Emirates 777, an Etihad 330 and the same from Oman. And then, out of the shade, came a humble A320 from Gluf. Quite the contrast.

[WELCO]

Since you are too cheap to buy the folks at rostering a bottle every week you should not expect to get anything good.

Why you couldn't keep the secret mate?! :E

[evilatp]

It doesn't matter. Most pilots are too stingy to do it. They call it "standing by their principles". ;)

[mamamia]

Gulf Air manager holding four positions has just failed etihad interview a week ago:D

[Landflap]

Some justice in the world then, eh ?

[Soft Altitude]

Mamamia, What do you mean by : "holding four positions" ? You mean, being a manager, trainer and captain ??? It still makes only three ... I really cant see any manager holding four managerial positions, GF wouldnt be having THAT many managers if this was true ...

[mamamia]

AT got it all or I guess you need to due your calculation start with A then T

[brassplate]

this is hilarious. if you have been in gf for the last 5-7 years and never saw the writing on the wall, it serves you right to be caught up in this cross-roads in your career. gulf air is doomed in more ways than one.

1. no long term strategy, at least none that have worked or adhered to so far
2. airlines in the gulf are raking in the bucks while gf is too top heavy to make anything, instead losing to the tune of 1.5million a day..or more
3. social problems with the locals on fantasy island destroying gf reputation with no end in sight
4. bahrainisation a priority ahead of profitisation
5. lack of teamwork among the managers, everyone watching for knives at their backs instead of the work at hand
6. even local pilots leaving, at least the ones who can be accepted by the neighbours by being affiliated with the 'correct' branch of their religion.
7. routes are opened without feasibility study, kept open when struggling, closed when market starts to picks up. no patience in developing markets.
8. to many chiefs not enough indians.
9. deep seated corruption and nepotism at every level. e.g contracts awarded to business's owned or affiliated with managers/board members etc.
10. all local managers. can of worms right there. offers only one perspective, the local way...or the local way. this has never been good in any international airline.
11. the worst one is even an ex-gf like myself can obtain this information. gf reeks of all the things that airlines should not be practicing and everyone in the industry can smell it.

get out while you can.

[Landflap]

Good Post Brassplate. I guess many of us retain an interest in " Gulfair Defelopments" because we enjoyed our time there . Nothing hilarious though, I have to say with the current unsettled state of affairs. Many of our colleagues will be unwilling or unable to move and will, regrettably, sink with the ship. "Get out while you can" is advice given by many over the last couple of years in fact. You are correct in all your points. Sad but true.

[AeroForce]

All very true brassplate and for your information, quite a few are abandoning ship for exactly these reasons, waiting for start or interview dates. Locals, gcc nationals and expat. However there are still many who do not wish to move and will wait until they have to. And not because they haven't seen it coming.

A Force

[DesertHawk]

Mamamia:

EY discussion was prohibited due to direct personal attacks. if u want to degrade our discussions to this please atleast have your facts straight.:ok:

[John21UK]

Anyway, back to happy news. Just saw the first pic of A321 nbr#5, A9C-CE, at Hamburg. I wasn't expecting any new arrivals after the 10 NOV news. #6 should then arrive in December. :ok:

[Che Guevara]

Would have been happier news if they were 333s like they should have been.

[buba]

I second che.. But beggars cant be choosers.. Lol

[John21UK]

A little bridie told me Gulf Air is proposing to keep around 28 aircraft. Aircraft to go are A319/A340/E190 and maybe 1 A320 and 1 A330. Last two new A321's will arrive. With the way things are going now they MAY need to hire new pilots late 2013.

Don't shoot the messenger... NO FACTS

[LNAV VNAV -]

I heard the same about 28 aircraft. But I heard it from someone who heard it from a big managerial bird.

[brassplate]

BBC News - Bahrain bomb blasts kill two foreign workers (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20203602)

6 IED nail bombs exploded in manama yesterday killing two, injuring others and damaging property.
i believe this disregard for innocent human life will only fuel bigger and bolder attacks on innocent people.
make your minds up, guys. if this is not a worrying development, i do not know what is.

[John21UK]

And if you read todays newspapers the oposition Al Wefaq is saying the events 'are fabricated' and a 'distraction tactic'. That has got a certain country's stamp all over it. (the same country that's denying that the holocaust ever took place "...due to the absence of independent human rights and media parties..."

[brassplate]

Al Wefaq is saying the events 'are fabricated' and a 'distraction tactic

lies. a filipino friend of mine who lives in gudaibiya where one of the explosions took place heard an explosion which shattered some of his windows.

[Landflap]

Some twerp on facebook, also in denial, claimed "it never happened". Of course it happened & I too have friends near to where it took place. Look, we all know this. And what does it have to do with " Gulfair Developments" (?), well, my dear John 21 UK, I think it might have some impact on GF Recruitment in 2013 for a start !

[flame_bringer]

brassplate
Your posts are completely unrelated to the topic, yes there were terrorist bombings but I believe that that is not the right place to post this, And it would be better if you would stop this fear mongering attitude because all of this is being taken care of by the security forces and it is thier duty to ensure foreigners security, This topic is about gulf air developments and politics are better off kept away.
When I flick this topic on I'm always usually after the company news, when reading posts such as your previous one it really renders the topic tedious and makes it lose value.
Thanks in advance

[samjetblaster]

Cheers:ok:

[brassplate]

my apologies. post removed. but if this goes on, it will not be fear mongering but reporting real reasons to be fearful.

[flame_bringer]

As long as you refrain from passing by the tense areas you will be fine and hopefully all of this will be sorted out, don't let this stuff distract you from doing your job.
Cheers

[Atebis]

Flamer...

Let me get this straight.... You suggest I close my eyes and ignore what's happening around me. Maybe take a different route to work...?

5 bombs exploding on the same day within hours of each others has very much to do with GF developments or lack there of. Bombs exploding on the island I call home does have an impact on my future here and the future and safety of my family.

Brassplate is not spreading terror, he's simply spreading the word. He's relaying facts. Those that are thinking of joining.... FYI... a couple of "tedious" bombs went off the other day. Politics does have its part with GF developments.... Routes, cash flow, hiring.... All discussed in parliament

[flame_bringer]

So what are you going to do?
Why don't you quit gulf air and work in the ministry of interior in chasing the terrorists, that would be a great idea...
And then make another topic thats titled terrorism developments.:E

Seriosly there is not much you can do about it, so keep this matter to the relevant authority and do your job.

[John21UK]

Does anyone hold any info regarding a 3 day trip coming up shortly on the Embraer to Athens/Casablanca?

[brassplate]

flame bringer,
now that is just being irresponsible and silly.
gulf air's certain demise is directly related to the security of gf employees in bahrain, among other things, like visitors reluctance to come to bahrain. you can not just put your head in the sand and say it has nothing to do with gulf air.
with a name like flame bringer, i will not be surprised if you are one of those thugs burning tires on the road and burning public and private property.

[EK2EYengineer]

Very well said brassplate

[John21UK]

Surprise surprise...CSeries first flight delayed till June 2013 and Entry Into Service till June 2014:
Bombardier delays first C Series flight - The Globe and Mail (http://m.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/bombardier-delays-first-c-series-flight/article5032632/?service=mobile)

Seeing Gulf Air is at present still M.E launch customer I wonder if they can now get out of this program in a 'less costly' manner... (depending on many obvious factors with regards to recent developments)

[buba]

Btw anybody heard anything regarding the saudi venture

[John21UK]

Gulf Air pay attention...:

Bulgarian private airline BH Air has applied with the US DOT for a Foreign Air Carrier Permit and route authority.

BH whose current largest aircraft is an A320 says it is "negotiations for lease of A340 and A330"

BH seeks to offer services both New York and Chicago with a proposed 3x weekly SOF-JFK-ORD-SOF routing. No start up date mentioned.

[flame_bringer]

Seems we're not alone when it comes to facing redundancies: Gulf Daily News » Local News » Redundancy fears spark union plea (http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/NewsDetails.aspx?storyid=341546)

Poor bahrain air chaps I reckon they are in a much more serious situation than us being as It's a low budget carrier with only 4 aircraft so thier revenues are already limited, Let alone being prohibited from the lucrative destinations.
The ministry of transport must understand that being a control freak won't bring any sort of wealth to the country and ultimately plummet it down to a worse recession.
I hope no one gets laid off or loses his job out there.

[55Jay]

Know it's a GF thread, but anyone know anyone at Bahrain Air with insight into which lucrative route is under review?

Fingers crossed it's not KTM.

Tx,

J

[LNAV VNAV -]

I heard its an issue with flight time limitations and the destinations are Dhaka and a couple of long Indias.

[55Jay]

Thanks. Regards, J.

[Panama Jack]

I heard its an issue with flight time limitations and the destinations are Dhaka and a couple of long Indias.

A business case built on the assumption that there will always be tailwinds (and crews willing to go into discretion)?

[John21UK]

Finally a sensible decision. Outstanding aircraft orders have been revised to 16 A320 NEO's and 12 to 16 787's. The only thing unclear to me is that it mentions 8 A320ceo's. Are they refering to the new A320er's and A321's already here?

Gulf Air restructures fleet orders with Boeing and Airbus to reduce long-term liability and meet future strategic needs | Gulf Air | AMEinfo.com (http://www.ameinfo.com/gulf-air-restructures-fleet-boeing-airbus-318647)

[mauro delpiero]

neo = new engine option

ceo = current engine option

[John21UK]

I know that, thanks. I mentions 8 A320ceo's (presumably current A320ER and A321's) And that would total 10 aircraft, not 8. Unless two come from a seperate order earlier on. It's good to see the 787's are still coming. I heard earliest 2016. So we'll finish 2012 with 24 A320 family aircraft. 14 of those are non -ER's and A319's. Presumably they will be replaced by these (newer) aircraft leaving a 2 aircraft expansion. That is if my quick mental maths are correct and I ain't gonna vouch for that... :p

[LNAV VNAV -]

I don't get it: What about the downsizing to 20 aircraft we were talking about last week?? :confused:

[John21UK]

Gulf Air allegedly proposes 28 aircraft and 16+12=28 Any visions of growth/development are out the window though...for the next 7 years.

And meanwhile all our neighbours are flying ever higher.

[LNAV VNAV -]

The below is from the Gulf Air careers site. Is Gulf Air recruiting pilots right now? And what 'expanding fleet' are they talking about?? :confused:

Current Vacancies

GULF1765 - Direct Entry Rated Captains for Airbus A320

Division:Pilots - Direct Entry
Location:Bahrain

Vacancy Information: We are now in the process of recruiting Direct Entry Rated Captains for Airbus A320 to join our expending fleet.

To be considered for this position you must:

[mickeydazzler]

wow

so sad to see from a distance whats hapenning to you guys and girls.
i miss that place,,,such a great country with great people,,
great airline.. with people like adel, gordo, richard, ishmail flying ?

should not have been bettered...or beaten

[buba]

The jist of an article in a uae rag..the outcome of the 'saudi venture' is to be announced end of this month. GF/QR to compete for the al qhattani group contract. Bah air and some chinese outfit to compete for a private contract. Whoever scores is required to set up shop within 6 to 7 months. Hope the old hag gets a slice of the pie.
Ps.. For all the harbringers of doom and gloom. GF is not the neighbours nxt door, we cant keep on makin comparison, nor is it SAS or iberia that just axed thousands of jobs and 17% pay cut. Count your blessings folks.

Nuff said.

[John21UK]

See reply 4605, then google "Dance Again World Tour" and put two and two together...