Gulf Air Developments

[T O G A Boy]

That so true Albergineman :ok:. Know exactly what you mean.

[Tziganul]

As long as lowering the minimums is not about getting the "boys" before the foreigners then it could work, but if it's anything but that, then there will be a lot of people pissed off! For me I don't care, they can put a guy with 1000 hours, my seniority wouldn't allow it for the next 2 years, and by then the "boys" will have the required hours, either way ... I just hope they aren't PUSHING the guys to command just because they are desperate, there a still lots of guys who have the hours and not to mention the guys who's second chance is up for grab again. They are not that desperate, they think we are stupid and that they can give us any salad and we'll eat it! Sorry but I stopped believing when I saw the 777 go back! We are looking at a very bright future flying C172 to Tubli and Isa Town!!!!!!!

AND PLEASE, DON'T SAY THAT IF THEY'LL PAY YOU THE SAME YOU'LL DO IT!!! THAT'S B.......T!!!!!

[Dessert Aviator]

Did any Pilots go to the meeting today ? if so feed back appreciated.:suspect:

[EK2EYengineer]

Nothing for cockpit/cabin crew they will review in 2011 for them mainly ground staff will get some pay increase but not been told how much that will be a rough ball game is between 18 to 20%.

[wrenchbender]

Are you saying the Engineers will get a pay raise of 18-20%?

[EK2EYengineer]

No i am not saying that and no body knows so far what will be the pay raise and who will get it its all up in the air as i said 18 t0 20% is a bracket and who ever will get it will be in this bracket

[Che Guevara]

If you look around you will find that most reputable airlines require 4000-5000 hours, and for good reason. Nobody disputes the fact there are some people that can do the job well with 3500, however there are many who can't.
Furthermore with the degradation of basic piloting skills through the use of modern automation and indeed in some cases, cadet pilot programs, we have further problem. When you consider the actual 'stick time' or actual handling time with the autopilot off on any given flight in our system, you soon realize that the pilot only really 'handles' the flight controls for a few minutes on every flight and the rest of time is spent 'monitoring' or manipulating the autopilot.
So what's the problem with that? Well, as good as these aircraft are, their Achilles heel is exposed when you have a major failure and you are forced to really fly and not push buttons. Unreliable airspeed, emergency electric configuration, multiple hydraulic failures etc. leave the unskilled pilot or shall we say 'rusty' pilot in a pretty uncomfortable position. Indeed add a bit of weather or poor airport facilities or even a cadet pilot in the right hand seat and things can deteriorate fairly rapidly.

So all of a sudden the 3500 hrs has been shaved down to perhaps a few hundred of actual flying (handling) time.

[Sal-e]

No question about it, some low-timers are light years ahead of high-timers. It isn't all about flight time in the log book any more since manipulating and monitoring autopilots is the same for one hour or ten hours.

It's not a matter of practice makes perfect, it's 'perfect' practice makes perfect.
So definitely, quality of flight hours play a far more significant 'experience' than total time alone.

Having said that, most of the time, better airmanship will favour the more experienced because nothing can ever replace good experience that only time can deliver.

The insurance companies recognise this and therefore it becomes a premium expense for an airline which pushes for lower times for commanders. (The very same reason why car licence holders of less than two years in Bahrain pay more than double the excess if they have a prang and/or pay much higher insurance premiums).

If GF decides to pursue this, they will have to be prepared for a massive spike in their insurance costs, and, ensure a much more rigorous training and monitoring regime than the current for low-time captains, and, pray nothing untoward happens.

[767]

Kabul . Kish.Das island .Zurku. Pa28-181:)

[Not Gulfair CEO]

Gulf air possible expansion could cover all these exocitic destinations;

Kabu,l kandahar, kish, bandar abbas, hafra al batin, Hail, gassim, ras al khaima, fujaira, musaira, salalah,salmaniya.......

Brace for impact Guys! :ugh:

[Che Guevara]

Seems to have missed out Mogadishu for some reason....Oh and what about Pyongyang?

[Sultan85]

can I add ((GAZA)) :}

[Albergineman]

For April 2011...

Easter Island with A319 ULR Stratosphere

:}

[Che Guevara]

Easter Island is not a war zone is it?

[Albergineman]

No, not at all! Google it!

27° 7'16.29"S
109°21'59.13"W

Cheers!

;)

[Che Guevara]

Thanks for the reply, I'm afraid I was being sarcastic as I do know where it is and indeed it is also known as Isla De Pascua in Chile. I did not know the coordinates though....
My sarcasm came after reading the 'new and future destinations' posts which included Kabul, another war zone.
Perhaps we should add Khandaher and Bagram as well....even more flights where our Life Insurance would not be valid.
Better fit flares and chaff dispensers to the Embraers then or are they already installed.

[finalcall]

Easter Island? I highly doubt it... I have never heard of the place until now. The Island is located in the Pacific and right now GF is focusing on regional routes.This is one of the most ludicrous rumors I have read..The flight would take more than 12-13hrs and by looking at GFs old wide body fleet, it seems they are not interested in adding those long haul destinations.

[Albergineman]

I can't believe you took the Rapa Nui destination seriously!

:eek:

[767]

;) Finall call i also hope you are joking with your remark:8

[Che Guevara]

Final call - I also heard Christmas Island is coming....

[Albergineman]

Better fit flares and chaff dispensers to the Embraers then or are they already installed.

Why not contract those DHL A300 crew to provide training on how to fly an Airbus without hydraulic system... and do not forget an additional questionaire for WZO (War Zone Operations)

:{

[Tziganul]

Well, Well, Well,

Guess what guys? ... The fleet transfers have resumed! So, the geniuses up on the 1st floor who kept on saying that we are fat of pilots, now are saying that next mont we'll be 18 A330/340 guys short!!!!!! Hmmm, If they'd only read this post, perhaps they would have figured it out earlier that this was INEVITABLE!!!! And of course, as always they don't prevent but only react. So, once again, the "regular" line pilots were right and the geniuses on the first floor were .... out to lunch. And what about these 340? It seems to me that every time we get close to Xmas, they keep saying they'll get rid of it and they're still here, just like poverty on the world!!! Can't wait to see what they'll have to say on December 5th at 4pm! Oh wait, 4pm? ..... Isn't 4pm too late to work when you have an office job? ...

[ironbutt57]

2 A-340 to remain in service UFN..hence the need for fleet transfers..

[Albergineman]

2 A-340 to remain in service UFN..hence the need for fleet transfers..


Also, 2 out of 3 of the old A320 will remain UFN pushing the A320 pilots's shortage envelope a bit further.

Time for overtime for extra Christmas gifts!!!!

:E

[finalcall]

Guess what guys? ... The fleet transfers have resumed! So, the geniuses up on the 1st floor who kept on saying that we are fat of pilots, now are saying that next mont we'll be 18 A330/340 guys short!!!!!! Hmmm, If they'd only read this post, perhaps they would have figured it out earlier that this was INEVITABLE!!!! And of course, as always they don't prevent but only react. So, once again, the "regular" line pilots were right and the geniuses on the first floor were .... out to lunch. And what about these 340?didn't see that comming.:E
For many of you who are still in GF should carry out the following steps in order to avoid future disappointments.
1.Take not book and a pen/pencil.
2.write down all your hopes and dreams in what you would become in GF .and what you want GF to be.
3.write your hearts out and note down what ever comes to you mind (mainly positive points)
4.Close the book.
5.Flush it down the toilet closest to you/throw it in the fire place.
Your pick.

[brassplate]

So, the geniuses up on the 1st floor who kept on saying that we are fat of pilots, now are saying that next mont we'll be 18 A330/340 guys short!!!!!!


they only want pilots to THINK that, so they don't have to pay us what we are REALLY worth.

instead, they pay themselves a whole heap, and create allies from ground staff (who are more useless than the tits of a bull) by giving them some of the crumbs.

[ironbutt57]

Only got one "classic" 320 left, and its here for a while yet, story goes 321's are out the door (thanks God), so we see...

[samjetblaster]

Any salary pay rise for Pilots? Why ground staff only? (Pen pushers)??

[Sultan85]

27th Nov 2010 07:33samjetblasterAny salary pay rise for Pilots? Why ground staff only? (Pen pushers)??

In your dreams!!!:}
our CEO and his sh:mad::mad::mad: mangment thinks we are useless and overpaid :}

[Tziganul]

Nice article, I think we can't learn anything else at the meeting on the 5th! There we go folks, if our beloved master thinks we can do it, who are we to say we can't. Hmmm last time i heard "yes we can!", it didn't turn out too well for a particular president, sure he got elected, but nothing has changed! And now, it's clear, black and white, REGIONAL AIRLINE!!!!!!!!!!! Here's what in my opinion is the trouble at GFA.

1) The round table!!!
2) 30 airplanes = 4200 employes to run it!
3) If a person can't do the job he's been asked to, then hire someone else to do it for him while promoting that person to a manager of ___.
4) Thieves!!!! even our beloved master said it at the big meeting, "some people were creating a different pay scale for themselves while others were stagnant"

As they would put it in my native language .... don't do the crime if you can't do the time!!!!! When will people realize that this and all the GCC airlines were not created to make money but to simple show the neighbor that I have more money than you!!!!! If we all accept that, then there is no problem, these airlines are doing exactly what they were meant to do, and that is, show off!!!!! 100 A380 for Emirates!!!! Hellow, your population doesn't even have 1m!!!!!!

[jackbauer]

Tziganul, EK made $970m dollar profit in the first six months of this year. Douche!

[capgemini]

HA HA HA:= EK made $970m dollar profit in the first six months of this year.... ,SO WHAT ABOUT THIS GUARDIAN ARTICLE :
The International Monetary Fund estimates its total indebtedness at $US110 billion, including the debts of central government, government-related companies such as Dubai World, and other corporations. This is about 140 per cent of GDP - putting the emirate above Greece and Ireland in the world debt league.

Compounding Dubai's problems, much of this debt falls due in the short to medium term. Some $US24 billion is repayable between now and the third quarter of 2012, suggesting that a raft of restructurings are likely soon.

Dubai Holding, the conglomerate owned personally by Sheikh Mohammed, which owns the Jumeirah hotels brand as well as the emirate's once gung-ho private equity group, Dubai International Capital, sent a shiver through UAE markets just before the Eid al-Adha holiday last week with a statement that it was in talks with bankers to restructure its $12 billion or so of debts.

It had missed two debt repayments, and is in serious risk of a formal default. It promises a resolution by the end of this month.

As well as rescheduling, Dubai has also said it will sell assets to repay debts. Some of these will be baubles that the emirate picked up on international markets in the boom years, from the New York retailer Barneys to the Canadian entertainment group Cirque du Soleil and the cruise liner QE2.

Others possibly earmarked for disposal or flotation on international markets include the indigenous businesses built up as part of the core economic strategy: Jumeirah hotels, Emirates Airlines and the DP World ports and shipping group (which contains the old P&O business bought in 2006).

''Is Dubai going to sell the family silver to pay for its profligacy? That would be a big blow to its pride,'' said a local banker.

In particular, another branch of the UAE family might object. Abu Dhabi, the biggest emirate, which plays Washington to Dubai's New York, will want a say in the fate of these and other assets regarded as core to the UAE's global strategy. There are already plans to merge the Dubai and Abu Dhabi sharemarkets, and there has been open speculation about Abu Dhabi taking over Dubai's huge new airport, the modestly named Dubai World Central.

Perhaps the most significant change of the past year has been the relationship between Dubai and the far richer but more conservative Abu Dhabi. The capital bailed out Dubai with $US20 billion of loans at the height of the crisis. These also have to be repaid and it is likely that Abu Dhabi will ultimately want a different kind of return.

Davidson said: ''For the first time in 170 years, Dubai has lost its de facto autonomy, given that its creditor and lifeline is now oil-rich Abu Dhabi, which has clear and unashamed ambitions to centralise the UAE federation and curb any autonomous macro-economic or political activity within its borders.''

Apart from the possibility of Abu Dhabi taking over Dubai's assets, this new subservience to the capital could make itself felt in two other ways, both with serious implications for Dubai: the setting of the emirate's budgets within the overall federal financial structure...........:oh::oh::{

[jackbauer]

The article refers to Dubai not EK. Another Douche!FT.com / Companies / Airlines - Emirates profits quadruple to $925m (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/af82cb6a-e59e-11df-b023-00144feabdc0.html#axzz16rUQzloD)

[Heleheleyani]

jackbauer, you are either not intelligent enough or fooling yourself with their lies, good luck either case

[capgemini]

Any difference :rolleyes:keep relying on those numbers:=

[jackbauer]

As the one who works for the 40 thieves in GF I would suggest you are the one who needs the luck. You can have mine. What is the loss now, about $1.5m/day. Ha ha ha! Good luck Regional Boy.

[capgemini]

seems that you already MISSED GF:{:confused:

[Heleheleyani]

well i am glad i am not in the same company with these nasty characters like jackbauer. I bet he will never be happy.

PS I would much rather fly locally and live in Bahrain than to fly 18 hours followed by 24 hours rest and fly back to dubai for 18 hours. Don't blame GF when you are diagnosed with cancer.

Good luck radiation boy !!!

[jackbauer]

Hee hee I'm real happy especially when winding up you nieve bunch. Keep it coming. Love being the evil one:\

[ironbutt57]

If you are going to call us "naive" then learn how to spell it at least...:ok:

some of us enjoy our lifestyle, and have a job to support it, others seem to center their life on their job, because they have no life out of uniform....:confused:

[capgemini]

jackbauer :\,by the way if you are in admiration of EK ,what are you doing in gulfair developments thread :hmm:i call that nostalgia :)safe Flt radiation boy

[Landflap]

Well said IronB. I had a short spell in Gf. Loved it. Bahrainis were sooooper. All the Arab guys I had the privilage to fly with were better than any Europeans or others. I too, just really enjoyed Bahrain and all it had to offer, Family loved it, kids thrived and all went on to really good stuff, as a result of the above average Bahrain school education. Nothing "naive" here, either. Good luck to you all.

[jackx123]

ironbutt

you don't seem to have a life out of uniform since your focus seems to be on spelling mistakes. i bet you have never made one ......:}

[Tziganul]

Look guys, who the hell cares about spelling mistakes!!!! All I'm saying is that you must realize that these companies were not put up for profits. From what I have gathered, Emirates started because one player at the round table wanted more flights to ____, back then, GF was the the "bully" of the region and said no, so, Emirates started up, GF was laughing at it, now Emirates is laughing at GF and I believe the same scenario was for Etihad and Qatar. Then the Omani weren't happy at trowing money down the toilet and the result is that GF is now a "national carrier"!!! Solely owned by the proud gov of BAH!!!! :D oups i did forget the hugely importance of the highly qualified Mumtalakat management :E

Now, as for quality of live, im surprised that anyone still believes that you are an actual human being with rights when you work in the GCC!! For those wonderful western boys, that includes my beloved USA, CAN, EU Nations (but not the eastern european countries because non of the GCC countries seem to realize that a country like Poland is part of the EU, and therefore gives anyone from the eastern europe hard time with the visa's because everyone there is a prostitute!!!! ) ... boys, aside from a hand full of countries in the world, there is no human rights, no working labour law, no logic to a judicial system, it's the jungle!!!!!!! So if you want to make the "BIG" money by being in the GCC because your own country steals from you in the form of taxes that are supposed to be beneficiating everyone but you, then you have a hard decision to take .... hmmmm .... money vs quality of life vs being the slave of a GCC owner or being the slave of the nice and polite western government ...... hard choices folks, hard choices!!! i wouldn't want to be one of you having that to make that choice.

As for me, being a slave that makes about 10k/month, that suits me fine. i'd rather be a slave living opulently than a "free" slave.

damn, i've wasted too much of my "free" time on this forum! I sure hope my master doesn't find out:E

[Mephistopheles]

A word of warning gentlemen. Keep a close eye on your leave balances since by the end of the year the 'easy' system will only carry over 10 days to 2011 & although we have been told it will not effect us you can bet your a** the scum in HR will use it as an excuse to screw us over once again.

[CRUIZE]

Tziganul (http://www.pprune.org/members/218940-tziganul)

I believe your grown man / woman. win some lose some or vice versa. the choice is yours.

[repapips]

All quiet after the meeting?

[ironbutt57]

What does being in or out of uniform have to do with spelling mistakes??...and no news from the meeting..

Im sitting here in my civvies with a Caribou coffee reading the same people bitch and moan at their new job just like they did when they were here...grown-ups move forward, brats (euro) live in the past...and relive the same headaches wherever they go...

[Tziganul]

So, great meeting right?

What have we learned? ... We are still in the red, we've cut down 20% of our staff while at the same time managing on doing more movements, saved more fuel, and according to the stats, pilot utilization was high.

We've also learned that the plan for 2012 is to be as close as possible to zero losses, or "manageable". That we'll have 25 narrow bodies, 10 regional, single digits long range. That perhaps the rest of the 6 regionals to come might be A318, and that there is no way in Hell that rostering will change any time soon!

We've learned that lots of failures to command, perhaps due to a "legacy" system and also due to the lack of preparation. They are working on it and "soon" a better system will come out.

We've learned that some pilots fly too much, some not at all, and according to management it's all because of swaps.

We've learned that the EMB boys are frustrated because they have been on the "upgrade" since the beginning of the year and as the most senior f/o's they were making the least money.

We've learned that implementing a new fleet is very very very difficult and that there will be hardships for everyone. That those who decide to stick it out will reap the benefits of it, whatever they may be.

We've learned that the rumor of lowering the mins for captains to 3500 hrs is bs.

We've learned that the transfer for f/o's to the 330 is still ongoing. That the mix fleet flying will resume in March for captains only.

What do I think? ... You won't loose your job, you'll still get payed on time, you won't fly the biggest airplane in the world for the biggest airline in the world on the most exotic destinations but you'll always be employed providing you don't directly insult the CEO, DFO, CP, MDFO, MCP, MCEO, who did I miss? Well you get the drift...

all and all not bad, thou I must admit was not impressed with the sandwiches!!!! they didn't have as many as last time, once again reflecting the budget cuts ! but well done, it's the thought that counts. :D almost felt special :O

[Che Guevara]

We've learned that lots of failures to command, perhaps due to a "legacy" system and also due to the lack of preparation. They are working on it and "soon" a better system will come out.

Care to expand on the 'legacy' system to which you refer?

[slowjet]

The ex RAF and non military Brits of the 60's to 70's ruled with an iron fist and created misery for the newly established cadet scheme. Many were failures in their own time and became the bully boys. I did ask one Kiwi fruitcake at a BBQ why he was "failing" so many people. He replied " I like people to be scared of me" ! The "Legacy" was that many victims learned nothing as juniors & became equally murderous in the sim, and on the line, in years to come. Thanks to Aussie, RJ, there was a breath of fresh air in the Training Dept. "Train to excellence" was his motto but not followed by the "old School". There are some, who delight in "testing" and have no idea what "Training" means. Stuck with this until more of us, get into training for the right reasons. I asked one guy why he had applied for a Training position, he replied, "well, it looks good on the ole CV" !!!!!

In GF, you still have the hard core bully guys who just enjoy failing people rather than training them. Old school, grandfather rights, and rotten to the core. Aaaahhh, but they......."know people " !!

THE LEGACY. Good name for my book blowing the lid on the rotters. Watch this space .

[Tziganul]

Che,

There you go, Slowjet put it in plain language and quite diplomatically, I would have been more subjective of course ;)

[Che Guevara]

Thanks for your thoughts, however you missed out on the second part of the quote which mentions being 'unprepared' or 'lack of preparation'. Is this also attributed to the so called 'Legacy' system that you refer?

Cheers

[rumrunner69]

I have not met one senior first officer that did not "prepare" for the upgrade interview. Myself included. Some had very tight time contraints- from learning the new aircraft to assessment and interview. Most of the senior fo's have been flying for the company for six years and the company should know the command capabilities of the fo's by now. Instead they hired 6 DECs on the Embraer ... solves the problem of getting left seat guys and keeps guys with experience in the right seat (hire left seat DECs for less than our Capts and have experience in the RHS without using the training resources that we are lacking). This kicks the **** out of morale when the hiring market is statirng to picking up. They might have to drop the captain minimums to keep guys around.

[slowjet]

Che,yes, part of a legacy of course. Create a climate of fear & people respond. Overpreparation is something we all do, for any exam. I too, like rumrunner, have never heard of "underpreparation". Of course there are a few, laid back guys, who think that the upgrade is a walk in the park & not even worth digging the books out for. For some really talented chaps, this is true. However, the perception from the Command Selection Board is that you appear uninterested or that the upgrade is just a seat swop. In a selective environment, you cannot afford to be THAT laid back.

All airlines differ. Some really do swop seats.It appears that way but, as RR says, after five or ten years in the RHS, companies already know if you are LHS material or not. GF adopted this awful obstacle course for all (even previous Captains who served GF in the RHS, initially,) and, I think RH & PM went too far in devising a selection procedure similar to the one they probably failed !

In my first Company, RHS was always coaching for the LHS. It was a long time to command, 12-15 years and those who really did not show Command potential were told that, many times in the lead up to upgrade. Some chaps were not interested in LHS. GF has a few.But, after 12 years, the Company provided a Command Preparation Course.One week of Tech review, classroom discussions & even a few sessions in the LHS, all fun, just to get used to the perspective. The Company really was focused upon "Training" and interested in getting loyal company First Officers into the LHS.

Once the "legacy" of the rotten old school have gone, GF has a big chance, with the young, enthusiastic Trainers to "Train to excellance".

Keep up the high standards guys. Always delighted in flying with the most talented bunch of people I have ever known.

[Tziganul]

Just heard the other day that they are seriously running out of f/o's with the time for upgrade. The unofficial number is 25 (excluding the ones who will be eligible for their 2nd try). If they continue to upgrade 2/month, and the failure continue to be 80%, ...., well, that means that by the end of 2011 they will have run out of guys and perhaps, just perhaps DEC! Of course, this rumor is only worth what I payed for ... = 0bd. However, you know what they say, the best things in life are free! :)

[samjetblaster]

How many Pilots are leaving Gulf Air????
:uhoh::mad:

[T O G A Boy]

Rumour has it, that quite a few are leaving.

[Tziganul]

Yeah that rumor has been around for the last 2 years, yet, where are they these guys who are leaving? In the last year we've lost what, maybe 40 guys, not counting the over 60 they have forced out. The more guys leave, the more they'll replace them with SO's, so there is no problem, it's the natural attrition oh skilled labour for bahrainisation. On the other hand, nobody can blame them for wanting an airline to be 100% bahraini, it's and utopian idea for a "national" airline. Trouble is, even the bahraini labour is getting out! But to come back to the rumor, so far, can't say i'm impressed with the exits, surely it won't have the effect of all the guys who have put in their resignation 3 years ago in order to get the pay package up. :=

[Donkey Duke]

Are newhires going to the E170 or E190 fleet, or are they going to the A320? What do the Gulf Air pilots think of the new EMBs? What are the rosters like on that fleet and bus? Cheers.

[Che Guevara]

What do the Gulf Air pilots think of the new EMBs?

Not a lot from what I hear.....

[Atebis]

That's right Che. Its Terrible!.......The 320 is way better!

[Yo767]

Boeing = Cadillac (solid, powerful, confortable and reliable)

Airbus = Renault (economical and french engineered (not very simple) )

Embraer = Lada (cheap (made for poor people), unreliable, underpower and ugly)

But I am home every night, rarely do 4 sectors and still get the same salary.

[ironbutt57]

Have to agree with Yo, I enjoy the life that my job allows me to have, not worth it to get all caught up in shiny widebody, etc....etc....at the expense of a good lifestyle...mmm my boat and my Seoul-mate is waiting..later boys!!

[Che Guevara]

First we had the Tuk Tuk (320s) and now the Lada! Brilliant, much better than the Embryer I think, so much more descriptive!

The Lada she shall be then....cheap, cheerful and .....well, you know.


Somewhere in the middle of Spain, a Lada is driving along and meets a donkey.
The donkey, never having seen a Lada before, asks:"What are you?"
The Lada: "I am a car. What are you?"
The donkey: "Hahahaha... I'm a horse..."

No offense to any Lada pilots here but I fear if things keep going the way they are, we could all be riding donkeys.....at least they'll be horses one day if we imagine it!

Cheers all

[jackx123]

Boeing = Cadillac (solid, powerful, confortable and reliable)

and taken out of service because falling apart.

[ironbutt57]

"Taken out of service" yes, any aircraft has to be properly maintained,

[Che Guevara]

If you don't maintain a Cadillac or a Merc, they will become Ladas someday!
However, if you don't maintain a Lada, well watch and see....

[dkz]

Just checking the Formula 1 website ... i see the Renault team leading the board with 498 points there but i fail to spot the Cadillac team :}

[jackx123]

dkz:

cadillac team is working at GF. you didn't know?? :eek:

[Tziganul]

Cadies, Ladas, Renault, who cares! This war between Boeing and Airbus has been going on since the beginning. It's the same as the French vs English, is there anyone better? Both have screwed the world as we know it! The French have screwed most of Africa, and the English the rest of the world. Well, still there is the Portuguese and Spanish in there but not to the same extent. Look at the greeks vs turkish, mainland china vs japan vs korea, etc...

Bottom line is that they're just a tool and even the best tools in the world won't do the job if not used for its purpose. I can try to fix a car engine with only the best of Revlon's nail cutter or eye liner but it was not meant for that. That's the same way here, using A330's to do a DMM, DOH etc. You never utilize an airplane to its full potential if you don't fly it close to its max range.

So it's neither the Boeing of Airbus's fault it's the owner!!!! It won't be long before our brand new A320 will start having APU's problems during the summer or that the new B787 will fall apart for poor maintenance!

On that thought, cheers and do the best with what you've got, which is not much!

[samjetblaster]

Boeing = Cadillac (solid, powerful, confortable and reliable)+ Mercedes Benz+economical:ok:

Airbus = Lada (uneconomical and french engineered (not very simple)+complicated ) Corrupt. :}

Embraer = Lada (cheap (made for poor people ), unreliable, underpower and ugly):bored:

But I am home every night, rarely do 4 sectors and still get the same salary.

[Che Guevara]

Any comments on the rumoured the BAH-DAC-BAH DH back to DAC ?

[40&80]

I think DAC should read MNL

[Che Guevara]

No I meant OBBI-VGZR-OBBI and DH back to VGZR in one duty.

[ironbutt57]

You will also probably fail to spot 40-50 year old A-340's with cargo doors flying the skies, as you do Douglas and Boeing aircraft....I'll take the Cadillac over the Renault or Citroen any day...

[Che Guevara]

Can't tempt you with the Lada huh?

[DesertHawk]

lada, renault or caddy dont really care. give me a job that provides a good salary, a carrer progresson plan and most importantly a lifestyle. GF should be more concerned about it crew policies and then the aircraft issues would be small potatoes if all the other variables were taken care of!

[Yo767]

Desert Hawk, you dont really care which ride you drive (Lada, Renault or Cadillac) until the day GF doesnt need you anymore or you had enough of the place. There are jobs in Far East right now on the Tuk Tuk that pay 200 000USD or you can find some Lada driver jobs for less than half of this.

So if you are a Bahraini and plans never to leave the Fantastic Island, I would say the Lada is the way to go.

[jackx123]

76: that's what happened to chris i believe

[DesertHawk]

I agree with your sentiment YO but to be honest it is not the companies responsibility to secure your future employment. Obviously a 320 type is preferable but if u are planning to stay 3-5 years more a stint on the EMB is not a horrible thing. I stand by what I said. If GF fixed its many problems that do not include aircraft most would not be leaving to jobs that move u sideways not up the chain if u get me. When our VP states that we can not get more then 8 days off cause office staff have only 8 days u have to wonder who is in control of this train!!!!:ugh:

[WELCO]

Guys.. Are you here addressing your personal problems with the airline or the company's problems with the whole region and the world?!

Cheers.

[DesertHawk]

NO not addressing my personal problems. I would think all pilots and managment alike would want our airline to organize in a way to maximize all staff and have a energetic positive working corps of staff. Since I have been employed at GF crew rostering and general organization of all matters has been a massive problem, and more importantly to GF, a massive drain on resources and finances. The recent EMB induction only highlights GF's lack of planning and general understanding to its pilots albeit ops managment was not given alot of lead in time. My whole point is we lose highly trained pilots every year to our competitors. Some for reasons GF can never solve but alot leave due to reason GF has full control over. GF's new years resolution should be to reasess the amount of quality peole we lose and develop an attitude to benefit staff and managment alike. This will SAVE money in training and most of all be a first step in becoming an employer of choice!!!!

Just so u all know, I know u will rip me for being VERY optimistic but hey its christmas time u have to wish for soemthing!!!!

[T O G A Boy]

Wow Despicable me. What a post for a first timer on this forum. Is that what your main concern is, in life?
Get a life my friend, coz if you want to pick on these issues, trust me, you'll be suicidal very soon. Yeah i agree with you that some things arent fair, but just remember one thing. All these managements that we have will one day lose their positions and they have no friends to fall unto. Let them enjoy their time while it lasts.............:yuk:

[Not Gulfair CEO]

Listen man you are not wiki so just go take a leak and release your self, you are just a puppet from a different camp. obviously your camp does not like 21 MNL camp. but why it should come to you as a curruption, you all are entitled to request one block with any one you like unless no one wants to fly with you.
will you stop your stupid posts as they are quite irratating now.

[Apache702]

CEO is in his PMS :}

[Tziganul]

hahahahahahahahahahahhahahaahha

[767]

Merry X mas;)

[Not Gulfair CEO]

I agree that many of these guys are not the best qualified for the job but do you have any names with in the company who are? how about your self, do you have any qualification to take up the safety department? or human factor.
look around who is the COO of etihad and check his package and tell me if he is worthy of even fraction of the package that he is getting.Does he qualify to take up the the salmi's job?Salmi is the best of the worst that you could get for the package gulf air is giving him.Is he qualified? may be not. Is he doing better job than etihad qatar oman emirite COOs? may be he is.
Since you have mentioned all the names, why dont you mention all the dick and harrys that are worthy of replacing these good for nothing, corrupt, maal waasta individuals.

[Sultan85]

bunch of uselees kids:mad: :}:}:}

[SandShovel]

So, more Omanis are leaving soon:rolleyes:

[Despicable Me]

7 capt , 8 F/O.... and if oman air pay them school fees ..... all will move

[T O G A Boy]

Thats sad if its true coz the Omani Capts we have are all great guys. And again there wud be pilot shortage and again DECs. What is happening in that Pink Palace. Can someone pls elaborate.............:ugh::ugh:

[Despicable Me]

As per A.A , we are fat of pilots.... caz still some boys flying on thier days off and leaves,...... so they are not too worried since we have those kind of people who daying for 150 and 100 dinars extra........ and by grounding more A340 , they should not be worried too much.......

[bus_aviator]

we're short on 320 f/o's, starting to see 2 captains on deck in a few flights, poor guys they've already been pushed to their duty limits now they have to do that out of the right seat as well...i think dec's are starting to be a reality...that'll make a few more right seaters leave, as the sparkle in their eye of a command dissapears. good foresight gulfair :(

[repapips]

@Despicable Me:

Say what??? Again what???
Anybody care to explain in plain English what the message was?

[Tziganul]

Wiseman,

How long have you been here? If you have been here long enough, then you should know that reporting anything or anyone, if from a particular "origin" nothing happens! As for getting the right info, I TOTALY AGREE with you on that.

[bus_aviator]

So initially we had the atpl allowance ( f/o 's) taken off the payslip without any notice and that slipped by quietly even though the cam says we should still be receiving that hehe. Now i've noticed we don't get the 6 nominee tickets with staff travel...and funny enough it seems to be slipping by pretty well....so my friends exactly when are we going to start paying to have the privilage to fly for gf? just some food for thought...p.s. am i paranoid?

[jackx123]

wiseman. err. PPRuNe is what? A Rumor network :ok:

[gf-jr]

Hi,
are retired grade 11 staff allowed to buy ID 50 j class on other gulf airlines like Qatar airways or emirates or etihad?
Thanks

[Panama Jack]

Looks like Nominee Tickets are history, according to an e-mail that was sent out by HR Services less than an hour ago:

In accordance to the new company’s strategy and direction to improve the staff travel facilities and benefits for its employee, Gulf Air has revised the current Staff Travel policy and entitlements and accordingly we regret to advise you that the Nominee Tickets are no longer part of your entitlements and will be discontinued effective 1st January 2011.

However, at present we are revising the current Staff Travel benefits and facilities and we are going to implement the new entitlements and benefits very shortly, with more facilities to the employee and their immediate families.

We are sure you have enjoyed the previous benefits, and hope that you understand the company’s present decision.

For any partially used nominee tickets, cancellation or refund you may process it through STMS or approach our staff travel outlet for any assistance.


I will be curious to see the results of the Company's strategy and direction to improve staff travel benefits, and how the discontinuation of Nominee tickets fits into the scheme.

I suspect that the suspension of the Nominee scheme is due to some unscrupulous individuals trying to make a little extra money by selling these tickets to strangers ("friends"); and those passengers cause problems because they do not understand the protocols for "staff" passengers. Once again, a minority ruins it for the majority and instead of the Company punishing the offenders, all employees suffer the consequences. Saw it at my previous employer also.

Over the last few years our staff travel benefits have slowly withered away, in part because of what I perceive as a lack of effort of HR Services to 1) increase the number of airlines we can access, 2) revise and improve the benefits on existing airlines (especially those which are not immediately in the GCC area) and, 3) the merger or bankruptcy of airlines with which we had agreements (ie. Mexicana) and no effort made to fill the gap.

I feel it is important for the Company to understand that, as an employee, I do not view Staff Travel as a "privilege" per se, but as an important piece of my total compensation scheme of which my pay, medical and dental benefits, etc. all play a part. It is one important benefit which discriminates and makes an IATA legacy carrier, like Gulf Air, considerably more attractive as an employer than some Low-Cost Carriers which otherwise may offer some more attractive options.

I wish all of you a safe and successful 2011.

[gf-jr]

Will the retired staff especially grade 10 and 11 staff benefit from the new scheme. It would be great if GF gives them their old entitlements which included the option to buy ID 50 or 90 j class tkts.
A suggestion would be that GF allow the retirees to buy discounted tkts on the old j class seats only.
A final question are retired grade 11 staff allowed to buy ID 50 j class tkts on other Gulf airlines like Qatar Airways, Emirates, or Etihad?

[Mike.Park]

In late 2007, Gulf Air, the national airline of the oil-rich kingdom of Bahrain, picked Airbus for a huge sale. Boeing told the US government, which responded that there was still a way to turn the deal around, even though Airbus had offered the planes for about $US400 million less than Boeing.

The US ambassador at the time, Adam Ereli, went to work ''lobbying Gulf Air management, board members, government officials and representatives of parliament'', and appealing directly to the crown prince of Bahrain, in an effort to line up a deal for Boeing that could be final in time for a coming visit by Bush, the first visit by a sitting US president. Within two weeks, the embassy alerted Boeing officials that the crown prince and king of Bahrain had rejected Airbus's offer and directed Gulf Air's chairman to make a deal with Boeing that could be signed while Bush was in the country.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy made a last-minute bid to save the deal, the State Department cable says. He offered to visit Bahrain after Bush had left, but that stop was cancelled when the Boeing agreement was signed in January 2008.

Source: New York Times (http://www.watoday.com.au/world/government-for-sale-make-us-an-offer-20110103-19ds5.html)

[Spirit]

But then again: Was GF not to be among the Launch Customers for the B777 back in the early '90s...when suddenly Airbus was chosen, alledgedly because a lot of money had changed hands under the table?

If so: What goes around, comes around, Nico :}

[Sal-e]

Yay, Boeings on the way back.....maybe.

[Panama Jack]

Not surprised. It is merely another chapter in the story of high-stakes sales between industry titans Airbus and Boeing. Both manufacturers and their host governments (EU and USA) play this game, despite insistence to the contrary. There are many stories like this and, unfortunately, state-owned airlines are sometimes along for the ride when political currents get involved. There is an interesting article on this in Flight Global’s blog.

#AvCablegate: US State Department swayed Gulf Air order from Airbus A350 to Boeing 787 - Flight International (http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/flight-international/2011/01/avcablegate-us-state-departmen.html)

Don’t get me wrong though. I think the Boeing 787, when it arrives, will be the ideal aircraft for Gulf Air and I couldn’t be more pleased that it is part of our fleet planning.

What would have been even more fascinating is if Wikileaks could have cracked files in many other countries such as certain EU and GCC countries, India, Pakistan, as well of those of the People’s Republic of China.

[Mike.Park]

What would have been even more fascinating is if Wikileaks could have cracked files in many other countries such as certain EU and GCC countriesWikileaks were not involved in 'cracking' anything. All Wikileaks do is host and disseminate information handed to them by 3rd parties. People forget that all the leaks and information they host are handed to them by disgruntled insiders.

[QatarA340]

According to http://airlineroute.net/2011/01/05/gf-gvamxp-s11/ (http://airlineroute.net/2011/01/05/gf-gvamxp-s11/)

Gulf Air from 28MAR11 will be expanding service to Europe after it scaled back its operation for 24-36 months. From 28MAR11, it’ll be launching 3 weekly Bahrain – Geneva and 4 weekly Bahrain – Milan Malpensa on board 2-class 94-seater Boeing 737 aircraft.

The Boeing 737 aircraft is configured in J16Y78

Schedules and configuration as follows:

Bahrain – Geneva
GF023 BAH0215 – 0750GVA 737 246
GF022 GVA1150 – 1850BAH 737 246

Bahrain – Milan Malpensa
GF021 BAH0215 – 0735MXP 737 x246
GF020 MXP1200 – 1850BAH 737 x246

__________________


I am not sure where it is getting the B737, as it is currently operating A320s!

Anybody knows?

[Radar Contact]

The route will be operated by Privatair until Summer 2011 then it will switch to GF A320LR Metal.

[SandShovel]

Heard a rumor it will be 321LR:confused:

[QatarA340]

^^ What is he for real? If he had such an important meeting, he should fly direct NOT via a coutry 500 km away! DUMBA$$! The courts are on crack seriously.

[T O G A Boy]

My little birdie told me today that the Sheraton Hotel was jam packed with Gulf Air Cabin crew applying for Emirates, as they were having a walk in interview. Not only did we lose good pilots recently :ugh: but it seems that our hosties are leaving too for greener pastures. Little do I blame them as they are living under the fear and scrutiny of being fired.
Well done, to those responsible for the low morale our crew are in today and helping the giant companies win our best assets, OUR CREW :hmm:

[Panama Jack]

There is a philosophy that says that the best time for looking for a job is when you don't need one.

The rumor circulating is that the Company is looking to further reduce staffing, however a significant amount of this will come from the reduction of cabin crew in the near future. So for the FA's that have their contract renewal coming up in the weeks ahead, I appreciate their concern and think it is normal for them to want to look at other options just in case their contract is not renewed. I would be doing the same if a similar rumor was about pilots.

I agree with you that the Cabin Crew are the Company's greatest asset. Moreover, I believe that these front-line employees actually carry the Company. It is unfortunate that they don't get more credit on a regular basis, which I think is due.

[ironbutt57]

Have to agree PJ, sad the powers that be don't see it that way....but it,s "industry standard" thinking unfortunately:ugh:

[Tziganul]

Alas, the great western way of doing things are slowly catching up to this part of the world as well. Work, work, work, work and get payed as little as possible because if you are not willing to do the job, someone else will for cheaper, so shut up and get to work! Boys and girls, unfortunately, once again the west has spoiled it for everyone else, thank you Southwest!!!!!! :D because of you we are all now suffering and downgraded to just bus drivers, oh wait a minute, they actually have better conditions! :ugh:

[Mephistopheles]

Get ready for AA's new cost saving idea-overtime at 85hrs.

Direct entry Capts on the Embraer & A320 due to such poor planning from the boys upstairs that without them our airplanes will be grounded.

The resignation rate is picking up once again. The office are still in a state of shock after 18 in 1 week.

Hold onto your hats ladies & gents cuz this is going to be a year to remember.

[Panama Jack]

Work, work, work, work and get payed [sic] as little as possible because if you are not willing to do the job, someone else will for cheaper, so shut up and get to work! Boys and girls, unfortunately, once again the west has spoiled it for everyone else, thank you Southwest!!!!!!

Tziganul, I assume you are referring to the US airline “Southwest” (SWA). If so, you evidently have a mistaken impression of the way business is conducted at that airline.

1) Southwest airlines invests a great amount of energy into building and maintaining relationships between employees. This is a defining aspect of the airline’s corporate culture that allows it accomplish the feats that it does.
2) Southwest regularly gets named on such prestigious lists as Fortune magazine’s “100 Best Companies to Work for in America.”
3) Contrary to popular belief, many of Southwest’s employee groups are unionized. The airline is definitely not a non-union shop.
4) Although the airline is a low-cost airline, it is not a low-pay airline. Pay and benefits is at par or better than other US airlines, including some of the legacy carriers.

If I had a US Green Card I would have been knocking hard on Southwest’s doors years ago, leaving no stone unturned in trying to get in.

You might find books such as “Nuts!” or “The Southwest Airlines Way” interesting reading on how things are done at that airline. Many airlines have tried to emulate this culture, with varying degrees of success.

[DesertHawk]

It will be a year to remember but if AA and fleet office introduce 85 hr overtime it will be the nail in the coffin for all pilot-managment cooperation. AA should stop worrying about things that have nothing to do with man power and crewing, maybe our CP should remind him what his actual job is CREW PLANNING!!!!! Anyways 85 hr OT will kill morale and if introduced guarantee no flying on days off.:ok:

[Panama Jack]

I will speak only for myself by saying that I would not mind, in principle, with flying an 85-hour month.

And perhaps even more, if only we could pull out some of the stupid stops that really keep Gulf Air from being a more productive airline, increasing pilot morale, and wasting money unnecessarily. I am talking about restrictions such as not allowing more than 8 days off a month (as a rostering restriction). Some low-cost airlines, which enjoy greater productivity and efficiency, have pilots flying between 80-100 hours off a month while they enjoy as much as 15 or 16 days off a month because their roster blocks are productive. On the other hand, in order to meet the not more than 8 days off a month roster, I have one DOH turn, followed by an AUH turn the next day, then a STBY. I have often heard that we are “short” on pilots, but with these types of rostering practices it does not surprise me that we would be "short" on pilots.

If I “time out” in flying the maximum number of hours/duty time allowed by the regulations, give me days off (not Forced Leave) so that I can really relax, enjoy recreation activities, and really recuperate rather than nickel and diming me for the next month with a mix of single short-haul turn around days and STBY days.

Give me some rostering options were I can have more than 8 days off a month, the ability to have 4 or 5 days off in a row, increased options to build a block and I will be better rested, more motivated, and happy to fly more hours. Because all of a sudden I would be able to enjoy a better lifestyle. It is a balance between “work hard” and “play hard.” Some pilots want to fly more (they need extra money). Some guys prefer flying less and spending more time at home. Some love the long sectors. Some dread it.

The technology exists to better entertain all of these preferences; other airlines, with tighter budgets and less office staff, are making it happen. The question is whether the airline is would be open to making these changes to enjoy the long-term benefits.

Alas, I believe this horse has already been flogged to death in the past.

http://i632.photobucket.com/albums/uu46/RosaBella75/beating_a_dead_horse.jpg

[DesertHawk]

PJ, Great points but an 85 hour month is fine but pay me my money!!!! OT starts at 75 and better stay that way!

[SW1]

Anyone know how many FOs they need? Theyare advertising for Direct Entry FOs for the A320 as well as the Embraers. Still looking for that first job:{

[Panama Jack]

@ DesertHawk

Agreed!

[Heleheleyani]

does the newsletter make sense to you,

........
Due to the above and in line with the fleet restructuring, as per the transfer policy, and in accordance with the company requirements it has been initially decided to transfer Embraer Gulf Air Line Captains/first officers back to the A320 to cater for the unexpected sudden shortage, and as of the start of February the Embraer fleet shall be manned by direct entry captains and first officers.

The Command Upgrade Programme will continue on the Embraer Fleet, and depending on the company requirements and the direct entry recruitment progress it might be stopped and reactivated back on the A320 fleet by Sep 2011.
..............

so if all gulfair line captains and first officers are coming back to A320, who will be upgraded in Embraer?

[40&80]

Panama Jack is seeing things as we did 1974 to 2000.
Interestingly "All" the subjects he mentions above were first raised with management as far back as 1976 and later every year until 2000...they are incapable of understanding crews problems and not interested at all in "humanizing" crews lifestyles...the SOP answer being basically... If you do not like it leave.

[Yo767]

By the way at Gulfair, overtime hours (beyond 75 hrs block time) are paid at a reduced hourly rate (30bd/hr for Capt, 20bd/hr for FO). This is approximately 66% of our basic hourly pay (monthly basic divided by 75hrs as per contract). We are already accepting to work for less than our basic salary for hours beyond 75hrs so AA is thinking: Since the pilots are already accepting to work for less than their basic salary in overtime without complaining (even being happy for some), why wouldnt they accept to work for free for an extra 10hrs???

We should be paid time and an half beyond 75hrs (60bd/hr for Capt, 45bd/hr). Lets all talk to our union representatives about this great idea as soon as possible! Wait a minute, do we have a union????

A cheap whore

[Mephistopheles]

The "unexpected shortage" was foresaw by everyone except the people who are paid to plan ahead for these events.
All along the maestro of crewing AA has been saying that we actually have too many pilots & that the only reason we get into high hours is cuz we fly on our days off.

[ironbutt57]

Yes, "Nuts" is a must read, I particularly like the form letter sent to whingeing passengers....:ok:

[ironbutt57]

In fairness to "crew planning", the overall fleet plan has been changed to maximize operational efficiency,and several unexpected departures have thrown a wrench into the plan as well..all crew planning can do is react and make adjustments to changes in the master plan...long after we sign out and head for the barn, those poor chaps are working feverishly to keep flights crewed, and airplanes moving...:D

[airbus380man]

the main problem with Gulf Air is COMMUNICATION, they are unclear and all the command upgrade is a show to keep the FOs(my personal opinion ),someone from the office starts the rummers then it will spread.
the last letter from OPS was not that clear.why they need to transfer pilots (FO)to 320 from ERJ. if the CMD will continue on ERJ until SEP

everybody knows AA and his way of disrespecting pilots. most of the pilots not happy with what AA is doing. still you see him in the office. everybody knows why . wing A can not touch AA

[Tziganul]

I agree with you all over these matters,

1) Everyone EXCEPT the ones on the 3rd floor knew the shortage was just a matter of time, yet, nothing was done to prevent it.
2) The letter we got from 1st floor was nothing special, once again it's just a way of trying to "officially" give out some info so that we don't say things like "there is no communication"
3) Overtime, no overtime, ..., well, if this 85hrs is really going through, then can I suggest that the locals bring up the fight just as they did 3years ago and get conditions to improve! Expats can't do much as they don't have the same bargaining power as the locals.
4) Why is the command still being done on the ERJ when they will be filling out the positions with direct entries? Who took this absurd decision?!!!!!!!!! So let me guess, pissing of the people the first time by putting a gun to their head and telling them either you take it or leave it was not enough?! Boy, they will never learn!
5) What 48 second officers program? Didn't QA get all of them? Who are they kidding?

Oh well, we are not the ones payed 6k-10k BD/month in order to think. So ... guess we just have to suck it up until the locals get enough and start punching back. Boy, come on, punch back!

[cyrilroy21]

5) What 48 second officers program? Didn't QA get all of them? Who are they kidding?

Is Gulf Air recruiting non nationals as second officers at the moment or in the near future ?

Seems like their real short for pilots... :cool:

[Sal-e]

I don't get it.

1. Almost every pilot on average is working harder and have overtime lines, by the way, at an abysmal rate. This is approximately 66% of our basic hourly pay (monthly basic divided by 75hrs as per contract)
2. This is exacerbated by recent resignations.

Now they want overtime raised to 85 hours.

This begs the questions:
1.Is this moral?
2. Is this ethical? And,
3. Is this how hard work is being rewarded?

Finally, this raises the possibility that maybe someone stands to benefit by cutting just rewards on others hard work.

[Radar Contact]

5) What 48 second officers program? Didn't QA get all of them? Who are they kidding?

No, QR will take 16 out of the 48. The rest are due to start with GF the typerating and line-training soon but very slow (rate of 4 per month) instead of the usual 8.

Is Gulf Air recruiting non nationals as second officers at the moment or in the near future ?

Nope, all candidates are Bahrainis.

[airbus380man]

For me i do not really care if they want bahrainis or non bahrainis, the problem is they are not clear ,about the plans like the other airlines next door .Wing A they do not respect pilots if u talk then thats it u r over but in a way u do not realize it. what ever AA tells them is right and with the latest letter from ops. it is a unclear message ,so everyone will explain it in diff. way. such as capt./fo to 320/ DEC and FO . soon most of senior capt. will be 60. so what is there plan. fail pilots in cmd interview and all DEC. or what. we are not secured -they do not care about pilots (if u r not part of the gang- coffee shop or if u do not go with them to area where they stay during winter time in the tent weekends)

1- AA plans and apply it wing A always yes u r right, we need pilot ohhhhhps no we r ok, ahhhh no we have extra.( as we hear it in the building from others)

2-soon most of ERJ pilots will go under CMD interview, most of them will go for the 2nd time hope to see them with 4 bars they are good.

if i ask any pilots in GF, what is happening in GF they do not know.

my cmd assessment finished and waiting for my interview, and the rate of failure keeping me nervous . guys any idea.

[Trader]

Oddly enough--85 hours per month is what EK is beginning to target! Was told in a GS washup with management that EK believes it is leading the trend towards this figure. Wondering if there is some 'talk' between the various companies to line up with one another in this regard!

[Yo767]

85 Hour Overtime

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't get it.

1. Almost every pilot on average is working harder and have overtime lines, by the way, at an abysmal rate.

Sale, by making you work beyond 75hrs instead of hiring someone else, the company saves 33% plus fixed indemnities.

A cheap whore.

[Tziganul]

hahahahaha so that's what it's gone down to ... cheap whores hahahahhaha well for the time being, i am starting to fell like one, maybe i should go the Wrangllers or Ramee or Diggers and go make some real money, plus who knows i might find myslef some nice girl who'll understand what I do and decide to sponsor my hobby of flying hahahahhaha!!!! Ah the glamourous life of an airline pilot!

[Tziganul]

Whats with this ETS!!!!!!???????

I send the figures and they still email us about not getting their info. Plus our beloved "envelop return boy" is NEVER THERE!!!! That's a nice job!!!! Please sign me up for doing NOTHING AT ALLL and getting payed! And then they said we need to cut cost! Well, let's create an ETS Manager so that ALL the ETS is being PROPERLY filled!

[Sal-e]

All the ETS information is there. It doesn't need any input from us.
Meanwhile, GF wants to give us pay cuts. Well, increasing overtime to 85 hours is effectively a pay cut.
Once again, is this how hard work is being rewarded?

[Tziganul]

To this overtime issue, we must be like the tunisians, after 23 years of stealing from the people, someone got up and stood up to him, i guess this could be done here with us as well, however, i'm not sure how many people will be willing to sacrifice themselves and be the martyrs. it's hard to go on strike or decide not to work on your days off when you have a family to feed. what we need is for QA, EY, EK to hire more of the "experienced crew" and then they'll have no choice, either pay or close up and be the laughing stock of the GCC! Oh wait, we ARE the laughing stock all ready!

[DesertHawk]

lets no get ahead of ourselves here guys. i heard the whole 85 hours was scrapped because someone up there realized the damage it would cause. also if this does happen it is not hard tostand up!!! SIMPLE. do your job and thats it. as YO said so nicely dont be a cheap whore and go in on days off for less money.

[Da Do Ron Ron]

Gulf Air is flying into profitability
By Arthur Macdonald , Posted on » Monday, January 17, 2011

MANAMA: Gulf Air will break even within two years, according to chief executive officer Samer Majali.
Speaking on the sidelines of the airline's annual commercial conference at the Gulf Hotel, he predicted that the days of the airline losing $1 million a day were a thing of the past.
"This year we are moving from mission impossible to mission possible," he said in an exclusive interview with the GDN.
"We are on the right track to get back to profitability and we are feeling very positive," he told more than 300 delegates from across the airline's global operations.
"This year will be a real test but with a pragmatic budget I believe losses can be cut."

[evilatp]

Gulf Air might stop the bleeding in the short term by cutting staff, increasing hours, etc. But they won't be profitable in the long term unless they eliminate fraud and corruption.

[brassplate]

But they won't be profitable in the long term unless they eliminate fraud and corruption.

that is the single biggest cause of all of gf's woes. it is a cancer which needs to be completely eliminated for any further progress in majaliwali's master plan. there must be a zero tolerance to any corruption. but the problem is it has permeated every single level of the airlines hierarchy and beyond, reaching level of government, even the royal family. if the very top sees fit to continue fingering the pie, all else below won't give a toss.

[fdr]

Do have info on a program out of the sand pit needing competent B767/B757 and B737 classic drivers. Presently, their candidates have been less than impressive, they are asking for guys who can fly which has been a slight impediment. T&C's are reasonable or better, in comparison to the low standard we have grown to appreciate. Small program but growing.

pm if there are any FO's and Capts out there that may be interested in a commuting or local base program.

No, I an not an agent.

[Panama Jack]

Do have info on a program out of the sand pit needing competent B767/B757 and B737 classic drivers. . . . T&C's are reasonable or better, in comparison to the low standard we have grown to appreciate. Small program but growing.

pm if there are any FO's and Capts out there that may be interested in a commuting or local base program.


Commercial (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlS1b6rrh4M&feature=related) :E

[bus_aviator]

oh boy, emirates roadshow at the movenpick feb 2nd and 3rd, looks like they really want to pull the plug on poor old gf...with the terms they are offering you've got to be deaf, dumb or blind not to be tempted, see you guys by the pool

[repapips]

yes, indeed. looks like the boat is really sinking...
the problem is...it feels like a frog being boiled slowly in hot water. he doesn't feel it coz the heat is increasing gradually...
very much like GF...not feeling the pilot loss coz it's happening gradually, unlike how it did in 2007 when they lost 200 pilots in 2 weeks!

[T O G A Boy]

That truly is "The Nail in the coffin". Fortnight ago, EK came to Bahrain and signed up a lot of our cabin crew. Now its pilots. wow. That's surely a big blow to the guys upstairs in the Pink Palace. Well done folks. :D. I, for one will be there. Got fed up feeling insecure.

[5Bruce]

Emirates Pilot Information Sessions Bahrain
2nd February 2011
3:00pm
and
3rd February 10am
Movenpick Hotel,
Bahrain

[Tziganul]

For sure, this will be the nail in the coffin! I imagine another 10 guys will sign up for it and ... my salami!!!!! GFA just doesn't get it do they. They must do either one of these things,

1) Increase the pay package (yeah sure!!!)
2) Give us a better schedule and more time off (dreaming!!!!!)
3) Stop pissing off people with this EMB bs!!!! (they have only started!!!)
4) Stop failing people at the command interview (duahhh!!!!!)
5) Stop the bahrainisation bs,

Since they have started this, they have laid off good people and from what I hear, their bahrainisation project is not going that well either. God bless them for wanting to make it 100%, it's the perfect scenario, however, you can't do it in 3 years!!!! There are too many expats involved and we need to work together towards trying to make this company a "profitable" one. We all ready have the best working environment in the GCC, everyone know it. So let's stop the stealing and back stabbing and get this show on the road!

ps. by the way, yes I will be attending the EK open doors! Just to keep my options open. What?.... I'm just looking out for myself, cause I see how well the company looks up for us and ... well ... their are not doing a great job at it!
Cheers!!!!! Long live GFA!!!

[jackx123]

one is up-sizing

the other down-sizing

which one has the future ?

and it ain't a trick question :p

[Wireless]

How much a month gross are the Embraer F/os making?

Thanks

[yomama]

Has anyone received an official invitation to the EMB assessment next week?

[Not Gulfair CEO]

I think time has come for management to resign with bit of Grace and respect or else face the invitable boot.
The rumor has it, AQP manager has resigned from the company, 10 training captains have resigned from training.Any one still happy in Gulf Air, please reveal yourself.

[Sal-e]

The one thing I have found interesting is that one of the few things that are not 'broken' with the airline are the crews. Yet, they seem to be the first ones to be targeted for cost-cutting. Is this undue focus deliberate to mask the real failings of the commercial and strategy departments? Penny-wise and pound-foolish comes to mind.

[Tziganul]

I don't think management has anything to say in this whole s...pile. However, the knights at the round are the REAL problem. Kind of thinking about it, it makes sense. They really don't care about the company, all they care about is getting their side of the pie and that's it. When they don't get enough of the pie they change the whole 3rd floor! Also, whatever money they give out to our beloved company, they take back. This whole "giving" is only a publicity stunt. It's like those kind of people who will take out their best suits in order to take a picture and then put it back in the closet and wear their old, dirty clothes!!!!!
As for the blaming part, haven't you guys realize that it's a custom here to put the blame on someone else?! It's never anyone's fault, Hell, if they could blame the Costa Coffee staff they would!!!!!
Ah EK is coming to town, expect more exodus and God bless this company!
My Salami!

Actually it's more like THEIR salami! only a question of time...

[Fubaliera]

Dude its more salami

[Landflap]

Check out the Career progression thread. Ironbutts, Sale e, Olbie, seem very happy. Well, that is three.

[ironbutt57]

Are you regretting leaving Landflap? Is that why you insist on bitter posts about a company that employed you in good faith?? Obviously your new life isn't that great, or GF would be a thing of the past for you....

[Tziganul]

Have to agree with ironbutt, when you leave something just don't look back. GFA is what it is, but in the end, it pays on time and working environment is good.

[Tziganul]

Hey what the Hell is wrong with the DGCA in India!!!! They are conducting evacuation drills randomly!!!! Last they delayed BA in BOM for 2hrs by "practicing" a bomb threat!!!! NICE GOING!!! I'm sure the Captain and the whole crew really appreciate it!!! Now we have to watch out for any suspicious call!!!! What the hell is wrong with this industry specially in that part of the world!!!!! They got rid of the english but not the bureaucratic bs!!!!

PS. And for those of you who are thinking that it's in our best interest, you guys are on CRACK!!!!!!! That's what happens when you have 1.3bn people who have nothing to do, you just piss off people by inventing new ideas on how to piss off people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Panama Jack]

"Confirm through Security?" :rolleyes:

Actually, the India DGAC story reminds me of some NASA ASRS reports a few years ago of how, in one country, fighter jocks practiced their intercept skills on airliners. It wasn't appreciated by the Flight Crew.

Causing a delay to an airliner on a revenue flight is not cool. I like to think that BA will send the airport authority/DGAC the bill and that IATA & ICAO will be jumping down DGAC's throat.

[T O G A Boy]

Is anybody having problems with Aims or is it just me. Cant seem to log on for a few days now.

[surfer of desert]

Hi TOGABOY, check on webmail, they are explain "why" everybody cannot access the aims.... basic we are facing with internet problems in Egypt...good luck:cool:

[T O G A Boy]

Thanks Surfer. I just did and found the new link....:ok:

[SandShovel]

AIMS back to normal now.:)

[ashcroft79]

Wow I saw a few postings for DEC's and thought it might be a fun thing to do for a few years but after reading thru this I'm starting to second guess that.

[ironbutt57]

Ashcroft, 5% of the folks account for 99% of the complaining,:ok:

[Tziganul]

Just been at the Emirates roadshow. WAW!!! We are MILLION years behind! GLOBAL VS REGIONAL? hmmm the choice is hard to make, ... NOT!!!!

[Panama Jack]

"Vaya con Dios," Tziganul.

[ashcroft79]

Mind if I ask you guys what the terms and conditions are for Gulf Air?

[Sultan85]

no comments regarding GF vs EK!:}
all the best!:ok:

[Speedbrake Lever]

HMMMM~!

Been in the region over 30 years !!

I can tell you Bahrain is the best by a million

UAE a dump

and i live there now - shame on me !!

S.L.

[Skindogg]

Hi all,

It's been asked before to no avail, so I'll give it a go.

How are the T's and C's for 320 first officers? Take home pay, housing allowance, any info you could give would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[Skindogg]

....I'll add

FO base 2100 BHD + 50 BHD per year in the company

from ppjn. But that's 3 years ago and it doesn't give details of housing allowance.
Again many thanks.

[BlueWhiteSky]

Thats the same numbers as 6 month ago when I left them. Housing was 550BD for single and 600BD for married, as far as I remember.

[Skindogg]

Thanks for that.
You left because....

money?
the company/roster etc?
expat returning home?
a.n. other?I'm trying to weigh up my options here so all info is welcome.

[BlueWhiteSky]

A bunch of reasons together not a single one.

1. Living circumstances: Bahrain is an island and everything is artificial. After a few month you know everything. If you are happy to spend your off time in pups than its for you. I became bored of the place.

2. Company: They changed strategies 2 or 3 times the time I was with them from B777 via a lot of A330 to the EMB to much for me to count on that company. I was only 1.5 years with them.

3. Money: It is not that much more as I have now or as I had before. The difference is not worth the living circumstances nor to be tossed around from the company.

This are my personal reasons why I left. Nobody needs to agree nor do I discuss it. If somebody can cope with It, go for It.

But there are not only bad things. Training is good and flying with most Captains are a pleasure and I gained a lot of experience which I can use in my present job.

If you are unemployed go for it but give the other ME carriers also a look.
Lot of colleges changed from GF to there neighbours.

[Skindogg]

brilliant, thanks again.
Food for thought, but as you say yourself, it's up to the individual. I'll have a long hard think about it while doing a bit more research.

One final question, do you know about their education allowance for children?

[SandShovel]

All of those who are thinking of joining GF. Come for the interview, and see BAH yourself, but do not get too excited with the conditions of your stay during interview. Try to go out of the Movenpick and see the "life":hmm:.
If you r single it might not be a perfect place to stay for a long time, u'll get bored. For those of u who r married, it is more or less ok, depends on your spouse:rolleyes:

[BlueWhiteSky]

@Skindogg
sorry don't know about education allowance, I am single.

As SandShovel said, don't be to impressed from the Moevenpick. Go to Juffair to the Al Khobar Hotel same street as Best Western and you will see what value you have to the company. That's the place they put me for the first 4 weeks. Or visit the Al Safir Hotel during a Saudi Weekend another experience.

[ashcroft79]

Skindog. I found a website that showed pretty much what everybody has posted regarding pay and it also showed education allowance of 1500 for two kids. Hope that helps.

For everybody else if you could chose who would you pick out of?
Gulf Air
NAS
Royal Air Jordanian

I've looked into all three and am trying to figure out the best one to try to get on with.

Thanks

[Tziganul]

All right, well the answer is easy NONE! Joke, GFA off course!!!

This is directly from my pay check. It's for 56hrs of flying.
Basic : 2200BD (been here 2 years)
Communication allowance: 13BD
Housing: 650BD (married)
Transport: 40BD
Utilities: 48BD
Wife Allowance: 41.5BD
Block hrs (56) : 338BD
Duty time: 275BD
Unemployment: 22BD
Overtime: 0BD
TOTAL: 3615 BD x 2.65 = 9579 USD or 7239 Euros

If you ask me, it's a great place to work in terms of working environment. Training is really good. There are lots of good instructors here. If you stay out of the politics of things, then you'll have a pleasant and quiet life. If you're like all of us here on this forum then you might get some gray hair from time to time. The things that are not so pleasant:
- communication with its employees, (I can communicate way better with my grandmother!)
- lack of vision (they don't know what they want, even the blind know where they are going),
- failing 90% of the command upgrades (though lately some have miraculously passed! maybe the board of interview had a pleasant night before ;) )
- some of the 3rd floor and 1st floor and the bureaucratic crap that goes on in the pink palace.

There you have it. Hope it helps you choose GFA over EK and EY lol lol lol lol!!!!! You'd be OUT OF YOUR MIND IF YOU DID!!!!!!!

ps. I apologies if I have offended anyone. Of course we do have a vision it's the 2030 vision. That would make me ancient and therefore tooo old to witness it!!!!!! Oh yeah and we do have the 787 who should be here by then ishaalah!!!

[mutt]

Do you really consider Housing 650BD/ Utilities 48BD as part of your salary? Its not as if this is disposable income that you have an option to save.... How is the cost of living? I have recently found Dubai to be extremely expensive, is Bahrain going the same way?

Mutt

[Tziganul]

mutt, where are you right now? I'm asking because if you are in Europe or anywhere else, or if you work a NORMAL job, you will not get housing nor communication nor wife allowance nor anything else, your salary will be what ever they give you and you have to pay everything for yourself. Life in Bahrain is much cheaper than anywhere else in the Gulf. As well, yes the housing is yours so if you find a cheaper place you can save the extra!!!!! That's what i'm doing now and I have a pretty good size place with 2 bedrooms for less. That's just me, some people will pay the full 650 (550 if you're single) and pay extra to be in the "white" neighborhood, me i like being in the middle of all the ****. Also, depending on your culinary taste, you can spend a **** lot or nothing at all. If you have a wife or girlfriend who loves to shop and spend your money, she'll find EVERYTHING she needs here!
Therefore, if you just want to make it as per European standards, or North American Standards and not include any of the benefits you have here: schooling, housing, transport allowance, free laundry, wife allowance, kids allowance, blablabla, then your salary here would only be 2100+another 600 or so for flying and that would be a total of 2700BD x 2.65 = 7155US or 5400Euros. TAX FREEE!!!! try finding that in Europe!!!!! Hope this answers the question, and once again, i apologize if I have offended anyone!

[jetjockey737]

How does the Education allowance work and how much is it please? For example do you have to provide receipts from the school and then they give you the money or do they just give you a set allowance per child?

[mutt]

where are you right now? A little bit to the south of you, but usually I'm a little bit to your west side :):)

or if you work a NORMAL job A normal job is a job in my own country, I work as an EXPATRIATE, hence my surprise that you consider housing to be a financial benefit in your employment package, to me its a necessity for your employer, especially as your aren't permitted to purchase property (in some places.) I saw a number of colleagues who joined Emirates and took the housing allowance, over the years they have moved from 3 bedroom villas to apartments as the rents sky rocketed and their allowances didn't.

Judging by the construction developments that we see in Bahrain and the limited amount of land, I would envisage that anyone planning a career in GF will see housing costs escalate over the coming years. (Btw, some of the places to the east of the airport look amazing from the air :)) That's why I wouldnt be too keen on basing my income on that expected Housing Allowance.

If we look at the 2100BD ($5565/Euro 4000 TAX FREE) without flying, I'm presuming that this is for the right seat of an A320. Is it that great? Especially considering that a beer in the Movenpick will cost you $8......

Ashcroft79, in this part of the world, it isn't only the money that you have to consider, but the complete package. I would hazard a guess that the same $5565 would go further in Amman than Riyadh and Bahrain. GFA are offering schooling and the right to bring your family, I dont think that NAS offer the same. Then there is the question of time off, NAS were offering 6 weeks on 2 off (I think), but now they appear to be offering 11 months on 1 month off....... trust me, 11 months is a long long long time in Saudi :):) What about GFA? Can any of them be considered a commuting contract? What about upgrade time/policies? etc etc

There is no easy answer as there are pro's and con's to each of these companies and countries....but i would suggest that you do serious research before coming to this part of the world. It's not for everyone :):)

Mutt

[jackx123]

A LH at TG makes ~$100k tax free (I guess they consider airborne not taxable), and cost of living is..well a tad lower than in the GCC.

You need however, to speak thai and hold a thai passport.

There are many opportunities outside the gulf but once settled in it becomes pretty much a frog situation.

Throw a frog into boiling water and it jumps out. Throw it in cold water and heat up, it gets warm and cosy until the water is boiling and then it's to late.

[ashcroft79]

Mutt,

Thanks for the info. Yeah I'm considering the cost of living and am trying to figure out which place I should try for. I'm actually (if I get an offer from one of these places) going to move over there for a few years since the wifey is okay with it. Yeah she's okay with it (hell she lived in a refuge camp for a few years as a kid so surely it can't be worse than that for her).

[DesertHawk]

Firstly, housing is not considered part of salary in my opinion. The rest of the allowances are you salary. Lets be perfectly honest, WIFE allowances come on! If my wife spent 41.5 BD a month I would be in heaven!! These allowances have always been there and will be as a way for GF to decrease the indemnity pay outs as you only get paid on your fixed monthly salary.

The bottom line is end of the month expect 2650-2900 as a new joiner FO not including your housing allowance. If that is on a 320 its a good paying job on the EMB it is spectacular.

I can only speak for myself but NAS or any Saudi company would be way down the list as the living condition in KSA are not for me. RJ I have no idea but why are there CAPT's on EMB starting this month for GF?

GF is an interesting place. Dont expect perfection for sure. If you go into it with an open mind and a REALISTIC expectation most will be fine. The pay is as good as anywhere in ME and cockpit environment as good or better then anywhere else. Expect MINIMUM 4 years as an FO. This is a good way to start. I find some guys think they deserve or are entitled to advancement just becasue they are with a company over here. GF follows seniority, from what I have seen.

As far as Gf considering commuting dream on. Just being honest sorry.

Command well, there has been some major hiccups in the last 6 months. With a new fleet and no real operational control or experience I suspect they were being very cautious. This is unfortunate for some but a biproduct of fleet introduction. Everywhere in this region they still have the check mentality IMO, slowly some are realizing that to productively develop people u need to train and encourage. These changes are coming inshallah!!!! Now that I foget what I was actually wanting to say I will sign off, Good luck making your decision. Life is what u make it, And nowhere is that exemplified like good old BAH. An island of infinite(exaggerating) oppourtunity or a glorified jail cell your choice!!!!!:ok:

[Speedbrake Lever]

Well

I sit here in Bah right now.

I'm being honest Bah is so much better than anywhere else in the gulf

pay lasts better here too

and GF is a friendlier airline than any of the others

Go for what you think you want

i've been here since 79

and i can tell you Bah ain't half bad

S.L.

[Tziganul]

Ok guys,

So as an EXPAT you EXPECT to get HOUSING as part of your salary. Why can't you guys realize something, if things were so great in YOUR country, why aren't you there right now? Oh wait, let me guess, you got layed off, you weren't making enough, you were taxed too much, you had to pay schooling for your kids if you wanted to send them to good schools, you wanted a nice car but couldn't afford it on your ****ty salaries, you wanted a nice house to live in but once again you ****ty salary made you slave to the house for the rest of your career, you got divorced and so touch **** now your ex wife took you for everything blablablablabla, bottom line guys, NOBODY gives you **** in YOUR part of the world, so just because you are an expat you don't deserve a housing!!!!!!!!!! Wake up and smell the coffee!!!!! Boys coming here from Easyjets saw their salaries doubled or tripled, as well as the boys from South America, boys from the West saw their salaries doubled, AND I'M NOT INCLUDING HOUSING!!!! Folks lets face it, this ain't the west, and it's got its own problems, but I'd rather live here than anywhere else in the west where they rape you with taxes and so called social benefits!!!!

As for the rest, now that my menstruation has passed ;) GFA is a great place to work. Upgrade went from 9 years to 7 years, to 5 years and now about 4.5 years. At the moment the company is hurting for guys with the departure of 16 of our brothers to Oman Air. The working environment is by far the best I have been in. The housing deal, well, for the moment the prices have dropped and with all the new buildings mushrooming, I suspect the prices will go down further. However, when the new bridge linking BAH-DOH will be completed, then perhaps another housing boom will arise.

Ok, enough bitching for the day, i wasted too much time on this all ready, back to drinking coffee.

[727Man]

When do GF plan to recruit non type rated guys? I am in living in Bahrain waiting for the chance, Bahrain is what you make of it. I plan to put in my papers anyway and see what happens!

[Tziganul]

We just hired 2 guys who were not type rated, but they were Bahraini! As a matter of fact they came from the 727. I can't say when they'll hire non rated expat guys, last time they did that was about 2 years ago when they hired some guys from SAMA. Prior to that 5 years ago they hired guys with only turboprop experience! Now there are too many rated guys on the market and of course they'll try to find them before hiring a non rated guy. It's a cycle, but once the west picks up, which it has all ready started to, i think there will be a few guys leaving and perhaps then.

[jackx123]

His highness's brother did represent the seller in the deal (as in GF not the government)

[Chuck Y]

So how was the turnout at the EK roadshow? Are we gonna be screwed even more come May due to
the obvious pilot shortage that upstairs refuse to admit to? I guess its once again time
to put serious thought into whether to stay or not since this company are very happy to
fly us all into early graves.

[Mike.Park]

I hope the commander of GF281 makes a full & speedy recovery


Gulf Air flight GF281, travelling from Kuala Lumpur to Bahrain yesterday, made an unscheduled landing at Muscat, Oman after the captain took the precautionary decision to divert the aircraft soon after he began to feel ill six hours into the journey, a statement said.

The aircraft, an A330 with 136 passengers on-board, landed safely at Muscat International Airport at 1345 [Local time] and the passengers disembarked normally, it said.

The captain was taken to the Royal Hospital upon arrival by the waiting medical services where he was diagnosed as suffering a mild heart attack and his present condition is described as stable.

A new crew, which arrived from Bahrain, took over and the flight then continued its journey to Bahrain landing at Bahrain International Airport at 2010 [Bahrain time] following a six-hour delay.

Captain Nasser Al Salmi, Gulf Air chief operating officer said: “The safety of our passengers and crew is Gulf Air’s number one priority. Our pilots undergo comprehensive medical checks every six months and are trained to international aviation safety standards and requirements and regularly undergo training simulating such situations and are fully prepared to meet such emergencies. The captain of flight GF281 had a comprehensive health checkup recently and was fully fit to fly. I would like to thank our passengers for their understanding and offer our sincere apologies for the inconvenience caused.”Source: TradeArabia (http://www.tradearabia.com/news/TTN_193074.html)

[Tziganul]

Why is there no mention of the first-officer who saved the captain's life? Or the doctor and cabin crew that took care of him? Of course, the whole emphasis is put on the captain!

Anyhow, I hope he recovers fast and continues to fly as I hear he is one of our great guys to fly with. May God speed up your healing!

As for the first-officer on board :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D you did a GREAT JOB!

[Mike.Park]

Why is there no mention of the first-officer who saved the captain's life? Or the doctor and cabin crew that took care of him?Because GF didn't go public with the details, but a job well done for all involved.

[GrannySmith]

"I LOVE GULF AIR"
I am not afraid,
I am not afraid,
I am not afraid.

[Sultan85]

not afraid of what?:rolleyes:

[esopees]

I just read a post where a guy talks about how great it's to make money in GFA....
I agree. But if you think about it, why do they pay such money?

Because otherwise NO ONE would go over there!! if they paid the same as other places , nobody would set a foot on bahrain.
Other places in the world offer you great social advantages and the cities are open 24/7 with many more things to do than to go to a Mall, or the british club, or go to see camels...
If money is what your looking for, take your chances in GFA,
if your looking for a COMPLETE life...specially with your family....
do as I did!!!
get the hell out of there.
:)

[esopees]

If they take so much care about upgrades why on earth do they let Mr. I.F. be on a left seat! I heard he is still there!!!!! :ugh::yuk:
be carefull FO's if he caughs his eyeballs will pop out!!!!

far East take better account of who gets left seat!!!!
Dont we M.M.?

[Atebis]

Esoppees......

Do you miss us already at GF? Is your life still so IN COMPLETE that you come back to the GF developments forum to complain? Is your wallet not as fat as b4? Are the city lights and the 24/7 cold stores not enough for you and your family?

I wish you luck in your search for COMPLETE-ness.

Move on.... don't look back. We are happy you left.:p

[esopees]

Ha,ha,ha Atebis, great reply!!!:D
Or course I look at this forum, got many friends in Bahrain. Got many friends in GFA.
And yes, I miss bahrain but not GFA, I'm sure you're better informed that I about the 'developments' of your company.
And yes again, I left GFA, because i had a very good option to leave. maybe I could move around your CV. Where I fly, they dont take anymore DEC on the G5.
About my pocket..I'm not going to tell you how much more I'm making cause you would really hate me then. What I am going to tell you is that I fly only 9 days a month based in London. last month i was in Tokio and Chicago, and Brasil, cool ei? And it feels great. superb.:ok:
maybe you should visit if you have any time between cochin, Bagdad or your split duties.
On the other hand, my life IS complete. Is yours? don't answer, it's best for you.
And it was ME who was happy to leave, which reading between lines means that i couldnt care less of how people like you feel. In fact I know that only a few of guys like you are in GFA. Cause I remember very nice people there.
Very nice.
take care and dont feel so angry and have a rest, you're probably on stby.
:)

[Sultan85]

nice one esopees:D:D all the best for you and your new world:ok:

[Tziganul]

hahahahahhahahahahaahhahahahahahahaahah esopees very nice reply! hahahahahhahahahhahahahhahahahhahahahahhah

[767]

Kabul Welcomes You:}

[Che Guevara]

Rumours of demonstrations on the 13th and 14th in BAH!
Be careful everybody.

[brassplate]

reasons to leave the golden chicken and bahrain
1 unprofessional treatment of pilots by hr and crew control
2 nothing to do except malls and f1 once a year
3 dangerous drivers especially on weekends
4 no real international ambitions only regional to undeveloped war zones
5 entirely local fleet managers, the mafia, who never listen to the pilots and only concerned about themselves, fat paycheque, and position
6 shiite sunni thing
7 demonstrations/riots which threaten lives of expats
8 second rate attitude towards expat pilots
9 second rate attitude even toward own local pilots depending if shiite or sunni
10 noisy shiite villages throughout the night
11 company that consistently looks for ways to screw you not help you
12 local cabbies who still try and rip you off even after their massive pay rise
13 idiot brown nosing jordanian ceo whose ideas are as small as the island
14 focus on cost cutting always on flying crews and not the real culprits, the revenue/commercial/planning departments and ceo
15.......
anyone else care to add more????

[Tziganul]

1 unprofessional treatment of pilots by hr and crew control
(What!!!!! Nah, we're all professionals!!! Professional screw ups!)
2 nothing to do except malls and f1 once a year
(Which F1 are you talking about? The one I go to goes on all year long!!!)
3 dangerous drivers especially on weekends
(THANK YOU KIND ABDULLAH FOR SENDING YOUR PEOPLE TO PARTY IN OUR BACKYEARD!!!!)
4 no real international ambitions only regional to undeveloped war zones
(I thought every destination was INTERNATIONAL!!!!)
5 entirely local fleet managers, the mafia, who never listen to the pilots and only concerned about themselves, fat paycheque, and position
(Come on!!! Making 10k bhd/month is not enough!!!! How can they feed their kids with that?!!)
6 shiite sunni thing
(i'm neither, why am I being punished!!!!?????)
7 demonstrations/riots which threaten lives of expats
(Bahrain is a peaceful country, it's the BEST country in the GCC)
8 second rate attitude towards expat pilots
(And I thought WE were from a 1st world country!!!)
9 second rate attitude even toward own local pilots depending if shiite or sunni
(Really, you mean indians are considered local?)
10 noisy shiite villages throughout the night
(Well, i'm in Juffair, that's a Saudi village and it's noisier!)
11 company that consistently looks for ways to screw you not help you
(taking away things without telling you is for your own good, they don't want you to go to jail for selling tickets and making extra money!)
12 local cabbies who still try and rip you off even after their massive pay rise
(Poor guys, I feel soooo sorry for them, just as sorry as I feel about the driving instructors!)
13 idiot brown nosing jordanian ceo whose ideas are as small as the island
(I guess the copy & paste function didn't go that well)
14 focus on cost cutting always on flying crews and not the real culprits, the revenue/commercial/planning departments and ceo
(Nooooo!!!! What will their family eat for dinner if you decrease their salary!??? you guys definitely don't have THEIR best interest at heart! shame on you!!!!)
15.......
anyone else care to add more???? yes, the next 60 years will be even better!!!!!

[John21UK]

Guys/girls,

I'm a newby on this forum so go easy on me. ;)
I've notived GF is reqruiting rated pilots and I happen to be one that meet the requirements for the EMB as an f/o. I'm currently in the UK and are very willing to move to Bahrain with family. I've read the interview thread on pprune but that goes silent after 2007 and I've read the GF careers website. Now, can anyone help me regarding the current interview process for rated pilots???

A quick PM would also be appreciated!

[flyboy328]

Tziganul: Years ago we had this expat guy who did nothing than a few Athens Flights every month and even got payed overtime. In his plentiful offtime he printed out his Threads written on pprune and presented it in the pink palace.

You really remind me of him.

By the way:
7 demonstrations/riots which threaten lives of expats
(Bahrain is a peaceful country, it's the BEST country in the GCC)

What about this (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=133732036) and this (http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-555019). Oh ic they give you only GDN to read:ooh:

[Tziganul]

hahahahaha flyboy328, I WISH I was only doing ATH and getting payed overtime!!! Where do I sign up!!!!?????

[Apache702]

Bahrain Uprising: Various injuries in Karzakan area | The Pilot Network (http://www.thepilotnetwork.com/?p=35#comments)

[brassplate]

any one here wish to fly for these prestigious airlines:

iran air?
aseman?
caspian airlines?
mahan air?

any one here wish to live in these exotic, modern, civilised places:

tehran?
esfahan?
tabriz?
buscher?

if so, remain in bahrain because if the protesters have their way, the place will turn into mini iran.

[a345xxx]

"if so, remain in bahrain because if the protesters have their way, the place will turn into mini iran."

That's a real sad remark. Its going through the pains of trying to be a real democracy. Give it a chance. People in the ME are not from or in the stone ages, including those in Iran.

[Tziganul]

well one thing's for sure, if this escalades ... there will be lots of us who will want out! Not willing to stick by them while they get their democracy, and anyhow, there is NO REAL democracy out there!!! only greedy politicians, and it doesn't matter where u are in the world, they are ALL alike, we are just their slaves! Don't ever forget that!!!!

FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!

ps. MONEY is my RELIGION!!!! Why? Because it RULES the world!!!! and us of course!

[flyboy328]

(Bahrain is a peaceful country, it's the BEST country in the GCC)

and now?:O

[slowjet]

You might want to ask that of the family of the woman still, today, facing execution by stoning to death.

[slowjet]

You might want to ask that of the Iranian family of the woman still, today, facing execution by stoning to death.

[Tziganul]

Seems to me that Global Consciousness is rising! That always implies some sort of "transition" (pains and sorrows) before true freedom can be achieve, just like the West went trough, where people have payed with their lives so that their kids and their children's kids can be their own master and not the puppet of someone else. However, the same Freedom we seeks is detrimental to humans, why, because as Machiavelis put it, "the human nature is evil!!!" envy will always destroy what we build, and as long as we (everyone!!!) envy what our brother/sister/friend have, AND hate them for having it and we don't, my friends, there is no hope!!!!

That being said, there is GREAT hope out there for GULF AIR!!! MILAN AND GENEVA NEXT MONTH!!!

[brassplate]

That's a real sad remark. Its going through the pains of trying to be a real democracy. Give it a chance. People in the ME are not from or in the stone ages, including those in Iran.

a345xx screw democracy when the majority will vote for someone who belongs to none other than their form of the religion rather than voting with their conscience. iran found that out the hard way when they voted in a puppet whose strings a tugged by a mullah who has his twisted interpretation of religion. look where they are now? bahrain is unfit for pure democracy due to it's toxic demographics. another ten more years of gradual change might do the trick....or not.

[a345xxx]

So in the west we vote along party lines! So whats the difference between that and voting along racial, religious or family lines?

[Tziganul]

Guys come on, this is an AVIATION forum, let the political comments for Face_book!!! By the way, anyone wants to join me in OUR own Hariri Square? I hear they are giving free food and drinks!

[brassplate]

So in the west we vote along party lines! So whats the difference between that and voting along racial, religious or family lines?

you are kidding me, right? this is nothing about racial or family lines. it is all about religious lines. everyone can see that. don't try and hide behind any other reason.
to answer your question in a phrase, SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE.
why? because when religion takes hold of leadership, it makes IT'S LAWS to be THE LAW, for everyone, believer or not, which amounts to ironically, LOSS OF FREEDOM.
back to the effects to aviation in gf, according to fellow pilots still there, lots. tanks have now rolled in to the pearl roundabout area, bridges are blocked to muharraq and the airport, and pilots who live out of town will have to negotiate their way through what is becoming a hazardous and dangerous route to work.
furthermore, the company is not issuing advice of concern or even interest in the welfare of flight crew until they get to work. then gf is more than happy to work them to death, before sending them back home through the same hazardous and dangerous route back home.

[a345xxx]

The statement is about how people vote. Not unsafe work conditions or how the company regards employee safety.

[bus_aviator]

boys and girls i would like to think that before we are one religion or another or before we have one political inclination or another, once we are behind that cage door that we call a cockpit... we become professional pilots, as such lets keep the thread related to aviation so that we don't trot the wrong ally and offend some people with whom i have flown and are of all different religions and political inclinations...and do not deserve to be offended. leave the politics for the politicians.

ps we had a fat salary in the good times and we as expats suckled that titty, it would be a lack of character on our part in the "bad" times which are now to turn our backs and say it's not our problem...read between the lines we are the problem ...lets make things better for everyone...
I have just spent too much time with this thread...cheers

[MikeAlpha7]

Brassplate ....Let me tell you something , mate. You have no clue of what is really going on in this country. If you really want to know , I suggest you spend more valuable time browsing the net to learn about the issues. Maybe you should check the Western media like , NYT , Guardian or perhaps the BBC , don't bother about Arabic media , they are backwards , aren't they ?.

Spare us this stereotype nonsense.

[Tziganul]

I think this is the perfect time to go on strike and ask for more money!!!!!! Remember, MONEY MONEY MONEY!!!! THAT should be our only religion and political inclination, get MORE OF IT!!!!

Now, on a more positive note, lately, I have not heard anyone failing the command upgrade. In fact, if memory serves me well, I think all the candidates have passed!!! This is what we call progress, going from 95% failure to 100% pass!!! I think our cry has been heard!!! Alaah/God/Budha (and I do apologize if I forgot someone) is great!

[flyboy328]

his is what we call progress, going from 95% failure to 100% pass!!!
Call it what you want but don´t use the word "progress";)

[esopees]

Sounds great and very good news for the new Cpts.
But remember that you become Cpt by merit and knowleedge and not by necesity of your company.
In Central America a company did the same, and soon they found out why they didn't pass 100% of their upgrades the previous years...
Cross fingers and best luck.:hmm:

[Tziganul]

I've been talking to some of the guys who have recently done their command and they say that the difficulty of the assessment has not gone down so I don't think that they have decreased the intensity of the process, however, I do think that now guys are getting their **** together and realizing that you MUST get prepared for this bloody interview. In a way, the failures before has hopefully brought people to get seriously prepare. Their are definitely some guys who still have slipped through the cracks but not as many as we'd think. In general, the new captains I have flown with are all good guys and have lots of knowledge about the company's SOPs, OMA, FCOMS, etc. Now lets hope that this continues and that most of us will pass. Off course, if they don't want u in the left seat you won't make it, no matter how hard you prepare for it. Let's just hope that this won't be the case for the rest of us who's command might come this year.

ps. I apologies for a previous post, I recently found out that not 100% have passed, 2 guys have failed their second try. Like one of my Science professor said, luck helps you sometimes, work ... ALWAYS!

[running rabbit]

I love to fly....anytime!

[Che Guevara]

No, we can't go to Heathrow more than twice a day, not now or in the future, because they sold their 3rd slot (another great move gents!) :D

The lounge is probably a left over contract that was signed when we had the 777s on the cards and a healthy order book. :{

[Tziganul]

RIP Ali Al Khalifa! Didn't know you much but sure enjoyed doing the refreshers with you. May God protect you wherever you go! Amen!

[Che Guevara]

Very sad news indeed.

An Officer and a Gentleman.
He will be missed.

May he rest in Peace.

[ironbutt57]

Yes indeed he was, RIP Sheikh!!!

[Elle34]

Guys ,

which Ali Al KHalifa??

[slowjet]

was that Abdul Rachman Al Khalifa? From IB, looks like it is. What happened ? we should, maybe move this to "Where are they now". Just asked a pal of mine, Retired GF Captain if he knew this guy. Reply was that if it was indeed Abdul, a finer spirit, true Officer, real Gentleman & one of the most gifted humourists ever to grace our Flight Decks.

My mate, Gordo MacFarlaine, recalls a trip he did to Bankok with Abdul. The guy pitched up for the HK turnround with Orange hair, claiming it was a mad thing to do but that he could not wash it out. Well, connected to the Ruling Family, guess he could do anything he wanted! Abdul fle for about a further month with gently, less orange hair !

Sad loss and if it is the same guy, sadly missed by all. RIP Sheik. Now you can get your hair done again.................any colour you like .

[Albergineman]

Sad loss and if it is the same guy, sadly missed by all. RIP Sheik. Now you can get your hair done again.................any colour you like . No, he's not the same person, Ali just became a Captain last year... what a character! Great guy!

Rest in peace!

[John21UK]

Does anyone know what the upgrade policy is at GF? Is there a good chance to move from the Embraer onto the 320's as an f/o?

[John21UK]

You mean folk leaving the Embraer to go onto the 320? Or when they get rid of the Embraer fleet alltogether?

[John21UK]

Does Gulf Air have any more outstanding orders or purchase rights? (Airbus/E-Jet) Airfleets shows zero.

[Panama Jack]

From my first reading of the message in my webmail, it looks like we got a very nice new Staff Travel policy taking effect tomorrow with both ID50's and ID90's for nominees and some free tickets for staff. No more Split-Leave, but rather 2 Leave Tickets per year (which will be nice for those who live in locations not served by GF).

I know it is not stylish to make happy remarks about T's & C's Gulf Air on this threat, but this looks like a top-drawer staff travel policy to me! :ok:

P.S., for you folks who "give" away nominee tickets to your "friends", please don't :mad: it up for the rest of us. You know what I mean. :suspect:

[TZZ]

it seems no more business class tickets for first officers.

[Panama Jack]

touk is correct. The system was updated earlier today and FO's are still eligible for upgrade and can buy J Class subload ZED tickets on GF as before.

One thing I am not sure about is whether "pilots" fit into the Specialist category or into the Supervisor, Manager, Senior Manager category?

[Albergineman]

The new "Matrix" as it unfolds for me:

FOC1: The old leave ticket all foreign staff are entitle to, to travel to their home country as per contract. For any airline which serves the country;

FOC2: The old "split-leave" ticket. Only for GFA network;

FOC3:The old "Long Service" ticket. Only for GFA network.

Pilots do not fit in the "Specialist" category - why they are not "specialized" from the GFA's point of view I do not know.

From my point of view and needs it did not change anything.

I hope we become "Specialists" one day...

:{

[Albergineman]

There is no more ID90 J class in QR
There is no more ID90 J class in LH
There is no more ID50 J class in EK


:(