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Emirates (EK) Interview - all you need to know about it (threads merged)

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Emirates (EK) Interview - all you need to know about it (threads merged)

Old 31st Jan 2007, 23:10
  #821 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 347
You don't reckon there's anymore to it than pay vs work? What about pay vs education, safety, security, two tiered legal system, management support, standard of living, living o/s, ftls, fatigue and so on.
Your posts smack of a desperate attempt by recruiting people, mostly new entrants to the company, to get a few bums on seats.
If there wasn't some truth in the posts on this site, negative and positive, then you would get people interested in the company. Fix the problems and you'll get your new recruits, don't and you won't.
ernestkgann is offline  
Old 1st Feb 2007, 02:55
  #822 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Fish Bowl
Posts: 53
"What about pay vs education, safety, security, two tiered legal system, management support, standard of living, living o/s, ftls, fatigue and so on." Earnest Gann.

Great points there. Shall we look at a few then.

1. Education. Maybe with the salaries we all made at our former airlines, we could send our kids to a private school. Maybe some of us could.

2. Okay the 2 tiered legal system? Well the first thing we need to understand is that this is not the good U.S. of A where there is freedom and justice for all. It is a Sheikhdom. There are no elections to a point where a cabinet is elected etc,etc. It's a bit different up here and one cannot change a system that has been around for years. Maybe when they have elections next, we can lobby our MP to make the necessary changes.

3. Standard of living? Man we are in the middle east what do you expect? Did your former airline pay for housing? Did they pay for water or gas or electricity, or a refurbishment alowance.

4. Safety? I have never felt more safe here than in my former country. At least here one may not be shot in a drive-by, or probably not mugged. Or knifed. It is a relatively safe country to live in.

5. Fatigue, great way to adress that is sleep a little more on overnights and not party or shop too much. Try it, it works.

6. Flight time limitations: We used to have a limit of a 1000 hrs a year in my forme airline, we would only ever work 7-800 hours of course, so 900 hours is a luxury. And to be fair i have felt tired on occasion, but that was a one off occasion, sleep is great for that kind of thing.

7. Management support. Well we are supported to a degree, and it is enough. Too much support and we'll be having them over for dinner every Thursday. Suites me fine.

So in short. For the wannabee joiners. EK is a good airline, it's not the best but it is a good airline. Every company has issues even EK. There are proper chanels to adress those issues. Certainly not slagging your own company and superiors on a public forum. Just not professional.


Last edited by Crinklstein; 1st Feb 2007 at 21:41.
Crinklstein is offline  
Old 1st Feb 2007, 05:13
  #823 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bolivia
Posts: 434
Propoganda Alert

To all viewing this thread, be aware the Crinklestein is probably a management stooge.

I belileve his posts to be at best misleading.

Sure there will always be different views/opinions on every issue there is, but be warned.

Education: Different for everyone and totally cyclic. At present not bad, as there is choice. A couple of years back you couldn't get your kids into any decent school, let alone one of your choice, and that will probably reoccur as the current surge in school construction slows down. Real education, as we know it in the first world, at secondary level does not exist in this city yet. Additionally, private education (as Crinklestein refers to it) here, roughly equates to a good State School at home.

Two Tiered legal system: Crinklestein suggests that we should accept it and get on with life. I tend to agree. But be warned it is fraught with danger. Step over the line in the sand that you cant see, and you could very easily be in an unpleasant jail for some time. Just ask many of our pilots/managers/cabin crew who have been guests of the government. It is true to say this can happen at home, but at least you can be reasonably confident in most cases that your case will be heard in an impartial court with competent representation and you are generally not incarcerated until proven guilty. I would not say the same here.

Standard of Living: Once again personal. If you are from many of the poorer countries we recruit from then dubai will be a significant improvement. If you come from a country that enjoys plenty of public space for recreation, access to community run and supported clubs, proper regulation of standards such as laws governing quality of construction, proper consumer protection, uncensored television, internet, and print media. Not to mention not having your mail opened before you get it!!!, then you may be a little surprised by what you find.

Safety: Yes you are less likely to be shot in a drive by, or mugged by a crack addict, but you are immeasurable more likely to be involved in a serious car accident. We have the most dangerous road in the world here, and you have to drive on it almost daily.

Fatigue is a major issue, it cannot be addressed by
"sleep a little more on overnights and not party or shop too much" That is a pathetic attempt to make light of what is probably the single biggest flight safety risk at Emirates. Alomost all of our layovers are 24hrs, regardless of what the previous duty was, or next duty is. It is well documented that 24hr layovers are not manageable, regardless of how little shopping or partying one does.

Flight Time limitations: There is a lot more to flight time limitations than how many hours you fly in a year. 1000 hrs can be fine if you have proper regulation of rest periods etc. We dont. It is common to do an ULH flight to the East, return to Dubai and then be sent on a Westbound flight. Or do back of the clock turnarounds where you get to bed at Midday to be rostered again for similar that night. We operate many of our flights under dubious "exemptions" which allow us to do two sector flights under circumstances that a one sector flight would not be allowed.
Again, quoting yearly limits is a pathetic attempt to make light of another serious issue.

Management support: Except for family/health issues, such as long term sickness, serious illness or the recent trauma experienced by one of our families, management does not support us. We are further down the food chain than cabin crew, dispatchers etc. I think i can confidently say that, as a general rule, EK's corporate philosophy on man management is to periodically publicly crucify someone in order keep the masses in check. To be fair this happens less nowdays since many victims of this policy have taken them to court (in other coutries) and won significant victories. This would have to be one of the few airlines where flight operations management are marginalised in the running of the airline. Our managers have less influence than commercial, cabin crew, HR, or corporate communications, and that is over operational issues, let alone HR issues.

And Finally
"There are proper chanels to adress those issues. Certainly not slagging your own company and superiors on a public forum."

This statement is clearly one from a person who is a management stooge or very wet behind the ears. Sure there may be "Chanels" but they are ineffective. The only result of highlighting issues to management is to invite a torrent of invective from LRE et al. Where is the pilot representative body? Where is the forum to air concerns and be heard? where is the accountability of management? The single reason you see so much dirty laundry aired on PPRuNe is because there is no other practical option available. If people thought they could effect change through the command chain they would try. Many (including myself) have tried and none sucessful. PPRuNe is far from ideal, but I'm afraid its all we've got. That alone should tell wannabes something about our management.

Crinklestein, I believe you are a fraud and you are attempting to mislead people.

To all prospective applicants to EK, I say come have a look, talk to colleagues who have been here more than 3 years (They will have experienced some errosion in conditions or been victim of management misrepresentation) take into account what Crinklestein has said, along that that of negative posters, because i can assure you, there is some truth in all of it. It just depends on your perspective, where you come from, and where you plan to go.

One thing i cant deny, and that is EK is probably the best place in the world to come and get the right type rating to further your career. But for most EK will never be a career in itself and that is because, for most, Dubai is unlikely to ever be a place where you will want to spend the rest of your working career.

V
Vorsicht is offline  
Old 1st Feb 2007, 06:07
  #824 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Oz
Posts: 86
Crinklstein,

You are joking aren't you.I cant believe you passed the IQ test.I thought you were actually Typhoon Pilot but even his comments aren't as one sided as yours.
dunerider is offline  
Old 1st Feb 2007, 13:39
  #825 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Varies!
Posts: 727
Vorsicht

Thank you. You saved me the time and effort to reply with something very similar. Having been here the 'obligatory' 3 years +, I concure wholeheartedly with your post especially the fatigue issues. You even showed restraint by not mentioning the debacle of upgrades in this Company. All valid and well reasoned points that ANY new joiner should note.

BYMONEK
BYMONEK is offline  
Old 1st Feb 2007, 22:46
  #826 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Land of NI
Posts: 97
By god mr V

You are the man!!

Very well Said sir!!

Crinklebottom crawl back to your pityful hole where you belong!

Liar and LOOOOOOOSER!!!!
BIKKERDENNAH is offline  
Old 2nd Feb 2007, 08:58
  #827 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: asia
Posts: 13
regards to everyone..
Any info regarding the tech exam?pls p.m. me thanks..
Do they ask technical questions on the interview?
What are the requirements for Accelerated Command?is 55t required?Do they offer this or you have to apply?

Thanks
b747godfather is offline  
Old 2nd Feb 2007, 10:41
  #828 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Fish Bowl
Posts: 53
For those of you wanting to join EK:

Do yourselves a favor and give yourselves a fair go. Come and have a look then make an informed decision. While there is truth to some of the posts, I would look past all the negativity and come and see for myself. The popular opinion on some these posts is very negative. Someone once told me never believe popular opinion, because it is usually wrong and half truths are whole lies. You need to ask yourslef the question: Why would someone shoot the "cow that provides him milk"? Ask yourselves: Why are some of these guys running the airline down and running me down in the process. The answer is very simple. They have a very dark agenda that goes beyond anything on these forums. They have something to gain by discouraging others from joining. All they care about is their bellies and what they can get out of the airline. I just tell it how it is despite the insults. When people start insulting others on public forums like these you can tell the character of a man and this screams of desparation.

Maybe a handful will listen to the negativity and stay away from EK but the smart man or woman will look beyond that.

For the record I don't work for management, and am not in recruitment or am I being paid to say nice things about the airline. I am just a regular guy who loves flying airplanes and doing a good job. I take pride in what I do and try to stand for truth and really really don't like negative people. I just thought I would do someone out there a favor by telling the truth for a change.

Before I joined a few years ago, I looked here to get some advice on how things were and out of 10 naysayers, I got 2 who really gave me an unbiased view of EK. I joined and have no regrets. Sure there are issues but I don't sweat the small stuff because there is more to life than those little things that others try to make into big things.

So I hope this helps and wish you luck with whatever decision you are going to make.

Crinklstein
Crinklstein is offline  
Old 2nd Feb 2007, 17:30
  #829 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: 30 West
Posts: 138
And anyone making up their minds to interview or not, or work at EK or not, by what they read on PPRuNe is nuts. It is so much easier to get on the internet and bitch and complain than it is to post that everything is all peaches and roses. Look on other web boards on the complaints about Southwest, UPS, FEDEx and other high paying first world companies. If you went by what was written, you wouldn't want to go there, either.

It's what your looking for, isn't it? Is it job security, is money, is it family life, is it upgrades, is it partying on layovers, is it destinations? No one airline is going to match up in all of these categories.

But also take into account what those who seem to have distain for management and the company. It seems to be the same 15 or so posters, and if some one says something positive, the are "managment stooges", "loosers", "liers", and on and on. You just might have to fly with one of these happy gents.

Here's something.......if someone could tell me please, what airline in the world can give you more than EK, a B777 or A330 captaincy in 3-4 years and the pay, and better management support and a more profitable airline and a bonus plan and a better retirement fund and housing supplied and better maintenance and job security..............Please tell me, 'cause I will leave my current first world airline and do what I can to get there.

The half dozen or so guys that I know that are at EK are giddy to be there. Simple as that. I tried, but for variouis reasons it didn't work out. Ek doesn't reach the top in any one category, but does anywhere else?

And please boys, tell the better airlines and why?
IXNAT

Last edited by IXNAT; 2nd Feb 2007 at 17:44.
IXNAT is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 00:02
  #830 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 246
Crinklstein & IXNAT

I have to admit that I admire your tenacity in stating your perspective. There is a lot of negativity in these forums and I agree that there are good aspects about Emirates that are worthy of your support, however....

I'll put it bluntly. In my opinion, your comments are immature in content and devoid of any credibility.

Just for the record, I'm settled in Dubai, like my job and not looking to move in the near future.

I'm not going to address your collective points individually because I don't need to. What I will say is this. I am an expatriate, employed for my skills and licence and expect to be compensated accordingly. What do I mean by that? Well...I'll put up with the two tiered system/driving/lack of any recourse if you pay me enough. Sounds mercenary, but that's the reality of it. Dubai is not our permanent home and never will be, we can accommodate the culture but we will never adopt it. Expatriates around the world make sacrifices in their choice of lifestyle but can collectively command better than average conditions to reflect their contracted status and personal circumstances.

I can only assume that you both orginate from conditions/quality of life that is less desirable to that found in Dubai. That's not to make a derogatory comparison, well done on improving your lot. But there are others in Dubai that see less of an advantage in being here anymore and have expressed their opinions accordingly.

Going back to my original opinion about your comments, if I have a problem with your credibility, then you really have reached the outer edges of the spectrum.

I finish on the comment about safety

It is a relatively safe country to live in.
My wife was almost run off the road not one week after the tragic accident that we all know about. No amount of compensation will ever replace lost family.
atiuta is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 00:19
  #831 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Fish Bowl
Posts: 53
"I can only assume that you both orginate from conditions/quality of life that is less desirable to that found in Dubai. That's not to make a derogatory comparison, well done on improving your lot." Atiuta.

I lived in paradise my friend and loved my job but then we all leave for various reasons right? I wanted to work for EK full stop.... And you know what they say about assumptions...

Crinklstein is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 13:37
  #832 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: 30 West
Posts: 138
'I'll put it bluntly. In my opinion, your comments are immature in content and devoid of any credibility.'

You are right. There are parts of Chicago and Boston that are far worse that Dubai.

I'll go back to my original statement. Find me the airline worldwide that offers you the total package.

USA-you are not going to get a wide bodied command anywhere that has job security in 3-4 years, even with the average pay of Emirates. Think you can get a job with UPS, FedEx, SWA with just a visa?

Singapore-Deposit your almost $50,000 bond in a bank there and don't leave a day early. Oh yes, I believe on the Cargo side you don't get paid for DH, plus 20% taxes.

China (anywhere)-And life in Dubai is rough?

Jet Airways-looks like you have to go back to your home country and pay for your PPC. Might be doable.

So please help me out, I am looking for that better job, and better than EK. Maybe you guys could go down the road to Etihad, or Air Arabia, or Gulf Air, or RyanAir. They're all better, right?
IXNAT is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 14:46
  #833 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 246
IXNAT

Allow me to comment on just one point to highlight the issue of credibiltiy. Both yourself and Crinklstein challenged the forum to name an airline that provides you with housing.

I don't have an issue with housing and am very satisfied with my accommodation, but I can't eat it or bank it. It's part of my package as an expatriate and I wouldn't be here if I didn't have the accommodation that I do and Emirates knows it. You can't wave the flag about how "wonderful" the housing is because it's a requirement when you are "guests" of another country. My last airline didn't provide housing (and I would have fell over if they did) but I could also buy, build and negotiate what I wanted, and had representation through various agencies over quality assurance. I didn't need anyones permission to sell or buy, neither did I have to pay the exorbitant fees charged here.

It is not a credible argument to present Emirates as a wonderful option because they provide housing and our previous employers didn't. It goes with the territory as an expat pilot!

Emirates does provide (in most cases) a good standard of expatriate accommodation where as others in the region do not. That's one of the reasons I don't work for the competition.

I could make a similar case out of a number of other subjects that have been raised here but I'm sure you get my drift.
atiuta is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 21:24
  #834 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: here and there
Posts: 74
referees in application!

Hey Guys,
need a short info on the EK application. This Topic seems to be most suitable.
For what reason EK wants 3 referees?
When and Why do they call one of these?
Answers highly appreciated

thx
Cityliner is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 22:45
  #835 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: dubai
Posts: 62
I did the interviews last week. ALL 3 of my referees were contacted.
Good sign I hope. In the course of the 3 days of interviews they
go over your referees with you to make sure they are suitable.
So chhose ones that meet EK requirements..............good luck the interview process is interesting and fun.
xkred27 is offline  
Old 3rd Feb 2007, 23:21
  #836 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Not here any more.
Posts: 644
Three referees

Why three? I dont know, but then why not.
My Airline shut down recently and quite a few of the lads applied to EK amongst others, normally what I've seen is that if you pass the interview and they want you they then call your referees. Basically you are in unless your referee gives you a bad reference, so pick your referee carefully. Recently I interviewed with another carrier in the region and one of the applicants told me that he had passed the Emirates interview last year, he had asked his boss to be one of his references, the boss agreed, when EK called him he gave the lad a Bad refernce so he was not selected. So be careful who you pick.
NG_Kaptain is offline  
Old 4th Feb 2007, 10:19
  #837 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: a seat on a fence
Posts: 80
IXNAT mentions several airlines that he implies are not as 'good' as Emirates. These include Singapore, Etihad, Ryanair, Gulfair, Arabian and Jet.

If IXNAT worked at Emirates and had information that was other than secondhand and/or subjective he would know that in the last few months more than a few Captains and F/Os have left Emirates for those same airlines he mentions, excepting Gulfair, Arabian and Jet. Although rumour has it that up to 35 EK Captains have recently been interviewed by Jet.

How contented those departees are with their decisions I do not know, but those decisions to leave where made after an objective assessment of their quality of life and prospects at Emirates.

IXNAT has never worked at Emirates. And I suspect has never visited Dubai, I'm sure he will put me straight on that point if I'm wrong.
theidler is offline  
Old 4th Feb 2007, 12:15
  #838 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: 30 West
Posts: 138
Right and wrong, Kimosabe. I am in Dubai quite regulary (see those big jets outside of your operations) and most of my information is second hand regarding the actual working conditions. But from my understanding, there are a number of FORMER Singapore guys at EK. Is the Etihad package better? And as far as Jet Airways, it's brand new and from the posts on their sites, it doesn't seem to be a bed of roses either. Is the pay better at Jet-yes, off basing-perhaps. But I would say it is too early to say if it will be better. As far as those leaving, perhaps it's for one reason and one reason only (or maybe two) pay and European basing. Give it a year to see and see if their is job security. ATW reports that there is the beginnings of too much capacity in India. Time will tell.

But I can see why people are tired of the Dubai living after a time. Can the company mitigate that? Maybe some..........
IXNAT is offline  
Old 4th Feb 2007, 14:55
  #839 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: overthere
Posts: 2,932
6. Flight time limitations: We used to have a limit of a 1000 hrs a year in my forme airline, we would only ever work 7-800 hours of course, so 900 hours is a luxury. And to be fair i have felt tired on occasion, but that was a one off occasion, sleep is great for that kind of thing.

I have stolen the quote above from a previous page of this thread. I have heard much the same kind of comment from a few new joiners. The fact that they never ever flew to the 1000hr limit and that they only flew 700 to 800hrs seems to have escaped them. It will be interesting to revisit these views after they have had a few years of 900hrs with min time off.

On another note, a neighbour has been given 23 days leave for the 2007/2008 leave year. He has no peak leave, and as all leave days are taken he can not bid for any more. He is bumping up against the 900hr limit.Today he was told that he can take forced leave in March. When he declined as leave then was no good to him, he was told to expect a month of SIM support.

Keep discovering

Don


donpizmeov is offline  
Old 5th Feb 2007, 00:44
  #840 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: worldwide
Posts: 3
Refrences

Whatīs up Cityliner, Iīve just being hired by Emirates and I believe they need three refrences because they donīt know you or your past. They need to be at least a little safe to know who they are hiring. Donīt give it a sweat just talk to whomever you are writing down as a reference and let them know. They will contact your references as soon as you leave the interview only if they are thinking to hire you. Good tip if they donīt contact your references itīs very probable you are not getting an offer. Hope I was of some help. Good luck!
CAFLYER is offline  

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