CORK - 5
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Leeds, UK & Cork, Ireland
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GX did fail, but the point we were making is that had they not burned through so much cash wet-leasing the fleet at the beginning of operations they might have been able to hold on a bit longer and routes would have been beginning to mature. The niche that GX once filled is long since gone. We have to remember that at the time EI was highly skeptical that Europe, other than a few weekly services to AMS and CDG could work from Cork, GX showed them otherwise and EI pounced.
I think LCY might be a relic of times gone by alright. Tellingly this is the only route not taken up by any airline since GX failed, Im sure the reasons are complex and the challenging operational conditions have probably played heavily into the decision, but in the current climate businesses are just not in a position to pay for fancy flights and convenience of somewhere like LCY - certainly not from Cork.
I think LCY might be a relic of times gone by alright. Tellingly this is the only route not taken up by any airline since GX failed, Im sure the reasons are complex and the challenging operational conditions have probably played heavily into the decision, but in the current climate businesses are just not in a position to pay for fancy flights and convenience of somewhere like LCY - certainly not from Cork.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ireland nowadays
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The Jetmagic route to London City was primarily sold on the basis of being the only flight that could get you into London in time for a full days work. However, that was fundamentally about having a 6am departure rather than flying to London City.
They failed for a number of reasons.
First and foremost, they were undercapitalized. They had start up capital of 4 million and managed to get this up to 10 million by the time they went under. Any start-up airline is going to burn a lot of cash initially. For the programme they were proposing, they shouldn't have even started without 16 million raised. Either that or they should have started with fewer aircraft.
They concentrated too much on their product and not enough on costs. While I never flew with them, I heard great stories about their in flight service. But with passengers who were already used to Ryanair at this point, keeping expenses down would have been a better option.
There was no frequent flyer programme. The kind of business passengers they were looking for to London were used to their Gold Circle perks and they stuck to Aer Lingus.
Finally, their aircraft were mostly too small. They were fine for multiple daily business services. But then those were the routes that failed anyway. Where they did well on Med and City Break destinations, they'd have easily filled an 80 to 100 seat aircraft and taken extra revenue.
Now, that's all with the benefit of hindsight (apart from the capitalization issues, which I remember commenting on at the time).
Interestingly, I think we've hit a point now, where there are a number of destinations - Dusseldorf, Frankfurt, Milan, Zurich, Madrid, maybe a year round service to Alicante and Faro - that could be served by aircraft that are smaller than what Aer Lingus and Ryanair have to offer, but with a range longer than Aer Arann's.
They failed for a number of reasons.
First and foremost, they were undercapitalized. They had start up capital of 4 million and managed to get this up to 10 million by the time they went under. Any start-up airline is going to burn a lot of cash initially. For the programme they were proposing, they shouldn't have even started without 16 million raised. Either that or they should have started with fewer aircraft.
They concentrated too much on their product and not enough on costs. While I never flew with them, I heard great stories about their in flight service. But with passengers who were already used to Ryanair at this point, keeping expenses down would have been a better option.
There was no frequent flyer programme. The kind of business passengers they were looking for to London were used to their Gold Circle perks and they stuck to Aer Lingus.
Finally, their aircraft were mostly too small. They were fine for multiple daily business services. But then those were the routes that failed anyway. Where they did well on Med and City Break destinations, they'd have easily filled an 80 to 100 seat aircraft and taken extra revenue.
Now, that's all with the benefit of hindsight (apart from the capitalization issues, which I remember commenting on at the time).
Interestingly, I think we've hit a point now, where there are a number of destinations - Dusseldorf, Frankfurt, Milan, Zurich, Madrid, maybe a year round service to Alicante and Faro - that could be served by aircraft that are smaller than what Aer Lingus and Ryanair have to offer, but with a range longer than Aer Arann's.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ireland nowadays
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The principle Gold Circle perks fall into two categories.
- Lounge Access - It might not seem like a big deal, but when you're flying every week, it really is a welcome break from the stress of the airport. Depending on the lounge, you can get anything from a couple of light snacks and free internet access to full catering services and showers.
- Flight privileges - Essentially you get to use your points to buy flights. You still have to pay taxes and charges though. I'm not flying as much as I sued to, but I still managed to get a pre-Christmas break in the Canaries for E40 when the flights were priced at over 200.
There are a few other ones like the ability to get yourself on flights that are sold out, but usually the price for that is so high, that you'd never do it.
- Lounge Access - It might not seem like a big deal, but when you're flying every week, it really is a welcome break from the stress of the airport. Depending on the lounge, you can get anything from a couple of light snacks and free internet access to full catering services and showers.
- Flight privileges - Essentially you get to use your points to buy flights. You still have to pay taxes and charges though. I'm not flying as much as I sued to, but I still managed to get a pre-Christmas break in the Canaries for E40 when the flights were priced at over 200.
There are a few other ones like the ability to get yourself on flights that are sold out, but usually the price for that is so high, that you'd never do it.
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Perks
Personally, and I'm flying every week, I'd much rather spend an extra 20 minutes in bed, get there just in time, then jump straight on the plane, than fart around the lounge eating peanuts.
On the other hand, with long haul and connecting flights, I'd love lounge access! All depends what kind of flying you are doing.
On the other hand, with long haul and connecting flights, I'd love lounge access! All depends what kind of flying you are doing.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ireland nowadays
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True about staying in bed.
And the lounge in Cork isn't open for the morning departure to Amsterdam anyway, so when I am on a morning flight out of Cork, it isn't an issue for me anyway.
It's mostly when you're returning on an evening flight that the lounge access becomes handy, especially if there's any delay on the flight or you're on a flight that departs 4 hours after you've finished working anyway.
And the lounge in Cork isn't open for the morning departure to Amsterdam anyway, so when I am on a morning flight out of Cork, it isn't an issue for me anyway.
It's mostly when you're returning on an evening flight that the lounge access becomes handy, especially if there's any delay on the flight or you're on a flight that departs 4 hours after you've finished working anyway.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Cork
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Originally Posted by DDX55
easyjet offer a 25 pound fee for lounge access that they sell online. i assume this is similar, but i wonder if this a thing common to most airports? (buy your way in)?
I have at least another year from my points, so I would contemplate moving my business account to BOI when that runs out.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ireland nowadays
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The barrier for entry is quite low anyway. 12 return flights to the UK, 8 to continental Europe or 4 to the USA. So if you're doing any moderate amount of business travel, you'll qualify. Like I said, I'm not travelling between Cork and Amsterdam on a weekly basis any more, but I'm still making the trip over to Ireland often enough that I easily qualify.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Cork, Ireland
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Declining passengers by up to 20% in May and declining airport visitors due mainly to there being nowhere for the relations of the Cork Santa Ponsa Brigades to meet up to have a jar and watch the planes & their kinfolk come and go off Palma and Lanzarote flights.
Just what can we do? Did someone say have a photo exhibition?
Glorified tarted up outdoor food stalls and photo exhibitions - Cork Airport 2009!
What a joke!
Just what can we do? Did someone say have a photo exhibition?
Glorified tarted up outdoor food stalls and photo exhibitions - Cork Airport 2009!
What a joke!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Cork
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Yeah I was talking to some of the groundstaff when passing through last week and they said that but for the charters, the airport would be dead at the weekends. It's already dead from Mon-Wed was the way they put it.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Cork, Ireland
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Ryanair restarted Carcassone this weekend for the summer months. Today's inbound which was just the second flight had about 50 pax so whilst it looks poor the fact that number of France originating passengers from a remotish airport wanted to get to Cork is not wholly discouraging as I am sure most of the pax on such a seasonal destination are from the Cork area.
I am really trying to grasp on to any shred of hope here!
In the good weather this afternoon there were of course many flyovers overhead the Cork Airport area heading westbound and in the midst of the multiple BA 777s there was one interesting item of traffic in the shape of the Emirates A380 bound for JFK which went abeam just north of the field around 1.10 pm. A nice sight to see especially in such good, bright summer sunshine.
Heard also there were 80 pax on a recent Chicago Dublin flight!
Yikes!
I am really trying to grasp on to any shred of hope here!
In the good weather this afternoon there were of course many flyovers overhead the Cork Airport area heading westbound and in the midst of the multiple BA 777s there was one interesting item of traffic in the shape of the Emirates A380 bound for JFK which went abeam just north of the field around 1.10 pm. A nice sight to see especially in such good, bright summer sunshine.
Heard also there were 80 pax on a recent Chicago Dublin flight!
Yikes!
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UIP : 4° 10’ 0” W, 47° 58’ 0” N
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ALOT of Ryanair aircraft parked up in DUB and STN in recent weeks. Just wondering are there any parked up in ORK as well? Why would they have so many parked up when the so called 'high season' has started?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Cork, Ireland
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Ryanair restarted Carcassone this weekend for the summer months. Today's inbound which was just the second flight had about 50 pax so whilst it looks poor the fact that number of France originating passengers from a remotish airport wanted to get to Cork is not wholly discouraging as I am sure most of the pax on such a seasonal destination are from the Cork area.
I am really trying to grasp on to any shred of hope here!
I am really trying to grasp on to any shred of hope here!
Join Date: Aug 2000
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Heard the geniuses up at Cork had Lorient up on the boards as L'orient! That would be a classic Cork howler. EI have an attractive poster at the departure doors for Lisbon. That should have been up a lot earlier but maybe it was but I did not see it if that is the case. The CAA might as well allow FR to park an aeroplane - after all, if the numbers are down by 20% for May why not - at least it would be some revenue and it might even encourage Duckie & Company to get it to do a flight to Blackpool or something at some point for an ol' laugh?
Laugh? We had a howl!
Laugh? We had a howl!
Join Date: Sep 2001
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Heard the geniuses up at Cork had Lorient up on the boards as L'orient! That would be a classic Cork howler.
EI have an attractive poster at the departure doors for Lisbon
Join Date: Aug 2000
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Cut the geniuses up at Cork some slack? That is a big ask but I will think about it!
I was waiting above for She Who Must be Obeyed yesterday and in the warm afternoon sunshine it made for a pleasant hour or two. It had been a busy morning with a few outbound Lourdes flights in the shape of a Titan and an Air Finland 757 along with a Air Mediteranean A320. By the time I arrived the Titan was touching down again on her return from Lourdes and along with the more usual line traffic of EI, FR and RE there was the Iberworld A320 and the Europe Airpost 737 so the place was fairly lively.
From my newly found perch I had a grand view of the approach road to the departures car let down area and it was regularly congested and there were regular hoots of anger from other motorists' car horns. It gave me a laugh in the end. Has anyone noticed how many folk in cars there are waiting for either airport staff or arriving passengers on the off set traffic line, the one closest to the Christy Ring sculputre? Seems to me they are taking the p!55.
It is probably the case that the old Dublin Aer Rianta crowd are responsible for a lot of the design of the new terminal? Seems it was with little sympathy anyway for the sense of local spirit in Cork? A lot of people like me were either waiting for arriving passengers or waiting to board their own flights yesterday. They were not quaffing a pint or a cup of tea but perhaps some of them would have been happy enough to while away an hour at a viewing area?
It is a pity as it seems to me that there seems to be little sense of what aviation is all about in the D(C)AA - no sense of having any responsibility at all for the future generations of pilots, cabin crews, engineers & techicians etc and where they are all to come from? You got to enthuse all these upcoming young people, you know.
So who thinks I should cut the geniuses up at Cork some slack?
I was waiting above for She Who Must be Obeyed yesterday and in the warm afternoon sunshine it made for a pleasant hour or two. It had been a busy morning with a few outbound Lourdes flights in the shape of a Titan and an Air Finland 757 along with a Air Mediteranean A320. By the time I arrived the Titan was touching down again on her return from Lourdes and along with the more usual line traffic of EI, FR and RE there was the Iberworld A320 and the Europe Airpost 737 so the place was fairly lively.
From my newly found perch I had a grand view of the approach road to the departures car let down area and it was regularly congested and there were regular hoots of anger from other motorists' car horns. It gave me a laugh in the end. Has anyone noticed how many folk in cars there are waiting for either airport staff or arriving passengers on the off set traffic line, the one closest to the Christy Ring sculputre? Seems to me they are taking the p!55.
It is probably the case that the old Dublin Aer Rianta crowd are responsible for a lot of the design of the new terminal? Seems it was with little sympathy anyway for the sense of local spirit in Cork? A lot of people like me were either waiting for arriving passengers or waiting to board their own flights yesterday. They were not quaffing a pint or a cup of tea but perhaps some of them would have been happy enough to while away an hour at a viewing area?
It is a pity as it seems to me that there seems to be little sense of what aviation is all about in the D(C)AA - no sense of having any responsibility at all for the future generations of pilots, cabin crews, engineers & techicians etc and where they are all to come from? You got to enthuse all these upcoming young people, you know.
So who thinks I should cut the geniuses up at Cork some slack?
Last edited by Tom the Tenor; 2nd Jun 2009 at 16:09.
Join Date: Mar 2005
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From my newly found perch I had a grand view of the approach road to the departures car let down area and it was regularly congested and there were regular hoots of anger from other motorists' car horns. It gave me a laugh in the end. Has anyone noticed how many folk in cars there are waiting for either airport staff or arriving passengers on the off set traffic line, the one closest to the Christy Ring sculputre? Seems to me they are taking the p!55.
I doubt any significant extra money has been raised, but it's caused bad congestion around the terminal whenever a couple of flights arrive at the same time.