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Ayla Aaa Jordan

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Old 22nd Dec 2008, 12:54
  #301 (permalink)  
 
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goneeast - Could you possibly scan the GulfAir Audit checklist and upload it.

icecream_pilot - You should know by now that Ayla isn't about standards or lining up themselves with airliners. It's all about pay the cost to be out there, a simple matter of which students in Charlie wanted to fly together as PF and PNF and he said "no the CARC doesn't allow it", What a sleezy way of saying no but I believe that in the CARC regulations it is allowed to do so. So, no matter what you do and how much you fight for your rights you will only get what you barely want. By the way, you can do whatever you want in JW and you can go X-C to Amman or WHEREVER you want and yes that includes Sharm Al Shaikh, Greece and even BAHRAIN, you can fly the airplane as any ordinary person but file your trip to Bahrain as IFR. The only problem is that the CEO doesn't want you to do any of this!
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Old 22nd Dec 2008, 15:43
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Mike.Park : In the beginning it was just this training area called JW ( Juliet West ) and Waypoint Jurf....Basically you go there report overhead and come back
That's what they call navigation.Now you can go to Amman and another area called Juffer (used for touch-and-go)...

As my colleague STRIKER54 mentionned we proposed a plan of building hours in dual pilot basis. 2 PPL pilots would do their missions together

But no they say it's not allowed !!! MY ...There is no where on earth that says a PPL holder can't fly with someone...At the end it means you have nothing or they don't trust you or even trust the safety the academy has...

Come on i contacted CARC and even them couldn't give me a proper answer they don't even know what's going on...Have a look at their website all the links are ERROR 404 NOT FOUND

I wish someone could help and clarify all that so one day those people could shut their mouths


Happy and safe flying to all
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Old 22nd Dec 2008, 16:24
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x-country

Thanks for the info Icecream_pilot.

Isnt it an ICAO requirement that you fly solo and land at two aerodromes different to that of your point of departure? From what I remember, this is considered your qualifying cross country flight and you won't get your PPL without doing so!

So for example AQJ (departure) -> Airport One -> Airport Two -> AQJ (Return)
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Old 22nd Dec 2008, 17:42
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It Suppose to be that way but you are in Jordan man !!!!

To let 2 PPL fly they cannot it's not allowed...but to avoid x-country flights and landing at 2 diff airports this is ALLOWED
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Old 22nd Dec 2008, 17:53
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Mike.Park

x-country
Thanks for the info Icecream_pilot.

Isnt it an ICAO requirement that you fly solo and land at two aerodromes different to that of your point of departure? From what I remember, this is considered your qualifying cross country flight and you won't get your PPL without doing so!

So for example AQJ (departure) -> Airport One -> Airport Two -> AQJ (Return)
Of course you are absolutely right but here in AAA there are six, out of eight GIs, un-licenced. One requirement for taking PPL and CPL exam is that every GI will sign on the record form of every student for the subject which he has taught them. Similarly an IGI must teach them IR, however presently no IGI is there in AAA. Also, the simulator installed in Ground School is un-licenced and un-certified but still it is being used to impart training to the students. CARC know all these shortfalls but still it is silent. If tomorrow one students of AAA is involved in a serious accident in future, then the accident investigators will have to check all these records of the pilot concerned. Now my question is that who will then be responsible for these shortfalls in the training of that student???????

I mean to say that violation of rules in AAA = AIDS is a normal phenomenon with the help of feloos and wasta. Otherwise for x-country flight, apart from landing at an airfield other than departure, even the minimum distance between the two is also specified.

Last edited by Truthful; 22nd Dec 2008 at 19:07.
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Old 22nd Dec 2008, 19:02
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Accident which is likely to happen in AAA

I have already said that all ingredients for a fatal accident are readily available at AIDS. One of the under training CFIs showed her ignorance when Chief Instructor told her to show him Lazy 8 maneouvre. One more is famous for porpoising after touch down. There is no cocept of a crew chief while statrting engines and seeing off the pilots while the students will learn the Marshalling signals when they join an airliners.

While carrying maintenance the technicians are absolutely oblivious of blanking the hoses and pipes. If you talk to the Maintenance Director about this, he gives you a blank look. Cessna is a forgiving aircraft but for how long? Lets see & wait about these un-safe maintenance practices. However I am likely to take the maintenance issues in detail very soon.

In my career I remember one fatal accident. The Academy record of the deceased pilot showed that that academy was the main contributor towards that fatal accident.

So AAA will be held responsible for its lapses even if one of its students is involved in such an accident in his future assignement. At that very time these un-licenced GIs, DCGI and CGI may be resting in peace as they are even now superannuated. So CEO and HoT will have to bear all the blames being shared by CARC as Regulatory Authority.

Last edited by Truthful; 23rd Dec 2008 at 03:40.
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Old 26th Dec 2008, 11:07
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Old 26th Dec 2008, 18:17
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Angry AYLA

Honestly, whatever you guys have mentioned earlier is indeed the plain truth of AAA, but think about it thoroughly, is it really the CEO mistake???!!! He is only a businessman looking after his own interest, and seeking a huge multi-digit number to appear in his account balance, just like any businessman. The only difference here is the way any businessman would create an image and build a reputation for his business. The only difference is whether honesty, ethics and humanity were placed into consideration when recruiting the heavily loan back-loaded cadets.
I was personally astonished by the well refined and polished image that AAA marketing manager presented AAA to me. Without a second thought I found myself on the plane dreaming about all the fake promises I have been bombarded with. Promises which made me resign a great job, decline an amazing scholarship and ditch a business project with good potential.
Luckily, for AAA CEO, he launched a whole “propaganda” about the academy and managed to fool good number of people, but sadly for him, “He believed it”.
I remember “after spending more than five months doing basically nothing except PPL ground school (which was a complete joke as everyone had the answers before getting the tests), and just after started my first flying lesson with a bullying master that calls himself an instructor” in a totally ridiculous email response from AAA CEO for a farewell email I’ve sent to everyone in AAA I quote “we have provided you with lap-top, accommodation and social activities so if you couldn’t make it in here you would not make it anywhere else” . Now guess what, in 2 months I managed to get my JAR-PPLfrom Scotland at cheaper price, higher experience (frost, rain, turbulence, MATZ crossing, SVFR and real X-country flying) and along with professional radio qualification.
Despite all the hatred accumulated Deep inside of me, I hope everything goes right for AAA, only because I think that their cadets have and still suffering enough in term of time wasted and financial liabilities that cadets and their families would have to face, liabilities which would go worst if any further delays have taken place by either AAA or GF.
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Old 26th Dec 2008, 20:00
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is it really the CEO mistake???!!! He is only a businessman
It's no longer "business" when the little outfit starts breaking laws to save a few bucks.. especially in the world of aviation where these laws are safeguards to maintain minimum levels of safety & standards. From what I've been reading of Ayla Aviation on PPRuNE, if indeed factual, this school would have been shut down or suspended a long time ago if it were operating anywhere else in the world.

Congratulations on getting your JAA-PPL though. Welcome to the club!
I got my JAA-PPL in the south of England in a little more congested airspace... London TMA just above my head!

Last edited by Mike.Park; 27th Dec 2008 at 11:38.
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 13:00
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My Name is Marwan Atalla, and I am the CEO of Ayla Aviation Academy. I am here to answer any questions or concerns anyone has, provided they are professional issues, addressed in a professional manner. Remember, the first P in PPRUNE stands for professional, so let's all try keep it that way.

For obvious reasons, i will not reply to rude & offensive messages, silly stories about credit cards and shoping, nor get into subjective, pointless arguments.

But i am happy to answer factual questions or address matters that concern anyone interested enough to ask about Ayla.
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 13:49
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Ahlan wa sahlan

It's been 17 months since the first Ayla Aviation thread started,
363 messages posted so far,
and a whopping 14,051 page views in total.


Welcome to the forums Marwan!
Took you long enough!
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 17:36
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Angel ayla

Hi guys,
My story in brief ,
I went to Jordan as my aim to study and be a pilot in my country airline so I chose ayla as this school is near my home and the marketing guys did there jobs very well to convince me that ayla is a very professional flight school and as you know we are Bahraini are so kind people so I believed them and I went to Alaqaba to do the acceptation exam and the medical test and I passed both these test but unfortunately ayla doesn't passed my physical exam..
Anyway,
I saw my friend there and he was already doing the course then I asked him about the school but he didn’t recommend the academy at all also he told me a very bad story about some Jordanians people had attacked the students accommodation and thread some of the students which mean the place is not safe to study on it, and every day new roles and new change in everything and everywhere, one more thing that the student are playing wing eleven(Play station) instead doing some flying by the Cessna which mean they are not flying and really the student situation were bloody hard ..
By the way,
I was told that the license which they offered is JAA. But after I argued with them until they told me that the license is JAA which means Jordan Aviation Authorize...

Then I came back to Bahrain and I recalculate my plan then I saw myself here in Australia with life style of (No Worries Mate)
After all what I heard and what I have been seen here I don’t feel sorry at all about my decision about students in ayla at all.
I wish all the best for all.
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 19:50
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Want to understand

ayla doesn't passed my physical exam..

What do u mean by that ?

RGDS
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 20:23
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Dear subzero-911. I am not sure why you did not pass your physical exam, but i can assure you it had nothing to do with Ayla. Physical exams (know as medical) are done by an aviation doctor approved by the Civil Aviation Regulatory Comission "CARC". There is no such thing as Jordan Aviation Authority by the way. it used to be the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA) and now it is known as CARC.

Ayla does use a JAA (Joint Aviation Authority) ground school syllabus. it is NOT JAA approved, but JAA based which was clearly stated in our marketing material and our web site. Nevertheless, to completely avoid any possible confusion, we have completly removed any reference to "JAA" from our web site and brochure.

Yes, some of our cadets do have playstations. they also have ipods and laptops. But i can assure you they fly more than any other academy in the region due to the fact that we are located in a very quiet airport, with very good year round weather, and the highest instructor to cadet ratio in teh region (4 to 1). in fact, except for class delta which was delayed due to a major fleet change, each one of our courses graduated on schedule, and we continue to be on schedule so far. if and when delays occur (something every safe pilot should understand), we do our best to cope, so long as it does not compromise safety or quality of training. i would rather delay a class than rush them through, even though it is more expensive for the academy as we have a fixed price contract.

Anyways, I wish you luck in Australia. i just finished watching the movie "Australia" with Nicole Kidman, and i envy you "mate".
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 20:26
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Dear Mike.Park;

you are absolutly right. i should have done this a long time ago.

i guess i was too busy trying to build a world class academy.

anyways, i am here now, and ready to answer any serious questions.

Marwan
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 20:36
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Dear Suzero-911;

I am not sure why you did not pass your physical (which is commonly known as medical), but i assure you it was not Ayla. These tests are usualy performed by approved aviation doctors.

For your information, JAA stands for Joint Aviation Authority, not Jordan Aviation Authority. In Jordan, the regulatory body is known as the Civil Aviation Regulatory Comission (CARC). Our Ground Syllabus is a JAA syllabus, but it is not JAA approved. Our marketing material and web site clearly stated that our ground school is JAA based, and that the license is issued by CARC. Nevertheless, to avoid any confusion, we have completely removed all reference to JAA from our web site and material.

Yes, some of our cadets have playstations. Some have iPods, some have guitars, and some have TV's. All, fortunately, legal forms of entertainment. However, i assure you it does not interfere with their flying. in fact, we fly more hours per day per aircraft that anyone else, due to the fact that we are located in an uncongested airport, with fairly good year round weather.

Anyways, i wish you luck in Australia. Just saw the movie "Australia" with Nicole Kidman. I envy you "mate".
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Old 27th Dec 2008, 21:30
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Danger

Mr. Atalla..

1) JAA license at AAA...some past students were seduced by your false claims and got trapped...I feel sorry for them..and obviously your marketing guy has stopped using that claim after it has been busted! now are there any REAL plans to grant JAA license in the near future? explain it.

2) MPL program had to be initiated in 2008 according to your pervious announcements...what took you so long?! and in case you still think you are going to make it happen, what are your new promises about it?

Now if you don't have answers for the above 2 questions, or if you don't wish to answer them, then you've got to answer the forthcoming 2!!

3) If we assume that everything is just fine at your academy, why do you think all those guys are attacking you and your people? and guess what...their batteries are still supercharged with loads of details about things happening out there..sometimes people are challenging you or anybody to falsify what they have said...bullets could be found buried into anything that carries your logo! what do you say?

4) Since you have finally made your way to pprune, what is it that you can tell to convince the guys here that your academy is the right place?

Thanks
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Old 28th Dec 2008, 01:57
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Icecream pilot and Marwan Atalla

Icecram piolt sorry for that and below my explanation
ayla doesn't passed my physical exam= when I saw ayla in real I change my ideal about this school.(physically or realistic).

Marwan, could you please give me idea about the (people had attacked the students accommodation and thread some of the students !
FYI.I am here not to urge with any one, I just said what I saw and from my experince and what happened with me.

Thanks and regard
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Old 28th Dec 2008, 02:43
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Dear Subzero-911;

one of the ayla buildings is located next to a house with a very conservative family. the people living in the house next door would see our cadets in shorts and t-shirts, hanging out on the balcony which overlooks the house, sometime playing music, and they became a little concerned. they tried to complain to the cadets, but it was not taken seriously. one day, a couple of teenage boys from the house next door tried to pick a fight with the cadets, and threw a stone and broke a window. fortunately no one was hurt.

we immidiately filed a complaint, and met with the police chief, who arranged for a meeting between myself, the cadets, and the parents of the kids next door. the parents were extremely apologetic and ashamed of what their kids had done, and they promised to take care of our cadets as if they were their own kids. they even invited them to lunch for them the next day. however, our cadets were not comfortable staying their, so we moved them to another building the next day, and coverted the old building into a staff housing facility.

in my view, it was just a couple of teenage kids probably a little envious of our guys, probably with a little too much testosterone. i did not feel arresting the kids would do any good (in fact i felt it would only escalate matters), but i told our cadets it was their decision. they decided to drop the charges.
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Old 28th Dec 2008, 03:02
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Dear SilveR5;

Like i said, i am always happy to answer serious questions, so please feel free.

1. Our material stated clearly that our syllabus is JAA based, not JAA approved, and that the license is a CARC license. One would assume a high school graduate with reasonable english could distinguish the two. nevertheless, we decided to remove all reference to JAA from our material to be 100% on the safe side. the cadets that felt they were mislead were offered a refund. two of them had been at Ayla just over two weeks, and they received a 100% refund. the rest decided to stay.

We do have plans to try and get JAA approval for our groudn school, but we cannot promise a timeline yet.

2. MPL is based on a partnership between an airline and an FTO. An FTO cannot do an MPL program on it's own because the course depends on the partner airlines' SOP's. We were ready to launch MPL, but our partner airline decided (for financial reasons) to delay it. we intend to use the time to develop our MPL program even more.

3. I believe it is a combination of anger and frustration. perhaps some x-employees who are disgruntled, perhaps some x-cadets who were delayed and decided to leave (contrary to their sponsor airlines' advice). perhaps some envy from competitors. hard to tell why people become so rude and offensive. If Ayla was that bad, why are they taking so much time and making so much effort to badger us....they should be happy that they are no longer here and move on, no?

4. My advice to anyone is to VISIT Ayla. i will personaly show you around, and you can meet and interview our ground and flight instrutors, our staff, and our cadets. you can inspect our syllabus & manuals, and fly our simulators. see our housing facilities. in fact, you should do this no matter where you decided to study. it is the best investment you will ever make.

Marwan
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