Global Aviation Magazine : 60 Years of the Hercules

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
what on earth was I doing sending 'quick Don' to Andros ! Obviously my drink was spiked your honour !

[mr ripley]

It was meant to be a quick trip to Oslo.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f191/mjg66/Wing-1.jpghttp://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f191/mjg66/Wing3.jpg

[mr ripley]

Buddy buddy in the Congo
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f191/mjg66/TrevsCongoTravail076.jpg

[CoffmanStarter]

Mr Ripley ... You can't leave us 'hanging' like that ... let's hear the story :ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Chaps ...

Just helping Dougie out with posting a few pics he'd like to entertain us with ;)

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/Safeashore_zps349fc104.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/kapitanivchenko1_zpsc2cf2b5e.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/Sunshot1_zpsb40b1cd2.jpg

I'm sure Dougie will be along shortly ...

Best.

Coff.

[Dougie M]

Thanks Coff.
In reply to AA's boat trip I thought I'd put on some pics from a while back when a few ascoteers took a racing yacht across the pond to Bermuda. Some of these faces you may know but the voyage was enhanced in many ways by the inclusion of an Air Trafficker from Coningsby. She was ship's cook and could dish up a 3 course meal in a force 5. As you can see from the "survival at sea" physique of the mate, P*** F**** she fed us well. The posed sextant shot of self was taken on land so it was steady.
We arrived in Bermuda just after the QEll and poet radio asked us to let the steamer through first. We tied up at St Georges and reported to BA at the airport as a herc crew awaiting recovery by VC10 and they put us in the Palmetto Bay on full contract for a week or so.
I bet the view of C******'s (C******'@s) bikini beats AA's akimbo shorts shot.
Great trip

[smujsmith]

More nice shots Mr Ripley, keep them coming.

AA62 #2001

Quick Don and all of us had a very exciting flight the day after that photograph was taken. You will probably remember that the detachment at that time operated out of Cape Canaveral AFB (or was it an NAS ?) and we usually used the "skid strip" as the prime runway. I always thought Albert could have gotten airborne across that huge runway. Anyway, the other nice thing with the Andros Det was that it was usual for the GE to take turn about in accompanying the aircraft out to Andros, the second GE being at the airfield on return to help put the aircraft to bed, and fix any defects. So, it was my turn to go to Andros, and, with I believe a rather large Mk48 Torpedo aboard we taxied out. On take off, I noticed the smell of burning, then saw smoke and some sparks emanating from under the Flt Deck floor. I was not on intercom, but being sat next to Don, I brought it to his attention. I asked him to inform the Captain, and would it be OK if I took the steps out to identify the source of it all. He OK'd that and I grabbed the extinguisher off its mounting on Stn 245 as I got under there. I immediately found the seat of the problem, No2 TRU was going in to meltdown mode. Through Don I asked that he inform the crew what the fault was, and in seconds the Air Eng had disconnected the No2 Generator. The TRU stopped erupting, and the smoke started to dissipate. The Captain by this time had called the emergency and requested a landing.

Intent on keeping an eye on the TRU, I wedged myself in and prepared for the landing, at which point Don, probably correctly told me to get strapped in down the back again. I asked if I could remain where I was as a flare up could be dealt with quickly by my extinguisher. He was not happy, so asked the Captain, who suggested that as long as I was in a secure position, he was happy. Don then connected me to his spare long lead to enable me to let the crew know if anything else occurred. We landed safely, and returned to the parking bay, where the aircraft was shut down with no power on at all. Murray and I spent the rest of the day removing the Generator and replacing the drive, as we had no spare TRU with us, we disconnected and removed the U/S unit, sending an Eng Rep asking for a replacement to be dropped off when possible. It was an interesting few minutes to say the least, being down the back Don and I saw more of it than the rest, and enjoyed a couple of beer later that evening whilst discussing it. He might have spiked your drink to get the trip, I doubt after that incident he was glad he did. Happy days.

Smudge:ok:

[mr ripley]

Mr Ripley ... You can't leave us 'hanging' like that ... let's hear the story
Which one, the exploding leading edge or the buddy buddy?
Feb 1993 30 Sqn
Off to Oslo-Bergen then RTB
Charging off down the runway with GE in the cupola who says f**k at the same time as lots of wing over heat lights and a bang and probably some other stuff I can't remember. Find the hot air bleed duct has exploded, it was just before Vr so we could have nearly taken it into the air and were fortuitous as flying control cables next to pipe. Remember GE got some banter for his non-standard abort call.
After a replacement aircraft was sourced we ended up via Norway in Bournemouth.

Second one was a buddy buddy at Bunia, DR Congo off a UN Herk in Aug/Sep 2003.

Happy days!

I remember flying with Quick Don and LE and Bostick Bob.

[Top Bunk Tester]

LE & Bostick Bob ....... You must have been a very naughty boy in a previous life :oh:

[Mal Drop]

I still remember the sign outside Stn Ops at Akronelli showing a stick man wearing breathing apparatus which some wag had altered to read 'LE line-dancing'.

[smujsmith]

Mr Ripley,

Interesting shot inside the leading edge there, I wonder if the distortion of the rib structure was down to the explosion of the Bleed Air Duct, or general Albert bendiness? I remember hearing this event, recounted by your GE, at a GE Christmas beer call, he, like you, reflected on the ribbing he got for his reaction. I seem to remember how impressed he was with how the crew dealt with the problem. Once again, we see that even Albert could bite.

Smudge:ok:

[ExAscoteer]

I seem to remember there were a series of bleed air failures at around that time.

I had a double start valve problem at Gib leading to an abort just before V1 with the concomittant shut down of the Nos 1 and 2. :eek:

Then there was the time we got airborne from LYE rapidly followed by a BANG! - the duct from the GTC bay had exploded (the Eng on that was Flo Jo).

I also seem to recall another leading edge bleed duct failure that peeled back the stbd wing inboard of the No2, but which happened in the cct at LYE.

[Alison Conway]

Mal Drop,

The "stick man" as you call it was in fact a breathing apparatus sign. I removed it one bright sunny morning after flying there all night. The Captain, Co and Nav had gone into Ops, and with my trusty Leatherman the dirty deed was done. I was his leader on his retirement, and I had it mounted by Station Workshops as a leaving gift. He was very pleased with it and said it would take pride of place on his mantle-piece. It was replaced at Akronelli fairly swiftly.

[smujsmith]

Ex Ascoteer,

Absolutely correct in your recollections of the K's bleed air ducting failures. And associated hot air plumbing. I remember a three day trip which involved moving an army detachment from Gutersloh to Benbecula, ISTR two trips a day were planned. We pre positioned at Gut, and an enjoyable night stop was enjoyed by all. A sparrows fart start to the day next morning saw us having a de ice, very cold, and we all looked forward to getting airborne to feel warmer. As we started our take off run, brakes of, accelerating, and being down the back next to the ALM, a loud bang was followed by the cargo bay filling with smoke, smelling of burnt oil. An abort was called, and we taxied back to the bay. On removing the access panel to the cargo bay pack I, and the crew were treated to the warming sight of the Cargo pack Cold Air Unit still glowing cherry red. Well, no spare in my "go bag", so we looked for options. Our first load included a large agricultural looking, tracked army thingy, bloody big so not something easily transferred. The plan evolved, Gut Benbecula direct, with all the diff the flight deck pack could give us, and obviously non airways. After offload return to Gut via Lyneham, a frame change and there would be no serious affect on the planned tasking. The trip to Benbecula was bloody freezing down the back, but we expected that, on the return leg, the four hour delay at Lyneham while they sorted out a replacement aircraft was simply daft considering they had at least 8 hours head start before our arrival. Had they given me a new CAU it would have been quicker to change that whilst re loading at Gut. Needless to say the task was done, on schedule, despite delays. But Albert and the hot air distribution was always worthy of respect from a Ground Engineering aspect.

Smudge:ok:

[ExAscoteer]

I remember flying with Quick Don and LE and Bostick Bob.

Oh Christ, Lima Echo, Quick Don and Bostick Bob?

You'd only need to add a Libby and you'd have a Full House!:E

[smujsmith]

Ex Ascoteer,

I too "enjoyed" routes with the three famous aircrew personalities. I never had the pleasure of sharing a trip with Mr Libby, but always enjoyed the pleasure of his company whenever our paths crossed. Mind you, the full set gets you wondering!!!

Smudge:ok:

[fergineer]

The names bring back many happy memories Mick Libby was a legend long before he became a GE, I had the dubious pleasure of being on shift with him before he became a GE and he was a laugh a minute then.

[fergineer]

There was an inboard LE blowout on an Oman Herc when I was there fortunately it was on a ground run but very messy.

[ExAscoteer]

IIRC it was P** D**** who had a number of these bleed air failures.

[smujsmith]

Hiya Fergineer, hope you are well. Your reference to Omani Hercs suffering similar Bleed Air Duct failures perhaps indicates that it was not limited to the K. As I ended my time as a team manager on second line Minor servicing I know that the ducting was only inspected visually, with no NDT of welds etc carried out. Perhaps more serious stuff was done by Marshalls on Major Service. As a trade based Airframe man, my GE career seemed swamped by Loran F and C comp failure. Now, I'm no expert but I believe that Loran was a descendent of the Gee system, used at the latter end of WW2 by Bomber command. So why in the 1990s we still had problems with it is a mystery to me. Perhaps an expert like DougieM could enlighten us. Beware though, I once asked a Nav to explain Loran, and fell asleep on the bottom bunk as he opened up his Loran chart, with all those diamonds on it. PFM, but capable of failure.

Smudge:ok:

[Top Bunk Tester]

Didn't have any LE failures with P** D**** but always managed to find ourselves deep in the dwang whenever crewed together, did lose the bearings on the FDCU an hour and a half out of KL in the middle of a tropical storm, full Smoke & Fumes. Landed to find the RAFLO was at an embassy cocktail party, not often the mild mannered and jovial P** lost it but this def and justifiably lit the blue touch paper.

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
your TRU fire sounds similar to the one we had when carrying the 500 Lox container to Belize. It does concentrate the mind.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/BILLTRENCHARD0002_zps566da01f.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/BILLTRENCHARD0002_zps566da01f.jpg.html)
Pic is of aa acting as the am (ancient mariner). Not as long as DM's trip but a week around Cowes etc on one of the RAF boats. Skippered by the same chap who had blown the whistle on the culprit as told in a previous post. He had only just got his full ticket but he was very good. Highlight was tacking up the river under sail (just the jib) to the pub at Buckler's Hard. He steered and I did the sail trimming. Of course all the powered craft had to give us right of way.
As we tied up we burst out laughing, job well done and went for our 'debrief' beer.

[fergineer]

Never had a TRUnfailure but remember way back as ground crew in Washington, my first trip we had a bleeder resister catch fire during refuelling.....never seen a bowser move so fast.....changing one of them was no fun whatsoever!!!!as the Leckies on the trip I had to do it!!!!

[ancientaviator62]

It occurs to me that some of the readership may be puzzled as to why we went to Andros. Modern weapons tend to travel so far that there are not adequate test ranges in the UK so we are forced to turn to the US and use their test ranges. However these ranges are very busy so it usually means booking years in advance. Most of this test range time is for the RN to test torpedoes. Sometimes we would fly torpedoes from Seattle to Florida which is a long way in a Herc.
The usual detachment, for two weeks, was to one of the Mil airfields in Florida from which the boffins would be flown out to Andros as and when they desired.
As the accommodation was in hotels on rates it was viewed by the 'K' crews as a VERY good trip.
During the hectic GW1 buildup one of these bookings of the test range was scheduled. If the RN cancelled it they would have to go to the back of a long queue so it was due to go ahead as normal.
On 30 I had two loadmasters I could not use on Granby tasks as they had chits excusing them from wearing aircrew NBC kit (no I am not going there ).
One time after landing from another very long Granby day I went to our squadron ops to check on things as I always did.
On the board the Andros det had appeared and the duty Flt Cdr had put one of the non Granby chaps on the trip. Made sense you may think but not to teddy throwing me. The morale of the troops would not be improved when they saw this. So I went and 'spoke' to the Flt Cdr. The result was that the non Granby chap came off the trip. I phoned round the loadmasters who I knew were back in the UK and the first one who answered the phone got the trip.
I made sure that there would be no repeat of this nonsense by getting my unuseables detached to Cyprus to reinforce the AT Ops Det. This was the closest to the'action' I was allowed to send them.

[November4]

Andros det...good memories.

Was sent to Cocoa Beach to offload the pre-positioning kit. Then had a 2 week wait for the sub to arrive to start firing the torpedoes and the daily shuttles to start. Except the sub crew went on 2 weeks R&R so had another 2 quiet(??) weeks. before an epic route home via Ottawa, Anchorage and Thule.

At the same time as this Andros det, another sub was test firing torpedoes under the ice around Alaska so another Hercules det had been set up in Anchorage.

Before setting off for Florida, we had been told not to speak to any of the local about what we were there for, the sub name or any other details as they were all classified. On the way to the hotel, we kept passing other hotels with signs up saying "Welcome to the crew of HMS sub name". That night in a bar, we were asked if we were the MAMS team and would we be loading 4 or 6 torpedoes or whatever they were ....so much for it being supposedly classified.

Oh yes, forgot to mention the middle two weeks was something called Spring Break....

[ancientaviator62]

November4,
sounds like a very nice det. Ah the spring break when the place was invaded by students intent on having a good time. 'Just love your accent' !!!!

[November4]

Certainly was AA

Thule was interesting to visit. Still daylight at 0300 so asked when does it get dark?

About October came the reply.

This was in April

[ancientaviator62]

Went to Thule several times. I remember the sales of SERES ? beer in the Class 6. As part of the agreement with Denmark the US had to stock certain Danish goods . The USAF were not keen on this beer but at 49 cents a case the RAF certainly were. I think anything not sold was dumped in the sea.

[Wander00]

Recall yacht skipper from Lyneham, not sure if he was GE flying or ground based, but known as "Salty Sam" - once hauled him over the rail after he fell into the Solent through not being hooked on to his lifeline.

[ancientaviator62]

The mention of Op Granby in my last post has persuaded me to put up this pic of my copy of the Op Order. It mentions the accommodation as being in the compound. The compound was not ready so we were in hotels. We were in one full of Kuwait refugees whose idea of fun was to run up and down the coridors all day and night screaming at the top of their voices.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/GRANBYOPORDER0005_zpsff4bc944.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/GRANBYOPORDER0005_zpsff4bc944.jpg.html)

[Mal Drop]

Ah yes, the Riyadh det...

I remember getting into theatre just after New Year to be placed in a compound with the STS 'SkyRats' who were to train up the non-TS qualified crews in the art of desert strips. The situation was utter chaos, we were sharing about three to a room (no problem there) but the arrangements for locally purchasing rations were all over the shop due to (we were told) the admin folk having to drag out SOPs which were years out of date. I remember having to draw pay in Saudi Riyals on my pay book and the utter confusion about what we could and could not 'legitimately' buy. The out-of-date and inaccurate topos showed our operating airfield about thirty miles from where it actually was and the rest of the charts would have been more accurately replaced by large sheets of sandpaper.

The initial ground rates were excellent, we could eat at local purveyors of 'flat chicken' while the catering was being put in place and we made furniture out of slabs of cold drinks. As things began to get sorted a small NAAFI was established where we could buy essential items such as bootlaces and date-expired toothpaste but an extra bit of effort got us into the US commissary where there was a slightly better selection of goods including the latest Bose sound systems, TVs and boom-boxes. I also recall that the US thought we were exceptionally fond of tonic water (we didn't let on that the Dubai supply routes ensured we had enough 'juniper-based cleaning fluid' to dilute it with).

At one stage during Operation Compound Hop we had just stocked our freezers with food (including turkey-bacon from the French supermarket) when we were given another 'bug-out' order and moved to yet another compound which meant leaving all our newly purchased food behind.

Eventually we shifted to the Marriot which was all sorts of comfy but not long after that it was off to Alola 6, the last compound before the whole shebang moved to Bahrain. Our leaving party was the stuff of legend and I heard tell that a senior officer wandered through the following day's wreckage (including but not limited to several members of the nursing community who were resting their eyes) whilst trying to think of suitable ways of getting his revenge.

[November4]

Ahh the end of war party....

The Movers were asked if they had any high priority freight which need to be sent to Akrotiri. We managed to find a landrover that was due to be returned to the UK at some stage so that would do as the reason to put a Spec flight to AKT.

The Movers there backloaded the aircraft with half a dozen large boxes which were offloaded and spirited back to the compound. The party went ahead with much merriment.

The next day we loaded a UK bound TriStar with several blue rubbish bags for disposal at Brize.

[November4]

In a similar vein to the above.

Just before the ground war started, a Padre arrived on the nightly TriStar in Riyadh. He was on moving to Al Jubail where he was to give Communion to the troops before they went into action.

Obviously he couldn't give Communion with wine as that was not allowed. Instead he had a couple of boxes of "Heavenly Liquid"

A couple of days later the same Padre was flown back as he had injured himself falling into a slit trench in the dark cracking a couple of ribs or similar. A touch too much of the heavenly liquid suggested me.

[smujsmith]

November 4,

End of war party, ooo eck, I remember it well. For some of us the party trailed along to the Diplomat in Bahrain, and continued for several more weeks/months. Now, I'm rather hoping that AA62 can offer some advice here. My extended detachment to Bahrain actually crewed me up, for the only time, with a 30 Squadron crew, who were some of the best blokes I ever worked with. Captains first name was John (ISTR) had a West Country accent and was a true gentleman, the Eng was Nutty Bob (You either know or don't) and the Loady a great bloke who was happy for me to run the galley regularly. Our Nav, who I was sharing a room in the Diplomat with (we were the only smokers), was I believe Nigel ? Sported a proper moustache, and had a real sense of humour. Our Co, Andy ? Another great character. All in all, a team who worked together well, and I wish I could remember their names. I still have the battery powered drumming bear that was given to me on our last night before return to UK. Any ideas AA62 ? I wish I had some photographs from that few weeks.

GW1 wasn't all hard work you know!

Smudge:ok:

PS, AA62, Nice to see Bert get a mention in your Op order.

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
captain was probably J W... and I can pm you with his name if you wish. As you rightly say a real gentleman. I put myself on his last trip on the 'K' but that is another story.
I cannot remember the loadmaster but it may come to me.
I was not at the 'end of' party but as you have seen I was in at the AT Det start. Logbook says XV 304 on 30 Oct 1990. We were the first a/c in to start the det and ATC claimed to know nothing about us. So we waited for almost an hour whilst the captain spoke to the Air HQ downtown on the HF ! Eventually we were directed to an unfinished terminal part of which became our base. Whilst the UK had dithered the French had acted and thus had the best part of the place.
There was no secure storage for our mountain of Aircrew NBC kit nor for the nine mil and ammo. We did have two brand new Toyota landcruisers. And BATA supplied us with bondu boots.
Two days later we started our hub and spoke operations.
As you can guess I put the one and only Bert up for the det. No one better for this sort of task.

[smujsmith]

AA, thanks for that memory jog. My memory is now refreshed, and that is indeed the gentleman who I was our Captain. I still struggle to remember the names of that crew, though why I don't know, we spent around two months eating drinking and flying together. A great bunch of people to work with.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
glad to help.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/LYN250001_zps6fa71ca8.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/LYN250001_zps6fa71ca8.jpg.html)

The above pic is self explanatory. Did anyone else attend this lunch ?
Shame Lyneham never made it to the 75th anniversary.

[ksimboy]

Ah, Nutty Bob! Recall the day he went wibble so well, an interesting time down South , he was an interesting character to say the least!

[Top Bunk Tester]

Yes, buggered my life around as I had to go down early and on a different crew to replace him ::mad:

[smujsmith]

Ksimboy, TBT,

With Bobs history, imagine his state of nerves on an approach to Kuwait Intl, using a newly installed tactical ILS, through the smoke from the oil fires, with the Comms flooded with US Navy, Army and Air Force helicopters call signs, asking for position reports. I worked with him for a couple of months, and considering the foregoing, reckon he did a bloody good job. Of course, You two may well have known him better than I did.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Tale about the one and only Bert . Towards the end of his service he started doing a few resettlement courses before his terminal leave etc. One day when he was at home I rang him and said I was going to Cx one of his courses as we were short handed and needed him to do a trip and he was the only one who could do it etc. I did lay it on thick. Needless to say he was not overjoyed so I told him to come in to the squadron and we would discuss it.
So in he comes and looks at the board. It is the three week Red Arrows support trip to the USA which I have put him on. He turns round and looks at me with a huge grin and says 'You bastard-SIR !
He had a great time including I think a trip in the back of one of the Hawks.
I thought after all his service he deserved a 'lollipop' as his last trip.

[smujsmith]

AA62,

Classic, and what a fitting reward for such a splendid bloke. On a different note, we noted earlier in the thread that all Squadrons once had SF crews, which eventually were amalgamated in to what I assume became 47 SF Flt. Do you have any more info on the progression to that status, and why did 30/24/70 lose that specialisation ? Meanwhile, I'm on the hunt for my old photographs again this weekend, perhaps I can contribute to the wealth of great photographs we have been treated to.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
what became known as the SF crews were originally in my recollection
the individual squadron 'pathfinder' crews. In a previous thread I have given my version of how this came about. Most of them were transferred to the new SF Flight which was then attached to 36 Sqn. When 36 disbanded they were attached to 47.
Pics are from GW1. Note the French C160 I referred to earlier.
Middle pic is of our crew under the palm trees as an acknowledgement of the sqn badge.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCRIYADH20002_zpscf94c9b0.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCRIYADH20002_zpscf94c9b0.jpg.html)

[CoffmanStarter]

Good morning AA62 :ok:

Can we just pop back to Bermuda for a moment ... if I'm correct ... didn't you have something to do with the use of a Nav's personal Duffle Bag, a Crew First Aid Kit, a couple of Her Majesty's finest Tensioners, McMurdo Lights, Px Life Jackets ... along with the local Constabulary some time later ;)

If so ... let's have the full version of the story old chap :)

Best ...

Coff.

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
I told that story in post #1067 I believe ! Or have I misunderstood (very likely).

[CoffmanStarter]

Sorry AA62 ... You are correct ... got my wires crossed after seeing something on YouTube produced by the RAF Museum :ok:


I take it you know what I'm talking about ;)

[ancientaviator62]

Yes,
I had a very sore throat that day but went ahead anyway.

[Bts70]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVjuw3g7jgE

Not sure if this Video that Ossie did has been posted yet?

Apologies if it has.

Good old Al King, took me under his wing, top man never forgotten.

[Bts70]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQfDMSv1gZY


"do you ever sleep in these beds" she asks.....well there are a couple of stories i could share!

[chickenlover]

BTS
Thanks very much for posting that. If anyone is in contact with Oz, he will have a mine of video clips. He used his redundancy money to set up a video digitising computer set up- the first one that any of us had seen/heard of. He did all the work on the LXX video. His copies of many clips maybe the only ones in existence after the great video cull of 97/98.
Sorry to lower the tone to lavatorial levels but many pages back someone asked about the 'elsan' incident with the door open. This was taken just before the door opened-on the ground obviously..... but by the road at the end of the runway.
IIRC he used the facilities on most displays - the green canisters should be a giveaway to his unit...

http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/Fryboy47/img672-Version2_zpsf22a032b.jpg

[smujsmith]

Bts70 #2048,

Thanks for 42 minutes of pure entertainment, and loads of good stuff that AA62 would approve of I'm sure. Your reference to Al, underscores that of many who knew him, and the credits on the video correctly reflect the respect we should have for those who lost their lives "doing the job". I'm hoping I can hang on to that youtube link for some time.

Smudge

[chickenlover]

Hi Smudge
Don't know if you've seen this one from youtube. If you ever lose the links I've got most of the Herc clips downloaded and stored. I can always bung em on a disc for you. Anyway on with the show-the Herc clip is about 1 min 30 in but the other stuff is pretty good too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL-KV79UkQE

[smujsmith]

Chickenlover,

Good stuff, and I presume you flew that K on the pass. I have a DVD made by the GEs at Victor (GW1) that is a right laugh. When I work out how to post it, I guaruntee a fine belly laugh.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

chickenlover,
lovely lavatorial pic. I wonder if it was the same chap as related in my story albeit he did it with the ramp and door open just before jumping !!

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/RIYADHtristar0002_zps03ffcc4a.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/RIYADHtristar0002_zps03ffcc4a.jpg.html)
Sunrise pic of the Tristar taken from the Herc as we taxied out for our first leg of the day.

[ksimboy]

Much nicer colour scheme than when the Hercs and tri* went pink.

[CoffmanStarter]

If I may say ... you Gentlemen who served on the Hercules during Op Granby are far too modest (which I can understand) ... however, I think it's very appropriate to include this video by Ian Harvey, AE, who explains a little more of how the Hercules fleet supported British forces in the Gulf in 1990 and 1991, flying vital supplies between the UK and bases in the Middle East.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnHzaLUSV68

[Brian W May]

Saw Ian at the Flight Engineers' do at Eynsham hall in the Autumn.

He's got old! Sadly, I looked in the mirror a bit later . . .

Glad to see Bill looking so well on another video of a similar ilk.

Lots of stories about the Gulf, including the Trimotor skipper who fell asleep on his approach between the Outer Marker and the Glideslope . . .

We could use this thread as the basis for our book eh?

[smujsmith]

Coff,

Thanks for that vid link. It's always great to see something like that. Ian was someone I remember throughout my time as a GE, and it's great to hear that doughty accent once again. This thread just continues to improve. Now Brian, give us a link to AA62 in action, I reckon he will still have "mooney knees" :eek:

Smudge:ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

We could use this thread as the basis for our book eh?

If a book were to be published based on the service life of RAF Albert and his Air and Ground Crews ... that would be one hell of a story Gentlemen. Count me in to buy the first one off the print run.

Sorry I don't have the knowledge or experience to be of any assistance ... But someone like Geehovah might be able to offer some pointers if anyone is serious :ok:

[Brian W May]

Your wish is my command oh greasy one . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-g7wp_-QX0

Sorry Bill . . . :p

[smujsmith]

Crikey Brian, they even spelled his name wrong in the credit block. Good Job AA 62, yet again, Albert and crew do the job.

A change of subject. I have, courtesy of an old GE mate, a DVD that records Albert and his times at Victor (GW1 SF Base) the original is almost two hours long, and contains lots of stuff that might or might not be relevant to the thread. It was made by the GEs who were sentenced to Victor for the duration and in some parts takes a "humourous" kick at the aircrew. I have managed to convert the old VTS format to MP4, but can't get Youtube to accept the upload. Can anyone help, there's some good video on this, of rather 91 quality. The FARP at Kuwait for USAF HH53 choppers is included. I'm sure someone can sort it out, please ????

Smudge:rolleyes:

[ancientaviator62]

When they recorded the video in the Cosford Herc I had a very bad cold and sore throat and could hardly speak but having gone all that way it had to be done.
Another early morning pic of the line at King Khalid.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCRIYADH0004_zps2100115b.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCRIYADH0004_zps2100115b.jpg.html)

[ancientaviator62]

Just watched both videos and boy did they bring back some memories, especially the tanking and airdrop. Many thanks for putting them up. Nice to see AVM Corbitt interviewed. He was a F/O Co on 47 when we first got the a/c. Later he was my boss on the OCU and then the 'staish'. He did well and deserved to.
Another gentleman it was my privilege to work for.

[Brian W May]

PM in your Inbox Smuj

[Yamagata ken]

'Scuse my interrupting. There's an interesting Hercules piece with some excellent photographs here:

24 C-130s 'Elephant Walk' For The USAF's Joint Forcible Entry Exercise* (http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/24-c-130s-elephant-walk-for-the-usafs-joint-forcible-en-1670660134/+Kyosuke)

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks Ken ...

I'm guessing ... But it won't be too long before someone mentions the RAF JATFOR formations of some 36 C-130K's low level and at night dropping on European DZ's ;)

[friendlypelican 2]

Aaaah! JATFOR, been waiting for that. Scatter, Penetrate, Tiree let-downs, Bold Guard, Deep Furrow and lots more. On a more serious note, lots and lots of training with12 and 18-ships, building up to the full 36. All the while, still managing to do the normal AT tasking and also monthly 'Trainers' to South Africa, West Indies, Norway and Globals alternating Eastbound and Westbound. All crews leaving the OCU with a basic TS Cat and lots of variety. Them were the days! Mind you, being young, single and poor, meant that I was free to enjoy it all to the max.

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
I was under the impression we had already covered the UKJATFOR story in several earlier posts. I even found my pics to put up for comments.
I am sure the big exercises (with 37 a/c) Bold Guard and Deep Furrow were also mentioned.

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/SAUDI0002_zpsaedf8100.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/SAUDI0002_zpsaedf8100.jpg.html)
As someone has mentioned a sheet of sandpaper would be as much use as a map for parts of Saudi.

[ancientaviator62]

Yamagata Ken,
great pics there and the whole thing on a similar theme (but much larger) to our JATFOR of old. Something we definitely could not do now.
The platform shown leaving the C17 looked small in comparison to the cargo hold. Compare that with the very limited clearance in some of the 'K' airdrop pics.

[CoffmanStarter]

Morning AA62 ...

The annoying thing is that I looked up our previous references to JAFTOR ... intending to post the URL to help Ken :ugh:

Anyway ... looks like Friendlypelican2 will be joining us :ok:

Welcome aboard FP2 ... if you have any stories or pics you'd like to share ... please join in. Let me know if you need help posting pics :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Coff,
you must not start too early on the Xmas sherry !
Having mentioned Xmas I suppose I had better send a card to all our loyal readers. This one (there may be some more) is from my time on 47 at Fairford.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/47XMASCARD0002_zps14493e18.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/47XMASCARD0002_zps14493e18.jpg.html)

[CoffmanStarter]

Never too early AA62 old chap ;)

BZ on the Crimble Card :D

Seasons greetings everyone ...

Coff.

[smujsmith]

A Merry Yuletide to all, and AA62, thanks for setting us off on an Albert theme. I've posted this before, but, it always brings back some happy memories of that time of year.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b572/smujsmith/image_zpsd4b913f3.jpg

All the best to everyone for a happy holiday and a prosperous New Year, whatever your faith.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

As we are in festive mood another Xmas card from another well loved place.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/CHANGIXMASCARD_zps08b79c06.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/CHANGIXMASCARD_zps08b79c06.jpg.html)

[ancientaviator62]

friendly pelican 2,
I would be interested to know when you were on the 'K' as our paths may have crossed.

[friendlypelican 2]

AA62,
Yes, our paths crossed in the 70/80s. I was at Changi (ground tour) mid-70 to Dec 71. Then 30Sqn, HTS and finally EU 84-87.
I think we exchanged PMs briefly about a year ago. Great days and I loved every minute of it.
Further to your post #2028. As Nav Ldr I went to Thule regularly and the Danish beer (Ceres?) started off in the Class 6 at $2 a case and pretty much every body picked up a couple of cases as a 'Route Bargain'. Lye Customs got used to this. However, when it came down to 50 cents a case it was a 'steal' that we couldn't ignore. Our co-pilot was i/c the Sqn Fund and after a crew huddle, we bought all the stock that was left. Back at Lye, we duly declared it as "the usual beer" and so no problem. However a little later, the Customs chap looks out from his office and sees a Condec being used just for the beer. OOPS! The Sqn boss was Brian Earle (lovely man) and he used up lots of favours to resolve this and the beer was initially stored in his MQ garage. It lasted for months and the whole Sqn benefitted.
Heading East again, yesterday I received a Xmas card from another friend from the early 70's and he included a photo of me enjoying a wind-down beer in the Blue Lagoon in Gan - another blissful memory!
Jenkins - Season's Greetings old chum!

[ancientaviator62]

FP2,
yes we did communicate about a year ago. Wish I was in Changi now ! Jenkins glad you liked the 48 Sqn Xmas card, I wonder if anyone else has cards they can put up. Any chance of seeing the pic of you and your wind down beer ?
Inside of the Xmas card after 48 came back to the UK.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/CHANGIXMASCARDFULL0002_zpsebdc09e7.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/CHANGIXMASCARDFULL0002_zpsebdc09e7.jpg.html)

[mr ripley]

AA62
I believe we were on 30 Sqn together during TMs stewardship?

Carrying on the snow theme :
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f191/mjg66/halifax029.jpg

[CoffmanStarter]

Mr R ... I hope SAC Frostey was properly checked out on Marshalling Procedures :ok:

[smujsmith]

I heard that was Jon Snow visiting to interview Harry Staish. OK, I get the message :ouch: it's not taken at Lyneham is it?


Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

mr ripley,
TM was one of 5 OCs during my eight years as the ALM Leader so we will almost certainly know each other ! PM if you wish.

[mr ripley]

It was Halifax

[smujsmith]

Thanks Mr Ripley,

For some reason I thought Gander or Goose, very fitting for the time of year:rolleyes:

Smudge:ok:

[Lyneham Lad]

Shall I, shan't I - hmmm. Oh what the heck:-

Surely not a LYN frame - the props aren't lined-up! :0




I know,I know; hat, coat, door...

[smujsmith]

Lyneham Lad,

Obviously they didn't have a GE with them:eek: or perhaps taken post B/F where the props will have been "pulled through". Thinking about my fellow GE's, I can't help wondering if I know that snowman.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b572/smujsmith/519aa1955b72b2ef21c9b4a746bc1dec_zps5a789535.jpg

See what you've started AA62, I'm waiting for a certain Gorilla to appear next.

A request for help !!!!!!!!!

Whilst being of the variety of airman endowed with the capacity to keep Albert moving, my ability to edit video is limited. I have a copy of a video made in 1991 that contains some seriously good flying sequences that many might find interesting. i have consulted with our admin and mods and have come to the opinion that the video is relevant to this thread, worthy for its content and is worth recording. I agree with those I have consulted that editing of the content might serve to protect the identities of some involved, as is PPRUNE policy. There's some good stuff in here, I just can't work out how to do the edit required, can anyone help ? I have the full vid on a Dropbox address, which I will supply to anyone who can help with editing to the required anonymity standards. Please PM me if you can help, the flying sequences are good value.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
your slightest wish is my command. This of course is the famous gorilla who would accompany us on my of our overseas trips. He would empty our wallets trash the room and leave us with a headache, all in the name of a good night out. Mind you in this pic he looks a little worse for wear himself. Probably down to smudge or one of his G/E pals.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCGORILLA0002_zpsa11d7399.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCGORILLA0002_zpsa11d7399.jpg.html)

[CoffmanStarter]

I hope that Gorilla had Nomex Fire Retardant fur :E

[smujsmith]

AA62,

Thanks for that, always a pleasure to see the rascal on tour. As for my wishes an ACC would go down nicely at the moment. Thinking of which, a story from the galley might make you chuckle. As we spent a lot of time away the GEs had a standard in flight meals selection which our boss would use when allocating us to a route. It was not unusual to arrive back from St Johns one night, and depart for Gander the next morning with a different crew. I was one of two GEs accompanying two aircraft through Tancos to Gibraltar returning to Lyneham, and it was around lunchtime as we arrived at Gib. My standard meals request of AA and an ACC was loaded, I had eaten breakfast outbound and was looking forward to the main meal on the way home. On landing, the other aircraft had an hydraulic snag, which, whilst not a stopper, could require a diversion if it developed and got worse. The other GE was an ex Avionics tradesman, and not comfortable with the thought of a "heavy trade" diversion, so suggested that we swap aircraft so that I would accompany the faulty aircraft back to Lyneham. It made sense, so we swapped. As there was some clean up to do, my original airframe and crew picked up the departure slot for the first aircraft, and duly taxied out. They lined up, slowly taxied down and returned to the parking slot. My mate the other GE jumped out, fuming. He had found out my meal was an ACC, which he hated, and convinced the crew to taxy back to parking to swap the meals. I have never seen before or since an aircraft abort a take off because of a Chicken Curry. On the Crimble Cards scene, this, by I believe Patricia Rielly is a cracker, I'm sure many will have a copy.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b572/smujsmith/67c75842834bd426b365ecd419953652_zps79ea1e0a.jpg

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/LYNXMASCARD0002_zps29906164.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/LYNXMASCARD0002_zps29906164.jpg.html)

Last card I can find. I should have one by Mark Postlethwait the well known aviation artist. It was done for 30 Sqn. No doubt it is in my now long lost box of pics.
So a happy Christmas to all our readers and especially to Coffman who triggered this flood of tales and pics.

[ancientaviator62]

mildly surprised that no one has turned my gorilla pic into a caption competition !
I take it you all noticed the legs of the person trying to escape up into the nosewheel bay.

[aeroid]

Thanks ancientaviator62 for turning the clock back. Having checked the good old RAF Form 414 I see that I was co-jo on the ferry flight of XV 187 from Marietta in April '67 with Vic Blake, fresh off the conversion course at Sewart AFB. Any other old timers around of my vintage. [email protected] will find me.

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
my pleasure and welcome. If you were a Co on a ferry flight after your USAF OCU then I assume you were probably on Hastings (or Beverleys) before that. I was on 36 at Colerne when it disbanded to become the first RAF Herc squadron. I was well below the salt so did not do the 'States' course but did my OCU at the beginning of 1968 after seeing 24 Disband as a Hastings Squadron in Dec 1967.

[CoffmanStarter]

AA62 ... You are too kind old chap ... It's me that is very grateful for your continued help and interest ... Happy Christmas :ok:

Welcome Aeroid, we are very pleased that you have joined our happy band of RAF Albert 'Threaders' ... Let us know if you'd like help posting any pics ... But please feel free to add to RAF Alberts service exploits :ok:

Best ...

Coff.

PS. I've just seen some pics of a RAF C-130J in Canada picking up the borrowed BBMF Lanc Merlin ... I bet that will be an interesting trip ;)

Here is the CWHM Twitter Link which has a number of RAF C-130J pics relating to the 'Merlin Pick-Up'

https://twitter.com/CWHM

[aeroid]

Please to meet you AA62 and all the many other FA fans. Correct, Hastings to start off withon 36 then Fat Al on ferry flight, 24, 48, 24 and OCU. I guess I must have met most of you at one time or another. Was that the gorilla that used to meet you down the route and during the night throw all your clothes all over the room, empty your wallet and cr*p in your mouth whilst you were asleep?

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
given your units served with the 'K' and mine our paths will almost certainly have crossed at one time or another. My 'K' time was 242 (stude) 47, 48,(FEAF and UK) 242 (airdrop instructor) JATE, EU (as MACR) EU (commissioned) 242 (CALMI)and 30 as ALM Leader. Then as one of the two aircrew members of the HEART before I retired.
Yes that is the self same gorilla or should I say gorillas because there must have been more than one to have been in several places at once. Unless of course he was a 'quantum' gorilla !

[aeroid]

AA 62 you've done it again. I have just seen your post of the 16th. That was the crimble card I designed. Keep em coming!

[smujsmith]

Gentlemen, I offer an insight into flying from the base known as Victor during GW1, with respect to the C130K and the crews and support crews of 47 Sqn SF Flight. I have, for various reasons a copy of a DVD entitled "The Gulf Boys 1991". I was told that it was made by the GEs attached to the flight for the duration of Desert Storm. I have had varied discussions with moderators and administrators of PPRUNE, regarding this video, which is an epic of over an hours length, and whether posting it infringes the posting rules. After many such discussions I decided that there is some relevance to this thread in posting the flying sequences used, and, whilst unable to completely anonymise personnel involved ask that my intent to ensure that the lads at Victor are recorded on this thread is seen as honourable, and appropriate. I have no doubt that the "authority" on this edited video would be our fellow poster Chickenlover, who probably has the full copy of the DVD as I do. It's Albert doing SF Ops in GW1, the quality is 1991 video tape, and apart from the star (Albert) has been edited to preserve anonymity for those involved. Apart from the general Low level type flying, the points that are really good to see are towards the end when the approach to Kuwait through the burning oilfields is recorded, and also the FARP operation at Kuwait Airport, which I believe may be the first aircraft, captained by AH, which kept many helicopters going. Brief but important records of the K's service. Sorry for the long preamble, I hope that what's left is of interest.

Credits are due to my former colleagues (GEs and Crews) who made the original. A thanks to the ex C130 admin for his input and also the advice of AA62 on how to go about it. Top thanks to PaulEMB, someone who follows the thread and is a wizard of video editing. He also has some good experience of Albert flying from Thorney as an ATC Cadet. I have managed to post this on YouTube for ease of viewing, I do not believe that it in anyway compromises either personal or operational security. I invite anyone who may take exception to my posting to PM me and I will certainly respect their opinion. It's not my video, I have credited what I believe is the maker. I was not there, though only by "accident". This is Albert, being operated in its natural environment by professionals, whose work should be recorded as part of this thread, I hope that some of this video is new to some, and worthy of the thread. Despite its being on YouTube, it is only accessible to those with the following link, assuming that only those with an interest lurk here, we should have no worries.


http://youtu.be/DfFA4wSXjh4

Enjoy, and Chickenlover, perhaps you could fill in on some of it. Finally, if you can link to Youtube on your biggest TV, it seems better quality.

Smudge:ok:

[Brian W May]

Nice one Smudge, well done mate.

Have a lot of respect for F Troop.

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
we must know each other if you designed that Xmas card. Have you read this thread from post 1 ? You may well be able to 'connect' with some of the others who were in at the beginning.

[ancientaviator62]

As smudge is on GW 1 theme here is a pic of one of our frames out in theatre in the early days.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCRIYADH30002_zps23b93433.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCRIYADH30002_zps23b93433.jpg.html)

[aeroid]

Thanks AA62. !8th May @0854 I'm in theRight Hand seat. I think that the Eng was Charlie Hartridge.

[aeroid]

AA62, can someone give me a clue on how to upload any piccies and the house rules

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
the originator of this thread Coffman Starter is your man. If he can teach me how to do it he can teach anyone. Look forward to your pics and tales of the 'K'.

[smujsmith]

Hi aeroid, and welcome.

The best way I've seen is to open an account with Photobucket, it's free, you then upload your pictures to that. Once uploaded it's quite simple to copy the link to the photograph and paste it in to the PPRUNE box as you compile a post. I hope that helps, I'm no expert, but someone with much more knowledge of it than me will be along soon I'm sure. You have to watch the size of the picture as if it's too large it throws all the font sizes out of kilter. Someone will know what the size limit is. Good luck, can't wait to see the pics.

Smudge:ok:

[aeroid]

AA62 Would I be right in thinking that you had a serious interest in old sailing ships.

[aeroid]

Many thanks. As you can probably guess I have been away from the site for some time and am keen to make up for lost contacts. Happy to hear from anyone on [email protected]

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
I certainly did !

[smujsmith]

With 112 views in under 24 hours, I would have thought that some, who were there, could give us some input on the vid I posted. Was that the famous AH refuel of choppers at Kuwait ?

http://youtu.be/DfFA4wSXjh4

Was it the work of the GE's as reported to me ? Whatever, at least we have a record of the work done by "the Flight" during GW1, the quality never approaches that of Chickenlovers photographs, but the sounds of No3 winding up at the beginning, the drop of the nose on the "Khe Sahn" and seeing the FARP set up again, particularly the struggle with those bloody hose reels, is great.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Here's one we avoided ! Thunderstorms and the Herc do not mix unless of course you are a WX hunter. This should trigger some WX memories.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCRIYADH0003_zps5eb716cd.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCRIYADH0003_zps5eb716cd.jpg.html)

[ancientaviator62]

I have had an e-mail from aeroid confirming his ID and we do indeed go back a long way. Back to the Hastings in fact. He is the person wearing the hat in post #360 ! Anyone who knows him will recognise him from the pic !

[CoffmanStarter]

Aeroid ...

Welcome. I'll gladly help you. I'm currently mobile but back home PM and will make contact then :ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Aeroid ...

I've just PM'd you to help get you started with some pics :ok:

Best ...

Coff.

[chickenlover]

Hi Smudge
Seasons best to you - I have only had a quick chance to scan thru the video so will report back more when I've seen all of it. Its a mix of footage, much of which I haven't seen before. I don't believe the FARP footage is AH, I believe it was taken when the 'official ' return flight went in with the Big Cheese on ( PB ?)The crew look like a 47 Main Sqn crew. I went in not long after AH and I remember it being much more chaotic. I think AH was FARPing Apaches that were still fighting within sight of the airport. I am prepared to be corrected on all of this as I also went in on a Chinook and I may be confusing events. I can't see what I thought was the funniest bit of the video I remember, which was Scotty and an oppo doing an 'In the trenches' sketch giving us aircrew some fierce but fair banter :)
I think I have reached the limit of the pictures I'm brave enough to post but I'll see if I mellow over the festive period, but it will be 25 years soon so I'm sure I can't upset that many people...... Seasons greetings to all the fine people from my past, both posting and lurking on here.

[smujsmith]

Chickenlover,

Thanks for that response. The GEs involved on the ground on that FARP at Kuwait certainly resemble some of the lads allocated to Victor, however I wasn't there, and accept completely that I also heard AH did a lot of Apaches. As for Scotty, check your PMs, I can offer the item you refer to, if only we could "post and be damned":=. All the best to you and yours for the festive season, I'm sure you have some quality photographs in your den, yet to be seen. Yet another "foxy" reference.

Smudge:ok:

Coff,

That photograph looks very JACIG to me. Let's see what develops.

[CoffmanStarter]

Gentlemen ...

I've made contact with our good friend Aeroid. Here is is first pic to help him get started and his stories flowing ;)

I understand he'll pick-up in the morning to add narrative ... I'll also follow-up behind the scenes to help him become self posting :)

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/mat5014_zpsa74b93a3.jpg

Best ...

Coff.

PS. Just moved my original post up to help Aeroid when he comes on-line :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman
looks like a round up of the usual suspects as I recognise some of them from my Hastings tour. Most of them will have been from 36 before it disbanded to reform as the first RAF 'K' sqn. As I mentioned I ended up on 24 till it in turn disbanded to become a 'K' sqn. Both squadrons were based at Lyneham but I went to Fairford on 47 with 30 as our sister squadron.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/24FINALLANDING_zps159bd4ad.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/24FINALLANDING_zps159bd4ad.jpg.html)
Invitation card to the 24 squadron disbandment bash. My last Hastings trip was Luqa-Abingdon-Colerne on 22 December 1967. My last 'K' trip was to Split and back on 24 December 1996.

[aeroid]

Thanks Coff,
The photograph was of some of the first UK crews to convert on to the "new" C130k ( or the h- model to the American). The pilot/Flight Eng ground school, simulator and flying training was carried out at Sewart AFB,Tenn.and involved 10 sim trips and ten flights. Then off to Indianapolis to carry out the Alison engine makers course and finally to Marietta in Georgia to do a short differences course on our own new machine before ferrying it back to UK.

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
when did you do the 'nosewheel steering' course ? I can then look up in my log books to see if we flew together when you were a captain.

[CoffmanStarter]

Morning Gents ...

I'm so pleased we're able to capture some pics and tales from the very early days of the K ... It's really important IMHO :ok:

Aeroid ...

I'll ping you an eMail this morning with a guide on pic handling/posting on PPRuNe :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
I remember Dean P one of the Navs on the course telling me he was so bored that he attended the Allison engine course and passed !

[aeroid]

Started the course at Thorney in Sept '69 and arrived on 24 Sqn in Dec 69.

[aeroid]

No one could work out why a nav had been put on an engines course so I recall that we all contributed to his final exam.

Ref your query about ALM training I seem to recall that they went on a separate course at Pope AFB then met up with the rest of us later. On the pilot flight training we just carried a "scanner" whose sole job down the back was to carry out scan checks.

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/048c3a9d-2973-4f38-9061-314ecf232b98_zpsa5f551d4.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/048c3a9d-2973-4f38-9061-314ecf232b98_zpsa5f551d4.jpg.html)

Last Xmas card from Colerne as a operational flying unit before it became the RAF C130k servicing base. Now part of the Royal Signals I believe.

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
according to my log book I first flew with you when you were a captain on March 24 1971 'Changi-MCT'. Day into night. Does the date tie in with your log book ?
I always had the impression that Dean P. just 'tagged' on to those doing the Allison course so as to see a bit more of the USA !

[nimbev]

I always had the impression that Dean P. just 'tagged' on to those doing the Allison course so as to see a bit more of the USA

Surely not!! I am sure Dean was following his thirst for knowledge, well 'thirst' anyway. Anybody know where Dean P is nowadays??

[Brian 48nav]

Dean was at the 48 reunion in June; if you are not on the list the contact man is Colin Eames, [email protected]


Merry Christmas and a very Happy New Year to all!


Brian Wildey

[aeroid]

AA62, All correct. It was my Day/Night Cat on XV297 with a certain Capt P "Treefeller"" (work that one out)

[Brian 48nav]

P*t* F*r*e*t*r - do I win a prize?

[aeroid]

Spot on, next question will be where am I now, once I have mastered uploading photos. Dont worry Coff I am working at it.

[aeroid]

http://s95.photobucket.com/user/wol130/media/mat1025_zps0eb30a5e.jpg.html?o=0

[aeroid]

http://s95.photobucket.com/user/wol130/media/mat1025_zps0eb30a5e.jpg.

[MPN11]

Dreadful photo, horrible day. I think I took that through a perspex sheet window.

Whatever, it's Albert trucking on regardless, bless 'im.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm468/atco5473/FlyerTalk/Scan2.jpg (http://s319.photobucket.com/user/atco5473/media/FlyerTalk/Scan2.jpg.html)

[CoffmanStarter]

Just helping Aeroid out :ok:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/mat1025_zps0c91c044.jpg

Over to you old chap :ok:

Coff.

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
that last pic could almost be Bonriki ! Welcome back Brian. Where are thy pics ?
My last post for a few days so here is my last Xmas card to wish everyone a merry Xmas.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/587a892c-5c55-4f90-b082-746b9be9c376_zps1592b675.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/587a892c-5c55-4f90-b082-746b9be9c376_zps1592b675.jpg.html)

[aeroid]

Thanks Coff,
Post 2136. Anyone like to try for a starter for ten? Begins with F and ends in I. Used to be part of a Far East Trainer.
Wol

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
Funafuti is my guess. Pics of the place in earlier threads.
MPN11, your pic is very evocative of 'K' ope in colder climes !

[CoffmanStarter]

Aeroid ...

I'm just having a look behind the scenes to see what might have gone wrong last night with your pic ... I'll drop you an eMail shortly as I have a feeling you have quite a few stunning pics of a 'young' RAF Albert :ok:

Best ...

Coff the IT Anorak !

[CoffmanStarter]

Come on MPN11 ... you can't leave us guessing like that ... which Perspex Tower was it then ?


I have a feeling we may have just started the equivalent of 'Where's Wally' (forgive me Aeroid) ... with 'Where's RAF Albert' :ok:

[aeroid]

Thanks Coff.
Don't worry about Wally, I don't know where I am myself most times. (Any of my earlier Navs please refrain from commenting on that last remark)

[aeroid]

http://s95.photobucket.com/user/wol130/media/mat1019_zps3fbe42c7.jpg.html

[aeroid]

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l144/wol130/mat1019_zps3fbe42c7.jpg

How do I get this in there?

[CoffmanStarter]

Well played Aeroid old chap :D:D:D:D

A good dollop of flap and some reverse pitch I'd say ...

[smujsmith]

Aeroid,

Just throw the GEs wallet over the side, you will land on that strip, I promise :}

Smudge:ok:

[aeroid]

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l144/wol130/mat1015_zpsbc666c94.jpg

Just keep it in the bl**dy middle

[aeroid]

Who said that Dean P was bored
[IMG]http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l144/wol130/mat5023_zpsf7b123e8.jpg[/IMG

[aeroid]

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l144/wol130/mat5023_zpsf7b123e8.jpg \dean bored?

[nimbev]

Looks like a typical bunch of truckies to me -however it looks as if Deano might be awake. Normal situation for a Nav though, staying awake while everyone else sleeps!!

[smujsmith]

nimbev,

A little harsh old chap, I always believed that staying awake was done on a rotational basis on Albert :eek: I know that there was always someone awake when I got out of my hammock for a cuppa.

Smudge:ok:

[ksimboy]

Seasons greetings to all current and ex Albert friends wherever you are.

[MPN11]

Come on MPN11 ... you can't leave us guessing like that ... which Perspex Tower was it then ?

Sorry to be slow in responding, Sir! That was RAF Stanley, mid-1983, and before the new double-glazed tinted window units arrived from UK. In that climate you can imagine that a single sheet of perspex was an inadequate option, perpetually misting up and leaking like a sieve round the wooden framing. I blame the Harriers for shooting 7 shades of s**t out of the tower the year previously ;)

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm468/atco5473/PPRuNe%20ATC/StanleyTower-AirportDamagecopy.jpg (http://s319.photobucket.com/user/atco5473/media/PPRuNe%20ATC/StanleyTower-AirportDamagecopy.jpg.html)

Anyway, same time and place, this time with an on-topic badly-done composite photo taken outside :D

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm468/atco5473/PPRuNe%20ATC/Scancopy.jpeg (http://s319.photobucket.com/user/atco5473/media/PPRuNe%20ATC/Scancopy.jpeg.html)

[Bengerman]

Christ, that bleak picture sums up Port Stanley so well!!

Had to reach for the malt!

[smujsmith]

Bengerman,

Well observed Sir, I'm sure the move to MPA a was a serious upgrade in facilities. Meanwhile, back to the malt:rolleyes:

Ksimboy, and to you too. Best wishes for the coming year.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
great pics ! Just back home after the Xmas detachment to our son's place.
Something to warm us all up on this cold windy day.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCBELIZE0003_zps04bd975c.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCBELIZE0003_zps04bd975c.jpg.html)

We are on a strip in the Belize Cays ! Normally in Belize we stayed down town in a hotel but on this occasion we were flown out to the quays for a change.
The pic is us waiting to board the 'transport' to fly back to Belize and depart back to the UK. The whole thing made a very nice nightstop.

[smujsmith]

AA62,

Now that brings back a very special memory for me. I had the honour to accompany a Flight Engineer known as T** Le C**** on a Belize trip (as I recall on OCU crew), where we fought our way, rather than flew to Belize. Tech faults in Gander and IAD ensured our late arrival, and the last real bed I had seen had contained my wife. So, on arrival, with a now going concern of an Albert, we were told that there were five rooms allocated to us on the Cays, a light aircraft awaited and that the "Crew Chief" would be downtown as usual. Our Flt Eng insisted that he needed the practice at putting Albert to bed, and duly decided that I was to accompany the team to the Cays, he would be the "GE for the night". Duly done, our arrival back at the airport next morning saw Albert fully prepped for departure, and a real gentleman snoozing in the Engineers seat. I will never forget the trip, the man and the pleasure of the Cays. Thanks for the memory.

Smudge:ok:

[smujsmith]

My son presented me with this book " C-130 Crew Chief: SeeThe World in in a C-130" by Steve Brown (available through the Big River on line outlet). I'm halfway through this tome (it's only 100 pages) and it has echoes of a former existence for me, although, USAF operated a different system to the RAF. The C130E, and the views of a USAF crew chief in the 1960s. Looking at the price for 100 pages, I'm glad my son is well paid. Im sure it may have an interest for some. Excuse the advert, I thought it had relevance to our own K.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCFLYPAST0002_zpsa81be6fa.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCFLYPAST0002_zpsa81be6fa.jpg.html)

Smudge,
glad the Belize pic brought back happy memories.
This pic was taken at one of the Lyneham Open Days.

[aeroid]

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l144/wol130/mat2074_zps0e4e21a6.jpg
I always used to ask for a room with a view (Somewhere in the Pacific I think)

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
looks nice and warm wherever it is. Does not ring any bells with me but I could have stayed there !

[aeroid]

Gradually working my way through all the threads. Sadly not too many photos from me but still searching. Can anyone remember an enforced "holiday" in Alice Springs in Sept '70 courtesy of Hydraulic Jim (alleged)

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
Have you read my posts on the subject of the control snatching etc and my views on the 'suspect'. As I posted I have refrained from any hint as to his name as I understand he was never charged much less convicted of any offence.

[Mal Drop]

RAF C130K - Check.
Palm trees - Check.
Para DZ Markers - Check.
Formation Drop - Check.
Location - Answers on a postcard...

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o254/photoboris/Where-am-IDZ_zpse3daecdd.jpg

[Lyneham Lad]

Have been dipping into this thread (109 pages!) and admiring the photos of all the exotic places that have been visited. And now for somewhere even more exotic. (Answers on a postcard not required...

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f84/Lyneham_Lad/LynehamOverview_1024_zps4b9edc08.jpg

[smujsmith]

aeroid #2159,

I stayed in a similar looking place on Mauritious in the mid 80's. Certainly had the facility to "skinny dip" direct from the front door. Although Indian, not Pacific Ocean. Someone must know ?

Lyneham Lad, I'm sure that the nicely outlined TFD is the giveaway.

Smudge:ok:

[aeroid]

Ah memories...I seem to remember spending half my time travelling between conversion Sqn and TFD clutching my butty box. Thanks Lynehamlad

[huge72]

aeroid #2159

It looks very much like the transit blocks on Diego Garcia, I stayed in them on several occasions in 98/99 whilst on 24. Do I win the prize?!!!!!

[smujsmith]

Huge 72,

Now you have me thinking. I stayed there too, 1991/92 so could easily be mistaken about Mauritius. Whatever the prize is, I reckon you just won it.

Smudge:ok:

[Brian W May]

Re: 2158

Another incidence of every man and his dog ignoring the 60˚ bank limitation flapless (even less with flap). These displays were watched by Messrs All and Sundry including Station Commanders (who usually held a category on the aircraft).

No wonder the fuel tank baffles were shagged (yes I know it's a quarter of a barrel roll, but not many pilots can do them well, besides which it was set by Lockheed for a reason).

Still can't help it after all these years.

[smujsmith]

Brian,

I would never dispute the voracity of your argument re bank angles and limitations, though perhaps some better qualified than me might, I'm a bit curious as to what these "baffles" are in the fuel tanks. I spent the early part of my career on the tank team at Colerne, as you know, and can remember no "baffles" in the main tanks, just struts and sealed wing structure. Are you referring to the baffles in the external tanks ? Fore and Aft, designed to prevent large changes of trim during steep climb and descent ? If so, I suspect that such displays were flown with external and aux tanks empty.

Smudge:ok:

[Bts70]

No baffle damage in the tanks, plenty of horizontal firewall rippling & overtorque checks though!

[Clunk60]

Glad to see you haven't changed after all these years Brian W

[ex-fast-jets]

1975:

Harriers deploy to Belize to defend said country against Guatemalan aggression. Six Harriers fly UK to Bermuda supported by Herc Route Support. Pilots who fly UK - Bermuda are replaced by six pilots pre-positioned in Bermuda who take the jets over and fly Bermuda into Belize. The route support Herc departs after the last jet has gone, but en-route has a "suspect standby Artificial Horizon" for the co-pilot. Decision is made to divert to Nassau. Senior Harrier mate on-board (Sqn Exec) pleads with the Driver to continue to Belize. It's daylight, the weather is good, and there is an operational need to get the six Harrier pilots on-board to Belize 'cos at that stage, there was a real possibility that the jets there would be needed to fight, and the six on-board pilots were important to provide some presence on the ground. GASO's were produced from behind one of the seats, and the Herc diverted to Nassau.

During the six months 1(F) Sqn was in Belize 1975/76 at no stage did a Herc ever stay overnight - the accommodation was pretty basic. There were usually some dozen or so with serviceability problems on the ground at Nassau. One evening, a Herc could not start one of its engines, and there was a real possibility that it might have to stay the night. We watched the activity closely with a Belikin Beer in hand - eventually, they got the engine turning, and very quickly the Herc took off - three tubes of condensation evident from three of the engines, with nothing behind the fourth. The fourth engine was stopped immediately after take-off, in sight of the airfield, and before the undercarriage was fully retracted.

Several months later after the Harriers had returned from Belize, with a new Squadron Commander on 1(F) Sqn, he wanted to visit in case the Sqn had to return - which, of course, it did. He wanted to visit with a pilot who had been there for the 75/76 deployment. He chose me.

In those days, 1(F) Sqn was a part of 38 Gp, the same as the Hercs, so he negotiated that we would travel out as super crew, returning after a few days on the ground in a VC-10. Our Herc went u/s for several days in Gander and Nassau on the way out - we missed our VC-10 connection for the return, and went u/s in Nassau on the way back. We spent almost 14 days away from the UK, about 2 hours on the ground in Belize, and received amazing amounts of money from the imprest, and ate huge amounts of food during the flights that we made.

I am afraid that in those days there were very definitely two different Royal Air Forces.

[Brian W May]

Hi Smuj, and others.

We were told on the OCU (originally) that the bank limitations were derived due to the movement of fuel outboard during (uncoordinated) turns. This 'slug' of fuel (depending on the severity of the yaw).

I'm trying to find the info, but I read of an incident where this 'slug' of fuel caused complete failure of the outer wing box and the fuel broke into the vent box (if I remember correctly - bear in mind I've been qualified on 6 aircraft types since). I'll come back if I find it.

Indisputably the bank limit was 60˚ clean and 45˚ with flap.

[Brian W May]

Smuj - PM to be going on with. Still looking.

[OmegaV6]

BomberH.... whist your tale has a certain "ring of truth" to it .. a few points to add for completeness ...

In the early days of the "Belize Slip" (or reinforcement/deployment call it what you will) the airfield was not as it became ... the parking area was two tiny concrete patches, one by the terminal, one by the tower. It was decreed by those on high that the Herc was NOT to nightstop Belize for "any reason" as when parked the passage of the mighty 10 was hindered .. and that could not happen .. :) No spares were initially prepositioned in Belize (we eventually got that changed) but two "ranger packs" and "enhanced support" (extra couple of GE's) were positioned in Nassau. The "slip" route being Lyn - Gander - Nassau - (flag) Belize - Nassau - Gander - Lyn Eventually the infrastructure at Belize changed dramatically and the Herc stopped there on many occasions ... if memory serves the Chinese Restaurant was particularity popular .. :)

[smujsmith]

MalDrop #2163,

I can't afford a postcard on my wages, (I do so miss the co pilot and his largesse (or was that imprest)) so will take a punt at somewhere in Kenya. I was only a GE, so rarely saw the view from the front of the bus, but the red soil and scrub indicates Africa, formation drop indicates some formal training area used by the Army, and I remember doing many trips to Nairobbery to deliver "ground pounders"!! I'm sure one of the drivers will be along soon to correct my guess, once again, a good picture contribution to this ongoing record of Albert in the RAF.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

OMEGAV6 is correct ref the small parking area at Belize in the early days. Before the Herc came into service we used to go there in the Hastings. After offloading pax/frt we then taxied to an area of the airport we christened the scrapyard because that is what it looked like. Full of bits of dead a/c etc. Naturally the Hastings looked right at home there.
This was done to leave room on the very small parking area for the civilian a/c to park, no VC10 then.
Whether you liked it or not GASOS ruled our lives and you disobeyed them at your peril. Unless of course you got an exemption in writing from HQ or were the AOC ! (see my earlier Belize tale)
As the comms back to HQ improved so did micromanagement. IMHO this was to the detriment of getting the job done on many an occasion.

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCVIEWLYN0002_zpsb56edd49.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCVIEWLYN0002_zpsb56edd49.jpg.html)

Typical day at you know where !

[smujsmith]

AA62,

Yourself and MalDrop are absolutely correct in your assertion that the no night stop policy in Belize was part of the operational plan of the time. In my day, as a GE, Belize trips were a standard night stop, with no parking restriction. The practice experienced by BomberH did though continue, and certainly both the UN relief mission in to Sarajevo from Falconara and the Kigale slip through Dar Es Salaam both precluded night stops at the "coal face". I'm sure others will have examples of getting in and out of airheads during tactical transport operations.

Smudge :ok:

[aeroid]

Sorry Huge 72, never got to DG. Possibly Tarawa, but you can buy the beers.

[aeroid]

Sorry Smuj. This was taken 1970-71. Almost before you were born. Could have meen Mahe

[smujsmith]

Aeroid,

70-71 was my final year as an Apprentice at Halton, I'm not as young as I look you know:eek: I was just trying to be clever with the geography.

Smudge:ok:

[November4]

Have just found a carrier bag full of photos and amongst them were my collection of photos from Op Bushel. I have posted a couple on here before but these are some new ones.

This was an airdrop of some roses(?) to nurses or could have been nuns at an aid station that happened to be under the route for that day (between 7 and 27 Nov 85) Hercules would have been either XV306 or XV297. The airdrop consisted of opening the para door and the ALM launching them out in a polystyrene box. Hopefully brightened up someone's day

Red on

http://i59.tinypic.com/1z17ius.jpg

Green on

http://i60.tinypic.com/2z6czya.jpg

More to come....

[huge72]

aeroid

Well I guess the beers on me but it was worth a try though!!!!:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

November4,
great pics. More please.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/EGYPT0002_zpsec93261f.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/EGYPT0002_zpsec93261f.jpg.html)

The Nile as viewed on Op Granby.

[November4]

One of the MAMS team produced a cartoon story of life on Op Bushell, Sure those that were there will be able to relate to some of the incidents

http://rafmams.co.uk/Operations/Op%20Images/Op%20Bushel/Page%201.jpg

http://rafmams.co.uk/Operations/Op%20Images/Op%20Bushel/Page%202.jpg

The full set are on the Movements Association web site (http://rafmams.co.uk/Operations/Operations/OpBushel%20-%20Cartoons.html)

[gopher01]

Stopping on the Cays in Belize was not a one off as during a Harrier changeover saga the crew I was on also managed to stay there instead of downtown and the story goes as follows:
Are you sitting comfortably and I will begin, it was a dark and stormy night, actually just stormy and very very wet as the two ship Herc trail carrying both bits of a Harrier to Belize, ( we had the wing, the other frame had the fuselage )landed at Nassau prior to continuing to Belize. As both frames were ready to go at the same time it was decided that the other would takeoff first and we would follow. As the Herc crossed the runway intersection on its take off roll a very large sheet of spray enveloped the aircraft as the mainwheels went through a gigantic puddle, we followed shortly after but with no problems. As we climbed out the other aircraft requested a visual inspection from below as they had a loud flapping noise from the area of the main U/C. After joining below it was seen that the inner port U/C door was flapping in the breeze, presumably damaged during the puddle splash. A decision was made to divert both aircraft to a military base in the States where engineering facilities existed so off we went to Homestead.
It was decided to freefall the port U/C to avoid any damage through forcing the U/C down under power and ask Homestead to check the position of the U/C on a flyby. We landed first and parked up to watch the proceedings as the flyby was performed which was followed by ATC calling in all his Phantoms before this Herc with only one gear down landed on his runway, slight breakdown in communications somewhere we found out! After lowering the rest of the gear normally the aircraft landed and taxied in.
Investigation showed the door actuating rod was broken, probably by the force of the water on take off so no major problem there. However, and this is were it all gets interesting I believe to freefall the U/C you switch off the hydraulic pumps, its a bit vague now it was a long time ago, and the pumps had tripped off and would not reset, yet again no problem apart from the fact it had Vickers pumps fitted which the Yanks didn't have so the frame would have to await spares from the UK.
A cunning plan was then hatched, we would night stop Miami, fly to Belize, unload our load (the wing ) and fly back to Miami to pick up the fuselage and night stop again, then fly down to Belize with the fuselage and stop while the Harrier was assembled, air tested and the returning Harrier was prepped for return. On our first arrival Rudi was asked about the possibility of being accommodated on the Cays as we would have several days waiting for the return load.
So on our return with the fuselage we were informed that our aircraft awaited us at Belize municipal airport to take us to the Cays and would pick us up two days later to take our flight back and so it happened. If you ever saw the municipal airport then taking off seven up from there in an Islander was quite interesting as one end of the " runway " was the seawall and the locals just wandered across as they fancied so the timing of the take off run involved looking for a gap in the foot traffic and aiming to arrive at the end of the runway the same time as the gap did!
We took our half of the Harrier home with no further problems but the frame in Homestead had the further complication after their rectification was carried out of when they went to start up to depart to Belize the Loady got struck by lightning whilst out on the end of the long lead resulting in a short hospital stay but I gather he was fine afterwards although some people said would anybody notice any difference.
It certainly made a change from the Fort George or the other one on the sea front whose name I can't remember,

[smujsmith]

Heh heh,

Thanks Gopher, that sounds like a pretty typical route, you know, the one where the plans go out of the window as the wheels are retracted out of Lyneham. I had a similar Jobby at Homestead doing a Belize LOX run. I think I described it in an earlier post, I ended up with a "field promotion" to Flt Lt. Hope you are well and, as the end of the year draws near wish all contributers and watchers of this thread a very happy and prosperous 2015.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

gopher01,
I assume by freefall of the MLG you are referring to the pulling of the handle on the forward face of the wheel well.
As I watched the Virgin 747 going round and round it triggered a memory of a nosewheel problem we had when I was on 48 at Changi. If some of the tech details have become blurred by the passage of time I trust one of out technical correspondents will correct me.
On September 9 1970 we arrived back at Changi after a night para sortie
to find that the nosegear was showing unlocked as we prepared to land.
I went under the flight deck and switched on the nose bay light and had a good look. It seemed down OK . There was a pin that protruded when the gear was locked down but it was so covered in muck that it was not possible to tell. After a crew conflab I put on a safety harness removed the inspection window and reached through to try to clean it. Being 'vertically challenged' I could not quite reach. So the Nav, a Flt Cdr with longer arms, came down and did so. It seemed fine.
However I also think he managed to put the nose gear pin in !
When we first got the 'K' the nose gear lock was a wedge shaped bit of kit.
The was later replaced with the simpler pin after a modification.
So we landed and gave to a/c to the ground crew to sort out what was obviously an indication problem.

[DCThumb]

I remember New York pumps, and Abex pumps. What were vickers pumps?...Smuj?

[smujsmith]

DCThumb,

Abex are the ones I remember, and possibly New York, I suspect that like both of them the Vickers pump is yet another manufacturers label. Like many parts of Albert, there are many sources who all produced a product, to meet a specification. I bet Gopher 01 knows a lot more than me though.

Smudge:ok:

[ExAscoteer]

IIRC it was Abex on nos 3 and 4 and New Yorks on Nos 1 and 2?

Eventually the fleet was fitted with New Yorks all round ISTR.

[ExAscoteer]

Smuj a quick Q for you.

I always thought that parking Albert's props straight up and down was to protect the air intake from FOD. You earlier on alluded to another reason (an oil leak?).

Could you elucidate for an aging and brain addled Ascot warrior please?

Ta Muchly :ok:

[Kengineer-130]

#1 prop blade at the top to stop oil leaking out of the beta feedback tube, to be honest as long as #1 blade was not at the bottom it was not really a problem, so short stops anywhere but down was ok, if leaving it parked up then #1 at the top was best practice.

[ancientaviator62]

Over the years the 'K' had Vickers, New York and Abex pumps but in which order I cannot remember ! On one variant the loadmaster could give a timely warning of a possible impending pump failure. This was because the hydraulic reservoir would become progressively hotter as the flight progressed.

[smujsmith]

Kengineer,

Absolutely perfectly described. Perhaps worth mentioning that No1 Blade has the yellow spot on it. I think my previous comment, to which Ex Ascoteer refers was regarding the aircraft at Cosford, with the blades parked in "X" position. I queried it on my last visit, and was told it was for safety reasons.

Smudge:ok:

[Alison Conway]

Gentlemen,

It appears that one or two memories have faded. The NY EDP was the original, it was replaced by the Vickers (which caused trouble) and subsequently by the Abex which was good. They were not supposed to be "mixed and matched", but owing to budgetary constraints (ie being tight or skint) they opted to use the new Abex on one system and the older and less reliable on the other. Try http://www.lockheedmartin.co.uk/content/dam/lockheed/data/aero/documents/global-sustainment/product-support/Service-News/V10N2.pdf for a further explanation.

[ancientaviator62]

AC,
that chimes with my recall of the sequence but was unsure enough not to say so. The Lockheed tech bulletin you linked also contained an article on the cargo door. I do not recall any snagging on the control cables but on the 'K' you could not close the cargo door by selecting 'closed' on the switch. The drill was to select 'Open. and when it had risen out of the uplock pull the emergency release handle. Any other method would usually result in a very fast freefalling cargo door and damage ! On opening in the air it was common to have to bunt the a/c slightly to ensure the cargo door entered the uplock.

[ExAscoteer]

Sorry AC I had Abex and NY the wrong way round - I put that down to the time of night of the post, alcohol and age! However I certainly don't remember a Vickers pump. Maybe what I was told was NY was in fact Vickers, who knows?

IIRC one of the problems with the 'NY' (as I believed it to be) was that, having isolated it, the runaround circuit would get so hot that you couldn't reinitiate it after 10 minutes or so because the incoming cold fluid from the wider system would cause the pump to explode.

I had a problem resulting in a booster system isolation inbound to somewhere nice and Tropical. It took some time to sort out so we didn't re-initiate.

Coming down the ILS the system pressure suddenly rose to 2500 psi then rapidly fell to zero. Apparently the thermal relief valve had opened one one of the pumps causing it to let go.

Result? Full hydraulic flush required so we go U/S in a Tropical Paradise. 6A called out......and went U/S on start up. Apparently people were falling over themselves to get on the next 6A standby.

We didn't care, we had a week in the sunshine. :)

[Brian W May]

To quote a verse from a song wot I wrote at the time: (to the tune of Greensleeves)

Three orange lights, pumps OFF at the rush
Christ we're stuck four days with an hydraulic flush
But we carry four boxes and two rubber wheels
A green towing arm . . . and all the wrong seals


Does that scenario ring any bells?
Yes the Vickers pumps had the thermo run-round (designed to prevent pump damage when isolated), but wasn't all it was cracked up to be (pun intended).

Happy days . . .

[Alison Conway]

Brian,

You obviously had too much time on your hands owing to hydraulic flushes, but a useful little ditty.

AA62,

The reasoning behind the method of lowering the door was that if you powered it UP then you pressurised the lines that would become the DOWN lines on release of the lock. That way you didn't get the rapid and dangerous decent of what could be a very heavy article dependant on how much sh*t was in the door stowage bins.

[smujsmith]

Brian,

Well remember the bags of OM15 full of what looked like glitter (pump remnants) when doing an hydraulic flush. Never managed to be so affected down route though. Most of the stoppers I got were related to propellers.

AC,

I'm sure that stowing his "down route" wallet in the cargo door, would not have been the cause of AA62 and his lowering problems, but had M**k L***y been his GE, and stowed his bling in the door:rolleyes: All bets are off. Interesting piece about the pumps, thanks for posting it. Now, why is National Waterlift sitting in my mind whilst discussing hydraulics.:eek:

Smudge:ok:

[Alison Conway]

Smudge,

You told me once in the RAFA club in Swindon that you were retiring to the Lake District. Can I assume that this did not last/never happened? As far as a certain brand of corned beef is concerned, I suspect the bling to be as fake as that tan he had which gave him an orange hue in the mess (before I went across the playing field). I reckon that much lead would indeed weigh the door to jack stall.

TTB

[smujsmith]

Ahh, AC,

What a memory you have. We spent four years living "up north" in Cumbria, but failed to resist the call of Albert, and where all the people I know lived. Now residing on the approach to 25 ? On the western extremities of Pig atop the hill. I agree with you on the trim shift when our man returned to his hammock, I remember at least two Captains who remarked on the need for a trim adjustment :ok:

Smudge:ok:

[Brian W May]

Well remember the bags of OM15 full of what looked like glitter (pump remnants) when doing an hydraulic flush. Never managed to be so affected down route though. Most of the stoppers I got were related to propellers.

Aha, had them as well - Gitz Seals being favourite. Last one was in Mombasa with Robbie Kendra (RIP) . . . (and a certain Mr Moffatt of the Fred variety).

[smujsmith]

Rear GITZ was a real pain if you ended up having to pull the prop to replace it. For the GE, if you had a bit of help (as in Richmond RAAF Base) you could get the job done in a day as the crew enjoyed an unscheduled day off. Valve housing and "walking the dog" might bring back some memories for those who have been there.

Smudge:ok:

[Kengineer-130]

Valve housing changes really were one of the few jobs that worked out better when left to the premier trade :ok:, the background of the said GE normally dictated how quickly the job went.... Faeries & DF's normally took an active interest , but ran away at the first sniff of OM15, the riggers were usually eager to help but the dragging knuckles could interfere somewhat!

I was fairly fortunate as an SVC , many times I had no faults at all, although 7 days U/S in Rio due to dual VSI failure could be seen as the best of bad luck?:}

[ancientaviator62]

AC,
understand about powering the line when lowering the cargo door, but I think later marks of the C130 had a mod to allow power closing of the door.
Often after an airdrop the door would not lock down on one side. this was usually the RH side as you look aft. The loadmaster then had to walk up and stamp on the door thus effecting closure.
And yes we tried all manner of things in respect of removing kit from the door before airdrop sorties. It just seemed an odd design feature all round.

[smujsmith]

AA62, and anyone interested.

I had lunch today, and a wee beer or two, with another ex GE, who has a vast fund of knowledge, like myself, was a rigger by basic trade, and had a lot to offer on the rigging and operation of the Cargo door and the inherent problems of locking up and down. T****r T******n, as I did, worked on A Line prior to becoming A GE, and well remembers the times that the door was snagged for either of the above problems, in his opinion, after lengthy investigation, it came down to air in the hydraulic system. He told me today of the fact that Lockheeds service news highlighted the problem of the door, as noted by AA62, in one of its issues. When they compared the suggested procedure with that of the Aircraft Technical publications, it seemed that the official tech pubs left a lot to be desired. For instance, a team under the supervision of a Cpl Rigger spent almost a whole night shift bleeding the system for the door, with no improvement. When they checked the door using the Lockheed tech publication, it was found that they had effectively only bled one side of the system, the air was in the other. Of course, officially, only the authorised Air Publication is the source of servicing activity.

And so we go to the Vickers Hydraulic pump, which was a "non self idling" pump. This meant that when coupled to an Engine that ran at 100% it ran at maximum output at all times. During periods of say, standard cruise flight, the pump was still giving maximum output, with nowhere for it to go, so it got hot. The answer was a relief valve that allowed the oil to be circulated through piping in the dry bays, which allowed some cooling and helped offload the pumps. Both the New York and Abex pumps were self idling, when no demand was made of them, they reduced output and therefore cut down on both workload and heat, no need for run around (cooling) circuits. I'm reliably informed by my drinking companion that from the late 80s only Abex pumps were fitted on the K and that the incidence of Hydraulic flushes was significantly reduced. I have to say, it's been a fascinating sequence of posts of great interest to myself. As a quick follow up, a nice Lockheed Technical News issue that gives a decent description of the E model technicalities, most appropriate to the K;

http://www.c-130hercules.net/LSN/No34.pdf

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
the tech pubs left a great deal to be desired especially in the early days.
The ramp locks saga being but one that would have benefited from accurate information.

[OmegaV6]

I think the major problems with the tech pubs was the fact that, for reasons known only to someone in procurement, we did NOT get/use the Lockheed Dash 1 (-1) documents .. but everything was transcribed/reissued/republished/screwed up* (* delete as applicable) to UK documents. It became apparent to me very early when doing "foreign" training (Belgians/Israelis/various Middle East crews etc) that the -1 had far more, and often more accurate/relevant information, than the UK versions did. Many an FE carried photocopied excerpts from the -1 to assist the grey matter when solving problems !- I know my limited grey cells needed all the help they could get !!

[Brian W May]

I know my limited grey cells needed all the help they could get !!

Yep, we'd heard that too :)

[November4]

A couple more from Ethiopia

http://i62.tinypic.com/29xfalj.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/303blgy.jpg

[November4]

Occassionally there were trips at places other then Assab and Mekelle. I think these were at Axum or Alamata. There was always an Ethiopian government minder on the aircraft. He was invited to the flight deck which meant I could take these photos. While the RAF and other aircraft were flying grain about, the Ethiopian Air Force was being used to relocate the local population.

http://i58.tinypic.com/2cf2lmu.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/vpfcsk.jpg

[TEEEJ]

Footage from Operation Khana Cascade - Nepal, 1973.

See from 1:28

x1St2Q24TPs&feature=related

[ancientaviator62]

Great pics and video from November4 and TEEEJ.
Now for something completely different !

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCBIRTHDAYCAKE0002_zps3bcabb45.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCBIRTHDAYCAKE0002_zps3bcabb45.jpg.html)

Made by my wife when she was in her cake making mode. Yes smudge I know the props are not lined up but you tell her !

[CoffmanStarter]

AA62 ... So is that Brakes Off or Bake Off :D:D:D:D

[ancientaviator62]

Coff,
with the length of the runway available it was definitely 'brakes on'.

[Dougie M]

I remember getting one similar on my 50th with 50 beer mugs along the borders. They had no idea that you can't mix drinking with flying Ahem!

[smujsmith]

AA62,

A Loadie I might take issue with, his wife never !!

A quick story on prop parking. I am reliably informed that at Lyneham in the late seventies two ground servicing entities existed ALSS and BLSS. ALSS parked their props in a cruciform pattern, No1 blade at the top. BLSS, always wanting to emphasise the difference between them and their ALSS brethren, parked their props "the Cosford way"! A newly arrived OC Eng Wing looked from his office one morning then asked his deputies why the mixed parking looked such a mess with the props "higgledy piggledy" (it wouldn't have looked so bad if the aircraft of A & B LSS had been parked adjacent to each other)? On explaining "Le difference" between A & B he ordered that he had no care for that, but, all propellers should be parked in a standard way, so as to make the ASP look more uniform. As OC ALSS was the senior Squadron Leader, the ALSS method prevailed at Lyneham, and certainly did when I was posted to ALSS around 1986. Despite my, and others reasoning, of why the No1 blade should be parked at TDC, it appears that it came down to seniority in rank, as a choice, at Lyneham.

Dougie M, Only 50 beer mugs, that will have taken a few minutes then:rolleyes:

Teej. Some good stuff on that short vid, the marching at Swinderby gave me a few shudders though! Even though I was a Halton Brat.

I'm away for a couple of weeks guys, I may have a little access to the interweb, but keep putting the pictures and stories up, it matters.

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCSHOREHAM20002_zps92bf27cb.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCSHOREHAM20002_zps92bf27cb.jpg.html)

Pic taken at a Shoreham Airshow. 30 Sqn used to take a 'K' there and sell Benevolent Fund items as the public boarded the a/c for a walkround.
Due to the space taken up by the Herc it had to be in position early as a lot of other exhibits were placed adjacent to it.

[CoffmanStarter]

Good to see the Thread is still going strong :ok:

I was Googling RAF Albert the other day and got a bit sidetracked (as you do sometimes :uhoh:) and stumbled across references to RAF Hercules Call Signs used by the Lyneham Transport Wing. Not just the usual Ascot 4000, 5000 and RAFAIR series.

That got me thinking ... maybe some of these Call Signs might jog a few more memories ... which might then prompt a few more stories to tell :ok:

Clearly ... as this is a public forum ... some ops will need to remain discrete.

As an aside ... I can only assume that the guy (who seems to be based in the Netherlands) who compiled this list also has a passion for car registration plates and/or train numbers :confused:

The Guide's Internet Callsign list - United Kingdom (GB) (http://www.the-guide.nl/callsign/country/gb/)

Anyway ...

A few that caught my eye ... ELVIS, GUINNESS and STARTREK

SNOOPY is an easy one ... and I assume CIRCUS is likely to relate to support for the RAFAT.

There are some 40 other Call Signs attributed to RAF Albert on the list ;)

Pictures

For those PPRuNe members who are possibly regular visitors to this Thread but are uncertain as to how to post pictures and would like to contribute ... please drop me a PM to make contact ... I'm only too pleased to help :ok:

Best regards ...

Coff.

[smujsmith]

Coff,

STARTREK was a 70 Sqdn Callsign for a Scottac formation as I recall. GUINNESS would relate to 47SF I suspect, considering their usual "après luft" lubricant of choice (well, certainly a particular Scots Co). I can certainly confirm that I once did a trip in the Gulf with a 47SF crew who used the callsign ALBERT 01. Off for a few days tonight, but couldn't resis a quick response. Keep it going Truckies.

Smudge:ok:

[billynospares]

We definitely used Elvis 01 a few years back in El Centro. Did a see off wearing my best Elvis shades fresh from Vegas :ok:

[fergineer]

Have fun Smuj don't do anything I wouldn't !!!!!

[CoffmanStarter]

Welcome Billy ... Any pics ... Shades-n-all :cool:

[billynospares]

I have a couple of pics but no idea how to put them on here

[Dougie M]

All military formation callsigns for use in the U.K. had to be from an approved list which naturally was plundered by the pointy folk before slower formations got a look in. Startrek, Mallard and Snapdragon really didn't convey the idea of a small village with wings on using up several miles of airspace thundering across the U. K. at low level but that was our fate in S.T.S.
Overseas the choice was unfettered. Slipper 1 and Giver 1 raised sniggers in Southern California and the end of day call to the tower of "Elvis has left the theatre" was most righteous.

[CoffmanStarter]

Billy ... Check your PM's ... I'll help :ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Brilliant and what 'style' Dougie :D:D:D:D

[Alison Conway]

I'm pretty sure I have been on a trip using Dograt callsign with a recently departed captain and good guy Mick Doggart.

[Descend to What Height?!?]

From the early 1990s Snoopy used the call sign METMANnn when on task with nn being the captains assigned number. When in transit to go on det we occasionally used ASCOT. Still remember the selcall as AJDM.
Happy days

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks for joining DTWH ... Any Snoopy pics you would like to share :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCSHOREHAM0002_zps11e12711.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCSHOREHAM0002_zps11e12711.jpg.html)

Another pic of the Herc at Shoreham It is myself with my four year old grandson.
He is now nineteen and learning to fly in NZ. Where does the time go ?
We had a conducted tour of the flightdeck and he was amused to see the Co drying out his nav bag. Some things never change.

[aeroid]

Coffers #2223

I think that the first ever callsign used by the 'K's was MPSL**** This was used on delivery flights from Lockheed at Marietta to Marshalls of Cambridge. The aircraft were not offically RAF property at this stage. I was lead to believe that we were operating on behalf of the Ministry of Technology.

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks for that Aeroid old chap ... another import little gem in RAF Albert's Service Career :ok:

Hope you had a great Christmas ...

Best.

Coff.

[Xercules]

At the same time as we started the Banner Bs and because of the threat of IRA SAMs or gunfire on the approaches, somebody high up decided that we should start using call signs which sounded like civilian operators in the hope of fooling the opposition. The plan was to use the standard ASCOT until handover to local NI ATC then adopt the "civilian" one. The only source was the tactical call sign registry already mentioned. After we had culled the obviously useless for the subterfuge we had about 20 or so. We used those for a few weeks and then felt that another selection was needed. This time the C/S registry grumbled slightly but gave us another selection of about 40. When we went back the next time the grumble became a complaint and after we went back further it became a serious complaint direct to Gp Capt. AT/AAR that we were using them faster than they could generate them and please would we desist.

The answer was somewhat unequivocal.

[aeroid]

I was trawling through some old posts recalling unusual loads and thought that this might ring some old bells.

Early in 1971 I was night stopping Hong Kong from Changi when the Changi Station Commander arrives with a broken Herc. He"asked" if I could swap aircraft with him as his need to return to Changi was greater than mine. Ever mindful of pro(de)motion prospects, Form 1369 (more stars than a bottle of Martel Brandy) Pixie points(running low) I happily agreed. Fifteen - Love.
Now, Turn the clock forward and read on.

Captain Slog, Stardate July1971. Star Colony Changi. The Almighty FEAF instruct me to take Star Truck XV 203 To Star Base Lyneham, its new home.
SCC soon to close so good opportunuity to take home a few domestic items as crew baggage, Camphorwood Chest, Rattan Chairs etc. Blond haired Co-p requests that he take his Ski boat as crew baggage. Agree providing that if Star Colonies at Bahrein and Akrotiri have any freight his boat goes off first. FHC gets lucky and boat arrives at SBL. Loaders at SBL not happy with Ski boat as crew baggage. Soon Very Senior Movements Officer approaches and asks how far to SCC as it will cost us 3p per mile! Eventually peace breaks out... but not for long.

Arrive back at SCC and 48 Squadron Commander says welcome home, you are on a Unit Enquiry.Tell him have not done one before therefore not qualified. Tells me "you are not running it, you are the cause of it!" VSMO has spilt the beans. UE carried out, results passed on to SCC Station Commander. My presence requested. No mention of tea and biccies. Look for best hat, not route one, sphincture goes sixpence, half a crown, dustbin lid. SCCSC asks" How do you want to pay, cash or cheque?" then smiles and goes on to tell me of some of his exploits in Habanya in 19thingy thingy.
Mind goes back to a certain day in Hong Kong. Fifteen - All.

Never worked out how the loaders at SBL missed the box with the engine and fuel tank in it. Now that would have been tricky.

[CoffmanStarter]

Xercules ... You couldn't make it up could you ;)

Aeroid ... That's a classic ... Beautifully told :D

Thanks Gents for sharing ...

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
I do remember the incident. How come you had two SD hats ? 'Fess up you borrowed one for the visit to the 'staish'. Your route hat can be clearly seen in the crew card playing pic in Fiji.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCSHOREHAM10002_zps901bde9a.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCSHOREHAM10002_zps901bde9a.jpg.html)

Last of the Shorehem pics.

[Dougie M]

It's hardly a tac strip but crew can't be that confident. No 1 cuffed!

[ancientaviator62]

Dougie,
obviously old habits die hard !

[ksimboy]

Would that be the number one on the starboard side perhaps? :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

ksimboy,
do't forget Dougie nearly always travelled sideways so can be forgiven for the numbering confusion !

[ksimboy]

AA62 a fair point, having seen Dougie "socially confused "on several occasions !:)

[OmegaV6]

Billy .. nice photos .. but definitely no 177 in that lot !! Some personal ones you might not wish all over t'internet however !!

PM sent as well ...

[CoffmanStarter]

Well played Billy :ok:

Great pic ...

[Dougie M]

Shurely shome mishtake!
Good spot!

[billynospares]

Sorry about that not sure what has happened there, but they are not even my photos. Too weird will try again