Global Aviation Magazine : 60 Years of the Hercules

[Mal Drop]

Experience has shown that's usually safer to alter reality than challenge an STS Staff Nav...

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o254/photoboris/Aircraft/RevPic_zps7d6efd1a.jpg

[ksimboy]

Mal
Excellent job, I found out not to upset Dougie while sober in E C many years ago. Was one of the better bollockings I received in my time. :ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Bit of a long shot really ... But does anyone have a copy of the original FRC's from when RAF Albert first entered service to share ? Did you use any humorous 'type' specific mnemonics ... Sad I know ... But I can still chant "My Friend Fred Has Hairy B@lls" :ooh:

[Xercules]

Coff,
There was no need to learn mnemonics for checks as all were done by challenge and response. The Nav read out the item (challenge) and the appropriate crew member replied with the appropriate words having completed the action. The only checks we needed to remember were the Immediate actions in the event of an engine fire - at first "Thandle pulled, Condition lever to feather, first shot fired and start the clock" all closely monitored by the engineer.

Indeed, so cautious were we of not acting in haste ( to repent at leisure) that the old joke was - what is the first action in the event of an emergency? - to which the answer once - Start the clock. That action was meant merely to slow everything down.

The "at first" above refers to the actions changing to condition lever first followed by Thandle. This was because the CL feathered the propeller mechanically and shut off the fuel quickly whilst oil was still lubricating everything whereas the Thandle as well as feathering shut off everything immediately. This was deemed to safer than ending up with an unfeathered prop still trying to rotate without lubrication.

PS I do have a copy of FRCs (at home) I think but I am in France for the next 3 weeks plus. If by that time anybody still wants them I will see what we can do.

[CoffmanStarter]

Many thanks Xercules old chap ... all understood :ok:

The only 'challenge' I ever experienced if I forgot my checks ... was a gentle clomp on the Bonedome ;)

Might still be good to get a couple of example FRC extracts up on here ... They would certainly interest me :8

Best ...

Coff.

[aeroid]

I can remember (just) back in the old days as a pimply faced APO taxying out and laboriously going through the TAFFIOHH (T Trim F Fuel etc) checks at the speed of the average glacier, when at the end my instructor said don't forget GFI. I pondered then admitted defeat and asked ," What's GFI?"
"Get F****n' Airborne!" was the exasperated reply.

[aeroid]

It was rumoured that following the introduction of Flight Deck Voice recorders, the first word usually uttered following a genuine ringing of the fire bells or engine failure was s**t. That was usually enough to get the directional consultant scrabbling for the check list.

By the way are there any members of S.O.D.C.A.T. still around. (Pulls out pin, throws grenade and ducks for cover)

[OmegaV6]

I think Dougie M is a founder member of SODCAT .... :)

Certainly AA qualifies under the "AT" portion of the acronym ... :)

[CoffmanStarter]

Apparently there is still a gap after The Society of Chiropodists and Podiatrists and before The Society of Radiographers on here ...

Trades Union Congress - Britain's Unions (http://www.tuc.org.uk/britains-unions)

:)

[billynospares]

http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg3_zps4af0fa46.jpgok another try ! XV177 on holtville DZ

[CoffmanStarter]

Perfect Billy :D :ok:

[Mal Drop]

There were a few mnemonics for problem solving, I vaguely remember BANGGEARO for the Touchdown Switch. From memory it was:

Bus Not Tied
Anti-skid
Nacelle pre-heat
GTC Door
Gear Latch
Engine Anti-icing? (Eclectic Emu? - can't really recall)
ADS 'Doll's Eyes' (Hazy on this one as well but seem to recall that zebras don't fly)
Radome Summat? (Just starting to make it up now)
Omega TAS Input (was actually my department)

To be fair it was fifteen years ago, I was mostly working in the map room and I've had a few careers since then...

[OmegaV6]

MD .. pretty good .. close enough to help out any baby eng having problems ....

now .. can you also do ..

EAT-A-PRUNE

and

FAAJIVEE

you will have also heard them a thousand times in the sim .... :)

[SVK]

Gentlemen,

Absolutely loving the thread and in a vain effort to stir the old brain cells after a few Saturday night sherbets, please allow me a stab at the mnemonics:

EATAP(R)UNE was the services/systems provided by bleed air and I would love to be corrected on the ones that I got wrong but here goes:

Eng Start
Anti Ice - Wings
T
ATM?
Pressurisation
(Radar Nose Bay Heating - though not in the later years)
Urinal Drains
Nacelle Pre-Heat
Empennage Anti Ice

Really wracking my brains for the 'T'!

FAAJIVEE was the systems directly connected to the BATT Bus:

Fire Extinguishing
AC External Power
Alarm Bells
Jump Lights
ISOL DC On BATT light
DC Voltmeter
Emergency Depressurisation
Emergency Lights

BANGGEARS/BANGGEARO eventually ended up as something like
BANGGREASED which I think went something like:

BATT BUS Tie Switch
Anti skid
Nacelle Pre heat
Gear manual release solenoid
GTC Door
Ramp and door control inhibited at the front.
Engines allowed into Ground idle limits?
ADS / ULLA release
SCNS TAS input?
Engine Condition Levers.
DIRCM

And keeping in the spirit of the theme, here's a couple more
GHOST - what comes off the engine accessory gearbox?
POSHBEEF/CODBEEF - when you pull a T-handle.

I can remember the mnemonic but I'm bugg£red if I can remember what they stood for.

[billynospares]

http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg6_zpsfac3619c.jpg flushed with success here's another 202 getting ready to do some parrot shooting

[ksimboy]

New buildings at Holtville since my last visit. Nice to see.

[CoffmanStarter]

Welcome to the Thread SVK :ok:

Grab yourself a standard NATO coffee and join in ;)

If you have any pics you'd like to share ... drop me a PM and I'll gladly help ... Billy is going great guns now he's got the hang of it :)

[billynospares]

Second pic not Holtville that was taken at Yuma

[billynospares]

On a roll now. Stop me if I am boring everyone. 214 in Cyprus and snoopy in Denmark http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/9F75833C-2F1A-4891-B745-DDD977A657AA_zpspsmzh0yf.jpg http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/AA3C7CCF-E03F-49AC-B6E5-72792C9D6B3B_zpscnd1qytn.jpg

[ancientaviator62]

No boredom here billy. Just keep those great pics coming. And of course any tales.

[billynospares]

http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg1_zps70279a15.jpg http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg11_zps2b9322da.jpg http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg8_zpsa87ced42.jpg finding these pics bit by bit

[OmegaV6]

SVK .. very close ... :) generally EATAPRUNE was

E - Engine Anti-Icing
A - ATM
T - Tail & Wing Anti-icing
A - Air Conditioning
P - Pressurisation
R - Radome Anti-Icing (later removed)
U - Urinal drains
N - Nacelle Preheat
E - Engine Start

GHOST - Gearbox Accessories

G - Generator (AC)
H - Hydraulic Pump
O - Oil Pump & Filter
S - Starter Motor
T - TachoGenerator (2 pads)

:)

Might be a bit rusty on these .. POSHBEEF - Engine T - Handle functions ..

P - Propellor Feathered
O - Oil shutoff
S - Starter inhibited
H - Hydraulics shutoff
B - Bleedair shutoff
E - Extinguisher Valves positioned
E - Extinguisher armed
F - Fuel shutoff

CODBEEF - GTC T Handle

C - Conditioning off (or was it Control Circuits isolated ) ??
O - Oil shutoff
D - Door inhibited
B - Bleedair shutoff
E - Extinguisher valves positioned
E - Extinguisher armed
F - Fuel shutoff


I think ........ :)

[ksimboy]

All those mnemonics I overheard in the sim, and constantly ignored lol. Fun times indeed

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/U2AKRO_zps121ef1da.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/U2AKRO_zps121ef1da.jpg.html)

The handwritten caption says all but not quite all.
We were on our way to Akrotiri in a 'K' on the infamous 'red eye' special when we were told to divert to Cairo ! Not enough go juice we said so they told us to land at Larnaca and phone Akro ops. So we did. Turned out that Akrotiri's runway had been 'blacked' by one of the returning a/c pictured above. A very stiff crosswind has seen him run out of directional control and the a/c was damaged.
So we waited at Larnaca for several hours whilst they cleared the runway and we were given the nod to fly to Akrotiri.

[WE992]

Is that a captain by the name of A......... H......... in the flying suit on the right walking back towards the tail of 202?

[dragartist]

I thought the same 992. Also recognise the wonky eyed PJI running up the rear. Must have been AH last Az Det.


We often used to share an aircraft between AD out of Laguna and para at El Centro (Hotville DZ) or even up at CL depending upon various factors.


Talk of Hotville, I did not care much for many of the PJIs but I had a lot of respect for Papa Smurf every time he got the chance to go to Hotville he arranged a Service of Remembrance for a group of his colleagues killed in a para acc some years ago. I think the young SR took on this mantle when PS retired.


I have some similar pics from the wet film era somewhere. I will need to check if the GEs had been properly trained by Smuge to get the props lined up. Clearly another example of standards being eroded in time! Cameras were frowned upon after 9/11.

[ExAscoteer]

AA62 (I remember you being Loadie Leader on Dirty Firty - though I don't think we ever flew together).

Do you have any detail shots of the area post 245?

I am attempting to build a model of Albert but I am rather bereft of knowledge about the Op End!

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCSEATS0002_zps75f09f32.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCSEATS0002_zps75f09f32.jpg.html)

Ex Ascoteer,
in previous posts there are a few pics of the a/c aft of FS245. I will hunt around to see if I can find any more. I am sure some of our loyal readers have some somewhere. This is a close up of a few of the seats and the eventual 'home' of the pax LSJs.
Yes I was the ALM Leader on 30 for a record breaking eight years !
Which kit are you making you model from ?

[ExAscoteer]

It's the Aifix re-pop of the Italieri kit, but with a number of corrections (resin engines for eg).

[billynospares]

That was indeed a captain by the name of A##### H##### and I think it was his last Az det. Experienced crew on that many a tail told during happy hour I can tell you

[dragartist]

Billy,
I was at the HOUE doing some work on the J on AH last day flying. he was mighty upset at his last mission flying orbits for hours on end with some GPS tracking device which he intended to pass to the "customer" with a note.


I hope they gave him a good send off that night.


ExAscot- I feel certain the last male TCO from JADTEU made a highly detailed sectioned model of the inside of the K. He now operates from a depot down in Gosport. He was at the reunion earlier this year so the AO should be able to contact him.

[ancientaviator62]

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCMODEL0002_zpse68d6359.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCMODEL0002_zpse68d6359.jpg.html)
This is the Airfix model I made for my grandson a long time ago. However in my absence his father decided to paint it in the colours you see!
Airfix took their measurements etc from a 'K' in the hangar at Fairford which was on jacks. So accurate was this that they even included the nose jacking pads in the early kits !

[ExAscoteer]

Don't let Smuj see those props!

[aeroid]

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l144/wol130/mat4003_zps693241fb.jpg
Sorry to break the thread but found this, sunbathing in Alice Springs ...thanks to Jim! with my Co-p, the future Stn Cdr Lyn, I.C. Where did I go wrong!

[ancientaviator62]

aeroid,
nice pic. I too went to Alice Springs but I cannot remember why.
Ah yes I.C known to the troops as 'junior' !

[smujsmith]

Never fear on the prop positions lads, I'm reliably informed that from an RAF perspective, it was down to OC Eng preference as much as anything else. A****r H****y is another matter. I enjoyed several routes with the man, and had the utmost respect for him. He gave up a free day in Hong Kong to show Smudge round the place, and not the bars. I've recently read a book on Hunter operations in Aden ? And, Lo and behold both in the text and in a photograph, a young A****r is present. Back soon hopefully gentlemen, keep the props straight ( we don't want to upset OC Eng) and the pictures coming.

Smudge:ok:

[Rocket2]

For info AH is very much alive & kicking - see him regularly - great guy

[CoffmanStarter]

AA62, ExAscoteer ... I hope you don't mind if I add to your scale model references above :ok:

Unfortunately my modelling ability plateaued very quickly ... but there is something about these miniature masterpieces that is quite captivating. Here are a couple of examples I came across today (I wish I was that talented) ... all 1/72 scale ... although I noticed someone was having a crack at a 1/48 scale subject :eek:

The first pic might also be of interest to our good friend Descend to What Height (aka DTWH) ;)

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/g06261_9176226_zps69c2ebd0.jpg

Image Credit : See URL Below (More Pics)

Lockheed C-130K Hercules W.MK2 Britmodeller.com (http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/58842-lockheed-c-130k-hercules-wmk2-snoopy-meteorological-research-flight/)

And your favourite colour scheme AA62 :ok:

Although I'm not quite sure about lugging Bloodhound Missiles around in the back of Albert :confused:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/Herc10_zpscd3b6119.jpg

Image Credit : See URL Below (More Pics)

RAF C-130K Hercules Britmodeller.com (http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234917449-raf-c-130-hercules/)

Best regards ...

Coff.

PS. Sadly I'm unable to give named credit to the skilled modellers who's work appears above so, in the circumstances, I have done my best to credit their work with the references given.

[DCThumb]

I was at Cambridge the other day - Poor old Snoopy was looking very forelorn and lonely, with the 'Red nose Day' radome fitted in place of its meteorological protuberance :(

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
the 'missiles round the back' are an authentic touch. They were included with the first Airfix RAF Hercules model. It is of course a Bloodhound on the transit trailer. Carried several of these (one at a time !) out Butterworth and back and also to Germany.

[Fugazi1000]

The first entry in my Father's logbook shows Bloodhounds from West Raynham to Laarbruch in 1972. He was UKMAMS.

Fascinating thread chaps - keep it up....

[billynospares]

http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg7_zpsb7399da5.jpg. http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/66110AF0-5FD9-4217-8E55-37EFC55A41E0_zpsgyn58c5d.jpg. Keep finding them. XV202 again and the 10 was about to give us gas so Albert related

[OmegaV6]

One almost identical to Billy's ..

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/57/03vc10nl0.jpg

and from another perspective ...

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/73/22vc10dr2.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/57/07basketzo1.jpg

[OmegaV6]

3 from the Arnhem 2003 commemoration airdrops, amazing how many folks there were on the ground to watch the para drop

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/913/S7Lc0n.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/540/xW4Ick.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/673/eHsWFF.jpg

[OmegaV6]

Made a "little" work for smudge and his associates in my time .. although I don't think he was actually involved in either of these .. both are birdstrikes in the Falklands on separate detachments ....

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/913/NWXhwc.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/673/nXv1ZG.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/537/StvO6s.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/540/pt9ntg.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/661/HhlYrT.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/540/PPWgEj.jpg

[OmegaV6]

AA might recognise some of these motley lot ... Laikipia (Kenya) 2001

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/905/j7z1RA.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/538/zZVEmi.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/540/aXKZZe.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/538/mCeR88.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/913/7klbg8.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/537/ACsuEO.jpg

I should have more of here, and a very bent Albert, but can't find them yet ...

[OmegaV6]

and lastly for today .. if you think that Oman is always hot and sunny .... Thumrait May 2002 ...

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/633/vg27AK.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/913/soltvk.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/538/w7aZOd.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/540/VAnBG7.jpg

This last one is the "remains" of the tented washing/showering area after the storm .. I don't have a before to show ......

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/673/RlFlwW.jpg

As an aside, all the Hercs were "flown out" before the storm came, if memory serves most went down to Diego Garcia, in order to avoid damage. good decision !!! It was NOT nice at all ...

[CoffmanStarter]

Many thanks OmegaV6 ... Outstanding pics :D

One thing very clear from the pics at #2295 ... Albert was/is a tough old bird who could take a fair degree of punishment but still deliver ;)

[CoffmanStarter]

Billy ... Great pics also ... Please keep them coming :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Did several Arnhem drops and as Omega points out there was always a large crowd watching. I remember one year dropping the TA in winds that were to say the least marginal. However everyone was so keen the drop went ahead anyway.
Doing para drops in a Skyvan in the Oman we landed on the DZ to emplane the next lift. As we waited a 'ginormous 'storm appeared from out of the sea. So we sat there with engines running being battered by the strong wind and torrential rain. Interesting experience !

[ancientaviator62]

Fugazi,
was sat in the a/c waiting for the 'sharp end' to arrive. A/c is role 19a (clear floor) with side seats as we are going to Finningley to give the students a bit of Herc experience. Captain turns up says it has all been changed we are off to West Raynham to pick up a Bloodhound to take to Germany.
At this time they were transported on pallets so the role fit was full side guidance etc. I suggested to the Captain that he point this out to Ops. He does so only to be told basically 'get on with it'. So we get to Raynham and the fertiliser hits the rotating cooling device. We are of course not correctly roled for the task.
We, the crew, are also fireproof ! So back we go, empty. to Lyneham.
We never did get to Finningley.

[Fugazi1000]

aa62,

Reading through the logbook - there seems to have been no shortage of Lyneham - West Raynham - RAFG trips throughout the '70s. I suspect an abortive attempt was no biggie.

I do see the Belfast getting in on the act too. More than a few Bloodhounds in one go?

[CoffmanStarter]

A quick side question if I may AA62 :ok:

With 65 Squadron based at RAF Seletar in the late 60's, was Albert used to rotate/service our Bloodhounds based out in the Far East ?

I guess pics of Albert with Bloodhound 'cargo' are going to be quite rare even these days.

Best ...

Coff.

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
my first Bloodhound rotation was in XV 213 on the 13 June 1968 from Butterworth to Lyneham. So you can see that from the outset the 'K' was doing these type of tasks.
Fugazi, I do not know if you served in the RAF but believe me cock ups like the one I described were not taken lightly and could generate a huge blame game.
Hence our call to Ops. Otherwise we could easily have been the fall guys.

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks AA62 ... Yet another example of the scale associated with military logistics and Albert's crucial role during the 60+ years we had the C-130K ;)

[November4]

Fugazi1000

This site (http://rafmams.co.uk/)might be interest to you or your father

[The Claw]

I hope this works ;-)

http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG-3.jpg

[CoffmanStarter]

Welcome TC :ok:

Do you have a location for Albert in that pic ?

[Fugazi1000]

aa62,
My Father served 25+ years, I never did, but spent 16 years as a Scaley Brat. I suppose the blame game happened further up the pole with the officers rather than NCOs and other ranks.

November4,
Thanks for the link - sadly my father has passed away, but I did find him on Advanced Course No. 3 - when still a corporal - and have just realised he must have finished the course and got the family's first Lyneham posting because that's when his logbook shows his first trip - Lyneham to West Raynham...

XV176 - The first delivery to the RAF of the Hercules? Who actually painted the aircraft? Lockheed factory or the RAF after receipt?

[smujsmith]

Claw,

Stunning shot of a naked Albert, is it allowed on prune ? Meanwhile 297 relaxes after its B/F while my fellow GE and myself attend to hydraulic problems on the Thai 747. A simple matter of tightening hydraulic unions on No3 engine pump. We were rewarded with packs of Thai Airways cards. I remember changing a brake unit on a civilian aircraft at Gander some months later, and receiving a more lucrative remuneration. Our crew enjoyed some time on board the big beast whilst we laboured. For those who worry, we departed on schedule, sober!

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b572/smujsmith/54d94a3cd8221d15ddc0dfc42b28edb4_zpsf5fc3008.jpg

Smudge:ok:

Fugazi,

The aircraft were delivered "naked" and painted by Marshalls of Cambridge (the Lockheed designated Engineering authority). I'm sure AA62 might have seen an unpainted K.

[ancientaviator62]

Fugazi,
the 'system's' objective in the 'blame game' is to find a culprit as far down the food chain as possible. This would then keep the noses of those above clean.
Smudge,
yes saw several shiny new 'K' models, but my dim memory seems to recall XV 179 as the first one I saw when it arrived at Colerne. We Hastings chaps had a very good look over our future. For an AQM (as we were then) it was the great leap forward. Level floor (no more struggling to get vehicles in round the side cargo door) lots of tie down points and an electric cargo winch. And many other benefits.

[Double Hydco]

Does anyone know the crew of the first Hercules delivery to the RAF?

Back in the mid-1980's my ATC squadron enjoyed the services of Wing Commander Mel Bennett. He had flown Sunderland's and Beverly's in the Far East, and I seem to recall was involved with the K in the early days, possibly doing the first delivery flight?

DH

[Brian 48nav]

According to Andy Muniandy's book, Hercules The RAF Workhorse, Mel Bennett was the skipper with Dave Wright as co, Nav' Cyril Loughheed, Eng' Fred Pennycott and AQM John Sutton.

[ancientaviator62]

DH,
when I was on 47 Sqn at Faiford in 1968 Mel Bennett was OC Ops. He was the captain of the (in)famous Westabout flight that saw them get to McClellan AFB on day one AFTER a delay out of Fairford ! One of the Station MOs, Doc Cassidy, was on the crew. Terrific character was Doc, as amongst other things your Class One Medical cost a bottle of scotch.

[ancientaviator62]

Brian,
I recall all of those chaps except the Navigator. I was too low on the totem pole to do the 'State's Course alas.

[Double Hydco]

Thanks AA62 and Brian....

Obviously I have no idea what Mel was like as a boss, but as a member of staff at our local ATC unit he was someone to really look up to. At that time he'd recently returned to the UK after flying the B707 for Royal Jordanian.

Sadly he passed away a few years ago, but I still have fond memories of doing aeros with him in an AEF Chipmunk over the Norfolk coast when we summer camped at Coltishall.

AA62, re the Westabout to McClellan - I guess flight time limitations in those days were more liberal in the late 1960's?

[brakedwell]

AA62, re the Westabout to McClellan - I guess flight time limitations in those days were more liberal in the late 1960's?

Max flight duty time in those days, regardless of start time or location, was 19hours + discretion IIRC!

[The Claw]

http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0004.jpg
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0008.jpg
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0007.jpg
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0012copy.jpg
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0005.jpg
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0006.jpg
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0013.jpg

[The Claw]

http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa434/paulsphoto1/IMG_0014copy.jpg

[The Claw]

Welcome TC

Do you have a location for Albert in that pic ?

The USA prior to delivery.

[aeroid]

Initially each crew, on completion of the conversion course with USAF was screened on the delivery flight from Marietta Georgia via Bermuda and Lajes to Marshalls of Cambridge for painting, modding etc. Eventually we had 4 crews based at Lyneham tasked with ferry flights from Lockheed.

[WIDN62]

That is the Lockheed factory at Marietta.

[CoffmanStarter]

Time to get your Log Books out Gentlemen for this one :ok:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/IMG_0996_zps6b1994d9.jpg

Image Credit : MOD RAF : Air Historical Branch

I came across this pic issued by the AHB and wondered if any of our Herc Thread Members were crew on this particular sortie. To help ... C.1s - XV192, XV196, XV205, XV211, apparently out of RAF Lyneham dated 21 Jul 1977.

Best ...

Coff.

PS. I did a quick check ... I don't think this one has been posted before ... no doubt AA62 will put my 'hat on straight' if I'm wrong :uhoh:

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
as far as I am concerbed your hat is safe. I was not on this photo trip but perhaps someone on this thresd was.

[ICM]

If that four was on 21 July 1977, I suggest that they were on return from a Full Rehearsal for the flypast at the Jubilee Review at Finningley on 29 July. (They had been joined by 10 Squadron's VC 10 XV108 for the join-up over the North Sea, and I have that flight in my logbook.)

[Yamagata ken]

Some nice USAAF photos including Hercules pron here:

100 Stunning Photos Of The US Air Force Operating Around Japan (http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/100-stunning-photos-of-the-us-air-force-operating-aroun-1680115870/1680499154/+pgeorge)

[Bengerman]

http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah104/bengerman1/OFFICEDESKTOP/001_zpsaaf2e104.jpg (http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/bengerman1/media/OFFICEDESKTOP/001_zpsaaf2e104.jpg.html)

Found this, appalling living conditions for crews at the ILCA during Op Bushell.

[Bengerman]

http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah104/bengerman1/OFFICEDESKTOP/MakeleRefugeeCamps001_zpsb0bc0b7e.jpg (http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/bengerman1/media/OFFICEDESKTOP/MakeleRefugeeCamps001_zpsb0bc0b7e.jpg.html)

I think this shot shows the camps for displaced people around Makele.

[WIDN62]

Questions:

Why do Ascoteers always drink around storm drains?
Why is the German captain ignoring the camera?
Doesn't Rick look thin?

[ksimboy]

WIDN ,
1. Because they can.
2. It's the Teutonic way.
3. Bloody hell yes!!:ok:

[ExAscoteer]

Is that a really young Obi Wan in that 'photo?

[condor17]

Brian 48nav , The Cyril Lougheed you mention as Nav . Did he have an illustrious later life as Nav tutor at CoAT Hamble trying to thump basic principles into the thick skulls of baby nigels ?
If so , a very good mate , having a rare moment of enlightenment ; managed to answer a ques. .....'' 3,000 ft per second Sir '' .
Cyril's , [ well we called him sir ] is still remembered after 43 years .
'' That Mr R+++ would have the flying properties of a brick '' .

ATB guys , and keep them coming ,

condor .

[CoffmanStarter]

Gentlemen it would appear that our PPRuNe Herc Thread has been picked up by the Secretary of the 24 Squadron Association who then kindly "Tweeted" the Link and mentioned us on their BLog (see below) :ok:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/ScreenShot2015-01-22at094427_zps618f37fa.jpg

Image Credit : 24 Squadron BLog

Many thanks to the Secretary :D

Returning the kindness ...

Here is the link for the 24 Squadron BLog along with the link for their active Twitter feed. Their BLog has been running for 8 years !!!

https://the24sec.wordpress.com

https://twitter.com/24SqnAssocSec

Quite a few interesting pics on their Twitter feed ...

Op Bushell adding to our previous pics from 1985.

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/B73HRDVIAAEKJ3jjpg-large_zpsd8be9514.jpg

Image Credit : MOD RAF : 24 Squadron Association (as best can be attributed)

10 Hercs in close formation ... any advance on 10 (with a pic) ?

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/B13D2_DIEAAhq2ejpg-large_zps91c2041a.jpg

Image Credit : 24 Squadron Association : Andy Muniandy (as best can be attributed)

Best ...

Coff.

[WASALOADIE]

I count 10 in the pic, plus the one where the pic was taken from so it must be 11!

[Bts70]

I can count 13 ......so it must be 14!

[ksimboy]

Wasn't there a 15 ship formation for IAT one year?

[Bengerman]

Yes there was..........

http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah104/bengerman1/OFFICEDESKTOP/IATFormation001_zps1df30775.jpg (http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/bengerman1/media/OFFICEDESKTOP/IATFormation001_zps1df30775.jpg.html)

[CoffmanStarter]

Many thanks Bengerman :ok:

A very impressive sight ... the sound from 60 T56-A-15s in unison ... awesome :D

[bi focals]

That's a very young and sylph like Bengerman drinking beer in Photo1.
Not at all like the one I went through Prestwick with.
Apart from the Beer that is.
:):)

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
I see the thread has now hit the 250000 mark. Amazing.
Pic (hope we have not had this before) is of Blenheim Palace as we await our turn to delight the punters at RIAT.http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCBLENHEIM0002_zps679f986a.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCBLENHEIM0002_zps679f986a.jpg.html)

[ksimboy]

Hope the Duke didn't complain about the fly past AA.

[ancientaviator62]

ksimboy,
I am sure the Duke would have counted himself fortunate to have witnessed such a sight !

[CoffmanStarter]

Good morning AA62 ...

Sorry I missed your post yesterday ... SWMBO had me tasked otherwise !

Yes 0.25M Hits with 2.3K Contributions over the 9 Months the Thread has been running ... Simply outstanding, and if I may say, a true reflection of the affection you all continue to hold for RAF Albert and the times you had together be it in the air flying or on the ground fixing him :ok:

I've said it before ... but it's been great to see old colleagues hook up along with some of the early crews joining in when RAF Albert had just entered service :D

Now I know there are a few members out there that are still sitting on pics ... as you have yet to take the plunge and post your first images using my "Quick Start Guide" ;)

I guess there will come a point where interest in the Thread may wane ... BUT if anyone has suggestions as to where we might take the Thread next PLEASE feel free to jump in and take the lead :ok:

I'd also like to thank some of our lead contributors for their interest and continued support ... AA62 and Smudge in particular :D:D:D:D

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/ScreenShot2015-01-24at083056_zps26efc363.png

Best wishes to all ...

Coff.

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
my pics are running out but one or two tales still to come. If we can encourage others to put up pics (Brian where art thou ?) and stories we may yet hit 300000 !
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m19/ancientaviator62/HERCTRISTAR0003_zpsc868b6f3.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/ancientaviator62/media/HERCTRISTAR0003_zpsc868b6f3.jpg.html)
This was taken during the practice for the post GW1 flypast. The two well known mudmovers can be seen at the bottom of the pic.

[10KTens]

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k147/hcm0908/img001_zpsff298fcc.jpg (http://s87.photobucket.com/user/hcm0908/media/img001_zpsff298fcc.jpg.html)

A bit too close to the Victor!

[kilwhang]

After prompting by AA 62 and help from Coff, I'm going to try and upload some of my depleted supply of pics......

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Guam77_zpsnpjaqyta-1.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Guam77_zpsnpjaqyta-1.jpg.html)

This is a 47 Sqn crew in Guam 1977 on an East-about. The crew (L to R) are:
Nav (Dougie M); Eng (myself); Capt (Dave C); Co; Loadie (Micky S); Nav; G/E; G/E.

If this works, I'll post some more.........

[CoffmanStarter]

Well played Kilwhang :D

Welcome to the Thread and looking forward to a few more pics :ok:

Best ...

Coff

[Dougie M]

I seem to remember a disabled stripper at the Hobo Bar in Guam and Sephie and myself having to help her with her crutches.(support variety). She didn't do much dancing but she had a good "mat finish".

[kilwhang]

Well remembered, Dougie. The other stripper was billed as 'Lady Ponsonby-Smythe from England'.
When we questioned her, it turned that she was, indeed, English and that her father had been a Flt Lt at RAF Yatesbury...........

[kilwhang]

I was lucky enough to be on the crew of Volant Rodeo '81. This picture shows C130's lined up at Pope AFB on the first morning of competition.

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/VR013_zps45cky4nl-1.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/VR013_zps45cky4nl-1.jpg.html)

[Dougie M]

Ah Lady Jane.
That was a voyage of quite a few incidents and anecdotes which somehow slipped inclusion in the memoires. Must rewrite again.
Thanks Coff for resurrecting a lot of pics and material from the crypt.

[Alison Conway]

Dougie M/Kilwhang

I was lucky enough to be one of the engs on a global which went through Guam. The current SMO had blagged his way on to the trip to "study crew fatigue". He never studied anything when we were airborne as he was always asleep having gone out with us in the evening. At Guam I was at a table with him and Mick Bedford (our Loadie) when the stripper appeared on roller boots! Needles to say we were impressed the Doc muttered something about skin tone, but couldn't speak properly as his tongue was dragging on the floor. She performed some amazing manoeuvres on the rollers but then did something for which Mick could never forgive her. She at this juncture was starkers, and was rolling backwards whilst holding her ankles. Shall we say that Mick was impressed that she winked at him, but then lost his cool when she over-estimate distances and crashed into our table! The place fell about laughing and hooting but Mick was really upset........she had knocked his beer over!!!!!!

[Brian W May]

Here Coff, just one detail on your list . . .

Dengue_Dude and I are one . . .

It has been so good to see folks here that were so much a part of all our lives at Lyneham.

All good stuff.

[CoffmanStarter]

Yep ... Got that Brian ... It's just that the PPRuNe Metrics Page isn't that sophisticated :uhoh:

Glad everyone is still enjoying the stories and pics :ok:

[DCThumb]

Does anyone else remember the year that Fairford were celebrating a Hercules anniversary and were trying to get that number of aircraft on static. As I recall, they found that they were going to be several short so the duty working crew spent a couple of days ferrying frames over to be part of the static......only for a last minute push (Mogadishu?) to arise whereupon we had to retrieve said airframes!!

If it was Mogadishu, I remember being crew 2 or 3 - paxing with 100 odd other crew members as far as Dar ex Salaam and picking up the first airframe as it came out of Mogadishu to return it to Cyprus......only thing was by then the Americans had offered a C5 which took the entire slip pattern of freight in one!!!

I think one crew who ate out in Dar Es Salaam ended up in Wroughton on their return...

I'm sure someone can add more detail!!!M

[billynospares]

http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/imagejpg9_zps40ed8416.jpg found another pic. The sound and smoke of freedom coming to pick me up :ok:

[10KTens]

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k147/hcm0908/img004_zpsfb8d6400.jpg (http://s87.photobucket.com/user/hcm0908/media/img004_zpsfb8d6400.jpg.html)
Pink Hercules trial.

[smujsmith]

Kilwhang,

Didn't Dougie M wear well. I have several good pictures of the man himself, on a route I shared with him, many years after your experience (8 - 20 Oct 94). By then he had given up strippers, and confined himself to trekking in the Jungles of Borneo with the hash house harriers (as a means of acquiring a beer or three). It's also worthy of note that your photograph, in 77 was only three years after we parted company as fellow Jnr Techs at Akrotiri, I was still struggling to become a Cpl. Good photo though. Now, we need Gopher 01 to tell us who your two GEs were, certainly his era, he's an old gentleman you know. I wonder also if you ever shared a trip with a certain Al B, our ex Sgt, Hydraulic Bay, who I believe was the S&D GE around your time. Keep the pictures coming, I for one can't get enough of the light stone/Dark earth finish.

DC Thumb, do you have a year for that "Mogadishu" Jobby ? Could it have been the lift in to Kigale (July/August 94) through Dar Es Salaam ? It has memories for me. With your description of an early return to UK, it sounds very similar to the Kigale job.

Smudge:ok:

[DCThumb]

Smuj, it could well have been Kigale - Africa all looks the same! Trawling through the logbook I see June 29 1994 - Lye to Fairford (DWC IAT Static) followed by Aug 1 Dar Es salaam to Akronelli (Op Gabriel) with a note "Cargo pack fail - 8 hours on O2!)

[CoffmanStarter]

Good to have you back Smudge :ok:

[smujsmith]

DCThumb,

That all ties in, my records show the Kigale fracas as lasting from July 31 - August 9 1994. And what an interesting :ugh: experience it was. My last year as a GE and the boss sends for me one day and says, I want you to organise an Eng Det. The job was to support a stream of frames, trucking through Akrotiri to Dar Es Salaam (DES), there to fly troops equipment and supplies to Kigale, where the Hootoo's had recently been chopping up Tootoos, or vice versa. Unusually, instead of just telling me to go book out a ranger pack, I was told to sort out the engineering requirements for a major through flow of Lynehams finest, I ask your perseverance now fellow posters, it's a story that exposes every mistake that can be made in a couple of weeks of Albert operations, at many levels.

So, the engineering side was pre ordained, 6 GEs, to accompany the aircraft in and out of Kigale from DES, and, the bonus of around 12 Lyneham Line technicians, the worlds finest, to handle the aircraft through DES. Equipment, as I requested, was agreed, with the exception of two spare mainwheels and a nose wheel set, I was told vetoed by OC Eng on weight grounds. Whilst working out what we needed, I had had a look at the situation at Kigale airport, which had experienced a large guerrilla war, and was likely to offer plenty of FOD to deal with. Anyway, OC Eng 1 - Smudge 0. Oh, just as I was getting a bit big for my Chf Tech Boots, I was told that a recently arrived young lady JENGO would be I/C the Engineering Det. My final restriction being that whilst I was to arrange the GE tasking from DES to Kigale and return, I was not to personally accompany an aircraft to Kigale, my job was on the ground at DES.

So, like DC Thumb I spent a night in the back of a packed Albert, it may have been the same aircraft, to arrive at Akronelli around 1000 local. A certain Mr M*** L***y was incumbent at the time, and invited us all to his married quarter for the afternoon. Having loaded up with Keo, we enjoyed his and Michelle's hospitality and after a kebab had an early night for departure early next day. And off we went.

The slip through DES ran well, we were accommodated in a good hotel down town, and with crews slipping through mostly being familiar faces, some good nights were enjoyed. The lads from the line worked bloody hard to try and keep the flow going, and in consultation with Captains and Engineers, my Red and Green pens were put to good use. The first problem was the very attractive young lady Officer who led us. She saw no reason why field type operations should be undertaken on this job, and I spent quite a lot of my working day arguing the toss. My opinion and experience, backed by Captains and Engineers, counted for nothing when compared to the vast knowledge she carried from Cranditz. Now, as Dougie M might say, we come to the tragic bit. As DC Thumb recalled, the whole shebang was cut short because the USAF offered to do the whole thing with those big jet things. So, I, a GE first and foremost, was not to be denied my trip to Kigale before endex, and duly disobeyed my boss and allocated myself as GE on one of the last trips. On arrival, I had a walk around the parking bay, and half filled a poly bag (usually used for water seds, if you know you know) with various shrapnel. Bullets, grenade fragments you name it, I thought OC eng might appreciate the souvineer. My return to DES was horrific, an aircraft that should have been North bound sat on the pan with the RH MLG door raised. I asked, and couldn't believe the response. Our good looking JENGO had grounded the aircraft because the RH rear tyre was worn to (not beyond) limits. She had even used the (very expensive) sat com to order Lyneham to send a spare tyre (not wheel) so that she could organise a civilian company to replace it. Total turn round time, about a week. I stopped the lads taking the wheel off and contacted the Captain of the crew due to fly this one to Akrotiri, and a tyre change. Being already delayed, the Irishman (we'll call him Tim) brought the crew to the airfield, ready to fly. He, his Eng and myself discussed the problem. It was agreed that the empty aircraft would be flown North with a green line for one flight only, intended to be Akrotiri, where the wheel would be changed. Our JENGO was full of fury as Tim, and Albert, departed northbound. Over the next couple of days we slipped the Eng det back to Lyneham as the flow reduced, leaving myself and a fellow GE to "mop up" and return home on the last aircraft. Our chariot duly arrived, and on shutdown we were a little surprised to see that the No2 witches tit had departed during the transit from Akrotiri. It only took 24 hours to have a new one delivered via a BA 747, and we were good to go as they say.

Arriving back at Lyneham, my boss the SAGE (Senior Aircraft Ground Engineer) seen in a previous photograph, posing with Dougie M in Rhodesia, informed me that I was to write an Eng detachment report for OC Eng, as our JENGO hadn't the experience to do so. In the process of writing that I also saw the funny side of it all and wrote a story which I submitted to the Globe. The young fellow known as Guy (you may remember him) duly published the report under the title Goldilocks and the Three Bears, must have been Sept/Oct 94 issue. Well, I was paying a hats on visit to OC Eng before the ink was dry, as they say. He was not amused. He had denied us spare wheels, I had failed to obey orders and remain at DES, and the young JENGO had no bloody idea what she was doing. From an engineering point of view, a real bag of worms, but, having grown up on "I learnt about flying from that", I'm sure that we all learned about supporting Albert a little better. If anyone still has a copy of the Globe with my story in it, I would love to see it again, my copy has long since disappeared. My next submission to the Globe led to a visit to the Station Commander, and not for tea and biscuits. Sorry for the long missive all, I hope it was worth the read.

Coff, thanks, nice to see plenty activity again.

Smudge:ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Welcome to the Thread 10KTens :ok:

[10KTens]

Thanks for the welcome Coff. I have only found a couple of photographs but I'll look for more.

[kilwhang]

During Op Corporate, while the UK fleet was in transit between the UK and Ascension Island, there was a massive flying programme designed to get as much kit as possible to the island.
At LYN nearly all training was cancelled and OCU crews got a chance to do some 'real' work.
I was on the staff at STS and here we are on Ascension.

Ignoring my rather unfortunate pose, the rest of the crew are:
Pete B (Boss of STS); Henry P; 'Yanto' T; and Bert H.

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/ascension_zpsozlt2y3e-1.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/ascension_zpsozlt2y3e-1.jpg.html)

A few weeks later some a/c were fitted with Long Range tanks, and others with probes. Things became quite busy at STS.

[smujsmith]

Long range tanks and probes Kilwhang. There has to be some background on that. STS return to their role, rather than route support etc. Having seen the efforts made to facilitate the Black Buck missions with IFR, I'm sure the introduction of IFR to Albert must carry some interest on the thread. If you have the time, any recollections from that period would be welcome. We won't mention "the pose":eek:

Smudge:ok:

[fergineer]

Kilwhangwhy are you holding onto your parts mate?

[ancientaviator62]

Ah STS (Support Traning Squadron) known in my time as TSF (Transport Support Flight) and then TSTF (Transport Support Training Flight) before settling on STS. All part of 242 OCU but trained crews in airdrop. At the time the Falklands was brewing up I was with the Group EU ('trappers'). Some of my early posts with pics have referred to our Op Corporate activities.

[Dougie M]

After being involved with the Tactical side of Lyneham for all my time there, and having had two tours on the instructional and examination unit, there have been many three or four letter abbreviations (TLAs and FLAs) for the best kept secret on the station. As a squadron the STS headquarters encompassed one of the best party facilities on the base and was far enough away from the OCU to be semi autonomous. All tragically brought to an end when it was dragged screaming and protesting across the airfield to "Jurassic" by an antipodean boss bent on getting the OCU under one roof. This was not to last. All OCU squadrons became flights and the saddest thing was eventually to be Ops O on the much reduced TTF - which in earlier times was the TLA for the tanker training flight - in the old 24/30 building because those squadrons had taken over Jurassic with the "mighty J model".
Ozymandias

[ancientaviator62]

Dougie,
yes STS/TTF was 'over the other side' in more ways than one and seldom visited by those in the corridors of power on the OCU. Given my affinity with airdrop when I was the CALMI I tried to spend as much time there as a welcome escape from the inevitable clerking in my office.

[kilwhang]

I'll try and give you a comprehensive reply Smuj.........

I was on STS from '80 - '82. As Dougie has said, we were in a great building close to the Hilmarton gate.
The unit consisted of; 3 pilots (including the boss), 2 Navs, 1 Air Eng, 3 Loadies, 2 PJIs and a small admin staff.
Our main job was to run Tactical Support (TS) Courses for the crews of 47 & 70 Sqns. The course consisted of teaching low-level flying and air drop techniques. It was quite an intense course, particularly for the Loadies, but it was great fun.
The course ended with a 3 day Scottac to, either, Kinloss or Lossie (very occasionally MAC).
We would take a Land Rover on the aircraft and, on the final dropping day, I would drive off into the wilds of the Moray grouse moors. There I would lay out a basic 3-panel DZ and wait for my lunch to be delivered.
I must have spent hundreds of hours at low-level and enjoyed nearly all of it. And, no, I'm not going to tell you about the bit I didn't enjoy!

As well as the course, there had to be periodic checks carried out on all crew members, except the Air Eng - who only had to complete the course. This is the reason I was the only Eng on the staff.

We did the occasional route trip, to keep in practice, and normally picked up a 5 or 6 day trip to somewhere nice. Sometimes, I was unable to fit that in - so I would give my place away to the guys in the sim.......who didn't get out much :)

We, also, ran ad-hoc courses for 47 SF and carried out trials on the 1st generation NVGs.

SKE (Station Keeping Equipment) was another challenge. SKE was a piece of kit that allowed up to 4 aircraft to fly at low level in formation.

As an added bonus, I was the standby Eng for JATE and got the opportunity to fly with them now and again. I vividly remember doing 4 or 5 ULLA trips - very exhilarating.

Then came Op Corporate...........

As the fleet moved south of Ascension, it quickly became obvious that the range/payload equation was going to be a big problem.
The first solution was to fit 4 Andover long range tanks, in pairs, in the freight bay. A metal box containing 2 fuel boost pumps was included and suitable plumbing was fitted to allow fuel from the tanks to get to the x-feed manifold. As you can imagine, this didn't leave much room for payload and it was obvious this could only be a temporary solution.
We devised a one-day course to qualify crews on this fit.

Next came the brilliant idea of fitting a probe for Air-to-Air Refuelling. After the first probe was fitted, the aircraft went to Boscombe for trials and I believe the first 2 crews (Capts Harry B and Max R) were trained there.

Further a/c were fitted with probes and the training was given to STS.
To give you an idea of how basic (and clever) this mod was, initially the AAR was controlled from down the back. The a/c refuelling panel (aft of the stbd wheel well) was simply turned around to face inboard (yes I know there were pressure hull issues - I'm trying to keep it simple).
This was less than ideal so, very soon, another refuelling panel was fitted at the Air Eng's station.

As you can imagine, the training schedule was hectic because of the need to get as many crews trained as possible. One of the problems was getting tankers. The Victors were heavily committed down South, so we had to use Vulcan tankers also. Plugging in behind a Vulcan was a wonderful sight.

Not long afterwards, someone came up with the idea of fitting a Hose Drum Unit (HDU) to the a/c with the long range tanks. The C130 Tanker was born.

Initially, we did that training as well but it was obvious, with the re-introduction of the TS courses, that we were short staffed. The tanker training became a separate entity.

I can honestly say that my time on STS was one of the best jobs I've had in aviation - Service or civilian.

Now, I know you are going to say 'where are the pictures?' Unfortunately, in '92 I went through a 'major domestic upheaval' and they were lost.

If you are still awake Smuj, I've done my best to be accurate but this all happened a long time ago, and I left the fleet in '88.

[kilwhang]

Fergie,

When in deep thought, some people scratch their heads. Others.........:)

[CoffmanStarter]

Kilwhang ...

Plugging in behind a Vulcan was a wonderful sight.

I've posted this before ... But some little while back I had the great privilege to share a coffee and chat with Pontifex who is a PPRuNe regular ... I'm sure he won't mind me posting this remarkable pic again. He was the lead TP flying Albert during the AAR trials at Boscombe Down. He might just pitch-up with a bit more to tell :ok:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/image_zpsad5dbc0a.jpg

Best ...

Coff.

[Dougie M]

It COULD be that Kilwhang was doing a kit check after remembering THAT Eastabout because the story continues.
As we sat in the coffee lounge in the Ops Dispatch building at Anderson Air Base in Guam a clerk came out and asked if we could take a "space available" indulgence pax to the States. On hearing that the pax was U.S. Navy Dave C. our skipper, said that we had an exchange agreement with the U.S. Air Force but not the Navy.
Seconds later a very well set up U.S. Wren appeared at our table in full No1 whites. She must have been from Devizes because her left breast was covered in awards and medal ribbons and her right one had just a couple of gold badges.
"Who is Captain Ascot here?" she said. Dave C very bravely said "That would be me."
"Why are you so ****ty to the Navy?" she demanded "I need to get home for my wedding!"
So that's how we ended up in Hawaii with our own imported totty. After several margaritas she even started to look attractive. Whilst sunbathing at the pool though it was obvious that she was a disciple of Archbishop Makarios which was rather off putting but we carried her on to Sacramento where she went home to her unsuspecting fiance. We thought about sending a card saying "Thanks for everything, Captain Ascot and the boys" but she may have hunted us down cos she'd seen the squadron badges. The memory also made me very protective of the jewels for some time afterwards.

[ancientaviator62]

I joined TSF in 1972 from 48 now in the UK. From there I went to JATE and then to the Group EU. So I was in at the start of the Lyneham airdrop training once it all had moved up from Thorney Island. And then we had JATFOR which has been described in some detail in earlier threads.
Anyone remember the Nicosia TS training detachments ?

[dragartist]

I am enjoying this latest round of stories.


I hope not to break any Prune rules and will try and keep this short. I was Lyneham way a few weeks back at an Aunts funeral. Her husband died several years back. His last posting was as supply officer at Lyneham. Gave me a chance to catch up with my cousins on my mothers side. One of my cousins mentioned her uncle by marriage on her Fathers side. One Peter Walker. Sqn Ldr or Wg Cdr Pilot on Hercs at LYN. He retired early 80s and went to Laker so I never new him from my Herc exploits post 95 through 2011


Accordingly he has many stories to tell. Perhaps he even participates in this forum. If not I wished to contact him and invite him to participate in this living history. I have a postal address for him not far from Brighton. Thought I would try this first as he may be known to you folks. I would have met him at another uncles funeral in early 90s in my Nimrod days.

[Brian W May]

There was one Sqn Ldr Peter Walker on 30 Sqn mid to late 70s (pilot), so it might be he . . .

[ancientaviator62]

When I first joined TSF as an airdrop instructor we used to take the courses away in the winter to Nicosia for low level and para training. This was always a very welcome exercise for many reasons.
On one of the dtachments I was asked if we could arrange to give some of the resident British Army soldiers a flight. It was arranged that the RSM would go first and he flew on a LLXC and was a very happy chappie as he spent all the trip on the flight deck. His soldiers soon followed on subsequent trips.
We the NCO Aircrew were usually invited to the army mess for drinks afterwards.
One day the RSM mentioned the fact that he would be absent but that we could still use their mess bar. Normally the bar could not be opened until he was present and declared it open. However he had briefed the barman that I (a very newly promoted MACR) could deputise for him. So that is what I did concious of the honour and the trust !
Happy days.

[Brian W May]

That's funny about the RSM thing.

Whilst I was at Wyton I had to do a course down at Ashford. Went in the bar and they were all stood about like spare Richards at a wedding.

So I went to the bar and ordered a beer (it was after the published opening time). The barman muttered something about the RSM not being present, so I encouraged him to do as I'd asked and give me a beer - NOW was good for me.

Standing, leaning against the bar and sipping my pint, I noticed it all go quiet behind me and then a 'presence' beside me. The guy was huge! He asked me who I was (I was in civvies) so I replied 'Master Engineer Brian May' and he obviously hadn't got a clue what that meant.

He then said 'What rank is that?' so I said 'Same as you', then added I was also CMC of the Sergeants' Mess at Wyton. I offered him a beer - that said, his and another one for me arrived almost immediately - his shout.

I could sense the disappointment behind me when it was 'expected' this Crab was going to get his'. Turns out I was also senior too (he checked ever so subtley).

He was a really nice guy, however I would think it would have been a slightly different outcome had I been a different rank. I've always found being aircrew quite fun . . . never had to wait all the time I was there.

Strange customs . . .

[mr ripley]

Smuj,
That brings back memories. I seem to remember that we had more crews than aircraft and it was a bit of a bun fight to fly.
The flight across the Serengeti and the view of Kilimanjaro were amazing.
Kigali was interesting, I believe one of the cos was going for a pee near the tower and had to be stopped because he was going into a minefield where to local dogs had been blown up recently.

What I remember the most was the trip back. Albert was full of crews stretched to, in hammocks, in fact in all sorts of places. One aircraft went direct to Cyprus and we dropped into Jeddah to pick up some GEs then arrived at Akrotiri for an expected quick turn round with the slip crews in place.
However the movers had other ideas and we were sent for brekky and the aircraft were loaded with cars.
I seem to believe there was a near mutiny. When we finally got on a few hours later there was hardly any room at all.

I wouldn't believe any stories about cars having flat batteries and the odd unfortunate scratch.

What I would say that there weren't any mythical slabs in the cars.

[WE992]

A slight thread drift but I thought those of you who no longer live near the once mighty fine place might be interested in the redevelopment of Lyneham into the DCTT. Photo taken last Saturday.


http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv273/WZ793/EGDL2.jpg

[downsizer]

Remind me how much the Lye to Bzn move saved?

[kilwhang]

This thread is certainly stirring some memories...........

Earlier, AA62 was reminiscing about his time on 48 Sqn at Changi and I'm sure that others remember the Changi Slip.
That was before my time on the Herc but from 2008 to 2012 I was a Ground School Instructor (Embraer 170/190) in Singapore. Our school was just behind Changi Prison and I lived 2 miles from Changi Village.
Being a bit of a history buff, I spent a lot of time wandering around Singapore looking for old service establishments.

Those of you who have been to SIN recently will know that the island has changed radically and is almost un-recognisable. However, Changi Village and Changi Point are almost unchanged.

To illustrate my point, here are two maps:
The first is part of a map given to new arrivals at RAF Changi in 1971 -

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/changi%201971%20Small_zpsmfuolilw-1.png (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/changi%201971%20Small_zpsmfuolilw-1.png.html)

The second is a map of how it is today -

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Changi%20walk%20Small_zpsodvvfffs-1.png (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Changi%20walk%20Small_zpsodvvfffs-1.png.html)

If you look closely, you will see that all the roads keep their names (Halton Rd, Cranwell Rd, Sealand Rd, etc) and nearly all the original buildings are still there. Most of the married quarters are now holiday chalets and the barrack blocks are now private apartments.

Most of the buildings are in good condition but one or two have suffered.

This used to be HQ FEAF:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20077_zpsjqrmk7in.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20077_zpsjqrmk7in.jpg.html)

Two buildings which look a bit sad are, Changi Hospital:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20034_zpsqg5nst8s.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20034_zpsqg5nst8s.jpg.html)

and the Fairy Point Officer's Mess:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20063_zpskgnednjb.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20063_zpskgnednjb.jpg.html)

Luckily, these last two are Listed Buildings so will, eventually, be looked after.

More pics to follow...........

BTW, if anyone wants a copy of the complete 1971 map, just PM me.

[Null Orifice]

Thanks for those, Kilwhang!
The HQ pictured is actually FEAF (not NEAF) - I know because I was invited to a 'hats off' party there in 1970 (to give evidence) - not me sir!
The map also appeared in a Changi Informer magazine - remember those?. I don't recall ever being issued with a copy as we were expected to find 48 using our own initiatve and inbuilt nav skills!
Our youngest daughter was born in Changi Hospital and has both British and Singaporean birth certificates - we had to visit the British High Commission to acquire the former piece of paper.
Glad to hear that Changi Village still stands - happy memories :ok:

[Brian 48nav]

Ditto - our eldest was born there in '69 and has both birth certificates.


Last year he stayed in Singapore for a night ( he was part of the crew of the 350 having a look see at HK & Singapore ) and asked their ground handling agent if he could organise a trip for him to visit his place of birth. A big emphatic 'No' as the hospital building is deemed unsafe.

[ancientaviator62]

kilwhang,
super pics. Thankfully never need to enter the portals of the hospital but we SNCO were invited to the OM at Xmas for a 'drink'. After more than one drink I remember one of our Navs opening his wallet and showing us some very risque pics of his wife.
I took a colleague home one year on his motorbike because he was too drunk to ride !
I had not ridden a motorbike for years and have no recollection of the journey.
The facts were related to me later by his less than impressed wife.
When the new SNCO Mess opened it was immediately declared substandard due to the low number of showers and toilets. I recall the food stals thet used to set up shop underneath it. On formal occaisions when we were all trussed up it was essential to get there early to bag a spot underneath one of the fans. No air con.

[MAINJAFAD]

And your favourite colour scheme AA62

Although I'm not quite sure about lugging Bloodhound Missiles around in the back of Albert



Image Credit : See URL Below (More Pics)

RAF C-130K Hercules Britmodeller.com

Best regards ...

Coff.

PS. Sadly I'm unable to give named credit to the skilled modellers who's work appears above so, in the circumstances, I have done my best to credit their work with the references givenquote]

Coff, RAF Bloodhound Mk 2's were shifted on C-130 on a very regular between 1970 and 1983 seeing that no missile servicing facilities were located in West Germany. The majority of the moves to and from the far east were most likely getting them back for 4th line modifications and return. Missiles coming back to be fired at Aberporth and the final withdraw of equipment in 1968-70. The problem with that model is the missile is a Mk 1 and that was withdrawn from service by the RAF before the Herc was in service. However making a diorama of out of the old airfix Herc kit with the Bloodhound Mk1 loaded can be done if you paint the Herc in early RAAF Markings. The RAAF did move their Mk 1 missiles on the loading trolley in their C-130s between 30 Sqn's main base at Williamtown and a missile det at Darwin (I've got photos of them doing it somwwhere).

[Null Orifice]

aa62
I remember the 'eats' stalls blow the Sgt's Mess, especially the satay man. The mess was not one of my regular haunts as I lived firstly at Katong, then in a hiring at Suicide Village (named after several lives being lost by pedestrians attempting to cross the Changi Road nearby) - it was actually called East View Garden. I lived next door to Geoff M, an Eng from 48 who was also a colleague on 24 Hastings at Colerne. He was the source of many tales involving various escapades with a certain loadmaster whose first name begins with T and the surname with F! GM was the lucky recipient of a longer than scheduled layover in Kiwi-land ;), caused by the need for a hydraulic flush.

[kilwhang]

Null Orifice,

NEAF amended to FEAF. I knew what I meant to type but, having done a tour at Akrotiri in the early 70's, I just got it wrong.

Here is the complete Changi map:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/RAF%20Changi%201971_zpsd3wwgeof.png (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/RAF%20Changi%201971_zpsd3wwgeof.png.html)

As you can see the quality isn't too good because of the size restraints. However, I do have it in high quality .pdf form and will willingly send it to anyone who asks.

Brian,

The hospital is in pretty poor state (it has been closed since 1977) but it is easily accessible. I think it is, probably, that the handling agent is ethnic Chinese.
Singapore Chinese are convinced that the hospital is haunted. During the annual 'Month of the Ghosts' lots of young Chinese gather in the hospital courtyard, lighting candles and burning joss sticks in an attempt to exorcise the ghosts.
In 2010 a Singapore film company was given permission to film in the hospital. They were making a feature called 'Haunted Changi'. Strange things happened during the filming and most of the crew got sick. This just increased the belief in the ghosts.
You can read about the filming here:
HAUNTED CHANGI - About the Film (http://hauntedchangi.com/film)

More pics later.

[ancientaviator62]

NO,
the Loadmaster TF you mentioned has the same initials as the chap who owned the motorbike in my story. They are certainly one and the same.
And yes I remember the satay man.
Great days, and nights.

[upgently]

Spent a few day's in and around Changi village last year and whilst the village and creek are as we remember structurally, the village is wall to wall eating houses.
Changi prison has long since gone but the famous POW murals from a hut on base have been well copied and now form part of a small museum of the war time experience of the island. This museum is well worth a look and is very close to the site of the old prison.

The yacht club remains on it's original site and is open to non members and remains a great location to chill and reminisce.

Tried to get onto the base but the SAF security were having none of it - shame

[kilwhang]

Upgently,

Till about 2003 there were no fences around Changi Base and you could wander around. Unfortunately, Singapore was threatened by 'a known terrorist organisation' and all the military establishments were fenced.

The original front wall and entrance to Changi Prison is still there.....but it is hidden inside the large prison complex.

Totally agree with you about the Yacht Club.

One of my fellow instructors was a keen sailor and rented an apartment close to the Yacht Club. The club bar was his local.
One day he came into work covered in cuts and bruises. His explanation was that, after a few beers, he had tried to take a shortcut from the club to his apartment.......and fell down a monsoon drain!
I wonder how many people reading this have 'been there, done that' :)

[Dougie M]

How sad to see the faded glory of Changi. When staying at Temple Hill once, my skipper - sailing and flying - said "Lets go see a pal of mine at Fairy Point"
On reaching the hallowed portals we were curtly advised by the FEAF snobs that dress regs demanded at least planters rig so poke off.
P*** R***'s mate was a fish head and he called us in much to the chagrin of said nerks. " You've got on since we sailed together and you were a spotty Lt RN" said the skip. "Yes I'm on Fearless now" replied the fish head. "Doug" said the skip, "Meet Captain ******"
"Fraid I must stop you there to spare embarrassment" said the matelot." I'm an Admiral now, CinC the Far East Fleet...Fearless is my flagship! Gin and tonics?
FEAF flunkeys nowhere to be seen.... Yesss

[Bengerman]

Found another Op Bushel memory

http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah104/bengerman1/OFFICEDESKTOP/GondarAirfield001_zps45588d0e.jpg (http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/bengerman1/media/OFFICEDESKTOP/GondarAirfield001_zps45588d0e.jpg.html)

[Wander00]

Dougie M - brilliant story.

[kilwhang]

Dougie,

Nice one :)

The Temple Hill Mess is now behind the security fence but can be seen from the golf course. It has a great view.........:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20140_zpsybyslvt3.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20140_zpsybyslvt3.jpg.html)

I spent a lot of time wandering round Fairy Hill and was very aware that this was a classic example of our Colonial past:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20053_zpsymfbw2us.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20053_zpsymfbw2us.jpg.html)

[Brian 48nav]

Sorry to disagree but that building overlooking the golf course is nothing like Temple Hill - the style of THOM was like Fairey Hill OM.


IIRC TH was on top of its own small hill with no trees rising behind it - I can't recall where the golf course was ( particularly as I loathe the sport :( ) but pretty sure not adjacent to Temple Hill.


Regards Brian Wildey

[smujsmith]

Kilwhang #2370,

Sorry for the delay, just a thanks for your explanation of tanker development, and what an interesting time you had. For my sins, I was SNCO i/c VASS at Machrihanish, a punishment tour I think. By the time I got back to the fleet you had escaped but I did manage a few MPA trips as a GE.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b572/smujsmith/image_zps109d4829.jpg

One I've posted before I think, but one I took myself. Hope you can find some more photographs from your time on the fleet, it all adds to the growing history.

Smudge :ok:

[nimbev]

Kilwhang, very interesting pics of Changi. Any idea what happened to the transit messes we used on the Changi Slip?

[kilwhang]

Brian 48,

Thanks for that. As I said, all of that area is now behind security fencing and my information came from some 'old timers' at the Golf Club.

Nimbev,

The old transit hotel is now the Civil Service Club. It is, virtually, unchanged and has a restaurant which is open to the public. I've got some pictures which I'm trying to find.
You get quite a good view on Google Earth.

[nimbev]

Thanks Kilwhang.

My most vivid memory of the transit hotel (probably the only vivid memory as all the rest are very blurred) was in 1969.
On 24 Sqn enroute Muharraq to Changi on the Changi slip. For some reason fuel flow was too high so we changed from Long Range Cruise to High Speed Cruise and diverted to Gan, quick refuel and continued HSC to Changi. As we were being turned round in Gan, the ground crew were rushing around with transistor radios held to their ears as the lunar module was about to touch down. We listened to events on BBC world service the rest of the way to Changi. The next morning the TV room in the transit mess was packed as every man and his dog were watching the grainy black and white pictures from the Moon.

I can't remember where I was when Kennedy was assassinated, but I'll never forget where I was when Man landed on the Moon.

[dragartist]

Prompted by this mornings news about the new Pyops Brigade: When was the last time any of you airdropped leaflets? I know they were dropped during the movement of the turbine up to Kajaki dam.


On the latest Changi chapter. We staged through there on the way to KL. Britannia in VC10 out 67 - 70.


The pictures of the old buildings remind me of my boarding house (Kinloss housed and Bourne School) Kinloss house had been an Army Officers mess and was latterly used by the Singapore Police as a training establishment.


Wind forward to 2000 and something. I sat at my desk at Wyton. 4 seats away was an old school chum from KL and Kinloss house. We shared photos of the era. He was fortunate enough to have gone back in the 90s and taken similar photos of our dormitories etc in a similar vain to those above.


Small world.

[kilwhang]

Thanks for that dragartist,

With today's depleted Air Force, we tend to forget just how big some of the overseas bases were. Take Akrotiri and Changi for example - thousands of personnel and lots of aircraft. Both bases had their own transport squadrons.

Have a look at this picture of the Airmens Swimming Pool on Turnhouse Rd:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20046_zpsrufzlz9b.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20046_zpsrufzlz9b.jpg.html)

This was a large, modern, facility which - in the late 60's - would have been the envy of any military base. I took the pic in 2009. Singapore Airlines used it for dinghy drill for a while, but that was years ago. The red roofed buildings in the background are the Yacht Club.

Changi had two periods of major construction. One was in the mid 1930s and the second was after the Second World War.
According to a plaque over the front porch, Fairy Point Officers Mess was built in 1935 and this building, on Turnhouse Rd, has a plaque dated 1934.
According to the Changi map, this was the Chalet Club:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20051_zpsgdrfzgz7.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20051_zpsgdrfzgz7.jpg.html)

It is now a fish restaurant.

Last picture for today........the sports pavilion on the Padang Sports Field:

http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww243/tulpen1/Singapore%20035_zpsicampmc9.jpg (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/tulpen1/media/Singapore%20035_zpsicampmc9.jpg.html)

I bet a few of you have memories of that.

[dragartist]

Kilwhang,
I would have swam in that pool around 1969. Our normal haunt some evenings and most week ends was the one at Tanglin Army barracks, or Tengah. One of my Dads mates at Tengah would occasionally put me up for the weekend where we would visit the Brit club, Pool and the slot car racing circuit.


Most of all I enjoyed the jungle on the mainland

[CoffmanStarter]

Mainjafad ... many thanks for your info @2386 :ok:

I believe the Bloodhound was deployed with 65 Squadron based out of RAF Seletar, Singapore. When the RAF pulled out in 1968, I believe Singapore bought the entire Bloodhound assets of 65 Squadron to form part of their then Air Defence System.

Best ...

Coff.

[dragartist]

Coff,
I remember folks telling me how brand new Hunter parts were destroyed rather than hand them to the Singaporeans or bring them home.

[CoffmanStarter]

Hi Drag old chap ...

Stranger things have happened I'm sure ;)

[kilwhang]

In 1976 or '77 I spent 10 days shuttling between Angelholm in Sweden and Marham. The Swedes had updated their Air Defence System and didn't want to keep their Bloodhounds. The RAF bought them back and we transported them.
The best bit of the trip was that we were based in Sweden and did 2 hour turnarounds in Marham :)

[kaitakbowler]

http://www.singas.co.uk/changi/changiswimmingpool1.jpg

This is the Airmans pool I remember from 1966.

[kilwhang]

kaitakabowler,

That is a great website, with a detailed map of the Transit Hotel for those interested.

I remember when the Society came to SIN in 2008. I met some of them when they were having the meal and presentation. As I'm sure you know, they presented the village with a Comet on a plinth which stands at the corner of Village Rd and Telok Paku Rd.

By the way, did the Society know that the Comet would be positioned outside two girlie bars?

[ancientaviator62]

kaitakbowler,
thanks for the pic. That is where my daughter learned to swim during our tour at Changi. Some wonderful memory stirring pics now appearing of what was IMHO the best tour on the 'K'.

[upgently]

Not much of a surprise but the Comet on the corner of Changi high street is now in a very run down state which is a shame but time marches on I guess.

I have a few pics of Changi which I will post should the Changi interest continue.

http://i58.tinypic.com/2zrzted.jpg

[CoffmanStarter]

That's a cracking pic Upgently ... :ok:

[upgently]

Another wonderful evening in Changi


http://i59.tinypic.com/v4o650.jpg

[upgently]

NCO's mess circa 1968

http://i60.tinypic.com/28jcmxu.jpg

[kilwhang]

Upgently,

The line of Hercules looks great. I counted 8 a/c. How many did you have on 48 Sqn ?

[ancientaviator62]

Upgently,
just keep the pics coming they are great. Trust you are well.

[Brian W May]

I learned to swim in that pool at Changi in 1964 (Scaley Brat). We were accomodated at Changi Creek until my dad got his ex-officio quarter at Tengah (he was incoming SWO).

Ah memories . . .

[ancientaviator62]

kilwahang,
not sure how many we had on strength during my tour but there are 14 different frames recorded in my log book from that time. This of course does not mean we had 14 on strength as some may have replaced earlier a/c that were sent back to the UK. For example on 15 Jan 1971 we airtested XV179 and then on set off for the UK on 17 Jan via Gan, Muharraq, and Akrotiri. The captain was a F/O ! We all returned back to Changi on a VC10.

[Brian 48nav]

When 48 reformed with the Herc' we had 12 a/c, XV198-209 inclusive. In my time there up to Oct' 69 the only replacement received was 307 - not sure which airframe it replaced.


Upgently - good to see your post, love the picture of the flightline. Did you receive my email from before Christmas?

[upgently]

Brian, my apologies
Been on the wrong side of the big C for some time now but things have improved and I will chase up your mail and reply

[smujsmith]

Upgently,

Welcome back, and thanks for posting that great photograph of RAF Alberts in RAF Colours (Light Stone, Dark earth (Titanine paint as I recall) and the gloss black underbelly). Your post is a treat for those of us who had our first experience in those colours. Stay well and keep posting sir, it's a joy to behold.

Smudge :ok:

[Brian W May]

The colour scheme was referred to as Crud and Custard when I was at Colerne then 30 Sqn.

You just knew when we went to European Grey and Green that we were going back to the desert didn't you?

You couldn't write a script . . .

[smujsmith]

Brian,

How right you are. Crud and Custard Eh ? I well remember arriving at Aldergrove during the operation motorman resupply weekend, when us Colernite techies were used as liney's for that weekends movements. The paint scheme really stood out amidst the greens of the Northern Irish countryside. I heard a while later that the white band had been removed from the roundel as it made it a target for IRA snipers, also the white flight deck top. By the time they decided to change the colour scheme, I had left Colerne to help Kilwhang overhaul hydraulic components in Cyprus, as I remember 70 Squadron, operated both Alberts and Whistling Tits in the "Crud and Custard" scheme. I wonder if there are any photographs around of 70 in those days ?

Smudge:ok:

[WIDN62]

Lyneham's farewell.

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/267e57bb-533c-4a9d-a22b-29b371e93f2d_zpsf7581945.jpg

A first go at posting a photo - not sure if it is the right size!

[CoffmanStarter]

Worth waiting for WIDN62 ... You are now "checked out" on pic posting :ok:

[WIDN62]

Flushed with success, here are some more:

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/058-LYN-11-243-136-out-U640x427_zpsd443db4c.jpg

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/042-LYN-11-243-122-out-U640x427_zps1fd525d5.jpg

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/082-LYN-11-243-152-Cranwell640x426_zpsd5f1cbc4.jpg

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/089-LYN-11-243-168-out-U640x427_zpscdcb383e.jpg

The 3 Ks in the background in the first photo eventually departed by road.

[WIDN62]

Final one for the night

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/027-LYN-11-243-030-out-U640x427_zps20263851.jpg

[smujsmith]

WIDN,

Any idea of the significance of the 150, formed on the ground in your penultimate shot ? Just interested.

Smudge:ok:

[WIDN62]

Sorry Smudge, I can't remember. I am sure somebody from Royal WB will know. One of the other schools spelt out "BYE" which almost brought a tear to the eye.
These were some of the official photos, I have some of my own if they would be of interest. No swimming pools though!

[Clunk60]

I was in the High St as the 4 ship went over, the police gave up controlling the crowd as it converged into the road and controlled the traffic instead. I got some dust in my eye, probably from the K that was a bit lower than the J's,to avoid wake turbulence you understand! I got in my car and with heavy heart drove to work; at Brize. There shall always be a connection between RWB and the Hercules (J or K) we aren't partisan, that tide nor time can diminish.

[ancientaviator62]

I was looking through one of my log books for something else and came across this entry. On the 25 April 1996 we took XV 190 on an Op Resolute trip to Split via Paderborn to pick up the troops. The captain was Hptm S. A fairly regular task at that time but this one triggered a memory.
After landing at Paderborn the crew wandered off to the terminal but I stayed with the a/c as was my wont, and sat on the crew entrance door steps in the Spring sunshine with a cup of tea watching the world go by. Very shortly after the captain came back out to the a/c. There was a party of German schoolchildren looking round the airport and would I mind if they came to look round the Herc.
Of course not ! I was very happy to show anyone around even the Devil if he would promise to improve the heating.
There were about fifteen eight to nine year olds with a teacher who spoke English. So they come up the ramp and I point out the Elsan high on the fuselage wall in the stowed position. As usual this provokes much mirth.
One of them asks teacher a question and she translates. No we do not have to climb up to it and I demonstrate how it was lowered on the bungee. Another question , could they sit on it ? So amid much laughter they all took turns (yes smudge the lid was closed).Of course you never have a camera on these occasions.
So we carry on towards the flight deck via trying the seats etc.
Then the captain shows them round and they try all the seats.
When it is time for them to go I rifle through the pax drinks packs (always too many) and give them a carton each.
As they depart I start to laugh. Hptm S asks why. I said you can imagine when the kids get home and the parents ask them what they did at school today. 'Well we looked round an RAF a/c and all sat on the loo'
He thought it was amusing at the time too.
Just one of these little interludes that made the job.

[CoffmanStarter]

Good morning Gentlemen ...

Just stepping in to help Dougie post some interesting pics. I'm sure he will be along shortly to add follow-up commentary :ok:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/Wideawakeairfield1982Annotated_zps4d3f9d57.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/XV179XV200_zps4db0fc27.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/WideawakwAirfieldMirrorcorrected_zps693fa52b.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/Hercasbomber_zpsd7611f7f.jpg

I'll leave Dougie to assign 'Image Credit" as may be necessary ...

Best ...

Coff.

[CoffmanStarter]

WIDN62 ... Although a little sad, those are outstanding pics you have there ... many thanks for sharing with us. Please feel free to add your personal pics ... we have a fabulous record of the K building here ;)

Best ...

Coff.

[CoffmanStarter]

AA62 ... PR like that is always worth the time invested ... it costs nothing and achieves so much :D

And without doubt ... toilet related jokes for the average eight year old of any nation is going to cause a few sniggers ;)

[Dougie M]

The thirty year rule of confidentiality has now been lifted on the other side of Op Corporate and a little known or quietly hushed number of tales have emerged. The joint commanders in 1982 discovered that the long range C130 fleet could do all sorts of new things and this energised the imagination of the Senior Commanders' brains. An amazing number of suggestions for objectives came forward ranging from the daring to the outright barmy. All have heard of the alleged "one way" trip to Pebble Island and some years later in the Cameroons I asked a certain "Kiwi" if the plan really was to "slot" the crew to maintain the integrity of the mission. He was evasive in his reply which was chilling. That and other Spec Ops have been reported in a book written by Ewen Southby-Tailyour who was a beachmaster at San Carlos.
This thread is too restrictive to elaborate on the Dark Side of Op Corporate so I advise eager readers to check out Exocet Falklands - Untold Special Operations on Amazon. Find out what really happened. Thirty years on! Where did it go
Thanks Coff for the Art Work and AA I'm glad you didn't mention the oven (sorry about that)

[November4]

At the other end of the runway to WIDN's photos ....

http://i58.tinypic.com/2lc62gx.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/2eav0xg.jpg

http://i57.tinypic.com/i6jzn5.jpg

[November4]

http://i58.tinypic.com/2db49b8.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/2hqcbvk.jpg

The last view before the aircraft disappeared.....until they over flew an hour or so later but I had to leave before that.

http://i60.tinypic.com/347aflf.jpg

[Double Hydco]

http://i1297.photobucket.com/albums/ag21/belfast97/430662_3315204498099_856354546_n_zpsc6984a39.jpg

And here's LYE during happier times, taken during an air experience flight with the ATC in the mid-1980's. The flight seemed to be an instrument check of some sort, and the other notable thing was that the ALM was Belgian Air Force.

DH

[smujsmith]

Double Hydco,

Thanks for that shot, that's what you call a home base !

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Double Hydro,
we had two complete Begian crews attached to the RAF 'K' fleet at that time. One each on 24 and 30. They did not fly as a constitured crew but as individual crew members. I was the ALM Leader on 30 Sqn and I was fortunate to have Dirk van L as our Belgian loadmaster. A class act and all round nice bloke. I would have kept him if that had been possible.
The Belgian captain was Leon op de B. A great chap to go on route with and a bit of a 'character'. Happy times.

[ksimboy]

The Belgians on 24 were a great bunch too, the Captains standard line to any woman was " Allo, my name is Didier, what about sex?" Rarely worked for some reason. The ALM was famous for his comment regarding feeding the passengers. He told the Captain he had squadge and bisquits for the paps!

[ancientaviator62]

Dougie,
I have referred in an earlier post to the HSP and mine laying 'bright ideas' during Corporate. I was at the EU and part of our remit was to provide specialist advice to the group staffs as and when required. As retaking the Falkands was 'mission impossible' rhere were no real contingency plans. So when Maggie decided to do it all manner of wierd and wonderful ideas were put forward by our VSO and political betters. These were passed down the chain to the HQ newly discovered MRCA (AKA the 'K').
Because they came from 'on high' they could not be dismissed as lunatic as most were. They all had to be staffed and a report sent back up the chain.
So we were kept busy clerking providing group with the specilist advice mentioned above.

[Xercules]

It is not just the convincing outsiders of the lunacy of their ideas. It can be equally difficult convincing our lords and masters of potential viability.

When I started in MoD we worked for the Director of Air Defence - naturally he was an Air Defender with no trucking background or previous knowledge. One of my roles was to write the Service Deviations (SD) for the Herc - we had just short of 100 which had to be re-staffed every 6 months. However....

You may recall that during the Bosnia deployments one of the Regiments was deployed forward in Pristina (I think) and expected to be cut off by the Nasties. We needed to re supply them by airdrop but the aircraft had to remain above the missiles ie above 17,000 ft. 2 ideas seemed feasible using either a slotted parachute (one with every other gore removed) or by tie-ing the parachute so that it never really opened. Then with wind measurements from a ground party it was reckoned the load ( albeit travelling fairly fast, about 75 ft/sec if memory serves) could with reasonable certainty be put into a football pitch. But we needed JATE (as it then was) to do some trials and these needed a SD.

The DZ was the Boscombe Calibrated Range on Salisbury Plain aka the Larkhill Artillery Impact Area. I did a lot of research and produced what I thought of as a masterpiece, complete with the need, pictures of the loads and parachutes, maps of the DZ etc and explanations of where it actually was we were going to drop. In it went to the D and after a while out it came again unsigned but with a few queries. After several more attempts, I gave up trying to convince him remotely and asked to see him.

In I went, SD paperwork in hand. After some discussion we came to his problem - how did he know that if he granted the SD there would not be any unwary civilians standing on the DZ when dropping took place.

I thought for a moment "Well, Boss, it's like this. 30 minutes before we arrive the Artillery will be lobbing 155mm shells into the area. 30 minutes after we depart they will begin lobbing shells again." "Ah" he said and signed without another thought.

[Captain Sensible]

Here's the link to the book: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Exocet-Falklands-Untold-Special-Operations/dp/1783463872/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top

- a top read sitting by the fire on a cold winter's afternoon!

[Dougie M]

The high altitude 1 ton ME's were an interesting load. I was standing in at JATE when the task came to resupply the Gorazde pocket by air. The better option might have probably been a low level drop at night. Anyway, there we were at 17000ft with our poor despatchers and loadie bimbling around on full oxygen as the stick of ring - slot 1 Ton manually ejected loads were prepared. As aforementioned there was a check fire on Larkhill as the load was despatched and disappeared rapidly as these drogue chutes did little to slow them down.
The first hit the DZ at Black Ball Firs in the "football pitch" area but the rest expanded along the line of the DZ quite a lot.
After reconsidering the fact that the Serbs would have got most of the load the plan for "Operation Certain Death" was shelved.

[dragartist]

X and Dougie,
I too was associated with the HAADS but not responsible for the initial introduction. The first cutes you tested in readiness for your Gorazde Op were imported from Irvin California and modified for the British way of doing things. Why we could not have just adopted the US methods I never did fully understand. The initial SD was maintained (yes reviewed every 6 months) for many years. The SD approved the parachute mods ( A loop of 1500 cord at the apex to attach the static line so it broke away at the anchor cable end) It also authorised the JATE report as the SOPs. It took years to get this into the C book and suppress the SD. We bought 1000 chutes to this developed standard and designated them SC21. RAB and rationalisation caused disposal of 800. Last seen in a barn not far from Kemble. When we needed chutes for Afg we tried to buy them back. The asking price was double what we paid new. We managed to keep 200 for training in support of HUMAID but not hold any for HUMAID if that makes sense. HUMAID was not a capability funded by this Force for Good who employed us. These 200 chutes were consumed doing trials on the C130J. No one had the balls to read anything across from K to J. I don't believe any were deployed in anger. So much for interoperability.

[ancientaviator62]

Xercules,
your cunning plan was flawed ! You should have preceded the resupply drop by an insertion of a Health and Safety Team to carry out a full risk assessment to any civilians in the vicinity (servicemen do not count). Once the report had been received and staffed the need for the drop may well have evaporated. However if the drop then went ahead then it must be preceded at least 24 hours in advance by a leaflet drop (in 27 languages) warning those within 100 NM including any hostiles.
After the drop another leaflet sortie needs to be flown advising all and sundry that they are entitled to sue the UK for a wide variety of alleged injuries and misdemenours. Naturally contact details for the increasing horde of UK 'ambulance chasers' would be included.
Then those who sue would need flying back to the UK on specially charterd civil a/c as to use a Hercules would merely add insult to their 'injuries'.
Once here of course they would be accommodated in posh London hotels and given benefits and cosmetic surgery on the NHS.
Actually your real mistake was in not presenting the airdrop as relieving the
system of the need to store the kit being dropped thus saving MOD money.
Any career minded SO woulds have signed without the slightest demur.
Cynical? Moi ?

[maximo ping]

Page 2? Wrong.

I only went to the K in 91, but left on 31 Oct 13. Keep the history coming chaps...

[smujsmith]

Maximo Ping,

I take it you mean the book Exocet Falklands ? Just recieved my copy today from Big River stores. Do you feature in it at all then ?

Smudge:ok:

[WIDN62]

Some more photos of the farewell to Lyneham.

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/08dada4e-2838-469f-91b4-a2ca973b1c56_zps6416534d.jpg

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/d19a12fc-370d-442f-96be-4fdb4351486b_zps1a68de07.jpg

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/12c80fbe-93d7-4394-9137-9a9e04d18f07_zpsb40ae1cd.jpg

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j34/WIDN62/eda9d711-01f5-4fba-80b5-806ac655e078_zpsef00ad7e.jpg

[CoffmanStarter]

Many thanks for you latest pics WIDN62 ... But I expect there will be a few 'Damp Eyes' looking at that empty dispersal :(

[fergineer]

Last time I seen it like that was on a JatFor and there was a sole Andover on Q

[621andy]

Well I've just finished wading through all 123 pages; No mean feat with our internet connection here in Myanmar! What a brilliant thread:ok:

Anyway, I first came into contact with the Herk on ATC summer camp at Lyneham in '79... All my mates had the 'pleasure' of 3hr circuits and Khe San approaches with many bags being filled:ok: I however got lucky and only had fun transits.

According to my 3822, I had the following trips;

21.8.79 XV186 Transit to Cambridge(Marshalls) & return 1:45

23.8.79 XV223 Transit to Coningsby & Return 3:15 (The more observant amongst you will note the date is the 25th anniversary of the first flight of the C-130:) )
I think 223 went on to be the first 'stretched' version?

On one of these flights I remember standing harnessed up with the ramp down as Snoopy flew past below us- quite a sight!

And summer camp again in '81;

19.8.81 XV213 Circuits 1:05

When I moved up to the Ross on Wye area at the end of the 80's we lived it would appear, on the low level route to Wales, with much aerial activity including Herks, Chinooks(presumably in support of the boys up the road in Herryford & Pontrilas) at all hours of the day and night, VERY low:ok: plus the usual RAF/USAF culprits including the lovely A10 :)

I also remember seeing a formation of 15+ over the Severn estuary in the early 90s?? Great sight and noise!

Another memory was having a flypast whilst flying our balloon near Ross with the ramp down and the Loadie waving as they went by:D

Anyway, keep the pics and stories coming, it's all great stuff!

I'll try and post some pics later of a couple of the fleet in service with a foreign air force in more modern times...Off for a barbecue on the banks of the Irrawaddy first though:cool:

[621andy]

This is 8T-CA.....AKA XV181, currently in service with the Austrian AF.

These pics were taken at Linz in 2013/4

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA10.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA10.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA_1.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA_1.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA2.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA2.jpg.html)

[621andy]

CA again, this time at Zeltweg at the airshow, being 'intercepted' by two Eufi's...

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA9.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA9.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA8.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA8.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA7.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA7.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA7.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA7.jpg.html)

I think he is just 'waving' :}
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CA3-.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CA3-.jpg.html)

[621andy]

8T-CB...AKA XV291 @ Linz...

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CB4.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CB4.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CB3.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CB3.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CB2.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CB2.jpg.html)

[621andy]

Finally, whilst the internet appears to be reasonably fast, 8T-CC AKA XV292...also Linz...

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CC3.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CC3.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg244/621andy/8T-CC2.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/621andy/media/8T-CC2.jpg.html)

Linky here: RAL 7013 - Lockheed Hercules C Mk.1P (C-130K) (http://www.doppeladler.com/oebh/luftfahrzeuge/c130.htm)

Hope it's OK to post these pics as they're not directly of the K in RAF service, but still part of their history...

[CoffmanStarter]

Welcome Andy and many thanks for the pics ... I can hear the rustle of logbook pages amongst our many followers from here ... I'm sure it won't be too long before someone says "I last flew XV --- in ..." ;)

[dragartist]

Great pics Andy, I don't know too much about these Austrian airframes. Were they amongst those with the lowest hours? Did they de mod them?


I know they retained the UK Skydel. I was asked to authorise the issue of all the airdrop APs at one time. I thought this rather odd as they had not bought MSP or some of the other unique boat stuff and role equipment we had.


I assume they pitch up at Cambridge for deep maintenance now and again.

[ancientaviator62]

Andy,
thanks for those great pics. Good to know the 'K' lives on. The Sri Lanka Air Force had two I think. Like dragartist I too wonder how they chose the airframes. A beauty contest perhaps !
First made the aquaintance of XV 181 on Dec 15 1971, MCT ay Lyneham.

[ancientaviator62]

Andy,
I am surprised that your flights in the 'K' did not put you off it for life.
It was not a good a/c for air experience flights, the Hastings was much better with large windows and 'proper' seats.

[621andy]

:) Well I was young and enthusiastic then...

I'd already had a flight in XR810 (VC-10) the day before with the strangely backward facing seats, which was my first experience of anything with engines!

Now, nearly 36 years later I've managed to scrape a living in aviation(albeit the inflatable type:} ) so it obviously triggered something...3000+ hours in balloons and 200 hours in gliders...and counting :ok:

[ancientaviator62]

Andy,
rearward facing seats were the norm for RAF transport a/c at the time, apart from the Hercules which was called a 'troop carrier' with the infamous sideways facing para seats. Rearwards facing was regarded as the safest system in the event of a crash . Pax aft of freight was also the norm until the advent of the 'K' and then the normal rules were mostly waived for this 'troop carrier'.

[smujsmith]

Oh dear AA62,

I always thought the travel arrangements for passengers such as myself (the hammock) was a most pleasant way to pass the hours as we transited to the next watering hole:eek:

Smudge :ok:

[dragartist]

Smudge,
I am guessing that your hammock would have been more crashworthy than the seats.

[smujsmith]

Possibly so Drag,

I clocked just less than 5000 hours as a GE on Albert, many others dead heading somewhere (dead heading? That was GE'ing wasn't it?) and always did my best to avoid the para seats. The worst incident I saw was when doing the Arnhem Drop, with night stop at Deelen. On the approach to the DZ the seat support rail at the centre front came adrift and cracked a seated para across the head. At that point the troops had not been told to get their helmets on, and he had a really nasty cut across the top of his head. We got him up to the flight deck, and managed to give him a bit of first aid. The doctor at Deelen was more efficient, but it was very nasty. How it was missed out of Lyneham by the roley squippers is anyone's guess. I always appreciated the offer of a chance to see the landing from the Flight Deck, seemed safer somehow:sad:

Smudge:ok:

[ancientaviator62]

smudge,
do not be too hasty blaming the role equippers. Those beams were notorious for their poor fit. When you add to this the distortion caused to the whole seat fit by the weight of the paras and and their kit an occasional dislodging of the 'meccano' that made up the seat was not surprising.

[ancientaviator62]

dragartist,
my opinion of the seats was flagged up during the HEART job. A perfect example of the 'domino' theory !

[CoffmanStarter]

Good morning Gentlemen ...

If we're talking about PAX safety and comfort ... I came across these pics on Twitter yesterday which I'm sure will be of interest. Perhaps we have members of the crew from the original 1968 Greenland Exp following our Thread who could share a bit more of the story :ok:

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/B5D0BPyIAAAMg7Pjpg-large_zps1cdb430f.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/B5D0gkzIcAIH5k-_zps9b42d163.jpg

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/B5D0gpRIQAI1ynm_zpsa7cbefbb.jpg

Image Credits : Crown, MOD RAF, IWM (all above).

AA62 ... So what was the SOP for 'Four Legged PAX' from the ALM's perspective ... bit of care needed with all that corrosive K9P down the back ;)

Best ...

Coff.

PS. For those interested the source/author Twitter Feed has a wealth of other pics and reference material that is worth a look.

https://twitter.com/IanDProctor

[ancientaviator62]

Coffman,
animals could only be carried when specially authorised. We did carry a number of RAF police dogs usually sedated with a handler. Animals have also been airdropped as 'meat on the hoof' or on the wing in the case of chickens.
Between all of us on this thread I expect we have carried most 'four legged pax'. I was not very keen due to the smell and their wish to escape confinement

[smujsmith]

AA62,

Thanks for that, and point taken. I wasn't aware that there were particular problems with the seats collapsing. However, with the exception of a few re roles during my time as a GE I had little to do with the seats, apart from tidying the straps when putting Albert to bed at the end of the day's flying. Now, about these huskies ?

Smudge:ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

Morning Smudge :ok:

I'm assuming that the 'Riggers' would adopt a similar routine with any K9P 'spillage' as they did with SAR Ops and saltwater contamination ... a good wash down then liberal amounts of PX24 :ooh:

[smujsmith]

Morning Coff,

Fortunately, as a "rigger" by trade myself, I never had to deal with K9P on Albert. The biggest liability I remember from being a GE was a blockage of the urinal drains. This often went unreported by the Pax until the urinal itself got rather full. Any turbulence then and .... , you can imagine. If we (the Loadie or GE) spotted the problem quickly, a large poly bag over the top usually saved the day, along with the appropriate signage. I do know that unblocking the damn things was often messy, and not appreciated by the people whose airfield was contaminated upon release. The only other major threat, in my opinion, were the large quantities of road salt we shipped in to Sarajevo, to help keep their roads ice fre, and help the road convoys around. The stuff spilled everywhere, and, for obvious reasons, had to be cleaned up as soon as practicable. Often leading to an extra couple of hours at the aircraft after a long day, usually 3 return trips Ancona to Sarajevo. Why the stuff wasn't shipped in by the road convoys is beyond me, but salt and aircraft are not good bedfellows I would say.

Smudge :ok:

[Alison Conway]

Many moons ago a loadie by the name of B***N A****R and I got to our aircraft to do a quick Germany run to deliver what we thought would be the usual mix of general freight. How wrong we were! On board there were a dozen really grumpy Army war dogs in individual cages. They are not bred or trained to be friendly. I have no idea how long they had been there, but they let us know that they were angry and in no way sedated. B***N said something to the effect of "not in MY aircraft" and we both left to find anyone who knew what was going on. Nobody seemed to know. Eventually the captain, co and nav turned up at which point both B**** and I said we were unhappy with the doggies. The captain asked why until he came face to muzzle with a very ferocious dog which was emitting steam from its ears! The RAF doggy handlers and their vet were called and the trip put off until the next day when said doggies were sound asleep....but we were not. The possibility of one of those on the flight deck kept us all very much awake.

[ancientaviator62]

See my point above. They should have been sedated and the respective handlers should have been in attendance from the time they were onloaded.
This, to the best of my recollection was what the regulations required.
On the Hercules with its open access to the flight deck there is no where to hide should a grumpy canine get loose.
Even sedated animals have been known to wake up on some of the longer flights.

[wub]

Didn't B***n A****r once get some kind of award for repelling a mob attempting to get on his aircraft. (I served with him pre-aircrew days)

[Brian 48nav]

I recall reading an article in 'Air Clues' in '68 about a Herc' supporting an expedition to, I think, Point Barrow the most northerly place in Alaska.


A photo' showed the skipper Sqn Ldr Mike Nash who sadly died last year and a Sqn Ldr nav' whom I did not know and never ever came across. Perhaps he was the nav' on the first Herc' delivered to the RAF?


Maybe someone like Lou Scannon may know more.

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

Didn't B***n A****r once get some kind of award for repelling a mob attempting to get on his aircraft?
I don't know about an award, but I heard that when he did his annual weapons shoot, he was allowed to do it running away, firing over his shoulder

[CoffmanStarter]

Well ... that just goes to show that we are a nation who loves the dog (I thought it best to phrase it that way) :ooh:

Mind you AA62 ... you now owe me a new iPad following a quick read of your phrasing this morning ;)

... usually sedated with a handler

Just had a vision of a sedated Snowdrop slumped in the corner with is dog :}

Brain Thanks for that ... perhaps someone might have a copy of that Air Clues article we can share :)

[Brian 48nav]

Another flash of recall from somewhere! I think Mike's trip was in support of the start Of Wally Herbert's Trans-Arctic expedition.
Looked at Wiki' and it relates that Herbert started at the top of Alaska and 18 months later, following 5 months rested-up on the Polar Ice Sheet, finished at Spitsbergen. Apparently he was well used to working with dogs on his polar expeditions.

[kilwhang]

I wonder if the B***N A****R incident you refer to, is the little bit of bother that C***S K**P and his crew got into in Central America.
I can't remember the exact details (1978/79?) but I'm sure that someone on here will.

[wub]

I recall that a mob tied to rush the aircraft hoping to be taken, from wherever they were, to wherever the aircraft was going and that, to dissuade them, B***n had to hurl tie-down equipment at them. Meanwhile the flight deck crew were trying to jump the chocks to get away. That's really all I can recall through the mists of time.

[November4]

Dogs.....one of the worst loads I ever loaded out of Lyneham was 2 pallets with 6 dog in kennels on each. The pallets were warped and took ages to lock into the side guidance.

I seem to remember it was to NI but it could have been the same flight as Alison Conway talks about. These dogs were definitely not sedated and were letting everyone know they were not happy.

And the smell.....:uhoh: :uhoh:

[Lyneham Lad]

Views from an Eng Wing Families Day flight, summer '85.
Our steed awaits:-
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f84/Lyneham_Lad/Lyneham/HercFlt1_zpsztvk4tty.jpg

Heading SW:-
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f84/Lyneham_Lad/Lyneham/HercFlt2_zpsyktkteuz.jpg

The Severn bridge:-
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f84/Lyneham_Lad/Lyneham/HercFlt3_zpsj6cnerlt.jpg

Castle Combe circuit:-
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f84/Lyneham_Lad/Lyneham/HercFlt4_zpsfaz4sf9a.jpg

Run-in for the break:-
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f84/Lyneham_Lad/Lyneham/HercFlt5_zpsw3snotro.jpg

[wub]

Nice photos LL. My last working day in the RAF was spent in that control tower.

[Alison Conway]

Kilwhang wub,

Nicaragua as I recall

[WE992]

What sort of roller is that fitted to the ramp in the middle photo with the dog going up the toe ramp? It looks considerably wider than what I remember and looks more like that fitted to the Beverley. Perhaps AA62 knows?

[November4]

I wonder if the B***N A****R incident you refer to, is the little bit of bother that C***S K**P and his crew got into in Central America.
I can't remember the exact details (1978/79?) but I'm sure that someone on here will.

From the RAF Movers (http://www.ukmams.co.uk/Operations/Operations/Nicaragua%201979.html)web site

Relief Supplies - Nicaragua 13 Jul - 1 Aug 1979

Red Cross Specials. Flt Lt Ian Drake, Cpl Gus Cobb plus 1. Delivery of relief supplies to Nicaragua following the Nicaraguan Civil War. Whilst at Managua Airport the Nicaraguan National Guard attempted to hijack the aircraft. This attempt was foiled by the crew including Cpl Gus Cobb for which they were later made members of the RAF Escaping Society.

* * * * *

On 1 Jan this year (1980) Cpl Gus Cobb was awarded a Commendation by the AOC No 38 Group for his fine service to the Squadron and in particular for his part in the Managua incident last July. (Attempted Hercules Hijacking). Cpl Cobb is now serving in Belize.

[November4]

What sort of roller is that fitted to the ramp in the middle photo with the dog going up the toe ramp? It looks considerably wider than what I remember and looks more like that fitted to the Beverley. Perhaps AA62 knows?

It does look like Bev roller. We used to occasionally use it to use it upside down to roll big items into position. I don't remember seeing it fitted like that though.

Looking a bit closer, I am not sure it is fitted, looks more like it has been laid on the floor to slide the items onto the ramp.

[Trumpet_trousers]

And the smell.....

....I'm sure the dogs got used to it after a while....:}

[ancientaviator62]

The roller referred to is almost certainly old Beverley roller. It was often used upside down(contrary to the infamous -11D) to move heavy items of cargo round the cargo compartment.
Coffman, if the dog had looked like getting loose then both the dog and the handler would have been sedated by that 'Swiss army knife ' of the 'K' a ten thousand pound tire down tensioner !

[ancientaviator62]

LL,
very nice pics. Did lots of family day flights but not that one.
I was due to do a MAMS one but when I arrived at Ops I was told that there was not an a/c. So I threw my cot at the Eng Controller and said had it been Eng Wing due to fly we would have been spoilt for choice.
A frame was grudgingly allocated but with the snide remark that it was clear floor and there were no Role equppers to fit the seats.
No problem says I for I have a Cerificate of Competence for role fits.
So the other ALM and myself with the enthustiatic support of some of the movers reroled the a/c. We were off on schedule and did a lot of lifts flying the route as shown in the LL pics.
One year during the 30 Sqn Family Day flying I manage to get my reluctant late father in law up for his first ever flight at the age of 74 ! Sat behind the captain on the Nav stool he enjoyed it so much he did not want to get off. We came back to Lyneham and flew down the high street of our village where the annual bowls festival was taking place. When I got home I was told that our flypast was the highlight of the day and the bowls event committee basked in the reflected glory of being able to organiise it !
Happy days,
The signed print the Sqn presented him with hangs in our hallway.

[wub]

Kilwhang wub,

Nicaragua as I recall

Thanks Alison, that rings a bell now.

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/43340/jdp3522nded.pdf

In 1979, a RAF C-130 crew was flying Red Cross supplies into Managua, Nicaragua, as part of an ongoing international disaster response. On landing, the aircraft was surrounded by a group of militia who cocked their weapons, withdrew the pins from hand grenades and demanded to be flown to Costa Rica. While the crew kept the engines turning and warned off other relief flights, they were lucky to have a Spanish speaking engineer on board who diffused the situation by bluffing that they had insufficient fuel and would have to land in Nicaragua again en route.


Article in Flight International:-
http://www.flightglobal.com/FlightPDFArchive/1979/1979%20-%202754.PDF


I got the story direct from B***n A****r himself, but that doesn't mean it was accurate! We might have been drunk. His version included a trip to the tower (something to do with passports) to discover murdered Red Cross workers. Eventual escape by taxiing in a straight line from the parking, to the runway, first bump of many was the chocks. Possibly S** V**** in the r/h seat, but my memory's hazy

[chickenlover]

Found this gem of a collection of snaps whilst browsing Flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/118903335@N07/
If the link doesn't work, go to Flickr and search for the photo stream of a gent called "quick shifter"
If you have plenty of time on your hands type 'low C130K' into the search bar and see where that leads you -then just enter any other terms-be warned you can lose days in there !
Have fun

[CoffmanStarter]

First class lead there Chickenlover :D

Also try 'RAF Hercules' as a search parameter ... But be warned ... Take a packed lunch along with a few beers as you could be gone for a while ;)

[billynospares]

http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/8C7A92D0-A26A-4E69-A4BA-4D000C27C97B_zpscry73l5w.jpgFound a few more in my filing system
http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/5C881668-CC9D-4D86-AFB1-9E1B406E382A_zpsy39m7x4m.jpg
http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/01ECEDF2-3F50-4899-B455-CFB1077C2FE2_zpstkhfgk3v.jpghttp://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y501/oakley1971/35F20DF5-0CDA-4AAF-AE09-CB01FC3F85B1_zpszx9xbels.jpg
Yuma and possibly a part of New Orleans but memory has faded a bit.

[CoffmanStarter]

Great pics Billy ... Many thanks for sharing with us :ok:

[Mal Drop]

I also recall that S** V**** was involved in the tryjack story and had been given membership of the RAF Escaping Society afterwards. I think there was something up on the wall of 30 Sqn about it when I was on the unit.

[Kengineer-130]

Whatever happened to the RAF C-130k tribute video with U2 beautiful day music? That was a great video & I can't find it anywhere :( Does anyone have a link to it or a copy I could have please?