BELFAST (BHD) - 3

[ara01jbb]

As a regular on the BHD-PIK run, my sympathies are with FR c/c. On that 80 mile trip they always proved themselves to be the hardest working FR employees bar none

[EGAC_Ramper]

Shame to see the loss all all routes, bit of a surprise would have thought close the 1 aircraft base yes. Hopefully see someone do BHD-EMA.

Regards

[OltonPete]

EMA

Ryanair East Mids in July carried 19384 on a 73H, which was probaby pretty useless at the prices they were charging but can flybe just ignore the sheer numbers involved and just hope that people travel to BHX.

The chances are they will just transfer to BMI Baby especially if the third service is reinstated as rumoured on the BFS thread.

BHX-BHD did suffer when FR started as pax were around 20000 a month before and they dropped with this July up slightly but still only 17914.

I believe the FR route also affected the Baby BHX-BFS which had been 12000 per month and is now around 8000.

Some difficult decisions to be made and they might decide it was all low fares, which is not worth the risk.

However two Q400's a day (weekday) and one at weekends would only be about 8000 a month, which might be possible. Daily would probably deter any potential business pax and you will then just compete directly with BMI Baby's BFS.

Pete

[eastern wiseguy]

Only 'cos I haven't an aeroplane to plaster it on!

[Sober Lark]

...also don't forget the final link in the motorway to Ryanair's offices in DUB opened on July 29th bringing the journey time to less than 2 hours. Only a few days ago Air Coach said they were dropping the Dublin to Belfast to Dublin coach service because Ryanairs base in Belfast meant not as many passengers were travelling on their service! Ireland is an island and with new motorways almost everywhere now we don't really need half a dozen airports.

[EGAC_Ramper]

Baby BFS-EMA

Well they may be increasing frequency but FR at least where ontime and few cancellations. Quite often Baby would cancel either BHX or EMA flight doubling up on the corresponding EMA or BHX flight and bussing pax. If FlyBe startup to EMA from BHD then that would be much preferred.


Regard

[EI-BUD]

I could maybe see Flybe taking over the London Stansted route, as for:

Liverpool - pulled of the route a few years back
Bristol - tried before and never lasted long
Glasgow Prestwick - already serving Glasgow International from BHD
East Midlands - they already serve Birmingham from BHD

mysecretsmile; Flybe (or British European at that time) did try BFS STN at 3 or 4 day on a designated Bac 1-11, I think it was early 90s!!!

I cant see Flybe looking at any of these routes but Liverpool could be a possibility as Flybe is better established at LPL now since taking over BaConnect, and also Ryanair have developed strong traffic on this route. I do however that that Easyjet will definately have to take a strong look at some of these routes to protect it's patch, ie Liverpool and Stansted. However, they will need to be careful if they do look at BHD that any exit from STN does not create a vacuum that BFS may accept Ryanair filling.

BHD was in decline 3 years ago at a rate of -2 to -3% and Ryanair came and spectecularly reversed this. BHD have gained much publicity from its growing status much to the detriment of BFS's position. if Easyjet look at any moves this could very quickly force the hand of BFS management to seriously look at a Ryanair offering???

Would Aer Lingus seriously look at BHD as an alternative for its operation?

[MerchantVenturer]

Bristol - tried before and never lasted long

Depends what you mean by 'long'.

The BHD-BRS route operated by Flybe (as Flybe and in its previous incarnations as far back as its Jersey European days) operated continuously for much of the 1990s (if not earlier) and on into this century until it was axed in November 2006 because, it was generally assumed, of the easyJet route to BFS.

Flybe had flown in competition with easyJet for about three years and in 2004 carried 76,000 passengers to BHD against easyJet's 232,000 to BFS which contrasts with 2009 when Ryanair carried 79,000 to BHD but easyJet had dropped to 163,000 to BFS.

[NWSRG]

Glad to see them go!

Firstly, I hope none of the FR people lose their jobs over this pull-out. They were only doing the jobs asked of them.

But as for the corporate Ryanair, I'm glad to see the back of them. Usually I don't get 'personal' about these things, but FR have brought the general theory of customer care into utter disrepute. From adverts that misled the public, to inexcusable charges for using recognised credit cards, and often times prices that were more expensive than they cared to recognise...

I hope the gap is filled by airlines that actually do seem to want to look after their customers...be it FlyBe, Easy or BMI...

...and as for the runway extension, this probably removes the only argument that could possibly have been made in its favour...that one airline was 'proposing' European flights. With that airline now gone, common sense can break out again. I can't see what financial incentive BHD now have to continue to push the extension.

[dublinaviator]

NWSRG, if people cared about customer service as much as you claim Ryanair would be out of business by now. The reality is most people know that you get what you pay for with Ryanair, and nobody expects the experience of a full service carrier.

You have the choice to not fly with them if you don't like them. Just remember though, that if it wasn't for Ryanair you wouldn't have half the choice you have today - they're the ones who brought fares down and if it wasn't for them you'd still be being ripped off by full service carriers like BMI.

[mutleyshriek]

Just watched Katy Best from BHD on utvlive.Seems the stance from the management at BHD is to remain telling lies to the public.She stated"we have lost five routes to the uk which were unserved from Belfast".Excuse me,but havent those routes with the exception of Glasgow Preswick been served for many years from International with easyJet and bmibaby.So BYE BYE RYANAIR.how ironic....

[Tower Ranger]

Very sad news indeed and my thoughts go to their employees and the people who worked so hard to make their operation a success. Regardless of which Ulster Airport you back I believe this is bad news for all.

[mutleyshriek]

Yes very sad indeed for staff concerned,however Ryanair will offer relocation and really they dont care much for their staff wellbeing anyway.
Their knee jerk reaction to Aer Lingus entering the Belfast market has not come to fruition and FR entering the market was an O,leary whim.
A few years ago some of my collegues had the misfortune of his arrogant personality when arriving at my airport and walking past one of his aircraft he stood at the top of the steps giving my crew collegues the two fingered salute with both hands shouting"**** off,youll all be begging me for a job in a couple of months".This was in full view of the press and passengers in the terminal.Thankfully this never has happened and I fly with ex FR crews who came to us with nothing but horror stories.

[tallseabird]

I've got to say, MOL does make it all sound very plausible but the bottom line is that the market needs to be fair for all operators, what is needed - and it has been said before - is a fair aviation policy for the whole of NI.

If you want to come to NI and operate a flight to LCY then is how you WILL do it, if you want to operate a flight to JFK then this is how you will do it and if you want to operate to PMI then this is how you will do it. That is not to say it has to be from one airport or that it has to be by one airline.

If it is left to the airports/airlines then it will not be in the interests of NI or the NI travelling public(inbound or outbound).

In my opinion, if Ryanair want to fly to Mediterannean destinations then there is a perfectly good airport available to operate from without any need to build any additional facilities. If NI was a large market and BFS (or BHD) was restricted in growth opportunities then yes by all means add additional facilites to allow for market expansion - but we are not a large market and in all likelyhood never will be.

Expansion needs to be managed by an entity with NI's interests at heart, MOL or any other single airline doesn't fit that bill!

I am a fan of BFS but will be happy for any managed growth in NI - I am using Ryanair for the first time soon - because it is cheaper and it suits me. I will be sorry to see them go as it will reduce competition on various routes and I will end up paying more to fly.

[gate 22]

Katy Best, business development director at the airport, said the airport was "very confident we will be operating these routes again" as their performance with Ryanair made them a "warm bed" for other airlines.
"Certainly there are a number of airlines who operate from those airports at the other end which have made expressions of interest today and we will be having commercial discussions with them."

Quite possibly EZY for BRS/STN/LPL??, WW for EMA??
or is it FR re-negotiating (as they are the only operator out of prestwick-if one reads it literally??

[Belboy]

I am not convinced that FR were making the level of profit they claim on the routes from BHD, the fares were generally very low and some of the loads low also. Even if they were paying the airport very little, or nothing at all, could these routes have been as profitable as claimed. MOL is a fairly commercially minded guy and if he was making money he would not be pulling out. If the bed is as warm as KB claims someone else will be in there double quick.

[tigger2k8]

I doubt WW will do EMA from BHD, didn't someone post that they were adding an extra flight from BFS?

Can't see EZY moving anything as the 3 routes EZY perform from BFS than BHD has lost are their most popular domestics... EZY will also not want to move much with the time restrictions, most nightstoppers at BFS land after the curfew time at BHD by over an hour, so if they did move routes they'd have to change times and plan the timings very well...

Shall be interesting, LTN still remains in the drop down box after 8 months of the route stopping...

[NWSRG]

NWSRG, if people cared about customer service as much as you claim Ryanair would be out of business by now. The reality is most people know that you get what you pay for with Ryanair, and nobody expects the experience of a full service carrier.

You have the choice to not fly with them if you don't like them. Just remember though, that if it wasn't for Ryanair you wouldn't have half the choice you have today - they're the ones who brought fares down and if it wasn't for them you'd still be being ripped off by full service carriers like BMI.

Dublinaviator,

You're quite correct, I do have the choice, and I decided some years ago not to submit myself to the FR experience again.

But you're not serious about FR bringing low fares to NI? I suspect that Easy, Jet2, Go (remember them?) and BMIBaby would all argue that they brought low fares to NI long before the yellow peril...you're not in PR for FR are you? And of course, the fares might be cheap if you book six months in advance on a day trip to a little known Baltic airfield with hand luggage only...but try to book a realistic business or leisure trip three weeks in advance with a suitcase...then you'll see just how cheap FR really are...

[JobsaGoodun]

But you're not serious about FR bringing low fares to NI? I suspect that Easy, Jet2, Go (remember them?) and BMIBaby would all argue that they brought low fares to NI long before the yellow peril

And long before all of these at BHD even Flybe's predecessor Jersey European was offering £39 return fares inclusive of all taxes/charges on its BHD-BHX route. Return prices to LBA, BRS, STN, LGW were also available at £58 return.

[dublinaviator]

And this is also the same FlyBe that bases part of it's business model on Ryanair, just like most airlines now, including easyJet. So while Ryanair might not have been the first low cost airline to serve the North, if it wasn't for them no low cost airline would be serving the North. No matter how much you hate Ryanair, you can't deny that if it wasn't for them, we'd still be being ripped off by high fare, full service carriers. Ryanair has forced other airlines to reduce their costs and their fares.