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Is Ukraine about to have a war?

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Is Ukraine about to have a war?

Old 18th Dec 2022, 11:10
  #12701 (permalink)  
 
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Which will allow Putin to say that Russia is being attacked by NATO weapons, therefore justifying a wider war against NATO.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 11:24
  #12702 (permalink)  
 
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Russia is getting its weapons from Iran and hitting Ukraine. Why can't Ukraine get its weapons from the US and hit Russia?
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 11:27
  #12703 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234
Which will allow Putin to say that Russia is being attacked by NATO weapons, therefore justifying a wider war against NATO.
Not a justification, an excuse. Which, many would argue, is a political decion to build / fabricate one, meaning they will do as they please anyway.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 11:39
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234
Which will allow Putin to say that Russia is being attacked by NATO weapons, therefore justifying a wider war against NATO.

Russia can attack nato any time it likes. After all the previous ref lines have been cross it still hasn't.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 12:24
  #12705 (permalink)  
 
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The weapons are being donated by Countries and not NATO so in a way do not in theory demand a response to the use of “NATO” weapons, Russia has already threatened the countries Germany and the U.K. for supplying weapons not as NATO Countries but simply as the Countries in their verbiage.

It’s getting more like the script of Kelly’s heroes

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-64016599

Freezing in trenches, shortages of food, fuel, ammunition, cold weather clothing…. Nooo problem, we will send a band to cheer them up.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 12:26
  #12706 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by FlightDetent
There is an important moment though. Embracing the hearts and goodwill of future generations of Russian peoples.

As they say, "reality tells the truth". By staying inside their own international borders the UKR deny Kremlin propaganda the tools to enemize the nation. Make no mistake, many are eagerly waiting for that, and it could be impossible to undo.
The suggestion is that Ukraine be given weapons that can relentlessly target the military facilities being used by Russia to attack them, wherever they are. That is the only way to end this - by so damaging their military capabilities that they have to give up. Sanctions should help make it increasingly difficult for them to replenish lost equipment. Anything else is dancing to Putin's tune.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 12:31
  #12707 (permalink)  
 
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Again they need to hit Russia take out their heating and power, training bases, depots, rail infrastructure bridges, airfields naval bases in sevestapol, that damned bridge again and Putins palace, his seat of power, then the people will get a feeling of war and will be looking at Putin and his tenuous holding on to power.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 13:02
  #12708 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Low average
Russia is getting its weapons from Iran and hitting Ukraine. Why can't Ukraine get its weapons from the US and hit Russia?
Risk assessment ? Obviously I don't know what the highest councils know, but if Putin really is in terminal decline for whatever reason, then I would guess that any impetuous decision is possible, although who knows if it would be enacted if it were a Doomsday-type decision. Such an action would be more likely if there were a dramatic new attack e.g. on a major military target close to Moscow . Under such circumstances those councils may feel that the best scenario with acceptable risk is achieved by bleeding Russia of its young men and best equipment. This will happen at the cost of Ukrainian casualties.

Last edited by Tartiflette Fan; 18th Dec 2022 at 13:21.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 14:25
  #12709 (permalink)  
 
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As long as Russian troops are dying in Ukraine, their families can blame Putin for sending them there.
But when Russian troops (and inevitably civilians) are killed in Russia and pictures broadcast all day on every TV channel, the population may reasonably expect a response by whatever means Putin says is necessary.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 14:56
  #12710 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234
Which will allow Putin to say that Russia is being attacked by NATO weapons, therefore justifying a wider war against NATO.
Imagine NATO armies holding positions on the frontline from Cherson to Svatove shoulder to shoulder with ZSU. With air superiority, trained forces manning the latest kit and executing modern combined warfare. I think that Russians would be pushed out from pre-2014 Ukraine within few weeks. Widening the conflict would be suicidal for Russia.

Chieftain said lately that Americans would expel Russians from Ukraine within 2 and half weeks.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 14:59
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And we worry about gas prices to heat our homes…

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Old 18th Dec 2022, 15:01
  #12712 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pali
Imagine NATO armies holding positions on the frontline from Cherson to Svatove shoulder to shoulder with ZSU. With air superiority, trained forces manning the latest kit and executing modern combined warfare. I think that Russians would be pushed out from pre-2014 Ukraine within few weeks. Widening the conflict would be suicidal for Russia.

Chieftain said lately that Americans would expel Russians from Ukraine within 2 and half weeks.
And right there reinforces the argument to fast track Ukraine into NATO. Putin is surviving on a knife edge in the knowledge that the West fears him pressing buttons. That risk was there a year ago, now and forever, so get in there and get the job done swiftly.
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 16:29
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Tragic no matter the side, told your son is dead and handed his personnel effects in a small carrier bag

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Old 18th Dec 2022, 16:32
  #12714 (permalink)  
 
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Another Russian oil and gas facility on fire…their cigarette disposal record is terrible

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Old 18th Dec 2022, 16:37
  #12715 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose
Tragic no matter the side, told your son is dead and handed his personnel effects in a small carrier bag



https://twitter.com/Tendar/status/1604195640363581440
Judging from the reports of mass burials and cremations in territory recaptured by the Ukraine, to say nothing of abandonment of troops by officers I wonder how many will just disappear and it may be a long time before they can be presumed dead?
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 18:13
  #12716 (permalink)  
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The administration of Sakhalin region in the Russian Far East has ordered the heads of local municipalities to withdraw exemptions from government employees, making them eligible for mobilisation. This is another sign of an imminent second mobilisation drive….
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 18:59
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There is bravery and bravery… how brave.

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Old 18th Dec 2022, 19:08
  #12718 (permalink)  
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Things starting to boil in Moscow - how long can the current regime last?

”….Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity…..”



Girkin says the defeat of Russia will see him being hanged in Kyiv, meanwhile the Russian authorities are leading the country into a catastrophe...
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 19:46
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Interesting that a supposed "super power" now has to be supplied from Iran & DPRK, how sad but funny.
Yet UKR still has to observe & protect its own borders - as the RF threatens the west with any response, & it sits in fear of the (possible) RF Nuclear capability/threats.

UKR are fighting with both hands tied behind their backs, but still doing a bloody good job.

So to hell with it, western countries should provide the means for them to fight 'an eye for an eye & a tooth for a tooth".

RF has been hit financially, now it should be military action. Direct on their ground, in their safe areas and their infrastructure.....
Roll the dice & lets go...
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Old 18th Dec 2022, 19:50
  #12720 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cura
Interesting that a supposed "super power" now has to be supplied from Iran & DPRK, how sad but funny.
Yet UKR still has to observe & protect its own borders - as the RF threatens the west with any response, & it sits in fear of the (possible) RF Nuclear capability/threats.

UKR are fighting with both hands tied behind their backs, but still doing a bloody good job.

So to hell with it, western countries should provide the means for them to fight 'an eye for an eye & a tooth for a tooth".

RF has been hit financially, now it should be military action. Direct on their ground, in their safe areas and their infrastructure.....
Roll the dice & lets go...
Where's a like button when you need one?
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