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Is Ukraine about to have a war?

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Is Ukraine about to have a war?

Old 5th Nov 2022, 20:53
  #11321 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose
Have you read up on itís defensive systems they have built into it, they a formidable.
however it has apparently given up its secrets.

https://www.thenationalnews.com/worl...fence-systems/
Being theoretically "formidable" hasn't seemingly carried over to its practical application.

Onyx has recorded at least 20 T-90 and 2 T-90M variants destroyed since they were first deployed to Ukraine.
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Old 5th Nov 2022, 21:06
  #11322 (permalink)  
 
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You are missing the point, the T90 and T90M which this is appear to be are poles apart and the T90M has been in service as their top of the range main battle tank a scant couple of years, this is the cream of their crop and as such is of interest to the West because if WW3 ever happened we would need to understand their defence modes against our latest weapons, their secret armour construction and how to deal with them or develop weapons that can….

Only a fool would go into battle not knowing their enemies capabilities and deterrents against missiles if you had the opportunity to learn those secrets, , equally I would assume Russia would like some of the West latest armour to study, probably one reason why the Abrams, Challenger or latest Leo is absent from Ukraine.

It is also probably the reason the latest Russian armour has been lacking in the field and is now only appearing due to the losses inflicted upon them and shortages there off.

but hey, I’m just an interested party putting my view across, but it all makes sense to me.

READ

https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2022/0...the-americans/

Last edited by NutLoose; 5th Nov 2022 at 21:43.
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Old 5th Nov 2022, 21:41
  #11323 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Spunky Monkey
The Yanks could turn its hand to building an improved but basic T80 and pass it onto the Ukes in about 8 months. Flooding the battlefield with T80s but evidently tanks are no longer where its at. Light role and Mech infantry seems to be the Daddy again.
How are the Americans suddenly going to be able to turbo-charge their planning and development by a factor of 10 or 15 ? Please let us into the magic secret.
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Old 5th Nov 2022, 22:33
  #11324 (permalink)  
 
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Last edited by Wokkafans; 6th Nov 2022 at 00:59.
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Old 5th Nov 2022, 23:34
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Originally Posted by Tartiflette Fan
How are the Americans suddenly going to be able to turbo-charge their planning and development by a factor of 10 or 15 ? Please let us into the magic secret.
Yep. I worked as a mechanical designer in both the marine and aviation fields and can testify that just the basic tooling design and fabrication bit is not an overnight job. The jigs and fixtures to mass produce a product like a tank, as well as the lead times for major castings, engines, gearboxes, loaders, guns, etc. are not simple 'write and order' things. Yes, stuff can be pushed through in an emergency, but setting up or modifying a factory to mass produce something like an advanced tank is not trivial. 8 months? No way.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 00:44
  #11326 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Winemaker
The jigs and fixtures to mass produce a product like a tank, as well as the lead times for major castings, engines, gearboxes, loaders, guns, etc. are not simple 'write and order' things.
One of the castings for the 747 main landing gear reportedly had a 4-year lead time .
Yes, those times can be reduced in a war emergency (and MBT castings are certainly less complex and material critical than a 747 landing gear), but agreed - 8 months is simply not going to happen.
Plus, the US isn't on a war footing...
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 07:09
  #11327 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tdracer
One of the castings for the 747 main landing gear reportedly had a 4-year lead time .
Yes, those times can be reduced in a war emergency (and MBT castings are certainly less complex and material critical than a 747 landing gear), but agreed - 8 months is simply not going to happen.
Plus, the US isn't on a war footing...
Fair enough, everyday is a school day.
The Russian kit is basic, because the troops (conscripts) have very little training, the armaments industry somewhat lacks the West, not to mention the quality of metals and materials.
Tactics that the armoured vehicles were used for have been shown to be obsolete, (were never really much good against an in depth defensive force).

For the Ukrainians the use of direct fire heavy weapons gives them the accuracy and fire support they require to clear static defensive positions.
Abrams and Chally are fantastic in highly mobile manoeuvear warfare, this however is not where they are currently at, the weather and mud will likely turn this again into a slogging match.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 07:58
  #11328 (permalink)  
 
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These are going to come in handy with the dam, the river and heck even skirting around the new defence line the Russians have thrown up.

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Old 6th Nov 2022, 08:08
  #11329 (permalink)  
 
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Given the mud, swamps and open flat farming areas, this might be the time to breakout some of those small combat hovercraft

IG
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 10:14
  #11330 (permalink)  
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On November 2 an entire Russian battalion made up by newly mobilized conscripts from Voronezh was wiped out near Makiivka, Luhansk. The commanding officers ran away. Out of 570 only 41 survived.

As expected, they are cannon fodder.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 13:00
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Khersonís abandoned city hall

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Old 6th Nov 2022, 13:04
  #11332 (permalink)  
 
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The end of July 100 volunteers set off to war in Ukraine, November they returned home….. all 12 of them.

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Old 6th Nov 2022, 13:57
  #11333 (permalink)  
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Following on to the cannon-fodder post above…

The grandiose claims about successful operations by Russians in Pavlivka and Uhledar direction have changed for "urgent appeals to the higher-ups to do something about it", as Sladkov cries about it in his latest post.



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Old 6th Nov 2022, 13:58
  #11334 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tdracer
One of the castings for the 747 main landing gear reportedly had a 4-year lead time .
Yes, those times can be reduced in a war emergency (and MBT castings are certainly less complex and material critical than a 747 landing gear), but agreed - 8 months is simply not going to happen.
Plus, the US isn't on a war footing...
Well, if it WAS on a war footing, it could accomplish something like this


in under two years - starting with bare fields and a workforce uneducated for the task at hand

### Warning: Aviation Content ###
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 14:03
  #11335 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC
On November 2 an entire Russian battalion made up by newly mobilized conscripts from Voronezh was wiped out near Makiivka, Luhansk. The commanding officers ran away. Out of 570 only 41 survived.

As expected, they are cannon fodder.
More inaccurate propaganda! I very much doubt that 529, out of the 570, died! There will have been casualties but also quite probably many who simply surrendered or ran away.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 14:11
  #11336 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by FUMR
More inaccurate propaganda! I very much doubt that 529, out of the 570, died! There will have been casualties but also quite probably many who simply surrendered or ran away.
Whatever the precise numbers, it seems unlikely that whoever remained would have been an effective fighting force. The earlier report of 12 remaining out of 100 Ďjoyfulí volunteers is only slightly better statistically - and they, apparently, were volunteers rather than conscripts.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 14:19
  #11337 (permalink)  
 
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Amidst the ‘joyful’ reactions to reputed further RU losses, I have to remind myself that UKR is also losing lives they can ill afford.

Please let this slaughter stop … soon.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 14:25
  #11338 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by FUMR
More inaccurate propaganda! I very much doubt that 529, out of the 570, died! There will have been casualties but also quite probably many who simply surrendered or ran away.
"...inaccurate propaganda.."?

The source is a Russian news site, not Ukrainian/other.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 14:36
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IG,maybe they(UKR) should think about those `Florida swamp airboats` and skidoos for operations when it gets wet/snowy.
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Old 6th Nov 2022, 14:40
  #11340 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Sue VÍtements
Well, if it WAS on a war footing, it could accomplish something like this

this

in under two years - starting with bare fields and a workforce uneducated for the task at hand

### Warning: Aviation Content ###
The lead time with technology development is much higher today than it was in 1940. The period from 1940 through to about 1958 had the fastest rate of technical development in aviation history, and was fairly impressive for land warfare technologies, and the navy below waterline definitely developed massively from the 40's to the late 60's. From there on, the tech has continued to develop, but has a much longer lead time to develop evolutionary change, and revolutionary changes while variable in development time, are much longer than prior generations. I suspect that more than ever before the fight gets done with the gear on hand. The B-29 took 4 years to put in the field, the P-51, "100 days", how long did the B-2, F-35 take? C3I and weapons integration takes a heck of a long time, other than 3D printing fins to put on a hand grenade and buying COTS quadcopters.
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