British Airways vs. BASSA (Airline Staff Only)
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seats4takeoff, Tiramisu
Sorry no tar throwing meant, I lost my sense of humour for a while. Yes there have been lots of very brave crew who came to work despite the intimidation. Wish I could have been there to support you all.
Sorry no tar throwing meant, I lost my sense of humour for a while. Yes there have been lots of very brave crew who came to work despite the intimidation. Wish I could have been there to support you all.
I for one hope that WW and BA will be able to weed out the wheat from the chaff and ensure that it is only strikers that get offered the 90-day 'take it or leave it' option.
As I understand matters the concept of LIFO is still acceptable when looking at the order of redundancies (or even SOSR), but with the modern slant of also using such matters as 'sickness' (or not real sickness!!), discipline record, time-keeping etc. Surely it would be completely possible, and legal, to ensure that any formula used by BA would be able to treat the strikers in the 'proper' manner!
Non-strikers would be deemed to have many positives, but strikers would be deemed to be what most of us consider them to be - pariahs intent on themselves, themselves and nothing but themselves!!
I really, really hope that those who have had the courage to go against the militant and selfish bassa lemmings get treated MUCH better than those selfish individuals who wish us all to sacrifise - but not them.
Come on Willie's lawyers - find a way to reward those who deserve reward, but most certainly ensure that the strikers get what they deserve - a P45 and no reference!!!!!!!!!!
As I understand matters the concept of LIFO is still acceptable when looking at the order of redundancies (or even SOSR), but with the modern slant of also using such matters as 'sickness' (or not real sickness!!), discipline record, time-keeping etc. Surely it would be completely possible, and legal, to ensure that any formula used by BA would be able to treat the strikers in the 'proper' manner!
Non-strikers would be deemed to have many positives, but strikers would be deemed to be what most of us consider them to be - pariahs intent on themselves, themselves and nothing but themselves!!
I really, really hope that those who have had the courage to go against the militant and selfish bassa lemmings get treated MUCH better than those selfish individuals who wish us all to sacrifise - but not them.
Come on Willie's lawyers - find a way to reward those who deserve reward, but most certainly ensure that the strikers get what they deserve - a P45 and no reference!!!!!!!!!!
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On the upside
Not wishing to downplay the seriousness of the impact of another strike (so soon after the last ones, and the ongoing ash crises), be it 10 days, 20 days or whatever, if i had to find an upside somewhere, after it is all over (whenever that will be), BA will have the most multi-skilled, crisis ready staff groups of any airline.
In my team of 12, between us we are now trained as VCC, WDC phone re-bookers, and now, thanks to Volcanic Ash, but sure to come in useful for strike times, Customer relations reps.
Its a small silver cloud, but i have to find one somewhere.
In my team of 12, between us we are now trained as VCC, WDC phone re-bookers, and now, thanks to Volcanic Ash, but sure to come in useful for strike times, Customer relations reps.
Its a small silver cloud, but i have to find one somewhere.
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What I don't understand is how the former Branch Secretary can still retain his position in BASSA. In my many years with BA, historically the role of the Branch Secretary has always been undertaken by current BA cabin crew.
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All this talk of a "vote" mystifies me. It is no more and no less than a straw poll and there was no legal requirement for it to have taken place. It is not moderated or audited (as paper ballots are) and so BASSA can announce whatever results they choose. I guess its FYI only and just part of some low level PR exercise. Its a real shame that the media doesn't see it for what it is.
There are 2000 fewer BASSA subscriptions being deducted from payroll (recently confirmed by WW at his forum) so this further weakens the maths methinks.
There are 2000 fewer BASSA subscriptions being deducted from payroll (recently confirmed by WW at his forum) so this further weakens the maths methinks.
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Sporran:
There seems to be some mis-understanding here. BA can give 90 days notice of compulsory redundancy to all CC NOW!
What BA may possibly be working towards is a position in which they can give 30 days pay (in lieu of notice) to any 'strikers' as of the 12th June!
HTH
PS: FG the most recent 'online poll' may simply have been a device to kick the dispute into the long grass until after the election. Pure and simple!
There seems to be some mis-understanding here. BA can give 90 days notice of compulsory redundancy to all CC NOW!
What BA may possibly be working towards is a position in which they can give 30 days pay (in lieu of notice) to any 'strikers' as of the 12th June!
HTH
PS: FG the most recent 'online poll' may simply have been a device to kick the dispute into the long grass until after the election. Pure and simple!
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On the upside
BAAlltheway,
My thoughts exactly. When the volcano blew in a big way on 14 April, the Waterside Disruption Centre was reactivated the next morning. This was possible only because BA was in a state of readiness for another strike.
Furthermore, several of the rebookers were able to hit the ground running as they had cut their teeth during the strikes.
As for VCC: in my department, I personally know three who have been trained and I am aware that several others have also been trained.
I also know some of the people who have manned the cabin crew helpline.
The bottom line is that BA now has a range of volunteers which would have been unthinkable less than a year ago.
My thoughts exactly. When the volcano blew in a big way on 14 April, the Waterside Disruption Centre was reactivated the next morning. This was possible only because BA was in a state of readiness for another strike.
Furthermore, several of the rebookers were able to hit the ground running as they had cut their teeth during the strikes.
As for VCC: in my department, I personally know three who have been trained and I am aware that several others have also been trained.
I also know some of the people who have manned the cabin crew helpline.
The bottom line is that BA now has a range of volunteers which would have been unthinkable less than a year ago.
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Tiramisu wrote:
Please don't worry, the posters here are not referring to the likes of you and me and many other cabin crew who backed BA and came to work. The references here are to the militant minority. The strike was a washout previously and it will be again. As for the intimidation, I refuse to tolerate it and BA were and are extremely supportive. It's zero tolerance to anyone who dares intimidate or harass anyone who chooses to come to work.
I am not 'militant' but will be going on strike when asked to do. From where I stand the bullying and harassment is only happening in one direction which in turn has hardened the resolve of many CC I know. As for the previous strike being a '"washout"....we will have to disagree on that idea, but I suppose if you believe all that comes out of the BA spin machine you will think that.
I am not 'militant' but will be going on strike when asked to do. From where I stand the bullying and harassment is only happening in one direction which in turn has hardened the resolve of many CC I know. As for the previous strike being a '"washout"....we will have to disagree on that idea, but I suppose if you believe all that comes out of the BA spin machine you will think that.
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seats4takeoff wrote:
"I will be coming in if there is a strike as I do not believe in my union , like many of us ... so again please please dont tar us all... many of us are hard working , good crew who will be in during a strike despite the intimidation we may suffer .... its not only Pilots , engineers, Ground Crew .. its the hard working honest Crew that will be in too"
That choice is for you....but have you wondered why WW wants as part of the agreement a deal that no legal action is taken by any in the future over the ST issue. Also are you aware of just what the redployment clause entails for your future. Just 2 points to consider apart from the many other issues ongoing.
And as for intimidation, I feel that is more within your head than hard fact....
That choice is for you....but have you wondered why WW wants as part of the agreement a deal that no legal action is taken by any in the future over the ST issue. Also are you aware of just what the redployment clause entails for your future. Just 2 points to consider apart from the many other issues ongoing.
And as for intimidation, I feel that is more within your head than hard fact....
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As for the previous strike being a '"washout"....we will have to disagree on that idea, but I suppose if you believe all that comes out of the BA spin machine you will think that.
The CRC was full, the flights were busy and my roster over BOTH strikes was impacted very little.
But then that comes when you believe the BASSA spin machine as well.
I firmly believe that the company have got this in grip, BASSA however have lost touch with reality.
Unite want closure, sadly after the Pensions debate when Unite forced BASSA's hand BASSA demanded a change in the rules. Now only BASSA may call off the dispute. As they have lost sight of the original causes and only seem to want to concentrate on protecting their mates and demanding back 'perks' they are willing to throw the members to the lions for it.
Shame really as the vast majority of CC are good, well meaning and intelligent people who can see what is happening hence they broke the strike.
Time for BASSA to be put mercifully out of its own misery.
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Top Bunk wrote:
"As you say though, I think a stitch-up is more likely, with stories of fat-cat union leaders, £460,000 houses, 20 hours flying in the last 12 months, £42,000 salary plus Unite union pay featuring heavily in any printed articles"
Now I wonder where you got those facts from....maybe the same papers that were quoted in the previous post to yours by LD12896.
Ha! Just carry on believing what YOU want to....and maybe listen to the interview on Tuesday and maybe you will learn one or two new facts to chew on.
Now I wonder where you got those facts from....maybe the same papers that were quoted in the previous post to yours by LD12896.
Ha! Just carry on believing what YOU want to....and maybe listen to the interview on Tuesday and maybe you will learn one or two new facts to chew on.
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Originally Posted by Juan Odeboyse
From where I stand the bullying and harassment is only happening in one direction
Currently in a longhaul destination - the militant minority members of the crew have whipped the rest of the crew into a pilot hating frenzy. They now refuse to sit, talk, eat or take a drink from the pilots, I have also been sent to Coventry for going out eating with flight deck.
This unacceptable behaviour by the militant minority needs to be stamped out.
Last edited by Meal Chucker; 9th May 2010 at 09:03.
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I'm really at a loss to understand where we go from here. BA lost £1billion last year and are expected to lose £600million this year. We are facing a crisis with our pension funds and a volcano.
CC were asked to make some savings along with other groups who agreed. My salary is down approx 10% from last year, even though I have moved up a pay point.
BASSA were unable for historic reasons to negotiate effectively so BA were eventually forced to remove a crew member from most longhaul flights, and 2 off some, the CSD had to work in the Club cabin, which most were doing anyway. This has not impacted to any great extent on Customer service, which anyway is BA's concern, not BASSA's.
CC have been offered a new deal, which I believe has 3 years of pay rises in line with RPI and a monthly travel payment to replace the existing unfair box payment system.
BASSA also want crew members on disciplinaries after allegedly intimidating other staff reinstated and ST reinstated. BA will not move on these points, partly because other staff who are taking the pain now and didn't strike would be incensed.
So where do we go now?
CC were asked to make some savings along with other groups who agreed. My salary is down approx 10% from last year, even though I have moved up a pay point.
BASSA were unable for historic reasons to negotiate effectively so BA were eventually forced to remove a crew member from most longhaul flights, and 2 off some, the CSD had to work in the Club cabin, which most were doing anyway. This has not impacted to any great extent on Customer service, which anyway is BA's concern, not BASSA's.
CC have been offered a new deal, which I believe has 3 years of pay rises in line with RPI and a monthly travel payment to replace the existing unfair box payment system.
BASSA also want crew members on disciplinaries after allegedly intimidating other staff reinstated and ST reinstated. BA will not move on these points, partly because other staff who are taking the pain now and didn't strike would be incensed.
So where do we go now?
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OK JO
.... tell us which of the above reported facts are incorrect.
The point I was making is that when you put your head above the parapet and into the media spotlight, they don't necessarily ask the questions of your choice / report the 'facts' you want / stick to the agenda of your choosing. They all have their own political agenda as determined by their owners and their readership / viewer profile.
DH will not control the output in the press, and possibly only a little more so on a radio show (where the interviewer has no knowledge or interest in the subject and doesn't ask probing questions).
He would be better sticking to doing a interview with Socialist Worker if he wants sympathy, I predict that there will be little elsewhere.
"As you say though, I think a stitch-up is more likely, with stories of fat-cat union leaders, £460,000 houses, 20 hours flying in the last 12 months, £42,000 salary plus Unite union pay featuring heavily in any printed articles"
Now I wonder where you got those facts from....maybe the same papers that were quoted in the previous post to yours by LD12896.
Now I wonder where you got those facts from....maybe the same papers that were quoted in the previous post to yours by LD12896.
The point I was making is that when you put your head above the parapet and into the media spotlight, they don't necessarily ask the questions of your choice / report the 'facts' you want / stick to the agenda of your choosing. They all have their own political agenda as determined by their owners and their readership / viewer profile.
DH will not control the output in the press, and possibly only a little more so on a radio show (where the interviewer has no knowledge or interest in the subject and doesn't ask probing questions).
He would be better sticking to doing a interview with Socialist Worker if he wants sympathy, I predict that there will be little elsewhere.
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Juan, I wish you well!
And if continued striking is what you perceive as the right thing to do I will not stand in your way.
On the other hand you can not blame the majority of crew who have seen sense and are coming to work!
(and yes, over 60% is the majority, even though you still like to delude yourself with propaganda stating otherwise)
And perhaps you can't blame BA for taking decisive measures against people who seem so selfishly hell bend on getting their own way at ANY price.
Past negotiation attempts have proven that BA could hand us a blank cheque and BASSA would still find loopholes in it.
I worked during both strikes, I worked on 747's with full service and no VCC's. I saw CRC full at 7.30 in the morning, only to see a BASSA SMS that same evening claiming only 26 people had reported for work
However I doubt very much BA will let you continue much longer with this selfish path of destruction.
Something that BASSA and CC89 seem so very intend on.
I know, you are not in BASSA, so it's CC89 then.
Even though their members used be known as the less hardline and more intelligent.
Time seems to change everything.
And if continued striking is what you perceive as the right thing to do I will not stand in your way.
On the other hand you can not blame the majority of crew who have seen sense and are coming to work!
(and yes, over 60% is the majority, even though you still like to delude yourself with propaganda stating otherwise)
And perhaps you can't blame BA for taking decisive measures against people who seem so selfishly hell bend on getting their own way at ANY price.
Past negotiation attempts have proven that BA could hand us a blank cheque and BASSA would still find loopholes in it.
I worked during both strikes, I worked on 747's with full service and no VCC's. I saw CRC full at 7.30 in the morning, only to see a BASSA SMS that same evening claiming only 26 people had reported for work
However I doubt very much BA will let you continue much longer with this selfish path of destruction.
Something that BASSA and CC89 seem so very intend on.
I know, you are not in BASSA, so it's CC89 then.
Even though their members used be known as the less hardline and more intelligent.
Time seems to change everything.
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I worked during both strikes too, but I noticed, frequently, that BA.com was a sea of red when studying departures from LHR. The crew room was busy, but there were alot of non-crew in there plus a surplus of pilots.
I commute home with another airline and whilst awaiting to depart I noted just how quiet LHR was. Indeed, it was a first, when my aircraft pushed back and taxied directly to take off. I arrived home early, before schedule!
Both sides spin, thats the game, and fools are the ones who take the word of just one side. As none striker who was there I would say the strike had an impact at LHR. Unfortunately Walsh & Co cannot admit this.
I commute home with another airline and whilst awaiting to depart I noted just how quiet LHR was. Indeed, it was a first, when my aircraft pushed back and taxied directly to take off. I arrived home early, before schedule!
Both sides spin, thats the game, and fools are the ones who take the word of just one side. As none striker who was there I would say the strike had an impact at LHR. Unfortunately Walsh & Co cannot admit this.
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I don't recall Walsh ever saying the strike hadn't had an impact. He did say that BA managed to carry over 70% of booked passengers, which is a crystal clear admission that 30% weren't carried. The cancellation boards were indeed a sea of red, but the vast majority of the cancelled flights were short haul, which is disproportionately affected by strike action (one crew doesn't show, 3 flights cancelled on EF as opposed to one on WW). Almost all 777 flights got away last time, and BA had VCC to spare because they weren't 747 trained. Now they are 747 trained, they can serve hot meals, they'll have yet more full time crew reporting as they are sick of the strike and probably can't avoid it through a fluke of rostering and they've had even more time to plan their response. The strike was ineffective last time. It'll be a flop this time!
Meal Chucker
Currently in a longhaul destination - the militant minority members of the crew have whipped the rest of the crew into a pilot hating frenzy. They now refuse to sit, talk, eat or take a drink from the pilots.
I have also been sent to Coventry for going out eating with flight deck.