British Airways vs. BASSA (Airline Staff Only)
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Ahem Wrbelestrum...I do not belong to Bassa but am very supportive of UNITE and its intended actions.
Irrespective of what you think Unite might be up to BASSA have, under Unites rules, the final say on what is and isn't accepted.
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Mealchucker
I was made aware of a similar situation on my last flight, unfortunately I didn't find out until after engine shut down. Back to back East Coast trip, on the first nightstop the CC met up and discussed the strike, one crewmember said that she hadn't gone on strike and gave their reasons why - at which point they got shouted down by a vocal few. Others remained silent and later confided to her in private that they hadn't gone on strike either but had found it easier to either not say anything or lie and say they went on strike. On the subsequent night stops (Arora and 2nd East Coast) the one stdss was deliberately not invited out.
As we walked off the aircraft this stdss was very upset, I asked what was wrong and she told me - at half way up the jetty she turned around and said, "It may be better if you didn't walk with me through the terminal"
On the bus she and one of the others whom had remained silent said that during the strike the atmosphere was fantastic at work and they really enjoyed their trips - this one they hadn't.
I was made aware of a similar situation on my last flight, unfortunately I didn't find out until after engine shut down. Back to back East Coast trip, on the first nightstop the CC met up and discussed the strike, one crewmember said that she hadn't gone on strike and gave their reasons why - at which point they got shouted down by a vocal few. Others remained silent and later confided to her in private that they hadn't gone on strike either but had found it easier to either not say anything or lie and say they went on strike. On the subsequent night stops (Arora and 2nd East Coast) the one stdss was deliberately not invited out.
As we walked off the aircraft this stdss was very upset, I asked what was wrong and she told me - at half way up the jetty she turned around and said, "It may be better if you didn't walk with me through the terminal"
On the bus she and one of the others whom had remained silent said that during the strike the atmosphere was fantastic at work and they really enjoyed their trips - this one they hadn't.
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Originally posted by Juan Odeboyse
I am not 'militant' but will be going on strike when asked to do. From where I stand the bullying and harassment is only happening in one direction which in turn has hardened the resolve of many CC I know.
I am not 'militant' but will be going on strike when asked to do. From where I stand the bullying and harassment is only happening in one direction which in turn has hardened the resolve of many CC I know.
I respect your decision to strike and do what you are asked to.
My question is why don't the strikers respect the decision of us non strikers and non unionised cabin crew to come to work?
Why do they intimidate crew who chose to come to work by ostracising us with the silent treatment, the stares, the malicious gossip and alienate crew on flights against us?
My concern is that in doing so it affects CRM and the onboard service. In an emergency where you would need to work as a team and have crew onside, the safety of our customers could also be compromised.
The bullying and harassment is rife from the strikers, period. I have experienced it first hand without going into detail here and our flight crew colleagues have witnessed it. Read Crew Forum and BASSA forum and I'm shocked that some crew have even admitted it in writing and are revelling in this whole disgraceful and intolerable behaviour!
I'm BA cabin crew and the above are my personal views.
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Strike washout
Juan Odeboyse wrote:
Once again you have been caught out making statements without factual backing. BA issued this release to the stock market:
As has been noted on a number of occasions, BA cannot legally misinform the Stock Exchange. On the other hand, Unite can publish all kind of wrong figures, like the 26 crew who turned up for work, the 20 planes parked at Shannon, the 20 planes parked at Cardiff, etc, etc.
As for the previous strike being a '"washout"....we will have to disagree on that idea, but I suppose if you believe all that comes out of the BA spin machine you will think that.
Traffic And Capacity Statistics – March 2010 Posted on Wednesday, April 7th, 2010
Summary of the headline figures
In March 2010 traffic, measured in Revenue Passenger Kilometres, fell by 11.4 per cent on March 2009. Passenger capacity, measured in Available Seat Kilometres, was down 13.7 per cent. This resulted in a passenger load factor increase of 2.0 points versus last year, to 74.7 per cent.Traffic comprised a 7.2 per cent decrease in premium traffic and a 12.2 per cent decrease in non-premium traffic.
Both traffic and capacity were affected by the strike action by cabin crew represented by the Unite union. Planned winter capacity reductions account for half of the decline in capacity for the month, with half due to the strikes. As outlined previously, over the first strike weekend the airline operated 78 per cent of its longhaul programme and 50 per cent of shorthaul; for the second strike weekend these figures rose to 83 per cent and 67 per cent respectively. For the seven days of strikes the airline operated 79 per cent of longhaul flights and 58 per cent of shorthaul.
Cargo, measured in Cargo Tonne Kilometres, rose by 6.4 per cent; volumes were helped by the additional capacity available during the strike periods.
The total impact of the strike action in the month is estimated to be £40-£45 million.
Summary of the headline figures
In March 2010 traffic, measured in Revenue Passenger Kilometres, fell by 11.4 per cent on March 2009. Passenger capacity, measured in Available Seat Kilometres, was down 13.7 per cent. This resulted in a passenger load factor increase of 2.0 points versus last year, to 74.7 per cent.Traffic comprised a 7.2 per cent decrease in premium traffic and a 12.2 per cent decrease in non-premium traffic.
Both traffic and capacity were affected by the strike action by cabin crew represented by the Unite union. Planned winter capacity reductions account for half of the decline in capacity for the month, with half due to the strikes. As outlined previously, over the first strike weekend the airline operated 78 per cent of its longhaul programme and 50 per cent of shorthaul; for the second strike weekend these figures rose to 83 per cent and 67 per cent respectively. For the seven days of strikes the airline operated 79 per cent of longhaul flights and 58 per cent of shorthaul.
Cargo, measured in Cargo Tonne Kilometres, rose by 6.4 per cent; volumes were helped by the additional capacity available during the strike periods.
The total impact of the strike action in the month is estimated to be £40-£45 million.
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Duncan Holley
What happened to the much-trumpeted Duncan Holley interview that was supposed to have been published in the "Sunday Times"?
Was there any press coverage of the former BASSA branch secretary in any of the Sunday newspapers?
That leaves the interview between Richard - sorry, Duncan - and Victoria Derbyshire on Radio Five Live on Tuesday (perhaps).
Was there any press coverage of the former BASSA branch secretary in any of the Sunday newspapers?
That leaves the interview between Richard - sorry, Duncan - and Victoria Derbyshire on Radio Five Live on Tuesday (perhaps).
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Cabin crew industrial action, strike alleged flop, 70% of passengers reach destination - Walsh tells world, BA in fight for survival, 40,000 jobs under threat.
Volcanic ash, nobody reaches any destination, estimated losses of £20m per day - Walsh tells world, BA has plenty of cash and loans in reserve to see the crisis through.
Chance of cabin crew accepting a deal which will bring action to an end, Walsh sacks senior rep before poll closes and ensures a decisive 'no' vote. I want this resolved, does Walsh?, At every possible opportunity he appears to stick the knife in. Thank heavens the Independent noted this stance in a recent article, are we the only ones who have?
Volcanic ash, nobody reaches any destination, estimated losses of £20m per day - Walsh tells world, BA has plenty of cash and loans in reserve to see the crisis through.
Chance of cabin crew accepting a deal which will bring action to an end, Walsh sacks senior rep before poll closes and ensures a decisive 'no' vote. I want this resolved, does Walsh?, At every possible opportunity he appears to stick the knife in. Thank heavens the Independent noted this stance in a recent article, are we the only ones who have?
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I'm afraid I'll have to beg to differ again. Walsh isn't sticking the knife in. Walsh has offered a series of acceptable deals to the cabin crew community, starting with a basic reduction in crewing complements, share options and no new fleet. BASSA on the other hand have continuously rejected these offers, occasionally making some grossly inferior counter-offers which even a 10 year old could see didn't add up to the savings they claimed. Meanwhile the BASSA reps have engaged in a scorched earth campaign, encouraging the intimidation of colleagues on both sides of the flight deck door.Holley has appeared on a national radio talk show in breach of his contractual restrictions, attacking the company, it's management and pilots, and engaged in personal, public attacks on individual pilots, giving more than enough information for them to be easily identified by the wider community. I ask you, do you really think his continued employment in BA was tenable? Just how many of BAs employment regulations do you think BASSA reps should be allowed to break before they are dismissed?
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That depends whether you think that BASSA represent the cabin crew community or vice versa. Just because a deal isn't acceptable to the political hacks at BASSA doesn't mean it's unacceptable to the crew. They simply vote they way BASSA tell them with scant regard for their own feelings. That is the way the union works.
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Hand Solo
Do you really believe that the crew community give no thought to the situation they are in? I would imagine that most crew are part of a household, with responsibilities not just for themselves. Do you not think that any debate has gone on?
I bet thousands of wives, husbands, partners, children and parents have discussed this over and over again and still there was a 5000+ rejection, with all that comes with it.
I bet thousands of wives, husbands, partners, children and parents have discussed this over and over again and still there was a 5000+ rejection, with all that comes with it.
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Litebulb
The crew I have spoken to about this have given their reasons for the original strike vote as...
1) We need to send a message to WW.
2) I agree that something needs to be done but negotiation not imposition.
3) I'm worried about new fleet.
Most didn't know what was on the table from BF and were just looking at the BASSA releases.
When I produced a copy of what BA had offered there was generally one of two reactions...
a) I didn't know that, well anyway it's about imposition.
b) I didn't know that, well I don't trust them.
Not once has any CC, that I have spoken to (admittedly a small sample), actually said that they found BA's proposals unacceptable.
Cheers
BB
The crew I have spoken to about this have given their reasons for the original strike vote as...
1) We need to send a message to WW.
2) I agree that something needs to be done but negotiation not imposition.
3) I'm worried about new fleet.
Most didn't know what was on the table from BF and were just looking at the BASSA releases.
When I produced a copy of what BA had offered there was generally one of two reactions...
a) I didn't know that, well anyway it's about imposition.
b) I didn't know that, well I don't trust them.
Not once has any CC, that I have spoken to (admittedly a small sample), actually said that they found BA's proposals unacceptable.
Cheers
BB
They may have discussed their options but from my discussions, few have actually investigated BA's offers in any depth. Not helped, of course, that BASSA chose not to disseminate the offers. It's very difficult to make a reasoned judgement with only half the facts.
And now that the price-fixing trial has collapsed it will be interesting to see how BASSA spin this latest piece of news.
And now that the price-fixing trial has collapsed it will be interesting to see how BASSA spin this latest piece of news.
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Interesting to see that BA have highlighted to the Union that there original strike mandate was over imposition and not staff travel. Maybe another injunction on the way or will Willie Walsh let them go all the way this time.
British Airways staff to meet union for strike talks | Business | guardian.co.uk
British Airways staff to meet union for strike talks | Business | guardian.co.uk
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a question to ponder :-
How unfair is it that a Union like Unite (that has nothing to lose by even bankrupting a company like BA), can cause such financial damage by announcing long strikes.
Surely UK PLC can fight back rather than see more multi million pound losses happen ? It just seems very wrong to me .... especially as there are many other employees of BA who depend on the company to live
Surely UK PLC can fight back rather than see more multi million pound losses happen ? It just seems very wrong to me .... especially as there are many other employees of BA who depend on the company to live
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But the question the rest of the employees in BA are asking is
"When will you accept that the dispute is over?"
Will you need to get a text message (or txt msg) from BASSA formally announcing that their conditions for settlement have been reached (whatever THEY are ...answers on a postcard please) or will you actually make up your own mind after a second or even third monthly pay cheque that has massive deductions from your industrial-action-inspired absences?
Or will it be when the new contract lands on the doormat saying "sign me or you are no longer an employee"?
Because, believe me, we all know that you have lost, and the longer this farce goes on the more painful, in a very personal sense, that loss is going to get.
BASSA officers may have a comfortable sinecure within UNITE to fall back on, but what of the rest of you? After a few months even a New Fleet contract will look pretty tempting, but will it still be available?
If you want to know how grim it is "outside" try having a chat with some of the "temporary" crew. They will tell you all you need to know about how cushy your present life is.
And you are about to throw it all away.
"When will you accept that the dispute is over?"
Will you need to get a text message (or txt msg) from BASSA formally announcing that their conditions for settlement have been reached (whatever THEY are ...answers on a postcard please) or will you actually make up your own mind after a second or even third monthly pay cheque that has massive deductions from your industrial-action-inspired absences?
Or will it be when the new contract lands on the doormat saying "sign me or you are no longer an employee"?
Because, believe me, we all know that you have lost, and the longer this farce goes on the more painful, in a very personal sense, that loss is going to get.
BASSA officers may have a comfortable sinecure within UNITE to fall back on, but what of the rest of you? After a few months even a New Fleet contract will look pretty tempting, but will it still be available?
If you want to know how grim it is "outside" try having a chat with some of the "temporary" crew. They will tell you all you need to know about how cushy your present life is.
And you are about to throw it all away.
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I think anyone who goes on strike because BA have imposed the changes rather then negotiated needs to read in full and digest the court judgement written after the 12 days of Christmas fiasco.
There really is little room for concluding that BA have been unfair in these "negotiations" or that imposition was not necessary.
There really is little room for concluding that BA have been unfair in these "negotiations" or that imposition was not necessary.
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Juan Odeboyse says ...lots of things seem really wrong hence why we are still in dispute with BA
Ok, i challenge you to list the 'lots of things' and we will see how relevant they are for a company in BA's financial position?
BA will lose patience with you soon. BA CC may generally be a good bunch of people but the militant minority need to be booted out and are a disgrace to a financially struggling company. You are entitled to your view but most of us love our company and get very sad when you lot try and bring it down.
If i had a £1 for every time, a cabin crew member has said to me that the job is really easy/not rocket science,i will be on as much as a long haul CSD!
Anyway, they have been meeting all day - must be about time for the latest Unite press release now ...
Ok, i challenge you to list the 'lots of things' and we will see how relevant they are for a company in BA's financial position?
BA will lose patience with you soon. BA CC may generally be a good bunch of people but the militant minority need to be booted out and are a disgrace to a financially struggling company. You are entitled to your view but most of us love our company and get very sad when you lot try and bring it down.
If i had a £1 for every time, a cabin crew member has said to me that the job is really easy/not rocket science,i will be on as much as a long haul CSD!
Anyway, they have been meeting all day - must be about time for the latest Unite press release now ...
License to Fly, UNITE are a large organisation that has influence well beyond being a trade union. They are the Labour party's biggest single donor, and have naturally been lobbying behind the scenes, particularly in the recent political environment, in an effort to gain further sway. Ultimately, they don't give a damn about what they see as a capitalist company (though they are happy to reap any rewards of capitalist business 
), they are only really interested in control.
BASSA are an understudy of UNITE, whose hierarchy are control freaks of a particularly virulent form - they just cannot believe that BA wants to wrest back control of it's own business.
Has anyone noticed how Len McCluskey suddenly disappeared from the public pronouncements of UNITE when he belatedly realised BA were not going to back down? McCluskey wants to be boss of UNITE, and suddenly realised just how weak and damaging this strike was ... so he vanished, literally. McCluslkey was right at the forefront of the foot-stomping and sloganeering - it was he who announced the (failed) 12-day strike around Christmas ..... but where is he now? Not a peep has been heard from this bloke for weeks. He is attempting to keep his nose clean for the leadership contest ("That fiasco at BA? Nowt to do with me .....")
Simpson and Woodley have been left to 'do the dirty', and they, too, realise that their cause is weak, but they have been left without a get-out. Not that they are overly concerned - their time at Unite is shortly over so they will retire with some hefty pensions and freebies, all courtesy of UNITE subscription-payers, many of whom are jobless, and some more of whom will be jobless very shortly.
Thats life!
), they are only really interested in control.BASSA are an understudy of UNITE, whose hierarchy are control freaks of a particularly virulent form - they just cannot believe that BA wants to wrest back control of it's own business.
Has anyone noticed how Len McCluskey suddenly disappeared from the public pronouncements of UNITE when he belatedly realised BA were not going to back down? McCluskey wants to be boss of UNITE, and suddenly realised just how weak and damaging this strike was ... so he vanished, literally. McCluslkey was right at the forefront of the foot-stomping and sloganeering - it was he who announced the (failed) 12-day strike around Christmas ..... but where is he now? Not a peep has been heard from this bloke for weeks. He is attempting to keep his nose clean for the leadership contest ("That fiasco at BA? Nowt to do with me .....")
Simpson and Woodley have been left to 'do the dirty', and they, too, realise that their cause is weak, but they have been left without a get-out. Not that they are overly concerned - their time at Unite is shortly over so they will retire with some hefty pensions and freebies, all courtesy of UNITE subscription-payers, many of whom are jobless, and some more of whom will be jobless very shortly.
Thats life!
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Blood is boiling
Just Heard The News Re The Strike. I Just Deleted My Intended Post, Expletives Would Have Rendered It Unprintable
Suffice To Say, Please Take A Wide Birth From Me You Guys And Girls That Are Going To Strike...please.
I'm At A Loss...the Public Are At a Loss...what Are You Thinking?
Suffice To Say, Please Take A Wide Birth From Me You Guys And Girls That Are Going To Strike...please.
I'm At A Loss...the Public Are At a Loss...what Are You Thinking?
Last edited by ranger07; 10th May 2010 at 15:28. Reason: repeated word...my anger is getting the better of me