BA Cabin Crew Strike Threat
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It disappoints me that for months now my flight crew colleagues have been asking me "so what are you guys doing about the pension, are you going to support us?" As soon as a deal is acceptable to BALPA, the crew start moaning about how could other people be so inconsiderate to threaten strike action and endanger all our jobs. Somewhat hypocritical
but when has it been any different in the last 5 years?
Xploy, you are exactly right my friend
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My point RIMMER is that never mind the subject whether it pensions or terms and conditions. Flight crew are prepared to threaten strike action to defend their terms and conditions and have to a large extent been successful. Yes flight crew have moved with the times but had they had a weaker union they would be significantly worse off. Yet when another group of staff wish to defend their terms and conditions they are quick to critisize. Yes some of the cabin crew terms and conditions and agreements amaze me. But just because others have worse conditions why shouldnt they defend them. Soon we will reach a point that unless we are all on minimum wage we have no right to moan which is the point of view of the media when such action occurs.
Engineers have a reached a point of such apathy with our union that we will not defend our terms and conditions just moan about them. But that does not stop us from making observations or supporting our colleagues.
Engineers have a reached a point of such apathy with our union that we will not defend our terms and conditions just moan about them. But that does not stop us from making observations or supporting our colleagues.
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I agree with you the new contract rates are rubbish, that isn't part of this dispute though as far as i knew, i would imagine if the big earners are now the minority the way to go is for Bassa to offer BA something in exchange for a review ( longhaul / shorthaul integration maybe )?
Maybe you should ask for expenses to be incorperated?
So what is BA trying to change that you have written down as a union agreement?
Maybe you should ask for expenses to be incorperated?
So what is BA trying to change that you have written down as a union agreement?
L337...It doesnt bloody matter what the name of the thread is, my point is that there are some rather bizarre postings in their from BA f/d on cloud cuckoo land! Fortunately I am very pro flight deck (rare in BA i know and perhaps I should not be) but I always defend them....just not a few certain individuals. However I dont think the cabin crew possible going on strike should be a "them and us" topic simply because we do totally different jobs and totally different pay levels, we simply work on the same tubs!!!
Its very sad because I dont think we will ever see in BA the likes of support amongst colleagues as we had in EI when willie was doing his business whereby Cabin Crew went out in support of the flight deck crew! Now that was a strong message of no confidence. I just dont think people have the balls in BA!
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I agree totally with you apaddyinuk. I am pro flight and cabin crew and anyone that is proactive and passionate about their job and wishes to defend their terms and conditions. Divide and conquer works. We all work together yet somehow when it comes to the crunch lots of secret deals are made with flying crew while groundstaff look on in amazement, which isnt right either.
I am not going to go into final salary pensions... for instance a group of staff (the majority) who have 7 increments and often in my department work for 49 years 42 on top increment and then retire versus one department that has 24 increments for an fo and a further 24 for a captain so effectively one could hang on as a career fo for 30 years ending up on pay point 24 fo and then five years before you are due to retire and enter a type freeze. Take a command course and jump to pay point 24 captain- a close to 40000 pound pay rise and profit from that when you retire five years later having only made five years contributions at that top rate.
That is why flight crew stand to lose the most. The final salary pension aps or naps is a fantastic deal for staff who have a pay that more than doubles in the term of their employment. An average salary pension or money purchase pension will never match that deal. In fact as an ex cadet pay will quadruple in the term of employment!
I am not going to go into final salary pensions... for instance a group of staff (the majority) who have 7 increments and often in my department work for 49 years 42 on top increment and then retire versus one department that has 24 increments for an fo and a further 24 for a captain so effectively one could hang on as a career fo for 30 years ending up on pay point 24 fo and then five years before you are due to retire and enter a type freeze. Take a command course and jump to pay point 24 captain- a close to 40000 pound pay rise and profit from that when you retire five years later having only made five years contributions at that top rate.
That is why flight crew stand to lose the most. The final salary pension aps or naps is a fantastic deal for staff who have a pay that more than doubles in the term of their employment. An average salary pension or money purchase pension will never match that deal. In fact as an ex cadet pay will quadruple in the term of employment!
Last edited by PaulW; 16th Jan 2007 at 16:02.
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apaddyinuk
As BA FD, I sympathise with the position of very many BA cabin crew. I genuinely believe we have many of the best (and a few of the worst!) in the business. I am sorry if the impression you, or any other cc, have got is that the pilot community is at best ambivalent, or at worst, hostile to the current action.
I would like to think that the overwhelming majority of us, are indeed sympathetic on an 'individual' basis. I just wish your union was a little 'smarter', that's all.
But then, perhaps mine could be too.
As BA FD, I sympathise with the position of very many BA cabin crew. I genuinely believe we have many of the best (and a few of the worst!) in the business. I am sorry if the impression you, or any other cc, have got is that the pilot community is at best ambivalent, or at worst, hostile to the current action.
I would like to think that the overwhelming majority of us, are indeed sympathetic on an 'individual' basis. I just wish your union was a little 'smarter', that's all.
But then, perhaps mine could be too.
Paxing All Over The World
A simple pax of 41 years paxing experience speaking.
To the CC. I must say: "Great sympathy with your situation but ... tough, that is life in the UK in the 21st century." I have said the same in the Pilots Strike thread and it seems, to an outsider, that their grievance is greater. They are seeking to make the company pay what they have already earned and you are seeking to make BA continue paying into the future.
Flying Lawyer in post #76 of this thread said it all and I would add, that bad managment is not the preserve of BA. Those companies where a decision to rationalise is started at the top and promulgated downwards with clear explanations, sympathy and alternatives? Nope, I ain't seen many of them either.
bermudatriangle
Eeerrr - No! It tells him that CC have made a crucial error of thinking that it is the 1970s. Strike action will not be seen as valid by the public. The only ones who are likely to get that support are teachers and medical staff.
Why? Because most folks in the UK work steadily and have to meet high payments for housing, due to the tragic way in which the property market has been allowed to let rip by the banks and government. Folks see their conditions of contract eroded all the time - why not yours too?
One of the problems for those that join the airline world is that your whole career tends to be in the airline world (naturally so for flight crew). This means that you only hear about the loss of conditions in other fields at second hand. Yes, of course, your families and spouses may work in loval govt or commerce but you run the risk of only seeing how the airline world was 20 years ago and it has always been different to the rest of us. After all - that is why many of you went into it!
Dogs_ears_up
Yep, that goes for me. I'm sorry but this strike will fail not least as BA would rather the CC strike and damage the company than that the pilots strike. You can replace CC faster and more cheaply then pilots. The qualities and training for CC can be met much more easily. If the CC strike and damage the company, then the FC have an even bigger problem on their hands. If they had co-ordinated and made the two strikes coincide?? Just possibly, they might have moved the mountain but that will not happen and each union is going their own way. Once again, just as BA need.
I am sorry to see other people gaining bad management and then losing their conditions of contract BUT that is the same gain and loss that I have seen and experienced in the past 16 years since the recession of 1990/91 turned the tables. The airline world is far behind others in this process.
You might say that you have negotiated all that you can and had to draw a line somewhere, just remember that the mgmt and board have been preparing for this far longer than you.
Once again, I'm sorry.
To the CC. I must say: "Great sympathy with your situation but ... tough, that is life in the UK in the 21st century." I have said the same in the Pilots Strike thread and it seems, to an outsider, that their grievance is greater. They are seeking to make the company pay what they have already earned and you are seeking to make BA continue paying into the future.
Flying Lawyer in post #76 of this thread said it all and I would add, that bad managment is not the preserve of BA. Those companies where a decision to rationalise is started at the top and promulgated downwards with clear explanations, sympathy and alternatives? Nope, I ain't seen many of them either.
bermudatriangle
The strike vote sends a clear message to Willie Walsh that his bullying, blinkered, misguided leadership that he has brought to this once wonderful company has to change.
Why? Because most folks in the UK work steadily and have to meet high payments for housing, due to the tragic way in which the property market has been allowed to let rip by the banks and government. Folks see their conditions of contract eroded all the time - why not yours too?
One of the problems for those that join the airline world is that your whole career tends to be in the airline world (naturally so for flight crew). This means that you only hear about the loss of conditions in other fields at second hand. Yes, of course, your families and spouses may work in loval govt or commerce but you run the risk of only seeing how the airline world was 20 years ago and it has always been different to the rest of us. After all - that is why many of you went into it!
Dogs_ears_up
If I'm wrong, then I intend to return to this thread and apologise - I don't wish for BA crew to lose, I just think that they will.
I am sorry to see other people gaining bad management and then losing their conditions of contract BUT that is the same gain and loss that I have seen and experienced in the past 16 years since the recession of 1990/91 turned the tables. The airline world is far behind others in this process.
You might say that you have negotiated all that you can and had to draw a line somewhere, just remember that the mgmt and board have been preparing for this far longer than you.
Once again, I'm sorry.
Junior trash
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I am not going to go into final salary pensions... for instance a group of staff (the majority) who have 7 increments and often in my department work for 49 years 42 on top increment and then retire versus one department that has 24 increments for an fo and a further 24 for a captain so effectively one could hang on as a career fo for 30 years ending up on pay point 24 fo and then five years before you are due to retire and enter a type freeze. Take a command course and jump to pay point 24 captain- a close to 40000 pound pay rise and profit from that when you retire five years later having only made five years contributions at that top rate.
Also there is presumably a chance to be promoted to other grades in your dept (I appreciate there is no guaranteed promotion) but if you did get a promotion say 5 years before retirement would you not expect to gain in retirement from that?
As for secret deals, well all the unions (except those that were too busy) were at the meeting so i dont see what the big secret was.
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PaulW
I am all for defending Terms and Conditions but i know of no written signed union agreements that BA are trying to change, i am not here for a wind up i want to know what they are trying to change, believe me if you do go out BA has a fantastic PR machine and to have support you will need to be clear on what they are doing, as now i don't see it.
Quote "Engineers have a reached a point of such apathy with our union that we will not defend our terms and conditions just moan about them. But that does not stop us from making observations or supporting our colleagues."
No idea what you are trying to say there mate.
AP
I commiserate with you over the interview i have had one or two, however its the same there for you and I, the time to oppose EG300 has passed and being unhappy is not a good enough reason to strike.
As for your other comments if you have an agreement to certain pay levels and BA are changing them without negotiation you have my and the majority of the engineers support
PaulW
Tell me about it but your guilty of the same as me Envy, we in engineering have 2 increments and that's it, do the pilots do well Payment Vs payout from NAPs over their Careers - blood right they do certainly better than us, I see no reason at all why my Union should recommend acceptance, however going off track, if you said to me BA were enforcing changes to my pension that are not the same as other groups we would know what's happening and you would get 100% support.
Quote "That is why flight crew stand to lose the most. The final salary pension APS or naps is a fantastic deal for staff who have a pay that more than doubles in the term of their employment. An average salary pension or money purchase pension will never match that deal. In fact as an ex cadet pay will quadruple in the term of employment!"
We know that as well, we believe its one of the reasons for the £2.1 Billion deficit but you announced your strike ballot with negotiations continuing, if its the pension we might join you!
Hotel
Quote"As for secret deals, well all the unions (except those that were too busy) were at the meeting so i dont see what the big secret was.
Seems the GMB found it though!
I am all for defending Terms and Conditions but i know of no written signed union agreements that BA are trying to change, i am not here for a wind up i want to know what they are trying to change, believe me if you do go out BA has a fantastic PR machine and to have support you will need to be clear on what they are doing, as now i don't see it.
Quote "Engineers have a reached a point of such apathy with our union that we will not defend our terms and conditions just moan about them. But that does not stop us from making observations or supporting our colleagues."
No idea what you are trying to say there mate.
AP
I commiserate with you over the interview i have had one or two, however its the same there for you and I, the time to oppose EG300 has passed and being unhappy is not a good enough reason to strike.
As for your other comments if you have an agreement to certain pay levels and BA are changing them without negotiation you have my and the majority of the engineers support
PaulW
Tell me about it but your guilty of the same as me Envy, we in engineering have 2 increments and that's it, do the pilots do well Payment Vs payout from NAPs over their Careers - blood right they do certainly better than us, I see no reason at all why my Union should recommend acceptance, however going off track, if you said to me BA were enforcing changes to my pension that are not the same as other groups we would know what's happening and you would get 100% support.
Quote "That is why flight crew stand to lose the most. The final salary pension APS or naps is a fantastic deal for staff who have a pay that more than doubles in the term of their employment. An average salary pension or money purchase pension will never match that deal. In fact as an ex cadet pay will quadruple in the term of employment!"
We know that as well, we believe its one of the reasons for the £2.1 Billion deficit but you announced your strike ballot with negotiations continuing, if its the pension we might join you!
Hotel
Quote"As for secret deals, well all the unions (except those that were too busy) were at the meeting so i dont see what the big secret was.
Seems the GMB found it though!
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You later state that you ONLY take home 1400-1700 a month .
Many many cabin crew from the independant sector would kill for that and GET BY on less.TRY LIVING WITHIN YOUR MEANS. What ever the skills needed for your job , it is , as stated, unskilled in economic terms. IE not professional level.Your choice to do it. A huge part of the industry earn less for much more work and dont get the staff travel,hotlines, and rosta stability that you do. Oh and I forgot, they also have to have interviews after sick, have to produce DR letters over Xmas or any other embargo period and generally work harder.In other words you new sick policy is a breeze. You have been exposed to it due to abuse. I would bet a months money(about 1400-1700) that its the same abusers now braying loudly for a strike
As for the general public they are just going to think you are taking the p1ss.
I also endorse from personnal experience the MOSTLY surly attitudes from BA crew including the snooty snarls from positioning longhaul crew, in uniform, on the shuttle should you dare to sit next to them.The snarl decreases slightly if they catch a glimpse of an industry ID or paraphinalia. Still its first impresions that count. I also dont want to be treated to a bitchy whiney conservation booming from the galley however the crews in LGW seem generally better, but they are usually new, so lets see. Mybe just tarred with the same brush
Again, GENERALLY, amongst operating longhaul crew the feed em and **** em off philosophy is alive and well from my extensive positioning and personnal travel. I had a friend moan last year they they didnt get a rest on a Cairo, the Dubai crew on one flight must have been hiding with Bin Laden...and so it goes.
You will be broken. Generally, as a workforce, behind the woolly concern you pretend to have for each other, are as a rule selfish, bitchy and dont have the balls for it. Arthurs or Marthas. The bottom line, your package is not that bad, (wages wages calm down dear) and the support thin on the ground for your plight. Certainly amongst your industry peers.
Inshort Paddy
You lot are starting to believe your own Bullsh1t
ps please note the generalisations are intentional. This is because generally thats what people notice, not your little language badge.
Ps pm me if you need a job in a week. You seem like a nice bloke and we need a few juniors. Or if you prefer to avoid reality i could post you the obligatory pins to stick in your eyes if you'd rather do that. (ps thats Flight crew type sarcasm, not wooly CC carey sharey crocodile tears)
Last edited by bushbolox; 16th Jan 2007 at 17:01. Reason: sarcasm
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WWW fan club only member ??
BA is a wonderful airline, lets not get a bunch of overpaid cart pushers get BA down. There are lots of girls who will I am sure do your job with half your pay and conditions. Get into the real world, you have had it too good for too long.
Go on Wilie sort out whats good for the share holders, look after who matters and "take care" of the test.
GO WILLIE GO!!!!!!!
Go on Wilie sort out whats good for the share holders, look after who matters and "take care" of the test.
GO WILLIE GO!!!!!!!
It is regrettable that the customers will be inconvenienced however BA (mis)management has messed with cabin crew for long enough ,the idiot Ayling et al! Good luck to you all from a former "cart pusher "colleague !
PS think you should change your handle to BARCLAYS!!
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No I don't envy flight crew. I admire them and what their union has done. Why sit back and envy someone, get on and do something about it which I have.
Not quite sure where you work RIMMER can't be the same BA Engineering that I know. We simply have lost trust in our own colleagues (within engineering) that we would stand up together united. When we have previously been upset by changes such as the introductions of JAR66 but no change to license pay and no increase to authorisation pay, that was originally promised (6 years ago), the agreement is for one type but now we certify for two, three or even four types with no extra pay. When we have all agreed across all shifts in the terminals to stand up and be counted, the union general convenor has come down and given us a speach about he is not going to lose his house over it, Arthur Scargill didn't even lose his house, but never mind that. Our union reps through confusion try and pursuade us to the companies point of view and aren't interested in the hard work of doing the reverse.
But we have admiration for those of us within BA that have the balls to stand up for what they believe in.
Bushbolox whats wrong with having better than average pay, if you have it why agree to lose it just because others dont have it. That would be a step backwards. If you want more money go get it, if you have more than others then fight like hell to keep it.
Not quite sure where you work RIMMER can't be the same BA Engineering that I know. We simply have lost trust in our own colleagues (within engineering) that we would stand up together united. When we have previously been upset by changes such as the introductions of JAR66 but no change to license pay and no increase to authorisation pay, that was originally promised (6 years ago), the agreement is for one type but now we certify for two, three or even four types with no extra pay. When we have all agreed across all shifts in the terminals to stand up and be counted, the union general convenor has come down and given us a speach about he is not going to lose his house over it, Arthur Scargill didn't even lose his house, but never mind that. Our union reps through confusion try and pursuade us to the companies point of view and aren't interested in the hard work of doing the reverse.
But we have admiration for those of us within BA that have the balls to stand up for what they believe in.
Bushbolox whats wrong with having better than average pay, if you have it why agree to lose it just because others dont have it. That would be a step backwards. If you want more money go get it, if you have more than others then fight like hell to keep it.
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£25-40 million per day, depending upon who you believe...
My my Bush, you are a rather embittered individual
Nice try to upset people with the non-skilled comments, it probably suits your own persona...considering your profile says your a plastic bus driver
manual thrust anyone?
My my Bush, you are a rather embittered individual
Nice try to upset people with the non-skilled comments, it probably suits your own persona...considering your profile says your a plastic bus driver manual thrust anyone?
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Here are some comments from the litle darlings
Go get em Willie. £50k for CSD? Now's yuor chance.
They would sacrifice every last one of us if it meant more in their pockets at the end of the day. They should realise that Continental and US Airways will most definately go pop sometime this year, that in itself would add a surplus of some 8000 pilots to the aviation job market. All with curent licences on all of our aircraft types....... I have a friend who is a captain with Continental on 747's, senior too, currently earning $85,000 per annum (£44,000)........Our 747 skippers boast a minimum pre-tax pay packet of £110,000 plus....... Who's overpaid now? Buy one, Get Two Free!
FlyboyBA I have to agree that yours is the post of the day.
I'm angry with them for bellowing for months like irritable bulls about 'their' pensions. Then when their reps sell them down the river and leave us isolated they have the absolute cheek to start dissing us. They sold out on flight pay and regretted it, they did the same on sickness and now on pensions. As they seem to have no balls at all what is it that they sit there scratching all day?
I'm angry with them for bellowing for months like irritable bulls about 'their' pensions. Then when their reps sell them down the river and leave us isolated they have the absolute cheek to start dissing us. They sold out on flight pay and regretted it, they did the same on sickness and now on pensions. As they seem to have no balls at all what is it that they sit there scratching all day?
Don't the FC just whine on and on like an old airbus about their pensions. But as soon as the £££ signs r shown, they sell their souls 2 the devil. I agree with u delankev, FC have no balls at all!
They have mansions, flats in the alps or dordogne(not all of them though) , their basic is higher , they have a medical pension : we don t , they allways ask for the food from 1st class and some of them not all of them can make your life miserable if the beef is too salty or their tea too white ...I am cabin crew, here to serve passengers and look after Flight Deck if I am the galley bird but I am neither a private cook nor a domestic , in the country where I live they call it Chacha . We must stand together as Cabin Crew and stick with our union . I just want to think that the guys who placed these comments are a minority and only a minority but they are the same sad nigels we get on board sometimes.
Thank you BASSA
Just did a trip last week with a training Capt ; he was giving off loads of spin basically trying to encourage us no to strike, and that really all the issues where not that important, certainly not worth loosing your job over, which he insisted would probably happen, and we would then have to fight to get them back!
Me thinks he had been given his orders from above, I suppose training does mean he represents management. Needless to say he hardly got any response, and nobody bothered to talk to him afterwards.
Thank you BASSA
Me thinks he had been given his orders from above, I suppose training does mean he represents management. Needless to say he hardly got any response, and nobody bothered to talk to him afterwards.
Go get em Willie. £50k for CSD? Now's yuor chance.
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PaulW
Ddnt realise you were engineering but a few points for you.
Firstly i agree Amicus can be poor but at the end of the day the reps know when the chips are down the guys wont support them - Your correct but its not entirely the unions fault you and i are to blame.
Secondly what happened with JAR66 ( with its agreement for 2 types and most only do two ) is you got an internationally recognised qualification without doing any kind of exam, thats something all the other UK airlines never had and something it has taken me 10 years of hard graft to achieve, from the union point of view in the UK it was a major result, BA would have been happy to demote all the technicians and then hand pick the ones it wanted back in grade, as it is BA is the only airline in the UK with 10% carpet fitters as licensed engineers!
Quote"But we have admiration for those of us within BA that have the balls to stand up for what they believe in."
So might i if i knew what thier issues are, very soon BA will take them to pieces if they strike, if i dont know what their issues are how on earth could they hope for support from the public, BA has a increadible spin machine and it will turn the public to BAs side very quick.
I am with you on Pay, so what if they do well , Willy Walsh does OK and as i remember a certain SIR Rod Eddington did ok for doing well ...........nothing
Ddnt realise you were engineering but a few points for you.
Firstly i agree Amicus can be poor but at the end of the day the reps know when the chips are down the guys wont support them - Your correct but its not entirely the unions fault you and i are to blame.
Secondly what happened with JAR66 ( with its agreement for 2 types and most only do two ) is you got an internationally recognised qualification without doing any kind of exam, thats something all the other UK airlines never had and something it has taken me 10 years of hard graft to achieve, from the union point of view in the UK it was a major result, BA would have been happy to demote all the technicians and then hand pick the ones it wanted back in grade, as it is BA is the only airline in the UK with 10% carpet fitters as licensed engineers!
Quote"But we have admiration for those of us within BA that have the balls to stand up for what they believe in."
So might i if i knew what thier issues are, very soon BA will take them to pieces if they strike, if i dont know what their issues are how on earth could they hope for support from the public, BA has a increadible spin machine and it will turn the public to BAs side very quick.
I am with you on Pay, so what if they do well , Willy Walsh does OK and as i remember a certain SIR Rod Eddington did ok for doing well ...........nothing
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Back to the thread.....
Having read through the many posts to date on this thread it makes me sad to read comments from many of my colleagues within the airline industry.
Whatever the Cabin Crew are currently paid and whatever T&C's they work to is totally irrelevant - the whole point of the propsed strike action is their reaction to the bully boy tactics and lies that BA have used over the last few years to change the above, which have now brought them to this very important decision.
I find it hard to believe that any readers of this post would not like to react in the same way if they were in the same position with their management.
Whatever the Cabin Crew are currently paid and whatever T&C's they work to is totally irrelevant - the whole point of the propsed strike action is their reaction to the bully boy tactics and lies that BA have used over the last few years to change the above, which have now brought them to this very important decision.
I find it hard to believe that any readers of this post would not like to react in the same way if they were in the same position with their management.
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Not sure where you work RIMMER. Your first name isnt Alan is it. 
With an answer like that it sounds like it. (Our former general convenor who sold us down the river) The prime reason a lack of trust in our AEEU now AMICUS union has developed.
By giving away an "internationally recognised" qualification to all and sundry, many who quite honestly should'nt have it, have rendered it worthless. If it has taken you ten years to get an A license I'm worried. They certainly didn't give away B1 and B2 licenses like the french authorities. Certainly licensed carpet fitters as you call them isnt anything to be proud of. Frankly Ill be suprised if you work on the shop floor, with your last post.
Yes the unions strength is its members but the members are tired of having the rug pulled from under them anytime they try and stand united by their own union who frankly enjoys the status quo of not having to do much.
But this thread isnt about engineering state of affair so this is my last post on the matter of engineering and its relationship with its union.
With an answer like that it sounds like it. (Our former general convenor who sold us down the river) The prime reason a lack of trust in our AEEU now AMICUS union has developed.By giving away an "internationally recognised" qualification to all and sundry, many who quite honestly should'nt have it, have rendered it worthless. If it has taken you ten years to get an A license I'm worried. They certainly didn't give away B1 and B2 licenses like the french authorities. Certainly licensed carpet fitters as you call them isnt anything to be proud of. Frankly Ill be suprised if you work on the shop floor, with your last post.
Yes the unions strength is its members but the members are tired of having the rug pulled from under them anytime they try and stand united by their own union who frankly enjoys the status quo of not having to do much.
But this thread isnt about engineering state of affair so this is my last post on the matter of engineering and its relationship with its union.
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Unfair dismissal on a mass scale?
Just digressing back a little on the hot debate as to whether or not one can be sacked for AI and the complications that follow.. If it's that plausable, then why don't more companies do it and more importantly (as it has not been their style in the past), why didn't BA do that in 97, the wildcat ground staff swipe card strike, and why then, were only a couple of baggage loaders sacked for crimes of insighting others to strike when they all illegally walked out last year during the GG scrap bringing the entire airline to a costly standstill?
Whilst your comments are probably right, surely, legistically, sacking the strikers may seem like a solution but it's not really a likely course of action because despite what some city slickers may think, replacing an 11,000strong workforce isn't as easy as it sounds. It's not a matter of just nipping down to the job centre and teaching monkeys to pour tea/coffee? Lets not forget the cost of recruitment, uniforming, training, admin costs, legalities of experienced crew members per flight, looking after their most important customers (Club) etc, etc whilst Virgin will no doubt be riding on the back of this with an agrressive advertising campaign to lure BA customers their way as they always do ... and becoming more successful at it everytime we piss off the public. If I were Jo Public, I'd given up on BA years ago!
BA have had a rather dreadful year when it comes to glossy publicity. Can it really, really afford another massive disruption crisis that the airline could possibily not sustain? If the airline doesn't perform, the shareholders don't get their returns and topdogs @ bluewater won't get their fat doshy bonuses .... Isn't that what this is all about? Bottom line ... Money money money? WW can't afford to gamble this way with other peoples money, not to mention what he has to loose himself!
Sorry, but sacking the workforce, yeah, maybe legally they can, but ... I just can't see it? Can anyone convience me I'm wrong?
PS Sorry city slics, don't take offence! None meant. x x
Whilst your comments are probably right, surely, legistically, sacking the strikers may seem like a solution but it's not really a likely course of action because despite what some city slickers may think, replacing an 11,000strong workforce isn't as easy as it sounds. It's not a matter of just nipping down to the job centre and teaching monkeys to pour tea/coffee? Lets not forget the cost of recruitment, uniforming, training, admin costs, legalities of experienced crew members per flight, looking after their most important customers (Club) etc, etc whilst Virgin will no doubt be riding on the back of this with an agrressive advertising campaign to lure BA customers their way as they always do ... and becoming more successful at it everytime we piss off the public. If I were Jo Public, I'd given up on BA years ago!
BA have had a rather dreadful year when it comes to glossy publicity. Can it really, really afford another massive disruption crisis that the airline could possibily not sustain? If the airline doesn't perform, the shareholders don't get their returns and topdogs @ bluewater won't get their fat doshy bonuses .... Isn't that what this is all about? Bottom line ... Money money money? WW can't afford to gamble this way with other peoples money, not to mention what he has to loose himself!
Sorry, but sacking the workforce, yeah, maybe legally they can, but ... I just can't see it? Can anyone convience me I'm wrong?
PS Sorry city slics, don't take offence! None meant. x x