BA Cabin Crew Strike Threat
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BA ARE NOT TRYING TO REDUCE THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS
The only references to terms and conditions in the ballot are BASSA's who want an increase for newer crew.
BA MAY try to reduce terms and conditions in the future but that is not what this ballot is about although BASSA have cleverly made most people think that it is
The only references to terms and conditions in the ballot are BASSA's who want an increase for newer crew.
BA MAY try to reduce terms and conditions in the future but that is not what this ballot is about although BASSA have cleverly made most people think that it is
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Cytherea:
you said.
I work for BA (not cabin crew) and I am genuinely concerned at this statement - could you elaborate slightly? Please pm me if you don't think it would contribute to the debate.
It's people like you whom BA should be devoutly persuing as customers!
we no longer use BA Long Haul because of the service received in Club World or First
I work for BA (not cabin crew) and I am genuinely concerned at this statement - could you elaborate slightly? Please pm me if you don't think it would contribute to the debate.
It's people like you whom BA should be devoutly persuing as customers!
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I fear for the day when one of my colleagues drives home from an exausting duty, has a crash and dies.
So that explains why BASSA insist that cabin crew after an 6 hour Atlantic crossing insist that the cabin crew who have had at least 1:30 in the bunk have to be taken to their hotel before the pilots who have had no rest can be taken to the car park before travelling home. Or that the non-UK cabin crew (eg SIN,HKG, etc based) must be taken to the hotel after the crew are dropped off at the car park?
Pot, kettle, black....
I sincerely hope that BASSA get kicked in the boll0cks over this bunch of sh1t, they deserve everything they have coming to them. They are even more despicable than the Labour Party, and that says something.
Having said that, the BA 'management' team deserve a bloody nose also, they are arrogant ******s who know the value of nothing and the cost of everything (except themselves).
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Topslide 6 - "alot of BA crew are on a VERY cushy number" - do you believe everything you read. Are you a Daily Mail reader? Have you not also read all the sarcastic/ patronising/jealous and downright rude comments about BA crew....what a shame people do not mention that the world's most profitable airline has the world's best cabin crew - even with bully boy management tactics pressurising us.
Sigmond - "No public support" - you have got to be kidding. Since the latest troubles have now hit the travelling public I have heard nothing but support from our BA pax - and many of them Gold/ Silver exec club members who realise what direction WW is pushing us.
overstress - (obviously not BA management with that title) get a life. For the last year we as crew have heard nothing but complaints from pax in all classes. I've now given up passing back their comments as nobody listens to us from the frontline. eg have just completed SIN - LHR...flt time 14.35 (duty day 17.05 but thats irrelevant)...our WT and WT+ pax got a hot meal ex SIN and then some 10 hours later their 2nd meal into LHR - a croissant and a chocolate muffin. The vegetarian pax were lucky...they got a small bowl of dried mangos and 4 bread rolls. Complaints....hundreds of them. Never mind that, also zero clean blankets (had to use used inbound re folded) or the lack of menus in First and Club, the many IFE defects, etc,etc.
This is real life on the frontline.I could go on but will rant on too long ...and this is exactly why cabin crew have had enough of the lies and terrible management over the last few years.
I need a glass of wine !
Sigmond - "No public support" - you have got to be kidding. Since the latest troubles have now hit the travelling public I have heard nothing but support from our BA pax - and many of them Gold/ Silver exec club members who realise what direction WW is pushing us.
overstress - (obviously not BA management with that title) get a life. For the last year we as crew have heard nothing but complaints from pax in all classes. I've now given up passing back their comments as nobody listens to us from the frontline. eg have just completed SIN - LHR...flt time 14.35 (duty day 17.05 but thats irrelevant)...our WT and WT+ pax got a hot meal ex SIN and then some 10 hours later their 2nd meal into LHR - a croissant and a chocolate muffin. The vegetarian pax were lucky...they got a small bowl of dried mangos and 4 bread rolls. Complaints....hundreds of them. Never mind that, also zero clean blankets (had to use used inbound re folded) or the lack of menus in First and Club, the many IFE defects, etc,etc.
This is real life on the frontline.I could go on but will rant on too long ...and this is exactly why cabin crew have had enough of the lies and terrible management over the last few years.
I need a glass of wine !
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Hotel Mode
Yes they are.
EG300 should not be used in the style of the Spanish Inquisition. I have sat at redundany meetings having employees fighting for their survival discussing problems like cervical cancer and whether it should be concidered or discounted on a matrix of sickness weighting. This is totally unacceptable. Having to justify why you are sick, regardless of a produced doctors note is wrong.
Generally, peer pressure stops people throwing sickies. Find a way of utilising that to cut down the amount taken, would be the avenue that I would take. I have not been sick for three years. For the year before that, I went sick numerous times. I had a change in my life that was the cause of that. Who is to say that that may not happen again? Does that make me a bad employee?
So, taking a payment for the introduction of a policy, does not waive your basic human rights of being treated compassionately and fairly.
Yes they are.
EG300 should not be used in the style of the Spanish Inquisition. I have sat at redundany meetings having employees fighting for their survival discussing problems like cervical cancer and whether it should be concidered or discounted on a matrix of sickness weighting. This is totally unacceptable. Having to justify why you are sick, regardless of a produced doctors note is wrong.
Generally, peer pressure stops people throwing sickies. Find a way of utilising that to cut down the amount taken, would be the avenue that I would take. I have not been sick for three years. For the year before that, I went sick numerous times. I had a change in my life that was the cause of that. Who is to say that that may not happen again? Does that make me a bad employee?
So, taking a payment for the introduction of a policy, does not waive your basic human rights of being treated compassionately and fairly.
Last edited by Litebulbs; 17th Jan 2007 at 20:13.
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TopBunk - This 'agreement' came in when Back to Backs were imposed onto crew by Marshall & King. We all (the whole crew) had to go direct to the hotel and stay there - no getout clause...thats why it is still in place.
A bit like you being able to sit/ eat/sleep in a First Class seat that most cabin crew find unbelievable amongst full fare pax...are you willing to give up your agreement?? ...I don't think so.
A bit like you being able to sit/ eat/sleep in a First Class seat that most cabin crew find unbelievable amongst full fare pax...are you willing to give up your agreement?? ...I don't think so.
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Cervix,
CC bashing? No
BA cc bashing .YES
25 yrs in the business yes
Manager NO
Misconceptions..Posssibly, but derived from personnal experience , so how many more are there with the same misconceptions.
You're on a hiding to nothing and if i was so anti cc i wouldnt be married to a psr.
You just dont get it. Some of your grievances come across as pathetic. The the sickness thing being administered in a draconian way may be valid, but many people here, including myself, are arguing from a position of being in the industry and so your moaning about down route reports, crew breakfast etc is just fecking tedious and jurassic. You cant bull**** a bull****ter. Next youll be telling me the CSD has more authority than the captain. ....as if
Take the time to break down the responses in this thread statistically. Factor that for the gen pop and theres your answer. You are part of a an outdated system. Instead of enjoying the fruits of that system you are about to **** it up by following dated militant fools to unenployment. This is ww's defining moment. He wont lose. The airline can replace cabin staff more easily than pilots. Thats why ww is taking you on instead of the pilots and as such your unions policies are reckless. You just dont have the cohesion.
Anyway , on a personnal level,good luck whatever the outcome.
Nothing else to say. Lets wait and see.
CC bashing? No
BA cc bashing .YES
25 yrs in the business yes
Manager NO
Misconceptions..Posssibly, but derived from personnal experience , so how many more are there with the same misconceptions.
You're on a hiding to nothing and if i was so anti cc i wouldnt be married to a psr.
You just dont get it. Some of your grievances come across as pathetic. The the sickness thing being administered in a draconian way may be valid, but many people here, including myself, are arguing from a position of being in the industry and so your moaning about down route reports, crew breakfast etc is just fecking tedious and jurassic. You cant bull**** a bull****ter. Next youll be telling me the CSD has more authority than the captain. ....as if
Take the time to break down the responses in this thread statistically. Factor that for the gen pop and theres your answer. You are part of a an outdated system. Instead of enjoying the fruits of that system you are about to **** it up by following dated militant fools to unenployment. This is ww's defining moment. He wont lose. The airline can replace cabin staff more easily than pilots. Thats why ww is taking you on instead of the pilots and as such your unions policies are reckless. You just dont have the cohesion.
Anyway , on a personnal level,good luck whatever the outcome.
Nothing else to say. Lets wait and see.
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Bush,
Have a look at my profile good sir, then perhaps you may revisit what you THINK I do, or indeed who I am.
I too am married to CC, and I too have over 2 decades in this industry, but unlike you, I would rather loyal and hardworking employee's be treated with dignity and respect, instead of being treated with thinly disguised contempt and derision.
I agree with you regarding the perceived ease of replacing cabin crew, however, WW has no stomach or ability to replace even 5% of those who take industrial action (his CC training Dept has been cut to bits in recent years), quite simply his company is in a tedious position. Investor support will evaporate should the industrial crisis get worse (baggage handlers, ground staff, and franchise issues) not to mention a quickly shrinking customer base fed up with constant disruption.
Add all these factors up, and it is clear to see WW has more to consider than just continuity of BASSA's industrial approach.
I suspect BA viewed a 96% ballot, as a potential worst case...my sources suggest they were expecting around 55%, I know New Road didn't expect the levels to be this high.
Have a look at my profile good sir, then perhaps you may revisit what you THINK I do, or indeed who I am.
I too am married to CC, and I too have over 2 decades in this industry, but unlike you, I would rather loyal and hardworking employee's be treated with dignity and respect, instead of being treated with thinly disguised contempt and derision.
I agree with you regarding the perceived ease of replacing cabin crew, however, WW has no stomach or ability to replace even 5% of those who take industrial action (his CC training Dept has been cut to bits in recent years), quite simply his company is in a tedious position. Investor support will evaporate should the industrial crisis get worse (baggage handlers, ground staff, and franchise issues) not to mention a quickly shrinking customer base fed up with constant disruption.
Add all these factors up, and it is clear to see WW has more to consider than just continuity of BASSA's industrial approach.
I suspect BA viewed a 96% ballot, as a potential worst case...my sources suggest they were expecting around 55%, I know New Road didn't expect the levels to be this high.
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TopBunk - This 'agreement' came in when Back to Backs were imposed onto crew by Marshall & King. We all (the whole crew) had to go direct to the hotel and stay there - no getout clause...thats why it is still in place.
A bit like you being able to sit/ eat/sleep in a First Class seat that most cabin crew find unbelievable amongst full fare pax...are you willing to give up your agreement?? ...I don't think so.
A bit like you being able to sit/ eat/sleep in a First Class seat that most cabin crew find unbelievable amongst full fare pax...are you willing to give up your agreement?? ...I don't think so.
Your defence of the B2B bus is rather feeble. Are you seriously saying that because the agreement was imposed over 10 years ago you are unable to change it? It could be changed at a stroke tomorrow but BASSA don't want it too, in no small part because it needles the flight crew, which is the favourite sport of the reps. Its like WW said to the press yesterday, BASSAs attitude is "We hold what we have" and their is no room for compromise or common sense.
Originally Posted by atyourcervix73
WW has no stomach or ability to replace even 5% of those who take industrial action (his CC training Dept has been cut to bits in recent years),
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The thing is Mr Carnage, its the pilots who are next. The aircraft have had the ability to takeoff, cruise and land for the last 30 years. I have yet to see any robot serving anybody, whether at Asda or the Ritz. Pilots now sit behind a locked door, cabin crew engage passengers every day that they work. The day it is proven that statistically, automation is safer than human, then its bye bye Captain.
I mean, if computers were worse than humans, then why do they land jets in fog, not Captains?
No matter the level of automation, I would want a pilot, preferably two, in the flight deck as well as any amount of computers. Not just system monitors, but the best money can buy!
I mean, if computers were worse than humans, then why do they land jets in fog, not Captains?
No matter the level of automation, I would want a pilot, preferably two, in the flight deck as well as any amount of computers. Not just system monitors, but the best money can buy!
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Bit of thread drift but don't count your chickens litebulbs.
I get my lunch from a sandwich machince and coffee from a Clix machine, even some of my spares are from an automated vending machine.
Just need arming mechanisms for the doors controlled by the flight crew and a couple of vending machines and things could change on-board!!
A simplistic view I know but no more simplistic than your view of automation in the flight deck.
Fargoo
I get my lunch from a sandwich machince and coffee from a Clix machine, even some of my spares are from an automated vending machine.
Just need arming mechanisms for the doors controlled by the flight crew and a couple of vending machines and things could change on-board!!
A simplistic view I know but no more simplistic than your view of automation in the flight deck.
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You may be surprised by this but aircraft have had the ability to take off, cruise and land since the very earliest days of flight. Generally you need all three to make a succesful flight. Perhaps you meant it could be done automatically? Well apart from the fact that no commercial aircraft can take off automatically and less than 5% of the worlds runways are equipped for automatic landing, I've yet to see a computer that could make a decision. Sure they can follow a plan, but what happens when that plan changes? Errrr, errrrrmmmm.
The reason computers land jets in fog is because the Captain can't see. Take away any of the numerous 'eyes' of the computers and they can't see either, so who lands it then?
The reason computers land jets in fog is because the Captain can't see. Take away any of the numerous 'eyes' of the computers and they can't see either, so who lands it then?
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Fargoo
That would be self service then, hardly a first class service. It doesn't matter how the jet gets to its destination, as long as it does, but I do know, when I want a special night out, I have a human interaction, good food, good service. I generally do take friends and family to a vending machine.
It was not meant as a drift, but more of a statement that it will be pilots next.
That would be self service then, hardly a first class service. It doesn't matter how the jet gets to its destination, as long as it does, but I do know, when I want a special night out, I have a human interaction, good food, good service. I generally do take friends and family to a vending machine.
It was not meant as a drift, but more of a statement that it will be pilots next.
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Is your special night out ever interrupted by your venue flying through a cumulonimbus, violently hurling you and your friends from floor to ceiling and back again?
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Carnage
You are dreaming sunshine, the company struggle to train 250 in 3 months, and dont forget, what does willy do after he sacks 250?and it doesn't work....fire another 250?
The stuff you're smoking is bad for your thought process
Max 5000 strikers. 5% = 250. No more than an average days sickness. They could be easily and quickly replaced. We have trained cabin crew in two weeks recently, it can be done again.
The stuff you're smoking is bad for your thought process
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Does anyone know what the outcome of the talks today were??
And what exactly are the chances of the company resolving this?
I support all our staff and front line crew in any stance they take. Banks in the city provide all sorts of lifestyle amenities for their traders and brokers - they realise that their assets are the people. I don't intend to ever be seen as a corporate commodity that can be reduced in value at the company's whim and nor do I think my colleagues are deserving of that treatment.
I'm highly qualified, as are many other pilots and cab crew - and can easily work anywhere else. The prevailing attitude of management shocks me every day and we all would do well to remember that we aren't to be compared with the lowest denominator in the industry; we were leaders and as such any comparison with LoCos isnt relevant.
Personally, being young as many of us are, I would rather be at the beginning of something great than at the end.. and there are many dynamic companies and options for anyone with half a brain. Which explains why our managers cling so hard to BA.
And what exactly are the chances of the company resolving this?
I support all our staff and front line crew in any stance they take. Banks in the city provide all sorts of lifestyle amenities for their traders and brokers - they realise that their assets are the people. I don't intend to ever be seen as a corporate commodity that can be reduced in value at the company's whim and nor do I think my colleagues are deserving of that treatment.
I'm highly qualified, as are many other pilots and cab crew - and can easily work anywhere else. The prevailing attitude of management shocks me every day and we all would do well to remember that we aren't to be compared with the lowest denominator in the industry; we were leaders and as such any comparison with LoCos isnt relevant.
Personally, being young as many of us are, I would rather be at the beginning of something great than at the end.. and there are many dynamic companies and options for anyone with half a brain. Which explains why our managers cling so hard to BA.
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Carnage.
Your understanding of points 1 - 12 shows that you have not researched the issues, and in all fairness, why would you have?
The one that really gets me (as you probably know) is 12. But I can assure you it's not just a case of small print.
One thing that might interest our customers reading this hoping to find out some real info on their doomed holiday.
The LGW crew community will probably NOT strike, as the vast majority are NOT in either union or in AMICUS (not striking). If all the BASSA crew stirke at LGW (about 150, 10% of the workforce) the operation should still run. However a I know a few BASSA people who voted NO, and if forced to strike will switch unions.
So see you all at LGW!
Your understanding of points 1 - 12 shows that you have not researched the issues, and in all fairness, why would you have?
The one that really gets me (as you probably know) is 12. But I can assure you it's not just a case of small print.
One thing that might interest our customers reading this hoping to find out some real info on their doomed holiday.
The LGW crew community will probably NOT strike, as the vast majority are NOT in either union or in AMICUS (not striking). If all the BASSA crew stirke at LGW (about 150, 10% of the workforce) the operation should still run. However a I know a few BASSA people who voted NO, and if forced to strike will switch unions.
So see you all at LGW!
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Shadows I'm copied in on all the BASSA emails and newsletters I've researched the 12 issues a lot better than many of the people who voted yes judging by some of my recent crews. Loved that diary of a stewardess, a piece of childrens fiction Enid Blyton would have been proud of.