Proviation customer care problems

[Hammersrule]

Dont use them then you wont have an issue

Simple answer once you know. Dont use them
Is this the guy in charge??

http://www.scambook.com/report/view/262607/Proviation-Nick-Ross-Complaint-262607-for-$375.00

[PaulKerry]

Yes.

Paul..

[pickupvw]

Have a similar problem with Proviation after I ordered a headset on 30th Sept.

Money taken from Credit Card and after 1 month, numerous e-mails from me (with no replies) and, laterley, 2 phone calls I have yet to make contact with a human. Yes they still appear to be trading

[DerekJS]

So it's not just me then

I have had what appears to be the standard "treatment" from Proviation. I cannot claim that my purchase was for anything more exotic than Scenery for FSX, which is as near as I get to flying. but the treatment is exactly the same as is provided to "real flyers" . i.e. Instant acceptance of monies, items continuously advertised as "in stock" , no replies to email or telephone requests for delivery or refund, and strange behaviour on the live chat in that it mysteriously goes dead. I have an order # (Order 0-23329) dated 21 Sept and despite some suggestions that posts on here are all from one irate customer I can assure you they are not. A Paypal dispute has been started, so I will just have to see how things develop. It is not the waiting that is the problem it is the complete lack of customer CARE that winds up the average small time purchaser and ensures that we will never come back .

As a non flyer I joined PPRuNe to help keep in touch with my low-fly photography hobby , not to moan about purchases, but when I Googled "Proviation problems" I did not expect to spent the next couple of hours reading through this thread. I guess I should have looked here first
Cheers Derek S

[PaulKerry]

I'd also recommend contacting Trading Standards. They will be able to advise you of the correct procedures to take before mounting legal action (although legal action shouldn't be necessary as you used PayPal) - however, the more reports there are about this shyster, the better informed they will be. This "standard treatment" has been going on for an extended period of time. It is not simply a transient blip in their service. If he is allowed to continually get away with his dishonesty, then more consumers will be in the same boat (or plane) as the rest of us. Trading Standards need to be fully apprised of this guy's behaviour in the hope that they will escalate it and bring him to book.
Too many people like yourself (me included) believed the dishonest claims on his website and then found themselves having to fight to achieve some resolution.

He has already shown that he is not interested in listening to his consumers. It seems that he thinks that the law applies only to everyone else and that he is not bound by the rules that govern the rest of us in business. It is going to take someone with a little more clout than one of his disrespected consumers to open his eyes to the fact that the laws apply to him, also.

Paul..

[DerekJS]

It appears that there is "life" at Proviation after all; I have just received an email stating that my goods "have now been dispatched to your requested delivery address at postcode.......... " ( I noticed the post code was blank) Time alone will tell; I will not hold my breath as there is a definite pattern showing here;
1:- take order,
2:-grab money,
3:- ignore until customer starts to make too much fuss, then (ignoring request for cancellation)
4:- carry on as if nothing untoward has happened
5:- hope to get away with it again

It can only last for so long
Fingers crossed Derek S

[PaulKerry]

3:- ignore until customer starts to make too much fuss

Yes. Having spent nearly a year watching this clown's shenanigans, and going through the mill myself, it appears that response comes promptly when the customer posts their experience of being shafted, publicly. Then, within moments (in a fair number of cases), the sleeping beast awakes and responds.

You can have made all manner of fuss to his deaf ears until that point but miraculously, the moment your complaint is public, he's fawning and dribbling and making all manner of pathetic and incredible excuses, blaming everyone and everything else and spouting "poor me".

5:- hope to get away with it again

And he will. Over and over and over again.

It can only last for so long

As long as dissatisfied customers shut up and feel grateful at finally being responded to after being taken for mugs, it will continue ad-infinitum.

The way to stop it is not to feel as if he's doing us a favour when he finally covers his own backside and actually deems it necessary to deliver what he is dishonestly advertising as being in stock and fobbing us off with vouchers (as a "good-will gesture") to spend with him at a later date.
This isn't a favour. This isn't good customer service. This is damage limitation and an attempt to currie favour and elicit further business.

Don't fall for it. You have been treated inexcusably and when you finally get the goods for which you have paid some time ago and have had to fight to receive, don't be conned into thinking that he as actually done you a favour. He hasn't even managed to meet his contractual obligation.

Advertise goods - take payment - provide goods within a reasonable period of time. It's not brain surgery.

Pretend to be a respectable stockist and advertise goods that you don't actually stock. Pass on the order to the genuine retailer and take a cut for doing nothing much. Ignore all contact in the hope that the goods will eventually arrive. That's neither honest nor ethical business and as long as we allow him to get away with it, he will. The pattern will continue and you will not be the last to post here nor have his review removed from TrustPilot (go see for yourself).

Paul..

[DerekJS]

Yes Paul , I did notice that my review did not last very long on Trustpilot Perhaps I made the mistake of (honestly) stating that I had come across this thread on PPRuNe which appears to be the reason for its withdrawal.
Between 19:18 and 19:44 this evening I received one email from Proviation and three from Nick Ross offering the usual , it has been said on here before; but interestingly the timeline runs

1. " items have now been dispatched to your requested delivery address at postcode "
2. "
   Further to your online chat, please see message below which my colleague Alex sent across.
   
   You should also have had a reply to an email on 23rd where we asked if the software had arrived.
   
   Further to this, this evening, we marked this for re-shipment as we hadn’t had a reply from you.
   
   I think some honest mistakes have been made here. If you’d like me to refund this order, I will do so immediately. Otherwise I have a copy here on my desk which I have now pulled aside. I can pop it in the post tomorrow for you as you wish.
   
   Please do give us the opportunity to turn this around. I note you came onto the live chat talking about your review, and I see it has now popped in.
   
   Cards on the table- we’re a small company – we’re not Amazon. We get things wrong but I’d expect to be given a chance to make it up and prove to be a company which is serious about service. We’re a family company- so we are all indebted to the company and its results. I’d rather we avoid negative feedback as much as possible.
   
   I hope you can see we’re being honest and I hope I can turn this around. I appreciate it may be too late, but I hope there is some room to budge based on my sincerity.
   "
3. "
   Dear Derek,
   
   You do need to confirm your post code, additionally.
   " ( what were they going to do? run after the postman with a marker pen?)
4. "
   Okay last minute correction. I have refunded you as you opened a Paypal dispute.
   
   If you wish to re-order please do so and take £5 off with this voucher:
   
   VOULD051986
   
   I’ll ship tomorrow on receipt of the order."

I will decline their generous offer of £5 and just wait until Paypal confirms I have got the money back. "
So, it appears that as a company, they dispatch goods and then for no apparent reason follow up with a "check" to see if the goods have arrived , and then if no reply is received; follow up by re-sending the goods ( to a still un-established post-code) , I do not believe I have come across such devotion to customer care in my 66 years on this planet. perhaps I have mis-judged them after all. If they devoted a fraction of the time that they spend on damage limitation exercises blocking honest reviews on Trustpilot or posting drivel on forums that try to highlight their lack of service; and spent the time communicating with their customers they might find it pays in the long run.
An older and wiser EX customer of Proviation.
Derek S

[PaulKerry]

Perhaps I made the mistake of (honestly) stating that I had come across this thread on PPRuNe

No. You made the mistake of pointing out their failings.
I made the mistake of refusing to remove my review. Then refusing their bribe to remove my review. It disappeared within moments of telling Nick that he earned it fair and square. It was reinstated after I proved to TP that I was a genuine customer, though... and reported to TP some of their dishonest business practices, including removal of reviews, bribery, claiming a 5* TP status on their website (although that's now finally been addressed) and quoted the email in which he called TP a bunch of dishonest crooks.
I did suggest to Nick, not to take me for a mug and think that I'm a soft-touch. I guess that as usual, he just put his fingers in his ears and hoped the problem would vanish. Oooops !

Between 19:18 and 19:44 this evening I received one email

If true to form, that will have been soon after posting your TP review (or your post here), right?

I think some honest mistakes have been made here.

Yep. You sent Bloviation money. That was an honest mistake. I bet you'll never do that again, eh?

We get things wrong

But, if this thread and the TP reviews are anything to go by, in nearly two years, still haven't learned to get things right - like actually stocking what they claim they stock and shipping the goods for which customers have paid in good faith.

but I’d expect to be given a chance to make it up

There's that "poor me" again. Anyone would think that we simply place an order and if it doesn't arrive within the hour, start kicking up a fuss. No. Every single one of Bloviation's disgruntled customers have wasted their time trying to get through their brick-wall of ignorance. I think in every case, he was given a chance to make it up and get it right. Bleating about bad reviews and begging for a chance is insulting in the extreme.

and prove to be a company which is serious about service.

Service? Lip-service is the only service I see them being serious about.

I’d rather we avoid negative feedback as much as possible.

Then ship the products as advertised and quit with the drop-shipping arrangements, cheapskate! Deleting reviews doesn't avoid negative feedback. It just hides it temporarily - until those out of pocket find somewhere else to post where Bloviation cannot simply flag reviews and have them removed.

I hope you can see we’re being honest

Strangely. I can't. No. You see, I've heard it all before first hand and seen countless others reporting the same claptrap.

and I hope I can turn this around. I appreciate it may be too late, but I hope there is some room to budge based on my sincerity.

Yep. As sincere as a snake-oil salesman in a pin-striped suit.

If they devoted a fraction of the time that they spend on damage limitation exercises blocking honest reviews on Trustpilot or posting drivel on forums that try to highlight their lack of service; and spent the time communicating with their customers they might find it pays in the long run.

I told him almost exactly that nearly a year ago. Nearly word-for-word and offered to put him in touch with one of my clients - the CEO of a business specialising in Internet presence. His response - "I have a business consultant". To which I replied, "He's either not worth his salt, or you're not paying attention to what he says."

I'm reasonably sure that other victims have said much the same, too.

Paul..

[Mrdini]

So, it appears that as a company, they dispatch goods and then for no apparent reason follow up with a "check" to see if the goods have arrived , and then if no reply is received; follow up by re-sending the goods ( to a still un-established post-code)

I've avoided commenting on this Proviation thread up to now despite having issues with them as I felt that I had nothing new to add (I raised a Paypal dispute and got my money back - case closed).

However the above post by DerekJS reminded me...
The item I had issues with was a logbook and at one point, I was told something fairly similar to the above. I was told that Pooleys had sent me a new logbook directly (or words to that effect - might've been via Proviation?) to my address and I was like "Er? Never got it!". "Oh ok, we've got stock now - we'll send you one ourselves".

So it seems they've got severe issues as well with their postal service. (riiiight)

Another point since I'm already commenting - for those who've paid for their items with PayPal, keep in mind that you can & should raise a dispute via PayPal but be aware of their timescales - you MUST raise the dispute within 45 days of paying for your item. This is why I wasn't too badly burnt by Proviation - raised a dispute in time & got my cash back.

[XMole]

Another mug!

Just wanted to add my name to the enormous list of victims of these crooks.
I placed my £140 order on 4th Oct and my money was taken 3 days later. Its now a month later and my emails are being ignored. Sound familiar?
These liars need to be dragged through the courts then put out of business - not allowed to keep ripping countless people off.
I will be taking legal action very soon for sure.

[CaptainChaos981]

What a pathetic excuse for a 'professional' business

What a pathetic excuse for a 'professional' business
The latest factual Trustpilot review before it gets deleted by this nonsense of a company

------------------

If I could give 0 or negative starts I would gladly do. I have had two transactions with this company and both have ended the exact same way - a Paypal dispute to get my money back after waiting for more than 2 months to get the items I had purchased.

The story was nearly identical on both occasions - item shown in stock, I place the order, it is promptly acknowledged and all looks fine. Then a few days later I would get an email advising of some stocking issues but not to worry - my item will still be on its way with just a few days' delay. Then you wait and wait and nothing happens - calls are NEVER answered, emails only replied to once you show you are treating this issue seriously. The replies promise delivery any day, in fact I was told the item was already on its way a couple of times - lies lies and more lies!

In the end I am left with no other option but to raise a Paypal dispute as it is my only way of ensuring I get my money back. By then it is already 45 days since the date of the order. The Paypal process is completely ignored by the company, I just have to go through the motions of following it through to completion when Paypal eventually decide in my favour and refund me my money.

So the whole process from ordering to getting a refund has taken more than 2 months - a complete waste of time and energy and I would most certainly never have anything to do with these people ever again and would also recommend anyone who does not wish to be messed around to give them a very wide berth too.

[abgd]

Why did you buy from them a second time?

[Jonzarno]

A bit like remarriage following a divorce: a triumph of hope over experience? ....

[PaulKerry]

The phrase "sucker for punishment" springs to mind.

Paul..

[PaulKerry]

Latest bad review of Bloviation:
This review was removed at the usual time for "strong language". Then was reported for "Including personal or sensitive details about the company" and finally for "Lack of proof of purchase".

It has been reinstated so I am copying it here before it is flagged for some other bogus reason.

---

Money taken and nothing received! Do not do business with Proviation

I placed an order for an item for next day delivery with proviation. The item never arrived. I emailed them to enquire as to the location of the item and was advised that it was not in stock, even though the website offered next day delivery. My order was placed on the 17th October. Proviation promised by email to refund the charge for next delivery and deliver the item the following week once it was in stock. I think they were wrong to take money for an item and charge me for next day delivery when they did not even have the item in stock. I could have gone elsewhere and received the item in time! After emailing and calling the office with no response I emailed the Proviation on the 28th October to ask where my goods were, as still none had been received. In my email I told them that I expected delivery immediately or they should refund me the full amount charged. I managed to chat online with someone called [Name] who said that the money would be refunded. I advised them that it was unfortunate that they could not deliver as promised, as I intended to purchase 16 of the same unit ('butt kicker) £150.49 and they could have had a good size order from me, but now after the lack of service that I had received I was forced to go elsewhere. Later that same day I received a call from [Name], he did not apologise, he was only interested in gaining the order for additional 16 units that I required. I told him to refund my money immediately. He confirmed that the money would be refunded. Following the call I sent an email on the 1st November to advise the orders department that both [Name] and [Name] had agreed to a refund. I received a reply the same day advising that my order had been cancelled and that a refund could take up to 7-10 days to show in my account. I knew that this was waffle as I have made and received refunds on debit cards previously and they do not take this long. However I decided to be patient and give Proviation the benefit of the doubt. Now it is November 12th and no monies have been received. They still do not answer the telephone. I have called them since and no answer. I even have [Name]'s mobile number but he never answers his phone when I call. Avoid this company at all costs. They do not respect or appreciate their customers. They do not the first thing about customer service. They are keen to take your money, don't' be fooled by their website and hand them any of your hard earned cash!

---

Contrast this with Bloviation's recent claims:

" There is nothing worse than being left in the dark. Something we know, recognise, and will correct. "

... and earlier...

"...we are doing all we can in our business to ensure our systems are far more robust so as to prevent this from happening ever again."

So, they are doing "all they can" which means they cannot do any more than they are doing. If they are doing everything that they can and still failing, then this is a clear indication that this company will NEVER improve and the past two years' history is substantial evidence that no improvement is likely.

It seems to me that they are either incompetent beyond belief or lying.
I know where I'd place my bets.

Paul..

[dealaparty]

Proviation are bad news - do not do business with them

I placed an order for an item for next day delivery with proviation. The item never arrived. I emailed them to enquire as to the location of the item and was advised that it was not in stock, even though the website offered next day delivery. My order was placed on the 17th October. Proviation promised by email to refund the charge for next delivery and deliver the item the following week once it was in stock. I think they were wrong to take money for an item and charge me for next day delivery when they did not even have the item in stock. I could have gone elsewhere and received the item in time! After emailing and calling the office with no response I emailed the Proviation on the 28th October to ask where my goods were, as still none had been received. In my email I told them that I expected delivery immediately or they should refund me the full amount charged. I managed to chat online with someone called [Name] who said that the money would be refunded. I advised them that it was unfortunate that they could not deliver as promised, as I intended to purchase 16 of the same unit ('butt kicker) £150.49 and they could have had a good size order from me, but now after the lack of service that I had received I was forced to go elsewhere. Later that same day I received a call from [Name], he did not apologise, he was only interested in gaining the order for additional 16 units that I required. I told him to refund my money immediately. He confirmed that the money would be refunded. Following the call I sent an email on the 1st November to advise the orders department that both [Name] and [Name] had agreed to a refund. I received a reply the same day advising that my order had been cancelled and that a refund could take up to 7-10 days to show in my account. I knew that this was waffle as I have made and received refunds on debit cards previously and they do not take this long. However I decided to be patient and give Proviation the benefit of the doubt. Now it is November 12th and no monies have been received. They still do not answer the telephone. I have called them since and no answer. I even have [Name]'s mobile number but he never answers his phone when I call. Avoid this company at all costs. They do not respect or appreciate their customers. They do not the first thing about customer service. They are keen to take your money, don't' be fooled by their website and hand them any of your hard earned cash!

[Solar]

Coincidentally an AD for this crowd popped up on my Ipad recently, coincidence in that I had just been made aware of them through this thread.

[riverrock83]

An Airworthiness Directive? Thats impressive for a retail company!

[Pegpilot]

AD = Avoid. Definitely.