Merged: QANTAS/ALAEA EBA

[Flugbegleiter]

Originally Posted by ACARS747

I understand that you are angry with the past treatment.

SO IS EVERYONE ELSE IN THIS COMPANY

Yes, we are, and that's why I SUPPORT the action of the LAMEs. We would have taken action if we still had the industrial strength to, but unfortunately, we no longer do. And look at the results of having no industrial strength: New flight attendants now have the privilege of working higher hours for less money, as well as a host of other benefits. Some were critical of us signing off on our EBA, but the only alternative would have been industrial action which we would have lost, anyway.

Talk to ALL the front line staff about what they are coppimg because of your desire to destroy that "dixon"
Of course they will say they support you to your face, otherwise they will cop the ignorant abuse that they cop on this web site.

WE DO SUPPORT YOU! 100% And it has already cost me real money. We do cop some pretty nasty abuse in these situations, but I am a big picture kind of person, so it doesn't sting too much. If you guys cave in, and this was all in vain, I'll never talk to you again.

If you want to get back at dixon and his cronies, do it another way!

And what do you suggest, oh wise one??? Huh?

The delays and disruptions are having a devastating effect on EVERYONE.

Yes, they are. But if simply withdrawing overtime and working within the company's rules are all it takes to cause such a mess, then can't you see that the problem is not with the LAMEs, but with the management. H245 should never have been closed down. That was like ripping the heart out of this airline. I still can't believe it had such little press. At least these guys are making a noise.

[ALAEA Fed Sec]

I think you will find that another union or organisation has put that website together. I'd say so if it was ours or if we paid for it.

[kotoyebe]

Acars747

Quote by Acars747 from May 2006 in another thread:

As predicted the QANTAS techies have been posting their drivel even on this site.
And they wonder why the rest of the QF employee workforce have such disdain for them.
There is KARMA! just watch the jet star boys have them for breakfast, don't show them any sympathy they deserve what they get.
In our group we are sitting back and laughing, Jet star will put them where they belong........pushing lawn mowers or driving cabs.....

He seems to post during EBA negotiations....mmm, I wonder why?

This is the person telling the LAME's to think of the other employees in QF, and how they are hurting them......

Enough said about Acars 747

[acslame]

Well, well ACARS,after all your "I care for all employee's" dribble
I see you just like to bash anyone in dispute with the company.

Well you have everyones attention, how about you tell us how
to change QE managements destructive path.
I would love to be doing things differently but I am all out of ideas.

So lets hear it.

[ALAEA Fed Sec]

Thnx for the offer frozo but I'm more than happy with the way our little campaign is going. Maybe a bit further down the track when we step things up I will reconsider your offer.

[Bumpfoh]

Debate.

No, I'd welcome your debate on any topic. That is what fora are for. Debate.

Quite right PAF but as I said it would appear that you are abdicating that I and many other QE LAME's should accept a real wage cut against CPI.

I doubt very much that you would accept me and others suggesting you should do the same over the next 5 to 10 years just for the shareholders sake.

[fixitdude]

Just keep on keeping on guys. No need to escalate any further. No need to go slow. Green guides still getting bigger. More aircraft approaching 110%. Just reassure the public that we are just busy with our familys and havent got time to do overtime at the moment. Surely thats not unreasonable!

[up2us]

attn FedSec.

I overheard a brother today saying he cant understand how Dixon keeps saying that if he gives us the 2% extra it will cost the company 360 mill in the 3rd year. FedSec can you run the numbers as Dixon has said this last week as well. I know there is 1600 Lames and our increase May have a follow effect to some other unions in their EBA claims,however I'm sure as hell a lot of Qantas 33000 employee's are salaried staff, contract staff even executive staff who bargain their own rises which is probably more than 5% & have nothing to do with our claim. For Dixon to say this,he is implying if some sections receive 5% all will. I wish he would be that fair to all employee's with regard to the percentages he gives execs!. So please fedsec clear this up with the media,Even better get the media to challenge his rants.I would love to hear his response to this. I am sure @ some point the big insto's will tell him to pull his head in if they knew the real figures and how little it would cost to give the Lames 'the extra 2 %'.
On a brighter note GD's wife unfortunately left for the states 1 1/2 hrs late yesterday

[ALAEA Fed Sec]

Dixon's 360 mill statements? Why would we bother challenging the numbers? He has said if it flows on to all employees it would cost that. If we do some serious number crunching and can prove that it is only 330 mill who really cares?

It is 120M p/a against 1400M p/a profit. I would rather say

360 over 3 years, is that all, that is less than 10% of the profit given back to the staff. Thank you Geoff we have delivered productivity that has delivered massive profits and 10% comes back our way.

His 360 mill sounds good to me. I wouldn't even waste my time challenging it.

[amstrang]

I am a Qantas employed LAME involved in the current PIA.
I fully apologise to all non-executive staff who are adversely affected by my, and my unions, actions.

However, I am fully behind the ALAEA in the current dispute with Qantas management.
I firmly believe that we are going along the right path, the end result of our actions far out way any financial or physical pain felt by any individual!
The current management structure within Qantas Engineering is unsustainable. They are simply making too many errors of judgment.
If I were to carry out my duties with similar errors, I would be unemployed!

Non executive employees of Qantas do not work on a performance based pay structure that applies to management. We rely on a fair wage for our knowledge, experience and commitment to our work.
I do not think Qantas employees are being treated or paid fairly by their employer.

I know there are a number of people who disagree with our actions and I understand they are entitled to their opinion, but that is all it is, an opinion.
The members of the ALAEA have spoken as one and are acting as one.
It is humbling to see so many, intent on an outcome, that will benefit all employees.

I urge all ALAEA members to remain focused and committed to our quest. It will not be easy from here on. There will be many obstacles placed in our path but I believe we can and will, negotiate all hurdles with ease, if we remain united.

At the end of this dispute, no matter what the outcome, Qantas employees will never again be looked at in the same way we were previously seen by management.

My best wishes to all.


PS
PAF, go somewhere and find a friend.
ACARS, if you struggle with simple English, use your spellchecker.

[tnfixer]

Well said Amstrang.
I have had nothing but support from all other areas of the company I interact with (ground staff, F/a's, Tech crew, cleaners, ramp and catering) in our battle for a well overdue renumeration increase.
One thing we can do is go out of our way to thank them or help them so that they know we appreciate their support.
All other departments are looking at us, we must maintain our solidarity and not let them (or ourselves) down.

[Bumpfoh]

For F sake PAF

Firstly I don't think your EBA is for the next 5 - 10 years. If that's what your union wants then they are crazy.

I never suggested that it was, this was just an arbitary period of time to highlight what we have/have not received in the last 10 years.

I'll give you a hint. GD will be sitting in a multimillion dollar home and sipping a nice wine in 10 years - regardless of anything you do.

I think you have hit the nail on the head, and he will do this at the expense of the shareholder and employees alike.

what makes you think that I'm going forwards pay wise with the current inflation rate?

What your personal remuneration situation is none of my business, read what I said. If you are going backwards as you imply then by your logic you should take a pay cut for the shareholders benefit to boot.

Your logic is this: You want to declare war on China, so you've started bombing every mine site in WA and a couple of Perth suburbs

.

Thats your opinion but you don't work there and are not subjected to the current QE management lunacy on a daily basis which is where our real beef lies, GD just happens to be the figure head who drives the 3% policy.

[amstrang]

PAF,
Don't worry about us missing the point, we will look after ourselves!
You just settle down somewhere comfy and calm yourself down!

Thanks for your input and concern in the past, now, don't you give it another thought.

[acslame]

PAF & ACARS
Plenty of high talk but no suggestions on a course
of action staff should take.
So lets hear it.
I am all ears.

[Flugbegleiter]

Originally Posted by Pass-A-Frozo

If you wish to win your argument then tell the shareholders that GD is reducing their companies [sic] long term value.

This is one of the only good points you have made here, PAF. I totally agree with you on this one. The shareholders and the public need to know what a rotting mess this company has become.

Qantas was warned about the detrimental effects of a "disengaged workforce" about 2 years ago, but they chose to ignore this - nothing changed.

The 5% appears to be the minor issue in this dispute and to be honest, I think a lot of the guys will be disappointed if they get their 5% but there is no shake-up to management; that is what they really want.

[Collando]

question re 360 million

When GD says it will cost the company $360 million over 3 years if the flow on of 5% extends to others,does he mean it will cost $360 mill to pay everyone 5% or does he mean that it will cost $360 mill to pay everyone an extra 2%?

Just wondered?

[Collando]

Interesting

Flying Empty

Tonight...Thursday 12th of June 2008.
A 747 is flying to LAX.....empty.
Thats a whole lot of burn for absolutely no revenue.
Any one able to provide the finer details?

[sickofqf]

saddam's old buddy said...

Forget higher duty bans,That gives the company reason for standing down a single employee, One in all in. Return to the 8 hr roster.

Ali,

I agree, forget higer duty bans because that would be the quickest way to lose the dispute when pay day comes around. All those 4 hour dockings....ouch.

As for 8 hour roster, you need to talk to SP about that. He has some VERY interesting things to say about when that may be an option which QF have no need of finding out here!!


SP.
How about putting an AD in the press thanking passengers and especially QF staff for their patience during these trying times that Dixon has inflicted on us all in defence of his "legacy" ( read EGO)

I haven't seen any apologies from Dixon to HIS customers so how about we grab that moral high ground?

Better go now............defects to find.............wonder if I can ground something........

[Bolty McBolt]

Welcome ACARS747 to our little thread and glad to see you back P.A.F. Thought you had been chased off. I would have been very disappointed to see a member of a Defence force quit so easy ..unless of course you are a francophone

ACARS747
Troll on

Why should you get 5% when others have settled for the standard 3%

To use your myopic antagonistic type argument..
Why 5% Because we can !

All the other unions within QF large and small have been fragmented by multiple unions representing the same "profession" across the QF group or people employed on multiple pay bands, different T.Cs with casuals doing same or similar job for different money or both.

If you want to get back at dixon and his cronies, do it another way! the delays and cancellation are not accepted by the public! they don’t care that you want the extra 5%, they have saved up for years for their holiday and they abuse the check in staff to the ground staff to the cabin crew when a delayed has occurred.

Dixon, Cox, Harris, should have thought about the repercussions of their actions after 18 months of delay tactics in negotiating the EBA.
This did not happen over night.
Engineers have always been about getting the aircraft out so bums on seats were happy.
I can assure you our actions are not taken lightly BUT
The same tripe was served up each time by management that not even the most non discerning pallet could digest.
The company offer was given the big NO and PIA was voted in twice by a huge majority of 80% +. Something I believe made I Oldmedow choke on his chardonnay as the second result was unexpected and the rest ......is Now.

PAF. You enjoy using the word bully associated with union.
Perhaps we are bullies at the moment but that is the game we are playing and we have had good coaches
So be it

I do apologise to the rest of the prune community for actually answering and/or encouraging trolls. I promise I won’t do it again.
As my father always said Do not put any store in the ravings of an idiot.
And as my punishment I shall read my air legislation notes

[mel applied]

PS. I am a LAME but would never take directions from a union exec full of hypocrites. At least QF pay my wage

You were obviously not one of the 80-odd percent who voted in favour of PIA?
If you have a better way of advancing our claim, then let's hear it.