Is Ukraine about to have a war?

[langleybaston]

Originally Posted by FUMR

Naive but honest question from a non mil person: With the accuracy of weapons now at the UA's disposal, can't RF artillery and/or missile launchers (using the nuclear plant as cover) be targeted without any significant danger to the plant?

Another non-military:
yes, probably but the Ukrs have been at great pains to occupy the moral high ground [not difficult compared with the opposition].
Such a stance, as brave patriotic victim good guys, will be increasingly important as the West takes the strain of autumn and winter hardships.
Very important that any radiation leaks/ spills/ accidents harming Russians should be seen as self-inflicted.

[Tartiflette Fan]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50

All it takes is one round to fall short and it ends in tears.

The containment envelope ( of Western plants ) is supposed to withstand a very large passenger plane striking it, so even a 155 mm shell shouldn't be too much of qa challenge.

[NutLoose]

This could be a worry if true.

Twitter

[jolihokistix]

https://english.alarabiya.net/News/w...r-treason-TASS

Quote: “A leading Russian hypersonics expert has been arrested on suspicion of treason, the state-controlled TASS news agency reported on Friday.”

[ORAC]

he containment envelope ( of Western plants ) is supposed to withstand a very large passenger plane striking it, so even a 155 mm shell shouldn't be too much of qa challenge.

I would suspect you have no idea what you are talking abou?

An aircraft is designed for light weight to slice through the air, a shell is designed to penetrate concrete with explosive plasma jets to severe steel let alone a few inches of concrete.

Bottom line - the containment vessel is easily penetrated - and the external cooling systems and ponds are obviou and unprotected.

[NutLoose]

Didn’t the US take out the Iraqi none nuclear power plant by stuffing one missile into the wall to punch a hole into it, then sticking another one through the said hole to take out the generation plant

Containment requirements

https://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/public...ub1189_web.pdf

..

[cheekychimp]

Originally Posted by ORAC

I would suspect you have no idea what you are talking abou?

An aircraft is designed for light weight to slice 5b rough the air, a shell is designed to penetrate concrete with explosive plasma jets to severe steel let alone a few inches of concrete.

Bottom line - the compntainment vessel is easily penetrated - and the external cooling systems and ponds are obviou and unprotected.

Say all again, not in BATCO

[etudiant]

Originally Posted by ORAC

I would suspect you have no idea what you are talking abou?

An aircraft is designed for light weight to slice 5b rough the air, a shell is designed to penetrate concrete with explosive plasma jets to severe steel let alone a few inches of concrete.

Bottom line - the compntainment vessel is easily penetrated - and the external cooling systems and ponds are obviou and unprotected.

Against that is the size of the facility.
Nuclear plants are pretty big, they don't explode if one punches a hole into the concrete containment shell.
To do serious damage, one would ideally hit the reactor, a pressure vessel entombed at the base of the containment.
Seen that the resultant mess would be yours to clean up, if you win, neither combatant has any interest in doing so.

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by etudiant

Against that is the size of the facility.
Nuclear plants are pretty big, they don't explode if one punches a hole into the concrete containment shell.
To do serious damage, one would ideally hit the reactor, a pressure vessel entombed at the base of the containment.
Seen that the resultant mess would be yours to clean up, if you win, neither combatant has any interest in doing so.

To state the painfully obvious - these are not "western" nuclear facilities. The Russian/Soviet standards are not nearly so robust.

[Lonewolf_50]

Originally Posted by Tartiflette Fan

The containment envelope ( of Western plants ) is supposed to withstand a very large passenger plane striking it, so even a 155 mm shell shouldn't be too much of qa challenge.

You want to bet your health on that?

[Lonewolf_50]

Originally Posted by NutLoose

Didn’t the US take out the Iraqi none nuclear power plant by stuffing one missile into the wall to punch a hole into it, then sticking another one through the said hole to take out the generation plant

Don't you mean the Israelis? The US blew up a lot of stuff in Iraq, but a nuclear plant wasn't one of them.

[fdr]

Originally Posted by NutLoose

Didn’t the US take out the Iraqi none nuclear power plant by stuffing one missile into the wall to punch a hole into it, then sticking another one through the said hole to take out the generation plant

Containment requirements

https://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/public...ub1189_web.pdf

..

Ilan Ramon, who was killed on the Columbia STS-107 was one of the pilots on the Osirak NPP raid flying his F-16...

[fdr]

Originally Posted by Beamr

Drones are really changing the way war is fought. How to protect troops from drones will be in the "very urgent acquisition list" of probably every army on earth. All one needs is a drone with some payload capability and a release servo, pick a grenade of your choice and off you go.
https://twitter.com/LXSummer1/status...26674928779265

That conscripted soldier has a severe brain injury that is causing his behavior, the guy is seriously injured. It may be shrapnel to the head, or just concussion but he is having a very bad day and probably the rest of his life will be altered by this one moment. The harm to any individual is a sad event, it may be necessary but it is not a point of amusement I would suggest. The Russians are committing horrific acts, they need to go home, and if they don't then they need to be neutralised, and that does cause death, all of which should be regrettable at the same time as it is necessary.

[peter we]

Originally Posted by fdr

That conscripted soldier has a severe brain injury that is causing his behavior, the guy is seriously injured. It may be shrapnel to the head, or just concussion but he is having a very bad day and probably the rest of his life will be altered by this one moment. The harm to any individual is a sad event, it may be necessary but it is not a point of amusement I would suggest. The Russians are committing horrific acts, they need to go home, and if they don't then they need to be neutralised, and that does cause death, all of which should be regrettable at the same time as it is necessary.

He's a volunteer, no Russia conscripts allowed in Ukraine.

[Winemaker]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50

Don't you mean the Israelis? The US blew up a lot of stuff in Iraq, but a nuclear plant wasn't one of them.

And was it an operating reactor or a reactor in construction or initial fuel loading. There's a big difference between an operating plant and one that has never gone critical. As to Soviet reactors, containment is not to international standards per Chernobyl.

[ORAC]

He's a volunteer, no Russia conscripts allowed in Ukraine.

ROFL,

Tell that to the families of the conscripts told they were just going to Belarus for an exercise.…

[NutLoose]

I must admit I have wondered if this is the Ukrainians plan for a while, make a big play for Kherson drawing Russian troops from elsewhere to bottle them up by dropping bridges and taking out their supply dumps and resupply lines thus rendering them less combat effective while maintaining the ability to accurately hit high value targets,

Thus while the other areas especially around the likes of Izyum, allow the Ukrainians a breathing space and the ability to stall the Russian advance by pushing on Izyum and cutting off the Russian main supply route into the region.


https://www.dailykos.com/stories/202...m_campaign=RSS

[peter we]

Originally Posted by ORAC

ROFL,

Tell that to the families of the conscripts told they were just going to Belarus for an exercise.…

that was long ago. They were withdrawn pretty quickly.

[henra]

Originally Posted by peter we

He's a volunteer, no Russia conscripts allowed in Ukraine.

Probably true (yet there do seem to be also conscripts involved) but still the fact that some ugly mercenary troops engaged and also some individual regular Army Soldiers (often from Chechnya - but those are not the ones in the trenches) are and have been committing atrocities and war crimes doesn't mean this particular guy wasn't a poor Joe average coming from a poor region in Russia where joining the Army was one of the few options feeding his family.
I'm with @fdr on this one.
I'm genuinely happy for each ammo storage flying to the moon. I'm happy for each arty piece or tank sending its turret to a geostationary transfer orbit. For each Cruise missile or Russian Fighter Jet being shot down. Yet I can't feel genuine happiness seeing this kind of vids. May have been a nice bloke that just signed the wrong paper. Will never return to a normal life like so many others in wars fought because some elderly sh*tbag has an itch for glory.

[Beamr]

Those ammo storages have staff.
with every turret, three troops blow up.
with every aircraft there are pilots.
in every trench there is an undisclosed amount of people.
Ii is easier to see a MBT blow up since you cant see the blood and guts that have spread out evenly to every corner. Or smeared the inside of the turret.

These videos aren't nice, especially since that specific video made suffering a comedy. That is wrong.

However, I despise even more castration videos, rape videos, torture videos, videos showing buildings with children blown up. These are the aggressors, invaders, those people in trenches chose to be there, they knew the dangers and odds and that may happen when you choose that uniform. If they can't fathom that it is a killing business, it's their personal issue.