British Airways vs. BASSA (current Airline Staff Only)
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in general, the non-strikers seem perfectly able to respect and understand the viewpoint of the strikers, even if they, ultimately, don't concur with it.
Either we all respect each other's opinions and decisions in these matters or we don't.
And can we please not have any more references to bouncy castles. It appears in so many posts on here and is a bit silly. If the Union organized bouncy castles at Bedfont for people with kids, so what? What did you expect, burning braziers and baton charges?
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how can these same people feel intimidated by luggage tags?
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I agree with that but if it's true how can these same people feel intimidated by luggage tags? I don't think they do.
Either we all respect each other's opinions and decisions in these matters or we don't.
And can we please not have any more references to bouncy castles. It appears in so many posts on here and is a bit silly. If the Union organized bouncy castles at Bedfont for people with kids, so what? What did you expect, burning braziers and baton charges?
Either we all respect each other's opinions and decisions in these matters or we don't.
And can we please not have any more references to bouncy castles. It appears in so many posts on here and is a bit silly. If the Union organized bouncy castles at Bedfont for people with kids, so what? What did you expect, burning braziers and baton charges?
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Mr Bunker, thank you for the response, you did not let me down.
I have no idea what your background is but you seem to have a strong opinion on the subject.
You paint a very blinkered picture, not the one I see at work. Yes if you wade through the BASSA and Crew Forum you will find some luddites.
The fact is the number of people making such comments is an extremely small proportion of the membership.
We as a community are very professional bunch, and from my point of view very seldom bring our disagreement onboard the aircraft. We have had a few incidents that were to say the least childish, but on the whole I am proud to work with such resilient people.
I will not challenge the figures because we all believe what we believe, I will just say that the numbers who took IA would not be considered a “cadre” we are strong in numbers and believe that change will come through negotiation.
The problem is that BA’s ideal future within IFCE is a de-unionised workforce. The model at LGW has proven that they can have it. The present workforce at LHR (whether you agree or not) has been subjected to anti union tactics that have caused immense stress to all involved (on both sides of the fence).
I believe that the strategy taken by our leadership was far too aggressive for the community involved. They thought that they understood BASSA, and the probably did comprehend the few they had encounters with.
Where this plan runs into problems is a lack of understanding towards a whole community, it was presumed that by showing crew that they were “over paid and underworked” they would “get it” and step into line.
Now the strategy is not at fault, most crew understand the need for change. The failure to acknowledge the emotion of the crew community is where this all started to go wrong.
Being constantly told that you are not performing, you are far too expensive, we could get others to fill your shoes, ……you get the gist, aroused the wrong response.
BA cabin crew on a whole are a proud bunch, whether you agree or not the feeling is that we are the face of BA and our customers think we are something special (well thy do on my flights).
Many very pro BA (I am one) people were incensed by the aggressive arrogant management style. Many of us tried to discus our future with our leadership team, but they stuck to the plan.
BA’s provocation drove the community into the arms of BASSA.
This is not as simple as black and white and not all about the BASSA forum.
I have no idea what your background is but you seem to have a strong opinion on the subject.
You paint a very blinkered picture, not the one I see at work. Yes if you wade through the BASSA and Crew Forum you will find some luddites.
The fact is the number of people making such comments is an extremely small proportion of the membership.
We as a community are very professional bunch, and from my point of view very seldom bring our disagreement onboard the aircraft. We have had a few incidents that were to say the least childish, but on the whole I am proud to work with such resilient people.
I will not challenge the figures because we all believe what we believe, I will just say that the numbers who took IA would not be considered a “cadre” we are strong in numbers and believe that change will come through negotiation.
The problem is that BA’s ideal future within IFCE is a de-unionised workforce. The model at LGW has proven that they can have it. The present workforce at LHR (whether you agree or not) has been subjected to anti union tactics that have caused immense stress to all involved (on both sides of the fence).
I believe that the strategy taken by our leadership was far too aggressive for the community involved. They thought that they understood BASSA, and the probably did comprehend the few they had encounters with.
Where this plan runs into problems is a lack of understanding towards a whole community, it was presumed that by showing crew that they were “over paid and underworked” they would “get it” and step into line.
Now the strategy is not at fault, most crew understand the need for change. The failure to acknowledge the emotion of the crew community is where this all started to go wrong.
Being constantly told that you are not performing, you are far too expensive, we could get others to fill your shoes, ……you get the gist, aroused the wrong response.
BA cabin crew on a whole are a proud bunch, whether you agree or not the feeling is that we are the face of BA and our customers think we are something special (well thy do on my flights).
Many very pro BA (I am one) people were incensed by the aggressive arrogant management style. Many of us tried to discus our future with our leadership team, but they stuck to the plan.
BA’s provocation drove the community into the arms of BASSA.
This is not as simple as black and white and not all about the BASSA forum.
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from my point of view very seldom bring our disagreement onboard the aircraft
We have had a few incidents that were to say the least childish
if you wade through the BASSA and Crew Forum you will find some luddites.
Witness the tirade against one csd.
BA’s provocation drove the community into the arms of BASSA.
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Hot wings
I am ex LGW it was not a sacrifice, the community at Gatwick did not listen to the union’s advice and volunteered for SFG. I will give that it could have been handled better(would you all have supported IA over LGW T&C) I doubt it!!!!
Being on WW and constantly hit my 900 hours, so not underworked, thank you!!!!!
As a 47-year-old CSD having made a career in this industry do not consider myself over paid.
I have vast experience, I spent 8 years in the military and within BA I have spent time in engineering, check-in, catering, and dispatch.
Over the years I have saved BA vast amounts, and enjoy the role I have worked hard to achieve.
We do need change I admit that, I would just like some respect and reassurance from my employer.
Not too much to ask is it?
I am ex LGW it was not a sacrifice, the community at Gatwick did not listen to the union’s advice and volunteered for SFG. I will give that it could have been handled better(would you all have supported IA over LGW T&C) I doubt it!!!!
Being on WW and constantly hit my 900 hours, so not underworked, thank you!!!!!
As a 47-year-old CSD having made a career in this industry do not consider myself over paid.
I have vast experience, I spent 8 years in the military and within BA I have spent time in engineering, check-in, catering, and dispatch.
Over the years I have saved BA vast amounts, and enjoy the role I have worked hard to achieve.
We do need change I admit that, I would just like some respect and reassurance from my employer.
Not too much to ask is it?
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The XXXX labels are a sign of being a member of a club. They are not intimidating in themselves. How non striking cabin crew perceive these labels is not for me to say, only they can comment on it as they are the ones who have to deal with it day by day.
As for the withdrawal of staff travel if the cabin crew went on strike was, IMO, a point in the dispute for the cabin crew to take a step back for a moment and digest the magnitude of the action they were about to take. How serious were they in taking this action. Some decided that it wasn’t worth it and went in to work, the rest decided that they felt strongly enough to go on strike, even if it meant losing their staff travel.
However their judgement was clouded by the union saying, that when the dispute was done and dusted, they would get their staff travel back as part of the negotiation.
As far as I can see, the management are trying to manage the situation and although what seemed to be a hard nosed approach to negotiations, they have softened a little, e.g. the return of staff travel, albeit with loss of seniority. The union have not been so reciprocal. If there is no give and take by both sides, how can this dispute ever be resolved?
Biteme
I have to disagree with you here. BASSA have shown a complete lack of understanding of the state of the company and were not willing to make the effort to help the company make permanent cost savings. Things maybe starting to look a bit better now, but these permanent cost savings still need to be made. The rest of the airline has negotiated these savings, it is time for cabin crew to do the same. The fact that they are dragging this out will only mean they will be losers in the long run. The starting up of mixed fleet is an example.
As for the withdrawal of staff travel if the cabin crew went on strike was, IMO, a point in the dispute for the cabin crew to take a step back for a moment and digest the magnitude of the action they were about to take. How serious were they in taking this action. Some decided that it wasn’t worth it and went in to work, the rest decided that they felt strongly enough to go on strike, even if it meant losing their staff travel.
However their judgement was clouded by the union saying, that when the dispute was done and dusted, they would get their staff travel back as part of the negotiation.
As far as I can see, the management are trying to manage the situation and although what seemed to be a hard nosed approach to negotiations, they have softened a little, e.g. the return of staff travel, albeit with loss of seniority. The union have not been so reciprocal. If there is no give and take by both sides, how can this dispute ever be resolved?
Biteme
is a lack of understanding towards a whole community,
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We can, if you wish rehash the chronology of the negotiations, or lack of therein, and who did, or didn't turn up to appointed meetings. It's been done a dozen times or more on here and I doubt very much the mods would welcome an attempt to bring the wheel full circle again regarding the mob quorum decisions made at various racecourses.
Try, if you may, to refrain from the condescension you display with phrases like "you didn't let me down". If you can be bothered to research my past posts you'll see I've always said that I'm open to debate, extremism on either side serves no valuable purpose and that I'm prepared to change my mind on the matters at hand if the evidence (and by that I mean, as I always have, verifiable facts and not, as many "forumites" would have it FACT) merits such a change. The "fact" is that no such evidence is ever forthcoming. Am I minded to believe BA more than BASSA? Yup, certainly if only because the law places more strictures on the veracity of their information. You may argue they operate outwith those laws - it's a strong allegation and one that has been made or alluded to by BASSA supporters many times. It's also one I'd be very wary of making without absolute evidence to hand.
As for my background, not that it's of any contextual benefit to this discussion, I'm BA flight crew, my wife is cabin crew. She went to work, her choice, because she didn't a) want to be represented by the hollyesque mantras and scare-stories coming from the union and b) having weighed up both sides of the story (something so many striking crew seem frightened of doing - how many times do we see people saying they don't read ESS like it's something to be proud of?) she felt inclined to the BA point of view.
For the avoidance of any doubt whatsoever she chose to go to work because she wanted to, not because she felt a) bullied, b) needed her staff travel, c) didn't see the "big" picture (that'd be the one painted by Holley et al that has the temerity to compare the nobility of your spat with Iwo Jima) d) wanted others to do her dirty work for her. She's out of your cadre (I stand by the word, regardless Cadre) because she felt you offered nothing but dissimulation at best and a form of vaudevillian militancy that cast her as a bit part player in a cack-handed pantomime.
She doesn't want a damned thing that BASSA could ever hope to offer in her name. Hard as it might be for strikers to grasp, she's proud of her choices. I'm proud of her too - I wouldn't have dreamt of trying to influence her thinking - she's infinitely smarter and more independent than that. Tough as it may be to fit in with the world view that BASSA and the acolytes are encouraging, she's not the image of the non-strikers you wish them to be. And she's not alone.
MrB
Last edited by MrBunker; 25th Sep 2010 at 11:55.
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Hot wings
I am ex LGW it was not a sacrifice, the community at Gatwick did not listen to the union’s advice and volunteered for SFG. I will give that it could have been handled better(would you all have supported IA over LGW T&C) I doubt it!!!!
Being on WW and constantly hit my 900 hours, so not underworked, thank you!!!!!
As a 47-year-old CSD having made a career in this industry do not consider myself over paid.
I have vast experience, I spent 8 years in the military and within BA I have spent time in engineering, check-in, catering, and dispatch.
Over the years I have saved BA vast amounts, and enjoy the role I have worked hard to achieve.
We do need change I admit that, I would just like some respect and reassurance from my employer.
Not too much to ask is it?
I am ex LGW it was not a sacrifice, the community at Gatwick did not listen to the union’s advice and volunteered for SFG. I will give that it could have been handled better(would you all have supported IA over LGW T&C) I doubt it!!!!
Being on WW and constantly hit my 900 hours, so not underworked, thank you!!!!!
As a 47-year-old CSD having made a career in this industry do not consider myself over paid.
I have vast experience, I spent 8 years in the military and within BA I have spent time in engineering, check-in, catering, and dispatch.
Over the years I have saved BA vast amounts, and enjoy the role I have worked hard to achieve.
We do need change I admit that, I would just like some respect and reassurance from my employer.
Not too much to ask is it?
Not too much to ask at all. However, it has to be taken in context with the union's actions. If they don't turn up for meetings, refer to the executives of the company by playground nicknames and try to claim the company as their own for the purposes of rabble-rousing, what do you, in all good conscience, expect by way of a reply from the management of BA? It's telling that the board elect to deal with Unite insofar as they at least recognise that the officers of that union (as opposed to its' sub-branch) are professional union officers and not given to so much of the braveheart, throw enough mud and see if it sticks, approach of BASSA.
My wife's a WW CSD too. I expect she's saved the company money along the way as well. I don't expect, as I don't think you can either, she could quantify that amount and until a) you can and b) you're paid according to the amounts of savings you make, it's particularly relevant.
As for LGW, well, looking from the outside in, you've articulated the standard self-serving argument always used for letting SFG happen. It's telling to note that one of BALPA's long-standing aims was to erase the existence of EOG pay and conditions for flight-crew in order to unify the pilot body. We're some way down the road of achieving that and it's also noteworthy that it provides that unification that so many crow about elsewhere. From the outside again, it appears that BASSA's survival strategy is to keep donating a limb as long as the torso is left alone. I say donating, I mean sacrificing.
Like it or not, BASSA haven't taken the hearts and minds of all crew and bases with them. The failure of representation at LGW has to be, in major part, down to the manner in which BASSA operate. To imply that it's down to approx 1000 individuals who don't see the "big" picture is to abrogate responsibility for a union to act in the interests of all.
MrB
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I find the Bassa xxxx tags and Bassa lanyards intimidating because basically the vast majority of us work together and just do the job, unaware of whether we are working with a striker or non striker but the moment you see one of these things, you immediately become aware of the persons opinion.
I am a non striker and this is purely because I did not agree with the way the union has conducted itself. In my opinion they did not negotiate in good faith, and that's if they turned up at all, and what they were offering, like 767 work to E/F, was not something I wanted them to be negotiating for me anyway. I can assure you that the vast majority of us non strikers are NOT regretting it at all and most of us came to work because we disagreed with the union and NOT because we did not want to loose staff travel.
I just did a flight as the in charge Purser and another Purser was called out to work down as main crew. This Purser had a yellow pen in his top pocket. This made me very aware of his views without even having to ask him and it made me realise how hard it must be for main crew who work with Pursers who make it so obvious how they feel, by using these symbols. However all it did, in fact, was make the other three of us realise that he was the only striker on the flight. During the flight he came up and looked at the passenger list and muttered about commuters and I actually started to feel sorry for him. I felt sorry for him that this dispute, caused by Bassa, has completely altered his personality and made him such a bitter person.
So yes these tokens are intimidating but they are also SAD to behold. Please don't feel that us non strikers are regretting not striking because actually I think it is the other way around.
I am a non striker and this is purely because I did not agree with the way the union has conducted itself. In my opinion they did not negotiate in good faith, and that's if they turned up at all, and what they were offering, like 767 work to E/F, was not something I wanted them to be negotiating for me anyway. I can assure you that the vast majority of us non strikers are NOT regretting it at all and most of us came to work because we disagreed with the union and NOT because we did not want to loose staff travel.
I just did a flight as the in charge Purser and another Purser was called out to work down as main crew. This Purser had a yellow pen in his top pocket. This made me very aware of his views without even having to ask him and it made me realise how hard it must be for main crew who work with Pursers who make it so obvious how they feel, by using these symbols. However all it did, in fact, was make the other three of us realise that he was the only striker on the flight. During the flight he came up and looked at the passenger list and muttered about commuters and I actually started to feel sorry for him. I felt sorry for him that this dispute, caused by Bassa, has completely altered his personality and made him such a bitter person.
So yes these tokens are intimidating but they are also SAD to behold. Please don't feel that us non strikers are regretting not striking because actually I think it is the other way around.
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The Blue Riband (a very nice Biscuit)
You made a judgement of my character very quickly, you seem to see me as a striking militant who bullies his way through life.
I would not get very far in my role if I went round with my eyes and ears closed.
I start my briefings by acknowledging where we are and tell my team I am happy to discuses any issues they have. I point out that whatever my stance on the situation is we are now at work and are all one team.
I have been living this terrible situation for far too long, so please don’t assume you know where I come from.
The sooner people understand that this is not about a militant band of anti-BA fanatics the better.
You are judging this situation by your preconceived ideas of what the cabin crew community are all about.
Get off the BASSA forum and engage with the cabin crew, ask the strikers what the think, feel, want. Engage with the crew who chose to work, what do they think, feel, want.
This is about people, not who is right or wrong, to resolve this we need to engage in honest meaningful dialogue.
As for not speaking out against the bullies on the BASSA forum I think you will find that many do……
A can't help but notice the silence over the BALPA lanyard question........
You made a judgement of my character very quickly, you seem to see me as a striking militant who bullies his way through life.
I would not get very far in my role if I went round with my eyes and ears closed.
I start my briefings by acknowledging where we are and tell my team I am happy to discuses any issues they have. I point out that whatever my stance on the situation is we are now at work and are all one team.
I have been living this terrible situation for far too long, so please don’t assume you know where I come from.
The sooner people understand that this is not about a militant band of anti-BA fanatics the better.
You are judging this situation by your preconceived ideas of what the cabin crew community are all about.
Get off the BASSA forum and engage with the cabin crew, ask the strikers what the think, feel, want. Engage with the crew who chose to work, what do they think, feel, want.
This is about people, not who is right or wrong, to resolve this we need to engage in honest meaningful dialogue.
As for not speaking out against the bullies on the BASSA forum I think you will find that many do……
A can't help but notice the silence over the BALPA lanyard question........
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Thank you all for your opinions, it has been a very interesting few hours.
What I take from this is that many people who are not directly involved in the cabin crew dispute are as single minded as the people they seem to disagree with.
This sad story has two sides, I made my stance but can still understand the opposite views.
The problem is that in reality if you educate yourself to both sides of this dispute there is not much in it.
One way or another people made a choice, this is a cabin crew issue and it is for us to sort out.
The “well educated” boys and girls from the debating society baffling us with big words will not resolve it.
Thanks again and please open your minds and get off the BASSA/Crew forum it’s not for you.
As Captain Kirk said “engage” you may be surprised at what you find…….
See you all soon.......
What I take from this is that many people who are not directly involved in the cabin crew dispute are as single minded as the people they seem to disagree with.
This sad story has two sides, I made my stance but can still understand the opposite views.
The problem is that in reality if you educate yourself to both sides of this dispute there is not much in it.
One way or another people made a choice, this is a cabin crew issue and it is for us to sort out.
The “well educated” boys and girls from the debating society baffling us with big words will not resolve it.
Thanks again and please open your minds and get off the BASSA/Crew forum it’s not for you.
As Captain Kirk said “engage” you may be surprised at what you find…….
See you all soon.......
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The side issues of yellow pens, union lanyards and XXXX bag tags have now been exhaustively discussed.
Can we lay those subjects to rest please?
As for cross-forum pollination; it´s not what this thread is for either.
PPRuNe is not an online tabloid.
In that same vein, high time to stop using the expression BASSAmentalists. Play-ground name calling belongs exactly there; on the playground.
If you have nothing relevant to say about BA CC industrial relations, feel free to abstain from posting until you do.
Thank you.
Can we lay those subjects to rest please?
As for cross-forum pollination; it´s not what this thread is for either.
PPRuNe is not an online tabloid.
In that same vein, high time to stop using the expression BASSAmentalists. Play-ground name calling belongs exactly there; on the playground.
If you have nothing relevant to say about BA CC industrial relations, feel free to abstain from posting until you do.
Thank you.
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This is about more than who went to work and who didn’t.
I really don’t care who did what, I have my reasons and others have theirs.
I would like to see this sorry mess rectified and get back to what I do best.
The behavior of my leadership team causes me concern, it seems to me that after two years of trying to implement change they have monumentally failed.
We as a community were obviously not happy with the proposed changes, the results of the ballot can’t be ignored.
We all of us, striker or not are considered contaminated, and are being sidestepped for the Phoenix that is rising from the ashes.
I hate to say this but the MF is where they are focusing, it is far easier to cut off the rot than try to manage us.
Like some on this forum (it may even be them) they have a blinkered view of the cabin crew community. We are judged by the actions of a few militants, why? Because that is the easy option.
How would it look if people seen that calm rational pro-BA crew were so unhappy with the way they are being treated that they took the drastic action of striking.
That would not fit the profile I am afraid.
We are still the same people we want mostly the same things, we have all been caught up in a big financial political game.
Lets hope we can come out with something we all want.
I am going for a rest now, it is hard defending the corner alone.
God forbid I make a spelling mistake, or say some thing that is deemed worthy of a 7-day ban.
Have a good weekend all…..
Hot wings,
No surprise to me mate, and to be honest I don’t want to see anyone else have their T&C eroded, so good luck to you.
I just find the undertones of your posts to be very vitriolic.
For someone to be so anti-strikers displays similar behavior to the very people you condemn.
It is about choice my friend and it was not your place to make the choice it was mine….
Right or wrong it was my choice, give me the same courtesy as I give to the people who made the choice to work.
Tiramisu
Thanks again.
I really don’t care who did what, I have my reasons and others have theirs.
I would like to see this sorry mess rectified and get back to what I do best.
The behavior of my leadership team causes me concern, it seems to me that after two years of trying to implement change they have monumentally failed.
We as a community were obviously not happy with the proposed changes, the results of the ballot can’t be ignored.
We all of us, striker or not are considered contaminated, and are being sidestepped for the Phoenix that is rising from the ashes.
I hate to say this but the MF is where they are focusing, it is far easier to cut off the rot than try to manage us.
Like some on this forum (it may even be them) they have a blinkered view of the cabin crew community. We are judged by the actions of a few militants, why? Because that is the easy option.
How would it look if people seen that calm rational pro-BA crew were so unhappy with the way they are being treated that they took the drastic action of striking.
That would not fit the profile I am afraid.
We are still the same people we want mostly the same things, we have all been caught up in a big financial political game.
Lets hope we can come out with something we all want.
I am going for a rest now, it is hard defending the corner alone.
God forbid I make a spelling mistake, or say some thing that is deemed worthy of a 7-day ban.
Have a good weekend all…..
Hot wings,
No surprise to me mate, and to be honest I don’t want to see anyone else have their T&C eroded, so good luck to you.
I just find the undertones of your posts to be very vitriolic.
For someone to be so anti-strikers displays similar behavior to the very people you condemn.
It is about choice my friend and it was not your place to make the choice it was mine….
Right or wrong it was my choice, give me the same courtesy as I give to the people who made the choice to work.
Tiramisu
Thanks again.
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The behavior of my leadership team causes me concern, it seems to me that after two years of trying to implement change they have monumentally failed.
the results of the ballot can’t be ignored.
We are judged by the actions of a few militants,
it is hard defending the corner alone.
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Even if you are a minority of one, the truth is the truth.
Mohandas Gandhi
Mohandas Gandhi
Engaging in debate is the only way that you are likely to bring others to your position. What you have done here has done nothing to try to persuade people of either the truth or justice of the BASSA position. If that provides you solace, fine, but do not expect people to take you seriously.
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Page upon page about how crew are different types of people and striked for all sorts of reasons really does stray from the actual reason you went on strike, they took one person off the plane without BASSA's approval.
If BASSA had talked 12 months ago, you would be quids in by now. There is only one place you should be pointing fingers.
Simples
If BASSA had talked 12 months ago, you would be quids in by now. There is only one place you should be pointing fingers.
Simples
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Biteme,
So which is it? Are we guilty of treating all crew alike because of the actions of a few militants, or are the crew as a whole upset at the way they have been treated as shown by the ballot result?
I have my opinion of crew and this dispute, and it's not based on bunk defiling or pants waving, it's based on the actions of thousands of crew who have refused to agree cost savings that were asked of ALL departments in BA. Everyone else, including members of the Unite union that crew belong to, has accepted changes in pay and conditions, and yet still you talk as if crew have been singled out for special treatment.
Yes, you got changes imposed on you. It was because you couldn't propose anything sensible to the leadership instead.
All the crew who voted for strike action put everyone's jobs at risk, because they didn't want to give up anything of value.
It's not the small militant minority in BASSA I have an issue with, it's the big collective 'we are special and we're not giving anything' group.
So which is it? Are we guilty of treating all crew alike because of the actions of a few militants, or are the crew as a whole upset at the way they have been treated as shown by the ballot result?
I have my opinion of crew and this dispute, and it's not based on bunk defiling or pants waving, it's based on the actions of thousands of crew who have refused to agree cost savings that were asked of ALL departments in BA. Everyone else, including members of the Unite union that crew belong to, has accepted changes in pay and conditions, and yet still you talk as if crew have been singled out for special treatment.
Yes, you got changes imposed on you. It was because you couldn't propose anything sensible to the leadership instead.
All the crew who voted for strike action put everyone's jobs at risk, because they didn't want to give up anything of value.
It's not the small militant minority in BASSA I have an issue with, it's the big collective 'we are special and we're not giving anything' group.
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: West Sussex
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Not to mention NF off the table, share options, protected pay........the list goes on. Not bad during present economic times.
Are BASSA still really stuck pre June 2009 while everyone else agreed cost saving measures and have moved on? The one out/ one back times are here to remain unfortunately however NF will soon be starting and will become more prevelent for the good of the company we all seem so passionate about.
Are BASSA still really stuck pre June 2009 while everyone else agreed cost saving measures and have moved on? The one out/ one back times are here to remain unfortunately however NF will soon be starting and will become more prevelent for the good of the company we all seem so passionate about.