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Australian pilots can work for US regionals.

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Australian pilots can work for US regionals.

Old 12th Aug 2018, 20:44
  #701 (permalink)  
 
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I’ll add as well at no point have I said one way is or was a better option than the other, just a simple comparison of wages.
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Old 12th Aug 2018, 21:36
  #702 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Left 270
Iíll add as well at no point have I said one way is or was a better option than the other, just a simple comparison of wages.
Thats not the issue. I completely agree that arguing over quality of life, or pay methodology is a waste of time. Example - The idea of long service leave makes me green with envy.

The issue is this - youíre answers are incorrect. Which makes me wonder if youíre actually living it, or just reading about it. You claimed that a 2nd year Dash FO is making $ 138K AU PA. Working hardish, itís around $100K. Your Super isnít your pay. You donít seem to have a firm grasp on either system.

The Oz EBAs are publicly available. Produce the United CBA. Iíll wait Like most people, I still have strong ties to friends in Oz airlines. Their EBAs have less flexibility in general. A good or bad thing. Depends on your point of view. example - here, it is possible to completely or partially clear your month, and then pick up trips at premium pay (150% or 200%). It depends on season, skill and seniority. But it occurs at ~ 90% seniority levels to differing extents. Hence - multiplying an hourly rate by guarantee is meaningless.

What type do you fly, and how long have you been doing it ?

Iím pretty sure Seagull is my 8 year old nephew trolling me

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Old 12th Aug 2018, 23:51
  #703 (permalink)  
 
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Dear God in heaven, my head hurts after reading some of these posts....

This is not rocket science gents; you can’t simply compare wages or in other words, as I’ve said before, AU$ to US$ because you’re not taking into account what things cost.

In the US, my taxes are half what they were in Oz, for the same amount. My food bill is half and my rent is half for double the amount of space. My car cost half what it would in Oz and I can look after a family of three and save money.


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Old 13th Aug 2018, 04:54
  #704 (permalink)  
 
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Which is all irrelevant really. All that matters is if you want to do it or not. Do you want to go to the US and fly there for the money on offer? Yes. Then go ahead and do it. It doesn’t matter a jolt what different people are earning.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 05:11
  #705 (permalink)  
 
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To get back on topic - I contacted a few of the airlines who are offering E3 sponsorship from the list previously posted in this thread. Most completely ignored my correspondence. Piedmont was the only one that wrote back to say they were interested, and PSA responded to say they specifically do not sponsor applicants requiring an E3 Visa. The rest (e.g. Compass, Envoy, Mesa, SkyWest, ect) were all silent.

Can anyone provide an update as at August 2018? TIA.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 05:17
  #706 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by AerocatS2A
Which is all irrelevant really. All that matters is if you want to do it or not. Do you want to go to the US and fly there for the money on offer? Yes. Then go ahead and do it. It doesn’t matter a jolt what different people are earning.
I agree. It would certainly help if posters who have no clue about either subject would confine themselves to videos and talking to “their mates”. There are plenty of pilots on PPrune who have either worked for an Oz Regional and/or a U.S Regional to supply facts. The rest is just noise.

For the Seagull and Left 270. This is what facts look like.

4th year Q400 FO. working 120 hours in 2018.


Originally Posted by Fujiroll76
Not necessarily, a typical 120hr month with 6 overnights per roster would see 100K. Most if not all being on Q400 bypass pay atm.

*figuers based on being a 4th year FO on the 65% rule.
From the Eastern EBA:

Base Pay: 78,733
DHA: 9,360 (120 x 6.50 x 12)
Overnight Allowances: 11,315 (157.15 x 6 x 12), this assumes the pilot qualifies for all meal allowances for each overnight trip.

Total: $99,408 + other allowances.

Based on the above I stand corrected.

I am probably in the minority with the following opinion but I wouldn't really include overnight allowances as part of the annual wage as I see it as an allowance to cover the additional expense of having to "dine out" versus feeding oneself at home.

Regarding FOs on by-pass pay, well yes they would be on more than $100k, but they aren't really on the FO pay scale are they? It's not like a new hire would be immediately accessing that would they?
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 06:07
  #707 (permalink)  
 
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Kranz ,

Envoy and PSA were never E3 sponsors. Mesa, Skywest, Piedmont and Commutair are still actively hiring.

You are better off filling in the online application rather than just emailing. These people do a lot of roadshows so getting them to reply to emails can be tough.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 08:22
  #708 (permalink)  
 
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Kranz,

On another thread you mention you don't have a PPL yet. Maybe you should stop wasting yours and other people's time emailing about jobs that your nowhere near qualified for.

Just for the people who missed it.

E3 is not a path to a Green Card!!!!!
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 13:27
  #709 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Seagull201
Tell me JP, what does an F/O at Skywrst earn per month, take home?
Is that enough to rent a unit, drive a car, groceries, pay bills, eat out, gymn fees, go out?
I dont think so.
I'm telling you conclusively that is is enough to do all of the above. Plus the savings are piling up nicely. If you want to continue to believe the youtube videos you watch and ignore the people who are here with first hand experience, then you really should go back to school and learn about acceptable sources of information.

Iím sure this has probably been covered already but does the E3 Visa contribute in any way toward an application for permanent residence as in a green card or citizenship? In the event that ones US employer doesnít require your services after two terms totaling four years is that it? You have to pack up and head on home?
The E3 has no path to a green card. You need to get married to an American or win the Diversity Lottery for that. If you wanted to come to the USA long term on an E3, I'd suggest Piedmont, where you can hang around for a few years and wait for flow to American. There is nothing in their contract that would stop that happening for an E3 holder but I'm yet to hear of any real life stories.

I think there is a 60 day grace period which will allow you to stay and and search for work if your employment is ended prematurely.
Even if there is, you're still going to need a new visa, which would be a damn pain to get onshore. You'd have to pack up everything and go, then come back a few weeks later with no flight benefits. That would suck.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 17:49
  #710 (permalink)  
 
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I've been in the US now for almost two years. It's always been my intention to come here, get the the jet experience and then move back home where the experience gathered here would make my job applications back home a lot more competitive than what it was without it. And so far, that plan is working.

Many treat the regionals as a stepping stone to the majors or other better paying jobs like the cargo or LCC carriers and the company also understands that. Infact, during my first day of Indoc here, that was exactly what was said to us by senior management in the company. They're happy to have us move on with nothing owing to the company and they're even happy to accept us back if things don't work out at our new company. It also fits their scheme of things by having pilots move on quickly, as they won't need to always be paying the top tier pay to their captains, as they move on after only a handful of years with the company. I suspect that's why the company keeps regional pilot pay at the levels they're at, and although there have been an increase of 100% or more in the last 15 years or so, regional pilot pay will never reach the levels of legacy airlines despite the fact that many of the routes that we do are the same as mainline routes (on the ERJ at least).

Although there are what's known as 'lifers' here (those who are happy to stay working at the regional level, either by choice or that they can't seem to crack it for the majors), the majority of people here (locals and E3ers) only see this as an experience gathering exercise or stepping stone for greener pastures back home or elsewhere. Although the pay is survival (and even more so if you upgrade to a captain quickly), that is not the main reason why many of us are here.

Here is some advice for those considering making the move to the USA on the E3 visa. Just do it. You have nothing to lose. You get a free jet type rating, no bond, no minimum service and you get paid to see some of the most amazing sights you'll ever see when flying (Eg, Mt St Helens, Mt Rainier, the Grand Canyon, The Golden Gate Bridge on the Bedega2 arrival in to San Francisco, the Statue of Liberty going in to La Guardia, the Niagra Falls when flying in to Chicago from the east). You'll also gain first hand experience in cold weather operations during the winter with deice and anti-ice procedures, operating in snow conditions, doing CAT 2 ILS as pilot flying in to LAX when the marine layer moves in and not to mention, getting RNP 0.3 certification as well flying into some of the busiest airports in the world, like Chicago, Atlanta, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle and Dallas. All this would look great on your resume for that 'dream job' you're applying for back home or elsewhere. This is what it's all about.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 20:38
  #711 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by VH DSJ
I've been in the US now for almost two years. It's always been my intention to come here, get the the jet experience and then move back home where the experience gathered here would make my job applications back home a lot more competitive than what it was without it. And so far, that plan is working.

Many treat the regionals as a stepping stone to the majors or other better paying jobs like the cargo or LCC carriers and the company also understands that. Infact, during my first day of Indoc here, that was exactly what was said to us by senior management in the company. They're happy to have us move on with nothing owing to the company and they're even happy to accept us back if things don't work out at our new company. It also fits their scheme of things by having pilots move on quickly, as they won't need to always be paying the top tier pay to their captains, as they move on after only a handful of years with the company. I suspect that's why the company keeps regional pilot pay at the levels they're at, and although there have been an increase of 100% or more in the last 15 years or so, regional pilot pay will never reach the levels of legacy airlines despite the fact that many of the routes that we do are the same as mainline routes (on the ERJ at least).

Although there are what's known as 'lifers' here (those who are happy to stay working at the regional level, either by choice or that they can't seem to crack it for the majors), the majority of people here (locals and E3ers) only see this as an experience gathering exercise or stepping stone for greener pastures back home or elsewhere. Although the pay is survival (and even more so if you upgrade to a captain quickly), that is not the main reason why many of us are here.

Here is some advice for those considering making the move to the USA on the E3 visa. Just do it. You have nothing to lose. You get a free jet type rating, no bond, no minimum service and you get paid to see some of the most amazing sights you'll ever see when flying (Eg, Mt St Helens, Mt Rainier, the Grand Canyon, The Golden Gate Bridge on the Bedega2 arrival in to San Francisco, the Statue of Liberty going in to La Guardia, the Niagra Falls when flying in to Chicago from the east). You'll also gain first hand experience in cold weather operations during the winter with deice and anti-ice procedures, operating in snow conditions, doing CAT 2 ILS as pilot flying in to LAX when the marine layer moves in and not to mention, getting RNP 0.3 certification as well flying into some of the busiest airports in the world, like Chicago, Atlanta, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle and Dallas. All this would look great on your resume for that 'dream job' you're applying for back home or elsewhere. This is what it's all about.
Well put, Sir.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 20:45
  #712 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by umop apisdn
The E3 has no path to a green card. You need to get married to an American or win the Diversity Lottery for that. If you wanted to come to the USA long term on an E3, I'd suggest Piedmont, where you can hang around for a few years and wait for flow to American. There is nothing in their contract that would stop that happening for an E3 holder but I'm yet to hear of any real life stories.
This is an interesting twist. The first E3 Aussie to flow to AA will be a precedent-setting case.

Just a rhetorical question: If said E3er goes to mainline AA, what does he do about visa status for the next ~25/30 years ? That's a lot of E3 renewals.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 23:20
  #713 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bafanguy
This is an interesting twist. The first E3 Aussie to flow to AA will be a precedent-setting case.

Just a rhetorical question: If said E3er goes to mainline AA, what does he do about visa status for the next ~25/30 years ? That's a lot of E3 renewals.
Unfortunately no company is obliged to renew a visa, I suspect it would as simple a solve as "Sorry we don't require your services anymore" and that would be the end of the story. Stranger things happen but I can't see anyone on an E3 flowing anywhere other than back to Australia at some stage.

That said, I would love to be proved wrong!
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 23:40
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Originally Posted by LostWanderer
Unfortunately no company is obliged to renew a visa, I suspect it would as simple a solve as "Sorry we don't require your services anymore" and that would be the end of the story. Stranger things happen but I can't see anyone on an E3 flowing anywhere other than back to Australia at some stage.

That said, I would love to be proved wrong!
not so, they are contractually obliged to flow them and would face a significant law suit if they didnít.
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 23:50
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Well that is great if so
My understanding of an E3 Visa was it was seperate to anything to do with ALPA or pilot contract. As in if the company elect not to renew someones paper work then it was entirely at their discretion given they are sponsoring said pilot. It happens already at airlines here, I know of one guy who wasn't exactly setting the world on fire with his attitude and was released with no visa renewal. No appeals either. A company merely has to say they no longer require that employee. Again, I think thats great if what you say is correct!
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Old 13th Aug 2018, 23:58
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Originally Posted by LostWanderer
Well that is great if so
My understanding of an E3 Visa was it was seperate to anything to do with ALPA or pilot contract. As in if the company elect not to renew someones paper work then it was entirely at their discretion given they are sponsoring said pilot. It happens already at airlines here, I know of one guy who wasn't exactly setting the world on fire with his attitude and was released with no visa renewal. No appeals either. A company merely has to say they no longer require that employee. Again, I think thats great if what you say is correct!
Theyre part of the seniority list sonthe whole contract applies to them. ALPA has already told them they will support the pilots if the company doesnít honour it.
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Old 14th Aug 2018, 00:33
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Originally Posted by havick


Theyre part of the seniority list sonthe whole contract applies to them. ALPA has already told them they will support the pilots if the company doesnít honour it.
Wow thats cool Havick, I am very impressed if they can pull it off! That is great for the guys and gals there. And truly, I hope it happens for everyones benefit (including my own for selfish reasons!)
But call me a bitter, old, overly suspicious fool...I will believe it when I see it. Temporary visas are an entirely different ballpark and I just can't see how ALPA could be involved in any decision to sponsor/not sponsor a pilot. At my company and most others it is an HR decision and at their entirely at their discretion who they sponsor and for how long they sponsor for...100% removed from ALPA. I honestly don't think ALPA even could (would) come in to bat for someone who the company decided to no longer sponsor on a Visa if they deemed they no longer needed them in that position - E3 legal language is VERY fluid so you don't really have a leg to stand on from a union if the airline decides they no longer wish to sponsor your Visa renewals.

More so, fastest way to peeve off a very large group of heavily unionised US citizen/perm resident pilots...start giving temporary Visa guys their coveted mainline jobs, the union is smart and wont bite the hand that feeds them, especially not for perhaps less than 100 people. I truly love the idea and ALPA's statement of support for the lads...but I think pigs will be flying on Mars before an E3 pilot is sitting in the right seat of a mainline A320/737 etc...via any kind of flow arrangement anyway. Maybe if and when the shortage gets significantly worse.

*Don't shoot the messenger. Just my opinion *
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Old 14th Aug 2018, 00:48
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Originally Posted by LostWanderer
Wow thats cool Havick, I am very impressed if they can pull it off! That is great for the guys and gals there. And truly, I hope it happens for everyones benefit (including my own for selfish reasons!)
But call me a bitter, old, overly suspicious fool...I will believe it when I see it. Temporary visas are an entirely different ballpark and I just can't see how ALPA could be involved in any decision to sponsor/not sponsor a pilot. At my company and most others it is an HR decision and at their entirely at their discretion who they sponsor and for how long they sponsor for...100% removed from ALPA. I honestly don't think ALPA even could (would) come in to bat for someone who the company decided to no longer sponsor on a Visa if they deemed they no longer needed them in that position - E3 legal language is VERY fluid so you don't really have a leg to stand on from a union if the airline decides they no longer wish to sponsor your Visa renewals.

More so, fastest way to peeve off a very large group of heavily unionised US citizen/perm resident pilots...start giving temporary Visa guys their coveted mainline jobs, the union is smart and wont bite the hand that feeds them, especially not for perhaps less than 100 people. I truly love the idea and ALPA's statement of support for the lads...but I think pigs will be flying on Mars before an E3 pilot is sitting in the right seat of a mainline A320/737 etc...via any kind of flow arrangement anyway. Maybe if and when the shortage gets significantly worse.

*Don't shoot the messenger. Just my opinion *
time will tell. But I think the companies are more afraid of multi-million dollar law suits/payouts rather than just having someone do their job.

ALPA just want to enforce their contract.

its probably very likely the very reason Envoy didnít go down the E3 route.
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Old 14th Aug 2018, 02:51
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Originally Posted by pilotchute
On another thread you mention you don't have a PPL yet. Maybe you should stop wasting yours and other people's time emailing about jobs that your nowhere near qualified for.
Didn't realise it was a crime to pose a question. In any case, the gist of my enquiries has been to ascertain more specific information around what each airline is looking for so that I can ensure I spend my training money in the way that best suits the airlines to improve my candidacy for any roles. Whilst you are correct in where I am with my training, I am working towards my CPL and would like to have this within three months (I am dedicating 3 days per week full time to prac & theory and am flying an average of 4 hours a day on each of those three days). I am also enquiring about the airline cadetship routes which include working as a CFI to boost hours to 1500 rather than DEFO. I therefore don't see my requests as being pre-emptive or wasting people's time. But thank you for your comment.

I also received a response from Compass overnight saying they do not sponsor E3's.
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Old 14th Aug 2018, 08:36
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Asking a question is fine but emailing a HR dept when you are 2 years away from min requirements would probably not impress them.

All the info on E3 is easily found by googling.

What they are "looking for" is found in the careers section of their website.

Your enthusiasm is great but work on getting your CPL and IR out of the way first. If you do want a helpful hint, during your 70 hours solo go and get 5 hours in a 206 or 210.

Last edited by pilotchute; 14th Aug 2018 at 08:59.
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