Luton-9 [Archive] - Page 5

ClearLand08

1st Apr 2018, 21:58

So I spent a couple of hours this afternoon looking at the summer schedules. The below list is what I can see for Monday, 9th July 2018. I count a total of 39 based aircraft (24 x easyJet, 8 x Wizzair, 4 x Ryanair and 2 x TUI). On this particular day there are also flights operated by Blue Air, El Al, Vueling, Sun Express & Thomas Cook, making total movements of 336 between 5.55am and 03.05am. The most frequently served destinations on this day are Amsterdam (8 flights, 6 x easyJet, 2 x Vueling), Tel Aviv (6 flights, 3 x El Al, 2 x easyJet, 1 x Wizzair) and Bucharest (6 flights, 4 x Wizzair, 2 x Blue Air).

https://i.imgur.com/N3xVtFJ.jpg

Boeing737-8

1st Apr 2018, 23:32

Thanks Clearland08, really good detailed timetable for a Monday at LTN. Didn’t want to be picky but Sunexpress changed the timing and goes to Bodrum in the day from the morning arrival from Antalya. Also we see a Dalaman on Monday evenings from Thomas cook. Apart from that TC flight we have a full Monday which is known up till today. Only changes which could be possible in the future are for Air Nostrum and Aer Southeast.

inOban

1st Apr 2018, 23:40

Are there actually two Easyjet flights from Rome both arriving at 23.35?

Falcon666

2nd Apr 2018, 04:20

davidjohnson6

2nd Apr 2018, 05:11

Anyone with inside info able to say whether the Air Nostrum / Iberia flights to San Sebastian and Vigo will return for summer 2018 ? I know that in previous years they have not been available to book until around Easter time but if Air Nostrum want to make a profit, it's getting a bit late to open reservations...

LTNman

2nd Apr 2018, 06:35

Should be 2 more stands for summer 2019 and possibly another 3 stands for 2020 if and when the biz jets are pushed out from around Signatures terminal 2.

inOban

2nd Apr 2018, 07:58

No , there are two flights on the Monday, first arrives back at 13.10 and second at 23.35.
ClearLand08 obviously put a lot of effort in so one or two errors is not bad.
Think it makes 24 based EasyJet a/c
Apologies if my previous post seemed churlish. It is indeed an excellent effort, and I'm sure the OP will welcome notice of any errors or omissions.

ClearLand08

2nd Apr 2018, 08:14

Thanks for spotting the errors guys (it doesn't bother me!) I've edited the original post for the record. It does indeed make 24 EasyJet a/c - is that 1 more than last summer?

Lee Baker Street

2nd Apr 2018, 11:10

Thanks for spotting the errors guys (it doesn't bother me!) I've edited the original post for the record. It does indeed make 24 EasyJet a/c - is that 1 more than last summer?
Yes Easyjet appear to have 24 aircraft based at present and that is an increase of 1 on last summer. A few years ago they said they would double their presence at LTN so another six should be integrated into the fleet within the next few years. I guess this will only be possible once the airport start building more aprons!

Doors to Automatic

2nd Apr 2018, 19:55

Great chart ClearLand08 - can I ask where you got the chronological info to put it together?

I have always thought there is a market for a "who flies where" App which shows where you can go from your local airport or airports within a specified time window.

lfc84

2nd Apr 2018, 20:36

https://www.pprune.org/cabin-crew/323203-what-mayfly.html

LTNman

3rd Apr 2018, 20:01

Seems that all the existing retail units in both arrivals and the check-in area will be closing at midnight. The retail units around the check-in area will make way for a bigger security area.

Spanish eyes

4th Apr 2018, 15:58

A question was asked on the airports Facebook page about the lack of a ceiling in the new ground floor terminal extension and the new canopy.
The airport confirmed a canopy will be built in phases but despite a follow up question about the lack of a ceiling they did not answer that question.

Makes me think that after being asked the question twice and choosing to ignore it the press department is too ashamed to admit the truth.:{

At least we know the canopy is coming though.

inOban

4th Apr 2018, 16:18

It's quite usual now to have an exposed ceiling. Our new Lidl has. It makes maintenance easier, and you don't get a cloud of dust when you move a panel.

Spanish eyes

4th Apr 2018, 16:46

1/ Yes I know but for starters the services are quite low so are in your face.

2/ This is meant to be the showcase entrance to a London Airport and not a discount supermarket.

3/ £180,000,000 spent and it doesn’t buy a ceiling or a finished look.

Saying that both the airport and Lidi focus on the same customer base so the great unwashed shouldn’t expect a ceiling:confused:

I would like to think that they forgot to answer the 2 part question but I am starting to have my doubts.

22/04

4th Apr 2018, 17:01

I echo previous comments about an open ceiling. Some of the new University buildings at Cranfield have them. Costs less, no void to hide nasty things etc.

inOban

4th Apr 2018, 17:05

From my experience of Lidl and from what I read here about Luton airport, Lidl is more upmarket than Luton.

canberra97

4th Apr 2018, 18:09

From my experience of Lidl and from what I read here about Luton airport, Lidl is more upmarket than Luton.

I agree with you one hundred percent especially when you see the numerous photos posted in this thread of the terminal.

pabely

4th Apr 2018, 18:13

Comparing Luton airport with Lidl, a company expanding at 17% pa in UK taking market share from others, sounds Ok to me!
With Lidl also opening a massive distribution centre up the road, I'm sure a few of their executives will use Easy routes back to HO in Germany. Their UK HO in Wimbledon has direct links via Thameslink :E

southside bobby

4th Apr 2018, 18:55

Wasted on here pabely....Spin doctoring beckons!.

LTNman

4th Apr 2018, 19:02

For those with long memories when the new terminal opened in 1999 the check-in area was so dark due to a lack of lighting that anyone with cataracts was ill-advised to use Luton unless they brought a torch with them. Maybe 10 years later the airport put in supplementary lighting.

I would like to think that Luton will finish off the ceiling to the original specification within the next 10 years as even when the retail units fully open the roof space looks like work in progress.

ericlday

4th Apr 2018, 19:22

Reply from LLA to my question regarding the ceiling.......The CGI video is purely an artist’s impression so the final finish will vary. We are not aware of what plans have been decided on for the ceiling.

LTNman

4th Apr 2018, 20:10

A bit like their walkway then. Artists impression showed a bespoke design but the reality came from a catalogue as used by Tesco’s for their trolly storage.

It’s a shame really but it won’t make a jot of difference to their passenger figures.

Buster the Bear

5th Apr 2018, 02:51

It is a bus station for travellers by air. Low cost airlines, low cost facilities. Get over it!

Can we have some proper news about anything that is not related to the 'low cost' tinminal please!

Airlines, Airports & Routes, as per the title. Not the latest franchise, or the lack of ceiling!

Sorry, but once-upon-a-time, this forum was full of ROUMERS!

Never mind, I am sure Pret can justify a change of sarnies made especially for angry bears!

LTNman

5th Apr 2018, 05:45

Got to be honest but I find the shenanigans surrounding the airport expansion far more interesting than news of a new Wizz route to a place I have never heard of.

I can invent a rumour if you like though :E

compton3bravo

5th Apr 2018, 06:19

Take a geography lesson LTMan because there will be more on the way or better still take a trip to some far away place, they won't bite and are a lot more friendly than the heads down in the street I am not talking to you Brit.

LTNman

5th Apr 2018, 07:28

15,799,219 passengers but only 2,354,589 items of luggage.

Busiest day was August 25th with 59,272 passengers

135,538 flights

14 airlines to 139 destinations in 38 countries.

29,119 tons of cargo.

Falcon666

5th Apr 2018, 08:12

Just had a look at the progress photos on the Airport website
Top row , new duty free shop right and new arrivals passage left
Look at the finishes on the ceiling and how on earth the airports not embarrassed is beyond me.
Agree with all the other posters, it looks awful!!

planedrive

5th Apr 2018, 08:45

The ceiling has started to go up on the exit from the arrivals route so no doubt it will be put up over the rest of the ceiling as and when other parts are finished.

southside bobby

5th Apr 2018, 11:14

A good indication of where the Biz traffic to be squeezed out of LTN may well migrate to is portrayed with the plans released today of the Cranfield Air Park which has received a go ahead today.

Poetic license to a degree but count 40+ Biz of all sizes arranged on the ramps in the plans.

Keyvon

5th Apr 2018, 15:11

https://www.lutontoday.co.uk/news/holidays-are-coming-three-new-distinations-added-to-luton-airport-offering-and-25-000-more-seats-1-8431852

New routes to Heraklion and Thessaloniki (Halkidiki)
Continuation of Hurghada (Egypt) into Summer
Additional flights to Dalaman
+25,000 additional seats

New for S19 is also Endifha (Tunisia) with TUI.

cj241101

5th Apr 2018, 15:45

New for S19 is also Endifha (Tunisia) with TUI.
Think you mean Enfidha....

PAXboy

5th Apr 2018, 16:07

LTNman
15,799,219 passengers but only 2,354,589 items of luggage.Of course there was hardly any luggage - it was all in the blinkin cabins ...:mad: :ugh:

LTNman

5th Apr 2018, 17:28

Yes I know, I even figured that one out for myself:= maybe the airport should have said checked in luggage.

LTNman

7th Apr 2018, 15:13

The first of the new entrances has opened. At the moment it is signposted as arrivals but will eventually be signposted as departures.
https://i.imgur.com/ejbAztU.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/yNKgj9j.jpg

In the distance the ceiling can be seen being installed. Either side will be retail outlets.
https://i.imgur.com/6myLSdv.jpg

Arriving passengers can pass either side of the coffee shop that is under construction to the left. To the right will be the relocated burger outlet.
https://i.imgur.com/frufmZJ.jpg

So far one shop and one food outlet is open. All the old retail outlets in the existing check-in area are closed and the whole area is now boarded up.
https://i.imgur.com/kuXPcLg.jpg

The new travel centre has been opened but I am not sure if this is the final layout.
https://i.imgur.com/5LLI7O2.jpg

Work continues on the pedestrian subway. The road will be raised to pass over the passenger route from the second multistory to the terminal.
https://i.imgur.com/6A8zMjd.jpg

While at the same time work continues on the new drop off zone.
https://i.imgur.com/NbEVHCQ.jpg

I have got to say the light is now at the end of the tunnel as far as the terminal is concerned. Also with the old temporary arrivals area now closed all arriving and departing passengers share the same concourse. This makes the airport look really busy with passengers and visitors everywhere which means taking photos involves a long wait.

There is no doubt that the airport is being transformed out of all recognition over the last 3 years.

Buster the Bear

8th Apr 2018, 14:38

Blue Islands (SI, Jersey) has dropped plans to operate services out of Guernsey to each of London City, London Luton, and Dublin Int'l as the Committee for Economic Development of the States of Guernsey rejected the carrier's bid for a subsidy, the Guernsey Press has reported.

"Following Aurigny Air Services' cessation of the Guernsey to London City route late last year, Blue Islands engaged with the Committee for Economic Development when it was in discussion with other operators about reinstating a service to London City. Despite competitive pricing, the ever-present issue of operating to and from Guernsey’s sub-scale market meant there was no standalone commercial viability and all routes were forecast to be loss-making," the carrier has said.

The Jersey-based regional specialist planned to operate an 11x weekly service between Guernsey and London City, with double-daily services during working days. In addition, the carrier would also have operated 6x weekly to each of London Luton and Dublin. In order to launch these routes, Blue Islands planned to add a sixth aircraft to its fleet. Business cases included options of either an ATR42 or a larger ATR72.

Currently, the carrier operates an Avions de Transport Régional-only fleet of one ATR42-300, one ATR42-500, and three ATR72-500s.

Since the proposal did not receive a go-ahead from the regional government, Blue Islands will not be expanding its fleet in the near future.

According to the ch-aviation capacity module, Guernsey currently sees London traffic with 40 flights per week to London Gatwick and seven flights per week to London Southend operated by Aurigny Air Services. There are no direct flights to Ireland out of Guernsey at the present time.

Expressflight

8th Apr 2018, 15:18

According to the ch-aviation capacity module, Guernsey currently sees London traffic with 40 flights per week to London Gatwick and seven flights per week to London Southend operated by Aurigny Air Services. There are no direct flights to Ireland out of Guernsey at the present time.

I think that should read "...... seven flights per week to London Stansted......"

canberra97

8th Apr 2018, 15:35

I think that should read "...... seven flights per week to London Stansted......"

Buster just did a copy and paste from the ch.aviation website without linking it.

I too had noticed the mistake regarding Southend instead of Stansted when I had originally read the article on ch.aviation.

port_94

9th Apr 2018, 15:40

I wonder if the ceiling in the check in concourse will change because it doesn’t seem to match the rest of the terminal.

LTNman

9th Apr 2018, 16:05

I would doubt it as all the services in the existing check-in concourse are well hidden and mainly fed from below. The high vaulted ceiling by the former entrances are meant to be getting circles suspended on wires.

https://roundme.com/embed/77047/193037/

The ceiling boards are a lot more spaced out than in this 360 view so diluting some of the effect.

Expressflight

9th Apr 2018, 17:48

Buster just did a copy and paste from the ch.aviation website without linking it.

I too had noticed the mistake regarding Southend instead of Stansted when I had originally read the article on ch.aviation.

No criticism of the good Bear intended.

LTNman

10th Apr 2018, 06:09

https://i.imgur.com/d9VxJfp.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/zKR4Oax.jpg

ClearLand08

11th Apr 2018, 19:17

Interesting that the gate numbers for Pier B are numbered 30 - 43 when, as far as I know, there are only 8 gates (4 stands on the East Apron and 4 gates for busses).

whitelighter

11th Apr 2018, 20:34

Looks like the (much derided) Stansted 'shopping mall'
Which in fairness is pretty similar to Heathrow T3

pabely

11th Apr 2018, 21:13

Well I think we all knew that! St Albans residents are most frequent flyers at Luton Airport | St Albans and Harpenden News - Herts Advertiser (http://www.hertsad.co.uk/news/st-albans-residents-are-most-frequent-flyers-at-luton-airport-1-5472642)

pabely

11th Apr 2018, 21:15

Interesting that the gate numbers for Pier B are numbered 30 - 43 when, as far as I know, there are only 8 gates (4 stands on the East Apron and 4 gates for busses).

For now......

LTNman

11th Apr 2018, 22:07

Reminds me when they signposted the multi-storey as multi-storey 1 implying there would be a second one, which is exactly what is now going to be built.

The gap between the new build shopping area and the existing departure lounge is the vaulted ceiling by the old entrances,which must be viewed now by the airport as lost retail space.

LTNman

12th Apr 2018, 03:48

1.2 million passengers in March.
Busiest ever Easter takes London Luton Airport to 1.2m passengers... - London Luton Airport (http://newsroom.london-luton.co.uk/news/busiest-ever-easter-takes-london-luton-airport-to-1-dot-2m-passengers-in-march-302481?_ga=2.61665448.581744589.1523504620-774014428.1523504620)

ClearLand08

12th Apr 2018, 06:31

The gap between the new build shopping area and the existing departure lounge is the vaulted ceiling by the old entrances,which must be viewed now by the airport as lost retail space.
The original plans had a few extra security lanes in this space

LTNman

12th Apr 2018, 10:23

Yes that will happen as that space is on the ground floor where the closed retail units are. I was talking about the lost space on the first floor due to the wave shaped roofline.

Anyway the big news story of the day is that the Monarch HQ building has been sold.

Also it didn’t take long but the yellow and black tape is already out in the ground floor new build as the floor to Pret is half an inch higher than the concourse floor so is a trip hazard.

planedrive

12th Apr 2018, 16:07

Any idea who the Monarch building has been sold to??

LTNman

12th Apr 2018, 16:55

No idea, I noticed the for sale sign has been replaced by a sold sign. It was only on the market for a matter of months so someone was keen to buy it when the opportunity came.

LTNman

12th Apr 2018, 18:43

The contractors village by Luton Airport Parkway is now open and partially occupied with 24 hour security on site. This is the first of the DART villages to be built and opened suggesting work will be starting at the railway station end of the mass transit system first.

pabely

12th Apr 2018, 19:37

No idea, I noticed the for sale sign has been replaced by a sold sign. It was only on the market for a matter of months so someone was keen to buy it when the opportunity came.

Now let me think, a new UK airline based at Luton?

LTNman

12th Apr 2018, 21:38

If I was a betting man I would think Easyjet, TUI, Wizz UK or a hotel chain could be contenders.

Easyjet operate from 2 sites at the airport with a car park off airport and run shuttle buses between the 3 sites. The Monarch building has a large car park which would be a bonus and would bring their buildings within walking distance of each other and could allow them to close their remote car park.

TUI are based a mile from the airport and also have to run bus services between their HQ, the airport and the station where one of their car parks is located. The Monarch building is a short walk from their airport operation and hangar.

Unlikely Wizz UK as I would think that would be run in the main from Hungary making the building too big.

Possible hotel conversion but it has been sold with no planning application to convert it. Whoever has bought it will have some sort of link to the airport.

TartinTon

13th Apr 2018, 09:08

Why the assumption that it's an airline? Would suit any major company looking to relocate out of/or be closer to London. Good sized building, plenty of parking space, international airport and hotel conference facilities on the doorstep and 30 mins from London.

LTNman

13th Apr 2018, 11:36

Valid point as the building is within the govenment's enterprise zone. The building does have one carbuncle and that is what I think was a large flight simulator building is attached to it that goes up several floors. Also it is only metres away from one of the airports fuel farms.

davidjohnson6

13th Apr 2018, 14:24

There are probably plenty of sites that would suit a company looking for office space that are not next to an airport. The only companies which would really want to be right next to an airport rather than a mile away are those that are actively involved in aviation. For anyone else, Luton town centre or a suburban business park / light industrial estate would likely be preferable

LTNman

13th Apr 2018, 14:40

I would say Monarch's building in located in the heart of the airport not next to it but I know what you mean.

SHTTKR

13th Apr 2018, 18:45

LTNman

16th Apr 2018, 20:57

Looks like pier B will be opening soon for at least coaches. Lots of window washing taking place today and the contractors village landside fence has been moved so the coaches will have an exit route between the village and the pier. There is still a fence between the aircraft stands and the pier though as of today.

Inside the ground floor terminal infill the 2 coffee shops will be opening next and soon but are still boarded up. Work on the The Burger King site seems to have only recently been started while M&S is still an empty shell.

No progress on the ceiling which still only has a few slats fitted.

The infill already has its first broken floor tile.

As for the new drop off zone, I can't yet get my head around the exit route yet as kerbing has been installed at the ends of each lane. Also how passengers will be crossing the ring road. The ring road used to come to a standstill when passengers had to use a temporary pedestrian crossing from the short term car park before the foot bridge was installed. Passenger volumes from the drop off zone will be 10 times that of the short term car park.

LGS6753

17th Apr 2018, 16:38

The Air Nostrum flights are not yet in the Iberia/Air Nostrum booking engine. However they are in the ACL Start of Season data with 99 slots.

Anyone know if they are likely to operate?

pabely

17th Apr 2018, 18:38

Work begins on new £225 million rail link at Luton Airport | Anglia - ITV News (http://www.itv.com/news/anglia/2018-04-17/work-begins-on-new-225-million-rail-link-at-luton-airport/)

If the boarding and exiting from trains via Glass Safety Door looks like the London Underground Jubilee link then it will be smart, but I doubt it!

LTNman

17th Apr 2018, 20:22

The public's perception will be in the quality of the materials used for the finish of the stations as well as the trains. The bulk of the spent money will be the build and a tiny percentage will be the finish.

The cost of the Luton DART is around £200 million; including construction of the stations, and associated infrastructure, and an additional £25 million has been allocated for a new Network Rail overbridge at Luton Airport Parkway railway station.

Looks like the cost is already up another £25 million before work even starts as there was no mention before of more money needed for a new passenger footbridge across all BR platforms. I have no idea why the existing bridge can't be used so there must be a very good reason to spend an extra £25,000,000

https://i.imgur.com/iFWyGGo.jpg

Still wondering how the passengers will end up paying for the link? At the moment passengers can buy a through ticket to Luton Airport but many don't seem to do this so another ticket has to be purchased from the conductor. If that happens for the DART it will remove the seamless interchange.

ExpectmorePayless

17th Apr 2018, 23:11

£25 million for a bridge ! Is it going to be made of gold ?
The current bridge has lift access on the southern side and stairs on the northern side.
I guess the new bridge is required for increased passenger flows and perhaps escalators to the platforms.
I still think the £25 million would be better spent on rebuilding Luton Station.

Best if they do away with separate prices for Luton Airport and Luton Airport Parkway, instead charging the same ticket prices for everybody using the station, whether going to the airport or not.

davidjohnson6

17th Apr 2018, 23:48

A train ticket from London to Luton centre is usually cheaper than London to the airport via Parkway station. It would be difficult to justify why a ticket from London to Luton centre cannot be used for London-Parkway. With this in mind, making tickets to Parkway the same price as those to the airport might require some very clever justification.

pabely

17th Apr 2018, 23:52

The current bridge has lift access on the southern side and stairs on the northern side.

Last time I used Parkway there were lifts to all platforms, southern, northern and central.

LTNman

18th Apr 2018, 03:53

It will be difficult to educate frequent passengers getting off the train south of the new bridge that they need to walk in the opposite direction the same way it will be difficult to educate car drivers that instead of getting into the left hand lane for the drop off they will need to keep right. For many of them no doubt they will exit the station on the wrong side and then wonder where the bus is.

At the moment despite signage many meeters and greeters still head for the old arrivals building then look bemused when they find the building is blocked off.

ExpectmorePayless

18th Apr 2018, 06:14

Last time I used Parkway there were lifts to all platforms, southern, northern and central.

Perhaps my reference to north and south was confusing. I was referring to the lifts at the London end and stairs at Bedford side of the bridge. Currently no escalators to platforms.

pabely

18th Apr 2018, 06:40

Escalators no, lifts yes so as advertised, step free access. Same I think at all 12 car platforms except St. P International & London Bridge.

gilesdavies

18th Apr 2018, 11:26

With the limited land on the airport site, I wonder if the Dart could be used as a catalyst to bring more people up to the terminal, and not just train users and in the long run this new facility developed further?

Back in the 80/90's there was talk of a terminal being located where the current Parkway Station and passengers would then be transported to what is now the Central Area, after clearing security and this whole area on the hill would be considered "air-side".

I think those plans may have been a little pie in the sky, but I wonder if things like moving the drop off zone and bus station away from CTA could be a possibility in the years to come. This would free up a huge area of land to extend the terminal and aircraft parking.

I guess it all depends on passenger perception and if being dropped off and then getting a train to the terminal would be acceptable.

LGS6753

18th Apr 2018, 13:18

...and would the DART have enough capacity to move everyone up the hill?

ericlday

18th Apr 2018, 13:40

Working on 8m passengers (16m split arrivals and departures 50/50) 365 days,say 18hrs per day (evenly distributed throughout those hours...but we know there are peaks and troughs) 60 mins in each hour gives roughly 20 pax every minute !!!!!!

LTNman

18th Apr 2018, 14:49

If the council/LLAL are spending £225 million on a dart link when the airport will reach 18 million passengers without it they are seeing it as money well spent. All will be revealed in June apparently with there master plan.

Dannyboy39

18th Apr 2018, 17:36

Don’t think the DART being made airside would be the worst idea ever - if you made it hand luggage only, or at least segregate trains to either being checked luggage / cleared security. It would probably give LTN another USP. There is certainly the space to put a number of conveniences and about 4-6 security lanes.

Alas the land has already been earmarked for other projects I believe.

At LHR, on the 2 days after the closing ceremony of the Olympics in 2012, they opened their “Games Terminal” which was in essence the same remote terminal philosophy.

LTNman

19th Apr 2018, 15:28

Work begins on new light railway at Luton Airport | BT (http://home.bt.com/news/uk-news/work-begins-on-new-light-railway-at-luton-airport-11364265371452)

Passengers are expected to be able to include shuttle fares in their train tickets, although they will also be able to pay separately.

So this will be the same arrangement as now. Passengers from London often seem to get tickets to just Luton Airport Parkway as they don't know about through ticketing.

I hate to think what the extra charge is going to be when the link is costing £225 million without the daily operating costs?

port_94

20th Apr 2018, 10:34

Temporary fencing is now coming down in front of pier b so I’d say we are a week or two away from opening

LTNman

20th Apr 2018, 14:56

The builders compound on the Eastern Apron is now accessed from the service road where it disappears under the terminal.

The first of the two coffee shops is about to open landside.

Being a single terminal airport and with arrivals and departures now sharing the same concourse the airport is buzzing with people and has the feel of a major airport even though it is clearly not. It is quite remarkable how the airport is evolving and physically changing.

LTNman

21st Apr 2018, 14:22

https://buyingbusinesstravel.com/news/2128712-wizz-air-expands-luton-fleet

port_94

22nd Apr 2018, 13:28

Do we know why they are digging a rather large trench down the side of the walkway next to the shelters? It’s a rather long detour if your coming off a bus

LTNman

22nd Apr 2018, 14:52

I have been also wondering why as well. The trench starts where the existing wall ends and looks like the concrete wall will continue as a curve and then at a right angle but I can’t believe it will be that long as it is half way to the drop off zone and if you are the wrong side of it it’s a long walk to get around it.

Another airport mystery is what is happening to the 5 drop off lanes that are under construction. Each lane appears to be a cold de sac with no exit route. Yes once a car enters it has to turn around and cross the path of cars entering the next cold de sac.

Looks like a pending disaster to me unless I am missing something.

gilesdavies

22nd Apr 2018, 15:49

With new TUI flights to below places confirmed for 2019, does that mean the Luton base is going back three aircraft next year?

Antalya
Enfidha
Funchal
Herakilion
Herghada
Thessaloniki

Any clues from any TUI insiders is this will be an all 737 base or could they sneak in a 757?

-------------------------------------------------

Still surprised after the demise of Monarch 6-7 months ago, none of the other LCC have jumped on and started filling the capacity Monarch left behind on a few of the bread and butter routes.

For example Alicante, Malaga and the Canaries... While easyJet fly the routes, they don't seem to have increased capacity compared to last year.

Ryanair have bases at Alicante and Malaga, so could start routes with equipment from these cities.

The Canaries has always been a weak route network from Luton, while you can get to all four of the main islands with Ryanair, they only serve them all twice weekly and easyJet to Tenerife and Lanzarote thrice weekly. Surely this must be an opportunity to increase to at least daily. Many other UK airport boast daily or several times daily flights to the islands.

boeing_eng

22nd Apr 2018, 16:22

FNC will be operated weekly this Summer by TUI

I doubt the Summer 2019 program has been fully confirmed and its unlikely the 757 will be dropped due to the need to rotate aircraft through for weekly A checks

ClearLand08

22nd Apr 2018, 16:26

Another airport mystery is what is happening to the 5 drop off lanes that are under construction. Each lane appears to be a cold de sac with no exit route. Yes once a car enters it has to turn around and cross the path of cars entering the next cold de sac. Looks like a pending disaster to me unless I am missing something.

I think the exit route will be at the Eastern end of the drop-off lanes, where the exit route is now. It also looks like they are moving the airside fence about a road-width further east in that area too.

Still surprised after the demise of Monarch 6-7 months ago, none of the other LCC have jumped on and started filling the capacity Monarch left behind on a few of the bread and butter routes.
I'm pretty sure Lanzarote was only twice weekly with EasyJet last winter, so they added an extra weekly flight. I agree with you though, I am also surprised we haven't seen a bigger increase filling Monarch capacity.

LTNman

23rd Apr 2018, 06:51

The airports aim to to increase the percentage of passengers arriving by train from the current 17% to 36% which is what Gatwick has.

Also info on what is involved in building the line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8ixS3cFpgU

Doppelmayr Cable Car: "DART Cable Liner" London Luton Airport, UK (2018)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjf4E15nsPY

22/04

23rd Apr 2018, 08:07

Still surprised after the demise of Monarch 6-7 months ago, none of the other LCC have jumped on and started filling the capacity Monarch left behind on a few of the bread and butter routes.

Most of the slack created by the sad demise of Monarch appears to have been taken up by STN and to a lesser extent BHX, where Jet2 and to a lesser extent Thomas Cook.

LTNman

23rd Apr 2018, 10:54

The 5 drop off lanes appear to be cul-de-sacs. I am clearly missing something here as I can't see how this will work.
https://i.imgur.com/TiYyB4h.jpg

A pedestrian route appears to be under construction but until the subway opens traffic will not only grind to a halt as cars try to exit each entrance to the drop off lanes but passengers will have to cross the ring road which ground to a standstill in I think 2016 when a temporary crossing was put in for the short term car park. The drop off area handles around 20 times the amount of passengers the short term car park did so I can't believe this is the solution so I will hold back judgment.
https://i.imgur.com/yZm4jYe.jpg

This gap will eventually be the subway.
https://i.imgur.com/8rnqNbv.jpg

This will be the raised road over the subway
https://i.imgur.com/FuPwjaK.jpg

Trenches don't normally interest me but this is no services trench, as the ground has also been removed around the foundations to the walkway. This ends up by the existing wall that fronts the terminal.
https://i.imgur.com/wsKcQIO.jpg

whitelighter

23rd Apr 2018, 11:33

Most of the slack created by the sad demise of Monarch appears to have been taken up by STN and to a lesser extent BHX, where Jet2 and to a lesser extent Thomas Cook.

Don't forget Primera out of STN have started on a few of the MON Spanish routes

Spanish eyes

23rd Apr 2018, 15:42

Summer strikes

https://buyingbusinesstravel.com/news/2328715-luton-passengers-face-summer-strike-chaos

compton3bravo

23rd Apr 2018, 18:26

I see the annual Baku airlift has begun - Titan B767 today, Azerbaijan tomorrow.

pabely

23rd Apr 2018, 18:48

I see the annual Baku airlift has begun - Titan B767 today, Azerbaijan tomorrow.

30th they all return 2 x 767-300 & 787-8

LGS6753

23rd Apr 2018, 19:24

Giles Davies wrote: Still surprised after the demise of Monarch 6-7 months ago, none of the other LCC have jumped on and started filling the capacity Monarch left behind on a few of the bread and butter routes.

Monarch had 3,243 slots in S17. WizzAir has increased their slots in S18 by 3,548. I think that's your answer.
The "bread and butter routes" are probably oversubscribed,particularly with Jet2 and Primera expanding at STN.

cumbrianboy

23rd Apr 2018, 22:12

The whole reason Monarch went bust was over capacity in the market and not enough demand to meet supply driving down the yield for the airlines to the point where Monarch went under.

You can bet all the others felt the pain too, so it's hardly surprising with one player gone the others trim capacity and try and boost the yields to something more sustainable

PAXboy

23rd Apr 2018, 22:16

When Monarch closed, it seemed to me that the other carriers were happy to let the seat count drop. This seat reduction would increase the value of their own seats for zero outlay on equipment and crews. Given the current financial climate, it would be the safe option.

Dannyboy39

24th Apr 2018, 05:34

southside bobby

24th Apr 2018, 06:56

Well NO actually...

cumbrianboy

24th Apr 2018, 07:17

Passenger numbers have nothing to do with it.

Anyone can fill an A321 if you sell every seat for £10 but you'll lose £'000s per flight which is exactly what happened (maybe not that extreme, I know seats were sold for more than £10) but it's about yield and profitability NOT passenger numbers. Some of the most profitable routes on an airlines network can have reasonably low load factors ...

pabely

24th Apr 2018, 07:31

https://uk.reuters.com/article/brief-private-equity-firm-ardian-sells-s/brief-private-equity-firm-ardian-sells-stake-in-luton-airport-to-amp-capital-idUKFWN1S10BV

Makes sense, a big owner of shopping malls.

ericlday

24th Apr 2018, 07:47

Global investment manager AMP Capital makes a swoop for London Luton Airport as it picks up 49 per cent stake from Ardian

SWBKCB

24th Apr 2018, 08:15

Global investment manager AMP Capital makes a swoop for London Luton Airport as it picks up 49 per cent stake from Ardian

And with significant shareholdings in LBA and NCL.

LBIA

24th Apr 2018, 08:24

AMP Capital hold stakes in
Melbourne and Port Hedland Airport's in Australia.
Here in the UK it owns Leeds/Bradford along with having a 49% stake in Newcastle Airport.

southside bobby

24th Apr 2018, 08:46

Interestingly Aena who own 51% of Luton Airport and had the preferential right of buying the remaining 49% stake purchased by AMP Capital today had already said they were not interested...

DC3 Dave

24th Apr 2018, 10:06

Interestingly Aena who own 51% of Luton Airport and had the preferential right of buying the remaining 49% stake purchased by AMP Capital today had already said they were not interested...

Does anyone know why?

LTNman

24th Apr 2018, 11:47

With just 13 years left on the lease as a minority holder that is a very good question.

gilesdavies

24th Apr 2018, 13:44

Does the borough council/LLAO and AENA have a say in the new 49% owner, or is it simply the highest bidder that buys Ardians share?

Just curious, as when the airport managment lease comes up for renewal, the council can choose and stipulate in the tender what they expect over the term of the lease and where investment needs to be made. Then choose the new management company accordingly, however if a company comes in halfway through the lease, they don't have any obligations, do they?

LTNman

24th Apr 2018, 13:57

So the trench (see previous post photo), which is being part filled in concrete and that sits next to the Tesco type existing walkway is getting longer by the day and now reaches almost the edge of the taxi rank. Thinking the unthinkable are these actually foundations for a new bespoke covered walkway? In the original artist impressions the fancy walkway roof was supported by a single row of columns.

One advantage of the 5 cul-de-sac drop off lanes is that the lanes don't need pedestrian crossings, which was the curse of the existing design. Will this temporary drop off area only open once the road is diverted over the the new subway?

LTNman

24th Apr 2018, 14:20

Does the borough council/LLAO and AENA have a say in the new 49% owner, or is it simply the highest bidder that buys Ardians share?

Don't think they do.

One point to note is that all the loans taken out by LLAL, which is the actual owner of the airport and is 100% owned by the council are due to be paid in 2028 and 2031. These dates are significant as 2028 was the original date that the existing franchise ended and 2031 was the revised date. While the expansion to 18 million is being funded by Aena and its partner the £225 million rail link is being funded by LLAL plus another £49 million borrowed for other completed projects by LLAL.

The new franchise deal, when taken out in 2031, will pay off these loans with up front payments so costing the council and LLAL nothing as the interest payments to the council by LLAL are higher than the borrowing costs for the council.

Spanish eyes

24th Apr 2018, 17:10

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/04/24/luton-airport-stake-changes-hands-passenger-numbers-take/

DC3 Dave

24th Apr 2018, 17:45

Nothing odd about an investment company selling its stake at an opportune time. But Ardian almost seem to be moaning about the airport's success exceeding their wildest expectations.

gilesdavies

24th Apr 2018, 19:35

Nothing odd about an investment company selling its stake at an opportune time. But Ardian almost seem to be moaning about the airport's success exceeding their wildest expectations.

Looks like they were hoping the airport wouldn't exceed 18 million for the next 13 years, and they could just cream off the profits from this current expansion investment.

I guess that's capitalism, but not going to go down that path.

Could be the reason why AENA also didn't want to invest further either.

Makes you wonder if the airport will only be doing controlled or limited growth over next few years? I suspect if that is the case the council and operators will be on a collision course, with different views of how the airport grows, like which what happened about five years ago.

--------------------------

On another note, looks like the airport could be heading for the perfect storm this summer.

The airport staff, Menzies and FX staff all threatening industrial action and being balloted!

www.mirror.co.uk/travel/news/luton-airport-strikes-summer-2018-12418519

compton3bravo

24th Apr 2018, 19:55

More charters tomorrow, Luxair B737, Azerbaijan B787 and Air Europa A330 with Athletico Madrid FC.

LTNman

24th Apr 2018, 21:06

Makes you wonder if the airport will only be doing controlled or limited growth over next few years? I suspect if that is the case the council and operators will be on a collision course, with different views of how the airport grows, like which what happened about five years ago.

They are already on a collision course. Aena have put in a strong objection to the LLAL planning application for a dual carriageway through the back of the airport to serve a new business park. They complain that it will disrupt the airport and that the airport won't be able to cope with the extra traffic.

LLAL are bringing out their expansion plans in June to double the size of the airport although I doubt that is achievable so we might end up with a smaller proposed project.

If it gets planning permission the question then becomes who will fund it. If like the DART link it is funded by the council they will just get the money back via the upfront concession fee that will be paid out in 2031.

Lee Baker Street

24th Apr 2018, 21:49

LTNman, back in the late 90's I had a very good chat with 'a future' airport Director. I remember the conversation very well. He stated that once the airport achieved 5 million passengers that would be enough and no further growth would happen. I disagreed with him. On that note and based on the fact the airport will acheive 16.5 million this year and therefore with the right investment the airport is more than capable of achieving 38 million passengers during its transition over the next couple of decades if not sooner! I am certain that the east of the airfield will have a satelite building with up to a minimum 18 stands and connected to the main terminal building via a escalator / people mover! Growth is there for the taking but only for those with funds to literally fund its development. This may transpire when a new leasholder takes the realm...

LTNman

24th Apr 2018, 22:03

To achieve 38 million they would have to expand airside onto Wigmore Park which according to LLAL is earmarked for a business park thus the new dual carriageway. We will have to wait until June to see what the plan actually is.

Captain_Caveman

25th Apr 2018, 03:37

The new costa opens today - 25th April
Starbucks scheduled to open this weekend
Burger king opens 25th May
M&S opens 11th June

second set of entrance/exit doors to the terminal opens 22nd May with works completed in this area including covered canopy by end of June.

the new temporary drop off area and seperate lane for buses scheduled to open by end of May.

Details published to easyJet staff after an update from our facilities team’s meeting with LLA

LTNman

25th Apr 2018, 04:24

Thanks for the update, there are some tight deadlines in there for M&S and Burger King as both are still empty shells.

No mention about the completion dates for the rest of the projects then including the expanded security area, immigration hall and baggage reclaim area with its extra belts or the finishing off of the entrance concourse, which is still a mess with no new work carried out since the new build opened.

If the drop off area opens at the end of May then passengers will have to somehow cross the ring road as the subway won’t be open by then as the road will need diverting. As mentioned before think 2016 and the temporary pedestrian crossing that brought the CTA to a standstill with just the passengers using the short term car park.

One minor issue is that the public keep using one of the fire exits by the main entrance. Once open, like sheep, everyone follows thus defeating the heating and cooling air traps and the special flooring to keep the tiled terminal floor dry.

Spanish eyes

25th Apr 2018, 10:08

So the trench (see previous post photo), which is being part filled in concrete and that sits next to the Tesco type existing walkway is getting longer by the day and now reaches almost the edge of the taxi rank. Thinking the unthinkable are these actually foundations for a new bespoke covered walkway? In the original artist impressions the fancy walkway roof was supported by a single row of columns.

Looking into the trench with its stepped foundations and seeing a plan from a distance it looks like a retaining wall with gaps for steps. I can only assume this is to remove some of the slope and make a more gentle slope for people in wheel chairs.

davidjohnson6

25th Apr 2018, 20:20

Until their demise, Monarch flew a winter seasonal route from Luton to Eilat-Ovda. I know there was talk about Easyjet being interested in the route but did anything come of it in the end ? Presumably if anyone is to open the route, an announcement would be made in the next month or so...

LGS6753

26th Apr 2018, 08:04

Vueling Amsterdam and Florence cancelled this morning, and this evening's AMS and BCN not on the airport destination boards. Strike?

PDXCWL45

26th Apr 2018, 08:07

Vueling Amsterdam and Florence cancelled this morning, and this evening's AMS and BCN not on the airport destination boards. Strike?
Yes. Only UK airports that'll be affected is Luton and Gatwick.

LTNman

27th Apr 2018, 08:39

For those that might be interested this is the route from Duty Free and through the terminal extension to pier A
https://youtu.be/II5iht8txlM

LGS6753

27th Apr 2018, 11:32

LTNman -

An interesting 6 minute walk - any chance you could post a map showing the route?
It contrasts greatly with the 1966 terminal which boasted a 100 yard walk from your coach to the aircraft steps!

LTNman

27th Apr 2018, 12:29

Starting at the top right and ending up heading for the gates in their 20's. Next to Firska can been seen the route to pier B

https://i.imgur.com/zKR4Oax.jpg

boeing_eng

27th Apr 2018, 13:26

Shame there isn't an Ikea type shortcut! :}

Powerjet1

27th Apr 2018, 13:30

Read a couple of weeks ago, I can’t remember where, that a second executive lounge is to be added to the terminal. Anybody know anything?

LTNman

27th Apr 2018, 17:33

The 1999 terminal was built with room for two executive lounges either side of the top of the stairs in departures. Don’t know if later on the two spaces were merged into one lounge. I suspect they were.

LGS6753

27th Apr 2018, 17:45

Thank you LTNman.

ClearLand08

28th Apr 2018, 13:32

5th based Wizzair from tomorrow, bringing it to 2xA321 and 3x320, with the start of Athens and Reykjavik routes.

LTNman

28th Apr 2018, 14:01

Seems like the Wizz love affair with Luton just carries on. I think I read a few years ago that Wizz had more flights into and out of Luton than any other airport and that was before they started to base aircraft here. I assume that is still the case?

I noticed on the arrivals board a week ago that Blue Air had 5 arrivals within an hour and seem to be increasing their activities from Luton as well.

LGS6753

28th Apr 2018, 14:52

Luton is the busiest airport in the Wizz network, and has been for some time. At present, the "first wave" of arrivals is of 13-15 aircraft. In addition to that, the increasing number of based aircraft depart at this time.
Blue Air has 4 or 5 morning arrivals most days, but after the Wizz influx (usually around 9-10am). There are often one or two later in the day. They are planning a significant further increase in S18 over S17, but operating no additional routes.

pabely

28th Apr 2018, 15:09

Doesn't the Wizzair or Wizzair UK commitment go up to 8 based eventually, Reykjavik is becoming a bit of a bloodbath?

ClearLand08

28th Apr 2018, 15:45

Doesn't the Wizzair or Wizzair UK commitment go up to 8 based eventually, Reykjavik is becoming a bit of a bloodbath?

Yes, I think the sixth and seventh based Wizzair UK aircraft arrive around 21st May with the eighth at the end of May. Reykjavik will be interesting, the easyJet and Wizzair flights leave within about an hour of each other.

pabely

28th Apr 2018, 16:49

And WOW, Icelandair & BA in the London market, that this a hell of a lot of capacity to fill.

AirportPlanner1

28th Apr 2018, 17:39

And WOW, Icelandair & BA in the London market, that this a hell of a lot of capacity to fill.

Norwegian and Thomson to add to the list

Southend is the only London airport without service which is extraordinary, given that only 10 years ago the entire offering was 10-14 weekly from LHR on Icelandair and daily from STN on Iceland Express.

LTNman

1st May 2018, 13:18

Fencing has been removed from around most of pier B apart from the shrunken builders compound.
https://i.imgur.com/ugdbg9S.jpg

The new walkway servings stand 61 has been clad. Basically it has the feel of a covered fire escape with a metal floor.
https://i.imgur.com/H2Eadsq.jpg

A walk through the new departure lounge extension. This was the site of the former bus station. To my eyes the strips of wood that is meant to partially hide the ceiling has been installed 90 degrees out when compared to the second photo as it runs in the direction people walk.
https://i.imgur.com/edhXnnR.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/3FdZc9q.jpg

Taken from the original departure lounge. The photo shows the connection of the new terminal extension that runs along the front of the terminal.
https://i.imgur.com/cDa1Bas.jpg

This is the route to pier B from the main departure lounge. The seating will be removed when it fully opens.
https://i.imgur.com/H3BcAY0.jpg

Despite the increase in the departure lounge size it still feels a tad overcrowded in places. All photos taken in the morning peak.
https://i.imgur.com/MmjAuMq.jpg

ImPlaneCrazy

1st May 2018, 19:45

Read a couple of weeks ago, I can’t remember where, that a second executive lounge is to be added to the terminal. Anybody know anything?

No 1 are introducing their Clubrooms Lounge after the Summer season is over. For what reason, I don't know as it's quite a high end product but the Escape lounge is certainly full most of the time in the morning and afternoon rotations.

jdcg

2nd May 2018, 13:38

Passing through the airport today and it all seems better and better here. I was expecting to get through security quickly as it's normally great here. But it had virtually ground to a halt, with staff virtually walking away from post with queues left right and centre. Apparently morale is really low as they're short staffed etc etc. Seems a shame when the airport is looking ever better. And so much more space to sit down now....

Pain in the R's

2nd May 2018, 15:43

I passed through security last week at around 5:50 which I would say was its peak. I thought it was a very slick operation and the staff seemed happy to me. I thought the departure lounge was fine though busy. Looking up at the Aspire lounge it seemed as busy as the departure lounge.

LTNman

2nd May 2018, 15:56

Security will be expanded in the coming months from 12 lanes to either 16 or 18 lanes depending where the source of the information is coming from. The old retail units continue to be dismantled, once clear work can then start on the expansion.

PAXboy

2nd May 2018, 19:19

A friend went through on a doemstci on Monday afternoon. He had not used the airport for a number of years and was scathing. He is due back Friday late afternoon. My next visit is not until August.

LTNman

3rd May 2018, 04:52

With Luton entering its final months before the terminal and its entrance is finished the work is now more in the face of the traveling public particularly outside the terminal.

I have been having another look at the new temporary drop off zone with its 5 cul de sacs. Any passenger being picked up will need to coordinate which lane they are standing by. I also suspect most drivers will try to enter the first lane while lane 5 will remain empty. Good to see that the lanes won’t need pedestrians crossings but the design has many issues including very tight turns and vehicles having potential problems entering and leaving the lanes due to queuing traffic.

I am already thinking that this design will be worse than the existing design for potential traffic holdups and will result once again in traffic queuing past the railway station during the morning summer rush.

LTNman

3rd May 2018, 13:48

Breaking Travel News investigates: Wizz Air | Focus | Breaking Travel News (http://www.breakingtravelnews.com/focus/article/breaking-travel-news-investigates-wizz-air/)

ClearLand08

3rd May 2018, 18:18

I've arrived domestic from Edinburgh last night and had a good experience up until the shuttle bus to Parkway. My car was in the multistory carpark there as I have a season ticket for my commute to work so I just wanted a ticket to the station. I went to purchase one from the staff member outside the bus but to my surprise was told they only accepted cash. So I had an 8 minute round trip walk back into the terminal to buy a ticket from the machine! Once finally on the bus I was chatting to the driver who explained the staff were equally bemused why cards were not accepted - particularly as they were given fancy new machines for that very purpose 18 months ago -- but the card feature was never activated!

Falcon666

5th May 2018, 00:17

See the latest NOTAM is indicating that the new Pier will be active immenently.
interesting that the NOTAM also states no pushbacks to infringe on taxiway Delta without ATC approval.
Have there been issues with this in the past?

LTNman

5th May 2018, 06:18

The NOTAM states that the stands have been renumbered which is more to do with a more logical numbering scheme than the pier opening which must be any time now.

Ryebridge who were not part of the contract for the pier or it’s road network have been been busy digging holes in the finished top surface of the tarmac where the coaches will go to pick up passengers. They have also
been cutting trenches into the concrete apron. Issues???

port_94

5th May 2018, 16:47

They have also
been cutting trenches into the concrete apron. Issues???

No issues, they had to move the lighting tower as the old one was in the way, because of the additional stand the old tower would have been at the head of stand 46 which isnt ideal.

I’m still more concerned about the trench outside the terminal, any news on it? Or what it is

LTNman

5th May 2018, 17:51

The trench forms the foundations of a concrete wall. The wall is now being poured and stands around 1m high and sits along one edge of the covered walkway. So far there are no crossing points and I can not work out what this wall is meant to achieve except to divide the pavement into two. Maybe the wall will divide the airport coach waiting area from people walking into the terminal but as the covered walkway is in the coach half of the pavement maybe not. Just seems pointless to me and at the moment it is a long walk to get around it.

LTNman

6th May 2018, 08:30

It has been confirmed that Luton will start the first part of its consultation process to expand the airport by bringing out a draft proposal next month. This will be followed by an 8 week consultation period followed by a year of more detailed plans being drawn up. In 2020 these plans should be published followed by a further 8 weeks of consultations. An application should go before the council in around 2021 but will then go to the secretary of state as it will have national significance.

Boeing737-8

8th May 2018, 08:56

Falcon666

8th May 2018, 10:15

gilesdavies

8th May 2018, 10:54

Speaking to someone who works at the airport last night. They were telling me that Wizz have starting strong on Athens with flights having a good load of at least 90% (219 yesterday). I do wonder if this might see an increase of frequency with an evening service being added on in the next year. For a large city like Athens, I feel it's underserved from London comparing to the likes of Istanbul & Bucharest.

I flew the route on the opening day on Sunday 29th April and flew home last Thursday 3rd May, the flight was well over 90% full on both flights, and was operated by the A321 with 230 seats.

Still not an amazing experience at Luton, the queues at security were over 30 mins, which is the longest I've waited since it was down stairs and backed right up the new boarding pass barriers, also at 5am hardly any seating departures was available to use.

I would probably say 60+% of passengers were Greeks on the new route, and many were not impressed with Wizzair and pretty unhappy with how things are handled by the airline/handling agents at Athens Airport and questionable if they will be using Wizz again?

Wizzair park on remote stands in the furthest corner of Athens airport, and everyone is bussed to the terminal.

Also there is a lot dis-organisation, they call the flight for boarding just as the aircraft has landed from Luton into Athens, we are then bussed to the remote stand. But the in-bound passengers from Luton have not finished leaving the aircraft, then all the passengers waiting to board are packed in like sardines on buses waiting by the aircraft for 20-30 mins in 30 celcius weather. When the aircraft has finished with all the leaving passengers, the cabin crew will not allow us to board until they have done their checks which is another 10-15 mins. Was waiting by the aircraft for 40+ mins in very hot weather!

Exactly the same situation on my inbound flight to Athens the return flight passengers were locked in buses on the apron.

This might sound typical of other low cost airlines, but at Athens, Ryanair and easyJet park directly by the terminal and not by remote stands. I got the impression, many Greek passengers regularly travel between London and Athens, and were not impressed with this in the slightest and might vote with their feet.

It is not like this is teething problems with the handling agents at Athens, the airport has seven routes from other destinations with Wizz Air too.

Myself and along with 30+ other passengers had issues checking in using the app (despite checking in the night before) and getting our boarding passes to download and was stung for 35 Euros each for a printed boarding pass. So I guess I am feeling a little anti WizzAir right now, but I've filled in an online complaint form and will see how we get on.

Got flights with them in the coming weeks to Reykjavik and Orhid in the next few weeks, and looking at the online seating maps where you can purchase seats, these flights are looking pretty busy too! So in general I would guess Wizz are going from strength to strength from Luton.

LTNman

8th May 2018, 13:22

Growth for Wizz as 1.3 Million passengers use LLA in April - London Luton Airport (http://newsroom.london-luton.co.uk/news/growth-for-wizz-as-1-dot-3-million-passengers-use-lla-in-april-305661?_ga=2.118578569.1275957164.1525763183-664238681.1525763183)
Barry Hunter, CFO of LLA, said: “April was an important month in our journey to become a world-class airport

I think Barry sees himself as a bit of a comedian.

jdcg

8th May 2018, 16:27

LTNman

8th May 2018, 18:04

I flew the route on the opening day on Sunday 29th April and flew home last Thursday 3rd May, the flight was well over 90% full on both flights, and was operated by the A321 with 230 seats.

Just goes to show that airlines like Wizz don't have to advertise new routes these days. Seems that the masses just do Google searches when they want to travel.

mariofly12

8th May 2018, 20:19

AirportPlanner1

9th May 2018, 06:28

Got flights with them in the coming weeks to Reykjavik and Orhid in the next few weeks, and looking at the online seating maps where you can purchase seats, these flights are looking pretty busy too! So in general I would guess Wizz are going from strength to strength from Luton.

Ohrid is a lovely destination by the way. But Ohrid airport does not use digital boarding passes and, even if you have a paper boarding pass, you still have to go to the check in desk to have it verified and swapped for a typical airline boarding pass. No idea why. Only one security lane too so don't go last minute. But the locals are all really friendly and helpful[/QUOTE]

Seconded, and amongst the last genuinely cheap destinations left in Europe. Two courses and wine for two people for a tenner!

When I travelled in 2016 my outbound and the outbound that came to collect me were pretty empty whereas the return flight was full, mostly Albanians coming over the border. It will be interesting to hear if loads are better balanced now, whether more Brits are discovering Ohrid and whether the route has been impacted at all from Wizz starting Tirana.

AvGeek1

9th May 2018, 18:58

I have seen on Linkedin via a post by the company's chief executive who has designed these canopies, the updated designs for the canopies for the exterior of the terminal. From what I can see there will be a downward sloping canopy at the top of each entrance (departures and arrivals) extending out and a canopy which is separate, running all of the way along the curvature of the bus station. There will also be a narrower canopy attached to the end of the bus station canopy on the arrivals side running up to the terminal. Installation is stated to have started this week. These designs are drastically different from the previous designs!

LTNman

10th May 2018, 04:36

A screen shot would be nice of the described canopy.

These designs are drastically different from the previous designs!

You mean cheaper

I see that apart from a contractors village at Parkway and a few red pegs nothing has been started yet on the Dart project and not even a digger has appeared yet. It is starting to remind me of the terminal extension where for the first year all the work seemed to be done by 2 men and their dog. The published timescale timetable is starting to look like a fantasy document.

I am also hearing that not all of the retail space in the departure lounge have been let. Of the completed units some shops seem to be under performing. I wonder how many wall mounted mirrors and vases one shop has sold as they would be the last thing I would want to carry on board and then squeeze into an overhead locker.

LTNman

10th May 2018, 09:04

Shiny stainless steel poles, as I would not call it steelwork, are being erected close to the second entrance while another pile of poles, some angled and others with T shaped tops are waiting to be installed. The waiting is nearly over to discover whether the canopy is made from glass, plastic or canvas.

jdcg

10th May 2018, 10:02

Ohrid is a lovely destination by the way. But Ohrid airport does not use digital boarding passes and, even if you have a paper boarding pass, you still have to go to the check in desk to have it verified and swapped for a typical airline boarding pass. No idea why. Only one security lane too so don't go last minute. But the locals are all really friendly and helpful

Seconded, and amongst the last genuinely cheap destinations left in Europe. Two courses and wine for two people for a tenner!

When I travelled in 2016 my outbound and the outbound that came to collect me were pretty empty whereas the return flight was full, mostly Albanians coming over the border. It will be interesting to hear if loads are better balanced now, whether more Brits are discovering Ohrid and whether the route has been impacted at all from Wizz starting Tirana.
[/QUOTE]
Flights were pretty much full both ways. Quite a few Albanians still, a smallish number of Brits and quite a lot of Macedonians

gilesdavies

10th May 2018, 11:36

I also forgot to mention previously, when we flew back from Athens last Thursday, a few other observations I noticed at Luton at around 2.30pm...

Have they shrunk the aircraft parking bays? When we parked in one of the bays which was facing the back of the original pier (behind the 6 pack apron), I noticed how close the wings of our A321 were to a TUI 737 next to us, and was only about four meters clearance from each wing tip on the left side.

I thought the pilot had parked off centre, but when walking across to the terminal he was bang on the centre line. Never seen such close-up parking to other aircraft at other airports, by having such small bays, they are limiting the aircraft they can handle! But I guess when 95% of the traffic is A320 family and 737's, this is not going to be an issue.

Also when we landed on runway 26, we taxi'd off and was held up for at least 15 mins queuing to access the taxiway which goes past the 6 pack apron, and held waiting by the remote stands near to the runway and parallel taxiway. All due to 2-3 aircraft being reversed from the stands on the 6 pack apron, as they now seem to reverse right out on to the taxiway, outside the apron. In the time we was waiting there was aircraft queuing at the old apron access point with 3-4 aircraft trying to go out to runway 26 and 3-4 further aircraft having also landed behind us and stuck waiting on the taxiway too.

Is congestion on the apron and taxiways now common place and what happened to the one way system on the Apron? I always used to be impressed with the quick runway to gate times.

Scrotchidson

10th May 2018, 12:07

Sounds like you're talking about the East Apron and the that apron was widened to be able to accept 4 aircraft up to A321's (instead of 3). The parking points are offset to allow the aircraft to be parked "so close" together. I don't believe the airport are limiting the aircraft they can handle because the size of the stands suit the operators and I don't believe there's any plans to go into a market where bigger aircraft sizes are needed.

As for congestion 1430 can be a particularly busy time but there's never been a one way system in place as such, aircraft will push and taxi in the most expeditious way whilst balancing the delay against the inbounds. The Ops centre do a good job at stand allocation so that when aircraft are due to be ready they are spread around the airport to limit scenarios where aircraft parked closely together are ready at the same time however as soon as one or two aircraft are delayed that plan can go out the window.

LTNman

10th May 2018, 12:32

Taxiway Foxtrot should help with the congestion. Work is meant to start next month.

gilesdavies

10th May 2018, 12:33

My apologies for the non-technical description, but yes I was referring to the east apron!

I am sure they always used to reverse within the east apron and not onto the taxiway. Is increasing the east apron to eight aircraft a consequence of this?

Scrotchidson

10th May 2018, 14:03

43L must push out onto Delta due to the contractors compound on 46 however now we're busier than we were 5 years ago there's more of a chance that when pushing an aircraft from the East Apron there's also an inbound landing to park within it or another aircraft wanting to push too so we try and be flexible whenever we can.

LTNman

10th May 2018, 14:51

The terminal frontage with the start of the construction of the canopy. Seems a tad on the low side

https://i.imgur.com/f7SjQ9R.jpg
LLA

forest

10th May 2018, 16:25

AvGeek1

10th May 2018, 16:51

Here are the images of the canopy designs:

canberra97

10th May 2018, 17:15

looking at those images it obviously isn't anything like the original images of the canopy but it doesn't look too bad considering what they could have done but still looking cheap in comparison to the original images.

LTNman

10th May 2018, 18:43

They look somewhat disappointing to me with the canopies covering the entrances looking like something my local greengrocer has and rolls back when the sun come out. Why gaps between the entrances and the canopy covering the front of the bus station and what are these canopies meant to achieve when there is no way to avoid getting wet? I will tell you now what is going to happen, people will pour out of the terminal and find it is raining and then stop in their tracks under cover to do their coats up and to get out their umbrellas so blocking the way. They will also be full of smokers using it as a smokers shelter. At the moment despite no smoking signs covering the yellow recess entrances vast crowds of Eastern Europeans just stand there puffing away as passengers push their way out of a single fire exit door ignoring the automatic doors. It is a joy to watch people queuing up to get in and out of a 3 feet wide fire exit door while just feet away are the automatic doors sitting there closed awaiting for someone to activate the doors.

Spanish eyes

11th May 2018, 04:24

Seems the bean counters have had the final say. The covers all seem too narrow to afford any protection and there are gaps. Many a time I have got soaked legs waiting for the shuttle buses when the rain falls even in a moderate wind. Waiting passengers also means walking passengers can’t get under cover so have to walk by the side of the walkways.

It will be interesting to see how they build the shelters by the bus bays, as it is difficult now to push past people and that is without setions being closed off.

It seems the airport have lost an opportunity to make a visual statement about the front of their terminal.

ExpectmorePayless

11th May 2018, 06:12

Oh dear. Why does the airport waste so much and then opt for a cheap finish ? Instead of the originally planned large glass sweeping frontage, we get wavy roofed bus shelters. Do these architects which are obviously being paid handsomely for their services not realise that disconnected canopies with open sides aren't compatible with horizontal rain blowing at Luton for 6 months of the year ? The white canopies will look filthy in no time.

PAXboy

11th May 2018, 21:12

Jolly good idea to ensure that the canopy does not extend over the front of the buses. This will ensure that Pax get wet and annoyed, lowering their enjoyment of LTN from the moment they arrive...

LTNman

11th May 2018, 21:41

The airport workers have been screwed for years with TUPE and zero hour contracts

Luton Airport workers vote to strike over May Bank Holiday weekend | Daily Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5719121/Passengers-face-travel-chaos-Luton-Airport-workers-vote-STRIKE-Bank-Holiday-weekend.html)

Buster the Bear

12th May 2018, 23:41

I am guessing Unite was once the TGWU? If that is the case, the damage started a long time ago to terms and conditions, but good to see staff prepared to fight against the ’race to the bottom’.

Spanish eyes

13th May 2018, 05:28

Working at Luton as I do it is a fact of life that mass immigration has held wages down. Why pay more than the minimum wage and put people on zero hour contracts when there are constant new arrivals from ever poorer European nations who think earning £7.50 an hour is like winning the lottery. I work with many of these people who live 10 to a house and who get a wage boost by claiming every entitlement they qualify for.

I would say at least 50% of Luton’s passengers and nearly all of its growth has come from Eastern Europe. I don’t blame anyone for wanting a better life but it is a fact that companies bid for contracts based on offering the lowest pay and zero hour contracts in the knowledge that they will always find staff who would work for £3 an hour if there was no minimum wage.

I can remember when the minimum wage was introduced and industry said it would cost a million jobs. In fact it cost no jobs, the same way as we would survive outside the EU and with less migrants to rely on wages would have to increase if companies wanted to recruit at Luton.

If this means less passengers passing through Luton then so what. People who post to these airport threads on pprune are fixated with passenger growth and nothing else and can't see or don't want to see the bigger picture.

Lee Baker Street

13th May 2018, 22:07

Let’s remember that no one is forced to work at Luton Airport. I worked there for many years and wages were good. People need to remember that the airport thrives on
low cost services but if it were to charge per passenger what Heathrow does then it would result in thousands of redundancies as low costs would move elsewhere. The key to actual descent wages is for the owner LBC to take back full control so that leaseholders are not getting 50% of the profits produced but that then would require LBC to have to put aside hundreds of millions for any or all future developments at the airport. That scenario won’t be possible for the foreseeable future though.

Spanish eyes

14th May 2018, 06:16

Let’s remember that no one is forced to work at Luton Airport.

So that is your justification then for the minimum wage and not a wage to actually live on??? Those same people who are screwed by the airport directly and those that work for the handling agents then fill their forms in for tax payer support including housing benefits, free school milk etc. If you are more than happy to support me with your taxes then that's fine.

If you look at any of the airport tenders there is never a mention of the tender being based on a living wage but just the lowest price. Those same people working for those companies then turn to the council for support.

LGS6753

14th May 2018, 06:57

As long as we have unrestricted EU immigration, we will have a large number of people on minimum wage. That's because employers can recruit from countries with low wages and moribund economies. The irony for Luton Airport is that it thrives on the travelling activities of just those people.

inOban

14th May 2018, 07:33

Spanish eyes

14th May 2018, 08:06

Complete rubbish, you need to spend a few hours in Luton arrivals and count those speaking English.

LGS6753

14th May 2018, 08:18

And the most moribund economy in the EU is
...you've been watching too much BBC. Compare UK average wages (because that's what I was referring to) with those in Bulgaria and Romania.

Complete rubbish, you need to spend a few hours in Luton arrivals and count those speaking English.
... it is, after all, an English airport. But look at the departure boards and then try and tell me that all those people flying to Bucharest, Craiova, Budapest, Sofia, and the like are tourists.

DC3 Dave

14th May 2018, 08:21

And the most moribund economy in the EU is.... the UK. Hence there are fewer people coming to work here because there are more jobs at home. Round here the service economy is getting desperate for staff.

Have to pay more then, won't they. Free market economy and all that. A huge pool of cheap, willing labour, mostly with a great work ethic is brilliant for employers and the economy alike.

Great for everyone in fact, unless it's your industry that tide of labour is flooding. Then bang goes your security and prospects. And as housing in your area cannot cope with demand, up goes the rent (sorry everyone, no pay rise again this year). Your kids can't get into that decent school. So you and your family's prospects are not quite what a hard working parent would have hoped for.

So a little of the tide going back out may be necessary.

cj241101

14th May 2018, 09:03

Let’s remember that no one is forced to work at Luton Airport. I worked there for many years and wages were good.
The important word here is "were". Presumably this was before the dominance of low cost carriers and the inevitable rise of "low cost" handling agents who try to make money handling airlines who want to pay them as little as possible, and who are then quick to defect elsewhere when they get offered what they think is a cheaper deal. Handling agent staff have suffered poor wages, nil hour / part time contracts and uncertainty as they have been bounced from one company to another for many years.

Skipness One Echo

14th May 2018, 10:33

And the most moribund economy in the EU is.... the UK. Hence there are fewer people coming to work here because there are more jobs at home. Round here the service economy is getting desperate for staff.
In the politest possible sense, do you really think Oban is reflective of the wider Britsh economy in many ways? It's in one of the remotest parts of one of the whitest bits of the country. What you mean is that local hoteliers can no longer find gullible and desperate kids who will work for terrible wages while smiling. People are getting wise to the some of the more transient benefits of globalisation.

inOban

14th May 2018, 10:53

SWBKCB

14th May 2018, 11:28

Remote? Us? We're the centre of the universe!

Our hoteliers, and indeed other industries such as fishing/fish farming, have for years depended on a migrant labour force, not on local kids. Many have settled here and are an important part of the local labour force. But fewer are coming to join them.

I would suggest that only Romania and Bulgaria have economies which still depend on exporting their young people, and although some are coming to the UK, far more are going to other EU countries.

I agree - this was always going to happen, as we see this pattern every time large, poorer countries join the EU. As living standards at home have risen, the Poles and those from the Baltic States (and the Spanish and the Portuguese before them) have been replaced by Romanians and Bulgarians. Recently, the drop in the pound has accelerated this and made other EU countries more attractive.

AirportPlanner1

14th May 2018, 12:31

But look at the departure boards and then try and tell me that all those people flying to Bucharest, Craiova, Budapest, Sofia, and the like are tourists.

Budapest is a major tourist draw. Sofia and Bucharest also get a fair few tourists, especially at weekends. To suggest a lot of Wizz-type destinations are there just to carry migrants and have no tourist appeal takes an outdated view of the world. Yes some have not a lot there, but others that are little-known in the UK like Lviv, Ohrid, Tirgu Mures are great places with real potential.

Manx

14th May 2018, 18:38

Many of the jobs at the airport such as helping load bags and people in and out of a plane involve no significant skills or educational standards and so people are (rather crudely) "easy" to replace. As a result, those jobs are unlikely to be paid far above minimum wage. That's especially acute in an airport which relies on cheap labour to enable low cost flights. If the wages go up, the cost of using the airport goes up and so flight costs go up which would deter use. Lazy tabloid/Facebook generalisations about Eastern Europeans and immigration really won't change reality. As in any job, I would always recommend that anyone who's in a job that doesn't satisfy them in terms of finances or opportunities should either work harder to climb the ladder or try something else. I'd hate to think that any of my employees were so disparaging about their customers, it wouldn't be good for their motivation and that would surely have a negative impact on their level of output.

A lot of the Wizz flights I've been on "appear" (because I can't survey people) to have many immigrants coming to/from their country of birth, a lot of visiting families and a lot of Brits taking opportunities to travel cheaply to Eastern Europe for both business opportunities and leisure. Luton is a gateway to many Eastern European countries thanks to Wizz choosing to based its UK expansion out of Luton. Many Brits around London would rather use other airports because of Lutons long term reputation (not just recent construction impacts) - they're more savvy to the other choices available. London is a huge tourist destination to all travelling Europeans, like many of the other major European cities. With all of that in mind, I'd personally not be surprised if you noticed that Luton has a large number of foreign travellers.

"I don’t blame anyone for wanting a better life but it is a fact that companies bid for contracts based on offering the lowest pay and zero hour contracts in the knowledge that they will always find staff who would work for £3 an hour if there was no minimum wage."
Being safe "in the knowledge" that somebody might work for £3 per hour "if there was no minimum wage" isn't actually going to be a point of interest for any law abiding company who will, of course, know they must pay minimum wage even for basic jobs precisely because there IS a minimum wage.

I usually read this thread with interest but it does occasionally drift into Daily Mail comment section quality and people lazily dropping in "Eastern European" for no real reason. Like when somebody above posts that "Eastern Europeans" often smoke in that walkway outside the terminal. Based on my own experiences, the most specific term you could use to label these people is "passengers" because I've heard all sorts of accents, including many Brits, using that area to smoke. There's no need to specifically call out a section of those passengers and it actually adds nothing to the point that people, whoever they are, shouldn't be doing it.

I wouldn't be one of those people that pulls out the "r" word to label you people because I don't suspect you are that, it's just a reflection of the gutter into which the tabloids and "anti-MSM" warriors/brigade have purposely driven popular conversation into.

LTNman

14th May 2018, 22:46

https://i.imgur.com/fm9LbeM.jpg

When I travel up New Airport Way and want to pass to the left of the Holiday Inn I use the middle lane as per the road markings. 50% of drivers don't so I often get hooted at by those that have not turned left and are using the left hand lane to carry on.

This takes us to the new drop off zone where for the best of intentions and to stop cars having to cross the paths of cars leaving each drop off lane, traffic has to enter the lanes on the wrong side of the road, go to the end, do a very tight 180 and then travel down the other side also on the wrong side of the road before exiting the lane and rejoining the ring road either to try another drop off lane or continue on the ring road to the pay barrier. These drop off lanes are marked with road arrows the same way as New Airport Way.

Just wondering how many drivers will travel around the drop off lanes on the left hand side of the road which is actually the wrong side of the road? Also the turn into the first drop off lane is incredibly tight and makes the 180 turn for the existing drop off zone seem like a gentle curve. I am also thinking that most cars will enter the first drop off lane and ignore the other 4.

Falcon666

14th May 2018, 23:24

What's with the A1081 being written sideways.
Can they not get it on one line?
Would make it easier to read and is that actually a highways standard?

LTNman

14th May 2018, 23:36

Actually the A1081 road marking is not a road marking but just appears on Google maps as an indicator so it is not really there.

compton3bravo

15th May 2018, 04:17

Could not agree more Manx. Recently Man Sahib had to go into hospital rather quickly when we were in the UK (we do have a base on the South Coast) and the service and staff (mostly non-Brits) were excellent. If you want to curtail immigration be careful what you wish for i.e. NHS, fruit and vegetable picking etc because me thinks there are an awful lot of Brits who will not get off there backsides and fill those posts.

Falcon666

15th May 2018, 08:32

LTNman
Thanks for clearing that up, it was early in the morning .
Mind you I wouldn't put it past them to do it up there!!

Buster the Bear

15th May 2018, 09:55

Firefighters, security & airport operations staff would not necessarily fall into the minimum wage category. When the firefighters strike for 24 hours from 0700 on Friday 25 May, in theory, the airport will also close unless some pretty robust contingency measures are introduced that satisfy the CAA? Not too sure if things have changed, but all management at the fire station were trade union members.

gilesdavies

15th May 2018, 13:56

There was talk on here a few weeks ago about Wizz competing with EZY on this new route they have launched in the last few weeks, so just giving my feedback/observations, having flown this route with them this weekend.

Going out last Friday, the flight was around 80% full... Mainly British and a few East Europeans on the route, going to Iceland for a holiday. Also a few Icelandics too, as was sat next to one on the outbound flight, and we got chatting and how they visit London, to come shopping and pick up what in their eyes are bargains, compared to Iceland's prices!

Coming back yesterday, the flight was atleast 90% full.

While load factors and just flying the route once in each direction is no scientific sign of how the route is performing for Wizz, it is a good indicator and they seem to be doing quite well!

When I booked, fares were very similar to easyJet. But as I am taking advantage of my Wizz Discount membership for the year and flogging it like a dead horse, it worked out around £20 cheaper.

It did seem strange arriving at Keflavik within 10-15 minutes of the easyJet flight from LTN...

Even though Keflavik airport is empty at around 9am when the Wizz and easyJet flights arrive (as all the WOW and Iceland Air flights have departed by that time for Europe), Wizz still choose to use a remote stand, while easyJet use the air bridges. So factor that in, if you find buses to the aircraft a pain up you know where!

LTNman

15th May 2018, 17:05

I boarded the coach at Luton at gate 20 which is associated with stand 61. The coach then drove all of 50m to stand 60, so much for easyjet priority boarders, as they found themselves buried at the back of the bus and were the last to board the aircraft.

pabely

15th May 2018, 19:01

Not everyone is happy about not being able to use Luton at night during the summer now BACA speaks out on London airport overnight restrictions (http://www.aviationpros.com/press_release/12412546/baca-speaks-out-on-london-airport-overnight-restrictions)

LTNman

15th May 2018, 21:24

Reading between the lines they don’t seem to be impressed with the idea of using Southend. I think I read that the Luton restriction will be for 90 days but will be applied again next summer.

Expressflight

16th May 2018, 14:25

Reading between the lines they don’t seem to be impressed with the idea of using Southend. I think I read that the Luton restriction will be for 90 days but will be applied again next summer.

I think SEN will be well pleased that BACA has drawn to everyone's attention the fact that SEN can offer limited night slots for those 3 months of 2018 and 2019.

Buster the Bear

16th May 2018, 22:44

The only folk bemused by the slot restrictions are the bizjet fraternity who have had it good for far too long. If they want a 24/7 operation, then find another airport and invest! Writing has been on the wall for years. If the elite wish unfettered access to London, then their hopes will be dashed.

LTNman

16th May 2018, 22:57

Well they have still got London access via Southend although their locals will be in for a shock when the biz jets turn up in the early hours and will no doubt kick off. Some of those jets are quite noisy and Southend doesn’t normally have overnight jet traffic.

As for Signature and Harrods I guess they will all be going home at night for the summer.

compton3bravo

17th May 2018, 07:46

If BACA are complaining about London airport's night restrictions have they not looked at continental Europe where a vast number of airports are closed at night especially in France, Germany and Switzerland. In Spain only Madrid, Barcelona and airports along the east coast remain open the remainder close for the night the exception being Vitoria which is a major freight hub. Still it would not be the UK without moaning about something, whinging poms etc.

pabely

17th May 2018, 20:29

Luton Airport workers postpone Bank Holiday strike - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-44160602)

LTNman

18th May 2018, 05:21

New pier now officially open

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5VU1gbS64k

adfly

18th May 2018, 08:38

Are they sure it's finished!? Says something when the pier still manages to look like a cheap bodge job in the promotional video for it...

AvGeek1

18th May 2018, 10:03

Are they sure it's finished!? Says something when the pier still manages to look like a cheap bodge job in the promotional video for it...

I really don’t understand what you expect from Luton. People fly from here for a reason, either for convenience or taking advantage of cheap flights. I don’t think many people are going to be judging how the boarding pier finish looks whilst they are boarding the flight they got for £90 return! You have to remember this isn’t Singapore’s or Dubai’s airport! I think the departure lounge finish is more of an area to concentrate on, which they have done quite well with in the new area, apart from the lack of seating. However, they would always choose more retail units over seating areas as it’s more money in their pockets!

cj241101

18th May 2018, 20:04

New pier? First impressions not good. First floor windows are 8ft off the ground so they let light in but no-one can see out. Perhaps LLAOL don't want the public watching the building site that will be there for some years to come.
Unless I somehow missed seeing them, there are no flight displays apart from the individual flights shown at their respective gate. Passengers ending up in the wrong part of the airport won't be able to find their gate number in a hurry.
Little or no seating. Not everyone is able to stand for lengthy periods waiting for their flight to start boarding.

LTNman

18th May 2018, 20:32

Might be the case on the coach side but I think the windows are floor to ceiling overlooking the apron. Also think the bulk of the seating is for the coach passengers some of whom have proper waiting areas which is where the video was shot.

Seems that a temporary exit road is being built from the pay barriers so the walkway from the former short term car park can be removed. I don't think it has been up 2 years. This seems to mean that the subway won't be opening anytime soon as the temporary road skirts the 3rd core and hugs part of the flyover which is far from being completed.

ClearLand08

18th May 2018, 20:44

I think some people might be judging Pier B a bit too harshly and as AvGeek1 points out, this is a low cost airport. I took a wander to the new pier whilst waiting for a flight today and took the following pics.

https://i.imgur.com/n2LRzkx.jpg
This is the link between the main terminal and Pier B, looking backwards towards the main terminal

https://i.imgur.com/WepnxxC.jpg
This is the departure corridor in the link, looking towards Pier B. To the left of the glass panels is the arrivals corridor.
The finishing quality in the link is not bad at all and (to the delight of some people here! has a proper ceiling :)

https://i.imgur.com/lboAVIs.jpg
This is the view at the end of the link as you turn left and get to Pier B itself. Toilets are on the left, with stairs and escalator down to gates 40 - 43 (busses for South Stands) and straight on for gates 30 - 33. The numbering makes sense (30s for upstairs and 40s for downstairs).

https://i.imgur.com/CPcynt1.jpg
The downstairs gates, with busses waiting on the right

https://i.imgur.com/j4C3GaX.jpg
These are the upstairs boarding gates to the East Apron. There are in fact loads of seats, although I can't help think they are wasted here since most people will only be in this pier when the flight is boarding and they are queuing at the gate. Finishing is simple but OK.

https://i.imgur.com/1tR5wuH.jpg
The end of Pier B where there are another set of toilets. And no, the signs on the toilets are not crooked, they are designed like that (and look better in person!)

https://i.imgur.com/JdDNv12.jpg
The view back down the pier. Whilst you can't see out the windows on the left, which will overlook the DART station construction, there is plenty of light from the windows on the right overlooking the Eastern Apron.

https://i.imgur.com/CONzoYR.jpg
Reverse view at the start of the pier. There are indeed no flight information screens in any part of the pier or the link at the moment... only the gate signs. I would imagine this has to change.

LTNman

19th May 2018, 05:45

Great set of photos. Some parts of the link and pier are of a good standard but others make the building look half finished with exposed metal framed walls and exposed services above the roof line but would passenger notice or even care.

Apart from the first wave of flights with night stoppers I haven’t actually seen the pier in use during the day.

The second entrance that will eventually be signed as arrivals is getting close to being opened but with the gap between the two entrances filled with canopy materials so can’t be tarmacked passengers heading for the drop off area will pass to the right of the new concrete wall while passengers using the other entrance or should I say exit will pass to the left of the concrete wall.

The strange wall that sits by the covered walkway is tapered and loses height the further down it goes. All very strange but might have something to do with eventually taking some of the slope out of the pavement. The wall is still fenced off making the bus station side pavement narrow as the wall foundations still need to be back filled.

Dannyboy39

19th May 2018, 05:53

Would it have pained them to use a more imaginative colour?

Seems to be a decent number of seats available. Could it be an idea to put gate numbers on the departure boards if known, rather than just before boarding, so you’d actually get people congregating in these areas rather than the overcrowded departure lounge?

cj241101

19th May 2018, 11:40

My comments regarding the seating were directed more at the lower gates i.e.40-43 which will be used for coaching to the south apron. A further check today and it looks like 8 seats (2x4) per gate apart from gate 43 which seems to have 16 seats. On a positive note there seem to be lifts at the upper gates i.e. 30-33, with one of the biggest existing gripes I hear coming from passengers having to carry baby buggies/prams down up to 6 flights of stairs as is the case elsewhere around the airport.
At the moment, gate numbers are displayed on the flight information screen 45 minutes from STD. Theoretically this gives passengers plenty of time to get to the right gate. Problems with displaying gate numbers earlier are two-fold; firstly there are no preboard zones in the new pier unlike the ones that serve (I think) gates 22 and 26 on the other pier. Passengers congregating well in advance of their boarding time would only impede access to the other gates. This was evident today, with a Wizz A321 boarding at gate 31 where the "cattle pen" quickly filled up and the rest of the passengers filled the width of the pier. Secondly, parking space is at a premium, especially in the morning, with the combination of departing aircraft incurring delays, and arriving aircraft turning up ahead of schedule, leading to last minute changes to the planned stand allocation and consequent changes of gate.

dvc

19th May 2018, 23:18

Apart from the first wave of flights with night stoppers I haven’t actually seen the pier in use during the day.

Now those stands are being used throughout the day.

ClearLand08

20th May 2018, 08:18

Wizzair based aircraft numbers 6 and 7 started today looking at FightRadar24, 1xA321 and 1xA320.

pabely

20th May 2018, 10:36

Wizzair based aircraft numbers 6 and 7 started today looking at FightRadar24, 1xA321 and 1xA320.

https://wizzair.com/en-gb/information-and-services/about-us/news/2018/05/18/wizz-air-announces-arrival-of-two-new-aircraft-at-london-luton-and-launches-two-new-routes-to-lviv-and-larnaca#/

nohold

20th May 2018, 20:14

East Anglia Helimed landed at the airport (circa 19:00) and some ambulances also in attendance.

Sunday 20th May 2018.

LTNman

21st May 2018, 05:34

Seems that Luton is the worst UK airport for flight punctuality with departures from the Bedfordshire hub leaving on average 19.7 minutes late although there is not much in it with Birmingham,Teeside, Jersey, and Gatwick all above 18 minutes.

Looking at Luton today there are 17 departures from 5:55 to 6:30 and 44 to 08:00. There are also 13 arrivals between 07:00 and 08:00 making a total of 57 moments to 08:00 which is rather impressive at almost 1 movement every 2 minutes.

compton3bravo

21st May 2018, 07:11

Plus you can add a number of executive movements. Wizz 20 departures this morning between 0600 and 0930.

Airbrake

21st May 2018, 07:20

Unfortunately, LTN is not an impressive airport at all. From today’s stats each of those departures will run on average nearly 20 mins late.
Whilst the airport layout does not help, and I accept there are external factors like Northolt departures which throw a spanner in the works occasionally LTN is still a slow and ponderous operation. From basics such as late Marshallers leading to blocked taxi ways, to the “mandatory hectopascal” read back which the rest of Europe don’t require, LTN needs a thorough revamp of procedures. From the simple things like straight or 45degree push backs to auto frequency changes and getting DCL sorted for northbound departures to name but a few.
The new gates on the East apron mean that 7 stands will be blocked as soon as one aircraft moves due to no thought given to allowing a double width access and let’s not even talk about the new improved airport road access or the inadequate immigration hall.

22/04

21st May 2018, 07:54

I think most of the delay comes from airport congestion really. I am confused about taxiway foxtrot which might allows more pushbacks on to Delta - is that happening.

Hectopascals isn't the airport's fault - you'll need to change the CAA's view after several incidents where American crews have got it wrong- they are used to one simple scale of inches.

Remember Luton has a higher percentage of large aircraft/short turnrounds than many of its competitors.

Oh and auto frequency changes- again difficult - as unlike say Birmingham they are more variable- sometimes Approach needing to work traffic before London control to de-conflict inbounds and outbounds. So another reason is the crowded bit of the London TMA in which the airport sits.

LTNman

21st May 2018, 08:15

The new gates on the East apron mean that 7 stands will be blocked as soon as one aircraft moves due to no thought given to allowing a double width access and let’s not even talk about the new improved airport road access or the inadequate immigration hall.

Soon to be 8 but a double width access would have reduced the size of the CTA road layout and car parks so there was no room to do that.

I am confused about taxiway foxtrot which might allows more pushbacks on to Delta - is that happening.

Work is meant to start next month.

At the end of the day we are talking about a minutes difference between Birmingham,Teeside, Jersey and Gatwick. The airlines factor this in so what is more important is the arrival times at the other end of the route.

Airbrake

21st May 2018, 08:37

If you push on to Delta you block it.
Nowhere else in Europe insists on the Hectopascal read back and American crews fly to Europe.
The auto frequency change is not difficult. Some of the largest airports in Europe use it very effectively to cut out unnecessary chat. If it’s not appropriate for some reason the controller simply says “remain on this frequency until instructed, clear take off.” Another option is simply “Contact departures” or “contact ground” without the verbiage of a frequency.

Luton needs a real operational kick in the backside to sharpen up the whole operation.

LTN Man. You have summed up the problem with Ltn very aptly when referring to the fact that roads and car parks get priority over a dead end East apron that is going to cause taxi delays for probably decades. The whole car parking & drop off area has been dug up several times and losing another 30-40m to create a free flowing apron would have been insignificant in the grand plan.

22/04

21st May 2018, 08:49

Nowhere else in Europe insists on the Hectopascal read back and American crews fly to Europe.
The auto frequency change is not difficult. Some of the largest airports in Europe use it very effectively to cut out unnecessary chat.

Just saying that a lot of the problems you mention are not directly under Luton's control but rest with the CAA and NATS so won't be sorted quickly and can't be sorted by the airport. .

The London TMA is more complex than most in Europe with many stakeholders and lots of traffic. Witnessed it yesterday in My Jodel joining the circuit at White Waltham with an A380 2000 feet above me on left base for LHR

ESQU

21st May 2018, 08:52

And where else in Europe says taxi to stand 42 Lima?

compton3bravo

21st May 2018, 08:53

I think that is totally unfair airbrake. Personally I think ATC and everybody tries there damnest considering the layout of the airport. I suggest you should channel your grievances to NATS.

cumbrianboy

21st May 2018, 11:26

I don't think you can blame having to say the word hectopascal on a read back to ATC (which takes less than 1 second) is the cause for delays at Luton ... I mean, really???

Yes pushing back blocks taxiways, but have you seen the cul-de-sac at Manchester - this is not a specific problem, and from what I have seen of LTN they do try to plan stands and plan ground movements in such a way to minimise these delays.

I think a lot of the problems come from having an airport which is more leisure focused and hence the passenger mix tend to (on average, and I know this not not exclusive), but on average passengers tend to travel less, are therefore less airport savvy and inadvertently cause delays ... it's the nature of leisure orientated low cost travel

Airbrake

21st May 2018, 11:49

I think that is totally unfair airbrake. Personally I think ATC and everybody tries there damnest considering the layout of the airport. I suggest you should channel your grievances to NATS.

No, LTN ATC management and LTN airport management should be getting a grip of it and going to NATS instead telling us to “turn left, hold A4.” Pause....... “contact ground blah”. ATC may be doing their best but this type of change has to be pushed through by airport managers. I don’t know if you are involved with ATC at LTN, but the resistance to change shown on this thread is why delays at Luton and operational efficiencies are only going to get worse. With increasing numbers of aircraft many of the bottle necks and operational short comings are only going to add exponentially to existing delays.

PS. Cumbrianboy, you clearly haven’t heard some of the Hectopascal RT conversations at LTN!

Crispo

21st May 2018, 13:48

Ref. the hectopascals this is a national requirement.
See CAP413 p27

The ATS messages listed below are to be read back in full by the pilot/driver. If a readback is not received the pilot/driver will be asked to do
so.

Altimeter Settings, including units when value is below 1000 hectopascals

LTNman

21st May 2018, 14:03

I haven't got by head around if and how Taxiway Foxtrot would help trapped aircraft on the Eastern Apron. If the tug took the aircraft to the south of the intersection it then can't get back as the towed aircraft is now in the way. If it took the aircraft to the north of the intersection as happens now what has been gained? I am assuming Taxiway Foxtrot will allow arriving and departing aircraft to pass each other rather than waiting at Alpha.
https://i.imgur.com/YjCSQr1.jpg

Out of date now but this is the NAT's view of Luton
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMzVd7OUf-w

Control tower view

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWwJSH0QGmE

dvc

21st May 2018, 15:23

Don't know if anyone else noticed. There's 5 aircraft parked on stands on pier B in below video. This 1st Easyjet seems too close to be on Delta. Are they going to squeeze another stand somehow?

Can't post link. The video is titled A Journey Through The New London Luton Airport (one that plays on the car park buses) and the shot I'm talking about is at exactly 1 minute.

Falcon666

21st May 2018, 17:33

22/04

21st May 2018, 17:42

Something like this. Links have been named zulu ( opposite the East apron) and "x-ray" to the north of that in my proposal.
"Lowcost 123 push back on to taxiway delta and ask your tug to pull you forward to leave link z clear. "
"Cheapflight 789 ( who has already pushed to the back of the cul de sac and started) taxi link zulu taxiway foxtrot and alpha hold alpha one." (when the lowcost has cleared)
"Blue Eastern 921 ( from say stand 9) taxi exho, delta, link x-ray foxtrot alpha hold alpha one runway 26" (when the lowcost is still starting).

Though I guess Airbrake won't like the verbage.

Airbrake, if we let airport mangers dictate aviation policy, it would be to the detriment of safety and certainly other airspace users like me in my little Jodel, gliders, hot air balloons, pipeline inspection flights etc etc. Exeter's Airspace change policy proposal has just been rejected remember.

Airbrake

21st May 2018, 17:51

22/04.

What a shambles that is going to be for years and years.

dvc

21st May 2018, 18:41

Why exactly are a/c being tugged out to Delta anyway?
Is it not due to the builders compound being in the Apron?
Once the compound has gone would the problem not disappear and a/c would push and start on the Apron?

Not enough room to dogleg (do 180) the aircraft from 43L or 46, some pushback drivers are struggling to do it from 44L or 47 as well. But the apron taxiway is being widened (or should I say stands moved closer to the piers) and when builders and Azurra temp crew rooms will be relocated I see it being possible to push within the apron.

Buster the Bear

21st May 2018, 19:28

22/04

21st May 2018, 19:35

I am not sure what airbrake is comparing LTN with. Heathrow certainly is little better with aircraft switching from an outside to inner taxiway system- granted the new terminals don't have cul de sacs but T3 still does big time with often a wait after arrival for a stand if there is any slippage in schedules. Gatwick North and holding at west end of 26 there an be a 'mare as well. And building new airports-out of the question- we can't even get a third runway at LHR!

LTNman

21st May 2018, 19:42

Why exactly are a/c being tugged out to Delta anyway?

By being tugged to the north half of Delta it then allows an aircraft to enter the eastern apron from the direction of Alpha.

Also worth remembering that Luton has to work with what is has as the basic layout goes back to the 60's If anyone remember life without Echo the main apron was then a culdesac with around 17 stands.

Falcon666

21st May 2018, 19:57

forest

21st May 2018, 20:24

I have just been watching the East Apron and of the last four departures from the stands only one tugged out to Delta.
The other three did in fact push and start from the Apron so presumably it has nothing to do with the compound.
Do they only tug out to Delta when a incoming is going to arrive at one of the inner stands (closer to the terminal) -but surely that shouldn't happen that often?

All stands in East apron are built to push within the Apron albeit St 43 and 43 Lima have to do a non standard long push onto Delta whilst the works compound is on st46. Not sure what will happen after its removed as the piers, now subject to a/c size are 4 a/c stands per pier. Will wait and see.

LTNman

22nd May 2018, 09:59

The first panel has been fitted to the new entrance. Can't yet make out what it is made from until I can get underneath it. The original plan showed a massive grand design but the bean counters won with this compact effort that will keep the glass dry but that is about it. Another mini canopy will run the length of the bus station.
https://i.imgur.com/vaTkLrs.jpg

The Mystery of the wall. What is its purpose? Note the drainage against the wall.
https://i.imgur.com/6Zd2I5M.jpg

The ramp that will carry all traffic.
https://i.imgur.com/GjAncj3.jpg

The subway that will eventually serve the new drop off area plus MS2
https://i.imgur.com/p8xzFpE.jpg

At the top of the ramp an exit is being created to access the first floor of the new multistory as the ground floor will be the drop off area.
https://i.imgur.com/Wj5RA2d.jpg

The new temporary drop off area. Cars will travel around the 5 individual bays on the wrong side of the road. Bollards are started to be installed to keep the traffic on the wrong side of the road
https://i.imgur.com/bxDNxjM.jpg

Traffic has been diverted around the second footbridge and 3rd core which are due for demolition and passes the entrance to the subway meaning it can't open until the road goes back.
https://i.imgur.com/8Z7lVwV.jpg

The new taxiway extension is taking the strain.
https://i.imgur.com/7uEpXRC.jpg

Finally what an airport handling 16 million passengers looks like
https://i.imgur.com/9yvzgnG.jpg

PAXboy

22nd May 2018, 12:19

The barking mad plan to build a tinminal in a cul-de-sac! I fondly remember the then Airport Director barking at me for my cynicism!

The original plan was of course for an additional tunnel to the north that would have exited along Frank Lester Way. That was design engineered out of the plans for financial reasons. In effect, a circular one way system.

ABSOLUTELY!!! The aspect of life driven by bean counters that I enjoy the most is reflected in the old saying: "Cheap - is Dear". When you cut back on something to save money, almost inevitably, it costs you more in the long run. For the original bean counters - it is a 'Win' as they save money but everyone after them has to spend more to compensate. In this particular case, as the North tunnel would now be VERY expensive, they cannot do it - but have to spend ever more amounts of money to try and offset the original bad choice. The same goes for the link to the railway station, now costing more than it would have done originally.

I appreciate that predictions of numbers were difficult but the short term attitude of modern Britain is writ large across LTN.