Luton-9 [Archive] - Page 12

toledoashley

8th Aug 2019, 05:37

Its a shame to see Ryanair cutting back on the Canary Island flights this winter...

Ryanair will be stopping there twice weekly services to Fuerteventura and Gran Canaria at the end of October.

Lanzarote remains, but cut from twice weekly to once a week and Tenerife remains with the twice weekly service.

While the airline did not offer an amazing schedule to the islands, at least it gave a link to the Canaries, which the airport has lacked for a number of years considering the number of flights from other UK airports and provided an alternative after Monarch departed.

easyJet provide a limited schedule to Lanzarote and Tenerife too, but not to the islands Ryanair are dropping. WIll be interesting to see if they maybe pick them up at a later date? Also weird Ryanair would drop flights to the Canary Islands at the start of the Winter schedule, when they are some of the most popular Winter sun destinations.

Also while on the subject of Ryanair, by jaw nearly dropped when I noticed they are starting flights to Krakow from November, operating four flights a week. So this now means Wizz, easyJet and Ryanair are flighting over this market, when eighteen months ago, not a single airline was operating this route! Surely Ryanair could make better choices on how to deploy that 737-800 from the airport?

Apologies if any of this has been discussed before.

Seville a direct replacement for FUE?

gilesdavies

8th Aug 2019, 07:46

Seville a direct replacement for FUE?

Not really, as clear cut as that... As there are a number of cut backs this winter, Girona doesn't operate during the winter months.

Athens, Malta, Marrakech and Murcia for example all see there schedules reduced to match the slower winter demand.

If you go to the Ryanair booking page and select a destination, and scroll through the monthly calender view, you'll see how the frequencies change from October to Novembe, when the winter schedule kicks in.

I think a few of Ryanair's flights into LTN are usually operated by aircraft from other bases (especially some of south European destinations), and quite often during the winter months these bases shut down for winter or see reduced aircraft based there. It is therefore likely, these flights might be using the LTN based aircraft in lieu, and hence why reduced schedules to other destinations are required.

LTNman

8th Aug 2019, 11:36

Work on Parkway interchange continues with first of two beams being lifted into position where the track will enter the station
https://i.imgur.com/2yAX17v.jpg

The covers are back off the gateway bridge after the sections were welded together. Trusses are being laid either side to support the framework of wood that the concrete trackbed will be poured into. This is going to end up being a mighty weight that will have to be lifted and transported down the hill.
https://i.imgur.com/lLBDD24.jpg

The temporary Taxiway Bravo route is just waiting for its final layer of tarmac. The taxiway sits over the DART tunnel.
https://i.imgur.com/9ScN2Hy.jpg

Meanwhile just inside the CTA trusses are being put in to support the pouring of the tunnel roof.
https://i.imgur.com/wp0dZIc.jpg

MS1 is being clad. The first multi story to be completed is called MS2
https://i.imgur.com/0E2S9DL.jpg

At the other end the cores are also being clad but in a lighter shade of grey.
https://i.imgur.com/jcZ6dTC.jpg

tczulu

8th Aug 2019, 16:43

pabely

8th Aug 2019, 19:13

Maybe there will be 50 shades of grey. After all,you have to be some sort of masochist to fly from Luton.🙈
That's s hell of alot of masochist then, would be more if the constraints of parking and 18M limits were not in place! Biz traffic allown would be x2 as well!

compton3bravo

8th Aug 2019, 19:58

Easy to commence daily Prague service at the end of October in direct competition with Wizz.

pabely

8th Aug 2019, 20:47

Easy to commence daily Prague service at the end of October in direct competition with Wizz.
Done STN for years (think it was a Go route orginally) and LGW double daily so they must know there is demand. Probably looking to more through Easyjet Holidays with this one.

gilesdavies

9th Aug 2019, 11:32

Easy to commence daily Prague service at the end of October in direct competition with Wizz.
Interesting move...

While Wizz are becoming more well known in the UK, they still do not have the presence to themselves like Ryanair and easyJet. I think many potential travellers will go to Ryanair or easyJet's website, to check a route before looking at Wizz and I think this is the area where easyJet can feel more confident and compete directly with Wizz Air, especially on routes which are largely filed by UK tourists.

easyJet are competing with Wizz on a fair few number routes now, Thessaloniki, Oporto, Lisbon, Krakow, Tel Aviv, Reykjavik, Split and Grenoble all spring to mind.

Lee Baker Street

9th Aug 2019, 15:28

Interesting move...

While Wizz are becoming more well known in the UK, they still do not have the presence to themselves like Ryanair and easyJet. I think many potential travellers will go to Ryanair or easyJet's website, to check a route before looking at Wizz and I think this is the area where easyJet can feel more confident and compete directly with Wizz Air, especially on routes which are largely filed by UK tourists.

easyJet are competing with Wizz on a fair few number routes now, Thessaloniki, Oporto, Lisbon, Krakow, Tel Aviv, Reykjavik, Split and Grenoble all spring to mind.

I agree with you gilesdavis. If I am honest I am weary of flying Eastern European airlines but Wizzair UK has never really promoted itself on the scene as an actual British Airline. I don’t even know if they have adverts wether in newspapers or on tv adverts. They could do with a major campaign on tv if you ask me.

pabely

9th Aug 2019, 17:02

It is reported that Wizzair will upgauge capacity on the Ljubljana route from the 180-seat Airbus A320 aircraft to the 230-seat A321

22/04

9th Aug 2019, 17:13

AFAIK Wizzair UK was principally set up to allow the airline to fly between the UK and non Hungarian destinations in the event of no deal. It has been opportunistic
in taking advantage of opportunities beyond this

pabely

9th Aug 2019, 17:31

BBC reporting Thameslink at a standstill currently between London and Bedford due to power outages nationality, airport reporting no problems

LTNman

9th Aug 2019, 17:44

Not quite true as the terminal is part flooded. Quite an achievement when it is on high ground

Following a period of unprecedented rainfall, we have experienced water damage in a number of locations in the terminal. We apologise for any disruption to services while we seek to resolve the issue.

Heard there has even been an evacuation and the place is in disarray although I am waiting for confirmation

pabely

9th Aug 2019, 17:50

Not quite true as the terminal is part flooded. Quite an achievement when it is on high ground

Heard there has even been an evacuation and the place is in disarray although I am waiting for confirmation
LHR is starting to stack them up over North Sea, not good timing if requests for diversions start coning in.

LTNman

9th Aug 2019, 17:58

It rained intensely for maybe a little over 5 minutes. Been in worse but only in Florida. Not a good time to be drooped off in the drop off zone. Maybe the flooding was due to dripping clothes?

pabely

9th Aug 2019, 18:20

It rained intensely for maybe a little over 5 minutes. Been in worse but only in Florida. Not a good time to be drooped off in the drop off zone. Maybe the flooding was due to dripping clothes?
Looks bad by what had been posted on social media by M&S

LTNman

9th Aug 2019, 18:30

Fantastic, that's the only bit on the ground floor new build to get a ceiling and was only finished 2 weeks ago.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-49299362/luton-airport-video-captures-rain-pouring-into-airport-terminal

Spanish eyes

9th Aug 2019, 18:56

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7342319/Luton-Airport-terminal-causing-long-delays-torrential-downpours.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7342319/Luton-Airport-terminal-causing-long-delays-torrential-downpours.html)

LTNman

9th Aug 2019, 19:01

Just occurred to me that most of the video was shot outside M&S while there is a floor above. Must have been worse upstairs.

PAXboy

9th Aug 2019, 19:14

Pay Cheap = Pay Twice.

Mr Optimistic

9th Aug 2019, 19:20

Unprecedented rain? Really?

racedo

9th Aug 2019, 19:59

Travelled into Luton in May and arrived early morning just as rain started to come down. There was water pouring down immediately after Border security but before the gates you walk through, eventually saw someone to tell on way out and was reported to duty manager.

Lee Baker Street

10th Aug 2019, 00:38

The rain we experienced in Luton was the worst I have ever witnessed in this country and I have experienced similar in Chicago. The town centre had floods and even the Mall had water coming from the ceiling. In turn we had some thunder. I bet there are many buildings in Luton that had water leakage from every angle. It was an unprecedented incident here in Luton.

Spanish eyes

10th Aug 2019, 04:12

compton3bravo

10th Aug 2019, 05:07

The Departure board on the airport website are now showing more information telling passengers which belt there luggage will be but more interesting is the information regarding cancelled services. This morning's easy Nice is cancelled due to no aircraft being available and last night's Mahon was cancelled due to the crew being out of hours. Never seen this before on an airport website.

Lee Baker Street

10th Aug 2019, 07:18

Last week or it could have been the week before, Luton Councillors refused to declare a climate emergency after being warned and reminded by the airport chairman that the council want to double the size of the airport. Karma comes to mind as the council owned building was extensively flooded including much of the first floor departure lounge where restaurants had to be evacuated for safety reasons. There is some staggering footage if you dig deep.

Spanish eyes in 1976 we had a heat wave. In 1979 we were freezing. Please disclose to me what the Karma was. I take it you were in Luton yesterday and witnessed what I and hundreds witnessed? There has been a climate change throughout my life and it is called weather!

LTNman

10th Aug 2019, 19:44

Yes but there are trends which scientists and weather experts have detected. With the council planning a massive increase in pollution they are not going to declare a climate emergency are they.

inOban

10th Aug 2019, 20:21

The physics of our atmosphere - how it acts as a blanket round the earth - was worked out 200 years ago. The effect of the massive release of CO2 due to the industrial revolution was predicted 100 years ago. As predicted, the climate has become more energetic and in general warmer. Anyone who thinks it hasn't, has to explain why, by proving 200 years of physics to be wrong.

pabely

11th Aug 2019, 16:24

Weather disruption again, some unusual arrival routings again?

commit aviation

11th Aug 2019, 18:26

With regards to climate change, I suspect all the London airports and their respective growth plans will face a bigger challenge in terms of government environmental policy over the coming years.
Luton council chose not to declare a climate emergency, Uttlesford council (where Stansted is located) did.
Commercial and environmental interests will need to be balanced somehow and I have no idea what the outcome will be but right now it feels as if the pendulum is swinging more strongly towards the environmental arguments.

SARF

11th Aug 2019, 21:01

The escalation,of the language is amusing . How can Luton council declare a ‘climate emergency’ when, in reality it’s raining and there is some local flooding .. Its a bit like network rail declaring electricity catastrophe when there is a power outage in Epping

PAXboy

11th Aug 2019, 23:48

They could because 'weather' and 'climate' are two different things. Although, of course, they won't.
As you were.

dvc

15th Aug 2019, 12:05

First one through Foxtrot
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1099/img_20190815_123946_01_9cec2974ee01e0c9c7b5b02cc452d91065efc 4d6.jpg

pabely

17th Aug 2019, 06:55

The second multi story which was having parking sold from August 19th has had that date dropped. There has been zero prospect of that car park being finished for a long time. At the time of writing not even the ramps have had concrete poured yet.
Airports own web site say it will open next week!

Falcon666

17th Aug 2019, 10:17

MS1 is being clad. The first multi story to be completed is called MS2
https://i.imgur.com/0E2S9DL.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jcZ6dTC.jpg

According to the Airport website it’s the other more logical way around( first MSCP will be called MSCP1)

The opening of the second MSCP is important as this will now allow the closing off of the section of the mid term car park to enable the starting on the next section of the DART.
I am guessing only a couple of floors will be open next week as the ground floor drop off area will take longer to finish due to road realignments.

LTNman

19th Aug 2019, 13:57

Remarkable scenes were witnessed today as the passenger footbridge from the existing multi story was having its walls and ceilings washed. This is the first time this has happened as the bridge was handed over by the builders without being cleaned and was filthy and grime ridden on day one of its opening in 2016.

I had a close look at the second multi story which was meant to open today. Still think this opening is a few days away and when it does open only the 1st and maybe the 2nd floors will open. Both these floors have had the parking bays painted in with the top floors are still receiving concrete.

The main core containing lifts is still being clad, contains no windows and has a temporary roof made out of nailed down plastic. Looking through the windowless openings the lifts still seem to be boarded up.

The exit route from the down ramp onto the ring road has no road markings and no give way signs have yet appeared. The pillars on the ramp have only been part painted with some untouched so it will be challenging to paint these if the ramp is opened to traffic.

While the hoarding has been removed that will access the new multi story the temporary route to the lifts and staircase has yet to be boarded. This is giving a view of where those that are paying premium money for valet parking are having their cars parked which is in the middle of a building site on what will be the drop off area. With the air thick with dust I am wondering if the cars are washed before being handed back over.

Falcon666

20th Aug 2019, 18:49

https://mediahub.london-luton.co.uk/news/20082019/london-luton-airport-announce-launch-of-express-rail-service?ref=Home

Didn’t get the four per hour they wanted but I guess it’s a start.

Also a NOTAM is out for taxiway Bravo realignment, starting this Thursday.

LTNman

21st Aug 2019, 05:21

Luton will end up with 2 express, 4 semi fast and 2 all stopper services per hour, total 8 trains per hour.

The issue for passengers departing St Pancras is do they use the high level platforms for the half hourly non stop service or the underground platforms for the 4 trains an hour semi fast service. In many cases the semi fast option will still be quicker as there will be less platform waiting.

As stated the airport and council were lobbying for 4 express trains per hour so got half of what they wanted which will be a disappointment for them. Also unless things change with a change of franchise, group saver tickets are not accepted on non stop services to and from St Pancras.

LTNman

21st Aug 2019, 21:40

Seems Luton is keeping open its existing de-icing spots on the south stands giving a total of 7 locations where aircraft can be de-iced with their engines running. Luton has apparently the largest de-icing facility in the UK for engine running de-icing.

LTNman

22nd Aug 2019, 05:19

East Midland Railways are buying a second hand fleet of what will be nearly 20 year old Siemens Class 360 trains from Greater Anglia Railways to serve Luton Airport for its express train service to Parkway that will continue to Corby.

The trains will only have 4 carriages although they can be joined to make 8 car sets. We will have to see what happens but a 4 car set could well suffer from overcrowding if airport passengers start to use the service in numbers.

AirportPlanner1

22nd Aug 2019, 07:57

Wizz are to move the LTN-Sibiu route to SEN from the end of October. They are also launching SEN-Bucharest and Vilnius.

Expressflight

22nd Aug 2019, 08:02

East Midland Railways are buying a second hand fleet of what will be nearly 20 year old Siemens Class 360 trains from Greater Anglia Railways to serve Luton Airport for its express train service to Parkway that will continue to Corby.
The trains will only have 4 carriages although they can be joined to make 8 car sets. We will have to see what happens but a 4 car set could well suffer from overcrowding if airport passengers start to use the service in numbers.
Having often travelled on those very trains I don't recall much dedicated baggage space.

1sky

22nd Aug 2019, 08:12

Wizz are to move the LTN-Sibiu route to SEN from the end of October. They are also launching SEN-Bucharest and Vilnius.

Interesting move. I am wondering why Sibiu got picked.

gilesdavies

22nd Aug 2019, 10:29

Interesting move. I am wondering why Sibiu got picked.

They have however also announced a daily service to Vienna and twice weekly service to Castellon in Spain from Luton.

Vienna is another they'll be competing directly with easyJet on!

https://www.businesstraveller.com/business-travel/2019/08/22/wizz-air-to-launch-first-routes-from-london-southend/

Lee Baker Street

22nd Aug 2019, 10:32

Interesting move. I am wondering why Sibiu got picked.

Wizzair carry around 100,000 pax a year on that route at LTN. It makes no sense to drop the service.

PDXCWL45

22nd Aug 2019, 10:36

Wizzair carry around 100,000 pax a year on that route at LTN. It makes no sense to drop the service.
Unless they got a better offer from SEN to operate it there.

Spanish eyes

22nd Aug 2019, 11:07

That will upset the council as they promote the building of a second terminal.

Wizzair carry around 100,000 pax a year on that route at LTN. It makes no sense to drop the service.

Remember Waterford when that ended up at Southend the passengers did not follow. Might be different now if there are no alternate routes.

LTNman

22nd Aug 2019, 11:29

Gateway bridge for the Dart is being prepared for the concrete tracks.
https://i.imgur.com/sW7WX5U.jpg

Taxiway Bravo diversion has opened which will allow the existing taxiway to be dug out for the Dart tunnel.
https://i.imgur.com/aY4A1Ch.jpg

As reported before the multistory car park numbering has been reversed. The new car park which has now opened is Car Park 2.
Photo shows the foot entrance with the first floor ramp that connects to the ring road just forward of the netting which is protecting a missing section of the first floor.
https://i.imgur.com/KHgxBgj.jpg

The car park has opened with no working lifts. Due to the height of the ceiling of the drop off area passengers are having to lug suitcases up 4 flights of stairs to reach the first floor. The staircases are half the width of the other multistory and seem to be built as just a fire escape. All windows have been boarded up due to a lack of window frames and glass.
https://i.imgur.com/5EGVIsL.jpg

Only the first floor is open
https://i.imgur.com/uY00MMY.jpg

The pay barriers are on the first floor
https://i.imgur.com/hFWQVj5.jpg

AirportPlanner1

22nd Aug 2019, 11:46

Remember Waterford when that ended up at Southend the passengers did not follow. Might be different now if there are no alternate routes.

Sibiu is not Waterford, and times have moved on. Waterford moved over prematurely before the new terminal was open. It required a bus transfer from the old terminal to Rochford Station. Perhaps if they’d held back a year things would have been different. Routes and airlines at SEN have come and gone but ventures towards the east of Europe have been highly successful to date, certainly in terms of passenger numbers. I have no reason to doubt Sibiu would be any different.

G-AZUK

22nd Aug 2019, 13:09

The issue for passengers departing St Pancras is do they use the high level platforms for the half hourly non stop service or the underground platforms for the 4 trains an hour semi fast service. In many cases the semi fast option will still be quicker as there will be less platform waiting

Same kind of Dilemma going south at Victoria where you can get the Southern or the Gatwick express.
My guess is airport passengers will naturally gravitate to the 'express' service as they do at Gatwick, without realising the same TOC operates a far cheaper 2 stop service, its just painted green and has a different platform.

Mr Optimistic

22nd Aug 2019, 13:20

4 car service !? Back to the 1990s. And yes there isn't much luggage space. I think it's only 30mins on the standard Thameslink trains so a bit puzzled as to the advantages of an 'express'. But 4 car trains better not have any other station stops!

Expressflight

22nd Aug 2019, 13:39

At least LTN can have an express train service from London. I cannot see SEN ever getting that as the track layout would seem to make it impossible.

AirportPlanner1

22nd Aug 2019, 13:46

The trains are 4-car insofar as that is the number of carriages you can walk between. They are actually operated in blocks of 1, 2 or 3 so in other words 4, 8 or 12 carriages in length. There isn’t currently any luggage storage but I’m sure they could be fairly easily reconfigured. What I will say as a regular user is the air conditioning is very good and they are about the most comfortable non-intercity trains I’ve travelled on in the UK.

LTNman

22nd Aug 2019, 13:55

https://www.railwaygazette.com/news/passenger/single-view/view/east-midlands-railway-announces-three-brands.html

A new electric service between London St Pancras, Luton Airport Parkway, Bedford, Kettering, Wellingborough and Corby will be branded EMR Electrics. This is to be operated using refurbished Siemens Class 360 EMUs, and will have its own website, ‘easier’ ticketing and a dedicated platform at St Pancras. EMR said that once various developments had been completed, passengers would be able to reach the terminal at Luton Airport in ‘a little under half an hour’ from central London.

Luton's Express trains will come 2nd hand from from here.
https://www.angeltrains.co.uk/Products-Services/Regional-Passenger-Trains/19

As Thameslink serves many more stations including Crossrail at Farringdon and London Bridge they will still be the company of choice for most passengers.

LTNman

23rd Aug 2019, 17:47

Seems Luton is doing well
Happy passengers at London Luton Airport - Airport World Magazine (http://www.airport-world.com/news/general-news/7299-happy-passengers-at-london-luton-airport.html)

pabely

23rd Aug 2019, 19:20

All this chat on the Southend thread about Amazon Cargo, luton with 3 distribution centres nearby, does any amazon come through luton, lease space on DHL or MNG metal?

LTNman

23rd Aug 2019, 19:38

Some of those flights are linked to British Airways.

Also hearing again about long term biz jet parking south of the runway.

pabely

23rd Aug 2019, 19:59

Also hearing again about long term biz jet parking south of the runway.
The is a chunk of land by Someries Castle which was designated ALLV, I think it is known as, area of outstanding natural beauty, or something like that. But so is the park area where T2 would go!

pabely

23rd Aug 2019, 20:07

https://www.exyuaviation.com/2019/08/flybosnia-outlines-europe-service-launch.html

LTNman

23rd Aug 2019, 20:52

The viaduct track base from the station is taking shape, also the trackbed can be seen inside the station.

https://i.imgur.com/A1RUT3l.jpg

Falcon666

24th Aug 2019, 08:13

All this chat on the Southend thread about Amazon Cargo, luton with 3 distribution centres nearby, does any amazon come through luton, lease space on DHL or MNG metal?

Not aware of any now , maybe wrong but during the Amazon German strike I understand ad hoc cargo flights did use the Airport.

On a different topic I see the Government has decided not to call in the original Century Park Plans including the 2Km road .
I know this isn’t the updated expansion plan but I wonder how long it will take to start the construction of this road and bulldozing the buildings in the way. pretty sure the council won’t want to hang around as this will be the basis for the planned expansion.
Also the Vauxhall Way duelling is part of the wider regional plans?

pabely

24th Aug 2019, 11:07

Not aware of any now , maybe wrong but during the Amazon German strike I understand ad hoc cargo flights did use the Airport.

On a different topic I see the Government has decided not to call in the original Century Park Plans including the 2Km road .
I know this isn’t the updated expansion plan but I wonder how long it will take to start the construction of this road and bulldozing the buildings in the way. pretty sure the council won’t want to hang around as this will be the basis for the planned expansion.
Also the Vauxhall Way duelling is part of the wider regional plans?

They wanted to start in 2019, doesn't mean any bulldozers in 2019 but plans can be finalised and contracts signed to do this work.
I think it was part of the wider highway plans, has not £6.2M already be secured for this work?

Spanish eyes

24th Aug 2019, 13:18

There is something very wrong with the planning process when a council sets up its own company which then puts in its own planning application that is then voted through with next to no discussion by a set of councillors who are biased. I was reading in the local paper that one of those councillors who voted it through was on a management committee of a charity that received £860,000 in grants from the company putting in the planning application. Seems he felt he did not need to declare an interest.

To put it into context they voted to destroy one of Luton's largest public parks for council gain while at the same time voting to block a small supermarket on the grounds that it was on a tiny piece of green space that the public can't access.

AirportPlanner1

24th Aug 2019, 15:29

There are three questions to answer.

1. Is it consistent with local and national planning policy?
2. If the same development proposal on the same site had been submitted by an independent private applicant would the outcome likely have been the same?
3. Was proper process followed?

If the answer to 1. AND one or both of 2. and 3. is no, get it challenged in the courts. If not, I’m afraid there is nothing to see.

Spanish eyes

24th Aug 2019, 19:35

1/ The planning permission breached the Local Plan that was only adopted in 2017.
2/I think it is unlikely that any council would vote through the destruction of its own 70 acre park due to a third party application.
3/ Planning permission was granted 2 weeks before the end of the statutory consultation period.

All very dodgy, all very Luton where democracy died many years ago.

pabely

24th Aug 2019, 20:15

https://m.luton.gov.uk/Page/Show/news/Pages/Plans-for-New-Century-Park-approved.aspx?redirectToMobile=True
Wasn't this on the cards last March, as soon as the Gov had no objections, full steam ahead?

Spanish eyes

24th Aug 2019, 20:40

Interesting article full of council bull. For a start Century Park mark 2 and the airport expansion site sit on the same piece of land so which is it? The application was all about putting a road into the local park on the pretence it was for a business park when it was actually for the airport.

The Council is correct in stating that Century Park has had planning permission for over 20 years but that is in the field next door to the park. Instead of creating 3,200 jobs that field has been identified as a site for a long term car park. So much for council job creation. Building a terminal and new aprons will just create low paid work rather than higher paid work a business park would create. Just need to look at the terminal vacancies to see that. Fancy starting work at 4 in the morning or starting a shift that finishes in the early hours or working 24/7 rosters? No, well neither no many other people which is why there are always vacancies.
https://www.london-luton.co.uk/corporate/working-at-lla

Falcon666

24th Aug 2019, 21:02

Lee Baker Street

25th Aug 2019, 00:53

Seriously you think that jobs on a business park pay better than an Airport these days!!.
Not sure if you live/ work around the Airport but I for one , who was born and raised in Luton am glad that the council are trying to invest heavily in its assets.Its about time, Luton has never been the most appealing place with too much negativity.
its a case of damned if they do, damned if they don’t for the council.

I share your sentiments Falcon666. If I had my way the airport would already be handling 32 million passengers a year! Luton Borough Council have been complacent in the past not realising that the airport was a potential money spinner for the town and a fantastic opportunity to make jobs for local people whether they live in Luton or Dunstable and Stevenage and St Albans etc. Many thousands of needed jobs could be created at the airport and in turn play it’s part in addressing the ever expanding aviation industry here in the UK. Not expanding the airport is morally wrong and goes against investment in local infrastructure but more importantly investing in the future for local workers.

LTNman

25th Aug 2019, 07:47

The high paid engineering work is fast disappearing away from Luton with Monarch going bust, Gulfstream moving to Farnborough and Signature stopping aircraft maintenance work.

Clearly jobs will be created at an expanded airport but the proposed new terminal, car parks and aprons will generate in the main low paid work, both zero hour, part time and full time work working 24/7 shift patterns. Airport security staff have only recently ended a strike as LLAOL forced them into new contracts where they got only 9 weekends off per year and were forced to work an extra 15 days per year.

While some here would love to work at the airport most people just want a living wage, doing 9-5 hours with the weekend off. My son did baggage handling at the airport for around 9 months, was stuck on a 20 hour contract working on some days just 4 hours and having to work any hour of the day or night. He would have loved to have worked on a business park but lucky for him he has now broken free from the airport and now works normal hours so he can always watch his beloved football.

The truth is that airport companies with 24/7 shift patterns or 4 am start times struggle to get staff and retain staff on the wages they pay as the work is regarded as shiite by many of the staff doing the work. As pointed out in a previous post you have only to look at the vacancies to see keeping staff is a problem at the airport yet a few here want more of the same as the quality of the job matters little.

https://unitetheunion.org/news-events/news/2019/may/more-strikes-planned-against-heavy-handed-management-at-luton-airport/

boeing_eng

26th Aug 2019, 08:32

Lee Baker Street...Your naive enthusiasm for the over expanding of the airport speaks volumes and I can only assume you are a plane spotter who cares little for the affect this would have on the local residents lives! I've actually worked at the airport for over 30 years and live in Wigmore so can see both sides of the argument. What the locals are now potentially faced with is the almost complete loss of a large community asset (Wigmore Park) and the local residential roads being turned into a primary feeder route for a huge new terminal. This would be unprecedented in the UK! All of this is being proposed by a Council who are being devious and untruthful with the local residents they are elected to represent.

The often used argument about additional jobs is as mentioned by LTNman is a red herring as the decent paid jobs are basically limited to Pilots, ATC staff, Engineers, Fire Fighters and some refueling staff (many don't live in the local area) Almost all the remainder are at best just over minimum wage jobs with a huge turnover....

LTNman

26th Aug 2019, 10:41

dvc

26th Aug 2019, 12:29

The council claims the average employee at the airport earns £36,000 a year yet has produced no evidence to support this figure. Doing a job search shows that no current terminal or apron vacancies are close to £36,000

Ground or gate staff makes Anything between 19k and 23k a year depending on the role . Cleaning staff even less. Security still under 30k. I reckon the 36k average comes from hundreds of pilots based at Luton which technically makes them being employed at Luton Airport.

boeing_eng

26th Aug 2019, 21:53

Ground or gate staff makes Anything between 19k and 23k a year depending on the role . Cleaning staff even less. Security still under 30k. I reckon the 36k average comes from hundreds of pilots based at Luton which technically makes them being employed at Luton Airport

I totally agree.....Its also worth bearing in mind that Pilots and Cabin Crew are mobile and can operate from anywhere. In the case of one airline, their LTN based staff operate a lot of flights from other UK airports (depending on the time of year) If you exclude the pilots, my estimate is that there is no more than 10-15% of airport workers earning over 30K a year!

IDR

27th Aug 2019, 11:34

Don’t forget easyJet HQ is situated at the airport and all staff will be considered airport workers as far as the council is concerned

pabely

27th Aug 2019, 17:06

Don’t forget easyJet HQ is situated at the airport and all staff will be considered airport workers as far as the council is concerned
Easyjet do very little engineering work on site, other than unscheduled work. It is far cheaper to send their aircraft to Eastern Europe or Malta. I'm afraid labour cost is too high in UK, it's not a Luton issue more UK plc. Even Germany is finding itself uncompetitive now and they might be going into recestion. If you ask Lufthansa Tecnik to do work for you they will ask you to send your airplane to one of their centres outside germany.
The days of 9-5 in aviation have long gone I'm afraid. Engineering in the area have spiralled down with BAe gone, Renault Trucks and Vauxhall a shadow of itself, in fact with the french now in control that has got to be a doubt long term.

LGS6753

27th Aug 2019, 18:02

Fly Bosnia on Monday (26AUG19) opened reservation for its planned Sarajevo – London Luton service, scheduled from 24SEP19. Based on the airline’s web booking system, the airline plans to operate this route 3 times a week with Airbus A319.

6W105 SJJ0715 – 0845LTN 319 267
6W106 LTN0945 – 1315SJJ 319 267

Courtesy AirlineRoute.

AirportPlanner1

27th Aug 2019, 19:42

How long until Wizz add Sarajevo?

Falcon666

27th Aug 2019, 20:57

How long until Wizz add Sarajevo?

They have already tried Tuzla and dropped it, maybe there just isn’t the demand to Bosnia Herzegovina.
Looking at the prices Flybosnia are charging it’s certainly not cheap.
Wizz didn’t jump onto the Chisinau route from SEN and take Flyone out , which they could have easily done with their new routes so maybe they haven’t read from the Ryanair book of route management recently.

LTNman

29th Aug 2019, 10:35

Parkway Interchange is having its temporary ground floor ceiling supports removed.
https://i.imgur.com/DxieR6R.jpg

While at the other end the viaduct pillars are receiving beams that will support the track
https://i.imgur.com/GgSe3lq.jpg

At central station the Dart carriage maintenance area is preparing to have more concrete poured
https://i.imgur.com/HJOHtoS.jpg

While part of the station has been dug out parts of it have yet to be started. The maintenance area can be seen in the background.
https://i.imgur.com/OvcRJO2.jpg

The second floor of the new multistory has opened but with lifts still not working people are being employed to carry luggage up this narrow fire escape which is the only route to the car park. The fire escape also looks half finished.
https://i.imgur.com/1orIlIa.jpg

Once passengers reach their cars they are confronted with this. With the car park only open for just over a week the site is very dusty. This car is actually black.
https://i.imgur.com/zgpsf12.jpg

Meanwhile concrete is being poured on the top two floors while cars can be seen parked on the lower floors.
https://i.imgur.com/l74VlW7.jpg

AirportPlanner1

29th Aug 2019, 12:31

They have already tried Tuzla and dropped it, maybe there just isn’t the demand to Bosnia Herzegovina.
Looking at the prices Flybosnia are charging it’s certainly not cheap.
Wizz didn’t jump onto the Chisinau route from SEN and take Flyone out , which they could have easily done with their new routes so maybe they haven’t read from the Ryanair book of route management recently.

Sarajevo is much more widely known and if you’re going to head to Bosnia it’s likely there or Mostar. It’s like saying Zagreb didn’t work out so Split won’t. To be honest I don’t mean it as a spoiler, more natural expansion in the same way they eventually ended up competing with Tarom.

Also worth noting Flyone is peak seasonal so not the same incentive to take them out.

Lee Baker Street

29th Aug 2019, 13:12

ajamieson

29th Aug 2019, 13:19

Sarajevo is much more widely known and if you’re going to head to Bosnia it’s likely there or Mostar
Indeed. Even Banja Luka — a hub for Bosnia's predominant travel method, the bus — makes more sense than Tuzla. But perhaps the airline is getting a better incentive. I hope FlyBosnia does well to SJJ.

LTNman

29th Aug 2019, 15:22

LTNman LLAL are sending out letters to us folk in South Luton. Why do they need confirmation of our interests in any particular land? You are in the know so thought it best to ask you first as you may have received the same letter?

If I was your neighbours I would start getting worried then but it would be ironic if airport expansion directly affected you as it is all about complying with a Development Consent Order which is needed for airport expansion. Sounds like you and your neighbours have been identified as people who are going to suffer under the proposed expansion plans. Might be road traffic blight (unlikely) or more likely extra aircraft noise. Also LLAL have been buying up land in random area's for reasons that are not apparent. Maybe there is a piece of this land near you that is linked to airport expansion. This might seem far fetched in your case but they have bought land in Hertfordshire for a replacement park. This park would be covered by a DCO so Herts County Council could not stop it. Don't know anyone that has received a letter in my neck of the woods but then they might be sending letters out in batches to different areas first.

Read this.
https://www.llal.org.uk/Documents/LR-guidance-sheet.pdf

compton3bravo

29th Aug 2019, 19:11

compton3bravo

29th Aug 2019, 19:33

Over 6,600 pax carried on the Bergen route in its first month, don't know what the yield was of course. Looks like the Castellon service has displaced the Verona which is now not bookable. Prices on the Castellon route seem to be holding up well. Some flights to/from Tromso already sold out.

LTNman

29th Aug 2019, 21:24

,The June and July passenger figures have now been published with July showing nearlyr 1.8 million. The rolling 12 month figure is just shy of 18 million. What was the yearly passenger ceiling allowed?

18 million. Might explain why Wizz are dipping a toe into Southend but then they might have done it anyway.

pabely

30th Aug 2019, 10:14

18 million. Might explain why Wizz are dipping a toe into Southend but then they might have done it anyway.
They had previously reserved slots at Stansted for W19 so on the cards anyhow, would assume Southend made them a better offer!

pabely

31st Aug 2019, 15:23

BlueA330

31st Aug 2019, 15:32

So with Verona and Ljubljana stopping the yields were poor I assume. Lets see how Castellon, Catania, Oslo, Saint Petersburg and Vienna hold up. I believe some capacity reductions at LGW as well, maybe just for winter but signs of it getting tougher!

Verona's figures are higher than Tromo and Ljubijana's didn't look too bad . Interesting that AMS has been going down from it's peak in OCT 18 .With AMS being the number 1 destination , you'd of thought KLM could give it a go

pabely

31st Aug 2019, 16:22

.With AMS being the number 1 destination , you'd of thought KLM could give it a go
They used to have a good relationship with Luton with it being it's No1 diversion preference if problems at LHR but that was the days b4 CAT3B but even if there was money to be made, what would that add to the pax numbers to push it above 18/19M? Didn't Luton have Netherlines, I think at one point, were they owned by KLM?

davidjohnson6

31st Aug 2019, 18:24

Apart from the previously discussed Ljubljana and Verona, the following routes will not be operated by Wizz over the winter season:
Bari, Catania, Tallin, Turku
I don't know if the routes will return for summer 2020 or not

compton3bravo

31st Aug 2019, 19:20

The difference between Tromso and Verona I think was yield. As I said in a previous post some Tromso flights are already sold out and some tour companies seem to be block booking seats on their Northern Lights holidays. Also Stavanger and Moscow start soon as well.

toledoashley

1st Sep 2019, 08:03

Bari and Catania I assume are more slanted to summer leisure routes, would seem odd to operate year round when you could be making more money from flights to the Nordics for the Northern Lights, or more high yielding winter focused destinations.

Falcon666

1st Sep 2019, 10:02

pabely

1st Sep 2019, 12:14

Various cancellations today due to the french ATC problem this morning.
Although the Airport website says the departures are cancelled due to “Protect OTP
Never seen this put into the public domain before- could lead to customers copying the web page and using it for future claims.

When I first read that I thought Protect Bucharest! Not On-Time Performance ;-) The Arrivals does state French ATC which pax might relate to though!

Buster the Bear

1st Sep 2019, 22:31

New Long-Term car park in south Luton with a feed into the DART?

LTNman

2nd Sep 2019, 07:30

3rd multi story for LLAL to be located next to the DART at Parkway but it is meant to be for offices parking. Heard of nothing else but then these plans are getting on a bit.

https://www.llal.org.uk/Documents/Bartlett-Sq-Consultation-Board.pdf

LGS6753

6th Sep 2019, 14:15

Confirmation of Russia flight timings from AirlineRoute:
Wizz Air UK from October 2019 is launching service to Russia, on board Airbus A321 aircraft. From London Luton, the airline plan to operate 1 daily flight each to Moscow and St. Petersburg. Following schedule is effective from 28OCT19, as schedule varies from 01OCT19 to 27OCT19.

London Luton – Moscow Vnukovo eff 01OCT19 1 daily A321
W98125 LTN0650 – 1335VKO 321 D
W98126 VKO1415 – 1515LTN 321 D

London Luton – St. Petersburg eff 01OCT19 1 daily A321
W98123 LTN2225 – 0450+1LED 321 D
W98124 LED0550 – 0620LTN 321 D

Reservation for both routes opened since July 2019.

Falcon666

7th Sep 2019, 22:11

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG0xbBeSveE

Dont know if this has been shown before..( you might have to click on the link)
Note the large MSCP next to Parkway!!
Also there is an interesting article in the September edition of New Civil Engineer about the DART and the challenges in building it- sorry no link.
Coordinating seven separate sites at the same time.The viaduct section only being possible due to an agreement with the Newspaper site to use their land for access.
Problems associated with the tunnel under the taxiway and unknown cables, fears of shutting the Airport down if they cut through critical services.
Evidently the Gateway bridge weighs 1,000t and can only be raised into position with certain cranes due to the proximity of the 08 threshold if in use.

LTNman

8th Sep 2019, 06:54

The video shows 4 multi-stories around Parkway. The existing one, a new one next to it on the same side of the tracks. The one I highlighted the other day for office parking and another one next to the newspaper printers by the Gateway bridge.

pabely

11th Sep 2019, 20:43

In August alone! (https://ukaviation.news/busiest-summer-for-luton-airport-but-wizz-air-uk-drops-routes/)

Falcon666

11th Sep 2019, 20:53

In August alone! (https://ukaviation.news/busiest-summer-for-luton-airport-but-wizz-air-uk-drops-routes/)

5.3 Million in August—really? Better shut the Airport in September as that will have blown the 18Mil limit— Poor reporting again.

Just noticed the Southbound A1081 is closed overnight on the 16th Sept, does that mean the DART bridge is on the move?
Is it ready to go?

LTNman

11th Sep 2019, 21:48

No not yet. One side has yet to have any concrete poured for the track. Also the ski slope has yet to be attached.

compton3bravo

12th Sep 2019, 08:13

Oh dear, not a very good piece of journalism I am afraid. Got to mention Stavanger and Oslo commencing on Monday with Castellon on 1 December operated by Wizz. Plus Fly Bosnia also commencing flights shortly. It grates me personally as I was production manager of a magazine with a similar name for many years and it was drummed into into us by the boss to check and recheck your facts. We all make mistakes but come on 3.1 million in a month!

LGS6753

12th Sep 2019, 14:58

From Airline Route:The following is overall Wizz Air UK A321 operation in winter 2019/20 season, as of 06SEP19:
London Luton – Athens 5 weekly (7 weekly 10DEC19 – 14JAN20)
London Luton – Belgrade 3 weekly (4 weekly 11DEC19 – 17JAN20)
London Luton – Bergen 3 weekly (4 weekly 09DEC19 – 13JAN20)
London Luton – Bourgas 2 weekly
London Luton – Bratislava 4 weekly (5 weekly 11DEC19 – 12JAN20)
London Luton – Constanta 2 weekly (3 weekly 12DEC19 – 14JAN20)
London Luton – Grenoble 2 weekly (From 14DEC19)
London Luton – Kaunas 5 weekly (6 weekly 14DEC19 – 13JAN20)
London Luton – Kosice 5 weekly (7 weekly 13DEC19 – 14JAN20)
London Luton – Larnaca 7 weekly (8-9 weekly from 01JAN20)
London Luton – Lisbon 5 weekly (7 weekly 09DEC19 – 13JAN20)
London Luton – Lublin 4 weekly (8 weekly 11DEC19 – 15JAN20, 5 weekly from 16JAN20)
London Luton – Moscow Vnukovo 1 daily
London Luton – Oslo 5 weekly (7 weekly 11DEC19 – 13JAN20)
London Luton – Palanga 2 weekly (3 weekly 12DEC19 – 14JAN20)
London Luton – Poprad/Tatry 2 weekly
London Luton – Porto 1 weekly (02NOV19 – 07DEC19)
London Luton – Poznan 6 weekly (7 weekly 09DEC19 – 12JAN20)
London Luton – Prague 3 weekly (29OCT19 – 07DEC19)
London Luton – Pristina 1 weekly (01NOV19 – 06DEC19)
London Luton – Reykjavik Keflavik 4 weekly (5 weekly 15DEC19 – 09JAN20)
London Luton – St. Petersburg 7 weekly
London Luton – Stavanger 2 weekly (3 weekly 12DEC19 – 14JAN20)
London Luton – Suceava 1 weekly (until 12JAN20)
London Luton – Szczytno 1 weekly (2 weekly from 13DEC19)
London Luton – Thessaloniki 2 weekly
London Luton – Tirana 5 weekly (7 weekly 11DEC19 – 11JAN20)
London Luton – Tromso 2 weekly (from 09DEC19)
Note - these are W9 only. Does not include W6.
I don't think I've seen mention of Szczytno before.

compton3bravo

12th Sep 2019, 17:47

Szczytno is another name for Olsztyn in North East Poland which Wizz will operate twice weekly through the winter with three weekly flights over the Christmas and New Year period.

Dannyboy39

13th Sep 2019, 17:08

Is there any logic which flights are W9 and W6? Are W6 all flights on aircraft based overseas and visa versa for W9?

pabely

13th Sep 2019, 20:10

Is there any logic which flights are W9 and W6? Are W6 all flights on aircraft based overseas and visa versa for W9?
W9 are usually UK based frames, but a quick search using FR24 shows the odd W6 flight as well. Maybe will become more logical once more G-WUK. come online once Luton can handle the parking overnight in a few years.

Buster the Bear

13th Sep 2019, 20:45

Lufthansa interested in the two ex Monarch hangars.

pabely

13th Sep 2019, 21:27

Lufthansa interested in the two ex Monarch hangars.
Technik rather than the airline I assume, are the engineers still around local though? Technik already run maintenance at Budapest and Debrecen for Wizz so would make sence for Wizz UK as well.

OltonPete

14th Sep 2019, 10:09

Lufthansa interested in the two ex Monarch hangars.

I assume Luton only then.

A definite lack of rumours in respect of the BHX facility.

Pete

LTNman

15th Sep 2019, 14:35

Out of shot the first of the curbstones are being laid in the new drop off area
https://i.imgur.com/mcln7j0.jpg

At the moment there is a large buffer zone between the temporary drop off lanes and the barriers. This will disappear when the drop off barriers move inside the ground floor making the buffer just a few metres. This exit queue would block the new drop off zone but today there was a problem with card payments. This area is set to become a new apron once the road has been moved.
https://i.imgur.com/C00zIDf.jpg

The shell of the ground floor of Parkway Interchange with the steelwork of the track base in the distance. The track will terminate on the first floor in the bays seen in the photo.
https://i.imgur.com/U3PzxjW.jpg

Approach lights on the left with a bridge support on the right.
https://i.imgur.com/XThPW9N.jpg

The original route for Taxiway Bravo has been covered in steel plates. Beyond the plates the route of the tunnel can be see that will be dug out next.
https://i.imgur.com/AuCcktG.jpg

The first completed section of tunnel inside the CTA is being covered up. The dual carriageway will then be moved to pass over the tunnel.
https://i.imgur.com/6PuZP9H.jpg

Looking out from the rear of the DART maintenance area
https://i.imgur.com/0nk2Q9O.jpg

davidjohnson6

18th Sep 2019, 23:28

Every year, as most people reading this know, Ryanair cut some of their worst performing routes so as to maintain strong profitability. I notice that routes from Luton to Girona and Murcia (admittedly seasonal) have yet to go on sale for summer 2020.
Any thoughts as to whether these 2 routes are for the chop, or just that Ryanair are taking their time over schedule planning ?

jfy1999

19th Sep 2019, 07:05

Girona and Murcia aren't currently bookable from any UK airports in S20 (except Stansted)

LGS6753

19th Sep 2019, 08:06

Fly Bosnia have started their new service to Sarajevo today. A trial booking shows 3 pax so far booked on next Tuesday's flight (A319).

Lee Baker Street

19th Sep 2019, 19:31

Fly Bosnia have started their new service to Sarajevo today. A trial booking shows 3 pax so far booked on next Tuesday's flight (A319).

Your comment reminded me, and took me back to 1995 in which Luton based airlines then claimed EasyJet would not survive! But all these years later both those Luton based airlines disappeared from the scene and Easyjet continues to grow! The point I am making is that any new routes may seem pointless and passenger levels are low on inauguration but change could result in any new airline being successful!

LTNman

19th Sep 2019, 20:53

1995 was a long time ago but I saw in the first Easyjet from Scotland. Seemed to remember it was full but it was being heavily promoted as flying for the price of a pair of jeans.

The first failure of a letting inside the new departure lounge extension has happened. The swanky Dubl bar which was a sort of champagne bar has shut. Food and drink outlets seem to do quiet well at Luton but this one was a little too upmarket. I would imagine some of the classy shops will be the next to go but we will have to wait and see unless a random sale generates enough profit to pay the overheads.

racedo

21st Sep 2019, 17:16

Luton Airport arrivals make no mention of EU coming up to border agency. Its UK plus other countries with flags with EU excluded. The only mention to go into machine lane was the symbol for auto reading passports but all signs were UK and then Other Passports.

pabely

22nd Sep 2019, 16:35

Lufthansa Technik seem to be a sure thing for the ex Monarch hangers, adverts for engineers to work on Wizz aircraft.

compton3bravo

23rd Sep 2019, 16:52

Wizz to commence twice weekly flights to Tenerife on 16 November increasing to three weekly the following month filling the gap left by Ryanair.

ericlday

23rd Sep 2019, 17:10

Wizz to commence twice weekly flights to Tenerife on 16 November increasing to three weekly the following month filling the gap left by Ryanair.

Ryanair are still operating from Luton to Tenerife winter time Wed/Sun, Wizz Tue/Sat

compton3bravo

23rd Sep 2019, 18:01

Thanks Eric for putting me right. Interesting development though.

1sky

25th Sep 2019, 18:13

LLA recently downsized the route development team. Reason given is that no substantial growth is expected before 2022-2023.

Rather odd I find.

pabely

25th Sep 2019, 18:40

LLA recently downsized the route development team. Reason given is that no substantial growth is expected before 2022-2023.
Rather odd I find.
I assume the 18M ~ 19M cap will be raised by then. With Wizz upsizing to 321s and Ezy to more 320/321s then pax will rise anyhow.
A period of consolidation before the next period of expansion.
How meny were in the team anyhow?

Falcon666

25th Sep 2019, 18:41

LLA recently downsized the route development team. Reason given is that no substantial growth is expected before 2022-2023.

Rather odd I find.

With the Airport reaching its current maximum Passenger limit of 18 Million ( Maybe 19 Million) I guess it’s pretty understandable. Most route development seems to be carried out by the three big Lo Co’s themselves.
Although I can’t get my head around some of the Wizz strategy.

On a different topic I see that at long last the new ticket desks are being worked on and due to open in a few weeks.
Tender is in for a Artisan bar serving craft beers in Landside- wondered how long it would be before alcohol was available again landside and a pharmacy style outlet is also planned.

Talking to one of the contractors it appears the late opening of the second MSCP is likely to put the DART back by three months at present.

LTNman

26th Sep 2019, 17:25

The council is getting the airport operator to put in gradual increase planning applications at 1 million per application to 22.5 million passengers as this can be achieved within the exiting boundary. This is why there is a tender out to add 6 stands. The airport operator is claiming the extra stands are part of the original planning permission for 18 million but were never built when clearly it is not the case.

Honesty is something both the airport operator and the council struggle with as they try to hoodwink the public, opposition groups and other councils.

Tender is in for a Artisan bar serving craft beers in Landside- wondered how long it would be before alcohol was available again landside and a pharmacy style outlet is also planned.

There were plans to add a couple of market stalls landslide so maybe one of those will sell beer.

Talking to one of the contractors it appears the late opening of the second MSCP is likely to put the DART back by three months at present.

The Dart is 3 months behind schedule because it was started 3 months late and has nothing to do with the second multi-storey. It is now due to open in the Autumn of 2021 rather than the summer.

pabely

26th Sep 2019, 18:23

I see the council are wanting to convert the roundabout at Hitchin Road, Vauxhall Way and Stopsley Road into a light controlled T junction. Help airport traffic?
And a South East St.Albans group against aircraft noise say Heathrow is more of a problem than Luton!

LTNman

26th Sep 2019, 18:45

Those with long memories will recall traffic lights at the bottom of the old airport approach road and inside the CTA.

The plan will eventually allow for a dual carriageway to run from Hitchin Road to Kimpton Road but traffic heading for Hitchin Road will be blocked by traffic heading for Luton and Stockingstone Road so will achieve nothing for traffic heading for the A1M

Buster the Bear

26th Sep 2019, 20:06

Luton to India?

The Airports Authority of India (AAI) is in discussions with Central and European LCC Wizz Air (https://atwonline.com/airline-financials/wizz-air-swings-profit-1q-25-revenue-boost) on plans to use longer-range Airbus aircraft to connect airports in western and northern India.

“Hungary based LCC @wizzair is ready to acquire [Airbus] A320XLRs for expansion (https://atwonline.com/airports-routes/wizz-air-expands-capacity-poland) of their services. They held a meeting with #AAI & expressed interest in connecting Indian cities by 2021. Proposal have been given for connecting airports in western & northern India at first,” Airports Authority of India said Sept. 23 via its official Twitter account.

AAI said the meeting took place at World Routes 2019, which is being held in Adelaide.

Wizz Air has been growing rapidly (https://atwonline.com/airports-routes/wizz-air-expands-capacity-poland), but its operations have been historically limited to Central and European routes. Wizz Air has a strict ultra-LCC focus and is not currently active in India.

Responding to an ATW request for comment, a Wizz Air spokeswoman said: “Wizz Air continually reviews its routes, bases and opportunities to expand to ensure that we are meeting our passengers’ needs, and will announce these as they happen. The A321XLR is one of the most cost-efficient aircraft available in the market and with its enhanced range capability, represents a significant opportunity for Wizz Air to further expand our network.”

Wizz Air committed to 20 A321XLRs (https://atwonline.com/paris-air-show-2019/paris-2019-airbus-a321xlr-wins-50-strong-indigo-partners-mou) at this year’s Paris Air Show, via a MOU for 50 of the long-range narrowbodies, signed by US private-equity firm and Wizz Air shareholder Indigo Partners.

Indigo has major stakes in four ultra-LCCs—US-based Frontier Airlines, Chile-based JetSmart, Mexico-based Volaris and Hungary-based Wizz Air.

“We are anxious to see the airplane in service. It expands the network opportunity for our carriers dramatically and that’s important strategically to the airlines relative to the market and the competition,” Indigo managing partner Bill Franke (https://atwonline.com/airlines/atw-s-excellence-leadership-william-bill-franke) said at the Paris signing ceremony in June. “As we looked at the XLR and the opportunity it would provide to the network of these three carriers, we became convinced this was the aircraft that we needed to add to the portfolio.”
The A321XLR (https://atwonline.com/paris-air-show-2019/paris-2019-airbus-launches-a321xlr-alc-commits-27), which was launched on the opening day of this year’s Paris Air Show, has a range of around 8,700 km, 15% greater than the A321LR. Depending on cabin configuration, it can carry up to 244 passengers.

At the time, Wizz CEO József Váradi said the XLR gives the Central and Eastern Europe airline an opportunity to extend its network.

“If you look at our network, it spans the Canary Islands to Astana [Nur-Sultan], Reykjavik to Dubai. It’s a huge geography and we believe the XLR will bring unique opportunities to extend the operating model.”

Victoria Moores [email protected]

Falcon666

26th Sep 2019, 20:34

The Dart is 3 months behind schedule because it was started 3 months late and has nothing to do with the second multi-storey. It is now due to open in the Autumn of 2021 rather than the summer.

If that is the case then why have they opened the second MSCP in the state it is?
He( Project coordinator, I think) stated that the mid term Car Park section should have been handed over at the end of July when the MSCP was due to be finished.
As a result it is likely to push the opening date back to Winter 2021 , I guess only time will tell.

LTNman

27th Sep 2019, 07:51

The work definitely started at least 3 months late, I am thinking it was actually 6 months late. Work is started in the order of complexity and time to achieve completion. The route through the midterm car park involves no cut and cover tunnel but a trough. Remember that part of the tunnel inside the CTA has not even been started yet and the route across Taxiway Bravo is only now being piled with sheeting. I find it hard to believe that the trough will be the last piece of the jigsaw to be completed and will delay the project.

This is the original time line and shows project dates although I have cut off the year and shows it as a 4 year 9 month project that was meant to have started in May 2018 after enabling work. It never did and was late summer before it was started. The time line shows an opening date of April 2021, it then became the summer of 2021 and now it is the Autumn.
https://i.imgur.com/Ng7qdGU.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/GM67dVE.jpg
Orange is the trough
https://i.imgur.com/mbG0AAb.jpg

ClearLand08

27th Sep 2019, 16:36

Details of the proposal have been added to the planning website. New six-pack between the engine run up bay and long term car park. The run-up bay also modified a little to allow 2 overnight stands. Application refers to requiring more space for GA parking - so I wonder if when this is built some other stands (perhaps the pond) would go back to GA use full time? It also states would have no impact on existing 18mppa limit. But as LTNman pointed out, there is already a separate application in to increase that to 19mppa - so a bit of smoke and mirrors going on here.

This is the plan which I have crudely overlaid on to latest satellite image.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/707x491/vwxchhr_bd5df4af6c7aa85c691793b3b5f1affaf29b9766.jpg

seer557

27th Sep 2019, 16:43

Falcon666

27th Sep 2019, 19:45

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1500x2000/47988b36_400c_463d_af3c_85dbcda81a64_7f2c65713ec23b292e2647f c980b6d66de99c1a6.png

Falcon666

27th Sep 2019, 19:48

Are there any mock/ups - artists impressions of how the interchange between DART and Luton Airport Parkway is going to look? Current lifts will not cope with the planned throughput. Neither will the escalators given how often they break down.

Found this , it may help. basically initially the entrance will be via the current walkway over the Platforms until the second phase is built with escalators from all platforms to an enlarged Dart station.
LTNman will probably have better images.

LTNman

27th Sep 2019, 20:29

Work has started on behalf of Network Rail to build the new platform bridge which is shown as stage 2a. Don't think they can start stage 2c until the the Dart is open as there would not be a passenger route to Kimpton Road as stage 2C would block it.

Also am I the only person to notice on my construction update post 2863 that there are no holes on the first floor for lifts, escalators and staircases?

1st Floor
https://i.imgur.com/GnyqNzB.jpg

From the Kimpton Road entrance
https://i.imgur.com/9zufCpK.jpg

Falcon666

27th Sep 2019, 20:48

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x532/192c01f5_0b50_4e39_b386_e162de15006d_48575828e8daadb9f50e6d1 524b839872d04e9d7.jpeg
The escalators shown in the artists impression are to the left of the lift shaft shown at the front of the photo
The artists impression above is shown far back by the entrance from the platforms

LTNman

27th Sep 2019, 21:26

Also noted that there are three sections of reinforcing rods sticking out of first floor for the building to continue but how will they put in escalators in this phase of building as they take up quite a bit of room and must allow for access from the left and the right

ajamieson

27th Sep 2019, 21:37

LTN will be a very solid proposition in 18 months' time, for budget airline customers. The terminal now matches or betters STN but is much closer with far better onward connections. The final 'hurrah' will be the end of the wretched bus connection with its fiddly cash charge and miserable staff. (They should just make it a free shuttle and stick 50p on the train fares, the improved feedback scores would be well worth the cost).
4 car service !? Back to the 1990s. And yes there isn't much luggage space. I think it's only 30mins on the standard Thameslink trains so a bit puzzled as to the advantages of an 'express'. But 4 car trains better not have any other station stops!
Indeed, I am puzzled as to why they want an Express-branded service now, just months after the introduction of a new timetable that gives Luton Airport a fantastic spread of fast, direct services into several key London stations on spacious new 8 or 12-carriage trains (with plenty of luggage space, albeit uncomfortable seats). The advantages of the Luton Express will be even more marginal than the Gatwick Express, which runs trains that are mostly empty except for the odd tourist or expense-account customer who knows no better.
Same kind of Dilemma going south at Victoria where you can get the Southern or the Gatwick express. My guess is airport passengers will naturally gravitate to the 'express' service as they do at Gatwick, without realising the same TOC operates a far cheaper 2 stop service, its just painted green and has a different platform.Yes, although the Southern and GatEx platforms are virtually side by side at both ends so you can easily compare the next few departures and weigh the cost of the 'faster' express. At St Pancras it's a 5-minute walk with luggage and two sets of escalators/stairs between the different platform areas and each areachas indicator boards that ignore the other so you can't find the next train except by checking apps on your phone. That makes it much easier to con people into the express service while ignoring the existence of a perfectly good (and presumably much cheaper) alternative two floors below.

seer557

28th Sep 2019, 16:42

Thanks Falcon.

Seer

LTNman

28th Sep 2019, 21:22

Yes, although the Southern and GatEx platforms are virtually side by side at both ends so you can easily compare the next few departures and weigh the cost of the 'faster' express. At St Pancras it's a 5-minute walk with luggage and two sets of escalators/stairs between the different platform areas and each areachas indicator boards that ignore the other so you can't find the next train except by checking apps on your phone. That makes it much easier to con people into the express service while ignoring the existence of a perfectly good (and presumably much cheaper) alternative two floors below.

At the moment apart from group save tickets which are restricted to Thameslink passengers, travellers can use either the existing non stop East Midland train service or travel on the 6 Thameslink trains per hour which call directly at many other London stations as the ticket allows for either company to be used and all for a single price regardless of which principle London station is used.

I have to say that when using the East Midland train from St Pancras no sooner have I sat down I have arrived after a 22 minute journey. Compare that with the Stansted Express which takes I think around 50 minutes or the Southend all station stopper service which no doubt seems like 50 days, the Luton Dart will be a game changer for the airport.

I have the expectation that when the East Midland Railway service is doubled and particularly when it gets Express branding there will be a price premium to pay and that the airport will get a cut for allowing their name to be used. Also there is no certainty that for passengers travelling to the airport that they won't have to queue to buy a second ticket for the Dart if they buy a ticket for Luton Airport Parkway and not Luton Airport which happens now. With the Dart costing £225 million and with an annual maintenance contract and operating costs to pay someone will have to pick up the bill.

Article here about funding
https://stoplae.org/the-dart-link-luton-council-paying-225-million/

davidjohnson6

28th Sep 2019, 22:05

ExpectmorePayless

28th Sep 2019, 23:18

Forgive my asking - but is there spare capacity on the railway line between Luton and St Pancras to run extra trains ?
If spare capacity does not exist, then does the Thameslink service by necessity have to see a reduced service ?
There are currently 5 EMR express trains per hour from St Pancras on the MML and this will increase to 6 once the line to Corby is electrified.
Corby is currently served hourly using a 4 or 5 car diesel unit. This will increase to half hourly using 8 or 12 car electric multiple units and it is these units which will provide the non-stop airport express service.
The units are currently in use on semi-fast commuter services on the East Anglia mainline from London Liverpool St, but will be refurbished prior to entering service with EMR.
Thameslink services will remain relatively unchanged, although certain peak time express services may be rescheduled to accommodate the 6 EMR expresses per hour.

ajamieson

29th Sep 2019, 12:30

So the express-branded operation will be a premium-price service on half-hourly old trains that are actually bound for Corby, whereas Thameslink will continue with a much more frequent and cheaper service downstairs? I'll stick to Thameslink (some of the Thameslink trains only make one stop so are just as quick as EMR.)

The Dart cost will surely be built into the rail ticket price. Charging separately (twice) would negate any of the benefit.

LTNman

29th Sep 2019, 17:04

No firm evidence of a premium price service but airport express normally means an excuse for a premium.

Passengers buying a return ticket from the terminal will have the Dart price included but passengers buying a return to Luton will surely be as now with the option to buy a ticket to Parkway or buy a ticket to the airport via the Dart. Many passengers just buy a ticket to Parkway in ignorance not knowing they can buy a through ticket as the airport is shown with a dotted line to it. I can't see how the same price can be charged for Parkway and the Airport unless the Dart was free but then how does the council get back its £225 million? If an additional price was built into any ticket to Parkway to cover the optional Dart then that would be unacceptable to any commuter who starts their journey from Parkway each day as they would be paying for the Dart and not using it.

The tap through oyster card should be working next year which will speed things up for many passengers.

avicon13

30th Sep 2019, 08:41

LTNman

30th Sep 2019, 10:16

The Gateway bridge, which is being assembled opposite the Ibis hotel, is receiving the supports for its LED lit launch pad. The lattice work are temporary structures to support the roof. If Luton had a full set of approach lights at the 08 end this bridge would be by the side of the approach lighting so not sure how they got away with adding a decorative ski jump. As can also be seen the concrete trackbed has been laid on either side. I would love to know how much the finished bridge will weigh and what sort of cranes will be used to lift it and even will the runway close for the night?
https://i.imgur.com/kaM02tv.jpg

The drop off zone is being laid out but work has yet to start on the approach roads leading to it.
https://i.imgur.com/O9RRwq8.jpg

Those with short memories that go back a year will remember the disaster of the drop off zone where central station is being built. The traffic would queue back past Parkway because of four pedestrian crossings with one in particular causing most of the problems as there was a never ending stream of passengers crossing the road. The new layout has 5 pedestrian crossings although 2 routes in will merge into one before spreading out for the pay barriers. The old zone had one route in. Can't help but think it will all end in tears again.
https://i.imgur.com/sSJxIw2.jpg

Worth noting the top floor of the new multi story. With the beams sticking out of the top floor and with a full set of holes to add plates it looks like the new multi story could gain further floors at a later date if required.
https://i.imgur.com/EB1cyD3.jpg

The finished section of tunnel inside CTA continues to be buried.
https://i.imgur.com/OhJuz4k.jpg

Piling is taking place across taxiway Bravo
https://i.imgur.com/AByzQc8.jpg

LTNman

30th Sep 2019, 10:42

Wizz to Russia starts today
https://i.imgur.com/ZRF55bl.jpg

racedo

30th Sep 2019, 13:23

Wizz to Russia

Keep clean mind or get locked out from another part of the forum :O

Good luck to them.

davidjohnson6

30th Sep 2019, 15:13

Does anyone know how FlyBosnia are *actually* doing on their new Luton-Sarajevo route ? Some sort of idea of how many revenue-paying pax there are on average would be interesting to know

It's been running now for almost 2 weeks. As mentioned by LGS6753, the seat map on the airline website indicates a disappointing story but I'm wondering whether that just reflects how many people have chosen to pay prior to check-in for a specific seat or whether it really is a proxy for load factor. The FlyBosnia website doesn't seem to have an online checkin facility, which makes me think reserved seats on the website seatmap for new bookings is unlikely to be a good indicator of load factor

I know that Wizz dropped their Tuzla route in autumn 2017 - when I flew on it load factor was good but average fare was very low. I know that Sarajevo airport charges high fees (hence why Wizz use Tuzla) but am wondering whether the 3h30 bus ride might push Saraejvan residents into using Sarajevo airport

compton3bravo

30th Sep 2019, 15:45

Sorry to be pedantic LTNman but the Moscow and St. Petersburg flights commence tomorrow the 1st October. Also are the night restrictions lifted from tomorrow?

LTNman

30th Sep 2019, 17:13

Restrictions should end tomorrow or is that Midnight tonight? As for Wizz and Russia, I was wondering if the props had come out a day early but I was too lazy to check.

compton3bravo

30th Sep 2019, 17:37

No problem and on behalf of everybody on this forum many thanks for the photos of the construction works.

Lee Baker Street

30th Sep 2019, 18:26

Whilst sat in a beer garden in central Luton this afternoon I observed a Air Caraïbes A330 possibly 300 series? climbing*out from LTN. Was it a repatriation flight bringing back Thomas Cook passengers?*

pamann

30th Sep 2019, 18:31

nt639

30th Sep 2019, 18:48

Looks like it was F1 related as came in from Sochi

compton3bravo

30th Sep 2019, 19:10

Yes it was an A330-300 on a F1 flight from Sochi along with the Titan B767 and an Alitalia A321 late on Sunday night.

pabely

30th Sep 2019, 20:46

Restrictions should end tomorrow or is that Midnight tonight? As for Wizz and Russia, I was wondering if the props had come out a day early but I was too lazy to check.
NOTAM has night time restrictions until 26th October, I believe.

LTNman

1st Oct 2019, 05:05

Notam does indeed say October 26th but Signature still says September 30th 2019

https://www.signatureflight.com/events/london-luton-airport-temporary-noise-closures

PAXboy

2nd Oct 2019, 12:17

I'm sure this question has been asked before but: Will there be a Park n Ride option on the Dart?

LTNman

2nd Oct 2019, 14:10

Wouldn't think so initially as the existing multi story is one side of the track and and the Dart the other. Plans show multi story car parks on the Dart side but not yet.

pabely

2nd Oct 2019, 19:51

Notam does indeed say October 26th but Signature still says September 30th 2019

https://www.signatureflight.com/events/london-luton-airport-temporary-noise-closures
I think a Vistajet arrived in the early hours yesterday before 6AM so perhaps the NOTAM is to scare but not without some prior arrangements.

pabely

3rd Oct 2019, 16:51

I think a Vistajet arrived in the early hours yesterday before 6AM so perhaps the NOTAM is to scare but not without some prior arrangements.
And some more between midnight and 6AM yesterday so looks like the NOTAM is not set in stone anymore.

LTNman

4th Oct 2019, 10:30

You tube search of "Drone tracks dart route Luton Airport"

Summer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lu2N-v_Jdn0

2 weeks ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9EI82LlYlo

pabely

5th Oct 2019, 07:46

MAEL training facility sold to British School of Aviation from the receiver. Be nice to see the facility up and running again.

LTNman

7th Oct 2019, 10:32

The Dart Gateway bridge has received its upper structure aided by 3 temporary support columns. On its right hand side scaffolding has started to be erected. The bridge will be back lit in LED lighting.
https://i.imgur.com/UA1wvLj.jpg

Behind the Airbus the temporary location of the bridge can be seen
https://i.imgur.com/3kWEJp5.jpg

Last week I mentioned and provided the plan for the internal road network of the new drop off zone and my thoughts about 5 sets of pedestrian crossings when it was pedestrian crossings that caused massive traffic queues in a previous drop off zone. Those with long memories will remember the traffic lights that were installed on the CTA roundabout and the queues they caused.

As can be seen on close examination the first three sets of traffic lights are being installed inside the drop off area. Looks like each crossing will be covered by traffic lights that are pedestrian controlled as there are panels at chest height for pressing . Is this really going to work and keep traffic moving?
https://i.imgur.com/RlzHdcf.jpg

The exit route from the drop off zone and the original multi-story which feels like driving through a canyon.The new multi-story exit ramp can be seen on the left.

The only commissioned lift in the new multi-storey has now broken down with the airport employing people to carry luggage to the first and second floors.
https://i.imgur.com/CCxKXC9.jpg

Work is now taking place to remove the embankment to taxiway Bravo
https://i.imgur.com/KmNUkuN.jpg

Two Wizz pass each other using Delta and new taxiway Foxtrot. After the Wizz passed resurfacing vehicles started work on Delta which can be seen queuing for airside access.
https://i.imgur.com/nf5oVzM.jpg

Falcon666

7th Oct 2019, 14:41

The Photo above of the Drop Off area is somewhat different to the diagram in Post 2898.
There were concerns about the current cul de sac drop off area but that has been fairly successful so let’s hope somebody has done their homework on this layout.
Maybe they can sequence the traffic lights to prevent congestion.
Looking forward to seeing how it pans out.

See the Gateway Bridge will move to its final resting place at the end of November and it does weigh over 1000 tonnes.

LTNman

7th Oct 2019, 15:29

The Photo above of the Drop Off area is somewhat different to the diagram in Post 2898.

Looks the same to me. 2 entry lanes and 5 drop off lanes that sweep back parallel to the multi story exit ramp before arriving at the pay barriers.

Seems the access route to the original multi story will follow the existing route with the car hire centre filling the gap that will one day become a new apron.

The Gateway upper structure starts off as a flattish tube before ending up as a blade. Also the whole bridge is curved.
https://i.imgur.com/xA1DRfG.jpg

Falcon666

7th Oct 2019, 17:22

Looks the same to me. 2 entry lanes and 5 drop off lanes that sweep back parallel to the multi story exit ramp before arriving at the pay barriers.

I was thinking more of the location of the walkway crossings , three are shown on the left side nearest the main exit to the terminal in the original diagram.
A bit difficult to see in the Photo but it looks like only one crossing on the left and the others further in where the lights are located parallel (about 15mtrs from the left)
Might just be old age affecting the eyes

ClearLand08

7th Oct 2019, 20:04

Installing traffic lights with traditional pedestrian crossings in the drop off zone has to be amongst the most stupid ideas the airport has had. I completely agree with LTNman that this will end in tears. It gives me no pleasure to say it, but it will be a complete disaster. The current system works mainly because traffic does not have to give way to pedestrians so there is a constant flow. I don't know why they didn't try to replicate that in the new zone. The distance to the pay barriers also provides a buffer against backlog there - this will also be lost.

The current system could be improved even further with a simple number plate reader and some simple flow rate logic. The number plate reader would be used to direct the first 15 cars to the farthest zone first, next 15 to next zone zone and so on. This would reduce the number of cars having to give way to other cars arriving and going to the farthest zones - which happens when the closest zones are filled up first. Even if half of drivers ignored the direction it would still be an improvement.

pabely

11th Oct 2019, 09:52

Well that's timely https://www.itv.com/news/anglia/2019-10-11/proposed-expansion-of-luton-airport-moves-to-next-stage/

Spanish eyes

11th Oct 2019, 16:19

Captain_Caveman

11th Oct 2019, 18:47

Complete rubbish that this is a consultation where the public have any input. Their claim of creating 16,000 jobs is bull and the jobs that will be created will be low paid work in the main on shift patterns no one wants to work.

Anyone knowing all the facts will know that the airport own land that has had planning permission for a business park for 20 years but instead of creating 1000’s of 9 to 5 jobs they want to use the land to build a car park. No mention of that in their statements.

so how many jobs will be created then Spanish eyes ? It’s very easy to dismiss something without providing any valid reasons why! I for one am in favour of the expansion... a whole range of jobs will be very welcome. The world isn’t run on a Monday to Friday 9-5 timetable any more ! Plenty of people like to work hours that are not classed as traditional. A 24 hr operation requires multiple times as many people to staff a position as a traditional 9-5 role with two days off at the weekend. Add in the construction jobs, the support jobs away from the airport and the spending that these people bring to the area and it will all add up.

davidjohnson6

11th Oct 2019, 19:36

FlyBosnia reported to be having a few issues...having a little difficulty with the fees at their home base airport, Sarajevo, and thinking of moving operations to either Mostar or Tuzla

pabely

11th Oct 2019, 20:42

Anyone knowing all the facts will know that the airport own land that has had planning permission for a business park for 20 years but instead of creating 1000’s of 9 to 5 jobs they want to use the land to build a car park. No mention of that in their statements.
What 9-5 jobs, there is loads of office space around the town waiting for these employees? It is the support jobs which will come which will attract more companies to the area and thus generate these such jobs. You don't think those high tech well paid jobs between the M4 & M40 were attracted by the parks around Windsor!

pabely

11th Oct 2019, 20:50

FlyBosnia reported to be having a few issues...having a little difficulty with the fees at their home base airport, Sarajevo, and thinking of moving operations to either Mostar or Tuzla
Wizzair have always had issues at high cost Sarajevo, Tuzla will put them in line of fire with Wizzair but Mostar has no direct London route

Spanish eyes

11th Oct 2019, 22:06

What 9-5 jobs, there is loads of office space around the town waiting for these employees? It is the support jobs which will come which will attract more companies to the area and thus generate these such jobs. You don't think those high tech well paid jobs between the M4 & M40 were attracted by the parks around Windsor!

Luton is no Heathrow. Companies are not going to relocate to Luton so their employees can fly to Ibiza for a business trip. A look around the terminal will find few suits with the majority of passengers being Eastern Europeans. Also suggest you google Luton Airport jobs and see what is on offer. Luton is great for part time or zero hour work on minimum wage rates but quality jobs will be hard to find. Finally there are very few workers who look forward to 24/7 shift pattens which is one reason why there is a high turnover of staff.

AirportPlanner1

12th Oct 2019, 07:04

Wizzair have always had issues at high cost Sarajevo, Tuzla will put them in line of fire with Wizzair but Mostar has no direct London route

How are the loads on the Sarajevo route? Mostar is where the tourists want to go so could actually work better for them

22/04

12th Oct 2019, 07:56

Luton is no Heathrow. Companies are not going to relocate to Luton so their employees can fly to Ibiza for a business trip

Sorry to be negative about Luton but that might be the case - but the Oxford Cambridge Arc will provide Luton with catchment. Stansted perhaps will take at the eastern end but the government wants many new homes between Bedford and Milton Keynes.

However on the other hand one could argue that with climate change air travel may have peaked and ask whether London needs more capacity.

davidjohnson6

12th Oct 2019, 09:09

How are the loads on the Sarajevo route? Mostar is where the tourists want to go so could actually work better for them

Unverified reports on the web that load factor has been very disappointing. However the route started on 24-Sep, ie only 3 weeks ago, so need to wait a while before reliable stats are published

A few years ago there were regular scheduled flights to Mostar from Rome and with Mistral Air on a 737 - I think it was 2x weekly in summer. Even with all the Catholic pilgrims, this route didn't get that many pax outside peak pilgrimage periods - I suspect most passengers travelled on air charters or travelled, at least in part, by land - eg from Dubrovnik or Split

Yes, the Catholic population in the UK has increased in the last 20 years, but the numbers are nothing like those in Italy. Tangney Tours are a UK travel agency who are heavily involved in taking Catholics on pilgrimages are focussed primarily on Lourdes. They offer Medjugorje but it's a long way down the list of top destinationd

The Bosnian diaspora in Europe is centred on Germany, Austria and various countries in the western Balkans. The UK is unlikely to see a large amount of VFR traffic to Bosnia (at least at profitable air fares) as Wizz found out in 2017

LTNman

12th Oct 2019, 11:45

The truth is that airlines have not exactly been queuing up to fly out of Luton. Also the airport has found no new markets since the opening up of Eastern Europe apart from Israel. That could all change with the Dart but the airport has a long history of promising much but building cheap. Would a second terminal have air bridges for example?

davidjohnson6

12th Oct 2019, 13:16

LTNman - playing devil's advocate, are there any particular markets that you think LTN should be targetting ?
Note to those who come up with ideas - please be realistic ! :-)

LGS6753

12th Oct 2019, 14:07

DJ6 -

I'll try to be realistic.
Whenever I go to Gatwick in summer, I see lots of flights to Greek islands not served from Luton. If there is demand from Gatwick, surely there is from Luton, although overall capacity will be limited.
I'm also struck by the paucity of flights to secondary holiday areas - Morocco, the Azores, Porto Santo, Egypt. All are within operational range, but the market must be limited to these places.
It's interesting that Wizzair have opened a number of Scandinavian routes. Time will tell as to the success of these, but if these can work, perhaps others can too.

CAP A330

12th Oct 2019, 21:43

Flybosnia has average 25 pax. Their flights aren’t cheap.

Why would TUI even consider flying from Luton next year since a majority of their flights can’t take off on time. Same problem with RYR ATH at 08:00, always leaving late due to slot. Surprised RYR haven’t cut it, maybe the delay doesn’t affect the late afternoon flight.

Luton doesn’t want long turnaround times hogging stand space. They are happy with 25 and 30 mins as WZZ,EZY and RYR are doing. Unless wiz can do 30 mins turnaround on transatlantic or Middle East flights, it’s not happening.

LTNman

13th Oct 2019, 05:31

TUI has almost pulled Luton from its programme so the question is why? Delays at Luton are similar to Gatwick so there are other reasons like a lack of demand. Charter flights showed another drop from 429,504 in 2017 to 358,811 for 2018, which is around 10% of what Luton has had in the past. 19 new routes came in 2017 and 33 in 2018 but all those routes came from Luton’s existing airlines with no new airlines coming to Luton despite the efforts of a dedicated marketing team which is now being cut back.

As I said before the Dart will be a game changer but new markets are not in Europe but further afield and Luton has a success rate of zero in those markets.

Personally I don’t support expanding the airport. There always has to be a balance between those living under flight paths or living close to the airport and those that demand air travel as long as the aircraft don’t fly over their homes.

From a selfish point of view it is good to see Southend starting to do well. They might be a smaller player but they are getting their passengers from somewhere and it might help contain Luton’s aspersions.

Dannyboy39

13th Oct 2019, 11:45

Having used both LGW and LTN extensively over the last year, I can definitely say delays are not the same between both airports, although that said I think FR do a far better job in scheduling than EZY; one captain of the latter once described the schedule as "optimistic" - the former do seem to pad out back at base.

LGW squeeze every second out of their runway and fair play to the controllers who manage this - but one small delay has potentially long knock on delays. In comparison, it's rare to even have to go into a hold at LTN. If LTN goes up to 30m+ a year, delays will increase.

You can't do the third trip of the day, in the summer season on simply 40 minute T/As or less. It doesn't work - one small delay knocks on for the rest of the day. Add in a stormy day with reduced flow rate into London TMA and aircraft just can't get in without having 1-2 hour delays if you miss the slot even by a few minutes. EZY at LGW must have cancelled 1000s of flights over this summer.

davidjohnson6

14th Oct 2019, 16:27

FlyBosnia now reducing flights on Luton-Sarajevo from 3x weekly to 2x weekly

LTNman

15th Oct 2019, 10:32

A temporary entrance to the new drop off area is being created by using the last drop off lane of the old zone as an access route.
https://i.imgur.com/2nMqgnJ.jpg

It seems the new drop off area will have 4 sets of traffic lights all at one end and not 5. I assume these will guard all the pedestrian crossings so one less is being put in compared to published plans. Each set of lights has a pedestrian controlled button to change the lights to red.
https://i.imgur.com/j0JMBnb.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/VQ29dst.jpg

At the other end 8 pay barriers have been installed but one set is outside the confines of the building. This is the same number as now but the new arrangement does not have a buffer zone between the drop off area and the pay zone.
https://i.imgur.com/cK6V84g.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/aN7I3sQ.jpg

The Dart maintenance area has had its floor laid and has had its wall support jacks removed.
https://i.imgur.com/1PWF5Qu.jpg

Work has started on realigning the dual carriageway inside the CTA so it passes over the Dart tunnel.
https://i.imgur.com/NAdYTwM.jpg

PAXboy

15th Oct 2019, 11:01

LTNman

15th Oct 2019, 18:03

Pedestrian controlled crossings
No buffer zone before pay
One must hope for a good cross breeze as the diesel and petrol fumes could build up rapidly, especially when there is a backlog to get through and out the pay barrier

Well, I'm sure they know what they are doing.

Do you really think so? I have lost count of all the different drop off zone designs in the last few years. None of them have worked apart from the current model.

This was the crossing point across the old bus station and shows just arriving passengers crossing the road. Departing passengers at that time went in a different direction.
https://i.imgur.com/wOysPok.jpg

PAXboy

15th Oct 2019, 20:11

Sorry LTNman forgot to add :rolleyes: :ugh:

LGS6753

16th Oct 2019, 08:55

A fair number of flights in the last few days to/from NUM - Neom Bay in Saudi Arabia. As this is on the Red Sea coast opposite Sharm el Sheik, were these flights associated with Saudi's recent launch of itself as a holiday destination?

Buster the Bear

16th Oct 2019, 11:16

I see that BBC have picked up the airport expansion story and those that are objecting to Tinminal 2 being built on their door step. I bet T2 doesn't get a glass front!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-50001028

pabely

16th Oct 2019, 13:15

pabely

16th Oct 2019, 13:16

The ex Monarch HQ building has a new tenant on the 2nd floor. LLAOL, bringing together teams scattered across various buildings at the airport.

CAP A330

16th Oct 2019, 15:59

Flights by whom?

Jordan Aviation

pabely

16th Oct 2019, 18:06

Jordan Aviation
I know an AlMasria A330 was due today from Hurghada. I didn't think the new Saudi resort was up and running yet. Perhaps showing the travel industry around?

LGS6753

16th Oct 2019, 18:46

Flights by whom?

The AlMasria A330 was in fact from/to Neom Bay, as were two Titan flights on 757 and 767 in recent days, together with at least one corporate aircraft.

pabely

16th Oct 2019, 19:45

The AlMasria A330 was in fact from/to Neom Bay.
Note: Check my messaged correctly! It did tell me 'of' Hurghada. Thus where it is based.
Looks like Neom Bay is going to be a very exciting destination in years to come!
As a bit of Saudi money goes into Egypt, I'm sure they are thinking, we'll have some of that! Toursim, e-gaming, sports all high on agenda.

davidjohnson6

16th Oct 2019, 20:01

Report on the web that if FlyBosnia leaves Sarajevo, it might not be at the choice of the airline. Sarajevo airport apparently has concerns about the money owed by the airline to the airport.

I imagine Luton will have asked for some sort of security deposit from the airline to cover the various airport fees, but one wonders about the long-term financial situation between FlyBosnia and Luton, and how long Luton will have direct flights to Bosnia

AirportPlanner1

16th Oct 2019, 20:01

The AlMasria A330 was in fact from/to Neom Bay, as were two Titan flights on 757 and 767 in recent days, together with at least one corporate aircraft.

There’s going to be an extraordinary demand for staff to get the Neom project up and running. Construction, architects, all kinds of consultants. Not just putting together the overall infrastructure but the ‘nuts and bolts’ - every individual hotel, retail complex etc, housing development for workers etc . Before that you’ll need the infrastructure and accommodation for those building it. Expect a lot of private charters for some time.

LTNman

16th Oct 2019, 21:56

The ex Monarch HQ building has a new tenant on the 2nd floor. LLAOL, bringing together teams scattered across various buildings at the airport.

They did want to turn their former Britannia building inside the CTA into a hotel. Don’t know if that is still the plan.

JW95

17th Oct 2019, 14:53

Hi everyone. New to PPRuNE. Just been reading up on the (proposed) LTN expansion, including the provision of terminal 2. Having travelled through LTN many times previously, and in spite of the redevelopment, it is clear that the current facility is unfit for purpose, with passenger numbers increasing and a desperate lack of space in the light of forecasted passenger throughflow.

So a second terminal would definitely help to free up some space in the existing terminal, and hopefully aid to enhance the experience for the passenger. As regards terminal 2, does anyone think it likely that this would come equipped with jet bridges? I do realise that LTN is largely perceived as a leisure/low cost hub, but having jet bridges in place would be a welcome provision for some existing carriers (e.g. EL AL, TUI, FlyBosnia) and may help to attract new operators to the airport if investment into new facilities is made.

Would be interested to hear your thoughts. Also, are there any detailed links to the proposed second terminal? (as I can't seem to find much info on this)

ericlday

17th Oct 2019, 16:36

pabely

17th Oct 2019, 18:24

JW95.....queing to board RYR on wednesday morning in drizzling rain the conversation with a chap behind me centered around just the topic of jet bridges and enhancing the customer experience at the perceived 'low cost' Luton Airport.
And I bet that chap paid £9.99 for his flight!
Also see the Egyptian A330 is back again today, getting to be a regular now!

pabely

17th Oct 2019, 18:27

Also, are there any detailed links to the proposed second terminal? (as I can't seem to find much info on this)
What sort of detail are you after, plenty of artists impressions on net, but those never seem to materialize into the actual thing?

Captain_Caveman

17th Oct 2019, 18:55

So the new drop off zone is going live after the morning rush on 22nd October ! I wish there was a head in hands emoji for this layout !

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1138x1469/capture_c9915cacdef72a828719974fc3d00f71e6b18011.png

LTNman

17th Oct 2019, 19:19

Part of the route on the south side of the drop off zone is 2 way traffic just to make it interesting . Then depending which lanes you use there is a 180 degree turn to face the barriers which now has no tailback buffer zone. Not content with that there is then another 180 degree turn to get to the road where 8 lanes become 2 in just a few metres. Oh and 4 pedestrian crossings with 4 sets of traffic lights that face 3 different directions depending on location.

Anyone using lane 8 barrier will have a tough time completing a 3 metre 180 turn but the real test will come next summer.
https://i.imgur.com/LswuskA.jpg

LTNman

17th Oct 2019, 19:25

Hi everyone. New to PPRuNe. Just been reading up on the (proposed) LTN expansion, including the provision of terminal 2. Having travelled through LTN many times previously, and in spite of the redevelopment, it is clear that the current facility is unfit for purpose, with passenger numbers increasing and a desperate lack of space in the light of forecasted passenger throughflow.

The airport disagree. They believe 22.5 million passengers can be squeezed through the existing terminal using its existing footprint so be prepared for an additional 4 million passengers. The first application to add a million has already been submitted.

Buster the Bear

17th Oct 2019, 19:28

Submitted to LBC who still own the airport.

Buster the Bear

17th Oct 2019, 19:59

Rumours of the new Drop off Zone opening by the weekend?

Buster the Bear

17th Oct 2019, 20:11

https://www.bartintl.com/luxaviation-uk-adds-london-based-global-6000-to-fleet

Captain_Caveman

18th Oct 2019, 05:32

Rumours of the new Drop off Zone opening by the weekend?

no Buster, LLA have published a notice saying drop off opens after first wave finishes on 22nd October.

pabely

18th Oct 2019, 11:23

Northolt should reopen on 31st October so it's 9000 movement's will be back. Interesting to see if any drop occurs at Luton, Farnborough or Oxford since alternative London entry/exit was forced upon the regular users.

Falcon666

18th Oct 2019, 15:36

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=13MC0zqSd-M

LTNman

18th Oct 2019, 16:52

Shows the car hire centre by Parkway. Wonder if the consultants are the same group that has had an input into the design of the drop off area? It will be the drop off area that will set the capacity of the existing Terminal 1

Alloy

19th Oct 2019, 00:05

It also shows no jet bridges.

I don’t live in Wigmore, but if I did then I would be up in arms about, amongst other things, the parkland being moved - the video makes it sound as if something is to be added when in reality farmer’s fields appear to be reclassified as parkland while Wigmore Park is concreted over.

As for habitat area, it’s basically already there in the form of open fields and trees.

pabely

19th Oct 2019, 08:43

Tomorrows early El Al arrives at 03:45 and departs at 07:30. Is that normal? Almost a night stop and maybe crew change.

ericlday

19th Oct 2019, 08:51

Another El Al arrives 08.05 dept 09.55 B772

pabely

19th Oct 2019, 10:07

I think that answers my own question then, when they send extra 777s in, Jewish Holiday so extra flights.

PAXboy

19th Oct 2019, 14:35

Thanks for posting that day-dreaming item, Falcon666.

As Alloy says, open land is classed as open land and habitat becomes habitat. Classic PR $hite.
The new Hire Car, Mid-term and staff parking show no access to the Dart - so is that still diesel coaches?
The new long term shows no access to the Dart or directly to the terminals (no travalator) - so is that still diesel coaches?
The super wide angle computer view makes it look as if there is lots of space but it will be very densely packed.

However, we and the local residents need not get worked up about this - as it will never be built. Anymore than LHR R3+T6 will be built.

The first holding patten on both of these will be the next recession, due to start within the next 12/18 months.
The second patten will be the residential and green protest that will work towards parliament.
The third patten will be 10/15 years hence and could be several reasons but, by that time, they'll be too low on fuel and will have to divert elsewhere to make money.

pabely

19th Oct 2019, 18:45

I see that SEN us fast running out of Night time movement slots due to new ASL Cargo services. Will the Stobart Executive Center even bother to accept Nighttime arrivals next year!?

LTNman

19th Oct 2019, 19:01

It is good to see that on this thread both positive and negative view points can be make without fear of condemnation and that all view points are respected although there can be disagreements. Some supporters of a Thames Estuary Airport could learn a valuable lesson here on tolerance and respect.

Back to Luton, so say terminal two is built on the toxic tip. No doubt either easyjet or Wizz would be expected to move and that the airspace above Luton will have no problems in absorbing all those extra aircraft to new destinations around the world on its 2160m runway.

The road traffic will flow with no holdups and the residential streets of Wigmore will have no issues in handling traffic to terminal 2 from the east and the A1M via a 100 metre link road that breaches the local plan that was voted through by councillors who have no scruples, no respect for the local opinions or the councils own local plan that banned such a route so to protect the area.

Lee Baker Street

20th Oct 2019, 04:15

[QUOTE=LTNman;10598575]It is good to see that on this thread both positive and negative view points can be make without fear of condemnation and that all view points are respected although there can be disagreements. Some supporters of a Thames Estuary Airport could learn a valuable lesson here on tolerance and respect.

Thanks LTNman- I feel relieved I can say where I would like to see the airport in a few years time without condemnation. I want its runway extended to 9000 feet and the two terminals able to handle 38 million pax a year between them. Equally I would like to see an increase in freight traffic with a minimum 8 dedicated stands. In my view the airport was held back denying thousands of job creations over the last several decades!

LTNman

20th Oct 2019, 06:52

Those that promote new jobs for other people to do working in an expanded Luton usually would not be prepared to do the work themselves. An expanded Luton would not be creating many highly paid jobs but low wage terminal, apron and car parking jobs where staff would be expected to cover 24/7 work pattens including weekends and bank holidays. The lucky ones would be offered full time contracts on low pay but too many jobs at the airport are part time or zero hour contracts as new tenders are won by lowering costs. A visit to an airport job fair is a real eye opener about how bad Luton has become as companies now try to avoid making national insurance contributions and offer no holiday pay due to zero hour contracts.

My son has recent first hand experience of airport work with start times of 4 in the morning or working through the night on shift pattens that meant his body could never adjust. He was guaranteed 18 hours a week work but would always work various hours but income was never predictable. His company employed an outside agency to permanently find new staff to replace those that would leave every week.

He looked around the airport for other work but it was more of the same. Eventually he broke free and now works away from from the airport in a job where he is now home for tea.

As for me now that’s another story but not for here.

Oh a 38 million Luton as wanted by LBS. Why are you thinking so small? Why not a 100 million of 200 million Luton? Respect your views though.

LGS6753

20th Oct 2019, 11:16

LTNman -

Regrettably, your description of insecure employment in poorly-paid jobs is endemic in the whole economy. At least having a centre of employment nearby means that those people who rely on such jobs have the opportunity to feed their families.

I am with LBS on this - I would like to see Luton able to expand both in terminal capacity and runway length. It is well-situated to serve a huge population, and its value to the ratepayers of Luton is enormous. With this growth would need to come surface access improvements on a large scale, and I hope we have a Government soon that is prepared to invest comprehensively in the road and rail networks.

Just my two penn'orth...

Spanish eyes

20th Oct 2019, 19:09

Wonder why the councils that Heathrow and Stansted are in are taking legal action to try and stop their airports expanding when expansion is so good?

Buster the Bear

20th Oct 2019, 20:47

How ever much have LBC borrowed and committed to this madness? Goodness only knows the interest payments alone.

Build on a toxic tip that close to residents :( I heard that back in the 1950's that the tip was a deep hole, how deep the foundations will need to piled and the noise that will create in Stopsley and Wigmore! Just don't strike a match when they start digging, maybe LBC can sell the methane :)

Dannyboy39

21st Oct 2019, 05:02

A moan for a Monday morning. Swissport and Luton Airport need to get a grip.

Last six weeks getting early morning flights out of LTN - the last two weeks, getting more and more into the supposed quiet season, it has taken longer and longer to get a bag checked in and get through security. Last week 45 minutes; this week closer to 1 hour... it’s not good enough for an airport aspiring for many more passengers.

On the expansion point, a left field suggestion that I don’t think has come up - why not mothball the current terminal and put all passengers under one roof? Surely the current setup isn’t the most efficient?

LTNman

21st Oct 2019, 06:48

You might be moaning more next week as the new drop off zone opens Wednesday so we will see if there are any tailbacks off season. As for the amount of money the council has so far borrowed or is committed to borrow the bill is sitting between £440 and £450 million. £225m is for the rail link that is only required for a second terminal as the bus service can cope but the cost of £225m is to get it to the existing terminal only. If planning permission is granted for T2 then new Taxiway Foxtrot and Taxiway Delta will need to be cut and covered for the track and the cut and cover will then have to continue across an unstable waste tip.

The council will be in deep financial sh!t if the government refuses planning permission. They might well be in deep financial sh!t if the government does give it permission. At the end of the day it is the council taxpayers who will suffer in cuts to council services but that information is being withheld that the council rather than LLAL will be funding the interest payments on some of the loans. The loans taken out by LLAL means they will have less dividend money to pay the council. And where did LLAL get their loan money from? Why the council who had to again borrow the money themselves.

LTNman

21st Oct 2019, 07:47

Standby for the worst traffic jam the airport will have seen in years.

29th November to 2nd December 2019
A1081 New Airport Way - Full closure
There will be a full closure of the A1081 New Airport Way in both directions between 00:01 on Friday 29th November until 23:59 on Monday 2nd December 2019 to allow for bridge installation as part of the DART project. Diversions will be in place.

Cars approaching the airport from the M1 should follow diversions along the B563 Gypsy Lane, A505 Kimpton Road to Airport Way.
HGVs and coaches approaching the airport form the M1 should follow the diversion route along London Road, onto Castle Street, A505 Park Viaduct to Windmill Road, then onto the A505 Kimpton Road and Airport Way.
These route are to be followed backwards for drivers travelling towards the M1.

ericlday

21st Oct 2019, 08:04

There is already traffic jam at the Gipsy Lane Retail Park traffic lights on a 'normal' day without the extra road closure traffic. So take notice of LTNmans warning !!!!

LTNman

22nd Oct 2019, 18:39

Heard from someone in the know working in TUI HQ that next year will be the last year they will base an aircraft at LTN.

Looking at Luton flight supplements it wouldn’t surprise me. I know of people living within a mile of LTN who fly not only from Gatwick but also Birmingham to save money despite picking up car parking charges.

Tomorrow the new indoor drop off zone goes live mid morning.

PAXboy

22nd Oct 2019, 19:14

gilesdavies

23rd Oct 2019, 00:03

So TUI announced on Tuesday massive expansion of their programme for Summer 2020, with around 50,000 extra seats for Stansted and just under 200,000 additional seats for Birmingham going on sale.

Not a single mention of Luton getting any new routes or capacity increase.

It's mentioned in the Exeter forum, they will also get expansion and will have two aircraft based there on certain days!

Other people have stated that the TUI Summer 2020 programme at LTN is already planned to be smaller than this year, which was already a cut on previous years. Doesn't seem to be much commitment to the airline's HQ.

With Ryanair and Wizz expansion over the last year, could that be a cause with a lack of morning slots and apron space?

LTNman

23rd Oct 2019, 04:47

I have lived within 30 mins drive of the airport for most of the last 35 years, Including on the Euston/Birmingham railway line. On ANY occaision that I compared routes and prices, the cost of going further always outweighed any saving in price. Not to mention the time factor.

All depends on the size of the party travelling. A family of 4 using a group save rail ticket or travelling in one car can soon make a saving by not using Luton for their TUI holiday and that is what has been happening. Personally I wouldn’t want the hassle when there is an airport on the doorstep.

LGS6753

23rd Oct 2019, 10:15

pamann

23rd Oct 2019, 11:27

What a contrast. Britannia operated ten or more aircraft from LTN in the 1970s, and even long-haul using 707s. In those days, Luton was 99% charter with the only scheduled service being Jersey, but with the demise of the package tour, it looks as though LTN will soon be one of the first airports in the UK to be 100% scheduled (if those distinctions still apply).

Southend, London City, Newquay, Prestwick are virtually all scheduled ops. Certainly not the first, it would be the biggest though.

Aren’t we jumping the gun here somewhat though?

rog747

23rd Oct 2019, 12:17

PAXboy

23rd Oct 2019, 19:03

Agreed LTNman. I do understand the savings for a family and friends of mine in Hemel Hempstead often use STN for that reason. As I am travelling solo or with my partner, then I use LTN or LHR as priority. I did use BHX once, simply due to the destination and having to meet with my brother.

Scheduled is now the norm, for all the reasons discussed over the last ten years.

LTNman

23rd Oct 2019, 20:12

Still hear the rumour every few months that TUI will close their Luton hangar. I always remember working in their concrete ops centre which was a major operation by the old control tower. They had several other offices and buildings around the airport and of course their old hangar that ended up as easyJet’s HQ.

TUI have a large office block around a mile away but I think that is more holiday rather than airline focussed. I think ops ended up in Germany.

Buster the Bear

23rd Oct 2019, 22:06

TUI will continue to and have used easyJet from Luton, just like TCX did. Probably see this even more in the future. Maybe overall, easyJet can seriously undercut price wise TUI's own airline? Buying a number of seats per season probably is a win-win for both?

pabely

23rd Oct 2019, 23:00

Correct TUI are sending a LTN based 737 next Summer to spend the half the week at EXT then over to BOH for the rest of the week it seems.
So EXT and BOH both see 1 and a 1/2 737NG's based for them each week.

Back in the early 70's LTN had around 10 Court Line 1-11 500's and 2 Tristars
BMA usually had one or two 1-11 500's operating on IT's.
Dan Air had 5 LTN based 1-11 300/400's plus the Comets and 727-100's coming in on W patterns for longer routes.
Monarch had both a handful of Brits and a handful of 720B's based
and Britannia had about a dozen or so 737-200's on the fleet by then
I think LTNman was talking about S21, S20 still requires the based 738 like this year, unless it will be a 757 thus releasing the 738.
That is hell of alot of based aircraft in 70s when LTN only had, I think 18 stands and a few used for cargo or work with MAEL.

boeing_eng

23rd Oct 2019, 23:27

Heard from someone in the know working in TUI HQ that next year will be the last year they will base an aircraft at LTN.

Hmmm....shame that person in the know hasn't communicated this rather important info to the affected TUI staff!

ROC10

23rd Oct 2019, 23:38

I think LTNman was talking about S21, S20 still requires the based 738 like this year, unless it will be a 757 thus releasing the 738.
That is hell of alot of based aircraft in 70s when LTN only had, I think 18 stands and a few used for cargo or work with MAEL.

LTN was a 1x 757 this summer, with a 738 only coming in for a few weeks in the peak season then leaving again. Perhaps LTN won’t see this next year? I’m not sure as I haven’t checked TUI’s website. LTN certainly won’t be seeing expansion but it is possible the base could shrink to just 1x 738 or 757 for the entire summer.

rog747

24th Oct 2019, 08:41

That is hell of alot of based aircraft in 70s when LTN only had, I think 18 stands and a few used for cargo or work with MAEL.

Dan's def had the 5 baby 1-11's based there

MON/OM had at least 4 maybe 5 of the 720B's by then, but one or two would have been flying in and out of say BHX for instance.
The Brits numbers were dwindling (all jet by 1976) and their 1-11's came along after Courts' collapse.

Likewise Court flew their 1-11's also from BRS BHX CWL NCL, then also from LGW too when they bought Horizon Hols who then dumped their BCAL flying contract.

Britannia flew also from LGW and many other UK regionals with their 737's so obviously the BY 732 fleet was not at LTN all the time.

Best R.