Luton-9

[LTNman]

LTN strike action.

According to various news sites LTN airport staff are striking over the May holiday period causing significant inconvenience to passengers,

LTNman we need the benefit of your inside knowledge.






Security staff have already been on strike for a week. Can’t say it makes any difference. I am probably completely wrong but the picket line seems to be made up of staff who are off duty as I see them waving to the ones heading to work on the staff bus. In my days it would have been two fingers and not a friendly wave.

[LTNman]

While I haven't seen any traffic or security queues this year, so can be classed as an improvement, what continues to get worse are the queues to get aircraft actually airborne into congested airspace above Luton. Aircraft can queue on the taxiways for a good 30 minutes with massive gaps between departures even when there is nothing on approach. This is the airport that plans to double aircraft movements but has offered no solution in solving congested skies.

Looking at flight radar Luton seems to get particularly affected while Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted doesn't. Yes they have queues but the queues move while at Luton they often don't.

https://i.imgur.com/p3LC8lb.jpg

[LTNman]

The last few weeks has seen the land opposite the hotels being levelled and a curved layer of concrete being laid. This will be the construction site for the Gateway Bridge that will cross Airport Way. Once complete it will be taken to site which is meant to be in the Autumn.
https://i.imgur.com/evIXhBT.jpg


Meanwhile at Parkway the temporary trusses put in a couple of weeks ago have been covered in planking and boarding at the far end. Careful examination also shows at the far end the first viaduct support just outside the station.
https://i.imgur.com/MTNIVHK.jpg

Just outside Central Station over the last few weeks a layer of concrete was laid. On this concrete two reinforced concrete beams were built either side of the bridge supports. I am speculating that eventually these beams will sit over the Dart lines when the concrete below is removed. On top of the beams planking has been laid with a side wall indicating the possible reroute of the passenger walkway to the temporary drop off zone.
https://i.imgur.com/NjC1HST.jpg

The second multi-storey is now reaching its full width in places.
https://i.imgur.com/lmcbVUE.jpg

At the other end a third core is being put up. Note the height of the drop off zone ceiling which makes the second multi-story taller than the first.
https://i.imgur.com/jboJTWl.jpg

Finally, 5 months after the terminal extension was officially opened the arrivals area is now complete with just a tiny piece of the rubbish slatted ceiling being installed around the flight board. To be honest it doesn't make much difference leaving the terminal extension in landside arrivals looking half finished.
https://i.imgur.com/YtAONFH.jpg

[LTNman]

The airport have been flying a drone. (thought is was illegal). The video with no sound was taken in April but has only just been released.

For full screen go to You Tube and search "aerial footage of Dart construction works"

https://youtu.be/ZfSvPxwqGkI

[Mr @ Spotty M]

Only illegal if Joe public do so, they did the same last year, when they if l remember correctly were surveying the proposed road routes to Wigmore.
They have to apply for a licence to fly the drone.
They sent an e-mail or letter to the companies in the area of the flights, this was to warn them it was go to happen, it was over a number of days if l remember.

[compton3bravo]

Seven diverts (six Ryanair and one easy) from Stansted this evening due to runway breakup again.

[pabely]

Seven diverts (six Ryanair and one easy) from Stansted this evening due to runway breakup again.

Wasn't it 4 RYR yesterday after a heavy cargo departure?

[davidjohnson6]

Last winter (I think) Wizz flew between London and Ovda, the now closed airport near Eilat in Israel. Wizz have now put their flights for next winter to/from the new Ramon airport on sale. Luton is not however included. No, this route will not work from Gatwick or Stansted - it's Luton or nowhere

I presume this means Wizz may not fly London-Eilat next winter. One for Easyjet or is the route being dropped from Luton completely ?

[rog747]

Looks a nice new airport at Eilat (Ramon) which will see Eilat City and OVDA the old charter airport both closing.
Ovda and the red sea resorts was once very popular with Brits flying with Britannia Airways at first with direct holiday charter packages.

Taba in Egypt is nearby, and sadly the holiday market there for Brits collapsed as did those too for SSH post the Metrojet A321 crash a few years ago.

Aqaba (also very close by) in Jordan is back with EZY now flying there, and offers the amazing trips to Petra, the Dead Sea, and Wadi Rum.
GBair, Astraeus, and Monarch used to do weekly charters there for Voyages Jules Verne.(Kuoni)

[LTNman]

Not NOTAM'ed yet but confirmation that the airport will be restricting movements between 23:00- 07:00 local from June 1st. Even after 07:00 there will be no slots for biz jets until the morning rush has ended.
https://www.signatureflight.com/events/london-luton-airport-temporary-noise-closures

[Mr Optimistic]

Not NOTAM'ed yet but confirmation that the airport will be restricting movements between 23:00- 07:00 local from June 1st. Even after 07:00 there will be no slots for biz jets until the morning rush has ended.
https://www.signatureflight.com/events/london-luton-airport-temporary-noise-closures

As someone who is not in the business, could you expand on the whys and wherefores of this?

[pabely]

While I haven't seen any traffic or security queues this year, so can be classed as an improvident, what continues to get worse are the queues to get aircraft actually airborne into congested airspace above Luton. Aircraft can queue on the taxiways for a good 30 minutes with massive gaps between departures even when there is nothing on approach. This is the airport that plans to double aircraft movements but has offered no solution in solving congested skies.

Looking at flight radar Luton seems to get particularly affected while Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted doesn't. Yes they have queues but the queues move while at Luton they often don't.

https://i.imgur.com/p3LC8lb.jpg
bbc reporting that today should break records for numbers of flights in UK airspace, could be more next week with you know what occuring.....departure queues....

[CabinCrewe]

Aqaba (also very close by) in Jordan is back
Didn't TOM also do a short lived regional series for Cruises to Aqaba a year or so ago which were never repeated ?

[LTNman]

As someone who is not in the business, could you expand on the whys and wherefores of this?

The airport was not meant to have reached these passenger levels for another 6 or 7 years meaning that the more quieter aircraft have yet to be introduced in sufficient numbers. Because generous noise limits set by the council were broken in 2017 restrictions were introduced last year and now this year to get night time noise below those limits. The airport operator blames late returning scheduled services that should have arrived back before the start of the night hours meaning business jets are now the principle casualties.

[Mr Optimistic]

The airport was not meant to have reached these passenger levels for another 6 or 7 years meaning that the more quieter aircraft have yet to be introduced in sufficient numbers. Because generous noise limits set by the council were broken in 2017 restrictions were introduced last year and now this year to get night time noise below those limits. The airport operator blames late returning scheduled services that should have arrived back before the start of the night hours meaning business jets are now the principle casualties.

Thanks. Problems of success. Perhaps Brexit may put a dent in it. Thanks again.

[rog747]

Didn't TOM also do a short lived regional series for Cruises to Aqaba a year or so ago which were never repeated ?

That may have been the case when all SSH flights were suspended as the TOM cruises departed from there.

[Buster the Bear]

London Luton Airport Appoints New Chairman (http://aviationtribune.com/airports-atc/london-luton-airport-appoints-new-chairman/)

[LTNman]

Council owned LLAL are the driving force in what has happened at Luton over the last 7 years. LLAOL who are the concessionaire and reluctant money provider have spent the minimum required and don’t come out smelling of roses with their redevelopment spend.

[pabely]

Blue Panorama sheduled to Baku tomorrow?

[LGS6753]

Blue Panorama scheduled to Baku tomorrow?

Yes, a B763 and B737.

[pabely]

Yes, a B763 and B737.
Yes I did know really, shame no-one ordered fuel!
Both back tomorrow after 11AM then we start to Madrid shuttles.

[Boeing737-8]

Does anyone have a full list of Madrid flights by airline and type of aircraft?

I have seen someone has put a list on the STN forum and think many of us on here would be interested to see the LTN flights.

[PLAMALTN]

Using the AENA planning tool I can see the following departures from LTN:-

Friday 31st
GNJ57 GAIN JET AVIATION S.A. --:-- - LONDRES /LUTON (LTN) 12:55 - MADRID-BARAJAS ADOLFO SUÁREZ (MAD)
IBE2565. IBERIA --:-- - LONDRES /LUTON (LTN) 21:20 - MADRID-BARAJAS ADOLFO SUÁREZ (MAD)

Saturday 1st
IBE2843 IBERIA --:-- - LONDRES /LUTON (LTN) 11:45 - MADRID-BARAJAS ADOLFO SUÁREZ (MAD)
IBE2895 IBERIA --:-- - LONDRES /LUTON (LTN) 11:55 - MADRID-BARAJAS ADOLFO SUÁREZ (MAD)
IBE2893 IBERIA --:-- - LONDRES /LUTON (LTN) 12:30 - MADRID-BARAJAS ADOLFO SUÁREZ (MAD)
IBE2551 IBERIA --:-- - LONDRES /LUTON (LTN) 14:45 - MADRID-BARAJAS ADOLFO SUÁREZ (MAD)

I did read somewhere there was more than what's above but not seen any confirmation of these.

[pabely]

I think Luton was 1st or 2nd choice for alot of the planned flights but it just could not handle them all so went from other London airports instead.

[LTNman]

This is the third of four sections of the Gateway bridge being lifted onto trusses. Each section then had two dart track bases laid either side which can be seen on two lorries waiting to be lifted.
https://i.imgur.com/5haXiIx.jpg

Photo shows four sections of bridge complete with eight sections track base.
https://i.imgur.com/30xGATu.jpg

The bridge will have a curve.
https://i.imgur.com/WvDNote.jpg

It is going to be an interesting day when the completed bridge is transported to site and then lifted into position as both the A1081 and airport spur road will have to be closed. I am also wondering what the complete structure will weigh, how big the cranes will have to be and whether the runway will close for the lift? The completed bridge will be back lit by LED's
https://i.imgur.com/HOGscEx.jpg

Down at Parkway Station the start of the dart trackbed is taking shape either side of a central platform.
https://i.imgur.com/m8jsvCP.jpg

At the airport a new temporary walkway to the drop off zone is being installed under the walkway to the car park. The Dart will pass underneath this point.
https://i.imgur.com/JT6VVdC.jpg

Work carries on in digging out the dart route. In the background can be seen a lorry carrying parts of the third core of the second multi-story.
Worth remembering that the council is borrowing £225 million to build the dart but hopes to get the new concessionaire to eventually cough up the dosh and pay the council back.
https://i.imgur.com/j1vsTl2.jpg
Photos shown are a combination of mine and time lapse photos provided by the contractor.

[southside bobby]

#2524...

Altogether all of the traffic at STN is business that LTN could not handle has been alluded to at one time or another here of course.

[ESQU]

I’m guessing the completed road bridge for the train link will be missing the fancy ski jump and lights, otherwise it will affect minima for landing 08 and affect takeoff performance from 26

[pabely]

#2524...

Altogether all of the traffic at STN is business that LTN could not handle has been alluded to at one time or another here of course.
Not at all, three I know of, some applied in case LGW refused slots but they got them so never appeared.

[LTNman]

I’m guessing the completed road bridge for the train link will be missing the fancy ski jump and lights, otherwise it will affect minima for landing 08 and affect takeoff performance from 26




I asked that question 2 years ago and was assured it was going in. Looking at the photo of the curved bridge shows some of the brackets to support the angle which is meant to represent flight. Worth remembering that runway 08 only has a part set of approach lights due to the roadway below which makes the bridge even closer.

https://knightarchitects.co.uk/project/london-luton-gateway/

[LTNman]

What happened to the summer night time restrictions that were meant to have started on June 1st? No NOTAM, business jets still arriving overnight and 3 Iberia flights were due to come in at 03:05, 03.40 and 04:30 when the airport is meant to have no spare overnight stands and which shouldn't have been allowed.

[SWBKCB]

According to the latest Private Eye(!), the airport has applied for a temporary (5 year!!) relaxation of the noise limits.

The article makes the link previously made here between the airport owner and the planning authority... :suspect:

[If you say so]

What happened to the summer night time restrictions that were meant to have started on June 1st? No NOTAM, business jets still arriving overnight and 3 Iberia flights were due to come in at 03:05, 03.40 and 04:30 when the airport is meant to have no spare overnight stands and which shouldn't have been allowed.

Implementation was delayed by one night to allow for the football traffic. Back to normal summer (non)-ops hereon

[Buster the Bear]

According to the latest Private Eye(!), the airport has applied for a temporary (5 year!!) relaxation of the noise limits.

The article makes the link previously made here between the airport owner and the planning authority... :suspect:

I wonder who has been keeping Private Eye informed?

[LTNman]

The council are not fit or proper to decide any planning application regarding the airport as they have a vested interest. LLAOL seek an exemption and reward for failing to comply with a somewhat relaxed night time limit that was set by the council in the belief that it could not be broken. The question has to be asked has the council prompted LLAOL to put this application in?

[Lee Baker Street]

The council are not fit or proper to decide any planning application regarding the airport as they have a vested interest. LLAOL seek an exemption and reward for failing to comply with a somewhat relaxed night time limit that was set by the council in the belief that it could not be broken. The question has to be asked has the council prompted LLAOL to put this application in?

As a resident here in Luton and who pays my community charge, I would have questioned why both the council and or airport operator did not seek to alleviate the many extra flights required to operate between the UK and Madrid knowing that a lot of airports in particular at this part of the country are operating are constrained. Every flight generates money for the economy and you being a Luton resident should know how the airport benefits not just luton residents but equally the surrounding towns. For the record those extra night time flights went un-noticed by us residents living under the flight path here in South Luton. I am convinced you are a Ladican member but yet I assume an employee of the airport. Could that mean there is a conflict of interest there?

[AirportPlanner1]

The council are not fit or proper to decide any planning application regarding the airport as they have a vested interest

It’s very common for Councils to determine their own applications as they are the planning authority for that area. This can be anything from a disabled ramp at a library to a new multi-million pound Town Hall. They have to be decided at Committee though rather than by officers which at least gives some transparency and accountability. Of course if something was particularly contentious it’s likely the local MP or other body would request the Secretary of State calls it in.

[LTNman]

They have to be decided at Committee though rather than by officers which at least gives some transparency and accountability. Of course if something was particularly contentious it’s likely the local MP or other body would request the Secretary of State calls it in.



I would suggest that you don't believe for a moment that the planning and development committee members have an open mind before deciding planning applications from LLAL or LLAOL. They are a rubber stamp for council policy and would not vote against their own council.

[Buster the Bear]

The lovely new road to Century Park, sorry Terminal 2 is an example of self interest and the need to raise the town debt toward £1bn on airport related expenditure!

[AirportPlanner1]

I would suggest that you don't believe for a moment that the planning and development committee members have an open mind before deciding planning applications from LLAL or LLAOL. They are a rubber stamp for council policy and would not vote against their own council.

See the last part of my statement. If it’s a stitch-up and something that shouldn’t be allowed it would get called in and determined by the independent Inspectorate (or challenged in the Courts). If it’s something that should be allowed but the Council/Councillors are unreasonably refusing it, it can be appealed to the Inspectorate. So one way or another there *should* be a robust and defendable decision. Whatever it is there will be people that don’t like it, but that doesn’t make it unjust.

[LTNman]

Many applications regarding the council voting on their own LLAL planning applications have been requested to be called in.

According to the local rag Century Park, which is actually about building the roads to terminal 2 was even voted through by a councillor who sits on a management committee of a charity that has received £750,000 from LLAL. Seems he didn’t think he should have declared an interest.

[Falcon666]

So one way or another there *should* be a robust and defendable decision. Whatever it is there will be people that don’t like it, but that doesn’t make it unjust.

Thats exactly the point. if the Council were doing anything illegal they would be called to account.
All councils pass planning Applications to suit their own needs , loan money to Football/ Rugby clubs etc
Luton is no different, it sees , quite rightly , the Airport as it’s biggest Asset , job generator.
Obviously people don’t like it on here but I agree it doesn’t make it unjustifiable.

[LTNman]

Local radio talk-in where the Council, LLAL and LLAOL all refused to take part in the discussion to relax the airport noise limit. Maybe they have no defence but it was a one sided argument. Worth a listen to those people here who don't care about peoples lives and those that think the council should decide planning applications regarding its own airport. It seems that the planning inspectorate might get involved. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p079zbfh

[LTNman]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-48526028?fbclid=IwAR0g9UFD3KqS7pTUrdaShaNk7wrBoSX0EFtzK29g6o bEmW8tFCTpYqkmkds

The best quote of the day
Luton Borough Council said: "We are still considering the application and cannot make any further comments at this time."

What they mean is can the planning and development committee who are far from being independent decision makers find a way to ignore public opinion particularly when one of the committee members is now being investigated for a breach of planning law by not declaring an interest in a LLAL planning application on March 27th when a decision was made in favour of LLAL 2 weeks before a consultation period had ended.

[LGS6753]

But the Planning Committee comprises Councillors, who get voted in or out depending on, err. public opinion.

[DC3 Dave]

By 29.37% of the Luton electorate.

[AirportPlanner1]

By 29.37% of the Luton electorate.

That argument is null and void, if people can’t be bothered to walk 10 mins to the polling station that is the fault of the people and not of the Council. An alternate view is not enough people feel strongly enough to change things.

[SWBKCB]

By 29.37% of the Luton electorate.

Which is the way democracy works - any better ideas??

[AirportPlanner1]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-48526028?fbclid=IwAR0g9UFD3KqS7pTUrdaShaNk7wrBoSX0EFtzK29g6o bEmW8tFCTpYqkmkds

The best quote of the day


What they mean is can the planning and development committee who are far from being independent decision makers find a way to ignore public opinion particularly when one of the committee members is now being investigated for a breach of planning law by not declaring an interest in a LLAL planning application on March 27th when a decision was made in favour of LLAL 2 weeks before a consultation period had ended.

No, they absolutely cannot pre-judge the outcome of the application before a decision is made. It’s absolutely correct they do not appear on any chat shows or make comment. Were they to do so they would be in hot water. Not everything is a conspiracy.

Committee members being investigated or suspended or even expelled or arrested is also not unique to Luton.

[LTNman]

No one was asking any of the Planning and Development Committee to speak on the radio. The BBC were trying to get someone from the council or LLAL who are actually the same people or the airport concessionaire LLAOL to appear.

The truth is that the planning committee cannot be trusted to give a fair and honest opinion based on the evidence presented on the day. The members who represent the ruling party are under instruction to follow the councils views even though they could never admit it for legal reasons. It might be the case that the council will buckle this time from mounting pressure so time will tell but it appears that the planning inspectorate will be lurking in the background to take over the decision if the council allows this to go through.

[DC3 Dave]

That argument is null and void, if people can’t be bothered to walk 10 mins to the polling station that is the fault of the people and not of the Council. An alternate view is not enough people feel strongly enough to change things.


​​​​​​Thank you for reflecting on your first sentence in your second. Not for the first time you have articulated my viewpoint better than I could. However, there is so much going on at LTN that only those on the ground can open up their nostrils to, that I feel obliged to retreat back to the seaside and comment on matters where I have some small contribution to make.

LTN has achieved remarkable success, but not without criticism from reasonable - middle of the road people. Food for thought, and lessons to be learnt elsewhere, I hope.

[LTNman]

I have followed Luton’s progress for well over 40 years. I have worked in the terminal when there was more staff on duty than passengers and when Luton still used additional grass runways for the light aircraft. Most of that time I was frustrated that Luton had peaked at around 3.3 million passengers in I think 1973 but after Court went bust always seemed to hover around the 1.8 million mark as I wanted more.

In 1999 the new terminal opened when from memory the passenger figure was around 5 million and all was fine in my world. There was still long gaps between departures and for much of the time there was no airport related noise so there was a balance. I can’t really say when that balance changed but the airport is now intrusive and affects more and more lives.

The physical changes in the last 5 years have been incredible. Stand inside the CTA and only the control tower and the hangar seemed to have remained untouched. The rest of the area is completely unrecognisable. New road layouts, bus station, terminal front, pier, drop off zone, 2 multi-storey car parks and a station under construction have all left the airport looking completely different.

From my point of view enough is enough. A line has to be drawn in the sand where future expansion outside the airports existing boundary is unacceptable.

[Falcon666]

In 1999 the new terminal opened when from memory the passenger figure was around 5 million and all was fine in my world.

From my point of view enough is enough. A line has to be drawn in the sand


I guess at the end of the day people will just have differing views .
I know people living in Wigmore more than happy with the expansion.

[LGS6753]

I too have followed Luton Airport's development since my first visit there as a schoolboy in 1965. LTNman is right that the development in recent years has been transformative.
However, life too has suffered or benefited from transformational change in recent years. Britain has unforeseen levels of prosperity. The propensity to travel, and especially by air, has increased exponentially. Use and ownership of cars has changed every built environment - mostly for the worse. In recent years, population growth, especially in the south-east, has been unsustainably high.

The idea that one can stop "progress", however malign it may seem, is unrealistic. The best that can be done is to try to influence events, or to accept them as they are, or escape to a more benign environment and look back on one's happier memories.

/Here endeth the lesson/

[LTNman]

This is just an observation but I think it is accurate. In 1999 most of Luton's passengers were UK citizens as it was rare to hear a foreign language inside the terminal so I will call that 5 million. I would say that figure now sits at around 8 million or 9 million so demand from UK citizens has grown say 80% in nearly 20 years.

Passengers from outside the UK has grown from next to nothing to 8 or 9 million so that is where most of the growth has come from. This is mainly due to Eastern Europeans and Luton being more recognised as a London Airport.

[Captain_Caveman]

easyJet HQ will leave Hanger 89 in three years time to a new purpose built building on Vauxhall Way. H89 will return to its use primarily as an engineering building and crew room unless the crew room moves airside. For the three years until the new build is ready, some staff will relocate to capability green and the academy which is behind the cargo shed. One or two floors of the multi story car park in the CTA will be for flight crew and those staff remaining in H89.

[LTNman]

Strange place to move to. Vauxhall Way has a hillside on one side and IBC (Vauxhall motors) on the other but also contains a massive car park by Eaton Green Road that is part used by Easyjet. Also it is outside of the Enterprise zone. Thought they would go to Napier Park down Kimpton Road with its access to Luton Airport Parkway and the DART

https://i.imgur.com/yqKt58F.jpg

[Captain_Caveman]

I don’t think it is that strange LTNman, Napier Park isn’t suitable for what is needed.Why rent land and waste money when you can purchase your own land and do what you want with it within planning rules 😉.

[Spanish eyes]

So Century Park was also rejected which is part of the Enterprise zone. While it is good news for the town the Council has lost one of its main arguments why Century Park is needed as its location was meant to be for airport related activity.

[gatman]

Good afternoon,
I've been pointed in this direction by a colleague so I hope this is the correct forum.
In short, I'm led to believe someone on here may have access to the movements records for Luton for 1973-1975. These would have included landing/take off times, flight no, destination, type, reg etc.
Is anyone able to help with these by any chance please, I'm hoping to tie up some flights I was on back then to specific aircraft etc.?

Regards

Gatman

[LTNman]

gatman You need to put your question here https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/527527-luton-history-nostalgia-181.html?highlight=Luton+airport+history

[gatman]

Thanks LTNman

[LTNman]

Hmmm link works on a PC but not on an ipad. If the link is dead go to Misc> Aviation History and Nostalgia (https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia-86/) > and then find the Luton History and Nostalgia thread

[pabely]

I don’t think it is that strange LTNman, Napier Park isn’t suitable for what is needed.Why rent land and waste money when you can purchase your own land and do what you want with it within planning rules 😉.
So the old Monarch HQ was not considered, but I suppose that would have been renting again. But this is Easyjet UK rather than Easyjet EU which are run as seperate entitles.

[LTNman]

Wonder if the hangar will go back to 4 bays as one bay was lost due to offices being put in a few years ago.

[davidjohnson6]

Is Wizz dropping or de-emphasising their Luton - Satu Mare and Luton - Targu Mures routes ? After the end of October 2019, they go from a steady frequency per week to highly irregular (sometimes 1x per week, other weeks no flights at all), a few one-off flights arounx Xmas/New Year and then back to an average of less than 1 flight per week. While the Wizz website shows their are flights after Oct 2019, many of these dates are marked as being sold out
Of all the Romanian routes at Luton, CAA stats show in 2018 these 2 are by far the weakest for passenger numbers
http://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/CAA/Content/Standard_Content/Data_and_analysis/Datasets/Airport_stats/Airport_data_2018_annual/Table_12_1_Intl_Air_Pax_Route_Analysis.pdf

[Captain_Caveman]

So the old Monarch HQ was not considered, but I suppose that would have been renting again. But this is Easyjet UK rather than Easyjet EU which are run as seperate entitles.

every available office space within several miles of the airport was looked at, some were badly maintained and others had internal issues etc. If you have specific ideas of what you want to create within a certain timeframe and can do it on land that you own instead of renting then starting with a empty plot of land is a much better idea as you can tailor the building to exactly what you want from it.
By the way, the Monarch building would be way to small for what is needed

The vast majority of easyJet Europe business is run from Hanger 89 along with majority off easyJet Switzerland. There are a lot more people working for easyJet in Luton than you might first imagine .
. Hopefully the plans are rubber stamped by the council without too much delay.

[LTNman]

It will also be good for staff not having to catch a staff bus from the staff car park which must be a real pain. Lets hope the building isn't clad in orange.

[dvc]

Ant idea what Ryebridge (and Geotech underground mapping) are surveying the aprons for? They drive around with some ground scanning stuff and GPS. Yesterday stands 8-60 today 46-49.

[LTNman]

Central station continues to be dug out.
https://i.imgur.com/l60iKOV.jpg

By the side of the temporary yellow supports the concrete has had fixings put in to support the beams that will cross the station one day.
https://i.imgur.com/SWsFFIw.jpg

The artists impression shows the station complete with beams.
https://i.imgur.com/OGxUr8n.jpg

The temporary route from the drop off area has now opened with passengers now walking through one of the cores.
https://i.imgur.com/vKLV82Z.jpg

Work has started on piling a new section of track by the abandoned temporary walkway.
https://i.imgur.com/wEYRWGb.jpg

The new multi story heads for the third core making the exit route pass between the two car parks.
https://i.imgur.com/SCQcgIK.jpg

[LGS6753]

The Sun Express flights have started earlier this year and are now in full swing. But some of them seem to be arriving/departing between 2300 and 0600 - surprising in view of the curfew on unscheduled movements?

[compton3bravo]

The SunExpress flights are scheduled flights and they have managed to secure a number of nightiime slots which were available. Also the Wizz flights this winter to Tirgu Mures and Satu Mare which David Johnson queried are now bookable - three and two weekly respectively.

[LTNman]

June 2015
https://i.imgur.com/T2aq8ok.jpg

June 2019
https://i.imgur.com/cjSVf8j.jpg

[pabely]

Weather similar then! :-)

[Falcon666]

See the drop off charges are going up from £3 for 10 mins to £4 for 13 mins,
That will make for more happy people��

[commit aviation]

£3 for 10 mins = 3.33 per minute
£4 for 13 mins = 3.25 per minute
So you could argue it is better value for money! :-)
Maybe people were taking an average of 13 minutes and paying extra so it is now more achievable.
Or maybe they are just charging more...

[LTNman]

Despite the signs some people still just sit and wait for passengers or worst still leave their car parked in the drop off area and walk to the terminal.

45 minutes with old charges = £38
45 minutes with new charges=£36

For anyone just dropping off 10 minutes is more than enough time with little queuing so the new price is just a price increase.

Compare https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2019/06/how-to-avoid-kiss-and-fly-charges/ (https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2019/06/how-to-avoid-kiss-and-fly-charges/)

[LTNman]

This video is worth a look. Fire alarm went off at 7:15 Saturday in departures. People could not get out of the building with ease and some were turned away from fire exists. ( Sorry advert first). https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9301790/luton-airport-chaos-flights-delayed-fire-alarm/ (https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9301790/luton-airport-chaos-flights-delayed-fire-alarm/)

[Lee Baker Street]

Hi LutonMan, the way fire alarms activations work is as follows: a person sets off a call point which triggers a sensor to local panel and to master panel. Both panels will show location for investigation by response teams. A feature on a master panel is that a delay can be made for the sounders to activate which allows time for the response team to locate area and from smell and vision determine what has happened and if a fire exists. If the delay times out then bells ring . In the mean time response teams will be positioned to make sure the area is cleared and secured. With no immediate danger to passengers and staff they would have been advised alternative exits as opposed to having passengers straying onto aprons with jet engines running. Had there have been a real fire then rightly all fire exits would have been utilised. Some establishments call it the 4 Cs. Confirm-Clear-Corden and Control. After 20 minutes passengers were let back in the terminal which demonstrates they have highly trained teams!

[Alloy]

I see Wizz will be operating 20 A321XLR aircraft that have just been ordered by Indigo Partners, it will be interesting to see if some of these will be operated out of LTN to their full potential.

[22/04]

Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere but do TUI go back to two aircraft at the summer peak. I seem to remember this was the plan.

It is dismaying to see this airline given its history doing so little at the airport- I wonder if they will operate at all when they do not need to rotate the 757s through for maintenance.

[compton3bravo]

Over 1.6 million passengers used the airport in May a 10 percent increase on May 2018, making it the busiest ever May. The figures were helped by the two European Cup finals and would you believe the Eurovision song contest held in Tel Aviv avoiding the airport's press release.

[PAXboy]

I try and avoid the airport's press release too ... :8

[pabely]

I see Wizz will be operating 20 A321XLR aircraft that have just been ordered by Indigo Partners, it will be interesting to see if some of these will be operated out of LTN to their full potential.
Could the 321XLR run to the states, I thought the LR had runway lenght issues fully loaded, it is not a 757! We know Jet Blue came to have a look but went elsewhere? Oh, who said about a starter strip.....cough cough....

[gilesdavies]

I see Wizz will be operating 20 A321XLR aircraft that have just been ordered by Indigo Partners, it will be interesting to see if some of these will be operated out of LTN to their full potential.

Interesting news today, but a little confusing too...

The A321neo's they are already receiving are capable of flying routes like LTN-JFK (from a range perspective), as Primera were using the aircraft on this type of route, before they shut up shop. In all the excitement last year, it lead people to think Wizz Air might start similar routes with the arrival of their NEOs, but the Wizzair boss always denied it, saying they have no interest in operating routes of 7+ hours. But now they have specifically ordered an aircraft type with that extended range, and as far as I am aware the A321XLR brings no other benefits to Wizzair than their exisiting NEO's other than this range increase!

Either way I would suspect they are looking to fly further east or west. They already fly to Dubai, so could they be looking at countries further beyond like India which is within range from bases like Warsaw or Budapest, but the market between India and eastern Europe I would guess is limited, and they offer no connections. Not sure it has the range from Eastern Europe to the USA?

It could potentially be used to fly to Dubai from the UK, but they would have to be very brave going up against the Middle Eastern carriers which dominate the routes from the UK.

[compton3bravo]

According to some reports Wizz are dipping there toe into the UK-Spain market with a service to Castellan in Eastern Spain commencing next summer. The airport is north of Valencia and right next to the A7 motorway. When visiting the area a few years ago not much English was heard and I would have thought relatively unknown to UK visitors but has some excellent beaches. Well worth a visit to Castellan itself, Segunto and especially Peniscola. Ryanair fly to Castellon from Bristol and Stansted from the UK.

[MerchantVenturer]

Ryanair don't fly from Bristol to Castellon any more. From September 2015 they switched their Bristol-Valenca route to Bristol-Castellon but went back to operating Bristol-Valencia last year and at the same time ceased their Bristol-Castellon route.

[pabely]

Well done to all those who ran the runway this morning and raised lots of dosh for charity!

[Buster the Bear]

https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/budget-carrier-wizz-air-plans-to-introduce-india-flights-1561608435106.html

[LTNman]

No certainty that Luton will be allowed to expand beyond 18 million.

[Lee Baker Street]

No certainty that Luton will be allowed to expand beyond 18 million.

There is no certainty that the airports planning application will be rejected! I personally hope that Wizzair will base between 4 and 8 A321XLR aircraft at LTN to serve long haul routes.

[Boeing737-8]

4-8 aircraft going long haul would mean a large amount of destinations. What destinations would you be thinking Wizz could realistically make money from?

Pakistan
India
UAE
These three look like the main options but other options that are outside the box which we could see with some of them already being served from Wizz from other bases:
Azerbaijan
Kenya
Nigeria
Saudi Arabia
Turkmenistan
Uzbekistan
Iran
Iraq
Kuwait

Please feel free to add to that list but I wouldn’t think Wizz would base any of these aircraft at LTN overnight. All would most probably be scheduled to land early morning once the stands have freed up.

[LTNman]

There is no certainty that the airports planning application will be rejected! I personally hope that Wizzair will base between 4 and 8 A321XLR aircraft at LTN to serve long haul routes.






50/50 at the moment but the longer a decision is delayed the more likely it will be turned down on environmental grounds. Definitely unlikely if there was a change of government with the Labour leader declaring a climate emergency, something Lee Baker Street is not bothered about.

[LTNman]

Central Station continues to be dug out. Under construction multi story to the right, new de-icing pads and taxiway in the background.
https://i.imgur.com/gJytvmz.png

Meanwhile at the other end of the line Parkway Station interchange is progressing well. The trackbed will be on the first floor.
https://i.imgur.com/TL2VOi7.jpg

The 5 sections of the Gateway Bridge are being wielded together.
https://i.imgur.com/avzE3GR.jpg

By Taxiway Bravo a section of roof has been installed over the trackbed which will allow the taxiway to be diverted over it.
https://i.imgur.com/jSXCHst.jpg

The second multistory has now reached the third core. With no missing sections of fencing maybe the bridge to link both car parks has been abandoned as drawings showed a bridge to the left of the core.
https://i.imgur.com/Vsoumzq.jpg

The new parallel taxiway to Delta and the de-icing pads are nearing completion.
https://i.imgur.com/n3cn1zW.jpg

[Buster the Bear]

https://blueswandaily.com/wizz-air-considers-eastern-europe-focus-helps-to-weather-pricing-pressure/

[pabely]

https://blueswandaily.com/wizz-air-considers-eastern-europe-focus-helps-to-weather-pricing-pressure/
That article quotes OAG which are based just up the road of the 08 threshold!

[PAXboy]

LTNman The second multistory has now reached the third core. With no missing sections of fencing maybe the bridge to link both car parks has been abandoned as drawings showed a bridge to the left of the core.
Sorry to be so cynical but, "If we don't build that link - it will save money."

[compton3bravo]

Two new Wizz routes starting today - Thessaloniki and Bergen which I don't think has been operated before as a scheduled service from Luton.

[Gordonwil]

Hi as a new one to the forum, just like to say I have many photos of aircraft and the airport over 35 yrs as a Firefighter serving the airport, so if they are of interest I will gladly share not brill pics but I am sure will be surprised at some of the traffic we have had over the years.

Thanks Gordon.

=======================

Until you have a posting history you don't have access to private messaging and adding urls or photos.

[Buster the Bear]

Hi as a new one to the forum, just like to say I have many photos of aircraft and the airport over 35 yrs as a Firefighter serving the airport, so if they are of interest I will gladly share not brill pics but I am sure will be surprised at some of the traffic we have had over the years.

Thanks Gordon.

=======================

Until you have a posting history you don't have access to private messaging and adding urls or photos.

https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/527527-luton-history-nostalgia-186.html

[Falcon666]

https://youtu.be/JjRl9tGQhYE

Latest drone footage of the DART

[LTNman]

Hi as a new one to the forum, just like to say I have many photos of aircraft and the airport over 35 yrs as a Firefighter serving the airport, so if they are of interest I will gladly share not brill pics but I am sure will be surprised at some of the traffic we have had over the years.

Thanks Gordon.

=======================

Until you have a posting history you don't have access to private messaging and adding urls or photos.


As Buster said stick them in https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/527527-luton-history-nostalgia.html

although it looks like you have to have to do a few more general posts before you can post a photo. Hope it doesn't put you off.

[LTNman]

The Dart opening date has slipped from the summer of 2021 to the Autumn of 2021 due to late starting of the project. I noticed that part of route is now being worked on 7 days a week.

Dart Maintenance area beyond Central Station
https://i.imgur.com/66bywiQ.jpg

Another thing slipping is the opening of the new drop off zone on the ground floor of the new multistory as that is meant to open this month. At least 3 months late I would guess as the entrance roads haven't even been started yet.

Taxiway Foxtrot is having its signage installed. Think I saw a sign for Taxiway Kilo being installed yesterday which is one of the links from taxiway Delta but I will confirm.

(Edit) The link taxiway between Delta and Foxtrot opposite the drop off zone is marked up as K1

[pabely]

Two new Wizz routes starting today - Thessaloniki and Bergen which I don't think has been operated before as a scheduled service from Luton.
Are not Turku & Kutaisi starting this month as well?

[Falcon666]

Are not Turku & Kutaisi starting this month as well?

Turku and Oporto start today

Oslo , Stavanger and Catania in Mid September

[LGS6753]

Wizz seem to be going big on Scandinavia. But is there sufficient demand?

[compton3bravo]

Luton-Kutaisi has been operating for a couple of years. Regarding Scandinavia we will just have to see with prices for Tromso this winter holding up well. I guess a number of seats have been block booked by tour operators for trips to see the Northern Lights.

[AirportPlanner1]

Luton-Kutaisi has been operating for a couple of years. Regarding Scandinavia we will just have to see with prices for Tromso this winter holding up well. I guess a number of seats have been block booked by tour operators for trips to see the Northern Lights.

Tromso would be more popular in winter than summer I’d have thought, not just northern lights but the time of year Norwegians would be more likely to come shopping

[davidjohnson6]

British Airways used to fly to both Bergen and Stavanger - now they don't
SAS fly London-Stavanger but not London-Bergen

That left Norwegian with a very dominant position on these 2 routes. I don't think flying via Amsterdam, Copenhagen or Oslo will be considered an effective substitute or (in the case of Amsterdam as strong competition

There may well be room for a Wizz on London-Bergen (in particular) and, maybe to a lesser degree, also on London-Stavanger. I would be interested to know if Wizz can pick up any oil/gas traffic to Stavanger though

[gilesdavies]

Wizz Air Eyes London To Dubai Flights With Airbus A321XLR (https://simpleflying.com/wizz-india-flights/)

Will be an interesting development if this happens, but is a few years away until they A321XLR. I guess if Transavia can make it work from Amsterdam and Norwegian from Scandanavia (which are similar length routes with 737s) and are competing directly with Emirates and the associated flag carriers from this countries, Wizz can make it work too!

They also state they have no interest in using the new longer range A321XLRs on transatlantic routes from the UK.

Even if the London to Dubai routes does happen, no guarantee it will be from Luton, as not sure what the aircraft type will be like on Luton's short-ish runway, and they are showing a real interest in expanding at Gatwick. Looking to buy up Thomas Cook's slots!

[Buster the Bear]

https://airlinerworld.keypublishing.com/2019/07/luton-dart-project-progressing-at-pace/

[compton3bravo]

Tromso is a winter only destination Airport Planner as is Verona.

[compton3bravo]

Tomorrow Saturday a total of 17 Wizzair arrivals between 0700 and 0900!

[LGS6753]

...plus the 10 based WUK aircraft departing.

[LTNman]

F...plus the 10 based WUK aircraft departing.

15 arrive between 07:05 and 08:00

[LGS6753]

It wasn't quite as simple as I had thought. This is what actually happened:
0623 D GWUKB WUK4485 Lviv
0641 D GWUKF WUK7910 Ohrid
0647 A GWUKL WUK3775 Constanta
0649 A HALWZ WZZ2501 Riga
0657 A HALWA WZZ1801 Wroclaw
0702 D GWUKJ WUK7674 Kosice
0703 A HALYJ WZZ8001 Vilnius
0708 A GWUKH WUK3615 Suceava
0710 D GWUKC WUK4489 Tallinn
0713 A HALWO WZZ4301 Sofia
0715 A HALPS WZZ3301 Cluj-Napoca
0717 D GWUKI WUK4459 Larnaca
0720 A HALPM WZZ3753 Craiova
0721 A HALXV WZZ1301 Warsaw
0724 A HALWS WZZ3651 Iasi
0736 D HALXQ WUK4554 Bourgas
0738 A HALWX WZZ1001 Katowice
0742 A HALXT WZZ1601 Gdansk
0745 A HALVB WZZ2201 Budapest
0755 A HALWE WZZ7851 Debrecen
0800 A HALXM WUK5001 Krakow
0807 D HALYJ WZZ8002 Vilnius
0811 D HALWZ WZZ2502 Riga
0816 A HALWV WUK7701 Skopje
0817 D HALWA WZZ1802 Wroclaw
0820 D HALWO WZZ4312 Sofia
0836 D HALXI WZZ3001 Bucharest
0838 D HALPM WZZ3754 Craiova
0842 D HALWS WZZ3652 Iasi
0849 D HALXT WZZ1302 Warsaw
0859 D HALVB WZZ2202 Budapest
0903 D HALXU WZZ1602 Gdansk
0908 D HALXM WUK5002 Krakow
0912 D HALWE WZZ1002 Katowice
0913 D HALWX WZZ7852 Debrecen
0915 D HALPS WZZ3302 Cluj-Napoca
0922 D HALWV WUK7702 Skopje
0958 D HALXI WZZ3002 Bucharest

38 movements, 17 arrivals, 21 departures.

[Lee Baker Street]

It wasn't quite as simple as I had thought. This is what actually happened:
0623 D GWUKB WUK4485 Lviv
0641 D GWUKF WUK7910 Ohrid
0647 A GWUKL WUK3775 Constanta
0649 A HALWZ WZZ2501 Riga
0657 A HALWA WZZ1801 Wroclaw
0702 D GWUKJ WUK7674 Kosice
0703 A HALYJ WZZ8001 Vilnius
0708 A GWUKH WUK3615 Suceava
0710 D GWUKC WUK4489 Tallinn
0713 A HALWO WZZ4301 Sofia
0715 A HALPS WZZ3301 Cluj-Napoca
0717 D GWUKI WUK4459 Larnaca
0720 A HALPM WZZ3753 Craiova
0721 A HALXV WZZ1301 Warsaw
0724 A HALWS WZZ3651 Iasi
0736 D HALXQ WUK4554 Bourgas
0738 A HALWX WZZ1001 Katowice
0742 A HALXT WZZ1601 Gdansk
0745 A HALVB WZZ2201 Budapest
0755 A HALWE WZZ7851 Debrecen
0800 A HALXM WUK5001 Krakow
0807 D HALYJ WZZ8002 Vilnius
0811 D HALWZ WZZ2502 Riga
0816 A HALWV WUK7701 Skopje
0817 D HALWA WZZ1802 Wroclaw
0820 D HALWO WZZ4312 Sofia
0836 D HALXI WZZ3001 Bucharest
0838 D HALPM WZZ3754 Craiova
0842 D HALWS WZZ3652 Iasi
0849 D HALXT WZZ1302 Warsaw
0859 D HALVB WZZ2202 Budapest
0903 D HALXU WZZ1602 Gdansk
0908 D HALXM WUK5002 Krakow
0912 D HALWE WZZ1002 Katowice
0913 D HALWX WZZ7852 Debrecen
0915 D HALPS WZZ3302 Cluj-Napoca
0922 D HALWV WUK7702 Skopje
0958 D HALXI WZZ3002 Bucharest

38 movements, 17 arrivals, 21 departures.

Today Wizz will operate 115 flights and EasyJet 133. Wizz UK will have A/C number 11 join the fleet very soon so the gap is closing in terms of movements but Wizz operate A321 on many flights so might overtake EasyJet in terms of passenger levels this coming winter!

[pabely]

Today Wizz will operate 115 flights and EasyJet 133. Wizz UK will have A/C number 11 join the fleet very soon so the gap is closing in terms of movements but Wizz operate A321 on many flights so might overtake EasyJet in terms of passenger levels this coming winter!
Wizzair said they would overtake Easyjet in Summer as far back as December 2018. With the extra based RYR examples, Easyjet have been a little slow in protecting their home turf.

[Buster the Bear]

https://www.mro-network.com/maintenance-repair-overhaul/offer-deadline-former-monarch-facility-looms?NL=AW-022&Issue=AW-022_20190709_AW-022_987&sfvc4enews=42&cl=article_3&utm_rid=CPEN1000000461654&utm_campaign=20369&utm_medium=email&elq2=9a3cb0934f0344fa942302f3e07d320d

[LTNman]

Luton picking up Gatwick diversions

[Lee Baker Street]

It appears some LGW traffic being diverted to LTN due to technical issues. Might be an interesting evening.

[pabely]

It appears some LGW traffic being diverted to LTN due to technical issues. Might be an interesting evening.
All drifting back to LGW now, I think Luton only had EZY diverts

[compton3bravo]

I think seven easy diverts. Wizz have 18 arrivals this morning 0700-0900.

[pabely]

Should be a busy weekend with Wimbledon finals, F1 at Silverstone & Cricket final at Lords!

[GrahamK]

Moscow and St Petersburg next new Wizz destinations apparently

[Falcon666]

https://www.acl-uk.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/LTN-W19-Initial-Coordination-Report.pdf

Make of that what you will!!
The coordinators report sums it up perfectly!

[GrahamK]

Moscow and St Petersburg next new Wizz destinations apparently
On sale, 1 x daily each from 1st October

[GOJET1]

Great news! Very nice additions. Timings outbound:

LTN-VKO:
0650-1235: 1, 3
1525-2100: 2, 4, 6
0655-1235: 7
0730-1315: 5

LTN-LED:
Daily: 2240-0405+1

[LTNman]

https://www.acl-uk.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/LTN-W19-Initial-Coordination-Report.pdf

Make of that what you will!!
The coordinators report sums it up perfectly!


So I am confused. Movements and passengers are showing a 12% drop for Winter 2019 due to a cut back in slots yet the slots seem to have hardly been changed when viewed per hour. They seem to have been cut back so they can be increased in the summer. 4 slots have been added to 21:00-22:00 but 8 have been cut from 22:00-23:00.

Despite LLAOL spending £160million on increasing capacity arrivals is operating at 50% over capacity in its peak hour. There are also runway constraints as LLAL decided not to put in new taxiways that went to the ends of the runway.

[jdcg]

Moscow and St Petersburg next new Wizz destinations apparently
Currently the visa will cost you more than the flights and are a hassle. Unless the Russian gov is about to change things then the routes may struggle

[AirportPlanner1]

Currently the visa will cost you more than the flights and are a hassle. Unless the Russian gov is about to change things then the routes may struggle

EZY gave up Moscow for this reason, and Podeba at STN didn’t last long to LED last year...their fares were pretty competitive and timings much better than the Wizz overnighter. The visa situation won’t change any time soon.

I don’t think these flights will be a success but I hope to be proved wrong. I’ve been to Moscow and would encourage anyone interested in visiting to do so while the flights last and they’re cheap.

[Boeing737-8]

Looks like Wizz have got many slots at LGW and even some slots at STN. Tuesday 16th should see the confirmed allocated slots. Wizz were linked with buying the TC LGW slots so we will have to see over the next week what the final outlook is for the winter.

[LTNman]

I can remember when Easyjet got their first slots at Gatwick with Luton playing second fiddle ever since. Wonder if the same will eventually happen with Wizz.

[pabely]

I can remember when Easyjet got their first slots at Gatwick with Luton playing second fiddle ever since. Wonder if the same will eventually happen with Wizz.
I doubt that number of slots will ever be available at LGW again unless they get the approval for second runway. EZY run the same routes from 4 London airports so why should not WZZ do similar to their other bases? But then again a T2 at Luton has got to attract a doubling of based aircraft by both and RYR I would think.

[Lee Baker Street]

I doubt that number of slots will ever be available at LGW again unless they get the approval for second runway. EZY run the same routes from 4 London airports so why should not WZZ do similar to their other bases? But then again a T2 at Luton has got to attract a doubling of based aircraft by both and RYR I would think.

I agree with you that T2 would result in Wizz and Easy and Ryanair increasing their fleets but equally in line with planned growth I would not be surprised in Jet2 coming on board at LTN with a small fleet. What are your views in relation to Wizz operating A321LR as I reckon they will operate long haul from LTN.

[pabely]

I agree with you that T2 would result in Wizz and Easy and Ryanair increasing their fleets but equally in line with planned growth I would not be surprised in Jet2 coming on board at LTN with a small fleet. What are your views in relation to Wizz operating A321LR as I reckon they will operate long haul from LTN.


Not so sure about that, Dubai maybe, unless LLA can get a 500m starter strip. The XLRs might get from US East coast direct to their bases in Eastern Europe, unless they do a stop in Luton.

[mudcity]

The Runway at LTN is too short for a fully loaded 321XLR -WZZ will either use another UK airfield or go direct from their European bases .

[Falcon666]

Not so sure about that, Dubai maybe, unless LLA can get a 500m starter strip. The XLRs might get from US East coast direct to their bases in Eastern Europe, unless they do a stop in Luton.

Pretty sure Wizz and the Airport will be aware of this.The option of a starter strip is a possibility- just a look at the scoping documents currently with the planning Inspectorate shows land being earmarked as coming under the airport control at the end of 26
Also don’t forget if, and it’s still a big if, the airport does get T2 then who gets which Terminal.They are unlikely to split Easy or Wizz flights between both Terminals so as they are the dominant airlines at the airport will they get one Terminal each with the other airlines split between ? Plans show several stands for long haul at T2 so the airport are still keen to attract them.
Would a T2 have any kind of transit facilities? Would any airline at Luton need them?

Several years before the A321XLRs are delivered so anything could happen in the mean time.
One thing for sure is the airport isn’t standing still, five years plus of a building site and doesn’t look like stopping anytime soon.

[LTNman]

If Wizz decided to fly long haul from the UK they would use their slots at Gatwick if they have any sense. Gatwick has shown that providing a quality product pays dividends as they have a diverse long haul market. Luton is only interested in the Eastern European market and the very bottom of the European market with its cheap infrastructure. IT services out of Luton continue to fall as holidaymakers retreat to Gatwick and Stansted as demand drops away. With Luton’s short runway why would Wizz want to use Luton when there are far better airports that could handle long haul better?

[Falcon666]

MSCP2
Airport website now taking bookings from w/c 19 Aug for the new car park.

[Dannyboy39]

If Wizz decided to fly long haul from the UK they would use their slots at Gatwick if they have any sense. Gatwick has shown that providing a quality product pays dividends as they have a diverse long haul market. Luton is only interested in the Eastern European market and the very bottom of the European market with its cheap infrastructure. IT services out of Luton continue to fall as holidaymakers retreat to Gatwick and Stansted as demand drops away. With Luton’s short runway why would Wizz want to use Luton when there are far better airports that could handle long haul better?
Except LGW’s OTP is absolutely pitiful.

[LTNman]

MSCP2
Airport website now taking bookings from w/c 19 Aug for the new car park.






They are going to open one floor at a time but seeing they have yet to install any lifts or even finish concreting a single floor or ramp they will be chasing the clock. In some areas the steelwork has only just gone in with daylight between the floors.

[davidjohnson6]

LTNman - I think you are being a bit harsh on Luton compared to Gatwick.
Gatwick has the luxury of far more acres of land and a longer runway. 3 years ago, Luton was cheap and nasty. The terminal extension with the new shops has tried to target a slightly wealthier passenger.

However Luton seems to feel far more overcrowded than other airports leading to the grotty feeling overall. This will only really be resolved by the airport having a bigger area of land to use
That said, most airports would consider overcrowding and too many pax, to be a nice problem to have

[Buster the Bear]

Rumours of cash flow tightening.

[LTNman]

LTNman - I think you are being a bit harsh on Luton compared to Gatwick.
Gatwick has the luxury of far more acres of land and a longer runway. 3 years ago, Luton was cheap and nasty. The terminal extension with the new shops has tried to target a slightly wealthier passenger.

However Luton seems to feel far more overcrowded than other airports leading to the grotty feeling overall. This will only really be resolved by the airport having a bigger area of land to use
That said, most airports would consider overcrowding and too many pax, to be a nice problem to have

The upmarket shops are always devoid of any passengers apart from the occasional Romanian shoplifter so I have been wondering how long most of them will last. Also it seems a great waste of terminal floor space having shops containing zero passengers for most of the time when a Greggs would attract the masses.

As for Luton needing a bigger area of space I think I would prefer to keep my local park which is one of the three biggest in the town. The offer of a replacement field in Hertfordshire is no substitute to a mature much loved local amenity.

Also anyone wondered what a second terminal would look like? Another grot box comes to mind that will be built on the cheap with again every pipe and heating duct on show. I am still staggered daily how bad the ground floor infill looks as it doesn’t get any better with time and all because they didn’t put a ceiling in to save a few pounds.

[LTNman]

I am still staggered daily how bad the ground floor infill looks as it doesn’t get any better with time and all because they didn’t put a ceiling in to save a few pounds.

Well, well, well. The arrivals waiting area is starting to get a black small square suspended ceiling. If I stand directly below it and look up I can see through it but the square grid pattern is so small it hides almost everything. The lighting doesn't line up so the ceiling lights are going to have to be moved. So I guess the question is will the whole of the ground floor infill get covered or just the arrivals waiting area where meeters and greeters just stand around for long periods looking at their surroundings.

[Manx]

I know this isn't politically correct, but with your now long-standing obsession with ceilings and repeated posts along the lines of below, you do often come across as being a sad little man.
The upmarket shops are always devoid of any passengers apart from the occasional Romanian shoplifter

[PAXboy]

I don't think that comment is justified Manx.The way in which LTN mgmt (all owners) have saved money over the last 35 years (that I have been using the airport) shows up everywhere. You only have to look at the artists drawings that were used to sell the ideas - and the reality. LTNman (whom I do not know and have never met) simply points out their own failings. If they had shown the ceilings as gaping holes - that would be what they intended.

[compton3bravo]

Personally I am not bothered about the ceilings etc is is the other comments that I find rather sad, but of course there are many little Englanders that the world ends at Dover.

[LTNman]

I know this isn't politically correct, but with your now long-standing obsession with ceilings and repeated posts along the lines of below, you do often come across as being a sad little man.

Ha Ha I am laughing now. Yes I have had an obsession with the ceilings. When £160 million has been spent I would hope for a better visual statement. Passenger impressions are based on many things including subconscious thoughts caused by visual impacts and the physical experience like long queues. Luton has been firmly routed in bottom position for the last few years and I don’t like it. Maybe that doesn’t bother those that are just interested in counting numbers but I have high standards of what I call acceptable.:oh:

[AirportPlanner1]

I know this isn't politically correct, but with your now long-standing obsession with ceilings and repeated posts along the lines of below, you do often come across as being a sad little man.

As well as the racism which is a big shame it is spectacularly naive as to the economics of “upmarket” retail...if the units were busy and sales made in volume by definition the product wouldn’t be exclusive. Income from 1 Gucci handbag = 40+ Accessorise handbags.

[ExpectmorePayless]

As I tire of seeing the same faces as we weave our way towards the passport control desks, my eyes look upward towards the open ducting in the ceiling.
They are caked in thick dust. My mind wonders as to the origin of such particulates and their affect on passenger health. I'm just amazed it's not considered a fire hazard.
As to the shops, I'm always puzzled why slices of Spanish ham are being elegantly cut from large joints in full public view. That and the leather Gucci handbags next door must be giving travelling Vegans apoplectic shock. 😂

[LTNman]

The arrivals waiting area is getting some much needed attention. We will have to wait and see how far the great cover up will extend. All the light fittings which are attached to angle iron will have to be moved to line up with the gaps.
https://i.imgur.com/mOqPXdh.jpg

Meanwhile at the other end of the terminal public areas are still covered with hoardings as this area has remained untouched now for 8 months.
https://i.imgur.com/bsxy3lG.jpg

The airport are now selling parking spaces for the second multi story that will open on 19th August. As can be seen there must be some doubt whether the car park will open on time. This photo shows the lift shafts with no lifts and each floor with no concrete. Just in shot is what will be the exit ramp minus a ramp.
https://i.imgur.com/Vt2Zfxk.jpg

At the other end the exit routes from the drop off zone that will be contained within the ground floor of the multi story will face the south apron.
https://i.imgur.com/cfpLPmb.jpg

Just inside the CTA by the road tunnel can be seen the middle concrete wall that will divide the 2 tracks. On the far side the wall linings to the tunnel are going in.
https://i.imgur.com/hLTYcfd.jpg

Looks like the station boundary.
https://i.imgur.com/DEsZNUe.jpg

At Parkway the first floor is being boarded out so concrete can be poured. In the distance can be seen the viaduct supports for the track. Behind the photo British Rail contractors have made a start on the footbridge that will cross the track for access to and from the DART. They also have their own compound which is also behind the photo on the other side of the footpath.
https://i.imgur.com/aGgEiqc.jpg

[Yahoo!®]

Excellent pictures and updates as always LTNman. Much appreciated :ok:

[Webby47]

Smell of New Paint within Terminal today. LLA Technical services touching up Pillars. Checked Royal Engagements and surprise The Princes Royal (princes Anne) is due to open Terminal extension on July 30 2019.
Also this possibly is the reason that a ceiling is going in and growing in the arrivals area.

[PAXboy]

Gosh wot a suprize :ugh:
If only a Royal would visit every week ...

[Dannyboy39]

Smell of New Paint within Terminal today. LLA Technical services touching up Pillars. Checked Royal Engagements and surprise The Princes Royal (princes Anne) is due to open Terminal extension on July 30 2019.
Also this possibly is the reason that a ceiling is going in and growing in the arrivals area.
the terminal that isn’t finished yet?

[LTNman]

Excellent pictures and updates as always LTNman. Much appreciated :ok:





Thanks, I know there is always an interest in the continuing changes at the airport which seem to be never ending.

Smell of New Paint within Terminal today. LLA Technical services touching up Pillars. Checked Royal Engagements and surprise The Princes Royal (princes Anne) is due to open Terminal extension on July 30 2019.
Also this possibly is the reason that a ceiling is going in and growing in the arrivals area.

It has already been officially open once by the Transport secretary Chris Grayling, Maybe with him being a Tory and the council run by Labour they will be removing the plague with his name on it by the entrance for a new one rather having two.

Just before the first grand opening last December the airport spent a good week hiring in a chewing gum removal company to clear the pavements. That company has been back again so I thought something was happening. They also brought in LLA plant containers containing small hedges to adorn the front of the terminal. They are still there but as no one has bothered watering them the hedges are now all dead. Also for the last visit the broken floor tiles that have been there for years were dug out and replaced in the area he was to visit while the areas he did not visit were left. Got to say more floor tiles have been replaced since then so maybe Princes Ann will be doing a walkabout before heading into Burger King or Costa for a quick bite.

I do find it annoying that for the million plus passengers that use the airport each month the wear and tear replacement budget is zero but it just takes a single VIP to visit and out comes the paint brushes and Jif.

As for the terminal being finished it all depends on what you call finished. Easyjet and BlueAir customer service counters are still in temporary areas inside the check-in area rather than in recesses that remain undeveloped and covered in more hoardings .

https://i.imgur.com/rBGYVnt.jpg

[pabely]

Thanks, I know there is always an interest in the continuing changes at the airport which seem to be never ending.



It has already been officially open once by the Transport secretary Chris Grayling, Maybe with him being a Tory and the council run by Labour they will be removing the plague with his name on it by the entrance for a new one rather having two.

Just before the first grand opening last December the airport spent a good week hiring in a chewing gum removal company to clear the pavements. That company has been back again so I thought something was happening. They also brought in LLA plant containers containing small hedges to adorn the front of the terminal. They are still there but as no one has bothered watering them the hedges are now all dead. Also for the last visit the broken floor tiles that have been there for years were dug out and replaced in the area he was to visit while the areas he did not visit were left. Got to say more floor tiles have been replaced since then so maybe Princes Ann will be doing a walkabout before heading into Burger King or Costa for a quick bite.

I do find it annoying that for the million plus passengers that use the airport each month the wear and tear replacement budget is zero but it just takes a single VIP to visit and out comes the paint brushes and Jif.

As for the terminal being finished it all depends on what you call finished. Easyjet and BlueAir customer service counters are still in temporary areas inside the check-in area rather than in recesses that remain undeveloped and covered in more hoardings .

https://i.imgur.com/rBGYVnt.jpg
When wad the originaĺ terminal opened and by whom? Answers on a postcard and returned to PO Box 12345.....

[LTNman]

When wad the originaĺ terminal opened and by whom? Answers on a postcard and returned to PO Box 12345.....

Ha Ha define original? Prince Charles opened the upgraded 1968? terminal after they built a covered bus lane in front of it and put a globe on a plinth inside the check-in area. The queen opened the existing terminal in 1999 and now we have Princess Ann. The Duke of Edinburgh arrived by helicopter but I cant remember why or when.

[pabely]

Ha Ha define original? Prince Charles opened the upgraded 1968? terminal after they built a covered bus lane in front of it and put a globe on a plinth inside the check-in area. The queen opened the existing terminal in 1999 and now we have Princess Ann. The Duke of Edinburgh arrived by helicopter but I cant remember why or when.
The one with the covered bus lane I was thinking if! 1968 was a little before my time! We had one Royal arrive on 747 but that was a diversion from LHR if I remember correctly!

[BlueA330]

The one with the covered bus lane I was thinking if! 1968 was a little before my time! We had one Royal arrive on 747 but that was a diversion from LHR if I remember correctly!
yes it was Prince Andrew coming in from Toronto

[LTNman]

Just another 555,000 passengers to go before the airport breaches its permitted maximum passenger limit.

[pabely]

Just another 555,000 passengers to go before the airport breaches its permitted maximum passenger limit.
Will that really be enforced, if so by whom

[LTNman]

There are enough pressure groups, MP’s and other councils to make sure Luton Borough Council does not turn a blind eye as being in breach of planning permission is serious. Of course the council can apply to itself to increase that limit but it would cause a major stink as once again the benefactor would be the council.

One group is on 3CR just after 5 about aircraft noise.

[pabely]

There are enough pressure groups, MP’s and other councils to make sure Luton Borough Council does not turn a blind eye as being in breach of planning permission is serious. Of course the council can apply to itself to increase that limit but it would cause a major stink as once again the benefactor would be the council.

One group is on 3CR just after 5 about aircraft noise.
3 Counties Radio?
Did it not take just over 6 months to get approval from 12M to 18M from Government before?

[LTNman]

12-18 million was again decided by the council. 18-32 to be decided by government while 32-36 or 38 million to be decided by the council.

There is a plan to go from 18 to 22 million if the government says no to 32 million but no one is meant to know about that plan yet. Might be the case that they will indeed go for 22 million as a short term fix to add capacity with mods to the existing terminal, a new pair and apron on the temporary drop off zone. This is part of the bigger planning application but it could well be separated.

[Falcon666]

https://www.businesstraveller.com/business-travel/2019/07/18/clubrooms-collection-lounge-opens-at-luton/

[inOban]

Is there also a limit on the number of people in the terminal at any one time, set by its fire certificate?

[LTNman]

If there is it isn’t enforced. A coupe of months ago I reported the terminal for overcrowding to Beds Fire Service and even supplied a video of an airside terminal evacuation but they never got back to me. Just waiting for the first crush during a real emergency when people are in a panic mode so I can say I told you so at an inquest.


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9301790/luton-airport-chaos-flights-delayed-fire-alarm/

When the builders where in some fire exits at the front of the terminal were blocked for months.

[ClearLand08]

The UK aeronautical charts on NATS website are now showing details for Taxiway Foxtrot and the Kilo link effective 15th August.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/338x516/dic6lph_523b54f553176daa1492cd30f34ba4e57e28677e.jpg

[pabely]

The UK aeronautical charts on NATS website are now showing details for Taxiway Foxtrot and the Kilo link effective 15th August.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/338x516/dic6lph_523b54f553176daa1492cd30f34ba4e57e28677e.jpg
That's quick, you can get 4 aircraft parked up between Foxtrot 2 & 4 at night ;-)

[LTNman]

The NAT chart doesn't show the deicing pads which are all floodlit with a row of 4 lighting towers. Looks like the de-icing pads are part of a super wide taxiway as F3 is shown on what would be the stand. Looks like if an aircraft is being de-iced then another aircraft does not have enough room to pass although I could be wrong. Certainly there are no stand markings. New opportunity to handle a few more diverts if pressed.

https://i.imgur.com/E1LHAYd.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/3X5j6cP.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/cKarCcb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/thqDL8E.jpg

[LGS6753]

Vueling will cease its Amsterdam service on 13th August. Thereafter all flights will be flown by Level. So capacity increases as an A320 is replaced by an A321.

[pabely]

The NAT chart doesn't show the deicing pads which are all floodlit with a row of 4 lighting towers. Looks like the de-icing pads are part of a super wide taxiway as F3 is shown on what would be the stand. Looks like if an aircraft is being de-iced then another aircraft does not have enough room to pass although I could be wrong. Certainly there are no stand markings. New opportunity to handle a few more diverts if pressed.

https://i.imgur.com/E1LHAYd.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/3X5j6cP.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/cKarCcb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/thqDL8E.jpg
Thanks for the pichures:
Can't see much drainage but this might just be the angle.
Those car owners are going to love all that deicer spray come the winter!

[Falcon666]

Stands 1R-8 to be reconstructed ? what’s this about?

New South East stands split build of a two and six pack ?

cost £22 million.

Also Tender out to replace both escalators from security to Duty Free next Spring

[Falcon666]

Thanks for the pichures:
Can't see much drainage but this might just be the angle.
Those car owners are going to love all that deicer spray come the winter!

According to the plans the drainage channel is on the western edge of the taxiway so probably can’t see it from the vantage point of the photos

[LTNman]

The drop off zone which is south east would only take 4 stands. Interesting to know where a 2 and 6 stand apron will go as that is not part of the consultation to expand the airport. Would they really build an apron on the wrong side of 2 live taxiways for passenger use?

[ericlday]

Desperate times (for parking) call for desperate measures (build more stands)

[LTNman]

The present stand count, terminal and general infrastructure were designed for 18 million passengers. No point in building more stands if the terminal can't cope but now we have another 8 stands. So what does that tell you?

[Falcon666]

The present stand count, terminal and general infrastructure were designed for 18 million passengers. No point in building more stands if the terminal can't cope but now we have another 8 stands. So what does that tell you?
Tells me there’s a lot going on in the background that we are all unaware of.
Just looking at the map, there are very few places that a two stand area would fit perfectly
Could it be that this is the area by the run up bay and not the current drop off area.Have plans totally changed?

Strange that Stands 1-9 need restrengthening, do they have to meet a new standard or are they showing physical signs of cracking?

[LTNman]

2 stands for biz jets 6 stands for terminal passengers? South east location doesn't give many options.

[Dannyboy39]

Perhaps the airport are thinking about building some new stands to allow some slack during busy periods such as diversions / bad weather, rather than holding aircraft at B5 backwards.

Long shot, but who knows!

[LTNman]

They are not going to spend millions unless there is a profit to be made. That profit won’t come for diversions etc. New stands followed by modifications to the terminal means more passengers once the council has given itself planning permission to breach 18 million.

[pabely]

Stands 1R-8 to be reconstructed ? what’s this about?

New South East stands split build of a two and six pack ?

cost £22 million.

Also Tender out to replace both escalators from security to Duty Free next Spring
Is the tender in addition to the tender as shown on #2044 on this thread?

[Falcon666]

Is the tender in addition to the tender as shown on #2044 on this thread?

I am guessing it’s one and the same. originally that Tender was for the design aspect of the Stands and this latest Tender is for the the design team to work with the construction company that win .
I am still thinking this is not the planned Apron on the current drop off zone , (as LTNman says you can only get four stands in that location. ) but the one by the Run Up Bay.
As Dannyboy39 was saying it could help with holding a/c if the concrete is poured at that location but I am sure that’s not the real reason.

[pabely]

I am guessing it’s one and the same. originally that Tender was for the design aspect of the Stands and this latest Tender is for the the design team to work with the construction company that win .
I am still thinking this is not the planned Apron on the current drop off zone , (as LTNman says you can only get four stands in that location. ) but the one by the Run Up Bay.
As Dannyboy39 was saying it could help with holding a/c if the concrete is poured at that location but I am sure that’s not the real reason.
I agree, some sort of remote stands for the overnights, and then can be pulled back onto terminal stands once the early departures free them up.
Then again this could be used more to where traditionally Biz are put on the Pond or Cargo and would give fast access to runway (subject to traffic).
When they resurface stands 1A to 8 then there will be a loss of parking at that point anyhow.

[Packer27L]

Perhaps the airport are thinking about building some new stands to allow some slack during busy periods such as diversions / bad weather, rather than holding aircraft at B5 backwards.

Long shot, but who knows!
New stands "just in case"? That'll be a first!

[LTNman]

New stands are not required for 18 million passengers, not during the day or during the night so there is another reason.

[Lee Baker Street]

Ltn bound traffic circling and a/c on taxiway not moving. Does anyone know why?

[LTNman]

Two aircraft on finals did missed approaches with nothing on the runway. Aircraft seem to be landing again but several in the hold. Lightning to the east but a fair way off. Landings on 08.

[Captain_Caveman]

LGW, LTN and STN Departures Halted Due to large scale storms building in London TMA

[Spanish eyes]

New stands are not required for 18 million passengers, not during the day or during the night so there is another reason.

Read the latest planning applications. LLAOL want to add capacity to 19 million but then claim they don't need to build any new infrastructure that hasn't already been approved. These stands are not part of any old planning application so that statement is total rubbish.

This has been put in by the operator but will have been promoted by LLAL and the Council who will once again just approve the plan with no scrutiny.

[Severn]

TUIs ever decreasing presence in LTN

Below is a summary of the number of based aircraft, number of weekly departures and routes operated over the last 3 summer seasons:

Summer 2017
3x based aircraft
38x flights (All operated by TUI)
22x routes

Summer 2018
2x based aircraft (-1)
33x flights (-5) (28x flights operated by based TUI aircraft / 1x operated by TUI w-pattern / 4x flights operated by other carriers - AEA, FHY etc)
21x routes (-1)

Summer 2019
2x based aircraft
27x flights (-6) (27x operated by based TUI aircraft)
20x routes (-1)

Summer 2020 - provisional plan
1.6x based aircraft (1x aircraft based all week, 1x aircraft split between LTN (Mon-Thu) and BOH (Fri-Sun))
20x flights (-7) (20x operated by based TUI aircraft)
15x routes (-5)

[Lee Baker Street]

TUIs ever decreasing presence in LTN

Below is a summary of the number of based aircraft, number of weekly departures and routes operated over the last 3 summer seasons:

Summer 2017
3x based aircraft
38x flights (All operated by TUI)
22x routes

Summer 2018
2x based aircraft (-1)
33x flights (-5) (28x flights operated by based TUI aircraft / 1x operated by TUI w-pattern / 4x flights operated by other carriers - AEA, FHY etc)
21x routes (-1)

Summer 2019
2x based aircraft
27x flights (-6) (27x operated by based TUI aircraft)
20x routes (-1)

Summer 2020 - provisional plan
1.6x based aircraft (1x aircraft based all week, 1x aircraft split between LTN (Mon-Thu) and BOH (Fri-Sun))
20x flights (-7) (20x operated by based TUI aircraft)
15x routes (-5)

Is it a possibility that no airline can plan ahead until planning allow an increase on the current 18 million pax per year which potentially can be reached by December 31st this year?

[pabely]

Is it a possibility that no airline can plan ahead until planning allow an increase on the current 18 million pax per year which potentially can be reached by December 31st this year?


I doubt that, as Wizzair bring more 321s online and EZY retire 319s then numbers will increase anyhow. More likely the Jet2 effect from up the road.

[pabely]

They are not going to spend millions unless there is a profit to be made. That profit won’t come for diversions etc. New stands followed by modifications to the terminal means more passengers once the council has given itself planning permission to breach 18 million.
As you say spend millions for flight of fancy. A sound business would have a commitment from mutiple airlines for the use of these already, more based frames, WZZ, EZY, RYR?

[MARKEYD]

Looking at the TUI schedule for 2020 the second aircraft based there hardly operates a full
schedule at the moment with Wednesday and Thursday only flying in July /Aug peak

[ROC10]

TUIs ever decreasing presence in LTN

Below is a summary of the number of based aircraft, number of weekly departures and routes operated over the last 3 summer seasons:

Summer 2017
3x based aircraft
38x flights (All operated by TUI)
22x routes

Summer 2018
2x based aircraft (-1)
33x flights (-5) (28x flights operated by based TUI aircraft / 1x operated by TUI w-pattern / 4x flights operated by other carriers - AEA, FHY etc)
21x routes (-1)

Summer 2019
2x based aircraft
27x flights (-6) (27x operated by based TUI aircraft)
20x routes (-1)

Summer 2020 - provisional plan
1.6x based aircraft (1x aircraft based all week, 1x aircraft split between LTN (Mon-Thu) and BOH (Fri-Sun))
20x flights (-7) (20x operated by based TUI aircraft)
15x routes (-5)

The LTN reductions have been even more significant than your post mentions and you’ll see discussion of this somewhere in the TUI thread.

For the vast majority of S19, LTN is one based aircraft (757). Only in the last week or so has a second aircraft (738) arrived to operate some peak season flights and will only be around for a few more weeks before it reverts to one aircraft. So next year isn’t a huge reduction and may even be an increase in the off-peak summer provided TUI base the second (albeit part time) aircraft from May-October.

[LTNman]

I stopped using TUI when their Luton supplements were so high. Just felt like a rip off for wanting to use a local airport so they lost me.

[boeing_eng]

TUI's LTN program has certainly reduced over the last few Summers with various reasons apparent. The main one being TUI now uses EZY for many holidays ex LTN to a lot of destinations previously flown in-house. This also allows more flexibility with holiday duration's to the more popular destinations. This year, apart from the second TUI aircraft based during the six weeks of the peak Summer holidays, outside of this period there are a number of "W" pattern flights operated by non-based aircraft on at least two days a week (two on Fridays) Also, next Summer will reportedly see only 737's based with the 757's planned to be operated only from LGW, MAN & BHX.

[LTNman]

Seems Luton was a tad overcrowded the other day. With the airport now seeking put even more passengers through the front doors they will be turning to Japan for answers.

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/luton-airport-delays-flights-london-1665390 (https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/luton-airport-delays-flights-london-16653906)

https://i.imgur.com/cYiZk6d.jpg

[Lee Baker Street]

As LTNman has hi-lighted, London Luton Airport is becoming so popular there can be no reason to deny a second terminal. I think we need that new terminal now because it’s popularity continues to grow and grow and grow and the only thing holding it back is further facilities. Due to the proximity of London and its quick journey times anywhere north of the Thames that makes it...Magnetic.

[boeing_eng]

Its certainly not a case of LTN necessarily being popular.......Its more a case of an ever increasing amount of passengers being squeezed into inadequate facilities (with profit being the obvious motivator!) The newish high end shops etc may give a superficial good first impression but your average family just want somewhere to sit!)

[LTNman]

I think we need that new terminal now

Plenty of room at Southend and Stansted. Send the overflow there.

As LTNman has hi-lighted, London Luton Airport is becoming so popular

Yeah right, the public sings its praises.

https://www.airlinequality.com/airport-reviews/luton-airport/

Things are better but facilities are based on cramming people into a fixed space at minimum cost. Now they want to bust the terminals design limits for an even better experience.

What Luton does have going for it is location, location, location. The DART link will transform getting to the airport by public transport but once arrived at the terminal front door it will be down hill all the way.

[Spanish eyes]

As LTNman has hi-lighted, London Luton Airport is becoming so popular there can be no reason to deny a second terminal. I think we need that new terminal now because it’s popularity continues to grow and grow and grow and the only thing holding it back is further facilities. Due to the proximity of London and its quick journey times anywhere north of the Thames that makes it...Magnetic.




You have got to be the nutter that has stated on Facebook that despite the airport wanting to double passengers numbers pollution will drop due the introduction of electric aircraft at the airport.

Not in your lifetime mate.
https://i.imgur.com/th6ZrUR.jpg

[Buster the Bear]

Nothing like having T2 close to established residential areas! Of all the places to build T2, on an environmental nightmare ex council tip, toxic to the core, and very close to residential homes, plus stealing their mature open space park.

Not it too sure who is advising, but Dick Turpin lives on!

[boeing_eng]

Incidentally, the extremely poor terminal experience passengers endured during the last couple of Summers has also been cited as a reason why TUI have reduced flying from LTN. It remains to be seen what the long term future holds for TUI and LTN but I doubt the airport really care as long as they can get bums on seats (not necessarily in the terminal naturally!):}

[LTNman]

Somethings are clearly betting this year. Gone are the traffic queues to the terminal which was caused by a single lane drop off area with 4 pedestrian crossings. The new layout works but will move again in a few months time so the queues might or might not come back as submitted plans show the return of pedestrian crossings in the next drop off area although the layout could change.

The exit route works with the additional exit barriers but the buffer zone between the drop off area and the pay barriers will be removed when the pay barriers are moved to inside the ground floor of the new multi-storey. Any tailbacks will block the drop off lanes.

The passenger search area which is causing nightmares at Stansted and Southend seems to be working really well. I have yet to see any queues forming as passengers scan their own boarding cards before disappearing into the search area.

The problem is upstarts with too many people in what is still a small departure area with a new shopping centre attached. Plenty of seats though if you know where to look with most of them located in pier B but passengers wait to be called before heading down a pier.

[davidjohnson6]

I don't think pax are choosing to avoid pier B seating of their own choice. The airport wishes to maximise retail income which requires keeping pax in the shopping area for as long as possible... screens showing gates across the airport deliberately discourage people from leaving the shops until about 45 mins before expected push back (and a delayed inbound means a gate isn't advertised until later).

Furthermore, it is not really in the interests of tge airport to provide many seats around the shops. Seats take up space where another retail unit could be, and pax who can't find a seat end up wandering around the shops to kill the time (and often spending money !)

Yes elderly, disabled and vulnerable people need seats, but why would an airport really want to provide more than the absolute minimum number of seats near shops or direct pax to area away from shops any earlier than necessary ?

[boeing_eng]

Its not just the elderly and disabled etc who would prefer a seat whilst waiting for gate info. Whilst its certainly in the interest of the airport and shops to keep passengers near the retail outlets for as long as possible, the whole airside terminal experience is pretty miserable (unless you travel at one of the less busy periods) I regularly see passengers sitting on the floor in the corridors adjacent to the retail complex.

[LTNman]

Ltn bound traffic circling and a/c on taxiway not moving. Does anyone know why?

it was actually caused by a biz jet bursting 2 tyres on landing and needing a tow off the runway.

[Spanish eyes]

Sometimes the airport operator makes a special effort to enhance bits of the terminal when a special visitor is coming. Today is such a day as Princess Ann is coming to unveil a plaque. The problem for the airport was that the unveiling was to take place under all the heating ducts, cables, trunking, pipes and angle iron that adorns the roof space of the new build. Problem solved as a really nice looking black false ceiling has been installed over the last couple of weeks but only over the bit she and the special guests will be standing under. What a shame the budget can't stretch to the rest of the new build as one little section has been transformed into something that looks really nice while the rest of the new build looks like the ceiling from a factory production line.

[LTNman]

I don't know what time she is arriving but yes indeed the airport have been shamed into spending some money. It was the same when Chris Grayling came to the airport in December. Only the broken floor tiles where he was expected to walk were replaced with new tiles. Some of those tiles had been broken for the best part of 20 years and replaced with grey filler that looked like elephants spat out chewing gum.
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=545627922503517

[Falcon666]

See last week a screening request went in to the council to raise the cap from 18mil to 19 mil pax.
No material changes to terminal.

[LTNman]

You know when someone important is arriving at the terminal when the cleaners watch the management clean the floors.
https://i.imgur.com/VOpdpmV.jpg

Missed a bit
https://i.imgur.com/jB4Foaq.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/MqWRhnI.jpg

[LTNman]

See last week a screening request went in to the council to raise the cap from 18mil to 19 mil pax.
No material changes to terminal.


They also claim they don't need any extra stands but they have tendered for 8 new ones. Those old check-in desks 201 to 208 will eventually go back in together with a remodelling of that end of the terminal although nothing else including the departure lounge will change apart from less space per passenger.

[SARF]

Haha those top two pics are brilliant LTNman

[LTNman]

The second multi story which was having parking sold from August 19th has had that date dropped. There has been zero prospect of that car park being finished for a long time. At the time of writing not even the ramps have had concrete poured yet.

[pabely]

An El Al 777 in tonight from LHR and departing to TLV after midnight, night ban?

[LTNman]

If it can take off from Heathrow to get to Luton why can't it take off from Heathrow and head for Tel Aviv?

[pabely]

If it can take off from Heathrow to get to Luton why can't it take off from Heathrow and head for Tel Aviv?
And there is an flight to go direct from LHR to TLV a little later! Usually a 739 around that time, perhaps bookings so strong from Luton that it justified the upgrade?

[LTNman]

El Al flight tracker shows that as 00:45 departure from Heathrow except it is a Luton departure. Also how has that flight broken the Luton summer time ban?

[compton3bravo]

One can only assume that it is part of the slots allowed over the summer period which includes Wizz, DHL and Sun Express.

[AirportPlanner1]

I see that Wizz are starting service to Minsk from Budapest. Is there anywhere Wizz have started service to (beyond the ‘Iron Curtain’) that hasn’t gone on to be served from LTN? This is a fascinating destination I’d be interested in visiting!

[cj241101]

One can only assume that it is part of the slots allowed over the summer period which includes Wizz, DHL and Sun Express.

El Al must have an allocation of night slots to accommodate their LY314 which operates 5 nights a week, STD 2330 local time, often delayed past midnight.

[pabely]

I see that Wizz are starting service to Minsk from Budapest. Is there anywhere Wizz have started service to (beyond the ‘Iron Curtain’) that hasn’t gone on to be served from LTN? This is a fascinating destination I’d be interested in visiting!
Has got to be on the cards, only direct route is through LGW

[davidjohnson6]

Wizz fly to Astana / NurSultan (renamed earlier this year) from Budapest. Never been linked to Luton nonstop by Wizz but probably out of commercially viable range with an A320 family aircraft anyway

Baku and Nis could be candidates for a Luton route

Rumour on the web that FlyBosnia will link Sarajevo to London - but both Gatwick and Luton thought to be in the running for these flights

Worth remembering that not all Wizz routes from Luton to central / eastern Europe work. Both Kharkiv and Tuzla have been dropped

[CAP A330]

Expect G-WUKK tomorrow, flying to ATH.

[pabely]

If you are dropping off now, bring your electric car, it is now 75% cheaper!

[Spanish eyes]

Only while there are not many electric cars.

[pabely]

Only while there are not many electric cars.
It is a limited offeŕ to be reviewed later, new charging points as well

[ClearLand08]

So with G-WUKK having arrived, Wizzair now have 11 UK registered planes (G-WUKB through G-WUKL) made up of 7xA321 and 4xA320. Whilst they are all based at LTN, Wizzair has an interesting schedule which means only 9 of them require stands overnight. Last night, for example, G-WUKG was travelling to/from Constanta overnight and didn't arrive back to LTN until 07.05 (then departed to Bratislava at 11.10) and G-WUKL was travelling to/from Suceava overnight and landed back at LTN at 07.15 (then departed to Porto at 10.25). Nice use of scheduling given how full the overnight parking is.

[gilesdavies]

So with G-WUKK having arrived, Wizzair now have 11 UK registered planes (G-WUKB through G-WUKL) made up of 7xA321 and 4xA320. Whilst they are all based at LTN, Wizzair has an interesting schedule which means only 9 of them require stands overnight. Last night, for example, G-WUKG was travelling to/from Constanta overnight and didn't arrive back to LTN until 07.05 (then departed to Bratislava at 11.10) and G-WUKL was travelling to/from Suceava overnight and landed back at LTN at 07.15 (then departed to Porto at 10.25). Nice use of scheduling given how full the overnight parking is.

I've also noticed the morning Krakow flight is operated with a W9 (Wizzair UK) flight number, and operates into the airport with the other inbound Wizzair rush in the mornings which are all W6 numbers (Wizzair HU), and then flys back off to Krakow 30 mins late using the same W9 flight number. Seems they might be basing a Wizz UK aircraft at Krakow?

[avicon13]

Did not think LTN had any kind of ban...they do have noise quota periods for night time (23:30 - 06:00) but this allows up to 9650 movements annually in this period.

[LTNman]

Allegedly in place. A few blind eyes have been turned like the European Cup Finals. https://www.signatureflight.com/events/london-luton-airport-temporary-noise-closures

[LGS6753]

Another El Al 777 in today - is that peak demand or the Heathrow strike?

[pabely]

Another El Al 777 in today - is that peak demand or the Heathrow strike?
EL AL own Web site shows one tomorrow & Wednesday - In fact 3 flights today with the usual 739s doing the early & late, same on Thursday.

[compton3bravo]

I see the airport has increased its commercial passenger movements for winter 2019-20 by 430 to 38,778 from 38,348. If this has been reported before please accept my apologies.

[ericlday]

Can anyone confirm that El Al 777 make an intersection departure when on 26 ? Tia.

[Webby47]

I an confirm that I have witnessed at Dane Street (26/08 runway view) that quite a few ELAL 777 do indeed take off at the intersection 26 and seem to be airborne by the Firestation.

[pabely]

Can anyone confirm that El Al 777 make an intersection departure when on 26 ? Tia.
I have seen as such before in the past, suppose it depends in pax load, weight and airport weather conditions.

[ericlday]

Thanks Pabley

[Lee Baker Street]

I see the airport has increased its commercial passenger movements for winter 2019-20 by 430 to 38,778 from 38,348. If this has been reported before please accept my apologies.

compton3bravo, Ryanair still has 1 new route opening late summer and Wizzair has 5 new routes starting late summer and will be increasing frequencies on current routes. This will explain the increase in movements.

[compton3bravo]

Many thanks Lee. I'm afraid the twice weekly Ryanair to Seville passed me by. Early morning departure so some juggling around with departures for other routes and/or reduced frequencies.

[cj241101]

Can anyone confirm that El Al 777 make an intersection departure when on 26 ? Tia.

Must confuse ATC. Usual question when El Al call for clearance "are you intersection able?" will get a "no" if it's a "small" 737-800/900 which, being short to medium range, will be close to its max TOW with a relatively high (% wise) fuel load.. The much larger 777-200, being a long range aircraft, only going on a 4½ hour flight to Tel Aviv, would take barely 30% of its max fuel capacity (around 94000kgs), and will often accept an intersection departure even with a full passenger load.

When a BA 777 took the England football team to the 2002 World Cup it took 90,000kgs of fuel, close to its maximum fuel load, albeit with only 125 passengers on board. It went for an intersection departure from Alpha 1 and rotated before the fire station.

[ericlday]

Thank you cj for your answer, did see one the other day on FR24 but wasn't quite sure that the graphices were telling the true story bearing in mind that the Google map does not show Twy B to 08 intersection.

[toledoashley]

Has it been mentioned anywhere that Ryanair are starting 2x weekly to Seville this winter (starting 9 November)?

[gilesdavies]

Its a shame to see Ryanair cutting back on the Canary Island flights this winter...

Ryanair will be stopping there twice weekly services to Fuerteventura and Gran Canaria at the end of October.

Lanzarote remains, but cut from twice weekly to once a week and Tenerife remains with the twice weekly service.

While the airline did not offer an amazing schedule to the islands, at least it gave a link to the Canaries, which the airport has lacked for a number of years considering the number of flights from other UK airports and provided an alternative after Monarch departed.

easyJet provide a limited schedule to Lanzarote and Tenerife too, but not to the islands Ryanair are dropping. WIll be interesting to see if they maybe pick them up at a later date? Also weird Ryanair would drop flights to the Canary Islands at the start of the Winter schedule, when they are some of the most popular Winter sun destinations.

Also while on the subject of Ryanair, by jaw nearly dropped when I noticed they are starting flights to Krakow from November, operating four flights a week. So this now means Wizz, easyJet and Ryanair are flighting over this market, when eighteen months ago, not a single airline was operating this route! Surely Ryanair could make better choices on how to deploy that 737-800 from the airport?

Apologies if any of this has been discussed before.

[davidjohnson6]

London-Fuerteventura is served by the following:
LGW - Easyjet, Thomas Cook, Tui
STN - Jet2, Ryanair

London-Las Palmas / Gran Canaria is served by the following:
LGW - BA, Easyjet, Norwegian, Thomas Cook, Tui
STN - Jet2, Ryanair, Tui
LTN - Tui (occasionally in winter)

CAA stats indicate that Tenerife-South and Lanzarote were by far the 2 busiest routes from London to the Canaries in 2018
What can Ryanair bring to the market in winter between Luton and FUE or LPA ? The flight takes at least 4 hours and the more profitable customers (i.e. those with a suitcase in the hold) will travel for a week - and thus are probably more willing to use Stansted or Gatwick if price has a big difference. Ryanair have ended their packaged holiday service, and these 2 islands already have plenty of competitors to/from London. Can Ryanair really make decent profits from Luton to these 2 islands ?

[Spanish eyes]

Las Palmas summarises Luton’s gradual continuing decline in what many would consider to be a traditional holiday destination. 8 airlines do battle at STN and LGW while not a single airline can see an opportunity to make money from LTN despite having the route to themselves.

Fuerteventura has 5 airlines doing battle from both airports but no airline considers Luton to be viable.

With TUI now operating with mainly just a single aircraft clearly holidaymakers have had enough of LTN as the airport relies more and more on Eastern European passengers as a percentage of total passengers. With the council planning a second terminal neither the council, LLAL or the airport operator have a strategy for hanging on to traditional Luton passengers or creating new markets.