MANCHESTER - 8

[Ian Brooks]

At this rate STN will be back 13M

Ian B

[mickyman]

This willy rattling is very tedious - is there nothing

on the tv !!

MM

[Ian Brooks]

Didn`t think it was, just a throw away comment on the backward trend of STN
over the last couple of years which is probably back where it should be as nobody
really wanted to go there in the first place.
But that`s another story for another forum.


Ian B

[PQC]

Understand that all blacktop works finished around 10 August. Now just the remainder of the lighting works to finish and then commisioning. Airside Directive recently published which takes this into October.

Notice that TAS have a social in October re the R1 job. No doubt full details will be revealed by those in the know then!

[RoyHudd]

Resumed flights to TIP soon?:E

[delta154]

Iberia to change to a nightstopper from April 2012:

IB8502 MAD 2000 MAN 2120
IB8503 MAN 0725 MAD 1045

Flights still daily and still on the crj1000

[nigel osborne]

Ian yes I agree,I always said STNs massive growth was probably down to BAA LHR profits being used to shore up STN LCC ,presumably operating for almost nothing.:hmm:

Once it was clear that BAA had to sell STN ,then imagine all the LHR profits being used for STN will stop..and prices will have to go up to balance the books.

Looks like airlines flying into STN are spotting this and relocating .

Looks like the boom years for STN are coming to an end unless it gets a rich new owner willing to subsidies all the LCC again.:confused:

Nigel

[commit aviation]

Nigel

I think you may be a little wide of the mark. BAA as a general rule don't "do deals" to attract airlines.
The numbers are down because RYR took their bat & ball home as a result of this policy & others are heading south of the river to LGW who (having escaped BAA control & having an ex BAA boss to boot) now will use their new found freedom to "entice" carriers in.
MAN have a much more balanced portfolio of airlines & that in part is because it serves a different region. Just like everything else in life, the fortunes of airports can go down as well as up. Ultimately STN is the fourth largest in the country, so I think there may be a few others airports who face demise before this particular goose is cooked!

[Bagso]

Sorry its true !

STN lived on the fruits of LHR and LGW for years, NG is correct, prices have gone up to realistic levels and the only reason that kept the LoCo's using an airport in the middle of nowehere was price !

Now that attraction has gone "see Air Berlin , Air Asia etc" there is no reason to stay !

It's not the end of the line, far from it, but the original reason for building STN as another London airport for overspill from LHR and LGW has never been fulfilled.

It's market was artificially generated when the LoCos exploded on the scene,
had they not appeared it would have struggled to become little more than a regional airport !

[commit aviation]

I believe you have got that back to front: STN prices haven't gone up - its LGW prices which are coming down. They have become much more competitive & will continue to win new business on price - much of it at Stansted's expense. Either way the outcome is the same.
Certainly Air Asia have gone to LGW because of the deal LGW can now offer (plus slots which are now available which were not before.)
Air Berlin are retrenching on several fronts including LGW.

RYR threw their teddy out of the pram at MAN because they couldn't get the deal they wanted. Now they are back again because they realise its a market they need to be in even if the price is higher than they may want to pay. More power to MAPLC for holding out - a good call.
It is on record that RYR have reduced their presence at STN because the current deal is not one they like. They believe they will get a better deal from a potential new owner & will offer more business if that deal is forthcoming. ......In light of which it could be interesting to see what happens if MAG buy the place! :\

[Manchester Kurt]

DfT predicting 55m passengers by 2040.

UK aviation forecasts 2011 - Publications - Department for Transport (http://www.dft.gov.uk/publications/uk-aviation-forecasts-2011)

Page 149.

[clareview]

Whats all this talk about London area airports and cross subsidy got to do with Manchester?

[roverman]

I was reading this report over the weekend, and when thinking about traffic predictions it is interesting to note that the DfT's model was significantly wrong with recent projections for MAN. On pages 37 and 40 the report presents the forecast vs actual tables for both passengers and ATMs as evidence of the accuracy of the modelling. However, figures for MAN are notably out on both counts, in particular with ATMs. There is no commentary to explain why MAN has not performed in accordance with predictions. The tables show MAN achieved significantly less throughtput than predicted yet there is no corresponding increase against forecasts at other competing airports to explain where MAN's traffic went. Competing airports generally performed closer to forecasts. These results may support the notion that MAN has a rather unique market profile which does not respond in the same way to economic and social trends affecting other airports with a more defined market i.e. Heathrow- all full service flag carriers; Stansted/ Luton / Liverpool - mainly locos. Interesting to note that the growth predictions on pages 149 and 160 single out MAN amongst the top five airports as being the only one to sustain growth beyond 2030. This assumes capacity is constrained of course, and there are no more runways. In terms of movements both LHR and LGW are shown to be effectively full now. MAN certainly has the potential to get back to its 2006 peak of 225000 ATMs and maybe some more, but I have no idea how it could achieve the forecast 400000 ATMs using the present segregated mode dual-runway configuration. It does make you wonder what assumptions have been built into these models.

[spannersatcx]

Way back earlier in this thread, someone stated CX would be starting pax operations via Zurich this winter, and it was gospel as they were told by some salesmen in the USA.:eek:

Winter schedule is out and it's not on there. :{

[Manchester Kurt]

Eastern promise: Link-up of Manchester and Beijing airports could bring billions in Chinese investment | Manchester Evening News - menmedia.co.uk (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1457463_eastern-promise-link-up-of-manchester-and-beijing-airports-could-bring-billions-in-chinese-investment)

[zfw]

Manchester will not do more than 25 million in the next 10 years, when the PLC was spouting ridiculous figures of 35 million by 2015 we just laughed.
{It was quoted recently again by one senior member of management}
Do the sums..... We have Liverpool, Leeds, Sheffield, even Blackpool, these were little tin pot airports 10 years ago, but were in the Manchester catchment area for charters.
As the locos carry on their march these traditional charters have all but disappeared and their passengers?, gone to these airports for loco flights.
Manchester does not need Cathy, why would it?, with the far east and Asia served by Emirates, Etihad, Qatar, Singapore, and where do we expand on the USA services?, American, Continental, Delta, USair to name but a few, we may be able to fit in a direct west coast but i bet that will be on a 787 when they arrive, long and thin routes.
Manchester max figures 22.5 million in 2007 was fuelled by every one and his dog borrowing money and cheap flights, that bubble has gone, were back to 18.4 million at the moment. In 2007 T2 had 7.8 million pax, its now down to 4.5 million, hence Monarch and Ryanair being based there to increase footfall and revenue.
We may get a slight increase to around 20 million or so in the next few years but as for 35-50 million, it ain't going to happen in our lifetime.

zfw

[TSR2]

Sadly I have to agree with you except on all but one point.

As the locos carry on their march these traditional charters have all but disappeared

Traditional charters are undoubtedly on the decline but at well over 5 million ppa, still represents over 30% of Manchester's total passenger numbers. The question is, will the Loco's continue to expand at the same or higher rate than the decline in charter passengers given the increased competition from other airports.

[JSCL]

As someone in Manchester I still stand my ground that I refuse to use loco carriers - more than prepared to pay more for a better quality service. Problem is, having flown Thomson in June on their 738 to Naples it was like being on easy jet with legroom and that was disappointing. I still think a decent chunk/percentage of people are prepared to pay that bit more for a better service, these charter guys need to deliver it and market it. I would always prefer to fly Monarch or Britannia based on service in the past, now I feel competition is stiff to the extent of completely ripping out the idea of a good experience flying.

[Ian Brooks]

ZFW
Blackpool and Sheffield are both going backwards
Leeds is almost full unless they do some quite major expansion to parking areas
Liverpool does well in loco market but Easy really wants to be at Manchester
and Ryanair could pull the plug in a flash if they fall out with airport
authorities.

Ian

[vinnym]

Sounds like you have your rose tinted glasses on Ian, Ryanair could just as easily fall out with MAN and pull the plug there, they already have done so once in the recent past.

[14 loop]

RYR threw their teddy out of the pram at MAN because they couldn't get the deal they wanted. Now they are back again because they realise its a market they need to be in even if the price is higher than they may want to pay. More power to MAPLC for holding out - a good call.

Is this what has happened at MAN? There is a story that MANPLC has indeed done a deal with RYR to get them back rather than RYR going back to MAN and paying their previously announced fees.

Discuss.

[pwalhx]

Hasn't it been discussed at length in the past do we need to ressurect the will FR stay or will they throw their toys out of the pram debate again. MOL said he had to pay more than he wanted to come back, maybe he did maybe he didn't. The one thing to be sure about is expect the unexpected

[Ian Brooks]

Vinnym

Not a problem if they do,and as you say they have done it before and we are still here.
Manchester has probably the best mix of carriers of any airport in the UK,
you can choose what ever floats your boat Charter/loco/Legacy both European
and long haul ,new carriers are joing all the time and we have plenty of parking
and runway space.
Charters are a dying breed as more and more people go for flexibility and do their
own thing. I used to work for a large travel concern both in holiday and business travel and could see the IT market changing a long time ago. Very few people I work with would dream of going on a package holiday now as they book everything
on the internet as individual items taylored to their needs rather than the otherway
round even if it means flying from LPL or LBA etc
Of choice I would never fly Ryanair but many will but, I will always try and use Manchester as my airport of choice, not that I am flying much at moment
but thats another story as they say

Ian B

[spannersatcx]

Manchester does not need Cathy whoever she may be!:ugh:

[TSR2]

Very few people I work with would dream of going on a package holiday now as they book everything
on the internet as individual items taylored to their needs rather than the otherway

Yes, that may be true. I have noticed that you can book independently on the internet far cheaper than tour operator prices but this very much depends on where you want to go. If your selected destination is 4 hours flying time or more, you can often get a holiday package from a tour operator cheaper than booking independently if you search through the various major tour operators on-line.

[rkenyon]

Have you actually flown on EasyJet?

I'm normally a full-cost payer, but for shorter flights EasyJet are fantastic. Legroom is fine (I'm 6'3"), and I'd definitely prefer to buy-on-board rather than get a pathetic BA 'sweet or savoury' snack. OK, I have to pay for booze, but I'd prefer to do that than fly indirect via LHR or wherever.

As for charters... Wow, my knees have still not recovered from my last Monarch flight a few years ago :)

[doublesix]

Not a single comment re the proposed China routes that may be opened up soon?? I'm not in the know but seems strange that no comments have been made particularly since a new route to say for example spain or germany usually evokes comments.

[JSCL]

@rkenyon I've flown EZY out of LPL twice in the last 5 years, so yes I have but not exactly often. It's an okay experience and I'm still not too bothered on short haul, although I do choose BMI for MAN-LHR but I did quite like my Flybe experience from MAN just recently, despite the deafening noise of those dash 8's. But for longer flights, I want room and comfort. Maybe I'm just too used to flying the 'full service' way with Qatar, BA, BMI and Cityjet.

[Skipness One Echo]

Don't CityJet have six abreast in the RJ85 and Qatar have ten abreast in the B777? Tis cosy is that.....VLM operating as CityJet do of course have loads of room on the Fokker 50, I did enjoy that. Unless your in business class, BMI is no longer full service alas.

Note : Qatar are NINE abreast in Y, it's Emirates that are ten abreast. Apologies.

[JSCL]

I've only ever been on an F50 Cityjet, first on Qatar often and a variety of bus/eco on BMI and BA.

[easyflyer83]

You cannot deny anyone the pleasure of full service if thats what they want. The problem is is that for your average economy passenger on a discounted ticket (which is a large proportion) there is actually not an awful lot of difference on short haul. Which then comes down to snobbery. Again nothing wrong with that, I can be snobby about my clothes. You would never get me wearing primark yet my Armani t shirt purchased last summer has several tiny holes in it. But i guess i admit i'm a bit of a name snob.

At GB they were steadily increasing capacity of both the A320/A321 in line with BA. 168 was the capacity of the A320 by the takeover date. Take into account the added wardrobes and bulkheads and the few extra inches on the first 4 rows (club convertor seats) and the seat pitch is very similar to Easyjet. The 29" relates to the last rows of Easyjet a/c especially on the A320 which is very tight. You can enjoy food and a wide choice of drink (to much choice if you ask me) you have to pay for it but it's on board unlike many full service flights.

I'm not denying that full service has it's plus points, it's definitely how they differenciate themselves, but much of the snobbery is just that.

[AGPwallah]

Having flown Qatar B777 earlier this year I would point out their seating configuration is 3-3-3.

[AircraftOperations]

Not a single comment re the proposed China routes that may be opened up soon?? I'm not in the know but seems strange that no comments have been made particularly since a new route to say for example spain or germany usually evokes comments.

Wasn't sure that agreements existed for any non-London airport to have a direct service to China, and pretty sure that BA/VS would kick up a stink because they wouldn't want to operate one from MAN.

[JSCL]

@AO

Cathay...

[viscount702]

Air China have the rights to a daily service to PEK but have taken them up

[roverman]

Apparent lack of excitement about a China service is no doubt a considered reaction by many industry observers who appreciate that this week's news release is just another small step rather than a leap toward this potential development. Looks like the MAN marketing team have continued their efforts to secure a direct service but they will know as well as any that it will take time. Whatever the tie up is with Beijing Airport, it would appear to be largely symbolic, but this is perhaps the way you do business with the Chinese, a slow and patient courting. It is perhaps wise to let the new capacity to the Gulf bed in, and to ensure that the long-standing SQ service remains viable. Hopefully the UK-Far East market will strengthen and then the time could be right for a direct China service. 787s will be around in say 2013 (although not sure about Air China), or perhaps a 747 combi could be a winner on MAN-PEK. We'll see.

[delta154]

I think the lack of excitement regarding the MEN article is that its overhyped (there are 2 other articles on the exact same subject that state this does NOT mean a route is imminant.)
Also, there seems to be a perrenial MEN article that always seems to state a route to China is in the offing, or India, or Thailand.

No doubt there will be a similar press release again next year.......

[mybrico]

China and for that matter Japan or Korea via the Gulf is a non starter for most people it takes too long, you may do it once or if you are on a budget but its going the wrong way for six hours. The Polar / Russia route is by far the best and so in my opinion the Gulf really doesn't compete to that part of the world. As a regular traveller to both Beijing and Shanghai loads can very thin on the BA and VS services to LHR even at just once a day. Hong Kong is different because its a regional hub. I really doubt that MAN can support a service to either Shanghai or Beijing. Maybe if tourist numbers from China increase with a relaxing of Visa requirements. Finally there is no open skies agreement and as yet London is not that well connected to Chinese cities.

[merchant sailors]

AY, KL, AF and LH all offer MAN pax Chinese markets and compete with BA via LON. Likes of AY offer shortest journey while KL now serves 5 cities in China.

The facts are not enough pax yet are taking these routes. When these volumes pick up their demand becomes transparent to airline network planners. This will be when they start to show more interest.

CX has a strong ethnic Cantonese market in Manchester, can offer South East Asia without visa issues and serves Oz/Nz markets too.

However they are up against EK, QR and EY who are swamping the markets with their capacity making the yield potential from MAN less attractive. Same applies to MH.

Perhaps for MAN to break through on the Asia markets again with more direct links, services with Air Asia X, Jetstar ans "son of SQ" will be the realistic way to compete with middle east capacitt and yield prospects.

Or if a significant company in either China or the Northwest has staff travelling every day in J class between the regions it could become a catalyst for a start of service. This is what happened with MAN - PHL and i heard was a also a factor in EY choosing MAN back in 2006.

Any of you know about a potential company that has this traffic flow currently?

[SN146]

SWISS last A332 was flown to MAN yesterday, presumably to be painted at Air Livery: anybody in the know as to its new operator? According to unconfirmed sources, it should be SN...

[Bagso]

...Route news in the M E N has been a work of fiction for years !:ok:

[tourismman]

SN146 Hi,

I believe it could be for Air Australia,previously Strategic Airlines.AGC or VC.Their first 332 was sourced from SWISS.

Lime twist in tail of rebranded airline Air Australia | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/lime-twist-in-tail-of-rebranded-airline-air-australia/story-e6frg95x-1226127606699)

[lasernigel]

AY, KL, AF and LH all offer MAN pax Chinese markets and compete with BA via LON. Likes of AY offer shortest journey while KL now serves 5 cities in China.


Going out to Hong Kong on Weds with AY. Looked at Emirates mainly for airmiles on my frequent flyer card. Travel time as flight goes from DXB via BKK is really long, 20 -24 hrs toatl with layover. Cheapest fare with realistic time was £1200. AY with total flight time 14hrs fare was down at £690. OK company pays but thats a big saving.:ok:

[Mr A Tis]

Yup, I'm headin Shanghai / HKG in a few weeks. the Gulf routes add at least 4 hours to the trip & mean a stupid o'clock plane change- and cost more to boot. So please people don't keep sayin the gulf boys have these routes covered-they haven't. I use Swisss or Luftie & AY is def the quickest.
With one of the largest Chinese communities in Europe, there is scope for a pax / combi service. I presume the main reason CX shy away is to protect their LHR operation. So, I hope MA are getting cosy with Air China or more likely China Eastern.

[Haven't a clue]

I'm off to HKG again on Thu. Current routing for my 5 trips a year is to LGW thence to LHR. Used to route through MAN and shuttle to LHR for a while, but BA's enthusiasm for cancelling domestics at the first sign of LHR overload (low viz, snow, ATC failure etc etc) put me off. Looking at AY for my Nov trip but concerned at 35 min connection in HEL. Would never consider routing via the Gulf.

Would indeed welcome a direct MAN/HKG routing, even at a small premium.

[ETOPS]

Haven't a clue

Current routing for my 5 trips a year is to LGW thence to LHR.

I'd be fascinated to see which airline this is with............


but BA's enthusiasm for cancelling domestics

Seems to lack a certain logic.

PS I use BA MAN - LHR twice a week (for 14 years) and have no qualms at all - I'm on the 1403 this afternoon............

[Haven't a clue]

ETOPS - Good spot! Especially as the helo connection is sadly history.

You must be lucky with shuttle reliability. Last year I sat in T5 while the first wave of snow came down and watched the domestics vanish from the board; earlier that year (or maybe the year before) Swannage radar failed for a while, and again the domestics vanished. A year or so earlier I was on board shuttle whose starter failed - I ended up on a later flight and on the 0215 boat home - not my best travel experience! I must be a Jonah.

[Mr Mac]

You must be flying on odd days as I fly this route on a frequent basis (approx 6 times a year). Outbound EK020 to DXB and then EK380 to HKG direct, return EK381 and good old EKO17 back to Man. Total flying time approx 14.30hrs outbound and 15.30 return but no stop in BKK. You do have the DXB two step but never found it an issue, and it does break the journey a bit. Used to fly CX when they did the Man HKG route with a Paris stop I think it was. However now no route, and my experiance with CX recently in the far east has been on par with BA. Therfore avoid if possible.

[madshopper]

i have flown CX when it served MAN, but then after the service was dropped.. i went via FRA, AMS, DXB, and LHR.
I am due to fly to hkg in nov and its only taking me under 15hrs including transit time in cdg.
I remember last winter when it was the cold snap in december:{, there were two CX flights that were redirected to MAN cos of the closure of LHR bound for hkg. surely manchester would be able to cope with the CX 744's again or even a 773 if they came back to MAN. There is a sizeable chinese community up north and by coming back, it saves the hassle of going via LHR.
i thought a while ago there were talks of man-zur-hkg, what happened to that?

[Manchester Kurt]

August 2011 up 3.62%

Manchester Airport : Traffic Statistics (http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/manweb.nsf/Content/TrafficStatisticsArchive)

[hard_landing]

R.E. China Routes...

I have a friend that works at MAN and he has told me that China Cargo Airlines is coming into MAN with a charter flight on the 20th/21st (one of those days) Sep and have put a tender out for POSSIBLE scheduled flights. I know this is freight rather than pax, but who knows...maybe it'll lead to pax flights too.

My friend said that the charter is for pigs of all things...although another friend of mine has sent pigs out on a couple of Great Wall flights...if I remember rightly.

Anyway...China Cargo Airlines is the freight arm of China Eastern I think so maybe that's a where a pax link to China may come from.

HL

[AircraftOperations]

Saw what I thought was an Il-76 on the ramp at MAN today.

Was interested to know, if my eyes were correct, what it was doing. Presumably AOG or AID related?

[TSR2]

Your eyes are correct. It was RA-76950 operating flight VDA4802.

[Nomoresteerage]

Insider News North West (http://www.insidermedia.com/insider/north-west/58466-berryman-hails-manchester-success-emirates)


Laurie Berryman, the UK vice-president for airline Emirates, has hailed the success of the carrier's A380 service from Manchester to Dubai, one year on from its launch.
He said: "I’m delighted to say we’ve exceeded expectations in every way. Running first class for the first time from Manchester was a step into the unknown for us but little did we know in September 2011 that within a year we’d be running a third daily flight. Manchester can be justly proud of being one of the first airports to run A380 flights."
Berryman said that Emirates flew 33,000 passengers in July from Manchester, up 15 per cent year-on-year. He added that cargo is performing well: "Cargo tends to be the Cinderella of aviation, but it’s vital for us – we’ve seen a 44 per cent increase since the introduction of the third service. The demand is there for freight."
He remains optimistic, despite nagging concerns over oil prices and Airport Passenger Duty: "Passengers in the UK pay 12-15 times more than in Europe. We’ve done all the lobbying we can. There needs to be more balance because aviation is a driver of economic growth."

[AircraftOperations]

Thanks for the confirmation of the Il-76.

Have since been told that a sick TCX machine at Montego Bay might be the reason behind the flight.

[JackRalston]

I'm at the viewing park at the moment and when the emirates A380 was on approx. 5m final 23R, i saw an aircraft crossing the ILS perpendicular from the South to the North at about 3000ft. Any ideas? This was at about 1310

[delta154]

China Cargo Airlines is coming into MAN with a charter flight on the 20th/21st (one of those days) Sep

It is indeed Wednesday 21st. Comes in from AMS at 16:00 and out again at 17:25 as CKK8762.

[Betablockeruk]

Re ILS crossing today

TOM and EZY crossed ILS and looped back, presumably for spacing after the A380.

[JackRalston]

Betablockeruk

Thanks, thought I saw a TOM!

[SplashDown]

Not due spacing but due weather. Quite a few hefty storms around. Had us holding at Trent on the way up with a few others due Dayne having bad weather.

[spannersatcx]

China Cargo Airlines used to be Greatwall and if I remember correctly they did a shipment of breeding pigs a few years ago.

[palomboj]

Just heard this on the radio

Bomb threats force plane to land - UK News - News - WalesOnline (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/2011/09/07/bomb-threats-force-plane-to-land-91466-29383079/)

[Mr A Tis]

Did I miss this one?
Blue Island starting a daily MAN-Jersey from 31.10.11. Not the best time to start, but I guess with Baby leaving maybe there's room for a FLYBE competitor. Wonder how many people know about it though?
Nobody seems to have taken up the Baby Cork, which has been left to Aer Lingus /Aer Arran.

[StoneyBridge Radar]

Singapore slings Manchester to tourism top spot | Manchester Evening News - menmedia.co.uk (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/business/s/1458388_singapore-slings-manchester-to-tourism-top-spot)

[delta154]

From 2nd November, British Airways will increase MAN-BLL to 3 daily on Wedsdays thursdays and Fridays, making the flight 14 weekly overall.

new flight is BA8249/BA8250 arriving at MAN 13:25, departing at 13:55.

(Yes, you did read the above right, BA expanding international flights from the regions, even if it is via Sun Air. Who would have thought it :ok:)

[JSCL]

BA have no input on that expansion though, it's Sun Air's choice and they just get to fly the flag as it were, hardly an argument for BA expanding ;)

[delta154]

BA have no input on that expansion though, it's Sun Air's choice

Oh yeah I know, thats why I made the point of putting sun air in the post. However, with BA on the side of the aircraft, BA flight numbers and bookable on the BA website, its good enough for me :ok:

[Jamie2k9]

Emirates SkyCargo carried on flights from MAN may see a slight drop as EK currently carry cargo from Ireland on MAN - DXB. EK will have 198 tonnes available from DUB weekly.

[lasernigel]

Looking at AY for my Nov trip but concerned at 35 min connection in HEL

If you fly out of MAN to HEL then HK you actually have 65 mins transfer time. As we are a Non Schenegen country I landed at gate 32 and the HK flight goes out of Gate 36, less than 200 meters and no passport control. I am flying back tomorrow with a 60 min transfer so will tell you how it goes.

Outbound EK020 to DXB and then EK380 to HKG direct, return EK381 and good old EKO17 back to Man. Total flying time approx 14.30hrs outbound and 15.30 return but no stop in BKK

But nearly £200 more expensive than AY for similar dates.

[Haven't a clue]

Thanks lasernigel for the info - I calculated a 35 min transit for the evening MAN departure, and felt a tad uncomfortable. But if as you say the transit is completely airside and the gates are close together then maybe ok. Having said that my last flight fm HEL to MAN was held back waiting for HK transit pax, so maybe AY do make the effort to look after pax, unlike some others...

[lasernigel]

Got back from HK via HEL on time. Landed 30 mins early at HEL. All you have to do is go through security and you're straight back in the region of gates 32-40 the non-Schenegen ones.

One downside, at Hong Kong duty free they will not sell alcohol in sealed bags so you can't buy it due to the liquid regulations at security at HEL. However you can use their duty free tho more expensive than HK. I smoke and a 220 carton Marlboro in HK worked out at £12.:ok:

[OltonPete]

Swiss appear to be taking the Basle over from BMI this winter.

RJ100's scheduled to replace the A319.

Departs Manchester 11.30 Monday-Friday & 10.40 Sunday with no
Saturday service.

Heathrow - Basle still showing three daily BMI A319.

Pete

[Zippy Monster]

A shame in a way... but the loads are probably more suited to an Avro than a 319.

Whenever I've flown the route, most passengers seem to have been holding Swiss-issued codeshare boarding cards with the LX flight number anyway.

Only problem is the prices will go back up, I expect. Had some dirt cheap return tickets on the route with BMI; it was always quite a bit more when operated by Swiss.

Still, at least the link will continue, particularly if BMI is sold and ended up exiting Star Alliance. There's definitely a market - unfortunately probably not quite enough for a daily A319.

-------

EDIT: Further to this; it appears to be a straight aircraft swap. The BMI A319 will instead operate a return BSL-BCN-BSL for Swiss between its Heathrow duties (effectively a wet-lease with a LX flight number but not a BD one, and not bookable through BMI.) The RJ100 previously used for this will presumably be what operates to Manchester.

[MANFlyer]

Airport Passenger Duty: "Passengers in the UK pay 12-15 times more than in Europe. We’ve done all the lobbying we can. There needs to be more balance because aviation is a driver of economic growth."

Yep, it's an absolute disgrace what we pay here. :mad:

On the subject of AY and HEL, I have been using them pretty regularly to Asia in the last 12-18 months. They have some great prices in J and as others have said, transitting at HEL is very easy.

Having said that I went to HKG last week on LX via ZRH, who also have a short transit time. However, the bussing to and from the bird in ZRH is a little frustrating at times. I am hoping that the new B pier at ZRH for non schengen flights opening shortly means the MAN flights will stop us being crammed on the bus.

I sadly don't tend to get many firsts at MAN these days so I was pleasantly surprised and bemused to land 'the wrong way' on runway 2 a couple of days ago. I have never even seen another aircraft do that!. I have actually taken off 'the wrong way' on that runway once about 5 years ago on a very full SQ 772ER nonstop to SIN, where we taxied down, turned around on the loop at the bottom and took off. On Sunday we just spun around on the runway and came back.

[TURIN]

Any news on Biman?

Last I heard the timings had changed. Now arriving about 1700hrs (ish).

[tHOmMY777]

"It also said that ZB were starting Bologna as well (15 April 2012) so I don't think it will be Air Europa"

http://www.pprune.org/6523967-post2145.html



Hi all! Anybody knows if there's any news about MAN-BLQ?

[pobox557]

some people will pay that little extra for a non stop flight MAN-HKG, just like down south.... LHR-HKG

hearing from family and friends and other passengers needs, people like to fly but are scared from sense direction, worried getting lost, looking for flights/gates or language barriers from a transfer flight.

There is nothing better to board a flight, then get off at the destination.

But i know people wont get on a BA flight cause of the luggage allowance and the price you pay over service.

[Ringwayman]

Finally Iberia have issued a press release about the launch of MAN-MAD (and also GLA). The release included this rough translation:

"Both routes serve both for point to point traffic between Madrid and two cities, and to bring traffic to the long-haul network of Iberia, particularly significant in the case of Manchester, the second city of United Kingdom and an important financial and cultural center"

We don't want to go down "which is the 2nd city" scenario again but that's an interesting observation from an airline!

[allosaurus]

I always thought London was the second city:)

[AircraftOperations]

I was told Biman 2x weekly. Arriving between approx 1700 and 1800 on each day, and going out about 90 minutes later.

But things change with BG.

[Ioniser]

What make and model of a/c is used on this route?
I have seen a high wing, twin jet type on stand but know not what it is .:confused:

[planenut321]

That would be a Dornier 328JET you are seeing. The flight is operated by Sun Air of Scandinavia which is a subsidy of BA. Have a fleet of JS31, Dornier 328-110 and Dornier 8328JET aircraft.

[Ioniser]

Thank you, nut,:)

[rutankrd]

They NOT a BA subsidiary but rather a franchise operator.
They PAY BA to fly in their colours and use the BA reservation system.

Their routes and frequencies have nothing to do with BA !

[easyflyer83]

Actually though BA do have a say in what they operate. GB had a hard time at MAN when they wanted to launch ATH, FCO and TLV. BA wouldn't allow it.

[TartinTon]

Maersk had the same thing at BHX and actually had a route pulled from them when it became too profitable - BHXFCO

[CabinCrewe]

Not sure its a clear cut as that. Cant believe that for a minute. The ATH and FCO routes were dogs if I remember correctly.

[easyflyer83]

That was what management of GB were saying.

[j636]

Iberia to change to a nightstopper from April 2012:

IB8502 MAD 2000 MAN 2120
IB8503 MAN 0725 MAD 1045

Flights still daily and still on the crj1000


Not night stopping anymore. Flights move an hour lather. Arr 18.05 - Dep 18.35.

[GayFriendly]

Maersk had the same thing at BHX and actually had a route pulled from them when it became too profitable - BHXFCO


Maersk didn't ever operate BHX-FCO, it was BA then BA Regional until it was dropped. And if it was so profitable why on earth has no one else picked it up apart from (briefly) WW?

As for GB from MAN I can actually believe BA stopped certain routes from happening to protect feed on the Shuttles

[crewmeal]

Sorry GF your wrong Maersk did operate it but as a franchise as were the rest of the routes. Quite often Maersk would operate a BA regional route. To the passengers it was ALL BA. I hated flying on those CRJ 200's far too small for a route like FCO.

[Mr A Tis]

I remember flying MAN-FCO on a BA(R) 2 class B733 in May 2000. It was 100% full & the guy next to me was from Granada TV & said he booked the last seat the day before at a whopping £500 return (economy)..... but of course BA couldn't turn a profit in on any route full or not from MAN (so they say, of course :hmm:).

[BTNH]

I wonder for last 3 weeks (seeing it every day) what the blimb is doing? Anybody knows what is doing?

[TURIN]

Came right over my house today during my 8yr olds birthday party.

The screams of 11 little girls when they spotted it brought most of the stray dogs for 10 miles around!

[pobox557]

China Cargo Airlines used to be Greatwall and if I remember correctly they did a shipment of breeding pigs a few years ago.


is not to be confused with China Airlines Cargo which is based in Taiwan.... China Cargo and Greatwall Cargo is based in China

[David Sharpe]

Can anybody tell me which Tour Operator has been using the Saturday Czech Holidays service to Palma, and whether it will return for Summer 2012 ?

[Jamie2k9]

Will not be coming back next year unless Czech Holidays operate from Prage base.

[Ian Brooks]

Why not? they have operated for a couple of years with the old CSA A321
into Dublin before they got their own aircraft, they are part of EU so can be chartered by any tour operator if the price is right.

Ian B

[Jamie2k9]

They are using the time that it operates MAN this year to operate Cork instead next summer.

[backtrack_32]

Hi there, sorry this is off the usual subject and sorry again if its in the wrong place... but can any one tell me when and where i can find out about any jobs coming up at man, particulary the Ramp side of things?


thanks in advance!

[Jamie2k9]

Ramp side of things would be mainly handling agents. Should be a list on the airport website.

[spannersatcx]

On the 'ramp' there are a multitude of differing jobs, do you mean the airport operated side of things, like airfield ops, security or a/c handling, baggage loading, catering, fueling, engineering, cleaning, or something else. It will either be with the airport direct or with any of the companies that supply services to the airlines etc. You need to narrow it down a bit to be more accurate.

[backtrack_32]

Thanks for the respose so far, im talking more push backs and baggage, as i thought this would be via the handling agents! I suppose with us going into winter not as many jobs will be up at the moment!

[750XL]

Have a look in Feb/Mar for the season summer jobs at Swissport etc.

Swissport use the agency Premier Work Support for recruitment

[rod_1986]

Hopefully someone will have a clue about this...

What's the deal with flights to YVR from MAN? Wikipedia (I know, rubbish source) says Transat are starting YVR on the 29th Oct. However their website only has it from 4th May 2012 after TCX appear to finish it on the 29th Oct.

Any ideas? I'm loathe to traipse down south so my best other option to get to Vancouver in January appears to be KLM via AMS...

[backtrack_32]

'Have a look in Feb/Mar for the season summer jobs at Swissport etc.

Swissport use the agency Premier Work Support for recruitment'

Thanks for that, ill have a look into it!

[TURIN]

Rod, the rumour is that Air Canada have applied for slots for summer 2012.

Nothing new there but it may well tie up with your info.

[Skipness One Echo]

Air Canada apply for slots every year since they left but have been happy to let BMI feed them over LHR, I'll let that one hang in the air for a mo.....

[roverman]

TCX are pulling out of MAN-Canada and so next year Air Transat are taking up the slack with 10 flights per week. Not sure how that breaks down across the destinations. YVR tends to be a summer-only route.

As for AC, true, they apply for slots every year and then hand them back. Not sure what the game is there. bmi may not be flying MAN-LHR next year (they may not even exist) and so it could be different.

[MKY661]

Still no evidence on MAN's website about EasyJet and Monarch moving terminals. When Air France moved last year it was announced by now. Manchester Airport : Which Terminal Full List (http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/manweb.nsf/content/whichterminal)

I have heard KLM are moving as well.

[Cazza_fly]

I have heard KLM are moving as well.

It would make sense for KLM to move to T3 and operate together using the same area as Air France.

[zfw]

Monarch now moving night of 14-15 Nov confirmed.Easyjet not signed up yet but hopefully before christmas to T1, KL probably before christmas but depends on Easy move, and........ _ _ next March.:hmm:

zfw

[easyflyer83]

Don't know what's been signed or not but as far as people at the base are concerned, including base management, the move is still on. Easyjet are supposed to be having Monarch's check in area.

[learjet50]

Rumour control here

Easy jet are having sole use of stands 1,5,2 and 4 and are converting the area inside the terminal around gate 3 A/B/C to become an esay jet holding area / Lounge

Should please FlyBe and Jet 2

Rumour control over and out :confused::confused:

[MKY661]

Pier C is going to be pretty dead when ZB move out. I have never even seen a Jet2 737-300 there except for gate 21 which i think that gate is only used by Jet2, never seen anything else there anyway. Will this mean that TCX will be using pier C mainly because Pier B looks pretty full with LS & EZY and when I have used T1 over the years Pier B seems full with LS and Pier C looks full with ZB and TCX seem to use both piers.

Head also that ZB will mainly be using remote stands at T2. I dont like getting on buses to planes, rather go though an airbridge but looks like I am going have to live with it. :\

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Are Ryanair going to use Airbridges/steps/bus to aircraft?

[Tight Seat]

ZB will have no more remote stands out of T2 than they have out of T1, that's the contract. Check in will be so much better in T2, loads my room. It will be a good move for Mon.

[learjet50]

Re Ryanair Airbridges ?? Wash you mouth out they cost money

I Understand they are coaching onto remote stands from a Stand on T2

I know RYR are notliked by a ;ot but they give the public waht they want and u book cheap u travel cheap

I wish them luck and they deserve it cos in this world u only get wat u pay for

RYR Knockers READ the Small Print When u book because I am convince lots dont



Millions do and sing the praises of RYR

[ETOPS]

Did you say "Ryanair Knockers" ?

http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/11_02/ryanair1611_673x800.jpg

[lfc84]

LOL :)

:ok:

[JSCL]

Traveled RYR from MAN-DUB just over a week ago in the early morning, late evening return - departed from a stand at T2 which had an airbridge but walked all the way down the stairs and walked to the plane (seems pointless IMO) and on return, was on the bus back to the terminal building (also seems pointless).

But as someone who can't stand LoCo experiences - I didn't mind this flight actually. Having flew a TOM 757 recently to Naples, I found RYR's flight to DUB from MAN last week much better than that TOM flight. Food was 'okay', just like any old airline really for the breakfast bap thing. Can't complain, 15 of us flew and neither had a complaint to make!

[AircraftOperations]

Ryanair might not want to pay for an airbridge stand, but don't want a remote stand either.

Buses back to UK Airport terminal buildings from Irish flights are to allow passengers to avoid passport control in an international arrivals terminal.

[zfw]

Monarch will be mostly remote, thats the agreement.

[PhilW1981]

I landed at MAN from BJV last Tuesday morning at around 3am, I was very disorientated on the approach, didn't recognise any landscape or buildings as I usually do, was also half asleep as we taxied but it appeared to me that we landed then backtracked, can anyone advise if we landed on 24L as a result of the runway works on 24R?

[Cloud1]

I landed at MAN from BJV last Tuesday morning at around 3am, I was very disorientated on the approach, didn't recognise any landscape or buildings as I usually do, was also half asleep as we taxied but it appeared to me that we landed then backtracked, can anyone advise if we landed on 24L as a result of the runway works on 24R?

How reassuring

[TURIN]

I landed at MAN from BJV last Tuesday morning at around 3am, I was very disorientated on the approach, didn't recognise any landscape or buildings as I usually do, was also half asleep as we taxied but it appeared to me that we landed then backtracked, can anyone advise if we landed on 24L as a result of the runway works on 24R?

Didn't the F/O sat next to you know? :)

[Suzeman]

can anyone advise if we landed on 24L as a result of the runway works on 24R?

And here's me thinking it was 23L and 23R. Must not have been paying attention in class.....;)

Runway work meant that you undoubtedly landed on 23L.

It would appear that the work on 05L /23R is extended until the end of this month with the below and other NOTAMS which seem to indicate work continuing on the lighting......

A2369/11 (AGA) Manchester International
N53°21.00 W002°17.00 5nm
Tuesday, 6 Sep 05:34 to Wednesday, 26 Oct 2011 16:00
Elevation: SFC - 99900
AD DOWNGRADED TO CAT 1 LANDINGS, AND TO RVR GREATER THAN 400M FOR
TAKE-OFF. NO EXCEPTIONS BELOW THESE MINIMA WILL PERMITTED EXCEPT IN EMERGENCY

Just what you wanted for those LVP autumn mornings.....

Another one I came across was this - no doubt a cost saving measure

DUAL RWY SEGREGATED OPERATIONS HOURS REDUCED:
01 OCT TO 29 OCT, MON-FRI 0530-0800 AND 1700-1900, SAT 0530-0800,
SUN 1700-1900.
30 OCT TO 24 FEB MON-FRI 0630-0900 AND 1800-2000, SAT 0630-0900, SUN
1800-2000.

Suzeman

[Ian Brooks]

Suzeman it`s to do with training for something, I will try and find the details
probably when we go to the pub next

Ian B

[opnot]

suzeman
the reduced hours for 23L till Febuary is not a cost saving exercise , it is so that the controllers can train up on the electronic flight progess strip equipment which is being introduced

[pobox557]

Traveled RYR from MAN-DUB just over a week ago in the early morning, late evening return - departed from a stand at T2 which had an airbridge but walked all the way down the stairs and walked to the plane (seems pointless IMO) and on return, was on the bus back to the terminal building (also seems pointless).

But as someone who can't stand LoCo experiences - I didn't mind this flight actually. Having flew a TOM 757 recently to Naples, I found RYR's flight to DUB from MAN last week much better than that TOM flight. Food was 'okay', just like any old airline really for the breakfast bap thing. Can't complain, 15 of us flew and neither had a complaint to make!


if the airline dont pay for the bridge use then obviously they cant use it. As for the bus on the return flight, its mainly cause as a health and safety issue as well as security issue passengers are bussed to a CTA channel, where they walk through and into the baggage area. Bypassing the immigration points, since the immigration agreement between ireland and uk no passport is checked (so not really pointless)

[Suzeman]

Thanks opnot

Good to hear it is only a temporary measure

Suzeman

[Suzeman]

The paragraph below from the Manchester Fees and Charges is relevant to the discussion about remote stands.

1.4 Aircraft Parking on Remote Stands

Where passengers are transported by bus to an Aircraft parked on a stand that is identified as a Remote Stand (because the passengers are unable to walk to the Aircraft from the terminal) a reduction of £0.75 per departing passenger will be applied to the applicable PFC. The reduction will only be
available for Aircraft scheduled to depart between 07:00 and 11:59 (local times).

Flights that have diverted into the Airport are not entitled to this reduction.

The allocation of aircraft to Remote Stands will follow the stand allocation rules as agreed through the Airline Operators Committee (AOC). Airlines requesting to park on Remote Stands when contact stands are available will
not qualify for the reduction.

For the avoidance of doubt, Airlines are not required to contract their own airside bussing arrangements for remote parked operations in the period 07:00 to 11:59 (local times).

PFC (Passenger Facilities Charge) is payable per departing passenger

I cannot find any separate charge in the document for the use of airbridges - don't think MAN have ever made a charge for these.

pobox and aircraft operations are quite correct that bussing inbound Eire passengers is related to the fact that these passengers must NOT be presented at the UK Border inspection area and any alternative route would involve walking some distance in the airside area with safety and security implications.

Suzeman

[750XL]

Manchester don't charge extra for the use of airbridges, it's purely down to airline preference (although only Ryanair refuse to use them). They don't use them as they claim it slows down the turnaround (only having 1 airbridge vs front and rear steps). I think FR use airbridges at stations where they get a 40min turnaround though.

[easyflyer83]

Absolutely. The airbridge use V's cost isn't always very valid. It is often down to the airlines preference and sometimes even individual station preference.

[Tight Seat]

Crewroom rumour is that the Monarch T2 move is in doubt. Anyone got any facts ?

[Manchester Kurt]

Sept 11 up 6.33% on previous year...

Manchester Airport : Traffic Statistics (http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/manweb.nsf/Content/TrafficStatisticsArchive)

[A330ETOPS]

I noticed A6-edo diverted in from JFK. Anybody know the reason?

330etops

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

This was a medical diversion. I believe A6-EDO was operating UAE202 from JFK to DXB. After a short stop, the aircraft departed MAN to continue its journey to DXB.

[delta154]

Jet2 2xWeekly MAN-IST-MAN from 16/3/2012.

Nice niche route for them. Lets hope they last against TK.

[LBIA]

Jet2 have just announced yet another new route from it's growing Manchester base, Starting 16th, March 2012 they will commence direct flights to Istanbul.

[nigel osborne]

Depending on the frequency Jet 2 may hurt Turkish A/L quite a bit.I am alarmed at the reduction in passengers on THYs MAN flights already, down 23%:confused:.

Nigel

[LBIA]

Looks to be 2x weekly on Tuesdays & Fridays using the Boeing 757.

[mikkie4]

cyprus airways to drop its 4x weekly flight to larneca, at end of the month,are there anyother carriers that fly to cyprus(larneca}?

[Chidken Sangwich]

MAN - LCA, Monarch (ZB).

[FR-]

Maybe ryanair will step in and start MAN-cyprus.

fr-

[mikkie4]

is that a year round service?

[BHX5DME]

http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/manweb.nsf/alldocs/BABB6081D8D7417C80257920004CC7C7/$File/September+11-1.pdf

[AircraftOperations]

Presuming an A380 divert from JFK to DXB would have landed overweight, given that an urgent medical divert wouldn't allow time to reduce landing weight?

[DomyDom]

Can anybody (easyflyer83?) give us a hint as to what likely new EZY routes are to be opened from MAN for next summer? Thanks, DomyDom

[Skipness One Echo]

An A380 that has been in the air for over six hours should not be "overweight" for landing.

[easyflyer83]

Can anybody (easyflyer83?) give us a hint as to what likely new EZY routes are to be opened from MAN for next summer? Thanks, DomyDom

Expect to see one or more Greek Islands, particularly smaller/quieter ones from what i've heard.

[Jamie2k9]

It will operate to Istanbul-Atatürk.

[AircraftOperations]

An A380 that has been in the air for over six hours should not be "overweight" for landing.

I was actually told earlier today by someone who saw the landing that it was chased down the runway by firetrucks in case of hot brakes.

Guess it might not mean that it was "overweight", but apparently they were worried about the possibility of something happening.

[DomyDom]

Thanks easyflyer83, really good to see Easyjet's commitments to Manchester coming on stream and I think that you and them are doing a great job:D Also regarding your response and having just come back from the greek islands (of crete in this case) I can vouch that they are a fantastic place to visit.

With EZY, Jet 2 and Ryanair really coming on like we were hoping they would I think MAN now has a fantastic portfolio of routes to be proud of. I would just now like to see Oporto, Krakow, Warsaw, Granada, Seville! Hopefully I'm not expecting too much!

Good luck to the airlines and lets hope things develop further. I'm certainly looking forward to my weekend break in Berlin from Manchester using Easyjet! At the end of the day we know that MAN has a huge catchment area with the incentive and ability to pay for premium routes, and may this continue.

[seahawks]

SKP 1E, ref A380 divert.

This was reported by the crew to ATC to AFS as an overweight landing.

If our own service had to divert back soon after departure you would not be surprised if it was declared overweight, I am unsure why an en route diversion with a similar fuel load should be seen as anything different?

[Aero Mad]

This might have been said before, but I notice that SunAir will add an additional afternoon rotation on Wednesdays, Thursdays and Fridays as of 30th October.

BA8249 Billund – Manchester 12.40 – 13.25
BA8250 Manchester – Billund 13.55 – 16.35

[opnot]

ref A380 divert
If the flt deck crew said overweight landing or request the AFS
enough said
its their aeroplane

[Mr.Bloggs]

Why did the A380 divert not land on 23L? It's longer and separate from 23R, which would have stopped the delays for other traffic. An RNAV or managed VOR approach would have worked fine. the cloudbase was not restricting.

In fact, what is the reason for so much single-runway ops at MAN? (Obviously if WIP is taking place, no issue). It seems like a waste to have aircraft waiting for departure, burning expensive fuel, while an empty runway is not being used. Perhaps it is a cost issue for the airport....anyone care to answer?

[Ian Brooks]

WIP it is, surfacing 23R and all new lighting, work should be complete by end of month,then the work is training the ATC staff on the new electronic progress strips
which will reduce openeing hours on 23L/05R for winter

Ian B

[Seljuk22]

CY will return from 16th December

[on time all the time]

Monarch is officially moving to T2 in november. This was announced by Kevin George, Monarch MD. All back offices moving there too.

[StoneyBridge Radar]

CY will return from 16th December

Only briefly though.

Email from Cyprus Airways themselves (my bold):


Thank you for contacting Cyprus Airways.



In response to your e-mail, I would like to inform you that indeed Cyprus Airways will stop the flights from/to Manchester permanently. We will have some flights in December and January but after that we will not have any flights.



Please do not hesitate to contact us for additional clarifications or further information that you may require.



Sincerely,

Cyprus Airways Contact Center

[Suzeman]

From tonight's MEN

Monarch looking to expand AND

Traffic statistics for Sept - reported earlier but with comment from MAN

Monarch to add 100,000 in passenger traffic | Manchester Evening News - menmedia.co.uk (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/business/s/1461285_monarch-to-add-100000-in-passenger-traffic)

Can anyone explain the continuing decline in flown freight? :{

Has MAN lost some all freight services? Certainly extra freight has been gained this year for the last few months from the Star Air 767 temporarily diverted from EMA which must contribute some extra so the decline is actually worse if this is stripped out. But with extra ETD and QTR as well as the UAE A330 I would have expected a rise.

Suzeman

[AircraftOperations]

What does the Star Air aircraft do? Uplift, offload or both?

[ZOOKER]

Suzeman,
the decline in flown freight is caused by the global recession. Also most of the goods we import (including those hideous London 2012 cyclops-thingys), now comes in Massive container ships from the far east, (mainly China). Felixtowe has recently built new deep-water berths to accomodate them.
Isn't it p*ss-poor when we can't even manufacture quality mascots for our own Olympiad?

[pwalhx]

We can manufacture, what we cannot do is manufacture low value (in terms of trade price not necessarilly retail price) as competetively as they can in the Far East.

In terms of freight, speaking from 30 years of experience, the balance between shipped by sea and air will always fluctuate and we are about to head into what should be the peak season for inbound freight, whether this will be to the scale of previous years in truth we don't really know.

[pug]

New Commercial Director appointed at MAG.

Manchester Airports Group lands Ryanair commercial director | Manchester Evening News - menmedia.co.uk (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/business/s/1461316_manchester-airports-group-lands-ryanair-commercial-director)

Could be interesting :ok:

[JSCL]

New strapline for MAN:

Manchester Airport - An LGW of the future!

[roverman]

Or how about Our London Airport - Manchester ??!! It has overtaken Stansted after all.

[Flightmech]

FedEx 757 slated to be routing CDG-MAN-BHX-CDG in early 2012 replacing ACL ATR. Daystop in MAN.

[Seljuk22]

SAS to start Bergen-Manchester from 6th January. Flight details will be revealed next Thursday (20th October).

[Hamburg 2K8]

Taken from airlines.net

EZY will move to T1 on 17th November, 2 days after ZB move to T2. They will use the old Monarch checkin area and ticket desk. This has been confirmed internally and we have also been told that stands 01, 02, 04, 23, 25 & 27 will be used on 1st wave departures and non airbridge B Pier stands will be used on the 2nd/3rd wave flights to enable quick turnarounds. The stand allocations have been approved by Manchester Airport. The move to T1 will enable growth as T3 was running out of available stands for the EZY aircraft, particularly early in the morning. It's looking likely (but not yet confirmed) that Lufthansa, Swiss and KLM will move to T3 in their place, SAS and TAP are also rumoured to be moving across to T3

Whenever I have ever had an early morning flight from MAN T1 LH have used Gates 23 & 25 for their FRA and MUC flights and Eithad at gate 27, but suppose with no ZB there room will be made for LH to use the likes of gates 22 & 24. Although TCX still use Piers B & C.

[Seljuk22]

BIMAN will come back from November.
DAC-LHR-MAN-DAC-ZYL every Wednesday and Saturday with B777-300ER.

What about ZB starting MAN-MAD? Rumour, confirmed or just a Code-Share flight?

[Suzeman]

Thanks for the replies about the decline of flown freight.

In the absence, it appears, of any major changes to flights, you are right that this no doubt reflects the poor economic performance. UK monthly figures of flown freight and those of MAN in particular used to be a good barometer of the general economy, but any positive or negative change took 2 -3 months to filter through into the general economic figures

If there was positive movement, it was usually reflected in an upswing a few months later. It is still going down, so this doesn't augur well for the overall situation for the next few months.:*

Suzeman

[Suzeman]

And now for something completely different.

Just found this thread in the military aircrew section - not sure why it is there and I'm sure it will get moved.

http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/466059-bae-woodford-sold.html

Basically suggestions seem to be that JCB are in the process of buying the airfield for business aviation whilst there is also talk of film studios being set up. Not incompatible in my view as the main factory is a big open space with aviation on S side.

So if it true that WFD will be retained as an airfield in some shape or form, what are the implications if any for MAN? (Suggest this thread keeps to that and discussion about Woodford continues on the other thread)

Possible implications for Ocean Sky FBO at MAN and some competition for them in the area?

MAN TMA Airspace Capacity implications?

Any more?

Good to see that there looks like there will still be some aviation activity there and may help preserve some jobs and skills.

Suzeman

[ZOOKER]

Any Jobs advertised yet? :)

[mytravela330]

was good to see an American B777 in today on a divert, and a second US Airways A330, just ashame there werent more....

[flyby1]

Hi

Bit of a longshot I know, however anyone know which aircraft will operate this route as of yet? 10th Nov 2011.

Thanks

[delta154]

Aer Arran ending Kerry and Galway to Manchester for winter 2011

[Suzeman]

From Travel News

Seems like our gain is LGW's loss

Nice to see the positive comment about MAN from the SAS Regional Manager :)

Suzeman

10/17/2011 1:30:00 PM

Scandinavian Airlines (SAS) has announced it will drop flights from Gatwick to Bergen next year in favour for a Manchester route.

The airline will cease its Gatwick to Bergen flights on 1 November and will operate from Manchester to the Norwegian city from 6 January.

“Manchester is a key regional hub for SAS and this decision is perfectly in line with SAS’ regional development,” said Hans Dyhrfort, regional general manager of the UK, Ireland and Iceland at SAS.

The Manchester flights will operate on Monday and Friday.

[aeulad]

Bmi basing a second Airbus at MAN to operate 2 of the 3 MUC flights for LH.

Regards

Mike

[rkenyon]

LGW down to 3 a day.

[roverman]

...and Heathrow up one frequency to 9? a day. Probably indicative of BA's continuing transfer of Gatwick international services to Heathrow. Not much good for people like me who have to travel to meetings at Gatwick, though. It's a long trip by road or rail. Have to admit that whenever I use the MAN-LGW flights half the pax seem to be dead-heading airline crews, and so that can't be a good earner for BA.

[harer92]

Hello everybody,

I was just wondering if someone could provide me with a schedule for the flights to go into and out of Manchester Airport operated by Pakistan International Airlines (PIA).

This would be most useful to me, :ok:

Many Thanks,
Hare92.

[Suzeman]

LGW down to 3 a day.

Not much good for people like me who have to travel to meetings at Gatwick, though. It's a long trip by road or rail.

It will be OK when the Heathwick hub takes off :E - that is assuming you could use it as a domestic pax to arrive at LGW

Suzeman

[TSR2]

This appears to be the summer PIA schedule in and out of MAN.

Monday
PK701 Arrive from Islamabad 18.25 Depart to Islamabad 21.00 as PK702 - B772

Tuesday
PK721 Arrive from Karachi 10.20 Depart to JFK 12.20 as PK721 - B772
PK701 Arrive from Islamabad 18.25 Depart to Islamabad 21.00 as PK702 - B773

Wednesday
PK709 Arrive from Lahore 16.10 Depart to Lahore 18.30 as PK710 - B773

Thursday
PK723 Arrive from Lahore 10.20 Depart to JFK 12.20 as PK723 - B772
PK701 Arrive from Islamabad 18.25 Depart to Islamabad 21.00 as PK702 - B773

Friday
PK709 Arrive from Lahore 14.40 Depart to Lahore 17.00 as PK 710 - B773
PK701 Arrive from Islamabad 18.25 Depart to Islamabad 21.00 as PK702 - B773

Saturday
PK711 Arrive from Karachi 10.20 Depart to JFK 12.20 as PK711 - B772

Sunday
PK701 Arrive from Islamabad 18.25 Depart to Islamabad 21.00 as PK702 - B773

[Cyrano]

No flights to Karachi? :confused:

[pennineuk]

The reduction in LGW-MAN services to just 3 a day makes a day return useless. They have removed the first flight of the day from MAN to LGW and the last service in the day from LGW to MAN, effectively removing the overnight stop. The schedule is clearly designed as a feeder to long-haul services arriving/leaving in the mornings at LGW. A great shame for a route that helps avoid a London transit en route to the south coast (either via LHR or Euston).

[delta154]

No flights to Karachi?

No, because the flight ops KHI-MAN-JFK-KHI.

Flight has to stop en-route to JFK for TSA security search, but can operate direct back with B777LR

[TSR2]

No flights to Karachi?

Apparently not, and no return flights from JFK. I can only assume the flights from Karachi to JFK only stop at MAN for some sort of US immigration purposes and that the return flights are direct.

Edit:
Thanks for confirmation delta154, you beat me to it.

[CabinCrew747]

Taxiing in this morning I am sure I saw a BA E170? Additionally a Titan 146 at Gate 16, any ideas where it was going?

[west lakes]

I saw a BA E170

BA Cityflyer (formerly BA Connect)(based at MAN) have a fleet of them

[CabinCrewe]

BA operate Embs on charter flights

[west lakes]

This lot

BA CityFlyer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BA_CityFlyer)

About BA CityFlyer (http://www.bacityflyerjobs.com/templates/BACity/about.aspx?raparam=6B4C5648425533566E7059514A4C3762414B4B624 A6767734341644D584F726B)

[HOVIS]

BA Cityflyer (formerly BA Connect)(based at MAN) have a fleet of them

Eh? :confused:

[compton3bravo]

A quick guess CabinCrew is that both aircraft operated charters -probably from the Irish Republic - in connection with the Man United-City derby match but not quite on the ball yesterday (no pun intended) as we had friends for lunch so had to help Mam Sahib.

[Ian Brooks]

Both flights operated school holiday flights to Spain and return next weekend


Ian B

[MKY661]

Whats with the aborted landings today? ZB655 from AGP one of them and ZB559 from BJV another.

[Tulsablue]

Not sure but there are some very strong gusty winds today

[RoyHudd]

Advisory: spotter silliness.

No-one professional discusses aborted landings. Go-arounds fit the bill. Which are generally non-events. Happen regularly.

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

RoyHudd -

Once again you seize the opportunity to twist a potentially useful contribution to the thread into a thinly-disguised attack on aircraft enthusiasts. Many of the finest people in our industry started out as enthusiasts (and some of them remain so throughout their careers). Aviation is very fortunate to enjoy a pool of talent to recruit from which is passionate about the industry. This is something we should all encourage. Why not just make your point about go-arounds in a pleasant and constructive manner and cut out the snidey stuff. You are in danger of coming across as one of those unsavoury "hey look at me - I'm a pilot!" types ... not good. Fortunately, most aircrew I know are above such pitiful behaviour. But there remain afew dinosaurs!

And by the way, there are also aviation enthusiasts who hold highly responsible jobs in other fields of expertise. You might not be familiar with the technical terms used in their professional lives either. But it doesn't mean you are stupid or silly. Please think carefully before making further derogatory remarks about other PPRuNe contributors.

SHED.

[Danny_R]

Spot on SHED, I know a senior Exec at a UK carrier who enjoys looking out of his office window onto the runway whenever an aircraft departs or lands, especially when they are his! It's nothing to be ashamed of and some of the finest people in this industry are enthusiastic about aircraft, long may it continue!

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

According to an article posted on routesonline today, Thomson Airways proposes to operate its inaugural revenue B787 service from Manchester on 01 February 2012. The destination listed for this first service is Fuerteventura. Regular winter destinations ex-MAN are listed as TFS, ALC and LPA. The B787 is also programmed to serve destinations ex-LGW and DSA (once weekly to ALC).

Can anybody confirm the degree of confidence TOM has that the February launch plan will proceed as stated in this article? I may just need to book another holiday!

After all the delays with the B787 programme, its actual introduction into service has kind of crept up on me ...

[JSCL]

Those routes seem a bit stupid for the 787... I'm sure there's logic but why continue it on existing sunshine routes in easy reach of existing narrow body a/c in their fleet... They could easily expand transatlantic holiday destinations profitably from slimmer airports now, so why don't they? Seems a bit strange and a waste of a 787!

[mickyman]

Initially I would expect Thomson to use the 787 on regular Sun flights
for crew familiarisation etc.....was there not a rumour that Boeing were
going to give them some 777's to fill the gap until the 787's appear ?
You cannot fly what has not been built....I suggest the monicker of this
aircraft to be 'the 787 delayliner' from now on.....I just hope performance
is at projected targets !!

MM

[Skipness One Echo]

Why walk before you can run? Think of T5 opening day....

BA used to fly the B777 on LHR-CDG and AF did a similar trick with the A380, all to bring the crew up to speed and give familiarity to the operation.

[TSR2]

was there not a rumour that Boeing were
going to give them some 777's to fill the gap until the 787's appear

The main rumour was that Boeing had offered new 767's at an attractive rate as a stopgap measure. Boeing don't give aircraft away.

[OltonPete]

Looking at various articles, logs and blogs this seems unusual to say the least.

A log on another site had 34 787's around Paine Field the other day, none in Thomson colours, on a different site it says that there are 36 (some of the above) are having mods (LN7, LN10-23 and LN25-45). Then there is LN46-49 in final assembly.

LN1-6 are test aircraft, LN8 & LN24 have already been delivered to ANA with LN9 is final prep.

Another site has 6 or 7 to be delivered this year, all Rolls as GEnx engines
are still to be certified and 51 due to be delivered next year.

None as yet have been identified as Thomson aircraft (but some are not painted) so it would seem that it is "rabbit out of a hat" time or the article is at best optimistic.

Certainly still looks possible for 2012 delivery but February would mean taking another airlines batch - Air India have several painted with no engines and of course there is much discussion regarding finance although in the short-term there is little problem as the engine isn't even certified. Thomson I assume will be having Rolls engines.

Pete

[mickyman]

'Boeing don't give aircraft away.'

Good point-well made.............Rodney !!

MM

[RoyHudd]

Why has the Emirates 018 flight been cancelled today?

[ManofMan]

Advisory: spotter silliness

Why has the Emirates 018 flight been cancelled today

Because the EK017 went tech.

[jubilee]

Returned to stand at Dubai. Tec. issues, flight cancelled, pax to be put on other flights.
I know no more.
J

[Chidken Sangwich]

TOM 787's - first was programmed from Sep 2012 and MAN was the first planned base. There will be no 777 or 767 'freebees from Boeing' to fill any gap as there isnt a gap as all bar one (i think) of the current 767 fleet leases have been extended accordingly.

Latest update from my contact is now Jan 2013 for first delivery as suits TOM better (not a Boeing delay).

[VC10man]

Thomson's 787s will sadly have GE engines. I live near Derby and would have been proud and thrilled if RRs have been chosen.

[OltonPete]

VC10man

Cheers, never realised they had gone for GE.

Dubai

The EK19 is running a couple of hours late - high density 77W.

Pete

[RoyHudd]

:)) xxxxxxxx

[RoyHudd]

Oh yeh, we wasted plenty of fuel holding unnecessarily the other morning. Over a ton ourselves. Think of the cost and the environment. And we were not alone. Airfield Ops, not ATC to blame, as usual. Crap council-run aerodrome. Health and Safety along with idiots in Security rule, no interest in customers' success. IMHO Tripoli and Benghazi were operated better. And for that matter, Annaba, Hassi Messaoud, Ujung Pandang, Camaguey and the rest. No need to reply, plane pushers and ATC. The place is a shambles, as us real users know only so well. (LGW is streets ahead, LHR more so, CDG too, but I'm just a driver, so I'm in the same boat as all the other poor suckers. Pax mostly. We keep making excuses to them.) As for those Leader drivers......clueless.

And honestly, I used to love the place. A good friend in management has kept me in the loop. It is being run by fools. And operated by a large percentage of same. MAN would be far better being run by Mr. O'Leary. Seriously. Ah well. back to join the miserable hordes at Staff West tomorrow. Or is that closed due WIP too?

[750XL]

Ah well. back to join the miserable hordes at Staff West tomorrow. Or is that closed due WIP too? It is actually closed for removal of the 'canopy' covering the entrance on Saturday 12th Nov :ok:

and no, I'm not kidding :*

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Back on here trolling again, RoyHudd? Did you not get the reaction you hoped for from your recent efforts on the Blackpool and Monarch threads?

[roverman]

Roy Hudd,

Do you know the reason for you being held 'unnecessarily? It was no doubt related to the ongoing runway refurbishment project - something all airports have to do from time to time. There can be unexpected problems when you are carving up a runway overnight and trying to get it back fit for use in just a few hours. In my experience MAN takes a lot of care over the safety of airfield works, and sets standards which others could usefully employ. Yes, Airfield Operations at MAN are often cautious, avoiding the 'pushing tin' mentality which can lead to mistakes being made. You would be unlikely to see MAN re-start flying just minutes after a major aircraft accident, and before everyone has a chance to properly assess the situation, as happened at a certain UK airport in January 2008. If you think the Leader vehicles are 'clueless' you ought to get out there and show them how it's done. I'm sure the Ops Manager would welcome letting you have a try at some of the things those guys and gals have to do.

[mickyman]

RoyHudd

A man of your calibre having to work up north - whatever have you
done to deserve that shame !!

MM

[Aero Mad]

Roy Hudd, your posts are extraordinary. In 2004 (I looked to the last page of your list of posts to see if you have always been this grumpy), you told someone to:

Have a happy life, and please lighten up a littleTake a leaf out of your own book and stop putting everyone/everything down. If it isn't Manchester, it's Blackpool and if it isn't Blackpool then it's Monarch. Calm down and get a grip; if you demonstrated this sort of manner in the air I'm not sure I'd be happy to fly with you!

[Mr A Tis]

Guys you really shouldn't rise to this well known troll poster

[Skipness One Echo]

You would be unlikely to see MAN re-start flying just minutes after a major aircraft accident, and before everyone has a chance to properly assess the situation, as happened at a certain UK airport in January 2008.

Now now, you mean G-YMMM at Heathrow don't you? If there was a procedure that wasn't followed that put the safety of the the public in danger then be specific as my understanding was that contingency planning meant that operations could continue. Roy is a grumpy old person but there's a good point in there somewhere that surely MAN could be run a little more efficiently. I mean not all airports grind to a halt to watch an A380 push back, it's that sort of annoyance that could be worked on in a construcitive manner and get people from A to B without wanting to shoot yourself at C.

[Beavis and Butthead]

I mean not all airports grind to a halt to watch an A380 push back

How very true. Manchester needs to remember it has other operators that end up delayed on stand and filling the holds up day in day out whilst Emirates get the A380 red carpet. Great to have it at Manchester but the operation and MAPLC's protection to it's schedule is quite bizarre and can surely be improved.

[mickyman]

I've not noticed the airport coming to a standstill when the 380
comes in or out......since 'special operations' no longer apply on
the ground other than neccessary things.Is spacing still in op at
Heathrow ???

If your not amazed the thing can achieve flight then thats your
loss - thank God Concorde got gone....

MM

[harer92]

Hi, I was just wondering if anyone had an updated schedule for all inbound and outbound PIA flights into Manchester for the Winter 2011/2012 season.

I am most grateful.

Many thanks,
Harer92

[learjet50]

This gentleman appears to have gone quiet over the last few days

Maybe he on holiday:D:D:D

[MKY661]

EasyJet now moving to T1 on 30th Nov. Dont know why it keeps changing

[Mr A Tis]

I understand MAN-GOT is being dropped by EZY in Jan, where will the aircraft go instead?

[Ian Brooks]

GOT is being dropped from all points on U2 schedule, I`m sure a replacement will be announced in due course


Ian B

[RoyHudd]

Just drying out after getting soaked by rainwater coming through the leaky roof of T3. Buckets everywhere. As a positioning passenger, I didn't think it was up to Indonesian regional airport terminal standards. (As a comparator)

Incidentally, a troll I am not, at least not intentionally. I criticize in the same manner as we do for flight safety. Its not comfortable but it is intended to remedy faults or even dangers. MAN needs many improvements, and yet a lot of you seem intent on impassionately supporting an airport. Why? It has been going down the tubes for a while, and needs turning round. It employs fewer people now, for good reason.

Off on holiday now, travelling via MAN, as usual.

[Dr Illitout]

I've not noticed the airport coming to a standstill when the 380
comes in or out.

It's because the 380 is so ugly. There is a tannoy message that it is arriving and all non esential staff go to rooms with no windows in to hide from it. The staff that have to deal with it under go counseling after each turn round. The airports advice if you are caught in the open when one taxies past is to risk one eye.

Rgds Dr I

[roverman]

Its been party time at MAN this week! In a throwback to the golden era of the 1980s and 90s, a new airline arriving (or at least returning) every day. Iberia, Blue Islands, Bangladesh Biman tomorrow, Ryanair base too. Yes, a few have slid quietly out of the back door but at the moment there seems to be others ready to take up the dropped routes.

MAN partied through the recession of the early 1980s for a variety of reasons, whether it can repeat the miracle we'll soon know. The 21st century recession seems to stretch to the horizon, but for now, crack that bubbly 'cos we're goin' to party like its 1989!

[North West]

Err...ok. Maybe time to book on one of these new services and take a rest.

[rkenyon]

I'd wager the only time RoyHudd has been to MAN is when he lands his MS Flight Simulator A330. That's the closest he's ever been to a cockpit... No airline would hire someone with such obvious issues.

[Mr A Tis]

So, the ZB new routes are Dubrovnik, Venice, Milan & Verona. I guess the planned Madrid has been dropped inlight of the IB, RYR & EZY services.

Any news on Veulings potential venture onto BCN?

[delta154]

Slightly off topic, but, it seems the SQ327 MAN-MUC-SIN has come off the runway at MUC. No injuries but runway closed.

[Vuelo]

What is the latest on the Metrolink to the airport? Is it being built? Does it have an opening date?

[roverman]

Indeed it is being built. Witness the coned areas on Outwood Lane and works around athe rail station, preparing the new platform and line. See also works along Shadow Moss Road, major roadworks will start here soon to bring the toy train to MAN. Opens 2014. Toot Toot!

[Curious Pax]

2016 according to the roadsigns. Going to be a long 4 years if you need to drive in the area!

[j636]

Ryanair boss reveals expansion plans | Manchester Evening News - menmedia.co.uk (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/business/s/1463945_ryanair-boss-reveals-expansion-plans)

MAN base unlighlty to grow above 4 aircraft for winter 2012/13 but expect 6 for summer 2013.

[roverman]

Cathay have taken delivery of their first B747-8F. Although expected to serve the Pacific routes at first, we can't rule out the Jolly Green Giant making a debut at MAN some time soon. Stand 73 is ready, and works to configure taxiway November (roadways) are well advanced. Bring it on.

[spannersatcx]

No plans for the -8 to serve Europe so unlikely to see it at MAN. Maybe 777F when they arrive.

[Cloud1]

Jet from Manchester slides off runway in Munich
BBC News - Jet from Manchester slides off runway in Munich (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-15581268)

[TSR2]

Jet from Manchester slides off runway in Munich

Has been extensively discussed in R&N since lunchtime.

[DomyDom]

Good to see the new Monarch routes. Steady as she goes as has already been said. Verona is an interesting additon to MANs route network as this is an attractive city with a superb ancient roman open air Opera arena with a great opera festival every summer. Great food and vineyards in the surrounding area also. I think this route will do well eventually all year round as it also caters for the skiing market in the winter. Good luck and well done Monarch.

DomyDom

[j636]

Every Airport's Worst Nightmare - 50 Michael O'Learys (http://www.ryanair.com/ie/news/every-airport-s-worst-nightmare-50-michael-o-learys)

What ever gave Ryanair the idea?

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Aeroflot Russian Airlines have applied and recived government approval to operate MAN - Moscow. Up to 7 weekly flights.

[MKY661]

Do we know the type of aircraft and what terminal they use yet? (Probably an A320 and T1)