FlyBe - 6

[Island Jockey]

:=Now now do not speak ill of the dead. EMX did a great job when the BA Baskets lost the point and let EMX take 6000 pax a month off Manchester. They had LPL up at 10000 pax a month and at peak were taking 24000 a month total pax.

[mutleyshriek]

BFS101 do not diss my accent,if that is your comeback then you are a very sad individual indeed.Resorting to taking the piss out of regional dialect is very very low.I have stated facts,and the facts have been printed in black and white.FLYBE have lost nearly 40 percent of corporate contracts at Belfast because of their own unreliability.Bombardier Nortel Networks British Telecom Japan Tobacco(gallaher)to name a few......

[LGS6753]

Back on topic -

FlyBe are to operate EDI - Manston daily.

[shortleg]

do not diss my accent


But it's ok to call someone a tosser ;)

[sam1993]

mutleyshriek, As has been shown previously in the thread, Flybe's punctuality is considerably better than other airlines - an average delay of just over 10 minutes on over 80,000 flights!
Fair enough - if you dont like Flybe, don't fly with them but is there really any point in posting on here telling us how much you hate them? :ugh:

[mutleyshriek]

Shortleg,yes when you are defending yourself.Im just stating the facts and Jim Frenches letter which was printed in the Belfast Telegraph backs it up.Terrible terrible service from the airline who cancelled at least 5 flights when I and my family were either coming or returning to and from Belfast in the space of two weeks(man route).The airline who have lost nearly 40 percent of corporate because of their poor on time performance.Maybe they are better now,I would hope so and I dont hate FLYBE.I actually quite like them for their stance against Brian Ambrose and Michael Oleary at BHD.I just wish that all you FLYBE lovers could remember the horrible service the belfast pax had for a long time.I certantly work with lots of ex FLYBE flightdeck who can.................

[mutleyshriek]

WingoWango,are you talking about the £100 000 profit they just about scrapped before tax.sailing too close to the wind I think...................

[tallaonehotel]

Eh, calm down lads.....

[Flightrider]

November (latest available) punctuality stats from the CAA website:

BHX-BHD Flybe 90.25% on time, average delay 6 minutes, no cancellations
BHX-BFS bmibaby 88.8% on time, average delay 7.6 minutes, nil canx

EDI-BHD Flybe 86% on time, average delay 7.76 mins, nil canx
EDI-BFS easyJet 92.3% on time, average delay 8.24 mins, nil canx

LGW-BHD Flybe 90.5% on time, average delay 7.11 mins, nil canx
LGW-BFS easyJet 80.8% on time, average delay 9.84 mins, nil canx
LHR-BHD bmi 78.5% on time, average delay 10.6 mins, nil canx
LHR-BFS Aer Lingus 71.9% on time, average delay 13.6 mins, nil canx
LTN-BFS easyJet 84% on time, average delay 10.7 mins, 1 cancellation
STN-BHD Ryanair 92% on time, average delay 3.7 mins, nil canx
STN-BFS easyJet 90.2% on time, average delay 4.9 mins, nil canx

GLA-BHD Flybe 91.9% on time, 6.5 mins average delay, nil canx
GLA-BFS easyJet 94.1% on time, 6.1 mins average delay, nil canx

MAN-BHD Flybe 80% on time, 11.9 mins average delay, 2 canx
MAN-BFS bmibaby 90% on time, 9.8 mins average delay, nil canx

Manchester seems to be the only route where there is an issue. Certainly the London performance is streets ahead of most others on the route, particularly bmi who bang on about being so wonderfully on time. The days of Flymaybe - during the BA Connect integration and the many issues which that brought about - have certainly been in the past on my recent flights with them.

[arnoldk]

Mutley, Mutley, Mutley - such erudite contributions. Many thanks for lifting the discussion to such a high literary level. Your glorious use of the word 'tosser' as a witty riposte, then complaining when you feel somebody is being slightly disrespectful to you - beyond irony!

[Cloud1]

And Mutley has the cheek to call someone else a tosser - what a laugh. As has been pointed out by other posters, your contribution is pointless, ill-informed and completely misleading. The article in the Belfast Telegraph I do not believe was last year but regardless of that the facts and figures speak for themselves.

Mods - this chap clearly has nothing relevant to say and just causes a nuisance.......a bit like a fly that buzzes around the place with nothing better to do.

Moving on, with the proposed Olympic Aegean merger in the pipeline will this affect the Q400's Flybe have leased to them?

[Bucephalus]

On behalf of the rest of the good people of the city, i'd like to apologise for Mutley's rants, especially when he can't string a sentence together. It must be the sea air!

Praise indeed to Flybe for maintaining a service, but i'am looking forward to the competition. Am i right in thinking we had over 200,000 passengers on that route during battle between Emerald and Manx?

[Coffin Corner]

Can't see it affecting the Olympic contract with Flybe, because afterall it is just that: A signed, sealed & delivered contract.

[adfly]

Just checked the BE and SOU site and the weekly Verona flight in the summer is on a Q400!

[emb-145]

- as it was last year. What's your point? Flybe fly SOU/SZG on a Q400, SOU/PGF on a Q400, SOU/AVN on a Q400.

[RVF750]

The EMX crews did a super job, no offence to them. The company was run by....well those that know, we'll leave it at that.

A lot of MAN services have been disrupted this winter, MAN has had massive disruption due to weather, andf unfortunately, due to various reasons a lot of the airfield ILs and DME equipment has spent far too long out of service.

The Only Low vis available is 05L and only somer aircraft can use the CAT2 ddue to specialist training and type restrictions. CAT2/3 on 05L particularly sticks the knife into Q400s and causes a big headache for flybe. Other carriers can use CAT3a on that runway and it is switched for LVPS to cater for big jets, as the airport doesn't appear to give a monkey's about a certain customer with probably more movements through MAN than most others combined.

It's a sore point.....especially for ex BRAL crew that WERE trained for CAT2 on 05L (06 as it was then)....

The point is the poor BHD-MAN reliability these last few months is nearly all weather related. With so much frequency, it is only possible to operate by cancelling flights where the slots are later than the next rotation!

There really is not much choice, especially when all the Q400s are parked at Leeds and Blackpool as they were on several occasions I believe.

Flybe's record this winter is absolutely first class given these difficulties- on one occasion, crew literally had to dig the aircraft out of snow drifts using makeshift shovels from old advertising boards to enable the roadway and fuel/service/de-icing trucks to get into position. You don't get many companies where crew will do this!

I'm proud to work with these people and proud of the way we pulled out the stops to keep operating whenever possible.

A list of cancellations on a screen don't look nice, but the full story is often lost on Ground Staff when questioned by passengers. I wish it were not so.

[sam1993]

Does anyone know the charter flights that Flybe will be operating this summer (from / to e.t.c) ? Any info will be greatly appreciated! :ok:

[fanrailuk]

Look back at the posts on here...theres plenty of info!

[adfly]

SOU-VRN is starting again in the summer but i'm not sure about the others-the Croatia flights may be charters but I think they are scheduled

[OltonPete]

sam1993

BHX seem to have a few changes compared to previous years but do
have a reasonable schedule over the summer weekend season.

Saturday sees INS (Inghams I believe?) and Faro (?)
There is also a Split schedule (many seats sold to charter such as Balkan)

Sunday has the Dubrovnik schedule/charter (see Split)
and a Faro for Thomson in high season.

Bastia has gone (got cancelled last summer) and Alghero
which Thomson used last year has also gone but carried
some awful loads in 2009n for a charter flight.

It still seems a bit light but the Pound v Euro has probably
not helped although I thought Thomsons & Thomson Cook
might have added more high season Spanish flights as their own
aircraft are mainly heading to Turkey/Cyprus (especially TC).


Pete

[sam1993]

Thankyou for your reply OltonPete - much appreciated! :ok:

[Cloud1]

Flybe are doing many more charters this summer compared to previous years. Off the top of my head, these are listed below but I may be missing some.

INV-PMI
IOM-PMI
EDI-PMI
EDI-INN
EDI-IBZ
DUB-INN
BHX-DBV (in addition to the scheduled flight)
BHX-FAO
BHX-INN
BHX-PMI
MAN-DBV
MAN-PMI
MAN-FAO
LBA-INN
EXT-INN
EXT-VRN
JER/GCI - FAO + MHN although these maybe private charters, not sure but they seem to operate weekly

I will check in the week but I think above is pretty accurate, if there are any more I will add them on.

[OltonPete]

Cloud1

Thank you for the update, do you know the name of the tour operator for the BHX - Palma flight and when does it operate?

I notice your comments re the Dubrovnik which is good news, although
there were two completely different flight numbers but the times were similar and I assumed that it was really only one flight.

Of course it should be INN not INS as I posted.

There is definitely a short season Faro on a Sunday morning if the Thomson website is correct unless things have changed.

Pete

[sam1993]

Thanks for the info Cloud1! :ok:

[Back at NH]

My partner flew FlyBe BHX-HAJ last Thursday morning to visit her parents and is due to return tomorrow evening. Her bag never arrived, in fact, her bag (booked online at an additional cost of blah, blah, blah) travelled with LH BHX-FRA Saturday evening and should have gone FRA-HAJ yesterday morning. It is still there in FRA. As it stands she would receive it in HAJ just in time for her to check it in for the return flight, so we have asked for it to be returned direct from FRA.

Question - Does anyone have a good direct contact at EXT who I could talk to about this without going through all the usual call centre rigmarole. I work in the business, I'm not an outraged idiot like you see on certain orange flavoured TV programmes but it is, let's face it, appalling customer service. Oh, and by the way, this is the second time they've lost her bag in under a year.

Back at NH

[assymetricdrift]

Back at NH,

I'd recommend starting with the handling agents - we've had several problems with them before on flights from Germany. I'd reckon the best place to start would be with the handling agent in BHX (I think it's Swissport), I might be totally and utterly wrong on this though, as they will be able to track down the bags and put you in touch with the German handling agent in turn.

Sadly, I've learnt the hard way - having lost a bag with a whole load of skiing equipment on it, I've always found it a lot easier to speak to the handling agents - it cuts out the middle man.

Sorry if it's not much use though, it's just the best I can think of right now...

Cheers,
AD

[Back at NH]

Oh I know where the bag is. It's in FRA, I tracked it down myself.

What I'm interested in, is why the bag a) did not travel on the flight with her, b) why, when she travelled in Thursday AM, did the bag not leave BHX until Saturday evening. I don't want handling agent excuses, I want to let Flybe themselves know I am disappointed and that someone needs to look at their procedures because they don't work. We're not talking a T5 disaster here, we're talking a single bag that did not travel on a lightly loaded flight. OK, that can happen BUT the follow up has been a disaster. It took 2 and a half days to get the bag moving and then it sat in FRA for 24hrs before I found out where it was and even then. it could not be guaranteed for delivery in HAJ before my partner leaves there some 5 and a half days after she arrived.

To sum up, my partner went for a five and a half day visit to her parents in Hannover. Her bag spent 2 and a half days in Birmingham Airport and 2 + days in Frankfurt Airport and she will only be re-united with her bag when she gets home......I hope.

NH

[mathers_wales_uk]

I am guessing if you worked in the business you would know what number to contact or at least know somone who will know the number.

The question is that it could be very easy for a bag to miss a flight and one of the main causes are stuck on a belt or have fallen off a baggae trailer and not located until the flight had gone.

How long after the aircraft departed was the bag found? How frequent are the flights by Flybe from BHX to HAJ? Maybe special authorisation was needed to use another carrier for sending bags.

Why it was in FRA for 24 is unknown.

The people who can give you the answers are the handling agents, all Flybe can do is to acknowledge your complaint and find out why the most efficient service was not given.

Unfortunatly by the time Flybe speak to BHX handling, BHX investigate the matter with relevant staff you are probably looking at a couple of days for a satisfactory response.

[Back at NH]

I am guessing if you worked in the business you would know what number to contact or at least know somone who will know the number.



If you don't know the answer, don't guess, you'll probably be wrong.

Best piece of advice I was given when I started in this business 30 years ago.

[BeViRAAM]

Many airlines contract this sort of thing out to third party companies. That could explain why it went via FRA.

[JobsaGoodun]

travelled with LH BHX-FRA Saturday evening and should have gone FRA-HAJ yesterday morning. It is still there in FRA.

....and bear in mind that the LH pilots strike on Monday wont have helped to get the bag from FRA to HAJ.

[Back at NH]

Well my partner arrived home from Hannover last night on schedule and her bag arrived at 1100 this morning and they are now re-united. I shall be writing to Flybe for a refund of the baggage charges for each sector and, I hope, a sincere apology.

I jsut want to re-iterate that I have no problem with a bag not travelling as these things can happen. However, it was known that the bag had not travelled before the aircraft arrived in HAJ and yet the bag remained at BHX for a further 2 and a half days. My partner was calling Hannover airport and simply being told that it had not arrived yet. I then made a few calls and lo...the bag was now in Frankfurt to be transhipped to Hannover so we phoned Frankfurt but they could not guarantee delivery before my partners return flight. So the bag had a two day stay in FRA and then was returned to BHX and delivered to us by courier this morning.

So my gripe is the time taken to forward it and the lack of correct information being passed on. The overall Flybe service is good, however they may want to take a look at their contractors to make sure they are performing against the required standards.

Cheers

[OMGitsDAVE]

So, who is running the Durham Tees Valley - Jersey flight? Is this not a FlyBE charter?

[SWBKCB]

Like all the other Jersey's, aren't these scheduled flights?

[airhumberside]

It is indeed operated on a scheduled basis

[Cloud1]

mutleyshriek, it has nothing to do with regional dialect. Yes I work for the company and they do have a number of faults in my eyes, mainly with their commercial decisions but then again they are one of few airlines that are still riding strong so I guess we cant win everyone over.

The problem with your posts is that they have no factual content and that is what pisses people off on this forum. You come on here and rant and rave just because you dont like them - is this because they stopped their LPL base? Not sounding rude but I cant blame them.......why compete with EZY when there are other markets to tap into...anyway this is seperate and irrelavent.

I really dont give a monkeys whether you are dyslectic or apparently have 15 years in the industry. This is not an english lesson, but you shouldn't just come on here and slag of a company just because you do not like them. I recommend you contact the airline directly with your woes rather than come on here and babble absolute nonsense. Anyway I am sure you will reply because you clearly have nothing better to do with your time than moan about BE - me on the other hand work for them and am very proud of the company the majority of the time!! Needless to say we have our bad days as do other airlines (lets consider EZY at LTN at Christmas) but we move on. May I suggest you also do the same.

[goldeneye]

Flybe are launching flights from BHD to Humberside from 27 May, Flights will operate Tuesdays, Thursdays, Fridays and Sundays on Q400's.

[mrmagooo]

Leading regional airline takes Top 10 place in 2009 Global Major Carrier Arrival Performance Report
Flybe, the UK’s Number One domestic airline, is today celebrating having hit the global aviation world big time by not only making the Top 10 in one of the influential Forbes magazine’s famous lists, the only UK carrier to do so. In being listed amongst these world-leading airlines, Flybe finished ahead of many other international household names, leaving trailing in its wake the likes of Air France, British Airways, Continental, Air Canada and Iberia.

:E

[Maverick8701]

Congratulations to everyone at Flybe this really is very impressive and shows how hard everyone is working to make the company great!

[hana994]

Personally I love dealing with flybe, their service is second to none and everything possible is done to make a passengers journey as easy as possible. Keep it up flybe!!:ok:

[FL370 Officeboy]

Most Punctual Airlines Best Airlines on Time Timeshare, Go Timeshare (http://www.gotimeshare.org/airlines/00677-worlds-most-punctual-airlines)

Well done to everyone across the network. Hopefully people will now stop wheeling out the old 'flymaybe' tag as those days are long gone :ok:

[RVF750]

Absolutely!

Everyone at my Base pulls out the stops to get people where they want to be as smoothy and on time as possible. Especially well done to those MAN guys and gals that got out in the snow and dug their aircraft out this winter.

Makes me proud to work for the company.

Roll on the next year!

[Tinwald]

fellas , what a love in this has turned into. good luck on your time keeping but pass me a sick bag quick, or is that going to be charged for.:yuk:

[Otto Throttle]

It's not a sick bag. It's a gift bag, and you may fill it and remove it from the aircraft at the end of your punctual and multi-award-winning service with our compliments. :}

[TJ1F]

Great News All !!! Great to be a part of this team and am in here for the Long Haul...(Exuse the Pun) :ok:

[Tinwald]

Fellas, I'll feel the love with several of your (female) hosties (oh! wash my mouth out with a pint of okells) but you ugly bar stewards can forget it!

A gift from flybe lol - you fellas should take a look at arann to see what a 'gift' service is on the city route.:ok:

[chrystall]

what "service" exactly are you referring to? nothing gratis that's for sure!

[FL370 Officeboy]

ser·vice n.

Definition: An act or a variety of work done for others, especially for pay: offers a superior service to that of his competitors; provides full catering services.

Nowhere is service defined as being gratis/free so I fail to see your point at all...or are you trolling by any chance?

[Cloud1]

Without sounding pedantic, I think the comment refers to the words 'gift service' in an earlier post. The word gift suggests its free??Anyway this is ridiculous - can we go back to topic please.

With the current OA contract, and the Bahrain deal which has been discussed, has Flybe got any more plans up their sleeves? Not all employees get to know about what is going on but I expect someone on here will be in the know - obviously only to discuss things which can be talked about in a forum......;)

[Maverick8701]

Cloud1..........There are a few things in the pipeline I am led to believe however have been asked not to say anything until signed and sealed although hopefully looks good. Saying that I think there were about 15 offers of work and only OA and Bahrain came off as being worth it. People are working very hard though your probably looking at winter work now though BE has a relativley busy summer schedule either scheduled or chartered.

Side topic does the Aegean/Olympic tie up effect Flybe? If Aegean were to get rid of their RJs for Q400's could be some more work? Anybody have any info? Someone based over in ATH I guess?

[Martyn hobbs]

"Flybe seals ground-breaking support deal with Gulf Airs Embraer fleet":

Advert link removed

Does anyone know any more about this deal?

Are any flybe flightdeck crews and a/c going to be used??

[virginblue]

Quick question - is Flybe operating the E195 on any domestic services from EXT or SOU?

[JC25]

Yes, they operate EXT-MAN and also SOU-MAN and SOU-EDI

[ALLMCC]

...and very occasionally on BHD from SOU, as well.

[Chitty]

and some time from SOU to LBA and MAN to IOM

[RNWY03]

also used on SOU- GLA and infrequently SOU-JER

[Cloud1]

Ok, to avoid many many posts here is a summary of the domestic routes out of SOU and EXT on the E195. However these can change with the summer schedule so it is best to either consult the ECO label during the booking process or look at the online seat configuration where you can prebook a seat. Anything with more than 21 rows should be the E195.

SOU-MAN
SOU-EDI
SOU-LBA (occasionally)
SOU-JER (summer 09 so not sure what this year holds)
SOU-GLA
EXT-MAN (only certain rotations in the week)

Other domestic services ops ex-BHD, LGW, BHX, MAN

[sam92]

Flybe has announced its picking up the Ryanair route from Bournemouth to Scottish hub. Although Ryanair flew to Edinburgh, Flybe are flying to Glasgow, albeit via Manchester

GlA-MAN-BOH unfortunately not so low cost either :( prices over £80 !! :*

[airhumberside]

:confused: Flybe are also offering EDI-BOH as a connection through MAN

[Random Flyer]

Flybe has announced its picking up the Ryanair route from Bournemouth to Scottish hub. Although Ryanair flew to Edinburgh, Flybe are flying to Glasgow, albeit via Manchester

GlA-MAN-BOH unfortunately not so low cost either http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/sowee.gif prices over £80 !! http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/bah.gif


FlyBe are not really replacing Ryanair to Glasgow. The onward flight to Glasgow is just one of a number of connections FlyBe offer throughout their network.

Ryanair also flew from Bournemouth to Glasgow, infact their BOH-PIK service seemed to do allot better than their BOH-EDI flight. Worst thing Ryanair every done was move this flight to EDI.

[SWBKCB]

GLA-MAN-BOH unfortunately not so low cost either prices over £80 !!

Over £80 to fly from Glasgow to Bournemouth?!? It's a disgrace - why it would be cheaper to drive by car!!

[gearupflapsupshutup]

I wouldn't like to drive that with a car, that's 10 hours man....
by the way like to go from Exeter to Hanover though! Excellent route! just in time, super! Can't wait till Flybe starts DUS and or FRA from EXT!:D
jawohl!

[sam92]

Over £80 to fly from Glasgow to Bournemouth?!? It's a disgrace - why it would be cheaper to drive by car!!

I know it is !! Although I don't fancy the drive either !!! even if you go to exeter or southampton still got a fair drive!!

I vote ryanair to bring back pik-boh!!!

[loveJet]

If the connections work, would there be any interest on Flybe's part to explore single daily direct services from Bournemouth to Glasgow, Edinburgh, Belfast? Jersey? Guernsey?

[Cloud1]

Ok guys lets have some perspective here please.

I have just been onto the BE website and a Monday flight between BOH and GLA is £58.00 in June. Not at all unreasonable and clearly shows that the fares vary.

It is averaging at an 8 hour drive covering approx 495 miles. This is direct without any hold ups so I reckon it would take a little longer myself. I have a decent car which would be able to do that journey on one full tank costing approx £70-£80. Without taking into consideration the cost spent at service stations, and wear and tear on the car I do not think that the BE fare is that bad even if it is still a 5 hour journey when considering the connection at Manchester.

Rather than moaning once again about Flybe, for gods sake show a bit of flaming support will you. Be grateful for the Manchester service, and just wait and see if additional direct services will be introduced. It is getting very tedious reading the moaning and groaning about this, that and the other.

[100above]

Cloud1

The problem we have is that MOL has managed to convince the travelling public that they can fly anywhere for 9.99 - a few can, but only as loss leaders. Running an airline isn't cheap. If you go back 15 years ago, pax were paying over £350 for a GLA-SOU return on a J31/J41 which would be £500 return today and the airlines were struggling to break even. Domestic airline fares are cheaper than they ever were. Looking at other modes of transport I've just looked at National Express for a day next month and the first day I looked at is quoting a single ticket GLA-BOH for £69 by bus or £140 by rail. £58 or even £80 for 2 flights GLA-MAN-BOH doesn't seem unreasonable by comparison.

[fanrailuk]

Anyone have any idea when BE are to release winter 2010/11 seats?
Thanks in advance...

PP :)

[Skipness One Echo]

f you go back 15 years ago, pax were paying over £350 for a GLA-SOU return on a J31/J41

That's because the J31 is a niche operation intended for businessmen on expense accounts. See Eastern Airways. If I want to travel on a similar route, ie EDI-BOH, then a 189 seat B73H allows me to do this due to excellent CASM and sold well to the market. Stop being such a snob, low cost mass market travel is here to stay.

Fifteen years ago how many people did it take to book me a ticket? How long did the travel agent spend battering at the keyboard to book a simple Shuttle flight? I NEVER want to go back to that palaver. Those barries and costs went out the window with good reason.

[100above]

Skipness One Echo, sorry I dont see where I'm being a snob and I can assure you I've got no desire to go back to the days of high fares and the CAA deciding which airline gets a given route. I'm merely pointing out the way in which domestic fares are far, far cheaper than they have ever been, yet we have posters up in arms that they could drive somewhere for less than the cost of flying. An airline that charges less than a bus or train company to fly you between 2 points isn't being unreasonable in wanting £60 or even £80 off you. The fact that your quoted 189Y 737 no longer links EDI-BOH makes my point. Some regional routes will not sustain Ryanair's ultra low fares and good though the CASM of the Q400 is, Flybe will always have to charge more than Ryanair would to make a route work.

[arnoldk]

Skipness One Echo

So what is your point?? Are you having a go at BE or supporting them??

Arnoldk

[cheesycol]

£4.99/£9.99 fares are not sustainable. Ryanair can offer these as they make a lot of money on selling their aircraft to a leasing company as soon as they recieve them. They also have a lot of seats to fill, and this is where their ancilliary charges make up for the low fares. In terms of revenue, Ryanair is number two globally for the % contribution by ancilliary charges to their bottom line. When they stop receiving new aircraft expect fares to rise.

Flybe fares are more realistic/sustainable. They charge what they need to charge/can get away with, and don't have the surplus of capacity that Ryanair do. Cheap, mass market air travel is good, it keeps me in a job, £4.99 fares won't.

I would happily bet that the only significant cost reduction to the industry in the last 15 years or so is ticketing & check-in, and that is due to the internet. Companies have just had to become more lean to find other savings.

[Skipness One Echo]

£4.99/£9.99 fares are not sustainable.

Yes they are as the continuing and rather blatant success of the business model will attest to. The reason Ryanair operate ONE model of 737NG is to max out the number of seats and keeps costs down. This allows seats to be sold at "unsustainable" prices, it's commonly known as a loss leader. So long as you balance the early sold, lowest cost seats with higher priced ones nearer departure, it balances out if you get the proportions right. The sheer amount of ancillary revenue also helps, also the fact I am no longer cross subsidising someone elses baggage weight also allows cheaper fares to remain available. In fact Ryanair can be quite expensive!

At flybe, the cost base is higher due to multiple fleets, better paid staff and to be honest, it's not really a traditional loco. Hence when you add in all the baggage charges and pay to select a seat, the fare is quite "normal", ie like an old style air fare. It's not a criticism as it's a succesful business model, but differs from the more succesful Ryanair model. Horses for courses and no criticism meant to either.

Ryanair can offer these as they make a lot of money on selling their aircraft to a leasing company as soon as they recieve them.
This is an oversimplification and is only a partial understanding of what makes FR tick.

[cheesycol]

This is an oversimplification and is only a partial understanding of what makes FR tick.

Granted.

better paid staff

Not granted!

However, whether it be the headline fare or otherwise, when FR stop recieving new aircraft, the basic fare will rise, it has to. Or an alternative method of extracting money in non-optional ancilliary charges will be used.

[bmi goldenboy]

Anyone know if BE has any plans to base an EMB95 at GLA?

The first GLA-BHX is pretty much always sold out now and the next gets as bad. They're now loosing Y+ custom on that route as travellers make alternative plans. I actually went BD to LHR then made my way to Euston to get the train to Birmingham a couple of weeks ago as both BE flights were full.

Don't ask why I didn't drive to EDI as I've no car and have you every actually tried to get to EDI from Glasgow by public transport....?

[OltonPete]

bmi goldenboy

Also the first BHX-GLA has changed from a 195 to a Q400 with the 195 going
to EDI instead, no doubt partly due to Baby pulling off that route (historically
BHX-EDI carries more than BHX-GLA).

The shame is that another 195 goes to BHD from BHX at the same time and loads rarely exceed 78 but it is required to do the BHX-MXP afterwards.

It would have been better to bring the GLA departure forward and change it
to the 195 to then turnaround for Milan and send the Q400 to BHD. However there must be a reason why that has not been done.

They must be making a mint on BHX-EDI & GLA with no competition but at
least they have increased frequencies.

I can't see anybody else taking on BHX-GLA although in future I feel FR
might give BHX-EDI a go,especially as it is between two bases (not sure
BHX-PIK would work though).

Pete

[Kavs8]

Any rumour of a SOU-ORK route RE dropeed the route and it had high load factors used to operate 6 pw?

[Fletchy88]

Anyone heard about Flybe winning a CRJ 700 / 900 contract?

...as in they are getting some new CRJ 700 / 900's in...

[Businesstraveller]

OltenPete - you are most likely correct (of course) regarding a potential for FR to ply this route in the future. Makes me think what a contrast from when I used to comute BHX-EDI on BA mainline just over 4 years ago. How the mighty have fallen...

[Fletchy88]

a contract for maintenance on the CRJ's, im using the word contract loosely though, just mean that I heard that they have won a biz deal to get some CRJ's in?? obviously no-one else has heard this...

no worries

[Maverick8701]

I believe the contract was for MRO side of the business although im sure the airline side of the business is always looking at this side of things re the smaller jet.

A couple routes Flybe have could do with a CRJ 700/900 EMB170 etc with loads not quite EMB195 but too much for the Q400 like LGW-INV BHX-MXP LGW-JER etc what does everyone think? The Q400 just doesn't replace the EMB145 on some routes. With already close tie ups with both Bombardier and Embraer surley both are possible?

[MUFC_fan]

Doesn't the E170 carry similar numbers of people as the Dash?

[Spotter LBA]

Didn't Flybe use to have four CRJ's several years ago and they didn't fit in with their fleet requirements and they were rather thirsty with the fuel?

[Maverick8701]

Think they are similar in seats but think the 170 may have better distance and speed over the q400. If the CRJ was thirsty maybe they will opt for 170s.

Could the 195 drivers fly both the 170 and 195 at the same time?

I don't think my q400 qual lets me fly the 200 or 300.

[Chesty Morgan]

Yep it's the same type rating. My license only says 170 but it covers all the different marks.

The only trouble is that the 170 burns about the same amount of petrol as the 195 but it has 50 or so less seats.

[Maverick8701]

Interesting would make things easy crew wise if they were to purchase some!

[JC25]

I doubt that Flybe will add any other types, or even sub-types like the E170/175. They have been working towards a two type fleet for quite some time so it would be pointless to add another type now.

Plus the Q400 is perfectly adequate for the vast majority of routes.

[macuser]

just had smoothest flight on the E195 jet, a la 146 on landing. Well done BE, keep it going! Q400 is good too - up to 75 mins flight, after which it becomes a bit taxing. Book ahead, good fares,

[FL370 Officeboy]

In all honesty flybe are more likely to phase the jets out and replace them with more Q400s than introduce more 170s etc.

[JC25]

I believe the E170 carries around the same number of pax as the Q400 so there really would be little advantage to adding them to the fleet. There are only a few routes where the time saving over the Q400 would be that noticeable (MAN & BHX to MXP, maybe FRA) and personally doubt it would justify the extra fuel costs.

[adfly]

175's would be a little better as they carry a few more passengers but I think they should just order a few more 195's for more popular routes and to expand their network.

[Tonyq]

FlyBe have firm orders for 4 more Q400's (due in 2011) plus 15 options and also 12 options on 195's, so they seem to be covering all the possible future scenarios which have been mentioned here.

They have also been mentioned a possible customer for a stretched Q400X which Bombardier have talked about launching in the past. This could bridge the capacity gap between the Q400 and 195, whilst retaining the former's economics.

However any move towards Q400X's or 170's would create sub-fleets which seems would seem to challenge their two type model approach.

I suspect though, that having apparently weathered the worst of the economic storm, FlyBe's strategic planners will be looking at all their options to be in the optimum strategic position when the genuine recovery arrives, and will soon be looking at what they do with those options from 2012 and beyond.

[Tonyq]

Programme seems to alive and well, although not formally launched yet

Q400X still of 'high interest' to airlines: Bombardier (http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/04/06/340305/q400x-still-of-high-interest-to-airlines-bombardier.html)

[JC25]

Flybe have said that up to 7 Q400 aircraft are available to start a shuttle between Belfast and Glasgow from 1900 until midnight this evening. At the moment only two return flights are scheduled in each direction but they will add more if there is demand.

Good to see they are getting things going as soon as possible :D

[TechProblem]

All this 170 talk is abit rubbish tbh, have you guys seen the loads Flybe are taking to places like ALC, AGP and other dest out of SOU and EXT like this. They are more or less full there and back all operated on the 195.

With the charatar programme starting soon the 170 wouldnt do anything the Q400 can do. Maybe flight alittle faster, but the ammount of pax is 70-80; and at what cost in fuel... Embraer (http://www.embraercommercialjets.com/#/en/products_detail/1),

175 is 78-88 seats. 10 pax more....i think not.

Flybe are not going to go all jets now, to much money invested in the Q400.

TP

[fanrailuk]

Any news on when this schedule is to be released? I was led to believe it was going to be today... :rolleyes:

PP

[scr1]

BBC News - Flybe plane makes emergency landing in Glasgow (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/glasgow_and_west/8656244.stm)

would this of more likely to have been a loganair a/c as it was from SYY

if so which one? G-LGN?

[mathers_wales_uk]

I would imagine so especially with only 3 crew on board. The Dash has 4 and the Embraer has 5.

[fanrailuk]

Flybe launches extensive 2010/11 winter schedule

UK’s Number One Domestic airline puts 5-million winter seats on sale with a choice of 143 winter services including 15 new routes and up to 3 214 flights a week
Flybe, the UK’s Number One Domestic airline, has announced its full 2010/11 winter programme that, on sale from Thursday May 13th, offers travellers a choice of up to 3 214 flights a week on 143 key routes. These include 15 new routes together with 10 popular European ski routes, seven of which - due to public demand - were announced earlier this week.
Key National Facts


3 214 flights a week
143 routes including 15 new routes available for winter
10 ski routes to Berne, Chambery, Geneva and Salzburg that includes flights to and from the Isle of Man to Geneva; Jersey to Geneva; and Southampton to Berne
5 Winter sun routes to three popular destinations namely Alicante, Faro and Malaga
11 regional and European routes from London Gatwick including new winter service to Nantes
Fares from £21.50 one way including taxes and airport charges
All available for booking for travel between October 31st and March 26th, 2011

Mike Rutter, Flybe’s Chief Commercial Officer, comments: “Despite industry challenges over the past year, and with other airlines limiting their growth, Flybe has been able to step in and fill many gaps and continue building capacity.
“We’re pleased to be able to offer such a wide choice of regional routes this coming winter including the 15 new routes that, due to popular demand, we’ve been able to now carry over to the winter schedule. Together with our franchise partner, Loganair, we remain committed to keeping Britain on the move.
“The diversity of our winter destinations is ideal for those wanting to book affordable business travel as well as those looking for short breaks over the autumn half-term and Christmas periods. To ensure the lowest possible fares, it’s advisable for people to book their winter travel now.”

[tallaonehotel]

G-LGNF.....MSN 192
Gear unsafe warning.

[aeulad]

What are the '15 new routes'?

Regards

Mike

[fanrailuk]

Clever, but not decieving, wording by flybe...15 new routes constitutes as 15 routes introduced this summer and continuing through the winter e.g. MAN-BOH.

PP ;)

[gearupflapsupshutup]

Air Southwest up for grabs! will FlyBe move in?

[JobsaGoodun]

I doubt it.
I don't see that ASW have anything of value except their LGW slots. If the business is losing money, it doesn't make for a very attractive prospect to any prospective buyer.

[gearupflapsupshutup]

so it'll bleed to death?

[Ringwayman]

Here's a new route: Manchester-Manston from September.

[silverstreak]

As per my post in ASW forum...

Loganair could op ASW routes with SAAB 340s (limited payload out of PLH) but maybe enough to justify sector to NQY, then full load from there.

Loganair aquire the ASW Dash 8 fleet. (Rumoured LC looking at Dash 8 and GLA hangar is able to accommodate up to Dash8-300 size)

Flybe gain through tie up with Loganair.

Just Possible

[shamrock7seal]

Does anyone know the load factors for the new routes that launched yesterday?

EDI - Manston
MAN - Bournemouth
HUY - Belfast

[gearupflapsupshutup]

Could be possible for Loganair to jump in but, who's got the cash nowadays to buy an airline, surely it is cheaper to just wait till it's gone.
Are LGW slots really that valuable?

[Serenity]

Flybe are on the edge of being a major airline in Europe.
Once they get the management & office staff to realise this practically then Europe is their oyster.
Therefore i think they should be thinking big terms, not small Southweat with a few routes from Plymouth and Newquay - which they already serve!!
as others have said, they will save their money and wait for them to go bust!!

Imho the only ones who may be interested would be Eastern.

[ara01jbb]

BHD - HUY was cancelled earlier this month, although as I noticed on my last BE flight not before May's inflight magazine went to press and JF extolled the new route in his editorial.

[john2408]

A new route Humberside to Malaga starts Saturday 29th :ok:

[GoEDI]

First EDI-MSE had 60+ on it.

[Cloud1]

The new EDI-MSE-EDI averaged at about 60pax (give or take a few) on both sectors so it was a great start. My only concern would be that these levels of demand do not last, with the flight times as they are I do not believe as many business pax will use the service as hoped. However having said that, Flybe have said loads have exceeded expectations and the route will continue through winter.

And of course, the new MSE-MAN would not have been announced if the EDI route was struggling to get the money in.

The BOH route was not as busy but was about 49/50 on each sector - still a very good turn out for the first service. :ok:

[Serenity]

So the first dash to be returned in 18 months time, and as the company states "the new fleet has not yet been decided upon"

so what are the options and I guess this means Flybe have to sit down and work out in which direction their future is to go, regional, more European, bigger, smaller ?????????????!!

[Flightlevel001]

Well rumour has it that a move to an all Embraer fleet is a strong possibility. With Embraer claiming to be able to 'tweak' the 170 to similar efficiency as a Dash on flight times of approx. one hour or more.

The Q4 is unreliable, and never has built up the passenger appeal the airline hoped it would, a move to an all jet fleet would be a huge step forward for BE, but only if it's cost effective.

[Cloud1]

Am I wrong, as I thought Flybe now owned a couple of the aircraft (as opposed to leasing them)

Which Q400 has been returned? G-JEDI I assume as its the oldest?

If I have completely mis-understood Serenity's post, ignore me!

[kellyoldsmunt]

what news on more routes from manston.?
will aircraft be based at manston, and what about job prospects ?
desperate from thanet

[Tonyq]

I didn't quite understand what Serenity was getting at either. I've not seen any comment that gives the slightest hint FlyBe have any plans to ditch the Q400.

G-JEDI is alive and well, and did the IOM-MAH-IOM charter the other day. The initial leases on the early ones do begin to expire in 2012 and 2013 and whilst they could be returned, they could equally be extended. The more recent ones don't expire until c2018/19 so they are committed way into the future, and have four more brand new Q400's to come early next year.

G-INFO shows which Q400's are owned and which are 'chartered' in CAA speak. Those which are owned, are probably mortaged and subject to long term financial obligations.

The leased ex-SAS ones G-ECOV/W/Y/Z seem to be leaving the fleet soon, as Jethro's have 'OW going next month. Presumably one of those with Olympic will be coming back to compensate, as they are now starting to get their new Q400NG's over the summer.

Whilst I'm sure that there will be a lot of careful thought in Exeter on where BE go next, especially when the economy really starts to pick up. Even if the 170 would offer upgrade opportunities on some routes, the Q400 is doing such a good job, it's hard to imagine it not forming a big part of their plans for most of the next decade.

[Cloud1]

If Flybe did ever turn to Embraer for an all jet fleet, how would that affect some of its key routes such as those to and from GCI? I assume if the E195 can operate 'in good weather' the smaller version would not pose any problems?

I would like to see Flybe expand a little more myself and feel they are missing out on some good opportunities. For example the Channel Islands have a large Portugese population yet only SATA operate in the summer whereas I am sure Flybe could support a service even if that is seasonal as well.

Poland seems to be an ever flourishing destination with some airports have a number of destinations thanks to Wizz. Could Flybe make a success anywhere with some of these outside of London?

Newquay seems to have died off a bit with only EDI and LGW. Could BE not jump into bed a bit more with Loganair and get a Saab down there. I am sure this could be filled on some routes in and out of Cornwall especially during the summer.

[Coffin Corner]

The E170 is still too heavy for GCI's ramp weight limit.

[GCILover]

Surely the E170 can't be any heavier than what the 146-300's were or are they???

I also reckon that alot of the talk about the embraer being too heavy is just the states way of stopping the aircraft coming in as they know alot of pax will probably choose flying on that than Aurignys ATR

[Chesty Morgan]

The max take off weight of the 170LR is 37.2 tonnes. About 8 less than the 146.

[Drink Up Thee Cider]

The new EDI-MSE-EDI averaged at about 60pax (give or take a few) on both sectors so it was a great start. My only concern would be that these levels of demand do not last, with the flight times as they are I do not believe as many business pax will use the service as hoped. However having said that, Flybe have said loads have exceeded expectations and the route will continue through winter.

And of course, the new MSE-MAN would not have been announced if the EDI route was struggling to get the money in.


I understand the pax mix on the first MSE EDI was VFR, golfers and a decent smattering of suits. The last group slightly surprising but bodes well.

[mrmagooo]

A certain department has been told by a high up manager "not to expect any other types on your licence" when asked about the 170 replacing Q4's he said that was less than likely as the dash did its job, cheaply

[Chesty Morgan]

But Mr Magooo if said Embraer could be made, nearly, as efficient as the Q400 but maintained it's near 100% despatch reliability (better by a mile than the Q400) then it would seem to be the best choice.

[RooCat]

Any route news or rumours for southampton???

[de Payen]

Tonyq,

for the sake of clarity, the first 4 aircraft (I,J,K and L) leases expire in October 2011 and not 2012 as you imply ;)

Hughes

[Toastal]

"Don't expect another type on your licence" mmmm........ I wonder if that was from a manager who wasn't actually privvy to the presentation Embraer gave the other week re Emb170's at Faulty Towers, come on!!

:suspect:T

[Otto Throttle]

Perhaps he meant that all those who already have the type on their licence will magically bypass the seniority requirements. Maybe the real post was "if you only have the Dash on your licence, don't expect a new type".

;)

[Cloud1]

I recall reading an article about Bombardier introducing the Q400 Stretch at Jim French's request.......I cannot remember the ins and outs but it would obviously be a longer version of the Q400 seating up to 100 passengers. Nothing mentioned since so I am not sure if it was just a joke or not but I wouldn't rule Bombardier out of any future fleet changes. Especially considering they too have their own jet similar to that of the E195....

I think any changes would be long term, after X amount of years.

[G SXTY]

A stretched stretched Dash - that'll be fun to fly . . .

:ooh:

[assymetricdrift]

Pitch 3.....

[choppercopper 99]

http://www.breakingtravelnews.com/news/article/flybe-flies-into-the-sunday-times-deloitte-top-track-100/

Interesting to see Flybe breaking into the league of the uk's top 100 private companies. How long will they remain private though?

Also very nice to see they have made £24 million profit in the last 12 months.

Very well done Flybe:D

[Drink Up Thee Cider]

I think the Sunday Times have got their numbers wrong and might be referring to 07/08 profits. :bored:

Looking at the Flybe website, they refer to a £12.8m profit in 08/09 and no official word on the 09/10 numbers yet: Flybe.com | News Archives | January 2010 (http://www.flybe.com/news/1001/29_1.htm)

[sparkymarky]

With Embraer claiming to be able to 'tweak' the 170 to similar efficiency as a Dash on flight times of approx. one hour or more.

Is there any more info available about the performance 'tweak' Embraer are planning?

Would be very interesting to see what the costs per mile are they can get for short-hops in a 170.

[Cyrano]

News here: (http://www.marketwatch.com/story/flybe-air-france-klm-sign-codeshare-deal-2010-07-13)

Flybe, Air France-KLM sign codeshare deal
By Sarah Turner

LONDON (MarketWatch) -- U.K. domestic airline Flybe and French-headquartered carrier Air France-KLM said Tuesday that they have signed a codeshare deal. Flybe passengers will have access to five additional routes between the U.K. and France as well as seven new domestic French routes and 11 international routes. Flybe services into Paris Charles de Gaulle airport will now connect to the Air France hub. Air France codeshare customers will gain access to 45 new routes from France to the U.K., as well as connections through Birmingham, Manchester and Southampton on a further 17 U.K. domestic routes.

[ara01jbb]

The AF routes that will carry BE codeshares, in detail:


Aberdeen to Paris Charles de Gaulle (CDG)
Birmingham to Lyon
Bristol to Paris Charles de Gaulle (CDG)
Edinburgh to Paris Charles de Gaulle (CDG)
Newcastle to Paris Charles de Gaulle (CDG)
Paris Orly to Bordeaux, Limoges, Nice, Perpignan and Toulouse
Paris Charles de Gaulle (CDG) to Bristol, Budapest, Geneva, Istanbul, Lyons, Madrid, Munich, Nice, Nuremburg, Prague, Sofia, Vienna, Warsaw and Zagreb

:ok:

[airhumberside]

A few omissions in that list (which was indeed sent out Flybe in an email) - the full list is on their website

A few curious omissions though
AF's SOU-ORY, LHR-CDG and LCY-ORY (LCY being Cityjet is perhaps understandable, since the LCY network seems to be excluded)
BE's LGW-Nantes (LGW-Bergerac/Limoges) are included however

[Serenity]

Don`t suppose Flybe crews will get anything like Air France pay or perks to go with this landmark agreement???!!!!

[virginblue]

Quick question - how fussy are Flybe when it comes to the size of carry-ons? Their allowance is 50cm x 35cm x 23cm, whereas the IATA norm - to which many trolleys are designed - is 55cm x 40cm x 20 cm. I am asking as they particularly remind pax to measure the size including trolley wheels, which indicates a somewhat fuzzy approach.

[davidjohnson6]

I seem to recall that FlyBE (or whatever the name was back then) had a significant codeshare with Air France many years ago, but that it was subsequently abandoned.

What's different about the codeshare this time that means it'll work now ?

[ara01jbb]

@virginblue.... how fussy they are depends entirely on the handling staff at your departure airport. But rest assured that if you bring something onto a Q400 that exceeds their dimensions, you will look a complete plonker trying to squeeze it into the (comparatively) narrow opening to the overhead bins.

[Drink Up Thee Cider]

If I remember rightly, the AF/BE British relationship was a franchise rather than a codeshare. A quite different relationship to what they have announced today.

[Tonyq]

Yes. BE had quite a few BAe 146's in full AF colours which were concentrated on the routes involved, but also appeared on their own services from time to time, especially at weekends.

[flying officer kite]

'how fussy they are depends entirely on the handling staff at your departure airport'

This is very true, alas several airports, notably Gatwick dont seem to regulate this at all. I'd hate to have an oversized bag fall out and hit me on the head when i fly

[Haven't a clue]

Gatwick do check from time to time. I have a Samsonite wheelie dimensioned in feet and inches, which when converted to metric is 2cm over BE's standard width. My bag fits happily in the locker or under the seat in front of me. But it sticks out a tad above their gauges. Thus far they have let me pass, but it does worry me, especially when it's full of expensive camera gear, as it often is.

I have tried to find another, but guess what? All so far have been originally sized imperially, and are equally (albeit modestly) oversize.

I think BE rounded down, not up when setting that standard.

Flying officer kite don't worry. In my experience really oversized bags don't fit in Q400 lockers.

[Cloud1]

My advice is if the airline says hand baggage no bigger than 50cm x 35cm x 23cm you follow it, and carry a bag this size or smaller. It is simple....

Flybe are fairly hot on it at the moment because too many people are taking the michael with what they take onboard. IATA bag sizes differ from airlines individual restrictions

[virginblue]

I do not want to bring oversized stuff, but just a standard IATA cabin trolley which has travelled on probably 100 different airlines with no problems. Problem is that suitcase producers tend to produce according to IATA standards, particularly when it comes to the length (55 cm vs. 50 cm). I have three Samsonite/Rimowa trolleys what all have different "heights" and "widths" (which is what really matter for the overhead bins), but "length" is somewhat standard. Maybe I should opt for psychological warfare and bring on the Lufthansa branded one :hmm:

[akerosid]

Good news!

Embraer Wins a $1.3 Billion Order for 35 Aircraft From U.K. Carrier Flybe - Bloomberg (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-07-20/embraer-wins-a-1-3-billion-order-for-35-aircraft-from-u-k-carrier-flybe.html)

Will these be used to replace Dash 8s, or for expansion?

[Ringwayman]

The Flybe release on their website says the Q400s are staying.

[DutchBird-757]

Ok, so 100+ E175's, 14 E195's and 50+ Q400's? That's one serious big fleet! So in the end all the rumors were true all along...

Indeed, looks like a dual fleet strategy.

Great news! :ok:

More info (http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-07-20/embraer-wins-1-3-billion-order-for-35-planes-from-u-k-s-flybe.html).

[FlyingTinCans]

It will be one seriously big fleet, prob too big.

I think the 175's will replace most of the Dash's as thier lease comes to an end, but leave a small fleet of them to do the low load, high frequency, short sectors, which will only ever make money on a Dash.

Great news for everyone tho, the E-Jets are great to sit in as a Pax and as a crew!

[Pandy]

Could some of these eventually find their way to BA at LCY, 'piggybacked' to obtain a better unit price?

[NickBarnes]

great news, iv'e flown on an E-jet a couple of times now both in a E-195 and a E-175 as a passenger, and both times they were great too sit in and very comfortable.

Good deal Flybe!!:ok:

[aidoair]

It will be one seriously big fleet, prob too big.

I think the 175's will replace most of the Dash's as there lease comes to an end, but leave a small fleet of them to do the low load, high frequency short sectors, which will only ever make money on a Dash.

Great news for everyone tho, the E-Jets are great to sit in as a Pax and as a crew!


It is great news for Flybe and their staff.

I do agree that it might be too big, though at the minute that's just going by how the fleet is currently being used, as their is no mention of this or plans for where the expansion may be used. It has already been stated some of the aircraft will most likely be used to replace the Dash's that are coming to the end of their lease. There is also the oppurtunity to perhaps open up at least two new airport bases in the UK and I can see some expansion in aircraft based in Europe too from this.

[andyafc]

Any idea where all these planes will go? Couple bases in uk would be good

[Jamesair]

I hope one or more ends up in NCL in line with their planned expansion from that base.

However, reading the statements on the Flybe website it seems that they plan to replicate their popular 2 x 2 seating, high frequency model within mainland Europe.

With first deliveries next year and, hopefully, economic recovery in Europe, there are interesting times ahead.

[Ian Brooks]

I thought that a few months ago they mentioned expanding into Europe


Ian B

[Ian Brooks]

I thought that a few months ago they mentioned expanding into Europe


Ian B

[autopilot_off]

There'll be a lot of happy faces in the crew rooms today!

Flybe.com | News Archives | July 2010 (http://www.flybe.com/news/1007/20.htm)

[egnxema]

If you tie in this latest news with last week's announcement of a large scale codeshare with Air France the future for flyBE looks like loosening the ties with BA and stregthening them with AF.

mr French was glowing in his comments about AFKL.

And AFKL have a recent history of buying up stock in partner airlines.

The codeshare with BE is just the start. Give it 12 months and AFKL will have purchased a share of BE (maybe BA will be wanting to divest its 15%?)

The new fleet expansion fit entirely with AFKL puchases for Britair, regionale, and KLM Cityhopper.

Within 5 year flyBE will be Air France UK.

[Groundloop]

Within 5 year flyBE will be Air France UK.

I hope not, after what happened to KLM uk.:ok:

[Boing7117]

No, I don't think Flybe will be snapped up by Air France - my understanding of the way the Flybe board want to do things is that if they're to be taken seriously by investors - they need to demonstrate that the UK's largest regional airline can apply its model into Europe.

The board firmly believe this will work (listening to Jim French's piece this morning on the BBC website), and if it is successful it won't be long before we see an IPO and Flybe Ltd on the stock market.

Flybe have some smart folk down in Exeter and I expect this be another impressive, forward-thinking decision that's going to make for some interesting times in the next few years.

Now.... where's my E175 bid form.....

[Wycombe]

FlyBe held options on a number of 195's - are these converted to firm 175 orders as part of this deal?

[WHBM]

Don't forget that BA own 15% of FlyBe, so both the Air France agreement and the big Embraer order will have needed Willie Walsh's approval.

It is surprising that AF have gone for a codeshare with someone else, rather than putting CityJet (which they own 100%) on these routes.

Regarding the jet order, are we seeing that the story about the Dash-400, and turboprops in general, being the way forward for shorter/smaller routes just doesn't stand up, and passengers perceive them as very much second best ? And as they are notably slower, you can't get in as many sectors per day. As well as seat-mile costs you need to think of revenue per aircraft per day.

[Tonyq]

Don't forget, that unless they have been quietly cancelled, BE still have 4 Q400's on firm order and 15 further options.

It would be interesting to have a definitive status on these orders/options too, in the light of today's news.

[bean]

The deal did not require Willie Walsh's approval. BA do not have a seat on the board

[G SXTY]

And as they are notably slower, you can't get in as many sectors per day. As well as seat-mile costs you need to think of revenue per aircraft per day.

The economics of Q400 v regional jets has been done to death on here. It has stonking great engines which mean that block times on shortish sectors (say 250nm) are virtually identical to jets. And because those engines turn great big propellers, it is very, very fuel-efficient (think similar burn to an E145, only with 50% more seats). Which is all great in theory.

In practice, reliability compares very unfavourably with our E195s – in fact a better comparison would be with a Friday afternoon-built Austin Allegro (albeit one with a Ferrari engine). And passengers really, really don't like turboprops. Holidaymakers might not care as long as they get a cheap seat, but frequent business travellers – the ones who buy the expensive tickets - are a bit fussier. Factor those points (amongst others) into the equation and the E175 starts to look like a very sensible option.

[Civagiarn]

Yeah, although most airlines seem to use idle reverse thrust on the e jets.

[Skipness One Echo]

but frequent business travellers – the ones who buy the expensive tickets - are a bit fussier.

Thank God there's no such thing as Eastern or VLM anymore. Oh wait a minute!
The best flight I've had this year was in an old Aer Lingus delivered CityJet liveried, Air France ticketed, VLM operated Fokker 50. There was even legroom.

[jdcg]

Where are they going to place all these new jets? Especially as it seems they're hanging on to quite a few of the Q400s. AF aren't going to sell them Cityjet are they??

[Serenity]

With all the money on new hardware, you now know why the crews only got offered a 0.3% pay rise (ontop of annual increments)!!

:=

[FL370 Officeboy]

Serenity - any crew member not happy with their pay rise should leave...pure and simple. Considering the problems the industry has had they are flaming lucky to have any pay rise at all and the move to get additional aircraft in now will ultimately help to improve upon future profits and possibly therefore, staff pay.

I am sorry if this sounds a bit shirty but I simply cannot believe your comment.... just be bloody grateful

I agree with serenity actually so I'm afraid your rant came across as indeed shirty..and naive!

[Coffin Corner]

And I agree with serenity & FL370 OfficeBoy

[Boing7117]

Cloud1,

Not sure which position you hold within Flybe but as aircrew we have an annual increment in place which has been in place as long as I've been at the company and before our union ever represented us.

This increment was implemented each year, and can be found for public reference on the flybe website under the careers section for flight crew.

Our letter which we recently received stated we'd be receiving a bonus (like yourself) and a 2% payrise...

Sounds fine in these harsh climates doesn't it...?

Though, what they forgot to mention was in fact that this 2% INCLUDES your annual increment (according to feedback from BALPA this afternoon). Therefore, in actual terms, again, according to BALPA, a real increase of just 0.3%. That works at about £8/month for me extra.

Since the annual increment has never been affected by pay freezes (I got mine last year and so did all the colleagues that I work with), to tell us that we're getting a 2% payrise is misleading and incorrect.

Oh and also Cloud1, I'm unable to leave since I'm bonded to the company (and as a result, if you take a look at the pay structure for new joiners), I accepted a lower pay in exchange for a type rating and a job (for which, as you put it, I am bloody grateful).

well if your crew, I am not surprised!

Expand upon that if you would. I'm keen to hear more..

[Cloud1]

oh dear, the moaners are out in force. well if it makes you feel any better the comment will be deleted :rolleyes: I really cannot be bothered to start arguing over this because it will go on forever like most debates on here....whenever there is a minority that disagree and speak up for someone or something a little gang develops to bash it out!

And when I said: if your crew I am not surprised, I merely meant that if Flightboy was crew too and had the same feelings as Serenity I wasnt surprised that he disagreed with me....thought that would have been pretty simple to comprehend myself...

[Coffin Corner]

It wasn't easy to comprehend cloud1, it came across as "bloody flightdeck, moaning and whinging again, aren't they paid enough?"

[Serenity]

I know the are those who say we should be grateful for a job, yes, but there are still bills to pay!!
We are not asking for millions, just a competitive salary with the rest of the industry.
The new jets are very shiny and may convince a few to stay, but when the rest of the world are flying jets for 20 grand + there will still be a mass exodus to greener grass, for better pay and conditions.
Flybe call themselves a training airline, this will continue until they grow up and join the proper aviation industry!!
Lots of profits, lots of cost saving and new shiny jets, yet the pilots still get shafted!!

We will see if BALPA have any teeth at all.

[Calmcavok]

Serenity - any crew member not happy with their pay rise should leave...pure and simple.

And as recruitment ramps up across the industry, watch them do so en masse! I suspect you are not familiar with the intimate details of our pay offer from the company. As noted above, it is most certainly not 2%, rather equating to 0.3%. After accepting a payfreeze last year, whilst making profit (and not subject to the profit share as promised), a .3% increase is something of a slap.

Whilst not trying to flame your post, please be aware that our pay offer is not as simple as was announced. We have annual increments set, these were not subject to a freeze, and nor should they be. They weren't in BA, they are not in the public sector. They are part of our career progression within the company and is in common with many other UK airlines. Please be aware that Flybe pay (as you have also alluded to) is low. Couple that with pretty tough scheduling, a poor management attitude to negotiation and you may start to understand why the pilot fraternity won't be terribly happy with your comments. If something isn't done to improve these points, watch Flybe struggle when BA, easyJet etc ramp up their recruitment.

In many respects Flybe is a great company to work for, w.r.t salary and scheduling, it isn't - and that dictates my mortgage and time off.

[Richard Taylor]

Great news from Flybe & hopefully for employment in an industry that has been hit hard of late. :ok:

Being selfish, hope to see more of Flybe at ABZ. :O

[arnoldk]

Hear hear RT.

Serenity - you're not living up to your name!

[dhc83driver]

you don`t really need any more, it sounds like concord backing up in the cabin if you use any powered reverse for not a lot of extra stopping. At idle it puts the weight on the brakes for better performance. It lands and stops so well its never an issue.

Great news for the Flybe boys and girls.

[NickBarnes]

so were do you think there euro expansion will be? i.e which countries do you think there domestic services model would work best?

gotta to say Scandinavia, i.e Norway and maybe Sweden wouldn't be a bad bet

[Ringwayman]

I don't think Olympic would be happy if they chose Athens given the deal they struck with them!

[assymetricdrift]

Possible codeshare with OAL and a deal to be had with moving on Q400s to them?

That would do the trick!

[BluffOldSeaDog]

So when do we buy the rest of the ex-BAConnect. Come on over you CityFlyer boys the water's lovely :)

[dhc83driver]

Come on over you CityFlyer boys the water's lovely

we prefer our water muddy and tidal!

Good news on the new aircraft. Just waiting to see if we are getting our options.

[mathers_wales_uk]

I hope the proposed Cardiff base is a step closer now then as the airport seriously needs the business.

[OltonPete]

Flybe.com | News Archives | July 2010 (http://www.flybe.com/news/1007/21.htm)

Wow only one day since the announcement and they have brought
forward the EIS date of the 175 to Spring 2011.

Glad I didn't put any money on the first base!!!!

Guernsey - Gatwick it is to be then for the first route.

Pete

[BAladdy]

Flybe.com | News Archives | July 2010 (http://www.flybe.com/news/1007/21.htm)

Wow only one day since the announcement and they have brought
forward the EIS date of the 175 to Spring 2011.

Glad I didn't put any money on the first base!!!!

Guernsey - Gatwick it is to be then for the first route.

Pete

With the first one going to GCI, I wonder if the next few will go to operate BE's flights from LGW to DUS, IOM, LBA, and NCL. The aircraft could then be roatated around the routes if required.

This would free up some DH4's for possible sale or to expand services from airports such as BOH and MSE.

[LAX2000]

Flybe's new investment a major boost for Southampton International Airport (From Daily Echo) (http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/8284059.1_000_new_jobs_thanks_to___3bn_airline_deal/)

SOU to get up to 10 new destinations possibly Copenhagen, Stockholm, Helsinki, Milan and Stuttgart.

Currently BE have 6 x DH4's & 2 EMB 195 based ?

[barker987]

is this a sign that the ariline world is on the way up? meaning hopefully some jobs

[nicoledc109]

Thanks you for the post.
Hi guys, Im a newbie. Nice to join this forum.


edited

[Haven't a clue]

From Flybe's man re GCI/E175:

“We have long been aware of the demands for a regular jet service to and from London Gatwick from Guernsey. We pride ourselves on always listening and responding to our passengers’ business and leisure travel needs and this move is an important reflection of our determination in meeting those demands.”

So can we here in the IoM have one too please?

Pretty please?

[Tonyq]

Mike Rutter was on the radio the other evening saying the he'd expect IOM-LGW to go over to the E175, but didn't say when.

As a regular pax on the route it will be very welcome and will probably have sufficient appeal to draw some business traffic back from RE and LCY and fill those extra seats.

Only downside I can see is that having 4 interchangeable Q400's based has given operational flexibility and enabled the daily IOM programme to run on a very reliable basis.

This has been a big improvement from the days when a 146 ploughed back and forth to LGW four times and was quite often significantly behind schedule by the end of the day. Not much fun for day trip pax getting back to Ronaldsway at 10.30pm, after starting from home at 5.30am. Not to mention the cost of late airport opening for the operator.

So provided there isn't a punctuality trade off, bring it on!

[ALLMCC]

I wonder if, at long last, we'll see some scheduled international destinations from BHD. Flybe have been promising these for years and, so far, all there is Paris and that's via Exeter.

[Cloud1]

Well you did have Rennes at one point but that didnt last long, I suspect because of lack of demand. Paris is not very busy even via Exeter so cannot see that going direct from BHD anytime soon.

[mathers_wales_uk]

Flybe has tried BHD-CDG direct on their seccond year or operating from CWL.

Initially it was BHD-CWL-CDG-CWL-BHD x 2 daily which was very popular in all directions.

However in their seccond year they switched it to GLA and operated BHD-CDG direct which im sure didn't turn out too good.

[GEB74]

With regards the corporate B.S "pulling out all the stops" to get a E175 or two quickly next spring to operate GCI to LGW........

This is but a riposte to the news of Blue Islands buying Aurigny.
Flybe are just pissed that they didn't get a fair chance to bid for Aurigny for themselves.
They are now making their feelings clearly known to the State of Guernsey and to Blue Islands.
I would expect Flybe to saturate the route with exclusive E175 operations until Blue Islands disappear.
Harsh, but fair game IMHO

[PPRuNe Pop]

Just So That You Know!


No Advertising In Name Or Deed. One Post Has Been Edited. One Is Deleted.

[Civagiarn]

I actually prefer hearing reverse thrust on landing, it makes the landing a bit more exciting! Are there any circumstances under which you would use powered reverse on the E jets?
Im really happy for the Flybe order, it looks like they're planning to become a very big market player.

[dhc83driver]

I`ve used full reverse twice on the Ejet, both times on the 170 max landing weight into LCY wet runway icing speeds in gusty wind. Its been that it all feels a bit fast and a bit short feeling with a Vap of 140kts + . Both times stopping has been very good and could maybe of got away without the reverse.


It is very noisy in the cabin, a lot more so than the Airbus or 737 using reverse.

The 190 has never been an issue, with the bigger wing it lands a lot slower.

[peacock1]

.congrats to you at fly be from the emerald isle....
now, do us a favour, and stuff it to europe's least liked airline...you know who....:ok:

[clareview]

Would that be the same europes least liked airline that 70M bookings are being made with this year?

[Chesty Morgan]

Possibly, but least liked doesn't necessarily equate to least used.

[clareview]

Mathers Wales UK is correct that Flybe did a direct Belfast City to CDG a could of years ago. It was in direct competition with Easyjet from Belfast International and did not last that long

[Civagiarn]

You see, I would have really enjoyed those landings especially being noisier than the 737/A320. So is there very specific airline guidelines then for t/r use or is it mostly pilots discretion? Sorry for going so off topic, Ive been curious about this for ages.

[Chesty Morgan]

Well Flybe SOP is to use minimum reverse. But there is nothing preventing us using max reverse right down to zero speed if we really need it.

Using minimum reverse removes the residual thrust from the engine therefore reducing (but not as much as max reverse) brake wear. It also minimises fuel consumption and noise.

[EI-BUD]

Mathers Wales UK is correct that Flybe did a direct Belfast City to CDG a could of years ago. It was in direct competition with Easyjet from Belfast International and did not last that long


Yes Flybe launched a daily nonstop 195 service on BHD CDG but at the same time Aer Lingus also launched a daily rotation from BFS and over night Belfast Paris market went from 1 daily to 3 daily flights, none of the 3 got great loads.. understandably!

[dhc83driver]

Our SOP is min rev as a norm, also if you use powered reverse it puts another thermal cycle on the engine so reduces life and there is the 6min cool down time. Not good if you have a short taxi.

[G SXTY]

I would have really enjoyed those landings especially being noisier than the 737/A320.

You'd love max reverse in a Q400 then. ;)

[olster]

This is the best bit of news for the airline industry and unemployed pilots for quite some time.Whether the Embraer has thrust reversers or not and debating same is going wildly off at a tangent and irrelevant.Stay focused chaps.

[aeulad]

BE's new Humberside to Malaga scheduled service averaged 108.5 pax per flight in June. This is very positive!

Does anyone in the know have an incling or info as to whether BE's offering of sun routes from HUY will be expanded next year?

Kind Regards

Mike

[Serenity]

Air Berlin have joined One World, and as ABTN reports,
"BA will be Air Berlin's alliance sponsor, helping the airline through the joining process"

As BA own 17% of Flybe, why haven`t Flybe joined One World to increase routes and passenger flow??

or,
is it in the pipeline now the jet order is on?
will they join Star Allience through Air France/KLM??
BA will just buy up the rest of Flybe when floated???
:confused:

[Wycombe]

I doubt anyone would be joining the Star Alliance via Air France/KLM!

Maybe you meant Skyteam?

[BAladdy]

As BA own 17% of Flybe, why haven`t Flybe joined One World to increase routes and passenger flow??


BA will probably hold on to see how the floatation goes.Then they could firstly increase there stake so that it has a majority over any other airline that may invest. They could sell there stake if it was to make a profit. Or it could sell there stake to AB who would probably look to taking the company over.

[clareview]

Why would BA want to buy Flybe when it was delighted to get rid of its regional operation to Flybe not that long ago. BA's record with regionals is interesting - Manx Airlines, Manx Airlines Europe, Cityflyer, Brymon, BA Connect etc.

Is it not more likely that Air France will show interest bearing in mind its long relationship with what was then Jersey European (operated BaE146's in Air Fr colours from Heathrow to regional airports in France), how it took over Cityjet and subsequently VLM and Scot plus the new Air Fr/Flybe codeshare?

[egnxema]

clareview
You are spot on. AF have every intention of purchasing a chunk of BE within the next two years.

If BA's current 15% is not enough to prevent BE from entering an extensive codeshare with one of its major competitors you may well ask how long will BA want to keep the stake. With BA's sights being more spanish in its future, you can be sure they will offload their BE holding quite soon.

[Tom the Tenor]

Well, I dont really know if the Cork Airport Authority are interested or not but I am more than happy to get down on both my bended knees to beseech, implore and beg for FlyBe to review whether it might be interested in making a return to Cork from Belfast and to also consider the viability of a Southampton Cork service as well even if it was two to three times a week.

The Q400s and the ERJ 175s to come would seem at first glance to be an ideal frame for many Cork operations.

Thank you.

[clareview]

My bet is Manx2 - it seems it operates successfully IOM to both BFS and BDH and is now doing BFS - Galway and Cork so why not BHD - Cork?

[Tom the Tenor]

Yes, and better still, base a Let 410 or Do228 in Cork and starts flights to BHD and Southampton and maybe, Coventry? If they could get their hands on something pressurised like a Jetstream 31/41 it would be better not that I dislike the Let which are actually quite nice aeroplanes.

[ALLMCC]

If Manx 2 take up BHD - ORK, it would need to be direct and not via GWY as they do with the BFS route. Also, BFS to ORK only operates 2x weekly, BHD to ORK would need to be at least daily or better still 2x daily - honestly can't see it.

As for Flybe, don't hold your breath - they themselves seem to have lost interest in developing any further at BHD and don't currently operate to ORK from anywhere else. I suppose a Loganair franchise operation might be a possibility but could Loganair spare the aircraft?

I think the best option would be Aer Lingus Regional if they can spare the aircraft operating 2x daily for the business fraternlty.

Just hope someone will step in.

[BFS101]

As for Flybe, don't hold your breath - they seem to have lost interest in developing any further at BHD They attempted Humberside only recently, but forward bookings alleged to have been awful, and new direct route to Guernsey this summer.

Would love to see FlyBE operate routes to some business centres in Europe, possibly codeshared to allow onward connections. Frankfurt, Brussels, etc. Business friendly BHD and smaller aircraft than the likes of EZY or EI.

[big d1]

I don't think they really tried with the Humberside, very little if any advertising. I therefore think they were not too bothered if it operated or not. The Guernsey is a nice route for the summer to add to the Jersey, but it is a shame that they dropped the Rennes to make room. The couple of times I operated it the previous summer I thought it at least payed its way, and have had a couple of people tell me that it is a shame its gone as they used it to get down to second homes in Rennes in the summer.

I believe Flybe are happy with what they have operation wise out of BHD and I don't think you will see flybe adding any new routes to europe any time soom. Remember that any european routes would take the aircraft out of BHD for a relatively long period. Especially if flying down to Germany. Both the dash and the E195's have full schedules with UK domestics in the afternoon at the moment (does get a lot quieter in the winter) and the business men and women want frequency. Therefore chopping out some of the rotations in my view would not be a smart move.

We seem to be happy to stick to the domestics and leave the European routes the EZY. Maybe if we got an E175 here in BHD you might see some new routes but I don't think we are that high up the list to receive one. Would like to be proved wrong though.

With regards to the BHD Cork route, I would put Manx2 as been more likely to take it over than Flybe. If we really wanted to start it we would have. Also is there the demand for a 78 seat aircraft? And again there is no room in the early morning schedule to do an early rotation at a good time for the buisness traveler without another route making way.

[Channex101]

Has anyone heard anything about BA selling off its short haul network to Flybe, to start summer 2011 and to be announced next week?

Just heard a crumour and wondered if anyone could shed any light?

[ara01jbb]

When prodded for an response re: BHD-ORK by a colleague, BE's response was:

We are evaluating the potential of this route, and may decide shortly if there is a viable operation to be offered.

Which could mean just about anything.

My hunch is similar to those above, that it would only work if it's at least twice daily during the week. But I doubt whether the BHD based Q400s have any lee-way in their busy morning / evening schedules. One of the Loganair a/c that visit BHD would perhaps be a better fit capacity wise, but that would mean all manner of re-jigging the schedules to make a reasonable W-sector.

</uninformed speculation>

[Maverick8701]

Has anyone heard anything about BA selling off its short haul network to Flybe, to start summer 2011 and to be announced next week?

Just heard a crumour and wondered if anyone could shed any light?

Had heard the rumours but thought it was going to be Jan 2013 after the Olympics as BA wanted to keep at least LCY for advertising purposes!

Maybe LGW/GLA/EDI/MAN??? could come sooner??

[big d1]

Rumours of Flybe taking over BA shorthaul at Gatwick have been been doing the rounds for ages. No doubt this new order of E175 has only added to it. If this is a new one about taking over ALL of BA shorthaul (LHR + LGW) then its a new one to me.

I'll believe it when I see it.

ara01jbb

Sounds like Flybe haven’t discounted it then. I know they have said in the past when other people have asked whether we are going to start a route (DTV-LGW when bmi dropped their LHR springs to mind) that we have no plans to do so. So maybe we might give this a go. As you say it could mean anything.

Got to love specualtion :ok:

[clareview]

BA Gatwick 737s were recently reported to be staying for the medium term which suggests no plans too off load the network. Also Flybe's link to Air France would tend to suggest Flybe feeder would be to Air Fr rather than BA long haul (though of course it is but a shadow of what it once was at LGW)

[Maverick8701]

Innolla lähden kotiin talvella!

[JC25]

Flybe are to begin flights on behalf of Finnair from October 2010 through to the end of the summer 2011. Good to know that there is now work for the aircraft (and hopefully crews) returning from Athens at the end of the Olympic Air contract :)

[Maverick8701]

Last thing I heard before it was agreed was Dash's so unless it's changed some interesting flying ahead!!!

[Tonyq]

This report indicates 3xQ400's.

Boarding.no : Finnair and FlyBe in cooperation agreement (http://www.boarding.no/art.asp?id=42672)

I wonder if this means the ex-SAS quartet will now be staying. The decommissioning of G-ECOW had suggested they were going to be replaced by the aircraft coming back from Olympic.

[Deano777]

A Dash it is, 3 x Q400s

[Calmcavok]

Another exciting development for Flybe. What about an exciting development in pay & conditions? I won't hold my breath...

[Cloud1]

Would be nice to see some Flybe routes.....am I right in saying that BE pax will not be able to book these Finnair routes on Flybe's website and it is literally just a copy of what the Olympic contract was just in Helsinki instead??

[virginblue]

Anyone in the know what FlyBe's position is re the cancellation of some of their EDI-NQY flights in September? Are they re-booking pax to/from EXT? The only other option I can think of would be dumping pax to dry out in the cold as they cannot route pax via LGW, obviously (unless they are happy to put you on a 2 stop flight)

They have tried to call me and I would like to be prepared when discussing the matter with their customer service (EXT is no really practical as I have accommodation / rental car etc. in NQY...).

[JC25]

I would imagine that they will offer you either a full refund or an alternative, perhaps EXT as you suggest. But if you're happy to do NQY-LGW-BHD-EDI as an alternative and the times match up, they may let you do that...

[Serenity]

Finnair blames ash cloud for widening losses | ABTN (http://www.abtn.co.uk/news/0614519-finnair-blames-ash-cloud-widening-losses)

[GCILover]

I see Flybe are now selling flights from SOU-ORY from the winter season. I thought it might have been as part of the AF codeshare but if you go to book or look at the timetable it shows 3 flights per weekday (the first and last being on a SOU night stopping aircraft) and states, operated by flybe using a q400.

Does anyone know if this is going to be as a replacement to the CDG service or an addition as an extra route ????

[RNWY03]

GCI Lover

Seem to remember that when the AFcodeshare arrangment was announced by Flybe it was stated that they would be taking over the SOU-ORY route from AF. It was reported a few days later in the local (Southampton) press, by a Flybe spokeman that the CDG service "may return" in the future........hedging their bets?

[teleparty]

Am curious why flybe have not tried flights to poland. Especially from Southampton where i think 1 in 10 are polish.

[jpthomas72]

Am curious why flybe have not tried flights to poland. Due to Ryanair, basically. Also the wrong planes. Ryanair has very strong Eastern European connections, from Bristol and Stansted. Also Wizzair at Luton. Doesn't seem so close from the South but there are coaches (check your local Polish shop). Poland really wouldn't work with BE's Q400, it's too far, and the Embraers need to be full to make any money. It's just not FlyBE's market. I'd also guess Easyjet's Berlin flight from Gatwick has a good portion of Polish people (esp from Poznan, Szczecin). Some people you think are Polish are actually Lithuanian or Latvian and they have flights from Gatwick already. Oh, not to forget, BA and LOT have Warsaw flights from Heathrow which are really not that expensive, at high frequency. Competition in Eastern Europe is fierce and more than one airline has already gone under there. BmiBaby once tried an adventure at Birmingham to go to Poland, gone so fast you couldn't see.

[darren1]

I'm sure Southampton to Poland flights overnight would work, be it EMB 195 or D-8's. Poles will fly at any time of day if it's cheap and it would keep the Flybe aircraft in the air, 10PM take off and 6 or 7AM arrival, just intime to fly the first domestic of the day.

[teleparty]

It can not be underestimated just how many Polish people there are in Southampton. Its around 20,000 with the majority returning home at least once a year. I personaly am surprised that flybe havn't at least tried to tap into this market. Sure wizz would try it if their planes were not stupidly big.

[Jamie2k9]

Ryanair served Wroclaw from Bourthmouth for a while and I think Krakow was there for a while but i'm not sure.

[IJM]

Sure wizz would try it if their planes were not stupidly big.

Yes, how reckless of Wizz to dare to use those behemoths of the skies - the A320!

[teleparty]

Well they don't strike me as the best plane to use if your a low cost airline. A319 would be better suited surely, well easyjet seem to show anyway.

[big d1]

EasyJet actually changed some of their A319 orders to A320's after gaining and operating a couple following the purchase of GB Airways. JetBlue seem to have made the A320 work very well aswell. Also Ryanair have been pretty successful operating an aircraft bigger than the A320.

[teleparty]

Just think your limiting the routes you can operate by having a bigger plane. Makes sense to have one type but why not a small plane? You can operate far more routes and if you need extra capacity just add more rotations. More frequency is only going to be welcomed by customers.