BA pilots vote to strike
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 593
Likes: 105
From: London
Is it my hearing or did Cruz refer to his company on Sky News as British Airlines.
British AIRWAYS please Snr Cruz !
Well here is a proposal to end this deadlock.
Give the pilots what they are striking for BUT in a structured way.
Give the pilots HALF of the current offer now, which will be paid regardless.
The remainder to be paid ONLY IF the profit reaches a level which triggers directors bonuses OR some other agreed amount, say 1b, when the results are published and at the same time as the directors are paid THEIR bonus.
So, Cruz , saves money now, and pays the remainder ONLY if and when the money comes in.
Face saved all round, BA gets back flying with motivated pilots NOT carrying extra fuel etc. and cost effective all round.
Trash this idea if you wish BUT it is basically how I ran my small aviation business and it worked.
Last edited by RetiredBA/BY; 9th September 2019 at 12:16.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 314
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From: Button Moon
In any case, withdrawing your labour from your employer is an enormously difficult and personal decision. I know my position as a BALPA member (sat at home with a coffee and sky news) but if others feel differently then that's absolutely fine too. We're Professionals first and foremost and should continue to act accordingly, treating our colleagues with respect and courtesy regardless of their own decision today and going forward.
Our biggest weapon in any dispute with our employer will always be unity and respect for each other as a professional community is paramount to achieving that.
Joined: Apr 2006
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From: Peripatetic
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,761
Likes: 6
From: Lemonia. Best Greek in the world
A couple of quick points.
1. No TU can "instruct" its members to do anything. They could only do that in the past when there were closed shops. Only the RMT tries to do that nowadays. BALPA asked its members what THEY wanted to do about BA. They replied more or less unanimously. The "Instructions" were from the members to the TU.
2. The word "average" is being misused. The BA pilot total fraternity have average pay of roughly £100k.
1. No TU can "instruct" its members to do anything. They could only do that in the past when there were closed shops. Only the RMT tries to do that nowadays. BALPA asked its members what THEY wanted to do about BA. They replied more or less unanimously. The "Instructions" were from the members to the TU.
2. The word "average" is being misused. The BA pilot total fraternity have average pay of roughly £100k.
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,761
Likes: 6
From: Lemonia. Best Greek in the world
Mr "Would you buy a second hand car from this man" is paid approx £1.4m. 14 times what a pilot gets.
Er, if it is him, or 14 Nigels/Ruperts, then I would go for the 14. (What do the Navy call their pilots?)
As an aside, no parents are calling their children Nigel anymore. Where will BA get their pilots from?
Er, if it is him, or 14 Nigels/Ruperts, then I would go for the 14. (What do the Navy call their pilots?)
As an aside, no parents are calling their children Nigel anymore. Where will BA get their pilots from?
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,148
Likes: 3
From: Brexitland
Great thing about these strikes -ie BA and Ryanair is that it tends to stop the continual attack on COS everywhere against the sharp end of aviation ~ the Aircrew.
Post Mr O'Leary and his ignoramus comments we have "Shock Horror" that BA A380 Captains earn approx £200,000!! I say that's the minimum they deserve. Of course it sounds a lot if you add 11% to such a number but these pilots are at the top of the tree! What do people want them to earn?? Remember they are at the pinnacle of their careers and have earned their rank/position over decades of being tested and examined very 6 months of their Airline lives and have maintained an outstanding level of professional knowledge and performance.
Who else do we want in charge when the **it hits the fan??
Good on you Lads and Lassies. My daughter wants to be a pilot and you'll be doing her a great favour.
Thank You.
Post Mr O'Leary and his ignoramus comments we have "Shock Horror" that BA A380 Captains earn approx £200,000!! I say that's the minimum they deserve. Of course it sounds a lot if you add 11% to such a number but these pilots are at the top of the tree! What do people want them to earn?? Remember they are at the pinnacle of their careers and have earned their rank/position over decades of being tested and examined very 6 months of their Airline lives and have maintained an outstanding level of professional knowledge and performance.
Who else do we want in charge when the **it hits the fan??
Good on you Lads and Lassies. My daughter wants to be a pilot and you'll be doing her a great favour.
Thank You.
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 363
Likes: 0
I won't wax lyrical in my appreciation for the stand the pilots of BA are making on behalf of all in this downtrodden profession. Many of us at lower profile airlines are facing the same fight with greedy executives. Suffice it to say if I encounter any BA crew down line the beers are absolutely on me. You have proven we can still stand strong. Thank you.
Joined: Jan 2015
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From: Centre of Universe
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
All the publication of “average salary” is a red herring. It doesn’t really matter, but the company uses it to try and say the pilots are unreasonable. What someone makes isn’t tied to how smart they are or how valuable they are... it’s what the market will bear. The modern society controlled by big business tries to always make labor the enemy. Worse yet, so many “common” working people don’t support labor, but rather buy into the false line of thinking pushed by the big corporations. Should your working 12 hour duty days, being gone from home countless days, studying for sim checks, etc etc enrich the shareholder? Management? We don’t want to kill the golden goose, but record profits are record profits.
I have a skill the company needs and I’m not easy to replace. I’ll leverage that to protect my livelihood and support my family. I work hard, I’m professional, and I emphasize safety. I know my colleagues at BA do the same! It takes years of training and skill to get to that level, so there is no reason you should settle for less than what the market can support. Especially on the heels of concessions and give backs.
Good luck! We’re with you!
I have a skill the company needs and I’m not easy to replace. I’ll leverage that to protect my livelihood and support my family. I work hard, I’m professional, and I emphasize safety. I know my colleagues at BA do the same! It takes years of training and skill to get to that level, so there is no reason you should settle for less than what the market can support. Especially on the heels of concessions and give backs.
Good luck! We’re with you!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
From: UK
Apologies if this has already been posted. Anyone not turning up for their duty today has had their pay deducted for the entire trip (e.g. 5 - 6 day) not just the days of the strike. It has also been deducted at the credited hours for that trip even though the flight has been cancelled. Office workers would be penalised by one day of pay for each day they didn't work. BA pilots have been penalised by the whole cost of the trip at their full rate. Some have calculated that at this rate of deduction, they will have a negative pay check after missing two rostered trips on strike days.
Additionally, all have lost staff travel for 3 years, lost any company wide bonus for this year, lost any pilot only bonus for 2017-19 as negotiated two years ago, no access to overtime rate to pick up trips (this is probably fair enough), plus no chance to bid for a fleet change on long haul - for ever ! This punishment has been in the planning for several weeks as the emails were sent out within hours of a failed report. If anyone thinks this is not a predetermined program by BA to break BALPA and the pilots then they are being naïve.
So if anyone thinks it will be better to cave in now and accept the consequences, the above shows the aims of BA. Break the pilots and tear up any industrial agreements. I feel sorry for the guys with long careers ahead if this is allowed to happen.
Additionally, all have lost staff travel for 3 years, lost any company wide bonus for this year, lost any pilot only bonus for 2017-19 as negotiated two years ago, no access to overtime rate to pick up trips (this is probably fair enough), plus no chance to bid for a fleet change on long haul - for ever ! This punishment has been in the planning for several weeks as the emails were sent out within hours of a failed report. If anyone thinks this is not a predetermined program by BA to break BALPA and the pilots then they are being naïve.
So if anyone thinks it will be better to cave in now and accept the consequences, the above shows the aims of BA. Break the pilots and tear up any industrial agreements. I feel sorry for the guys with long careers ahead if this is allowed to happen.
Last edited by Marty-Party; 9th September 2019 at 18:00. Reason: comments
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Hundred Acre Wood
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,726
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From: The Winchester
FWIW the current southbound SIN/SYD BA 15 airframe doesn't get back into LHR until early'ish Wednesday AM, so that may well be the "tail end charlie"...
Last edited by wiggy; 9th September 2019 at 19:11.
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 666
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From: Earth
weren't most of the 19 cityflier jets? There were only about 6 heathrow ba jets around 11am, osaka, haneda, lima, charleston , dubai and islamabad if i recall correctly. I didn't check the gatwick fleet though
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 3,077
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From: Oop North, UK
Not sure if it shows the strength of the BA pilots or how little the BA management are trying to operate the flight but TCX operated all their flights, not sure how many Ryanair did, but certainly a lot more than BA have done!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 46
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From: UK
Is it a coincidence that senior long haul pilots down route are not on strike, getting paid, along with their allowances while the junior ones back in the UK are on strike and taking a hit on pay and allowances?
I guess that is the fairness of seniority for you.
I guess that is the fairness of seniority for you.
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 32
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From: London
Complete fiction! I would’ve imagine Mon/Tues reports on long haul were pretty senior in any case.