BA pilots vote to strike
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 659
Likes: 10
From: The EU
Originally Posted by FACoff
Meanwhile people line up to join BA on nothing but the industry rumour that it's still the best place to be. I fell for it too.
And this is why things will never improve. There will always be a steady stream of personality vacuums willing to join BA simply for the opportunity to boost their self-importance and get the validation they never had in the real world, at the expense of those who have a life outside of social media. The management know this.
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 387
Likes: 1
From: Centre of Universe
At some point pilots need a make a stand at the poor terms and conditions on offer in the UK generally. Unfortunately, I don't see it happening as the industry is too fragmented, and pilots identify with their aircraft or airline more than a fellow pilot working elsewhere. You don't see that with Doctors , for example.
In the BA/IAG case, the organisation has shown itself to be unwilling to negotiate further. It is pointless waiting any longer. A one month strike would bring things to a head, and make loss of pay/salary deductions easy to calculate. Essentially, it is only the same as 1 months unpaid leave, something that is increasingly difficult to get in BA.
I would be more than happy to continue striking until the end of the mandate, before balloting to extend it further.
In the BA/IAG case, the organisation has shown itself to be unwilling to negotiate further. It is pointless waiting any longer. A one month strike would bring things to a head, and make loss of pay/salary deductions easy to calculate. Essentially, it is only the same as 1 months unpaid leave, something that is increasingly difficult to get in BA.
I would be more than happy to continue striking until the end of the mandate, before balloting to extend it further.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 125
Likes: 3
From: Europe
Vokes55
People line up to join BA because they believe flying a bigger chunk of metal or putting a picture of their hat and British Airways name badge on their Instagram page named “xxxx_the_pilot” or “pilotxxxx” is more important than T&Cs and pay.
And this is why things will never improve. There will always be a steady stream of personality vacuums willing to join BA simply for the opportunity to boost their self-importance and get the validation they never had in the real world, at the expense of those who have a life outside of social media. The management know this.
Joined: Jul 1998
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
From: between 20 & 30 000'
A bit harsh. I used to work for BEA then BA and also did a stint in BA Airtours. We always got some stick in the holiday destinations from the other charter guys, usually good natured. There is obviously a lot going on in the industry that I am not party to. But what seems clear is that management is determined to change the status of pilots "into glorified busdrivers". A backward step for one will eventually affect all. Best of luck to you all, you really need to support each other. By the way I have done some time as a BALPA rep and sat across the table from BA management. They are not interested in the long term future of the company. We were.
Good point made, many pilots in the industry are excluded from any group representation, a cynical move by management to change the status and package, as you say. I have been reading some articles about the recent BA strike and see many people are very critical of the pilots many calling them greedy, selfish, etc and applauding management. Pilots worldwide really do need to stand up and start selling the profession properly or we are doomed. When unions choose to take industrial, I reckon they should engage in PR companies to sell their image to the public, There is a definite campaign afoot to reduce the pilot packages (execs get massive bonusses for this!), time the pilot group started fighting back.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 125
Likes: 3
From: Europe
Image
It is not just in the airline business that executives are abusing the workforce for their own gain.
However I feel that the image of the airline pilot matters. I once threatened to offload a copilot if he came to work again without his hat. He made the point that the hat did not affect his ability. I responded that if he looked like a busdriver then the company would be delighted to pay him accordingly.. These days I am sad to see pilots in the terminal no hats, jackets undone, rucksacks over their back etc. Don't dumb it down, some of the old fashioned ways can still have a use. Just a thought. Maybe I'm just an old fart.
However I feel that the image of the airline pilot matters. I once threatened to offload a copilot if he came to work again without his hat. He made the point that the hat did not affect his ability. I responded that if he looked like a busdriver then the company would be delighted to pay him accordingly.. These days I am sad to see pilots in the terminal no hats, jackets undone, rucksacks over their back etc. Don't dumb it down, some of the old fashioned ways can still have a use. Just a thought. Maybe I'm just an old fart.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 204
Likes: 13
From: UK
If you were to offload a colleague for not bringing a hat, you would probably (in this age of instant messaging) find that would be the last time someone wore a hat when they were rostered with you.
Hats make you look like a security guard. So each to their own, old fart.
Hats make you look like a security guard. So each to their own, old fart.
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
From: Germany
If you were to offload a colleague for not bringing a hat, you would probably (in this age of instant messaging) find that would be the last time someone wore a hat when they were rostered with you.
Hats make you look like a security guard. So each to their own, old fart.
And im far from an old fart.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 199
Likes: 3
From: Top of the World
The longer this goes on, the more time management has to implement plan B.
A secondary workforce sourced and ready to step in temporarily. If you don’t think they are already planning this, you are naive - it’s their ultimate wet dream.
They will use this just as with CC to forever screw over the Pilots and force a new pay scale. It’ll be worth the short term pain for them, and easily justified.
You need to act, and act now.
A secondary workforce sourced and ready to step in temporarily. If you don’t think they are already planning this, you are naive - it’s their ultimate wet dream.
They will use this just as with CC to forever screw over the Pilots and force a new pay scale. It’ll be worth the short term pain for them, and easily justified.
You need to act, and act now.
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
From: Germany
The longer this goes on, the more time management has to implement plan B.
A secondary workforce sourced and ready to step in temporarily. If you don’t think they are already planning this, you are naive - it’s their ultimate wet dream.
They will use this just as with CC to forever screw over the Pilots and force a new pay scale. It’ll be worth the short term pain for them, and easily justified.
You need to act, and act now.
A secondary workforce sourced and ready to step in temporarily. If you don’t think they are already planning this, you are naive - it’s their ultimate wet dream.
They will use this just as with CC to forever screw over the Pilots and force a new pay scale. It’ll be worth the short term pain for them, and easily justified.
You need to act, and act now.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 125
Likes: 3
From: Europe
If you were to offload a colleague for not bringing a hat, you would probably (in this age of instant messaging) find that would be the last time someone wore a hat when they were rostered with you.
Hats make you look like a security guard. So each to their own, old fart.
"Love" from an old fart!!
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 125
Likes: 3
From: Europe
Old Hat
I know it's "old hat" but image can be important. Some professions need to look "professional". I always used to take my uniform off when commuting. I preferred to relax and be anonymous. Anyway we digress, the important thing is the dispute and a way forward for BA pilots and hopefully a positive knock-on effect for all.
Regards
Regards
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 593
Likes: 105
From: London
Just what do they wish to achieve, to me, if it is the case, it seems a really crass pursuit ?
The pilots are not miners, British Leyland workers or Australian pilots, all of whom made unreasonable demands from failing companies, financially unable to meet those demands if they were to survive.
If they really do want to crush BALP. and its members I believe Cruz and Walsh are on for a very sharp shock.
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 359
Likes: 221
From: Yorkshire
Funny old thing about the hats:
And it appears from several posts that the EasyJet Ts&Cs are probably better in some ways.
But stick to your hats...
But stick to your hats...
Only half a speed-brake
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 4,459
Likes: 136
From: Commuting not home
Explain how yourselves contributed to the massive financial success by working beyond what the job normally involves or above the standards of other large airlines' pilots.
Me - FD - does not need to know. Just a suggestion that the answer better be neat and convincing once it is demanded, unlike the eyewatering fiasco in the pages herabove after the "overpaid busdrivers" comment.
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: UK
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 593
Likes: 105
From: London
Not sure what you guys are on. Have any of you ever run a business ?
When things are going well, very well indeed, why the hell risk damaging it to try and get yet more.
A totally pointless exercise.
.....and for flight detents info. its a long time since I was a BA pilot BUT I understand the issues, and certainly ready to explain the issues to those who have not yet cottoned on !
When things are going well, very well indeed, why the hell risk damaging it to try and get yet more.
A totally pointless exercise.
.....and for flight detents info. its a long time since I was a BA pilot BUT I understand the issues, and certainly ready to explain the issues to those who have not yet cottoned on !
Last edited by RetiredBA/BY; 1st October 2019 at 13:02.
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 179
Likes: 25
From: uk
Class Clown Cruz has told The Training Department to reduce the simulator footprint
Klaus addressed Standards Training Captains meeting and told them they were placing too much emphasis on safety.
These are worrying statements
Klaus addressed Standards Training Captains meeting and told them they were placing too much emphasis on safety.
These are worrying statements
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 85
Likes: 0
From: United Kingdom
I sincerely hope safety always remains paramount at BA for everyone's sake.
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 954
Likes: 64
From: england
Part of the problem in BA has been the historic emphasis on top down training instead of bottom up. Only in the last few years have efforts been made to invert the training pyramid. Sadly, that comes as a cost. Personally, I would put more emphasis and money into training the guys and girls who will be flying the customers around daily than sending managers/tri/tre’s on even more courses.