BA Direct Entry Pilot.
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 132
Likes: 41
From: 370
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 132
Likes: 41
From: 370
My apologies, I missed that part. Yea, some of the rosters out there are crazy, but if those guys are making some extra dollar then who am I to judge. Not for me personally though.
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Full time contract it's 28 days leave per year..14 days to be taken in the summer season ( roughly April through start October), 14 days in the Winter. In the season it has to be taken as either a single 14 day block or two 7 day blocks...it cannot be spilt or broken down any further.
Before and/or after the leave block(s) - depending on whether it's a two week block or a pair of separated one week blocks you get buffer or "wrap" days (3 ?) where you cannot be forced to work but you may choose to do so (and there might be reasons for doing so but they are probably beyond the scope of this reply..)
Also you get two 7 day Duty Free Weeks (DFW), one week in the Summer season , one in winter, (plus effectively an optional "wrap" type day at the start of the DFW...you can choose to work in any of the days of DFW.)
6 Golden days per calendar year.
Leave/DFW entitlement is reduced proportionally for those on a part time contract.
Last edited by wiggy; 7th January 2020 at 09:24.
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Because somebody will ask - HOST is the allowances system...allows you to take money in and out of your account at down route hotels..
So if you take out lots of cash at slip hotels during the month and don't put little if any back in when you check out your take home pay will be reduced.
So if you take out lots of cash at slip hotels during the month and don't put little if any back in when you check out your take home pay will be reduced.
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
..and that is reflected in the way the "allowances" element of pay ( or more correctly the Time Away From Base - TAFB, payment) is taxed..
Each trip attracts an amount of money based on the time away from base.
By agreement with HMRC a percentage of TAFB payment is not subject to tax - the percentage is based on what HMRC think is a credible down route spend on food. The percentage is not calculated on an individual basis, it's a "blanket" figure and is based on evidence from audits (see last para).
HMRC tax the remaining percentage of TAFB as if it is income.
HMRC monitor the spend by running regular audits where they ask, well demand, that selected crew members produce receipts for their spend down route..their aim being no doubt to increase the percentage of the time away from base payment that is taxed as income.
Each trip attracts an amount of money based on the time away from base.
By agreement with HMRC a percentage of TAFB payment is not subject to tax - the percentage is based on what HMRC think is a credible down route spend on food. The percentage is not calculated on an individual basis, it's a "blanket" figure and is based on evidence from audits (see last para).
HMRC tax the remaining percentage of TAFB as if it is income.
HMRC monitor the spend by running regular audits where they ask, well demand, that selected crew members produce receipts for their spend down route..their aim being no doubt to increase the percentage of the time away from base payment that is taxed as income.
Last edited by wiggy; 8th January 2020 at 10:11.
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: London
Full time contract it's 28 days leave per year..14 days to be taken in the summer season ( roughly April through start October), 14 days in the Winter. In the season it has to be taken as either a single 14 day block or two 7 day blocks...it cannot be spilt or broken down any further.
Before and/or after the leave block(s) - depending on whether it's a two week block or a pair of separated one week blocks you get buffer or "wrap" days (3 ?) where you cannot be forced to work but you may choose to do so (and there might be reasons for doing so but they are probably beyond the scope of this reply..)
Also you get two 7 day Duty Free Weeks (DFW), one week in the Summer season , one in winter, (plus effectively an optional "wrap" type day at the start of the DFW...you can choose to work in any of the days of DFW.)
6 Golden days per calendar year.
So if I’m reading the above right
, you could get 6 months of the year where you have between 8-10 days off consecutively, if you break up your leave and DFW. Then you could use your golden days to book at least one Saturday off for each of the other 6 months? If that’s the case it seems pretty reasonable, and negates a lot of the stuff above about new joiners having little/no control over weekends etc......
Before and/or after the leave block(s) - depending on whether it's a two week block or a pair of separated one week blocks you get buffer or "wrap" days (3 ?) where you cannot be forced to work but you may choose to do so (and there might be reasons for doing so but they are probably beyond the scope of this reply..)
Also you get two 7 day Duty Free Weeks (DFW), one week in the Summer season , one in winter, (plus effectively an optional "wrap" type day at the start of the DFW...you can choose to work in any of the days of DFW.)
6 Golden days per calendar year.
So if I’m reading the above right
, you could get 6 months of the year where you have between 8-10 days off consecutively, if you break up your leave and DFW. Then you could use your golden days to book at least one Saturday off for each of the other 6 months? If that’s the case it seems pretty reasonable, and negates a lot of the stuff above about new joiners having little/no control over weekends etc......Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
That's one for the new joiners to answer.
Meanwhile I'll merely note that you can't always get leave/DFW where you want it (limited number of "slots" for each week, and it's allocated based on a points accrued system).
One gripe about Golden Days is that there is no protection from a very late finish night before one or an early AM report the day after one, but, yes you could protect a weekend if you took a pair of GDs together - which is allowable..
Meanwhile I'll merely note that you can't always get leave/DFW where you want it (limited number of "slots" for each week, and it's allocated based on a points accrued system).
One gripe about Golden Days is that there is no protection from a very late finish night before one or an early AM report the day after one, but, yes you could protect a weekend if you took a pair of GDs together - which is allowable..
Last edited by wiggy; 8th January 2020 at 07:14.
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
From: SE England
Flys4Funs - Yes, you are essentially correct. In the Summer 3 of the months can have 8, 10 and 11 days off consecutively; the winter three of them can have 9, 10 and 11. Golden days can easily be booked to achieve a weekend day off in the 6 remaining months if required.
Breakdown for clarity:
Summer - 10 day block (7 leave + 3 wrap days), 11 day block (7 leave + 4 wrap days), 8 day block (Duty Free week plus one ‘non-assignable’ day).
Winter - Same 10 and 11 day blocks, Duty Free week is now 9 days instead of 8 (agreed in the recent pay settlement).
The only caveat is that leave is bid for on a ‘points’ basis. If you take unpopular weeks (mid-November, say) these are worth about 6 points and Christmas week is worth 1 point. Your points total over a rolling 4-years is then used to decide who gets first pick of leave next time around. It’s a fair system which means everybody gets a reasonable crack at having popular time off, summer holidays for instance. What it does mean in practice is that new-joiners won’t necessarily have first choice leave straight away.
For completeness, LGW system is very similar except that all six leave and duty free blocks are 10 days long including wraps, and the golden days are called ‘trump days’ which can be taken in six pairs rather than six individual days off; therefore a whole weekend off can easily be achieved in every month of the year if desired (if not more than one during the quiet winter).
Breakdown for clarity:
Summer - 10 day block (7 leave + 3 wrap days), 11 day block (7 leave + 4 wrap days), 8 day block (Duty Free week plus one ‘non-assignable’ day).
Winter - Same 10 and 11 day blocks, Duty Free week is now 9 days instead of 8 (agreed in the recent pay settlement).
The only caveat is that leave is bid for on a ‘points’ basis. If you take unpopular weeks (mid-November, say) these are worth about 6 points and Christmas week is worth 1 point. Your points total over a rolling 4-years is then used to decide who gets first pick of leave next time around. It’s a fair system which means everybody gets a reasonable crack at having popular time off, summer holidays for instance. What it does mean in practice is that new-joiners won’t necessarily have first choice leave straight away.
For completeness, LGW system is very similar except that all six leave and duty free blocks are 10 days long including wraps, and the golden days are called ‘trump days’ which can be taken in six pairs rather than six individual days off; therefore a whole weekend off can easily be achieved in every month of the year if desired (if not more than one during the quiet winter).
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 283
Likes: 1
From: somewhere hot and sticky
Im a year in, direct onto LH. I can't complain about weekend working so far. .. just lucky I guess, I don't normally bid home on the weekends, but JSS often gives me some weekend days off (though I worry what's happening higher up the list to the pilots who can't get those days off due to global constraints. ......)
Also, as a junior pilot you can have some luck with weekends by bidding for reserve. .. as the 7 days off prior to reserve cover a weekend.
Also, as a junior pilot you can have some luck with weekends by bidding for reserve. .. as the 7 days off prior to reserve cover a weekend.
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: London
Thanks for clarifying - very interesting.
I had another question on Dupre’s reserve point - if you bid reserve, you get an additional week up front - I guess you can’t bid reserve and take a leave period in the same month - i.e. get the seven days off for reserve and another 8/11 days off?
How does the reserve work, you get allocated a time slot and are on two hours notice for that period. Is this for the entire rest of the month (7 days a week) after your first week off?
I had another question on Dupre’s reserve point - if you bid reserve, you get an additional week up front - I guess you can’t bid reserve and take a leave period in the same month - i.e. get the seven days off for reserve and another 8/11 days off?
How does the reserve work, you get allocated a time slot and are on two hours notice for that period. Is this for the entire rest of the month (7 days a week) after your first week off?
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Thanks for clarifying - very interesting.
I had another question on Dupre’s reserve point - if you bid reserve, you get an additional week up front - I guess you can’t bid reserve and take a leave period in the same month - i.e. get the seven days off for reserve and another 8/11 days off?
How does the reserve work, you get allocated a time slot and are on two hours notice for that period. Is this for the entire rest of the month (7 days a week) after your first week off?
I had another question on Dupre’s reserve point - if you bid reserve, you get an additional week up front - I guess you can’t bid reserve and take a leave period in the same month - i.e. get the seven days off for reserve and another 8/11 days off?
How does the reserve work, you get allocated a time slot and are on two hours notice for that period. Is this for the entire rest of the month (7 days a week) after your first week off?
How it works...(Long haul) you have to be on the end of the phone for three hours every evening to possibly be assigned a duty the next day. That duty might be a trip or it might be a home standby where you are on 2 hours notice (timed from phone call to crew car park at LHR).
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 283
Likes: 1
From: somewhere hot and sticky
Thanks for clarifying - very interesting.
I had another question on Dupre’s reserve point - if you bid reserve, you get an additional week up front - I guess you can’t bid reserve and take a leave period in the same month - i.e. get the seven days off for reserve and another 8/11 days off?
How does the reserve work, you get allocated a time slot and are on two hours notice for that period. Is this for the entire rest of the month (7 days a week) after your first week off?
I had another question on Dupre’s reserve point - if you bid reserve, you get an additional week up front - I guess you can’t bid reserve and take a leave period in the same month - i.e. get the seven days off for reserve and another 8/11 days off?
How does the reserve work, you get allocated a time slot and are on two hours notice for that period. Is this for the entire rest of the month (7 days a week) after your first week off?
1. Yes you can bid for reserve and leave in the same month. They can abut each other too, though it must be leave followed by reserve not the other way around (as you can't put leave on your reserve available days). Doing so comes with a caveat as well - the time zone acclimatisation rules are a bit tighter before reserve so it is not a great option for a holiday to Australia. But if you are staying in Europe it's a good way of getting more time off.
2. Reserve works line this: they can call you up to 8pm for the next day's duty. Can be a flight, a standby or day off. If you are given a standby duty it is either home standby (2hr callout) or airport standby. There are 21 consecutive days of this in your reserve period.
hope that makes some sense!
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
Feedback on recent BA A320 DEP selection ?
Good morning,
Any feedback available on the recent selection process?
Regarding the phase 1, is it still only 3 tests?
- numerical
- verbal
- flight capacity test.
In the past they used to have 2 other tests :
- Flight Director
- Shape test.
Thanks a lot for your answers.
Any feedback available on the recent selection process?
Regarding the phase 1, is it still only 3 tests?
- numerical
- verbal
- flight capacity test.
In the past they used to have 2 other tests :
- Flight Director
- Shape test.
Thanks a lot for your answers.
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
There’s a danger we are going to confuse people here, possibly because a 28 day reserve block can (and usually does) straddle two calendar bidding months. Just rowing it all back a bit to a CliffsNotes version of the relevant bidline rule (JSS version).
A bid for a reserve block will not be accepted if there is any overlap between Leave/DFW days off and any of the 21 available days of the 28 day reserve block..so no you can’t reduce a block down to 14 available days by having a leave in the last week. If you bid for such it will fail.
You can do what want in the Fixed Days off, but as Dupre rightly says you need to acclimatised on the start of the available days.
You can however have up to have to 14 credited hours of preassigned duties embedded in the available days, such as combinations of Golden Days, SEP, Sims....more than 14 hours and a bid for reserve will fail.
A bid for a reserve block will not be accepted if there is any overlap between Leave/DFW days off and any of the 21 available days of the 28 day reserve block..so no you can’t reduce a block down to 14 available days by having a leave in the last week. If you bid for such it will fail.
You can do what want in the Fixed Days off, but as Dupre rightly says you need to acclimatised on the start of the available days.
You can however have up to have to 14 credited hours of preassigned duties embedded in the available days, such as combinations of Golden Days, SEP, Sims....more than 14 hours and a bid for reserve will fail.