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British Airways vs. BASSA (current Airline Staff Only)

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Old 5th Aug 2010, 19:07
  #1721 (permalink)  
 
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I'm sorry that things haven't worked out for you.

The reality is that MF has a higher selection criteria than for temp crew. There is a serious effort at BA to get the right people in from day one. People that can do a serious days work and not need a dozen MBTs afterwards. Sadly some temp crew have displayed a "what's in it for me" attitude during MF selection - a case of BASSAmentalist contamination perhaps?

Edited to add that no temps or people in the holding pool have joined MF without an interview for MF ie. in the last couple of weeks.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 19:21
  #1722 (permalink)  
 
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Most all of the temps I have come across have displayed a great positive attitude, and I agree have shown "whats in it for me" , but Hot Wings what they have all been refering to is a opportunity in the new BA mixed fleet.

Im sadened for all of those who have helped and been exposed to difficult working conditions, regarding rosters, standby and interigation from some crew, to be kicked by the company and told your not good enough to do the job you have been doing for 6 months. They are not Bassa members, but have been treated, now worst than had they have been so and gone on strike.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 19:27
  #1723 (permalink)  
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What i just dont understand is that temps who were in the hold pool and who chose not to help BA back in Feb, received a phone call asking them to book an interview date for MF. Whereby , us current temps who DID come back in Feb to help, had to apply like every other main current crew, only now to be told, not good enough!

So maybe we are being treated like all other main crew and that the MF criteria is so high that its very diffucult to achieve! How come others, who have been out of BA for almost 2 years , bypass the application stage, go straight to interview and now get a position!

To me, I think something is seriously wrong in the recruitment process, maybe they did things the wrong way around!!
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 19:28
  #1724 (permalink)  
 
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As I have already said the selection criteria is higher for MF. This is because these are permanent positions with a new ethos for BA. It is a harsh world out there!
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 19:47
  #1725 (permalink)  
 
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ptc,
I think that I see the point that you're trying to make. Things aren't perfect in what is a new process and it seems that there may be some anomalies. What I do know is that people in the hold pool had already passed selection therefore didn't need to apply again. As you are now serving BA main crew you are being treated as a new applicant for the new fleet on a new contract.

In reality you came to do a temporary job for which you are getting paid. The company does not owe you a living and this is the lesson of MF - crew who want to get stuck in and do a good job, even if it means picking up rubbish or lowering blinds.

ptc - have a good critical think about your application/interview and about what you might do or say differently should you apply again. For what it's worth, there are many pilots here who took 2 or 3 attempts to get in.

Last edited by Hot Wings; 5th Aug 2010 at 19:59.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 20:06
  #1726 (permalink)  
 
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UNITE slap BASSA down

FROM MY SOURCE AT UNITE HQ, yet another gaff from BASSA doh



This Notice is given in accordance with the requirements imposed upon the Union by the
Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992. Only the Executive Council
can authorise industrial action and it can only do so after a secret postal ballot.
On 2 August 2010 a posting was published on the BASSA website entitled ‘Closing Window
Blinds at the End of Your Flight’. The posting asked cabin crew not to agree to close the
window blinds at the end of each flight. This posting could be taken as a call to take
industrial action. Cabin crew should ignore this posting and should close the window blinds
at the end of each flight as instructed and work normally.
The Executive Council has not authorised any industrial action by Unite the Union members
employed by the above company and this Notice relates to all and any calls, or threats of,
such action

Last edited by Pornpants1; 5th Aug 2010 at 20:41.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 20:42
  #1727 (permalink)  
 
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How about hot towels now.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 20:44
  #1728 (permalink)  
 
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Isn't BASSA supposed to protect it's members from dismissal rather than put them in the firing line?
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 20:52
  #1729 (permalink)  
 
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Quote: "The reality is that MF has a higher selection criteria than for temp crew. There is a serious effort at BA to get the right people in from day one. People that can do a serious days work and not need a dozen MBTs afterwards."

Errrr, now I've been one of the most soundly anti BASSA posters from within cabin crew, but I must admit to being a bit put out by this posting.

Longhaul flying is extremely tiring, and while I abhor all the whinging about reduced crew complememnts, and putting yourself out to maybe work closer to Scheme whenever there is disruption, I don't think our MBTs, or indeed our shorthaul TOBs are overly excessive.

If, sir/madame, you are a pilot, to be fair, you should know better, since although you may work more taxing itineraries, you are compensated by having more time off than us. That was the deal you union negociated for you, and good for them, at least they CAN negociate.

If you are not a pilot (or cabin crew) then I respectfully suggest you don't know what you are talking about.

I can totally understand BA's need for New Fleet, and those that apply will probably happily accept less time off than us, but then they almost certainly will only do it for 5 years or so, so will be able to cope.

Nobody is more critical of the BASSAmentalist attitude than me, but lets not get carried away with the idea that the current job of cabin crew is a breeze, 'cos if you are full time, turn up whatever your roster and go the extra mile to make sure we have loyal customers, it certainly is not.

You especially hit a raw nerve tonight, as I have just completed a 12 hour day, last day of seven staight days on, with one day off tomorrow before being back at work again on Saturday,
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 20:56
  #1730 (permalink)  
 
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Latest from BASSA

Can someone please post the latest from Ho Chi Holley, it beggars belief, even the BASSAmentalists on the other forum are having doubts, what is happening to their so called leadership. Time for a change?
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:09
  #1731 (permalink)  
 
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Re the window blinds, the other day I posted:

I get the impression that BASSA may have overstepped the mark with this one, I expect the issue may 'go away' shortly.
They (BASSA leadership) are going to get themselves in very hot water soon, if only with UNITE!

Surely, as with many cults, there will be a dramatic ending soon?

(Cult: noun
a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object
• a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister
• a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing : a cult of personality surrounding the leaders.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:13
  #1732 (permalink)  
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This one? It's being called drivel on the BASSA forum so must be a good one. Anyone think of any other suitable ABBA songs?

I believe it's the first time that CSDs pushing trolleys has been compared to Vietnam too!

So where are we? What’s happening, What is going on, what’s going to happen next, why is there no ballot yet?
It would be too easy to believe that all our troubles will be over when our current CEO leaves us towards the end of this year, and that somehow peace, prosperity and goodwill will return to our airline shortly thereafter.
Though it’s comforting to think this, it’s also unlikely to actually happen quite in this way.
Of course, it would be easy and populist to lay all of the blame at Mr Walsh’s door, but in reality this is not correct; he must enjoy considerable support from both Chairman, Martin Broughton and indeed the majority of the current board. If he didn’t, he would not have been able to wage such a long and ill-judged war, effectively against his own front line customer service staff, in a way that no other modern day CEO has even contemplated, yet alone undertaken.
Is a settlement or solution likely or imminent? The short answer is NO.
Strange though it may seem, our current “leadership” team don’t actually want one, at least not yet or indeed one that’s fair.
Why? Because they see this as their “Waterloo”, their opportunity to defeat the largest union within British Airways once and for all, in what they hope will be one last battle, one glorious victory; bringing about the humiliation, defeat and total surrender of their perceived nemesis, BASSA and Unite.
Clearly, this approach makes a difficult situation even harder to resolve. There is of course no need for this - nor ever has been.* A solution, sooner or later, needs to be found, and it needs to fair.* Crew also need to feel that it’s fair - and currently it’s obvious that they do not.* If a solution isn’t found, then this conflict will simply carry on and on. We will not rest until we reach agreement, by whatever means necessary.
All pretence of running an airline seems to have been abandoned.* The “Board” instead appear resolutely determined to squander billions of passenger revenue and continue to damage our once proud reputation even further;* all to try and destroy a union. This would all seem strangely unnecessary, as to all intents and purposes, they already have.
Our union has not had a single meeting with British Airways since 2009, every forum, from simple product, to agreements or hotels, has been shut down. Our ability to be able to represent you or influence anything at any level has gone, probably for good. Our offices have been closed down for months. Only this week, product changes once trialed with the union, is now carried out by a group of* “selected CSDs”
Yet strangely, this is not enough for our leadership, they still want more; they still crave that glorious public victory, that elusive media headline that would spell total defeat for our union and the cementing in the public’s mind of Mr Walsh’s union-busting reputation, no doubt encapsulated by a crowing headline in the Daily Mail “union goes on strike, BA flies 100%”
In truth, with the countless millions that have already been spent to achieve this, and an almost commercially suicidal policy of giving our passengers and revenue to our competitors, it would be somewhat strange if he couldn’t achieve exactly what he wants.* Volunteers are everywhere you look, from* “Team America” and “Team Newcastle”, holed up in an overflowing Arora, to “secret” Miami crew bases.
Everything is in place to achieve this inglorious “Waterloo” and then it’s off on a donkey into the Spanish sunset with Iberia.
Just one cloud remains on this picture postcard scene.* Crew - we are still here; he hasn’t defeated us, we haven’t gone anywhere and we’re not going to anytime soon and the original problems have not been solved. Not everybody has bought into his holiday brochure imagery, or even wants to visit the promised land of* “book now but pay later” mixed fleet. As crew we simply don’t trust their empty words and promises.* We want fairness, security and guarantees, or we’re just not going to book our futures with him. Approaching 7000 people will also want their staff travel back, those that have been sacked need justice. So this dispute will carry on and on, into a different new phase and in the end, justice will prevail, and this planned glorious exit will elude him.
Time is now on our side, it takes as long as it takes; if this “Board” continue to want to wage war instead of finding a peace, they will sooner or later get the fight they so crave - but not at a time of their choosing.
If he continues to suppress and bully people instead of taking them with him by reaching a fair solution, instead of “Waterloo”, Mr Walsh may well end up with his very own Vietnam.
The Vietnam War* [vi-et-nam war]
A Cold War conflict that occurred in Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia from November 1, 1955 to April 30, 1975 when Saigon finally fell.* History records this as an ideological struggle fought between the North and South parts of Vietnam. World opinion largely recognised the government of the south as being corrupt and unpopular with many of its own citizens but it was still heavily supported by the United States and other anti-communist nations.
The Viet Cong, a lightly armed but determined group, led North Vietnamese resistance.* Fighting a largely guerrilla war against the more powerful South Vietnamese Army. The South engaged in a more conventional war, relying heavily on massive financial support from the United States. The North, though smaller in number and with far less resources, relied heavily on large popular support amongst ordinary Vietnamese.
The United States entered the war largely for political reasons, to prevent - what elements of Washington politics at the time believed - was a Communist-backed takeover of Vietnam, which must be contained. U.S. involvement began in the early 1960s, and ended with the capture of Saigon by the North Vietnamese in April 1975 marking the end of the Vietnam War.
The US media became increasingly critical over what was widely believed to be an unnecessary war. The number of casualties and the huge financial costs led to dwindling public support within the United States. Civil disobedience and protest became common across the country. This in turn resulted in a huge authoritarian crack down by the Nixon Government against many of its own citizens. Those that disagreed with its policies were often jailed, harassed, smeared or suppressed. This heavy handed response in turn, spawned a growing protest movement, leading to wide sections of society openly questioning both their Government’s motives and tactics.
Ultimately, this led to the downfall and public disgrace of then President Richard Nixon, after his involvement in the now infamous “dirty tricks” of Watergate were made public.
North and South Vietnam were eventually reunified.
The war exacted a huge human cost in terms of casualties on all sides and remains a divisive subject amongst Americans to this day
Source- text reproduced both from both Wikipedia [Vietnam war] and “a historical reference of Vietnam” from future historical records archiving services- recordings* for future generations
My my, at Waterloo, Napoleon did surrender
Oh yeah, and I have met my destiny in quite a similar way
The history book on the shelf
Is always repeating itself
Waterloo - I was defeated, you won the war
Waterloo - promise to love you forever more
Waterloo - couldn’t escape if I wanted to
Waterloo - knowing my fate is to be with you
Waterloo - finally facing my waterloo.
Abba lyrics to Eurovision winning song 1974
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:15
  #1733 (permalink)  
 
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Beagle9,

Sorry to have hit a raw nerve. I do not see where I have stated that the job is a breeze. Are you refering to some one else's posting?

The first crew to join MF are there to set the high standard wanted for the new fleet. Think of them as a cadre. As numbers increase then perhaps the criteria for new crew will be lowered but the standard will have been set from day 1.

My comment about MBTs refers to some applicants who have failed to understand the "mixed" bit about mixed fleet.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:23
  #1734 (permalink)  
 
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It would be too easy to believe that all our troubles will be over when our current CEO leaves us towards the end of this year, and that somehow peace, prosperity and goodwill will return to our airline shortly thereafter.
Though it’s comforting to think this, it’s also unlikely to actually happen quite in this way.
Of course, it would be easy and populist to lay all of the blame at Mr Walsh’s door, but in reality this is not correct; he must enjoy considerable support from both Chairman, Martin Broughton and indeed the majority of the current board. If he didn’t, he would not have been able to wage such a long and ill-judged war, effectively against his own front line customer service staff, in a way that no other modern day CEO has even contemplated, yet alone undertaken.
Only took BASSA 9+ months to acknowledge this!

I thought everything was going to be OK when that nice man Keith Williams who did the pensions deal was taking over?

Also, I thought it was BASSA that decided to withdraw from the various fora, save for Health & Safety?
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:25
  #1735 (permalink)  
 
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Hot wings,

I think your comments are way off the mark, the point that ptc was making is
all temps are currently working as crew on mixed fleet terms and conditions, long and short haul, with main crew both strikers and non strikers and have been doing so with very poor rostering since, in many cases Feb 10.

Not one of the temps I have spoken to have had any problem in working on the contract they signed up for, the issue raised here is the inconsistant recruitment filtering being used. All the temps, both working at BA and those waiting to return along with holding pool crew have ALL DONE THE SAME SELECTION PROCESS, but those employed since Feb have not been allowed to complete to MF selection day the externals and hold poolers have done.

Your comment of some pilots applied 2 or 3 times is probably true, as im sure some of the cabin crew have done so too. But for which ever role you are trying and however many times you try, you dont expect to be disadvantaged after coming back to the company when they first called for help, ie in Feb before the strikes.

I work for BA and have always thought things were quite transparent, lets hope this is a over sight and we are not closing the door to a bunch of positive forward thinking crew ...
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:38
  #1736 (permalink)  
 
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What a dreadful email from DH.

I can't understand how any Bassa member can take this union seriously when they operate on such a puerile level.

This is what BA have tried to negotiate with - no wonder Bassa have been sidelined.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 21:55
  #1737 (permalink)  
 
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These are tough times for cabin crew and there has been a lot of vindictive pain inflicted by BA on loyal union members. From here on in, we make no apology that we do not intend to take that pain lying down. Whatever it takes will have to be done.
If a solution isn’t found, then this conflict will simply carry on and on. We will not rest until we reach agreement, by whatever means necessary.
A couple of times, Duncan has referred to doing "whatever it takes" and using "whatever means necessary" to end this.

Unite only have three options:

A) Do nothing
B) Settle
C) Call another ballot (the third, no less) for lawful industrial action

Duncan seems to be implying that BASSA has something else up its sleeve and I expect BA's lawyers will be all over this, if they aren't already.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 22:04
  #1738 (permalink)  
 
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LD:
I expect BA's lawyers will be all over this, if they aren't already.
I expect this is why the Unite hasty instruction/over-rule was issued so quickly.
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Old 5th Aug 2010, 22:26
  #1739 (permalink)  
 
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BASSA has been mortally wounded and knows so. It has little else to do except spin its delusions to die hards and any possible audience.

This may not be the end....but IT IS the beginning of the end.
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Old 6th Aug 2010, 00:26
  #1740 (permalink)  
 
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Mid-Fleet crew seen as 'cadres'? Are you kidding me? Have you been brain-washed or what? Who sold you that smelly fish?
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