British Airways - CC Industrial Relations & Negotiations
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I am sick to death of people saying we are not market rate. We are not if you compare us to VS, Easy jet etc. If you compare us to other EU carriers such as IB,LH,AF,KLM we are very competitive.
You are paid significantly more, across the board, than KLM and AF to my certain knowledge. And csd's are paid massively more than any other crew in the industry.
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Blu riband, totally untrue. 
Sharing a crew hotel in Africa and with this thread in mind, I recently compared renumerations and conditions with a BA CSD.
She earned slightly more than I do, and I work slightly less than she did.
Came out at about the same.
Only difference was that the BA system appeared VASTLY more complicated than ours.
Unlike BA, we have a fixed monthly salary, do 24 hour stops at most of our worldwide destinations and the only money on top of our salary is the daily allowance which covers food down route and varies according to the expensiveness of the station where we slip.
Sharing a crew hotel in Africa and with this thread in mind, I recently compared renumerations and conditions with a BA CSD.
She earned slightly more than I do, and I work slightly less than she did.
Came out at about the same.
Only difference was that the BA system appeared VASTLY more complicated than ours.
Unlike BA, we have a fixed monthly salary, do 24 hour stops at most of our worldwide destinations and the only money on top of our salary is the daily allowance which covers food down route and varies according to the expensiveness of the station where we slip.
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My heart really bleeds for you. The point is that BA C/C are paid what they're paid. Whether it's more/the same/slight less than other major airlines I don't see being the critical point here. If you boil the job down to what it is BA C/C are overpaid. It's about time an adjustment was made and I hope, as a BA stakeholder, that BA management throw full force behind this and FORCE a change. It's been too long.
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Unlike BA, we have a fixed monthly salary, do 24 hour stops at most of our worldwide destinations and the only money on top of our salary is the daily allowance which covers food down route and varies according to the expensiveness of the station where we slip.
Still can't see the writing on the wall BASSA?
Junior trash
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Sharing a crew hotel in Africa and with this thread in mind, I recently compared renumerations and conditions with a BA CSD.
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Came out at about the same.
Only difference was that the BA system appeared VASTLY more complicated than ours.
Only difference was that the BA system appeared VASTLY more complicated than ours.
Remove the bureaucracy, the inefficiency and the working to rule and you can afford to pay the majority of crew what they currently take home per month - and get your savings.
Join Date: Oct 2003
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Good luck to all you BA staff,having worked for a low cost airline for 5 years I really hope you guys get a good result in your struggle.Don't forget that the people who destroyed the world economy are low life vermin with massive wealth in hidden places.BA is a great company which I will always fly with.I really hope you win this important battle.
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She earned slightly more than I do, and I work slightly less than she did.
Came out at about the same.
Came out at about the same.
Don't forget that the people who destroyed the world economy are low life vermin with massive wealth in hidden places.
There you go - back on topic...
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Don't forget that the people who destroyed the world economy are low life vermin with massive wealth in hidden places.
Surely the best result for BA staff is one in which they keep their jobs?
Join Date: Jul 2005
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If the staff get the "result" you hope for then ironically flying BA may not be an option for much longer. Not in their current incarnation, anyway.
BASSA has never really been a good communicator and, this time around, it is essential that they fully disseminate information to their members to allow their membership to make a judged, balanced and informed decision.
Now is not the time for the protect the top 10% rhetoric. Other departments have levelled the payment slope, i.e. engineering, why not the CC? Removal of the 'cherry trips' allowance structure will be beneficial to all crew as the 'cheery picking' the big allowance trips won't happen any more.
A decision needs to be made soon as I think WW won't have a problem with his imposition plans.
Come on BASSA, support ALL your paying members for once.
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Good luck to all you BA staff,having worked for a low cost airline for 5 years I really hope you guys get a good result in your struggle.Don't forget that the people who destroyed the world economy are low life vermin with massive wealth in hidden places.BA is a great company which I will always fly with.I really hope you win this important battle.
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A friend of mine is new contract crew. They have absolutely no idea how the BA proposals will effect the bottom right hand corner of their payslip - because it has not been communicated to him.
All that is being banded about is the headline grabbing stuff.
BASSA tell the rank and file what they need to know to make an informed decision. Not how much a longhaul CSD's life is about to change.
Interestingly - what is the breakdown of the BASSA reps?
Are they predominantly old contract or new? Longhaul or Shorthaul ?
All that is being banded about is the headline grabbing stuff.
BASSA tell the rank and file what they need to know to make an informed decision. Not how much a longhaul CSD's life is about to change.
Interestingly - what is the breakdown of the BASSA reps?
Are they predominantly old contract or new? Longhaul or Shorthaul ?
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Interestingly - what is the breakdown of the BASSA reps?
Are they predominantly old contract or new? Longhaul or Shorthaul ?
Are they predominantly old contract or new? Longhaul or Shorthaul ?
Sometimes the onus is on the crew member to find out any info. needed.
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Dear 'CFCly'
I perfectly understand what you are alluding to however, as most things with BASSA are, that is not the whole picture.
BASSA claim they started negotiating in February. If they did so, as they claim, what were they negotiating over if BA had not given them sight of their objectives?
Add to that that BASSA claimed a BA/BASSA news blackout to enable the negotiations to continue unabated. What then was being negotiated and under what proposals if BA only gave the proposals 24 hrs before the deadline?
Why did BASSA claim that their primary negotiation principal had to be redundancy protection in the preceding 4 weeks to the 30th deadline when more applications for VR existed then CR was required? Also, why did BASSA refuse to discuss anything apart from the CR threat when VR would cover it with a better deal for those wishing to take VR (3750 ish according to BASSA)? BASSA claimed to have sight of the 'new fleet', 'new contract' requirements in those 4 weeks but refused to discuss them due to the reasons given above.
The 'proposal' that BA gave BASSA on the day prior to the 30th deadline was what BA proposed to implement if failure to reach an agreement occurred.
Time will now tell. Unfortunately I think the ACAS call is purely for BA to cross the T's and dot the I's prior to legal representation.
Hopefully I am wrong.
being given the final BA proposals 24 hrs before the 30th June deadline does not make negotiation
BASSA claim they started negotiating in February. If they did so, as they claim, what were they negotiating over if BA had not given them sight of their objectives?
Add to that that BASSA claimed a BA/BASSA news blackout to enable the negotiations to continue unabated. What then was being negotiated and under what proposals if BA only gave the proposals 24 hrs before the deadline?
Why did BASSA claim that their primary negotiation principal had to be redundancy protection in the preceding 4 weeks to the 30th deadline when more applications for VR existed then CR was required? Also, why did BASSA refuse to discuss anything apart from the CR threat when VR would cover it with a better deal for those wishing to take VR (3750 ish according to BASSA)? BASSA claimed to have sight of the 'new fleet', 'new contract' requirements in those 4 weeks but refused to discuss them due to the reasons given above.
The 'proposal' that BA gave BASSA on the day prior to the 30th deadline was what BA proposed to implement if failure to reach an agreement occurred.
Time will now tell. Unfortunately I think the ACAS call is purely for BA to cross the T's and dot the I's prior to legal representation.
Hopefully I am wrong.
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The AGM will be the same old dull affair it always is. You'll get a few individual shareholders banging a drum about something but the major institutional investors won't be there and they are the ones BA listen to. There are a lot of BA employees clinging to rumours that the City doesn't like Walsh and want him out. Thats nothing but wishful thinking. The City want to see him get a grip on BAs costs and restive unions and there'll be no putsch from them.
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The AGM will be the same old dull affair it always is. You'll get a few individual shareholders banging a drum about something but the major institutional investors won't be there and they are the ones BA listen to. There are a lot of BA employees clinging to rumours that the City doesn't like Walsh and want him out. Thats nothing but wishful thinking. The City want to see him get a grip on BAs costs and restive unions and there'll be no putsch from them.
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BA AGM
20% of BA's shares are owned by just four shareholders. Iberia is one (9%), and the other three are financial institutions (roughly 7% each) who hold the shares as nominees for their clients (pensions, mutual funds etc). There's no evidence that the big corporate governance advisors are advising any kind of anti-WW stance at the AGM. It's more likely that WW is under pressure from large shareholders to find efficiency gains at BA in return for additional investment to allow him to refresh/grow the fleet ready for the upturn. My money is still on WW wanting to launch a Rights issue, and being under pressure to improve BA's operational gearing (ie efficiency) as a condition of getting the level of uptake required.
What may make the AGM "interesting", and it's a tactic being used increasingly, is for a single issue pressure group to buy a small number of shares, attend the AGM, and get media air time for their issue by asking questions, briefing the media on their position etc. It's great "gesture" politics, but has little short-term impact. I'm not decrying it. I've advised using it myself with certain companies. It does start a debate and can lead to long-term change. Its value, though, is in generating a debate to initiate change from the status quo. It has little value in stopping a company doing what it wants to do short term. If employee reps use this tactic at BA, I don't see it stopping WW forcing through change. Sure, it will get short term media coverage, but it won't hold up any changes BA want to make.
What may make the AGM "interesting", and it's a tactic being used increasingly, is for a single issue pressure group to buy a small number of shares, attend the AGM, and get media air time for their issue by asking questions, briefing the media on their position etc. It's great "gesture" politics, but has little short-term impact. I'm not decrying it. I've advised using it myself with certain companies. It does start a debate and can lead to long-term change. Its value, though, is in generating a debate to initiate change from the status quo. It has little value in stopping a company doing what it wants to do short term. If employee reps use this tactic at BA, I don't see it stopping WW forcing through change. Sure, it will get short term media coverage, but it won't hold up any changes BA want to make.