Originally Posted by turbantime
(Post 11070143)
Foxxster - It’s the Medicare app on your phone. You can save the digital certificate offline within the app. The digital certificate also has holographic features which makes it extremely difficult to forge.
No different to the NSW digital driver’s licence. please tell me how you propose to enforce this. And the answer is NOT just the same as drivers licences. That’s a hint for you. |
Originally Posted by Foxxster
(Post 11070130)
bully for you,
is that mandatory. It would have to be.. or to carry a physical form of proof of vaccine. and how are you going to police it without stopping everyone on the street. Papers please…..logistically impossible. The UK, while it doesn't have a vaccine passport per se and BoJo is pretty reluctant to implement that type of policy is moving along with his 'irreversible' path out of the pandemic. They've actually set out a target for the threshold the government is willing to accept in the amount of vaccinations that will get the UK out of pandemic control and on with the rest of the world - all while 18,000 cases a day but with minimal hospitalisations. Because treatments are a whole lot better, vaccinations aside. But alas, Australians know how to do it better. A clear concise message of getting vaccinated but you're still subjected to lockdowns and travel restrictions and can't travel abroad to safe countries and upon returning (if you can get a seat because numbers are still capped) you're still required to quarantine at your expense. A message of changing who is eligible to get the vaccine but change the goal posts every five minutes. A message of you can wait, we've got time, but we want you to get vaccinated as soon as you're eligible (as long as you meet the recently changed eligibility criteria). Most of the developed world have ordered at least 4 or 5 different types of vaccine per country back in July. Australia ordered 2 types in November - but don't forget, according to SloMo, we're ahead of the queue. But the main message that all politicians in Australia would have you believe is that 'there is nowhere else I'd rather be during a pandemic but Australia!'. Really? The 12 or so million people currently in lockdown at the moment might take on a different view to that. You know you've screwed up as a Liberal PM when even Sky News journos are openly bagging and questioning your policies and lack of direction. Maybe he should go back to marketing school. But we've had little cases! Some here would bellow, to profess a type of arrogant superiority over all others. That was last year's battle. Casualties and the associated fallout was minimal which was terrific and highly commendable. That battle was won, but as the war continues, new fronts with slightly different enemies are approaching from all sides and like any adversary looks for chinks in the armor. This year's battle is different, but we have a highly effective weapon to our advantage, but our generals didn't order enough ammunition. Our generals prefer to hide under the doona instead. Fuel-Off :ok: |
Originally Posted by Fuel-Off
(Post 11070149)
Europe does it with passport on the phone mostly when checking in on flights, on intercity trains, international ferries and crossing land borders. Some venues with large gatherings have a set up with scanners at the ready at the entrance. Just a smartphone app, produces a QR code so it can be verified and you're on your way The US have a pretty flimsy system of just producing a card from the CDC, but several states (both red and blue) have removed ALL pandemic related policies and are effectively back to normal. Hence why we are seeing a post pandemic boom in travel. Might have something to do with the fact almost 70% have had one dose. US-EU travel this northern summer will be unrestricted, no quarantine either side. I mean, if the Americans can do it...
The UK, while it doesn't have a vaccine passport per se and BoJo is pretty reluctant to implement that type of policy is moving along with his 'irreversible' path out of the pandemic. They've actually set out a target for the threshold the government is willing to accept in the amount of vaccinations that will get the UK out of pandemic control and on with the rest of the world - all while 18,000 cases a day but with minimal hospitalisations. Because treatments are a whole lot better, vaccinations aside. But alas, Australians know how to do it better. A clear concise message of getting vaccinated but you're still subjected to lockdowns and travel restrictions and can't travel abroad to safe countries and upon returning (if you can get a seat because numbers are still capped) you're still required to quarantine at your expense. A message of changing who is eligible to get the vaccine but change the goal posts every five minutes. A message of you can wait, we've got time, but we want you to get vaccinated as soon as you're eligible (as long as you meet the recently changed eligibility criteria). Most of the developed world have ordered at least 4 or 5 different types of vaccine per country back in July. Australia ordered 2 types in November - but don't forget, according to SloMo, we're ahead of the queue. But the main message that all politicians in Australia would have you believe is that 'there is nowhere else I'd rather be during a pandemic but Australia!'. Really? The 12 or so million people currently in lockdown at the moment might take on a different view to that. You know you've screwed up as a Liberal PM when even Sky News journos are openly bagging and questioning your policies and lack of direction. Maybe he should go back to marketing school. But we've had little cases! Some here would bellow, to profess a type of arrogant superiority over all others. That was last year's battle. Casualties and the associated fallout was minimal which was terrific and highly commendable, but as the war continues, new fronts with slightly different enemies are approaching from all sides and like any adversary looks for chinks in the armor. This year's battle is different, but we have a highly effective weapon to our advantage, but our generals didn't order enough ammunition. Our generals prefer to hide under the doona instead. Fuel-Off :ok: WE ARE TALKING ABOUT NOW IN AUSTRALIA WITH EXTREMELY LOW,VACCINATION RATES. now how are you going to police it..on the street. NOT getting on a plane or entering an entertainment venue. |
Originally Posted by Foxxster
(Post 11070130)
bully for you,
is that mandatory. It would have to be.. or to carry a physical form of proof of vaccine. and how are you going to police it without stopping everyone on the street. Papers please…..logistically impossible. |
Watch Scomo tonight , his smile will be just a bit bigger . Australians have moved a few more inches to mass vaccinations today .
|
Originally Posted by Chronic Snoozer
(Post 11070153)
Do your own legwork instead of sprouting off on here.
the original post being if you are vaccinated then you do not have to obey lockdowns. The numbers of police required to adequately enforce and check that people moving about are fully vaccinated would require doubling the police force and stopping EVERYONE on the street. we don’t have 50%, 60% + vaccinated here so our population is still very vulnerable.. any measures taken in countries where they do have those vaccinated rates therefore are irrelevant. there are some real …… on here. Grow a brain |
Originally Posted by Fuel-Off
(Post 11070149)
Europe does it with passport on the phone mostly when checking in on flights, on intercity trains, international ferries and crossing land borders. Some venues with large gatherings have a set up with scanners at the ready at the entrance. Just a smartphone app, produces a QR code so it can be verified and you're on your way The US have a pretty flimsy system of just producing a card from the CDC, but several states (both red and blue) have removed ALL pandemic related policies and are effectively back to normal. Hence why we are seeing a post pandemic boom in travel. Might have something to do with the fact almost 70% have had one dose. US-EU travel this northern summer will be unrestricted, no quarantine either side. I mean, if the Americans can do it...
The UK, while it doesn't have a vaccine passport per se and BoJo is pretty reluctant to implement that type of policy is moving along with his 'irreversible' path out of the pandemic. They've actually set out a target for the threshold the government is willing to accept in the amount of vaccinations that will get the UK out of pandemic control and on with the rest of the world - all while 18,000 cases a day but with minimal hospitalisations. Because treatments are a whole lot better, vaccinations aside. But alas, Australians know how to do it better. A clear concise message of getting vaccinated but you're still subjected to lockdowns and travel restrictions and can't travel abroad to safe countries and upon returning (if you can get a seat because numbers are still capped) you're still required to quarantine at your expense. A message of changing who is eligible to get the vaccine but change the goal posts every five minutes. A message of you can wait, we've got time, but we want you to get vaccinated as soon as you're eligible (as long as you meet the recently changed eligibility criteria). Most of the developed world have ordered at least 4 or 5 different types of vaccine per country back in July. Australia ordered 2 types in November - but don't forget, according to SloMo, we're ahead of the queue. But the main message that all politicians in Australia would have you believe is that 'there is nowhere else I'd rather be during a pandemic but Australia!'. Really? The 12 or so million people currently in lockdown at the moment might take on a different view to that. You know you've screwed up as a Liberal PM when even Sky News journos are openly bagging and questioning your policies and lack of direction. Maybe he should go back to marketing school. But we've had little cases! Some here would bellow, to profess a type of arrogant superiority over all others. That was last year's battle. Casualties and the associated fallout was minimal which was terrific and highly commendable. That battle was won, but as the war continues, new fronts with slightly different enemies are approaching from all sides and like any adversary looks for chinks in the armor. This year's battle is different, but we have a highly effective weapon to our advantage, but our generals didn't order enough ammunition. Our generals prefer to hide under the doona instead. Fuel-Off :ok: Israel (highest % vaccination rate in the world) has re-imposed restrictions with face masks and quarantining people who have the delta variant. |
Originally Posted by John Eacott
(Post 11070003)
There's a significant difference in vaccinations given and being fully vaccinated: being at the end of the supply chain and initially limited to mainly AZ jabs with a 12 week gap between the two, we stood little chance of matching countries who (understandably) kept the production for themselves. I'm among a significant number who will be getting their 12 week booster this weekend, and I suspect that the fully vaccinated figures will then boost noticeably.
Apathy and outright agitation against vaccination doesn't help: I can't help but remember everyone (yes, everyone) getting vaccinated against polio, the scourge which has virtually disappeared. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....094b1ff817.jpg https://www.health.gov.au/initiative...accine-rollout Re. NZ we went for Pfizer but also had the ability to source AZ; I believe we gave out AZ to Fiji, and NZ has also vaccinated the Cook Islands with Pfizer so that tourist bubble could open. It was on our news that we are running low on Pfizer, and like Australia NZ waited so the countries with the highest death rates had access ti it first, which maybe explains the slow rates, |
Originally Posted by Foxxster
(Post 11070155)
thanks for admitting it is impossible to police and a bloody stupid idea.
the original post being if you are vaccinated then you do not have to obey lockdowns. The numbers of police required to adequately enforce and check that people moving about are fully vaccinated would require doubling the police force and stopping EVERYONE on the street. we don’t have 50%, 60% + vaccinated here so our population is still very vulnerable.. any measures taken in countries where they do have those vaccinated rates therefore are irrelevant. there are some real …… on here. Grow a brain |
Problem there is people play the game by leaving on one passport, but when they need to come back to Australia to get away from Covid they whip out their Australian Passport and demand to be let in The reality is they know if you are an Australian citizen, your name and DOB will flag on the Border Farce system. We are all being distracted, lock down is only needed because they cannot get us vaccinated due poor management of the purchase of vaccines. Then they can open borders like most of the world. |
The uk is actually seeing 200 hospitalisations PER DAY and is starting to increase. |
Originally Posted by vne165
(Post 11070124)
This has to be peak insanity...12 million people in lockdown....nearly 50% of the entire country.
People didn’t like it when Jayne made those statements. I’m glad she didn’t backtrack 100% on those words. |
Originally Posted by Icarus2001
(Post 11070210)
200 in a population of 67 million people.
Our hospital system is pretty much maxed out as it is. We should have started preparing for increased capacity 18 months ago. In many states there is little to no ICU dept in the regions. |
I can imagine proper quarantine arrangements and adequate ICU infrastructure, all of which would cost less than the real cost of the lockdowns and border restrictions.
|
Interesting…regarding the new European vaccine passport.
the interesting part was when she said only AstraZeneca vaccine MADE IN EUROPE is acceptable. Much of ours is made in Australia. |
Originally Posted by jrfsp
(Post 11070157)
The uk is actually seeing 200 hospitalisations PER DAY and is starting to increase. What happens when the hospitals reach capacity? More restrictions?
In a country of 67 million….. That has 122,000 hospital beds available…. Between January-March, 250 people PER DAY were admitted for “General Medicine” (22,000+ in 3 months). Ahhhhhhh!!! Bit of perspective please. A public health system exists to improve outcomes for people affected by disease and injury. If we just “lockdown” for everything, why even bother to have a health system at all??? Ban smoking, driving and alcohol while you’re at it. And how do you propose a lockdown should be used to prevent the spread of cancer? Or perhaps should people just go to the doctor and use the health system we all pay for? |
Originally Posted by Icarus2001
(Post 11070210)
200 in a population of 67 million people.
The data is freely available on the U.K. NHS website. |
Originally Posted by 3Greens
(Post 11070281)
The data is freely available on the U.K. NHS website.
Don’t tell anyone these things called “facts” are available! They’d all rather believe the latest panic driven, click bait headline. Thanks to the rest of the world, there is a huge amount of data available to show the effectiveness of vaccines. But in Australia we wouldn’t know that because “the data isn’t clear yet”. |
Originally Posted by aviation_enthus
(Post 11070274)
200 per day.
In a country of 67 million….. That has 122,000 hospital beds available…. Between January-March, 250 people PER DAY were admitted for “General Medicine” (22,000+ in 3 months). Ahhhhhhh!!! Bit of perspective please. A public health system exists to improve outcomes for people affected by disease and injury. If we just “lockdown” for everything, why even bother to have a health system at all??? Ban smoking, driving and alcohol while you’re at it. And how do you propose a lockdown should be used to prevent the spread of cancer? Or perhaps should people just go to the doctor and use the health system we all pay for? |
Originally Posted by Transition Layer
(Post 11070295)
Don’t bother reasoning with jrfsp, he/she has clearly been brainwashed with fear living happily under Herr McGowan’s reich. You know, the people who are OK with a “circuit breaker” lockdown to “crush” the virus, because of 3 whole cases in Perth :rolleyes:
|
I don’t think we can afford a break out ( big) anywhere in Australia. Not just WA. ( yes I agree it seems WA Health is a bit fxxxxd). But I feel that this Delta thing as put a stop to normal again. I just want my second AZ.
|
Originally Posted by Lead Balloon
(Post 11070238)
I can imagine proper quarantine arrangements and adequate ICU infrastructure, all of which would cost less than the real cost of the lockdowns and border restrictions.
|
Provisional estimates of overseas trips in May 2021 show:
|
Originally Posted by chookcooker
(Post 11070093)
except for the messaging.
it’s not a race, AZ for adults. Az only over 50s wait , AZ only over 60s hangon, AZ for everyone, and hurry up and get it!! It’s a race! then add the fact they knocked back Pfizer for a Israeli style total vaccination plan that would have had us 40M doses by now. they do perhaps deserve some blame. |
NSW just shut to WA. I think we are almost done. Front doors locked , fire on, wine opened , lets see where this goes.
|
Yep those THREE cases in Perth must be pretty scary.
|
Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 11070389)
NSW just shut to WA. I think we are almost done. Front doors locked , fire on, wine opened , lets see where this goes.
|
Originally Posted by Transition Layer
(Post 11070295)
Don’t bother reasoning with jrfsp, he/she has clearly been brainwashed with fear living happily under Herr McGowan’s reich. You know, the people who are OK with a “circuit breaker” lockdown to “crush” the virus, because of 3 whole cases in Perth :rolleyes:
WA has done 5, 3, and 4 days. So less total time for 3 breakouts than Sydney for 1. Even Bruz admitted today they should’ve locked down last week. Whoops. I don’t like any of this going on either, but either make quarantine air tight and remote, which they won’t or vaccinate a lot of people, which they haven’t. |
Originally Posted by dr dre
(Post 11070447)
Yeah, should’ve just sat on his ass like Gladys over in Sydney, and let it all develop into a 14 day lockdown.
WA has done 5, 3, and 4 days. So less total time for 3 breakouts than Sydney for 1. Even Bruz admitted today they should’ve locked down last week. Whoops. I don’t like any of this going on either, but either make quarantine air tight and remote, which they won’t or vaccinate a lot of people, which they haven’t. |
Originally Posted by Foxxster
(Post 11070155)
thanks for admitting it is impossible to police and a bloody stupid idea.
the original post being if you are vaccinated then you do not have to obey lockdowns. The numbers of police required to adequately enforce and check that people moving about are fully vaccinated would require doubling the police force and stopping EVERYONE on the street. we don’t have 50%, 60% + vaccinated here so our population is still very vulnerable.. any measures taken in countries where they do have those vaccinated rates therefore are irrelevant. there are some real …… on here. Grow a brain Some people really need to grow a brain…. |
Ops normal here in Tassie except my wife works in one of the large hotels which is now full of mainlanders in quarantine. First time that her hotel has had significant quarantine numbers.
|
Originally Posted by Icarus2001
(Post 11070392)
Yep those THREE cases in Perth must be pretty scary.
|
Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 11070389)
NSW just shut to WA. I think we are almost done. Front doors locked , fire on, wine opened , lets see where this goes.
this guy works for news.com.au or the dailymail I’m sure of it. |
Originally Posted by gordonfvckingramsay
(Post 11070635)
Are you suggesting the THREE cases are scary or are you suggesting the potential number of cases that could come from those THREE people is? Three cases is not scary at all, but The Delta strain has an R0 of about 7, your THREE cases could be thousands in less than 30 days. A short, sharp lockdown prevents this.
|
Originally Posted by ScepticalOptomist
(Post 11070654)
And how many of those potential cases will need hospital treatment? Data from first world countries showing it’s definitely more infectious but causes serious illness approximately 90% less than previous strains. You don’t see Aussie media reporting that though do you? Doesn’t fit the “let’s keep em scared” narrative.
|
Originally Posted by morno
(Post 11070535)
Settle down dip****. Think of it like a drivers license, we all need one to be out on the road, and you’re right, they can’t possibly police everyone, but the deterrent to driving without a license is the risk of getting pulled over and checked, followed by the consequences of a fine and possible court appearance. Now translate that into a vaccine certificate that permits you to be out and about during a lockdown.
Some people really need to grow a brain…. God almighty. I sure hope you aren’t a pilot with people’s lives under your responsibility. |
Originally Posted by ScepticalOptomist
(Post 11070654)
............ Data from first world countries showing it’s definitely more infectious but causes serious illness approximately 90% less than previous strains. ..........................
There is no evolutionary advantage to killing your host. And you are correct in that I have seen no such statistical data in the Australian media. So I'm interested to see your source. I suspect that the 90% reduction that you mention would be linked to vaccination rates. Because fatality rates at it's source (India) do not appear to be insignificant. |
Originally Posted by ScepticalOptomist
(Post 11070654)
And how many of those potential cases will need hospital treatment? Data from first world countries showing it’s definitely more infectious but causes serious illness approximately 90% less than previous strains. You don’t see Aussie media reporting that though do you? Doesn’t fit the “let’s keep em scared” narrative.
|
Originally Posted by AerialPerspective
(Post 11060194)
Haha, me too.
Makes me laugh that I innocently posted a reference to a segment on a news program (although I use that term lightly with Sky) by a demographic expert and every pretend expert on this forum has unleashed their mob-wisdom to discredit it without even realising what the point the guy was making was. YES, people cross from one place to another in Sydney, but the ENTIRE BLOODY POPULATION doesn't do it on a daily basis. When you have a clump of suburbs in Melbourne that have an outbreak, there is no bridge or harbour or natural barrier, every suburb almost without exception borders (often on the other side of the street) with the next suburb. Given that not all 100% of people in Sydney drive to every other suburb separated from their region by a river or bridge every single day, it's OBVIOUS that sunken rivers and other barriers provide 'some' separation that does not exist in most other states, especially Victoria. Precisely because of the bridge that you refer to this guy's position does have some merit, whether all the self-appointed geniuses on here agree with it or not. There is a physical/topographical difference between Sydney and Melbourne. oh dear.. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...burn-west.html |
Goodbye Adelaide according to reports.
Jetstar are oversold Melbourne to Cairns at the moment and Melbourne-Tasmania is full across all carriers. Not many other places you can go! |
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