British Airways Future Pilot Programme.

[SirPulok]

Also got my OAA interview

Do you remember when you submitted your application?

[wyc01]

Also got my invite to Oxford, only dates available are 10th-14th December. The confirmation letter says they are running Stage 1 day 1 throughout December and early January, so I would assume more dates become available.

[Openwaters]

Wow, congratulations to those with interviews! Short time to get prepped so fingers crossed for you all. Still waiting for CTC.

For those with dates how soon had you put your application in from the starting date?

Kind regards,

[Hamsterminator]

Wow- I must say I am extremely surprised that they are inviting people for interviews already. Has the application window closed now? I got mine in but the BAfuture pilot website is still saying 13th dec closing date.

Seems odd to be giving out interviews when the window is still open?

:confused:

[17PA]

Technically not interviews, Day 1 at Oxford is just a computer based test.

[wyc01]

For those wondering I submitted my application on Tuesday 27th, so not that early!

[Roger-Wilco]

For those thorugh to the OAA assesment Day 1 - is it £250+ like last year? I wonder if they would do some sort of discount for last years' applicants (rejects!) :} - or is it possible to 'lose' a pilots' physical apptitude in 13 months?

[flying_god]

It is £ 250, I doubt you would get a discount... They have opened up more dates now for the week after..

I don't have a degree or PPL..

Good luck..

[Titan Airways]

@ flying free.LEVC

Thanks. I'm a 4th year undergrad in electrical and electronic engineering. I started my application on the 19th but didn't complete it till the 26th of November. So by no means was I an early applicant!

Further dates have also appeared for assessment at Oxford. It runs till the 21st of December now. I'm unsure if this will be further extended - but I certainly hope so!

[Langeveldt]

Sent my application off on the 19th, and have heard nothing :sad: No degree but 170 hours experience, so hope it's something at least..

[Titan Airways]

Did you apply for Oxford or one of the others? Seems to only be Oxford applicants getting contacted at the moment.

[trader988]

I too have not received any feedback,, I applied on the 28th to Oxfor FTO. Does any one know what happens in the first stage of Assessments??

[Hamsterminator]

Not wanting to sound rude at all- but it would be nice if we could avoid flooding the forum with "have applied- heard nothing" posts, simply because that's kind of a given for everyone reading this thread!

But by all means it would be great to hear from those who are getting through to various stages, as it gives the rest of us an idea of where the application cycle is.

Speaking from last year's application experience, it was over a month before hearing back from CTC.

If you want a feeling for how last year's progressed- check out THIS (http://www.pprune.org/interviews-jobs-sponsorship/459243-ba-future-pilot-programme-fpp-merged.html) thread.

:ok:

[saqademus]

Applied to Oxford on the 26th. Received an invitation email on 2nd December.

Booked day 1 for December 17th. £250!!!!??

Are the preliminary tests fairly simple? Has anybody failed or known anybody thats failed the prelims?

P.S - Degree + A levels. No flight experience. also I have no idea what some of the 3 letter acronyms you guys are using.

[ophelie]

Hi guys,

Do you know how many people are going through day 1, day 2, fnal stage with BA ?
It seems many people are being called by OAA and the £250 fee call to mind...:hmm:

I found it strange to receive an automatic email a Saturday, only 4 days after submitting my application.

[cc86]

Got to agreeably disagree with you there... ;)

The forum and thread are for all issues related to FPP - if people want to say they've applied then go for it. All it means is I have to scroll alittle further with my mouse! I personally don't mind...

That other thread is very good though - essential and interesting reading. Good find.

[Langeveldt]

Yes I did apply to Oxford..

Sorry about the "applied, heard nothing" posts, I guess it gives a bit of comfort to know we are all in similar positions though.. I take it we get feedback whether we are succesful or not?

[Fostex]

Does anyone have a valid contact email for OAA or know if any additional dates will be availble in the new year? The current dates of 10th-21st don't suit me without some rescheduling and considerable expense.

[mad_jock]

You either want it or you don't.

They will not give a flying toss if you don't want to go on the dates supplied.

[FlyingSportsman]

Cant help but thinking OAA are being a little too generous with their acceptances, any thoughts on them taking us for a £250 ride?

FS :ok:

[funkyt111]

What makes you say that?? Because a handful of people have been accepted on this forum...?

[FlyingSportsman]

rather the speed at which they have been accepted, and the fact the application window isn't even closed yet!

FS :ok:

[funkyt111]

lol but there's only a few people? There's been 1000's of applicants. I haven't had a reply as of yet and I'm sure lots of other people have not. If there anything like last year then they will not just been accepting anyone on to stage 1.

[FlyingSportsman]

Find it a little strange, submitted on the 26th and had a reply on the 2nd. There have already been 10 dates for assessment with quite a lot of appointments on each of these days.

Makes me think that they're inviting a few more people to fund the FPP programme itself :E

FS :ok:

[cc86]

Let's face it - most of us have wasted £250 on way more stupid things..!

OAA would be foolish not to screen everyone hoping to catch some failed FPP fishies to train up later on... FPP is quite the bait

[Hamsterminator]

@ Taggus-

I didn't make it to phase one last year! Reading over my application questions again however they do make fairly unimpressive reading ;)

Fingers crossed for this time around though. I don't hold up much hope as although I think i'd make a fine pilot, I certainly am not one to excel in aptitude tests! But you'll never achieve anything if you don't try, or so they say :)

[Langeveldt]

How are people being notified?

Bored of pressing F5 on my email inbox :ugh:;)

[cc86]

Via email.

All this reminds me of my UCAS days back when I was a little "yoot"

[Propellerhead]

I doubt Oxford make much of a profit from the tests, if anything it may be a slight loss leader but worth it to gain customers ultimately. They have to pay the company who owns the computer tests plus the staff who administer them. Surely it's good to give as many suitable applicants a chance as possible? I believe the pass rate is around 50% but that doesn't mean you make the cut for the next round as only the best X % will go through. I believe if you pass but don't make the cut you may be offered a place as a self sponsored student - provided you can raise the finance of course.

As someone says, £250 is nothing compared to the cost of the course and if you do ultimately succeed then Oxford provide the skills net based on the results of the skills assessment.

[Libertine Winno]

Everything was done via BA recruitment site, only got to OAA when you need to pay!

Therefore I would presume that BA recruitment determine who passes the initial application, not OAA?

[Langeveldt]

250 pounds is a drop in the ocean really, I've self funded nearly a comm and I guess will have to repeat nearly all of it. (I haven't taken the comm test as I want to see if I get this and they don't take comm pilots)..

I guess you've got to really want to work for BA :suspect:

[mad_jock]

Not everyone is sitting around on their behind ready to go at a moments notice, nor are they necessarily in this country or even on this continent.

I don't need to wind my neck in, I am already flying and have no intention of applying.

The fact is that if you can't make it they really don't care one little bit if you can't make it. You may be the perfect person for the scheme but there will be another 100 people more than happy to take your spot.

My first job was phone call on Monday on a flight 10 hours later on Tuesday for interview and hadn't heard anything on Friday so phoned and the FOM wasn't in but the lady on reception said crewing wants to talk to you. Started the type rating on the Monday. If I hadn't no job.

Empathy and airline operations don't mix.

[Langeveldt]

They definitely don't...

It would be interesting if the recruiters were reading these forums..

[mad_jock]

Its almost a certainty. They will also at some point do a web search for the people as well so any dodgy crap on facebook profiles will come up.

[wyc01]

Out of interest, is anybody who has been invited to OAA stage 1 holding back on booking a date because they hope dates in January will become available?

[BUGS/BEARINGS/BOXES]

Holding back on assesment dates would be potential suicide. Making a career and life changing move requires some balls when dealing with current employers. Especially in today's climate. Do what you can and take the first available opportunity to attend assesment.

In response to an earlier suggestion to FTOs lowering selection standards. They most certainly have done. The FTOs in today's market are in the wrong place to make money the old fashioned way. The UK and European markets are shrinking (in terms of pilot requirements). The best place for a FTO to be right now is South East Asia/Australia or the Middle East. These locations can easily serve the growing markets more directly. The recent economic situation has put the 'sensible' money off investing in their future flying aspirations. This has led to a reduction of applicants. The FTOs, who attend many careers fairs and the like, are aware of the high number of very young hopefuls (you can spot them when you visit the schools wearing bomber jackets, lanyard and aviators). Whilst they would not hesitate to run selections for these individuals (for free in the past to keep applications numbers up) it was found that these individuals kept on failing selection. This is partly due to a reduction in education standards across the board, but also due to the naivety of young individuals who did not truely appreciate what they were getting themselves into. As such the fianacial types in FTOs all saw a huge £ sign. Airlines running courses in conjunction with FTOs were faced with selection scores way below what had been seen before.
Have the brains dried up, or have the candidates with sence put applying off until an opportunity such as the FPP came along? In my opinion it is a bit of both. Be under no illusion, the FTOs all have their 'quota' of no hopers, there filling the debt hole of the FTOs, continually failing exams (even with the aid of Bristol) who simply have been failed by the dumbing down of a robust selection system. BA were aware of this, and as a security measure made all the FPP finalists undergo another, BA run, set of aptitude tests. Think of it as a quality assurance check.
The naive 18/19 year olds attending some FTOs will continue to fail and be back coursed, keeping the money coming in. It used to be the case that if the FTO did not think that you had a high probability of getting through on the first attempt, you were politely declined. Now, as long as you have a hope in hell, and have the finances in place, you have a shot. The FPP attracts a high number of applicants (brand awareness) and the FTOs know they can pick off the best and make offers to the rest. Some even try to get the failures onto the next airline scheme in the pipe line. BA and other airlines are fully aware of this, but the new 'status quo' is what it is. The economy really needs to pick up to bring the FTOs back to their previous good days.

I keep on harking on and on but DO YOUR RESEARCH! visit the schools, KNOW that you would be happy there, look for contract changes, how are they justified? Is there a double standard? No FTO is perfect, by any standards and they would never claim to be. There are many great instructors still at the FTOs and some fantastic training will be delivered. But do get into the nitty gritty. It is YOUR investment, and YOUR decision.

The FTOs all have there varying good and bad points. Reading posts on here is incredibly subjective. Biased and tarnished posts abound. The most important thing to do is visit the intended FTO's open day. Get to know the place! Once again GO AND BLOODY VISIT THE FTO!!!! It pains me when individuals do not, and end up realising it is not for them far, far , far too late in the game. The FTOs would not want you to be there, failing because you were unhappy with being in Phoenix, Jerez, New Zealand. Really really think about what it is you are doing, and what to do if you are placed into a hold pool at the end of training. Have a credible back up in mind.


Finally good luck to all of you. Even being on the FPP does not make this game an easy ride, there will be moments you bang your head against the wall and ask why the hell you are doing this to yourself. However,being sat at the front is, without any doubt, the best job in the world. (apart from being paid to blow stuff up in the Royal Artillery)

[funkyt111]

Very informative post. Thank you kindly for this information. I advise the younger aspiring pilots to read the advice above carefully and ask any questions if you need to. I remember what I was like when I was 18/19 and I was incredibly instinctive and naive (although I thought I knew it all).:=

Anyway, on another subject. Does anybody know for sure who reviews the intial applications? To my knowledge it is the FTO's but other people seem to think its British Airways?

[saqademus]

As much the big post above makes sense, secondary research can be a lot quicker, cheaper and more informative than primary, especially when gathered from a few sources.

So on that note, does ANYBODY know at all the main differences between the integrated courses at these FTO's? And any personal opinions/anecdotes would be much appreciated.

Thanks

[Mr Jingles]

Would successful candidates get a choice of BA base location upon completion of training?

If not what are the most likely locations one can expect to be based at?

Thanks in advance

[BitMoreRightRudder]

Heathrow or Gatwick. That's your lot.

[funkyt111]

Would successful candidates get a choice of BA base location upon completion of training?

If not what are the most likely locations one can expect to be based at?

Thanks in advance

It amazes me how people do not know such information? All the information is on BA's website dude. :ugh:

[Propellerhead]

BUGS/BEARINGS/BOXES, your last 3 paragraphs are very good advice and should be read. Whilst the rest may be true for smaller FTOs, it is ill-informed with regards to the 3 FTOs chosen for BA. If anything, the opposite has happened since 9/11.

Pre 9/11 most students were high calibre sponsored, and the remaining places were open to anyone with a cheque book, leading to the problems you allude to. Post 9/11 the game changed and no sponsored students existed so the FTOs went to their banks and asked if they could secure favourable loans for self sponsored students. The banks agreed (being a time of easy credit), but wanted assurances the student would pass. Hence the skills assessment was born for all.

Whilst turning students away seemed madness initially it has been a huge success as the pass rates of the courses is now in excess of 99%, backed up by Oxford's skills net (now a full refund for course failure at any time, and no re-sit fees). What happened was that the end product was of a higher calibre, more likely to get a job (if there were any), and the FTO saved money by having greater course throughput due less failures. The skills assessment process has evolved and whilst initially basic is now worthy of any modern recruitment process, and in some cases better than some airline's! The fact that BA have always in the past done all their selection in-house but now trust the FTO's assessment process is the ultimate validation. The airline will always do the final screening, but what this means is the candidates reaching the final stage are of a very high calibre indeed and make BA's job easy (or difficult depending which way you look at it)!!

[theo93]

I would like to ask if I complete the application form and be accepted, and for some reason cannot be there for the selection process, shall be unacceptable for future programmes? Thanks in advance.

[mad_jock]

The 99% if true which I doudt. I think you will find is more to do with the in house IRE's doing the IR tests instead of the CAA staff IRE's.

[StevenM]

Just got word back that I have been unsuccessful:ugh:

Good luck to anybody who gets through! :ok:

[concord2]

On the edge of applying, but I'm a little confused about how the financing works. Could someone explain it to me?

Also, it would be cool if people could post their stats? Like:

Education Status: Degree, a-level results?
school applied for: OAA ect.

obviously not giving too much away!

[ford cortina]

Concord, you finance it this way,
Your parents re mortgage their house to the tune of £84,000.00.
Or if you are not able to raise the money using assets, ie your parents Home, you may be eligible to raise the money through the British Airways loan, if your credit check and score be good enough the bank will give you the money with BA acting as guarantor.

Easy really,

[flyinglondon]

Don't intend to be rude but wow...some of the questions you guys are posting should disqualify you from ever even coming in contact with an airplane.

Really, read the BA FPP site first. It's not rocket science.

[my_call]

StevenM,

Sorry to hear that man. Don't give up. It will happen

[concord2]

Don't intend to be rude but wow...some of the questions you guys are posting should disqualify you from ever even coming in contact with an airplane.



Don't intend to be rude but wow... Was there any point in you posting this, apart from giving yourself an air of superiority, despite the fact you are in exactly the same boat as everyone else?

Clarifying precisely how the funding scheme works is hardly an idiotic question to ask. I just don't know why you think you're in a position which makes you think you can comment on whether others are suited at all to becoming a pilot.

[Roger10-4]

One thing you might not consider before you apply to your FTO is, how long does the course actually take? I'd suggest that you will be out of the other end that little bit quicker with FTE and at the end of the day we all want to be sat in the right hand seat asap. Going to the open days is certainly a good idea but if you can, speak to people who are actually there at the moment if you know any. Alternatively, drag a volunteering student to one side and gather as much information as you can from them!

[FunkyMunky]

Just recieved my knock-back.

Pretty gutted, at least last year I got to the 2nd assessment day! :ouch:

[Stocious]

Ah but there were only two FTE courses on this years - One in April and one in November, so pretty big gamble to take for being in RHS the quickest. At least CTC and Oxford had one every couple of months. The difference is pretty negligible anyway. And FTE has the highest top up fees of course.

[Roger10-4]

...but FTE is fully catered not that I'm with FTE.

[baldopilot]

@FunkyMunky

sorry to hear that :(

What was you FTO/background?

Don't give up! :=

[flying_god]

Hi,

Does anyone know if OAA let you know your compass / physics scores on the day of the test ?

Thanks,

[FunkyMunky]

@baldopilot

OAA, 2nd attempt at same FTO.

Worried now that something from the interview last year has stuck on my file this time round - I knew I fluffed the interview last year, so worked hard to get promoted into a role with more leadership potential in my current career, and thought that being able to say "look, I really havn't sat on my arse" might have boosted my application a little bit.

Of course my current career isn't remotely aviation related, so that might be worth sod all! :p

[baldopilot]

@FunkyMunky

as I was saying before don't give up!
Apparently OAA is the only fto that's sending out invitations/rejections atm. Still nothing from FTE

[ExMilRedundancy]

OAA take the longest to do the selection process. They were the last ones to finish last year. FTE were the earliest to start last year. OAA will just be trying to get done earlier as they were cutting it a little fine with cranebank deadlines.

[Roger-Wilco]

@FunkyMonkey

Just a thought - you didnt copy & Paste your essay answers from last year did you? They might have cross-compared and filtered out the cheeky/lazy applicants?

The Q's are so similar that it would be tempting, especially so given the finely-tuned piece of art my essays were last year!!! :{

[er82]

ExMil- what a load of tosh!! OAA did not cut it fine last year at all. They had a far more strenuous selection process compared to other schools which might explain why they got 46 places compared to FTE's 14.
OAA, like last year, have cracked on with screening the applications and send out yes/no emails as they go along.

[ExMilRedundancy]

What you'll actually find er82 is the reason last year that OAA had most of the final cadets is the final numbers were split in the same ratio as the applications to each school. OAA had the most applicants, simple as that. Had nothing whatsoever to do with how "strenuous" the selection process was. They had the most applicants and it took them longer to screen them all as they had a "longer" selection process. They were the last school to finish screening their final applicants and still had assessments after the first cranebank assessments.

[flying_god]

OAA Day 1 Assessment done.

It really is a skill assessment rather than a exam. I spent about 8 hours studying, but what I learnt in the first 5 minutes would have been enough for the Maths and the Physics tests. That is not to say they were easy, its just wasn't something you could study for.

The majority of what they are assessing is based on your natural ability ( Ie memory, ability to use joysticks etc) rather than anything you can study for.

Other points were:
Absolutely no feedback will be given. They don't even tell you your compass score.
2nd day assessments will start from the 14th Jan.

Good luck guys, my Christmas starts here!

[FunkyMunky]

@Roger-Wilco - Just a thought - you didnt copy & Paste your essay answers from last year did you?


Oh goodness no! Not naive/stupid enough to think I could get away with that.

[Stocious]

ExMil- what a load of tosh!! OAA did not cut it fine last year at all. They had a far more strenuous selection process compared to other schools which might explain why they got 46 places compared to FTE's 14.

Surely if they had a far more strenuous selection process, then they would have had the least amount of people on their courses, as the rest wouldn't have made the required standard?

Anyway, the point is moot - BA had the final say as to who got in, irrespective of which FTO they had selected, hence the difference in FTO numbers.

[Danny212]

Has anyone heard back from CTC?

Scrolling through this...many people have so much flying experience where i have only been able to fund my flying through two or three scholarship awards...with barely any hours under my belt...and with GCSE's and A-levels and bit of work history...its kind of worrying :( :( :(

[Keeley]

Hi everyone,

This may sound like a silly question to some of you, but I would like constructive advice from those who are willing.

I am in the process of completing my BA FPP application as I type, and I am currently focusing on the "Employment History" section. Now, the section description reads "Please give full details of significant employment by clicking on the 'Add Employment History' link below. Indicate whether it was full-time, part-time, vacation work or an industrial placement and provide details of specific responsibilities, experience and knowledge gained". Voluntary work is described nowhere in this description as really it isn't a form of employment. However, I currently tutor maths for free and attend a local primary school once a week to play numeracy games with some of the children.

Would it be worth including this work in this section do you think, or do you reckon it will just come across as though I am unable to read and understand what details they are asking for?

Thanks guys and good luck to you all.

[yukimush]

CTC Applicants - Check your emails!

Congratulations to those invited to attend for phase II!

[ExMilRedundancy]

Keeley,

I suggest putting it under Part-time work.
Just because you aren't being paid for it does not mean it isn't work.

[bex88]

Put it under part time work. It shows you have wider experience and at interview it will certainly reflect well on you. Respect for doing it BA want can do people who will go beyond what is expected of them

[my_call]

I can confirm the email from CTC yukimush and I'm completely over the moon, no doubt. Good luck to everyone including those having to defer ..and remember it's bite size chunks.

[yukimush]

Good luck to you all! This programme is a wonderful opportunity!

[Openwaters]

Hi all!

I have just been accepted for the next stage with CTC! Over the moon does not even come close to how I am feeling right now! Best of luck for those waiting to hear!

[Openwaters]

Great idea!

I have booked my next stage and paid the £210 requested!

Anyone else?

[GrummanSk]

Congratulations to ye!

Just wondering when did your email arrive?

I haven't received an offer yet! :(

[Openwaters]

Thank you!

Email was sent approx 16.30 today and I applied on the 28th.

[baldopilot]

Congrats guys! Just to get an idea on which dates is CTC doing the assessments?

[champair79]

Applied at the end of Nov and got an email around 1730.

CTC assessment dates are 8/9/10 January. Who knows if there are any more that haven't been uploaded.

A nice early Christmas present. Good luck to all (but don't stop me getting the job :}).

[preshair]

Just wondering if anyone had heard from CTC? I think I'm wearing out my email checking all the time :)

[erpeor]

hi guys, anyone knows if FTE Jerez is already contacting to do the assessment tests? I applied in the 29th and still got nothing

thanks

[baldopilot]

@erpeor i applied to FTE the first week the application window was open. Nothing yet :)

[erpeor]

@baldopilot thanks for your quick reply. Hopefully we will meet @ FTE! I wish you good luck

[planemadsam]

I applied to CTC in the first few days of the application window opening and haven't heard anything yet :/

[baldopilot]

@erpeor Good luck to you. Hopefully :rolleyes: yeah :ok:

[GrummanSk]

I am the same planemadsam maybe they are working there way through those who submitted later first. :)

[planemadsam]

I hope so. Need to stop pressing the "check mail" button!

[DavidC83]

Remember to check your junk and trash email guys. My response was in there

[erpeor]

anyone actually knows what to study for the assessment days?

[Mikk2k2]

Accepted for phase 2 at CTC - See you guys in Jan! What're you all looking at with regards revision?

[FrankMatt]

Does anyone else think that those of us who haven't heard back from Oxford yet are sitting in the MAYBE pile?

[preshair]

Accepted for phase 2 at CTC - See you guys in Jan! What're you all looking at with regards revision?

Did you hear from CTC today?

I'm like planemadsam and constantly pressing refresh,,, surprised I've not been blocked from checking ;-)

[erpeor]

hi guys what kind of exercices do they ask in the assessment examns?

[pandiani1]

What time do applications have to be submitted by?

[SHolberg]

Application has to been in by 23:59 tomorrow :)

Just sent mine. Exciting to wait for an answer. On what grounds were you guys rejected? :)

[Paxi_R6]

I got my app in on the 2nd or 3rd of Dec , FTE was the FTO I chosen , Anyone get a word off them yet I have only gotten an email saying its under review :) CTC and Oxford already making people smile so far good to see :) best of luck , but it's Everyman for himself at the moment ;)

[beck9000]

I am also waiting for FTE to gte back to me, i presume they will wait till application window is closed before they make the choice.

[MaydayMaydayMayday]

Paxi, sounds like FTE were the last to start getting back to people last year, although it sounds like they started responding as soon as the application window closed. Does this mean Friday? Who knows. We can but hope!

I've applied to FTE as well. Haven't had anything back other than the confirmation email that BAR are currently reviewing the application.

Best of luck and heads up if we make it to the evaluation stage! :)

[Mikk2k2]

Did you hear from CTC today?

I'm like planemadsam and constantly pressing refresh,,, surprised I've not been blocked from checking ;-)

Found out Tue 11/12/2012 16:48 :)

[Speedbird777]

Two quick questions:

- anyone have a sense of how many years BA intends to do the FPP for?

- what are the earliest and latest course start dates that are possible from the 2013 enrollment cycle?

Cheers!

[flying_god]

In terms of revision, at least for Oxford I wouldn't get caught up in learning hundreds of Formulas for the Maths and technical tests. You don't have a calculator, and expecting you learn the Sin / Cos tables is way beyond the scope of what they are looking at.

The Technical test is more looking at how you approach a problem. The best advice I can give is think how to logically follow problems through. Ie if you had a pile of parts how would you construct them to solve a given problem. The rest is really basic.

90% of the score you are going to get is based upon your natural aptitude, only 10% you can revise for. Like the Maths test, you need to be able to read the question, compute the answer and type in the result in 50 seconds! If your not a natural at maths, that is going to be difficult. Remember that each FTO is going to only going to take the top 5-10%? through to the next round, so you can't afford any weaknesses.

Best of luck.

[alexonaplane]

Absolutely gutted, invited to the OAA 1st day assessment but there's no way I'm going to be able to scramble £250 in time. I should of saved my application for next year when I might have a bit more money. So frustrating :ugh:

[Openwaters]

Can you not get an overdraft or creditcard for the money??? You can't lose this opportunity for the sake of £250!

[Stocious]

To be honest £250 is just a fraction of the costs the applying and getting through the process will cost. You'll also have to factor in travel costs, days off work, medical costs etc etc. It mounts up!

[BerksFlyer]

OAA charged £200 last year as well. I very much doubt their admin costs have risen 25% in a year.

[alexonaplane]

it's just annoying given that BA market this as it's attempt to stop financing from being an issue...

[Bealzebub]

If your interpretation of "financing" as it relates to commercial pilot training is £250, then you are woefully naive! To be honest, falling at the first hurdle is probably the kindest thing that could happen to you. There are people who will need to spend more than this on fares simply to get to the assessments.

[aspiring-pilot]

My application was successful for oxford my assessment day is next week the 20th! anyone else going on that day ? :ok:

[Propellerhead]

I would have to disagree with the tests being 90% natural aptitude and 10% how much revision you do. It may seem like this but they are something you can improve a lot on by practicing similar tests, especially under time pressure. I'd say you can improve your scores by 25-50% at least by putting a load of work in. I guess there will be a few 'sky gods' that are just naturals and don't need to revise, but the vast majority (myself included) benefit a lot from revision.

[Paxi_R6]

Cannot miss out on a chance like this ! Get the money some where mate if you can :) as for studying Cram Cram Cram with maths and physics but there's other parts to the exam as well so try make them your strong points ! No calculator is a bit harsh in fairness ... I've to pay for a medical , Uk Naric letter of certification , flights to Coventry (FTE hold there assessment there from what I'm told ) accommodation and I'm sure FTE have there charge on top of that ... Be worth it though , sure that's only the start the loan we have to take out ain't cheap ! Be Positive and study or we all work together and rob a bank ;) .
Best of luck , Hope FTE start getting back to people soon and maybe seeing few for assessment day :D !

[SHolberg]

Congratulations to all you guys who made it so far!
I believe that you can practice quite a lot beforehand, and if successful in my application i would certainly do so. This is to big a chance to spoil on bad preparation!

[ford cortina]

Alexonaplane, you are being asked to pay a fee for assessment, why did you apply, if you could not afford that.

If you get through, you are going to have to find £85,000.00 for the course, plus £5,499 to OAA for your exams.
Not to mention uniform, CRP-5, Headset, etc etc
I would want to have at least £100,000.00 avaiable to pay for all that.

Professional Aviation has high price to join, if you gawp at £250.00 now, knowing you might have got selected when you applied then your are in for a very rude awakening. By not going, you have potentially taken the place off one one else who could have. No sympathy end of.

If you feel that British Airways are marketing this as a cadet program with little or no financing, then you have read the wrong website.
Best of luck

[daveandg]

Hi Alex

Whilst your points have some level of validity, so do everyone elses. BA are advertising this as a route into commercial aviation for those that can't afford the huge lump sum required, but it is by no stretch a free lunch. As much as it pains you now, take your current financial situation as a necessary evil, preventing you from applying this year. Given BA' plans, you still have 2 years/chances, so don't be disheartened. You could argue that BA's plans may change and they pull the plug, but in that instance you should be grateful you're not mid-training because if they stop the programme, chances are the guys at the end will not be offered employment.

Instead, take the opportunity to start tucking away money. BA are giving guys a chance to train via the integrated route with three of the biggest, but a quick search and you'll find many modular schools (we'll not get into that debate) offering frozen ATPL for about half the price. BA also need assurances you are motivated by your career choice; sure, anyone can say they want it and come across well in interview, but the guy who's saving hard and making sacrifices to self fund comes across better!

The above have mentioned the scheme holds additional costs like food, equipment, insurances etc (each FTO price varies slightly), items which aren't part of training, more your own life and items you'd be paying for regardless! Like I said, chin up, and take what seems a massive blow as a kick in the behind to start showing your motivation. If you apply next year with 12 months savings and get in, problem solved. If you don't get in, you're still sitting on 12 months savings and are a step closer to making a dream reality! Food for thought

[Openwaters]

DAG

What a fantastic reply! Very positive.

Anyone have any good suggestions on how to get my maths skills in reference to aptitude tests upto scratch?

Thank you.

[alexonaplane]

Many thanks for the reply DAG I appreciate it :) Wondering if there's scope to hold my offer of second stage until next year. Does anyone know of anyone this has been an option for?

[naturals]

OAA have a maths course on CD. I haven't used it so no idea if it's any good but it has to be as good a starting point as any.

[Danny212]

Has anyone recieved any rejections yet?

[Openwaters]

Thank you naturals

[saqademus]

so what other costs are there leading up to the first paycheque from BA?

£250 admin fee for test
£6000 on exams
£??? uniform and headset? <-- will this not be given to you? Cheapskates!
£18 months of accomodation

Anything else?

[SmileyRiley]

FTE emailed :D

[MaydayMaydayMayday]

Email from FTE Jerez/BAR came through at 3.01pm. :)

[Paxi_R6]

Still waiting ... Well congrats :) when's the assessment days ?

[Paxi_R6]

With OAA your forgot the visa to live in the US , the flights to the US , accommodation in the US (I think) , food , transport ...... Same with CTC and New Zealand , Price to pay for dream career I guess , should of looked into the flight schools more FTE was the overall best choice for me anyway :)

[MaydayMaydayMayday]

7th - 25th January, from the look of it. Variable start times too. Given the proximity to Heathrow and some of the start times, it looks very possible to fly in and out on the same day, assuming you're based in (or near) the UK with commuter flights. :)

[erpeor]

Got nothing yet from FTE and now is weekend so i guess i have to wait until next week to see if i get any email! Hopefully they havent contacted everyone yet.

By the way, does anyone know if they contact to even if u have been refused?

Sorry for the mispellings but i am writing with a iphone

Thanks

[wiggy]

Alex

I should of saved my application for next year when I might have a bit more money. So frustrating

Be careful, it only takes another major nose dive in the economy or a major event on a par with 911, and there might not be an FPP run next year. If you are really interested in the scheme I'd find some way of getting the finances together.

[Mike91]

Does anyone have any advice for stage one at OAA? I'm most worried about the maths and physics? any suggestions of what material I can study from?

[Romeo Kilo]

Regarding supplementary costs, it was all very clear what I would have to find on top of the security bond and top-up fees when I applied last year. I would be surprised if it was less so this time around.

Note I can only speak about those at OAA.

Speaking basically, the only expenses one will incur are:

Food (although full board is apparently provided in Pheonix)
Leisure - Could be beer monies, Vegas chips, travel, etc.. Whatever you do that makes you happy...

The costs involved with the lead up to the training are:

EASA Class 1 medical. Initials must be taken at Gatwick. Successful candidates may be able to get renewals from BA AME's;

Any costs involved in raising the capital. Any borrowing will no doubt incur some form of arrangement fee, as well as the cost of borrowing itself;

Life insurance;

Loss of training expenses insurance covering the loss of medical certificate;

The cost of undertaking selection at the school (£250 at Oxford this year);

Costs associated with attending selection - train tickets, hotels as required. Not these are always the responsibility of the candidate.


Everything required for the completion of training is included in the sponsorship or the top-up fees. To be clear that means:

Uniform
Study materials
CRP5
Various other sundries

I just thought I'd try and clarify some of the red herring that seem to be emerging about costs. The idea of the scheme being accessible to all is more than simply a slogan on the website. Credit status notwithstanding, there is little to stand in the way of successful candidates from being able to accept the deal, financially speaking. Whether or not one wishes to commit such a large bond is, of course, a personal choice, however.

@Mike91: Read the instructions and take your time. Ensure you understand what is being asked you in each of the tasks.

[SirPulok]

By the way, does anyone know if they contact to even if u have been refused?

Yup! Got an automatic email from OAA saying that I have not been accepted. Does not say why just that I can go through a self funded route.

[erpeor]

Thank you so much.

I will keep my hopes up until either one of the two emails is in my inbox.

Sorry for not been accepted. There are more years that will be BA FPP keep trying man, I will even if I get refused.

[Bearcat F8F]

Hi fellas, could someone who has been through the process last year with FTE tell me, do they ask question on the assessment day specifically to do with the written application that you send them in the initial stage (i.e. the answers to the written questions)? Just curious if they will ask "why have you given this answer to that question?"

Or are these initial application forms now irrelevant to them? Will they still count for the rest of the application process or basically everyone who gets through to the assessment stage starts with a clean sheet?

Hope that makes sense. Thanks.

[EZY_FR]

Very good question Bearcat! Maybe people who went through the process last year can shed some light some this if possible?

[Ollybolly]

Not being funny here, but we're all competing against each other for very few places - why on earth would anyone want to help someone else, and potentially lose out! :ugh:

Just a thought....

[rojocrv]

yes they do ask questions on your application. last year i had an hour long interview, however i must say it was very relaxed. How id best describe it was an interview to find out how you ticked, what kind of person you are, they asked questions on the application, but i think when they did they were more conversation starters. The questions were regarding the eassay questions and your work experience. i have to say the interview was really the most relaxed part for me, but its horses for courses, some of the people who i was with that day prefered the written test or the pilot aptitude.
i didnt get any further but i really enjoyed the day and met some really nice fellow applicants.

BTW i applied again this year and i have not heard back from FTE yet. :uhoh:. regardless i am going flying in 2 hours and doing it my way :8

[saqademus]

Need some advice with OAA stage 1 booking:

You have to book it through 2 websites: the BA website and the OAA website (where you pay)

I booked it though BA, but now need to change the booking.

Shall I just book it for the new date on the OAA and leave the BA one alone? I assume its less important because its just simply registering a date with BA..

Hmm..

[Paxi_R6]

Just out of curiosity anyone who lives outside the united Kingdom get Invited to an Assessment day ?

[Orangaphobia]

if I were you I would go straight to the FTO.

[Sebas27]

For those who had an answer from FTE. Where does the assessment take place?

[preshair]

Just wondering if anyone has had any good news today about their application?

[Airone2977]

It's clearly written on FTE Jerez Website :

" Once your application has been assessed and accepted, you will progress to Phase II of the selection process. Phase II consists of a series of questions that you will be required to answer within a given time. If successful you will progress to Phase III which is a two-day assessment at a venue (soon to be confirmed) in the UK"

[SmileyRiley]

FTE is at Hounslow :)

[erpeor]

No email from FTE yet. Starting to worry....:ugh:

[Fadecc]

Is anyone attending the BA assessment with CTC at Dibden Manor on the 8th of Jan? The am slot?

[saqademus]

OAA stage 1 assessment done! Time to enjoy Christmas

Good luck to everyone else!

[EZY_FR]

saqademus- How do you feel it went?

[JJetstream]

How many people have heard from CTC either way? I submitted my application on the 28th November and am anxiously waiting the response :uhoh:.
Cheers.

[preshair]

How many people have heard from CTC either way? I submitted my application on the 28th November and am anxiously waiting the response :uhoh:.
Cheers.

Im in the same boat as you. Submitted on the 28th and not heard anything either way :/

[Danny212]

JJetstream - I submitted mine on the 26th....as anxious as you are...no reply as of yet :( some people have received invites from CTC...not sure if anyone has been rejected from CTC yet :uhoh:

[ally1384]

Sent my application on Thursday and got a reply from OAA today.

I want to practice similar tests and as so does anyone have any ideas of good aptitude test books? Having looked on book sellers websites reviews of the available books are not encouraging.

Best of luck to all applying.

[VNAVPTH]

ULTIMATE PSYCHOMETRIC TESTS

Mike Bryon

ISBN: 978-0-7494-5308-4

Very similar to what you can expect to sit for the 'written' tests.

As for spending a small fortune for computer based tests, don't bother. Use MSFS or similar. The space shuttle landing sim on iPad/phone uses exactly the same motor skills employed by the brain.

£250 for assesment? That's a money making venture if ever I saw one. How the price has risen that far is beyond me.

[BBrus]

Those who have been already accepted by FTE, when did you finish your application? I started mine several minutes after they opened it but finished it a week after not to do things in a hurry. No reply yet.

I was taking things quite calmly, but it was opening this thread and getting super nervous. :rolleyes:

[MaydayMaydayMayday]

BBrus,

I started on the 26th November, submitted on the 2nd December (was working away from home all week). Heard back about 3pm on the 13th.

Hope they get back to you soon. :)

[SHolberg]

Well, that didn't turn out to well.
Negative reply from OAA yesterday. I find it somewhat hard to understand being rejected this early, as i hold the Norwegian equivalent of AAB, hold a PPL-A(60 hours) and was very satisfied with my answers in the application.

Well well, maybe its because i'm a Norwegian... :uhoh:

[fido7]

nope.. i guess theyr nt taking pple from outside uk.. i had my application rejected a week back.. i stay in Dubai btw..dey ddn giv any reason though.. but it was bad for me i missed out on an amazing opportunity.. btw im a design engineer, having just completed my mechanical engg 6 mnths bak.. so i thought smwhere i cud b given sum preference.. but nt to be.. looking fr other cadet programs though.

[flying_god]

Hi,
Anyone know what the last date for 1st day assessment at Oxford is?

Reason being is that they said we would have to wait until they were all done before we got notified for the 2nd day..

Thanks.

[Orangaphobia]

..............

[Paxi_R6]

Well UK nationals get priority BA won't really want to take any EU nationals unless the candiaties from the UK don't do well in the assessments and they need to look outside the UK , highly doubt that will happen . taking people like me from Ireland they would worry after a few years plus a type rating like the a320 I would go back home and get a job with Aer lingus hence EUs fecking off home after awhile which is not true for me anyway . My application was sent in on the 3rd of December and I have not heard a word be patient but don't get your hopes up :(

[SHolberg]

Paxi_R6

Yeah, i somewhat understood that before sending my application, but i have to say that if they don't even intend to asses any foreigners; then why even bother to make it a opportunity for them to apply?

Does anybody know if a non-UK citizen has been taken into the program?

[Shawrey]

flying_god

We were informed that we will be told during the first week of January, if we get the 2nd date or not :E

fido7 and Paxi_R6

Rubbish. We had three gentlemen from Dubai, Germany and France on our Day 1. Don't lose hope until you get that email.

[SgtBellPepper]

Been accepted past the application stage and am now gearing up for stage 1 (assessment) at Oxford.

Good luck to all those awaiting any news.

Quick question regarding financing from anyone who knows : as someone who doesn't own any property, I would be applying for finance via the BA guarantor scheme (assuming I am one of the chosen few of course!) and realise that credit checks will be done.

I don't have a bad credit rating (I have no defaults, no CCJ's) and all my existing accounts are in good standing.

So how good is good in this respect? What are they looking for?

Thanks and again good luck.

:ok:

[saqademus]

Not too bad!

Does anybody know the pass mark for the OAA technical/physics test? And how its incorporated into the final marking?

ie. if you pass the compass test with flying colours but then dont do so well in the physics test, would you still go through?

[naturals]

Does anybody know the pass mark for the OAA technical/physics test? And how its incorporated into the final marking?

ie. if you pass the compass test with flying colours but then dont do so well in the physics test, would you still go through?

I too am curious as to how this works. On my selection day they said the benchmark would be set once all people had taken the test and that they were looking to bring around 400 back for the next selection day (OAA said this, though not sure if they're bringing 400 in or all the FTOs are bringing that in total). I presume the look at your mark and the marks in each individual round (i.e. you wouldn't want a maths genius in the cockpit with the hand eye coordination of a snake).

There's a thread on the OAA forum about pass marks, though OAA told us the mark would depend on the overall calibre of participants. I suspect the requirement will be far far higher than a usual intake due to the demand for the scheme.

Thread is here (http://ask.oxfordaviation.net/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=5132) if you're interested.

[BBrus]

Well UK nationals get priority BA won't really want to take any EU nationals unless the candiaties from the UK don't do well in the assessments and they need to look outside the UK , highly doubt that will happen . taking people like me from Ireland they would worry after a few years plus a type rating like the a320 I would go back home and get a job with Aer lingus hence EUs fecking off home after awhile which is not true for me anyway . My application was sent in on the 3rd of December and I have not heard a word be patient but don't get your hopes up :(

What is your basis to make this statement?

If I were to be accepted by British Airways, I can assure the last thing I would think about is to get my flight training and TR sponsored by BA and go back to Spain. Actually, I doubt anyone would give up a career in British Airways to start from scratch in another airline in their country of origin.

You would be signing a contract which will contain a clause of permanence.

[BerksFlyer]

Well UK nationals get priority BA won't really want to take any EU nationals unless the candiaties from the UK don't do well in the assessments and they need to look outside the UK , highly doubt that will happen . taking people like me from Ireland they would worry after a few years plus a type rating like the a320 I would go back home and get a job with Aer lingus hence EUs fecking off home after awhile which is not true for me anyway . My application was sent in on the 3rd of December and I have not heard a word be patient but don't get your hopes up http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/sowee.gif

You're wrong. I don't know on what basis you can make this comment? Completely unfounded.

Regarding your lack of hearing back. If you are 17, then unless Ireland runs a year ahead of the UK in education, or you took your A-Level equivalents a year early, you don't actually qualify. As clearly stated on the website, A-level grades need to be in-hand.

[Libertine Winno]

@naturals

The format for working out aptitude testing scores etc is a closely guarded secret! If you read any forums regarding the FAT's at Cranwell they are exactly the same, and the short answer is that nobody apart from the recruiters actually know.

It is indeed true, however, that there is a 'pass' mark...but in reality this is a competition (as are the FAT's at Cranwell) and as such merely passing is not good enough, you need to pass good enough to be in the top x% of candidates.

As stated, though, what percentage the x actually is depends on all the other candidates, so will not be know until all candidates have taken the tests.

Not much help I know, but in essence it's a futile exercise worrying about it or trying to guess, just do your best and wait!

[Paxi_R6]

Well I thought it would be UK nationals given priority due to the the loans would be easier to get compared to someone who lives outside the UK and that fact pilots have in the past that were taken on left after a few years (Was told by a pilot) so they try prevent from past mistakes . On the contract side of things there's ways out of everything ! ......

I do infact qualify :) I sat my Leaving cert the summer just gone , got my letter of certification saying I have 3 A-Levels :ok: it also states I have to be 18 before July 2013 , I am I'm 18 in march ;)

I'll wait and see like everyone else :) best of luck to the people who has an assessment !

[Bearcat F8F]

Hi guys,

I am attending Phase 2 assessment day at FTE soon. I am aware that upon completion of Phase 2, there is a Phase 3 which consists of a 2-day assessment.

Does anyone know how FTE splits these phases and days up? What are they assessing on day 1, then days 2 and 3?

I am aware of all the material that will be covered during the entire assessment as I'm pretty sure all of us get the same info from BA. I searched through FTE's website but this yielded no clear explanation of what will be assessed at Phase 2.

If no one has info on this, I will give them a ring.

Thanks in advance.

[Ollybolly]

Well I thought it would be UK nationals given priority due to the the loans would be easier to get compared to someone who lives outside the UK and that fact pilots have in the past that were taken on left after a few years (Was told by a pilot) so they try prevent from past mistakes . On the contract side of things there's ways out of everything ! ......


Facts are better than supposition.

I know for a FACT that non UK nationals were included at all stages of last year's FPP programme.

Maybe there's another reason that people don't get through to stage 2.... :ugh:

[Rne]

I've just finished OAA stage 1 and thought I'd share the following:

They said that every online application was given a mark/score based on how good it was. At the moment 30% of applicants have been invited to stage 1 (or have completed it).

There will be an email between 4-6 Jan inviting successful candidates to the next stage.

Last year OAA got 44% of BA's future pilots, and they believe the reason is because of 'head of OAA recruitment lady' - who previously worked for BA. Apparently she knows exactly what BA are looking for and will invite everyone that has potential back for the next stage. (she said "if there are 400 good candidates, then I will see them all", so it doesn't seem like they have a certain number of seats to fill for stage 2)

In response to comments about BA favouring UK nationals: I counted 13 people present at the assessment and about a third of them were from outside the UK.

[ETflyer]

Bearcat,

I am slightly confused at to what to expect from stage one assessment. There seems to be contradicting information from the email and what appears on the website.

The email says:

Invitation to Stage 1 Assessment which consists of

"4 x written tests:
- Numeracy
- Numerical Reasoning
- Verbal Reasoning
- Combined Maths/Physics

*Pilot Aptitude testing
*Group exercise"

I do not really understand why there are stars next to Pilot Aptitude Testing and Group exercise.

The website says:

"Once your application has been assessed and accepted, you will progress to Phase II of the selection process. Phase II consists of a series of questions that you will be required to answer within a given time. If successful you will progress to Phase III which is a two-day assessment at a venue (soon to be confirmed) in the UK, which includes the following tests:


Mathematics
Physics
Numerical Reasoning
Verbal Reasoning
Pilapt

Hand-Eye co-ordination

Two dimensional tracking
Three dimensional tracking


Cognitive tests

Information processing
Selective attention





Candidates who are successful at this stage will progress on to the next two assessments:

Group Exercise
Competency based interview"



What does the "series of questions" refer to? I have received no information with regards to this and it appears this phase does not exist and everybody is directed straight onto phase 3?

If anybody who applied last year could shed some light on this confusion please that would be great. :confused:

[flying_god]

Some interesting facts stated about Oxford Selection.

I thought there was about 16 on my compass test, 3 groups a day, minimum of 10 days = 480 people. I suspect there is much more than that though if they really want 400 back for 2nd stage.

If you trawl through last years thread on the FPP, someone in the know stated that the pass mark last year was 34. (http://www.pprune.org/interviews-jobs-sponsorship/459243-ba-future-pilot-programme-fpp-merged-36.html)

Outside of the FPP, Oxford state that only 50% of people get above 28 to pass. So I would guess it would be about 34 again. - Not that we know because they don't tell us the score. £ 250 for not much!

[VNAVPTH]

Libertine Winno @naturals

The format for working out aptitude testing scores etc is a closely guarded secret! If you read any forums regarding the FAT's at Cranwell they are exactly the same, and the short answer is that nobody apart from the recruiters actually know.

It is indeed true, however, that there is a 'pass' mark...but in reality this is a competition (as are the FAT's at Cranwell) and as such merely passing is not good enough, you need to pass good enough to be in the top x% of candidates.

As stated, though, what percentage the x actually is depends on all the other candidates, so will not be know until all candidates have taken the tests.

Not much help I know, but in essence it's a futile exercise worrying about it or trying to guess, just do your best and wait!


So you are being charged £250 to be in a lottery. Hmmmmm.

[Stocious]

@SgtBellPepper

You should be absolutely fine. There were people straight out of uni, and even straight out of school on last years scheme with next to no credit history, and they were able to take up the BA option.

[Libertine Winno]

@VNAVPTH

Not a lottery no, as you will be selected if you are among the top x%.

The point is that nobody knows what number that top x% will be, as it is dependent on the overall standard of the rest of the candidates. This is the same way that things like GCSE/A Level grades are worked out, with the 'pass mark' being set only once all the results are known.

All I'm saying is that there is absolutely no point in worrying about it because what the standard was before may be different to what it is this year...and even if it is, then you wont know what it is anyway as none of the FTO's give out scores or feedback!

[Bearcat F8F]

ET flyer, yes I am confused much the same but would probably trust the email better.

Last year the system was different for FTE. All of the assessments were done on one day in one location. They have now split it up into three days.



On another note, we need to bring "copies of your right to work a 37.5 hours week in the UK".

Where might we get this kind of document? I have never heard about this in my life.

[ETflyer]

Bearcat,

What makes you think it has now been split into 3 days?

Did you get the email because there is no suggestion of a 3 day process in the email. It says it will take 6 hours and will contain the written tests and the aptitude tests so I assume the website is wrong? :confused: I think I will ring them.

[Libertine Winno]

@ Bearcat

I would suggest a passport and NI number are all you need!

[Bearcat F8F]

Libertine, thanks. I will double check with them just in case. :ok:

[AndontcallmeShirley]

BBRus-

What is your basis to make this statement?

If I were to be accepted by British Airways, I can assure the last thing I would think about is to get my flight training and TR sponsored by BA and go back to Spain. Actually, I doubt anyone would give up a career in British Airways to start from scratch in another airline in their country of origin.

You would be signing a contract which will contain a clause of permanence.

I just wanted to add something to this post because I feel it needs saying.

To all you 'starry eyed wannabe's' (which I was one myself barely 7 years ago), especially those who would be considering relocating countries to avail themselves of this opportunity...

BA, or most majors for that matter, isn't/aren't bad places to be at all but I assure you after a little while it will just be a job and home is always home.

I work for a far eastern legacy and there are a lot of relatively senior guys I fly with that are on a ton of money (considerably more than I make), who will leave at the drop of a hat when airlines start hiring again in their home country. If you're Spanish, for example, for most Spaniards it would take a hell of a rewarding and well renumerated job in the UK to make up for what you would miss as far as weather/food/culture/friends/family for the long term. It doesnt seem it at the time when you're sat in your first jet and get your first few pay cheques through but after a while most will realise just how much they really miss these things and elect to return home if the right opportunity arises.

You are right to consider seniority and starting again from the bottom, but, hypothetically speaking, if you got your magic wand out now and knew you could get into BA but you would have to do say 7 years before you could leave and also that there would be a strong chance you would want to go to your national airline afterwards but you knew you could go there say, 4 years from today after training and flying a few tin cans for a while. Now tell me which is the better option for the very long term? I know, all very hypothetical but hopefully you see my point. This game can often be '1 step forward, 2 steps back, 5 steps forward' etc etc at times.

And 'signing a contract with a clause of permanence', well what does that even mean? No employer can permanently handcuff you to a place or a job against your will. Well, maybe in North Korea..

Just wanted to offer a different perspective.

[Danny212]

Has anyone been rejected by CTC? So anxious:rolleyes:

[Diffusion]

Applied on the 13th - deadline day - and got invite to Day 1 assessment at Oxford on 19th. There were many interview slots for this week and second week of January but now there's only 9 Jan available.

Contemplating whether or not to find the £250, as I'm pretty certain I won't even make it into the top elite of COMPASS scores. :(

[Ollybolly]

Contemplating whether or not to find the £250, as I'm pretty certain I won't even make it into the top elite of COMPASS scores. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/sowee.gif

Hmmm... may one ask why one applied in the first place then?!? You knew exactly the financial commitment from the first day you read about FPP (or should have done).

Are you happy wasting you own, and other people's time when you're "pretty certain" you won't make it? Or are you happy to pay £250 to find out... some might say that even asking that question now means a whole lot!

Just a thought.

[Bearcat F8F]

Bearcat,

What makes you think it has now been split into 3 days?

Did you get the email because there is no suggestion of a 3 day process in the email. It says it will take 6 hours and will contain the written tests and the aptitude tests (http://www.pprune.org/#) so I assume the website is wrong? http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/confused.gif I think I will ring them.


Sorry, missed your post.

From the email we got:

"If you are successful at the first stage of FTE assessment you will be invited to attend a further interview."

Thus, it is split into more than one day. :ok:

[ETflyer]

Bearcat,

It's ok. My posts dont appear straight away for some strange reason.

Just to let you know, I spoke to FTE and he confirmed that it is a one day process.

All of the tests, including written tests, aptitude tests, one to one interview (which was not mentioned in the email) and the group exercise. If you are successful on this assessment day then there is the final interview with British Airways at Cranebank.

Hope this helps! :ok:

[AndontcallmeShirley]

City Flyer-

With respect, I think you have completely missed my point. London may have all the French people in the world, all the restaurants, same food etc... But its not home and never will be. You can't quite quantify that really; You can't replace home. And 6 years seniority in BA on the 320/737 (or being very junior on a LH fleet) wont allow you much of a life as a commuter. It may work for you, and good luck to you if it does, but most not from the UK will eventually want to work somewhere closer to home, as is human nature. France is probably a bad example as far as my point goes because obviously it's not a long or difficult commute to LHR/LGW but for someone from a rural part of Eastern Europe, for example, they will find it difficult at times and wonder if it is all worth it. I can tell you this as I am doing it myself and I have friends in many airlines in various parts of the world in all manner of ranks/seniority all trying to do the same.

Anyway, I digress...

[FlyingSportsman]

Just a quick heads up for those that may have applied with predicted grades:

I applied, was accepted, booked selection day, but only found out from a friend that I could not attend the selection, and was not contacted by a certain FTO until I called them two days before the assessment.

Find it a little misleading that you can enter predicted grades on the FPP application!

[EZY_FR]

Applied on the 13th - deadline day - and got invite to Day 1 assessment at Oxford on 19th. There were many interview slots for this week and second week of January but now there's only 9 Jan available.

Contemplating whether or not to find the £250, as I'm pretty certain I won't even make it into the top elite of COMPASS scores.
Diffusion- you don't know if you will be in the in the top elite of test scores, no-one does. Compared to what you will have to pay for the course, this is negligible and would be more than happy to pay it. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain from doing it as it would at least give you invaluable practice for future applications.Go for it!

[unluckywannabe]

Hi there :)

Does anyone know if there will definitely be any of those cube folding/rotating tests at the Oxford FTO day 1 assessment? It's not mentioned in the "things to expect" part of the email, which just says that there will be the COMPASS test and then Technical tests. I'm not sure if maybe that's one of the technical tests. Thanks.

[erpeor]

Hi folks,

just wanted to know if anyone has not been contacted yet. I applied and I have not heard from neither the FTO nor BA.

Thanks

[FO_DJ]

Hi all,

Just got back from the first stage testing at OAA this afternoon and thought I would share my two cents with everyone.

I was in a group of myself and around 11-12 other guys (yes, all male) all from different backgrounds. Some out of uni, others in full time jobs etc, and even one who had traveled all the way from Australia. I found the COMPASS test a real mix of easy and challenging obstacles. The hand-eye-foot coordination I struggled with somewhat. Although I did progressively improve, I was struggling at the beginning to keep both dials simultaneously level.

Didn't seem to have too many problems with memory, hand-eye coordination or multi tasking. Spatial coordination, like many others have pointed out is ALL about reading the instructions but I believed I fared well here. I was foolish to stick too long on one question on the maths sections and only completed 18/24 questions. Likewise with the physics I was gave more thought to some of my answers. Although I think I've done alright today I'm worried that it may be just short.

But hey ho, I will never know until January and perhaps I've done better than first thought.

[Flo324]

Hello Fo dj

This is my first post on here.

Thanks for the helpful information. I have the same day at oxford after Christmas - am very nervous as have no flying experience.
Trying to practise but not too sure how!?

I am glad your day went well- sounds like you did good! :)

[theo93]

I have send my application the very last time. The FTO that I have choosen is CTC. Does anyone know when approximately to wait for a response? Thanks in advance.

[chrisjmacdonald]

And still waiting a reply. Given I am Canadian with Dutch passport and hold a PPL in Canada I can only hope for the best. The wait is killing me though.

[FO_DJ]

Hi Flo324,

Good luck with your assessment after Christmas, it isn't as stressful as some make out. I actually enjoyed my day at OAA and I'm sure you will too!

I'm flying for my PPL (under 10 hours only so far) but I really would not worry about having any experience as the FPP is designed for those with little or no flying experience.

In terms of practice I would revise GCSE maths and physics as much as you can. Browse these and the OAA forums for information and advice of the rest of the COMPASS tests.

Good luck with your application.

FO_DJ

[ayau813]

I also applied for CTC and have gotten a response a couple days ago to book an assessment day in January at Dibden Manor. I suspect that you should be getting a response very soon since the first assessment days start around the 2nd week of January I think and ends on 24th January. Good luck :)

[alexonaplane]

topics relevant to aviation or any? For instance Algebra...

[bonation_alias]

I applied and have been successful to get to stage 2, the dreaded assessment stage 1 for BA FPP. Doing it through CTC is quite daunting but I have no clue as to what to prepare for and what they may ask on the day.

Can anyone give advice who have had experience of the group exercises and aptitude test held at Dibden Manor, near Southampton?...

I've got my date of assessment on 08th January and am really nervous so any help or preparation material somebody can point me towards would be really appreciated...
:8

[tylerolo]

Through to the second stage with OAA. Just seen on their forums that the pass rate is 45% which has me worried when I have taken any maths of physics lessons for yeas. I just wonder if I could take my successful online application and postpone the assessment until next years round. I don't want to just throw £250 at a tiny chance.

[SmileyRiley]

For FTE, is the interview om the assessment day - I'm slightly confused as it's not mentioned in the email.

Also, I know someone who's been invited with predicted grades - is this a mistake then?

Thanks

[naturals]

I just wonder if I could take my successful online application and postpone the assessment until next years round.

Unlikely I'd say, given the sheer number of people on here who applied last year and are reapplying this year.

I don't want to just throw £250 at a tiny chance.

Not wishing to sound rude but why did you bother applying? You always knew there would be a skills assessment and that you'd have to pay and that the chances of success are low. "You've got to be in it to win it" springs to mind...

[nholme]

@FO DJ

Thanks for sharing your experiences of the assessment day at OAA. For the numerical reasoning tests were you allowed to use a calculator? Knowing this would help me prepare for this portion of the day.

Thanks in advance

[tylerolo]

Not wishing to sound rude but why did you bother applying? You always knew there would be a skills assessment and that you'd have to pay and that the chances of success are low. "You've got to be in it to win it" springs to mind...

apologies perhaps I didn't explain myself very well. I was of course aware of the fee but I was referring to my ability to catch up to the required maths and physics level before the exam - if I can't do that then my chances are even more narrow and not because of sheer capability so in that sense it would be a waste of £250

[FO_DJ]

You're welcome. Any other info, just PM me.

To answer your question, no calculators are permitted at any stage during the testing. I would practice your mental arithmetic though since this is what took up the majority of my time during the numerical reasoning section.

[v3r]

quite interesting to read through that thread...thx

i finished my application two days before the deadline and still havent had any reply so far. since there are lots of people here that have already gone throught phase 1 i assume that means bad news for me?:confused:

[flying free.LEVC]

I sent my application one month ago and haven´t received any answer yet either, positive nor negative, just the two confirmation emails after sending it.

I am not British, apparently many foreigners haven´t received an answer yet so we still have an opportunity.

[tylerolo]

now I think about it, i'm not sure i'd acquire any significant amount of advantage if I delayed the assessment by a year. I feel with stuff like the compass test it's more of either you've got it or haven't sort of thing.

[bonation_alias]

I did ask this before but seems everybody is more concerned with asking specifics. Having got to stage 2 of BA FPP assessment stage. Would be grateful if anyone could shed some light on what in particular is tested and how it is tested..

i.e. Will calculators be allowed at any stage of the testing?...
What in particular will be tested and in what form?
Is it imperative to have your Class I Medical completed before the assessment or can this be postponed until you've got through the assessments?

Would be grateful if someone could point me in the right place of any preparatory material that is useful in preping for the assessment day...

:confused:

[halpo87]

Have any Irish applicants heard back from any of the FTO's?? I finished my application to FTE on 21st November & haven't heard anything...

[EZY_FR]

According to facebook, CTC are still sending out invites for assessments so don't worry about it!

[Callan]

Yes I'm Irish and I've done my assessment for it.

[Flo324]

Hello everyone.

I wear glasses and I am trying to research if that is okay for being a commercial pilot- from my research I believe it is as long as you can correct your eyes to 20:20 vision using glassess or contact lenses.:8

Can someone please confirm this for me?

[halpo87]

Callan, have you done it for FTE? When did you hear back from them because me & 2 friends haven't heard anything back

[erpeor]

halpo87 I haven't heard anything yet either. I guess we just have to sit down, relax and stop refreshing our email inbox hehe

[513059]

Hi,

At Oxford calculators were not allowed but you didn't need them. There were was no need to use cosine etc.

I would revise basic maths like additions, subtractions, multiplication particularly how to do them fast, you have about 50 seconds per question. There was algebra, you were given a value of x and asked to find the value of y for a given formula.

For the physics, it was again really basic almost pre gcse. Hope I'm not giving too much away when I give an example question I was asked: Does hot air rise or fall ?

Most of the questions in the maths and physics tests didn't require revision more an ability to think logically. For the other tests, its all down to natural ability that I don't believe can be trained for in advance (I used wii ski to practise the slalom, but it was completely different.

No need to get a medical before the tests, unless you have a reason to think you would fail..

Good Luck.

This makes me so cross. Do you want this job or not? I am irritated that any hard work, revision and research I have done for myself with no help is blown out of the water by ill though out posts such as this. This is a competition, and whilst I wish everyone the best of luck why are you giving away info like this to your fellow competitors? If you have any hope in this highly lucrative and extremely improbable endeavour you really need to review this attitude.

[freeflying]

For the eye sight question, as well as 20:20 vision there are three important factors

'If you need correction the refractive error (the amount of correction) must not exceed +5.00 dioptres of long sight or -6.00 dioptres of short sight'

'Astigmatism must not exceed 2.00 dioptres.'

'The difference in correction between each eye (anisometropia) must not be more than 2.00 dioptres'

This is all from Class 1 medical certificate - Flying Academy (http://www.atpl.at/class_1_medical_certificate.php) but I read the same material on the official requirement list too.

hope that helps.

[spider_man]

This makes me so cross. Do you want this job or not? I am irritated that any hard work, revision and research I have done for myself with no help is blown out of the water by ill though out posts such as this. This is a competition

Good luck with your group team work exercise :hmm:

[Trip86]

I have my OAA Assessment coming up but I'm having issues trying to pay the £250 - issues with the website that is...NOT financial issues! :hmm:

Anyone else experiencing problems with the payment site? I've been trying to pay since 21st Dec..Any suggestions? Sadly, OAA are closed! :bored:

[Thomas90]

If your "competition" does not know if hot air rises or falls I don't think you have much to worry about.

[Alex_95]

I applied on the 13th December at midday for CTC wings and haven't heard back (apart from receipt of application). Is that bad news?
I am currently still in sixth form but finish my A-Levels before the 1st July when you have to be 18 by which i will be. Do I stand a chance?

[naturals]

It looks as if the next OAA e-mails are going out as I write.

I just had confirmation that I got through to Day 2! What an great start to 2013!

[Ollybolly]

This makes me so cross. Do you want this job or not? I am irritated that any hard work, revision and research I have done for myself with no help is blown out of the water by ill though out posts such as this. This is a competition, and whilst I wish everyone the best of luck why are you giving away info like this to your fellow competitors? If you have any hope in this highly lucrative and extremely improbable endeavour you really need to review this attitude.

Couldn't agree more. Don't people realise this? It's a competition! Why help your direct competitors and risk them taking your place! If they can't do the research themselves they need to be looking at what they are doing applying in the first place and just how much they want it...:ugh:

[Alex_95]

Has anyone heard back from CTC wings yet? I applied on the 13th December.
Cheers

[abby-mills]

Congrats Naturals! When did you have your assessment?

[tomkins]

"Couldn't agree more. Don't people realise this? It's a competition! Why help your direct competitors and risk them taking your place! If they can't do the research themselves they need to be looking at what they are doing applying in the first place and just how much they want it..."
Get a life guys .......what secret information that is going to spoil your chances , has been given away?

[Danny212]

"Get a life guys .......what secret information that is going to spoil your chances , has been given away?"

I agree with you Tomkins. He told people basic information. Things people should already know such as there will be a basic mental maths test etc.

Anyone been rejected from CTC yet? I haven't received a reply yet...

[unluckywannabe]

Is the maths test timed per question or is it just 1 overall timer for all the questions and you're left to ration it yourself??

[naturals]

Is the maths test timed per question or is it just 1 overall
timer for all the questions and you're left to ration it yourself??


One overall timer at OAA and by god does it move quickly when you're in there!

[naturals]

Congrats Naturals! When did you have your assessment?

Thank you! I sat mine about ten days before Christmas.

[wyc01]

Also got my invitation yesterday to day 2 OAA, see you all on the 14th! :)

And I'm afraid I agree with 513059, this is a competition and although its kind to give information away, you are giving not only yourself a disadvantage but also the applicants who fairly went into the process not knowing what to expect. BA and OAA made a big point that they patrol these forums and giving a question from the test is surely a prime example of what they don't want to see, regardless of its difficulty.

[alexwhk]

Hi Naturals. My congrats for your day 1. When your day 2 is going to be? I did my day 1 on 21st of December - still waiting for reply.

[CeeBee106]

Just got through first selection day at Oxford for the BA FPP,,,,,anyone joining me on 17th for some team exercise and interview action? Look forward to seeing you there!!!

[CeeBee106]

@Alexwhk,,,,mine was on 20th at Oxford and I got the email yesterday. I think I remember the lady saying they would have all results before the end of this week?.....There were alot of candidates though - maybe they need more time!!

[pilot in command]

Anyone heard back from FTE yet? I sent my application away on the 20th of Nov but no word yet. Did everyone make an application to their place of training as well as the BA application form?

[Alex_95]

Any one heard from CTC? When the assessments start etc?

[alexonaplane]

did anyone do the flight simulator exercise for their OAA day 1 assessment, hearing contradictory things on whether it's been left out of this stage?
Got my assessment on the 4th, nerves definitely building now!

[Openwaters]

Alex_95 :- yes, heard back within a few days. Assesments 7/8/9th jan. Unless more have been given out.
Fingers crossed for you.

[fallingwithstyle]

@Alex_95 If you haven't sat your A-Levels yet, you don't meet the minimum education requirements, maybe this is the reason why you have not been contacted. Unfortunately posting the same question 3 times here will not get you your A-levels in time for selection.

[Alex_95]

@fallingwithstyle I though it might be ok because you have to be 18 by the 1st July by which i will have finished my A-Levels. I have been predicted by my school AAA and last year got AAB so to fall to BBC I would have to get CCD this year which is unlikely. Also the flight training doesn't start until the autumn at the earliest by which i will have received my results. So i thought it would be worth applying and hoping they understand this.

[Danny212]

@Alex_95

Unfortunately this isn't the case with the FPP scheme. I should know as I was advised by OAA to do the same thing last year and I was in the same position. BA state that you must have obtained these grades before the time of your application and NOT before a 'possible start date' for the courses. :(
But good luck nonetheless! :)

[funkyt111]

@Alex_95

"Please note that academic qualifications must have been achieved upon submission of application."

This is clearly stated on Oxford Aviation's website. Unfortunately you will not be eligible to apply and will not be invited to assessment. Try next year buddy :ok:

[saqademus]

went for assessment on the 17th. havent heard back yet :(

Have a feeling it didnt go so well..

[Sebas27]

No answer from FTE yet here...:rolleyes:

Submitted my application the day before the closing.

Good luck to those that are doing the assessments already.

[gordonquinn]

I've got a Bsc degree and meet the minimum school grades, also feel like I answered quite well on the questions and have a few hours of flying experience in light aircraft but sadly no reply.

Overall I feel my application was OK but haven't heard anything back yet, is anyone else in a similar position?

Starting to think I didn't make the grade.

[preshair]

Gordonquinn im in exactly the same boat as you in every way. Degree, have 7hrs flying experience, and thought my application and experience was good.

Still not heard anything but CTC did put on their facebook on the 28th of Dec that they were still working through invitations. So lets keep the faith :)

[funkyt111]

Does anybody know approx how many applicants there have been for this BA FPP??

[saqademus]

funkyt111, I heard numbers like 8000 total applicants being thrown around - not sure if true.

[funkyt111]

Hmmmm thats more than last year. I thought it would have been less since the application window was open till the very last date, unlike last year where they closed it early. I wonder how many applicants end up at the final stage.. hmmm :confused:

[gordonquinn]

Just got a rejection email :( gutted, oh well I guess it's just part of going for something so competitive

[Blablabla500]

I presume that after having sat the OAA Day 1 assessment back in early December, and having heard nothing since, I haven't made it through the next stage. Its now nearly 6pm on Friday evening and assuming they shut for the weekend I guess if they wanted me they would have to give you more notice than a week (which is what it will be on Monday for the 14/15th Jan Day 2)

[flying_god]

Interesting debate on competition vs collaboration. My feeling is that BA is looking for people that will point a potential future colleague in the right direction, rather than standing back. I think these traits will become obvious in the personality test, groups exercises and interviews.

Seems some of the people that are against helping got to differing points of selection last year, so absolutely have an advantage knowing the type of tests and questions against us virgins!

Don't give up on OAA yet there are still dates online into the week commencing 21st.. I don't think they told the highest scoring guys and girls first either, I suspect they want some diversity of scores across each day..

As always .. good luck to all. We are all in this together!

[Openwaters]

From what I recall CTC said this is for 72 places but do not quote me on that!