BOURNEMOUTH - 2
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expressflight, by calling the BOH marketing department a 'team' you are giving them undue credit. i believe all the marketing and business development decisions are made from east midlands. i also believe that the only person dedicated to BOH is a PR person there to handle the odd press release and 'crisis' every now and again when a small cessna has issues.
i do agree that it is very difficult to get airlines to the airport and to keep them there. i dont like reading posts like 'just get some airlines in, just get a few routes launched, people are crying out for X,Y,Z'
the airlines do the marketing, the airports do the recruiting.
so many airlines have come and gone it is quite disheartening to see. not many regional airports have had the likes of bmibaby, jet2, airberlin, wizzair, easyjet, aurigny, flybe, ryanair, thomsonfly etc etc. the only issue is that bournemouth seems to do a great job of losing them all.
oh and by the way. BOH is the only airport in the UK and perhaps the world! where two airlines are completely shutting down their operations for 3 months. i dont think you can blame that on the UK economy. Its the bournemouth economy.
i do agree that it is very difficult to get airlines to the airport and to keep them there. i dont like reading posts like 'just get some airlines in, just get a few routes launched, people are crying out for X,Y,Z'
the airlines do the marketing, the airports do the recruiting.
so many airlines have come and gone it is quite disheartening to see. not many regional airports have had the likes of bmibaby, jet2, airberlin, wizzair, easyjet, aurigny, flybe, ryanair, thomsonfly etc etc. the only issue is that bournemouth seems to do a great job of losing them all.
oh and by the way. BOH is the only airport in the UK and perhaps the world! where two airlines are completely shutting down their operations for 3 months. i dont think you can blame that on the UK economy. Its the bournemouth economy.
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Bournemouth catchment is only big enough to support lots of routes when the economy is booming. When people are watching their budgets, as now, it's the first place to suffer, especially in winter. On top of that, marketing is done from east mids etc. However, does anyone seriously think that MAG would spend £45 million and then not try and get airlines in? Who knows what Ryanairs' real reasons are - they've never had problems with their most popular routes in the winter before so there's maybe a political element to 'pulling out' for 3 months.
Anyway, the place will not be 'mothballed' etc - there are many other flying organisations operating. Passenger numbers down - yes dramatically - aircraft movement numbers down - only a few per cent.
Anyway, the place will not be 'mothballed' etc - there are many other flying organisations operating. Passenger numbers down - yes dramatically - aircraft movement numbers down - only a few per cent.
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While everybody is so pessimistic on here about how Bournemouth is going to struggle without Ryanair and Palmair,nobody seems to think that when Ryanair return in January followed by the announcement of the summer schedules around February time, that Bournemouth could see another few routes added, wether its Rome, Barcelona, Hahn, Berlin or wherever, as well as increasing capacity on existing routes. This has been a year where we are still in the recovery period from the recession but next year could be totally different and once again, people will be a little more relaxed.
Who knows, we might be able to see a few new regional routes. Lufthansa cityline serve Newquay and Inverness at around 2x weekly using a 50-seater so why shouldn`t they use Bournemouth. Its possible!but Bournemouth have to do something that makes them more aware to a wider audience because currently, their advertising and marketing job are about as useful as a chocolate fire-guard
Come on Bournemouth, lets hope its a better year next year!
Who knows, we might be able to see a few new regional routes. Lufthansa cityline serve Newquay and Inverness at around 2x weekly using a 50-seater so why shouldn`t they use Bournemouth. Its possible!but Bournemouth have to do something that makes them more aware to a wider audience because currently, their advertising and marketing job are about as useful as a chocolate fire-guard
Come on Bournemouth, lets hope its a better year next year!
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Expressflight
Thankyou for acknowledging my enthusiasm for BOH, and you are indeed correct that my sentiments are heartfelt & not just idle rantings.
However I do not share your view in the last line in your last post.
My main area of concern is for the people who work at BOH, I'm talking about the people who actually carry out the job they are paid to do, with the utmost diligence every day.
Lets wait until Nov/Dec/Jan to arrive, and see how many innocent BOH employees are being laid off, lets also see how many sub-contract employees are being laid off, I suspect quite a few.
How many marketing jobs do you think will go, the people who have obviously not done the job their paid to do?
Who will suffer most as a consequence?
Then lets have a conversation about any injustices being done!!
Thankyou for acknowledging my enthusiasm for BOH, and you are indeed correct that my sentiments are heartfelt & not just idle rantings.
However I do not share your view in the last line in your last post.
My main area of concern is for the people who work at BOH, I'm talking about the people who actually carry out the job they are paid to do, with the utmost diligence every day.
Lets wait until Nov/Dec/Jan to arrive, and see how many innocent BOH employees are being laid off, lets also see how many sub-contract employees are being laid off, I suspect quite a few.
How many marketing jobs do you think will go, the people who have obviously not done the job their paid to do?
Who will suffer most as a consequence?
Then lets have a conversation about any injustices being done!!
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On a serious note
I have been following this forum for over a year now and it amazes me that its the airports that have nothing going for them (Bournemouth, manston, Doncaster Robin Hood etc) that get the most posts.
Its pretty clear now which airports have a future and Bournemouth certainly is not one of them. The only reason that the measly amount of flights it still has are there is because Southampton doesnt have enough stands or the runway is to short, fact. If BAA could just buy the old train works extending the runway and building a second terminal then that really would be the final nail in the coffin. Then that new terminal in Bournemouth could be turned in to a hotel or something. Better than being a ghost town lol.
Its pretty clear now which airports have a future and Bournemouth certainly is not one of them. The only reason that the measly amount of flights it still has are there is because Southampton doesnt have enough stands or the runway is to short, fact. If BAA could just buy the old train works extending the runway and building a second terminal then that really would be the final nail in the coffin. Then that new terminal in Bournemouth could be turned in to a hotel or something. Better than being a ghost town lol.
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The only reason Bournemouth has any flights is because Southampton doesn't have enough stands or a long enough runway, fact. If only BAA could by the old train works, extend the runway and build a second terminal then that really would put Bournemouth out of its misery.
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Teleparty...
I liked your posting, it made me laugh too... I can see the funny side. Actually it would be more efficient to have ONE airport for SOU and BOH - you could turn Boscombe down into that, no? But fate has dealt its hand and as such BOH does has a future catering to the demand that SOU cannot, and that is mid to longer range holiday flights with larger aircraft.
But in all seriousness BOH supports a lot more than just commercial flights. it survived from 1993 after Jersey European pulled out to 1996 when Ryanair stepped in with no scheduled flights at all! (apart from a small blip with euro direct which was a mess). BOH has a catchment that is second only to Bristol in the south west of England. It's larger than EXT, PLH, NQY catchments. One problem: surface access is very poor to BOH.
But in all seriousness BOH supports a lot more than just commercial flights. it survived from 1993 after Jersey European pulled out to 1996 when Ryanair stepped in with no scheduled flights at all! (apart from a small blip with euro direct which was a mess). BOH has a catchment that is second only to Bristol in the south west of England. It's larger than EXT, PLH, NQY catchments. One problem: surface access is very poor to BOH.
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or alternatively, build a decent link to the A338 and re-instate the christchurch to ringwood railway line (already looked at in a feasability study) then close Southampton !
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Better than that, just close all UK Airports and keep the " Beer Swilling-Fish n Chip Eating - Union Jack short wearing - Tatooed Chav's " out of europe altogether.
Or am I being unreasonable ?
No disrespect to the good people of Southampton !
Or am I being unreasonable ?
No disrespect to the good people of Southampton !
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Good idea, certainly can't go to the south of Spain for that reason! Just think its funny that the dead airports like manston, doncaster etc get the most posts on here. Bournemouth is more or less a ghost town and will never ever sustain domestic routes irespective of the size of the aircraft. Flybe's manchester route is just to keep BAA at Southampton in check.
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Teleparty,
This thread maybe about Bournemouth, and without wishing to divert any attention from the topic in hand, I'd just like to take a few moments to point out to you how wrong you are.
In the next 24 hours, Doncaster will handle upwards of 17 inbound flights. The majority of these will be operated by Boeing 737/Airbus A319/320 aircraft capable of carrying twice the load of the Dash 8's (and well over the load of the E195s) that use Southampton. Although, Southampton is a busier airport, it is unfair and frankly a waste of server space to call Doncaster a "dead airport". Equally, Manston is a busy cargo hub and Bournemouth has it's fair share of flights. These airports have plenty going for them. Doncaster for example, has a long runway, hangar space, good location, reasonably good access, new facilities. Manston is accessible from London, the South-East and in some cases Northern France. Bournemouth can capture the markets that Southampton can't handle, such as longer distance flights.
The world does not revolve around Q400 movements. Other things stop airports being dead.
My apologies for the diversion. That is all.
Cpt. Sunshine
This thread maybe about Bournemouth, and without wishing to divert any attention from the topic in hand, I'd just like to take a few moments to point out to you how wrong you are.
In the next 24 hours, Doncaster will handle upwards of 17 inbound flights. The majority of these will be operated by Boeing 737/Airbus A319/320 aircraft capable of carrying twice the load of the Dash 8's (and well over the load of the E195s) that use Southampton. Although, Southampton is a busier airport, it is unfair and frankly a waste of server space to call Doncaster a "dead airport". Equally, Manston is a busy cargo hub and Bournemouth has it's fair share of flights. These airports have plenty going for them. Doncaster for example, has a long runway, hangar space, good location, reasonably good access, new facilities. Manston is accessible from London, the South-East and in some cases Northern France. Bournemouth can capture the markets that Southampton can't handle, such as longer distance flights.
The world does not revolve around Q400 movements. Other things stop airports being dead.
My apologies for the diversion. That is all.
Cpt. Sunshine
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I welcome your point of view cpt sunshine.
Your right these airports do handle flights and on bigger planes but will they be there in november? They serve a purpose but will never have anything other than seasonal traffic that has been politely told where to go by the more sucessful airports.
Bournemouth to Southampton is like Blackpool to Manchester. Its only going to ever handle overflow. Sorry to be all doom and gloom but its just the facts.
Your right these airports do handle flights and on bigger planes but will they be there in november? They serve a purpose but will never have anything other than seasonal traffic that has been politely told where to go by the more sucessful airports.
Bournemouth to Southampton is like Blackpool to Manchester. Its only going to ever handle overflow. Sorry to be all doom and gloom but its just the facts.
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Again going slightly off topic..
I'm sorry but they are NOT fact merely conjecture.
How can an airport with CATIII capabilities, new terminal arrivals on it's way, new radar (i saw it turning!) no doubt Mode S (yet another diverse revenue stream!) be an 'overflow'.
Look around all airports are in decline.
Come the winter when the minimas are exceeded due to the uncategorised ILS of Southampton I'm sure Bournemouth will be busier. That should get Flybe thinking.
If I was a bullish share dealer, I'd buy the shares now because soon they will be rocketing.
Bournemouth to Southampton is like Blackpool to Manchester. Its only going to ever handle overflow. Sorry to be all doom and gloom but its just the facts.
How can an airport with CATIII capabilities, new terminal arrivals on it's way, new radar (i saw it turning!) no doubt Mode S (yet another diverse revenue stream!) be an 'overflow'.
Look around all airports are in decline.
Come the winter when the minimas are exceeded due to the uncategorised ILS of Southampton I'm sure Bournemouth will be busier. That should get Flybe thinking.
If I was a bullish share dealer, I'd buy the shares now because soon they will be rocketing.
but will never have anything other than seasonal traffic that has been politely told where to go by the more sucessful airports.
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Well because its seasonal. Maybe not refused but always treated second best. The sucessful airports concentrate on the domestic and european buiness routes that will have demand all year round with the odd bucket and spade route. The other airports just get what they can. The new terminal etc is hugely impressive but personally I think its as much a white elephent as the milenium dome was. There is no reason to fly to dorset. It has a beach, thats the only thing it has over Southampton. Same with Manston, no one is going to fly to kent. No reason, just fly direct to London. Southampton has the M3 and and a direct train service on its door step to the rest of the country not to mention numerous businesses and industries located near by. Lets not forget the cruise ships either. Who ever is bank rolling Bournemouth is in for a horrible surprise in my opinion.
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Ok I'll bite.
Not 'a beach' but some of the nicest beaches in the country not only at Bournemouth but also Sandbanks and Studland to name just a few.
It also has the 'Jurassic Coast' - a world heritage site and is closer to the New Forest National Park than Eastleigh.
Ok, so the links to BOH are not quite as good as those at Southampton but I really don't understand all the complaints. It is only about 1.5 miles to the A338 and a dual-carriageway link all the way to the M27 via the A31. It is exactly 1 mile from Southampton Airport onto the M27 so not exactly much difference! Also Bristol is doing very nicely with inferior transport links than BOH.
Doesn't Bournemouth/Christchurch/Poole also have numerous businesses and industries? It certainly has numerous language schools.
I do not agree that there is 'no reason to fly to Dorset'. In my opinion, the marketing department for BOH are not doing enough to attract inbound visitors. When I used the Ryanair Prestwick flights in the past there were numerous Scottish families travelling South for their holidays but sadly just not enough to maintain a service on a B738.
The area has a large population of wealthy and retired people looking for flights to destinations other than the usual bucket and spade type holidays, with a better quality service than that offered by Ryanair (I have nothing against Ryanair having used them many times from BOH, with little problem, but I appreciate they do not suit all tastes). I am amazed that Palmair have not managed to develop and grow their market but instead will lose many of their previously loyal customers by cutting winter flights. They seemed ideally placed to benefit from the Ryanair pull-out by putting on extra flights but obviously the volcanic-ash saga has hit them very badly and they cannot afford to take any risks.
But the white elephant that was the Millennium Dome has become the very successful O2 Arena. Hopefully the new terminal will become just as successful in the future.
LT
There is no reason to fly to dorset. It has a beach, thats the only thing it has over Southampton.
It also has the 'Jurassic Coast' - a world heritage site and is closer to the New Forest National Park than Eastleigh.
Southampton has the M3 and and a direct train service on its door step to the rest of the country not to mention numerous businesses and industries located near by.
Doesn't Bournemouth/Christchurch/Poole also have numerous businesses and industries? It certainly has numerous language schools.
I do not agree that there is 'no reason to fly to Dorset'. In my opinion, the marketing department for BOH are not doing enough to attract inbound visitors. When I used the Ryanair Prestwick flights in the past there were numerous Scottish families travelling South for their holidays but sadly just not enough to maintain a service on a B738.
The area has a large population of wealthy and retired people looking for flights to destinations other than the usual bucket and spade type holidays, with a better quality service than that offered by Ryanair (I have nothing against Ryanair having used them many times from BOH, with little problem, but I appreciate they do not suit all tastes). I am amazed that Palmair have not managed to develop and grow their market but instead will lose many of their previously loyal customers by cutting winter flights. They seemed ideally placed to benefit from the Ryanair pull-out by putting on extra flights but obviously the volcanic-ash saga has hit them very badly and they cannot afford to take any risks.
The new terminal etc is hugely impressive but personally I think its as much a white elephent as the milenium dome was.
LT
Last edited by Le Tirer; 1st Sep 2010 at 12:35. Reason: Mismatched quotes
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BOH has far more potential than SOU. I can't understand how SOU's materplan projection of 6m passengers can EVER be realised. BOH's 3m projection is more achievable though depending on the ability of LCC's to grow there.
But lets face it. BOH to PAD and NTE and LMG and all these tiny airports will only be relying on outbound demand from BOH - no wonder they didn't work. By the way it's not load factors that are a problem at BOH its yield.
It would be a perfect time for easyJet to announce 2 based winter aircraft rising to 4 for the summer. Viable Daily flights can be achieved on smaller A319's (156 seats) to main city airports of GLA, EDI, BFS, AMS, NCE, PMI, FCO, BER, SZG etc etc. In the summer FNC, PMI, MAH, VCE, BOD, LIS, ALM etc etc. easy to make a million with no competition on the main routes.
I have no doubt BOH are talking to easyJet but considering EZY got burnt on KRK and GNB (dipping their toe beyond the successful seasonal GVA route) they are probably more skeptical now. It would require a significant incentive from MAG/BOH to get this in place, but if the deal was right they would take it. They have aircraft. They even have ample crew for the winter. BOH certainly has far more going for it than does DONCASTER, DURHAM, NORWICH, BLACKPOOL, EXETER, NEWQUAY or SOUTHAMPTON.
But lets face it. BOH to PAD and NTE and LMG and all these tiny airports will only be relying on outbound demand from BOH - no wonder they didn't work. By the way it's not load factors that are a problem at BOH its yield.
It would be a perfect time for easyJet to announce 2 based winter aircraft rising to 4 for the summer. Viable Daily flights can be achieved on smaller A319's (156 seats) to main city airports of GLA, EDI, BFS, AMS, NCE, PMI, FCO, BER, SZG etc etc. In the summer FNC, PMI, MAH, VCE, BOD, LIS, ALM etc etc. easy to make a million with no competition on the main routes.
I have no doubt BOH are talking to easyJet but considering EZY got burnt on KRK and GNB (dipping their toe beyond the successful seasonal GVA route) they are probably more skeptical now. It would require a significant incentive from MAG/BOH to get this in place, but if the deal was right they would take it. They have aircraft. They even have ample crew for the winter. BOH certainly has far more going for it than does DONCASTER, DURHAM, NORWICH, BLACKPOOL, EXETER, NEWQUAY or SOUTHAMPTON.
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Teleparty
O the arrogance of you Southampton people!! Bournemouth is a nothing town??
Dear o dear. Like our football club which at present is higher than yours in the league!!
Bournemouth/Poole/Christchurch is the largest non industrial conurbation in the UK. Its combined population is larger than Southampton. There are many important companies with large bases here. JP Morgan European HQ, Sunseeker, Liverpool and Victoria, Hamworthy Combustion, Ryvita, RNLI, RIAS, FR Aviation, Lush cosmetics and as has been stated before the largest number of language schools outside London.
The potential is there and surely MAG one day will be able to work long term with an airline to develop routes which will provide both good load factors and good yields.
Whether this is FR/EZY/BE/SZ/LS or someone else...only time will tell.
Dear o dear. Like our football club which at present is higher than yours in the league!!
Bournemouth/Poole/Christchurch is the largest non industrial conurbation in the UK. Its combined population is larger than Southampton. There are many important companies with large bases here. JP Morgan European HQ, Sunseeker, Liverpool and Victoria, Hamworthy Combustion, Ryvita, RNLI, RIAS, FR Aviation, Lush cosmetics and as has been stated before the largest number of language schools outside London.
The potential is there and surely MAG one day will be able to work long term with an airline to develop routes which will provide both good load factors and good yields.
Whether this is FR/EZY/BE/SZ/LS or someone else...only time will tell.
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Le Tirer that is certainly a spirited response. Don't get me wrong Bournemouth is lovely and often think about moving there but you have only proved my point. Bournemouth is a seaside town who's customer base is tourists. Again its seasonal traffic. No airline HAS or is going to put money into making a base at an airport that is dead half the year. Ryanair tried and proved my theory right. Before anyone posts the age old argument that the planes are to big and that most the planes originated from other bases, please realise thats the only way to make money at an airport like Bournemouth. No one is going to pay a decent fair to fly to Bournemouth in the uk or Europe as they can get the train or just fly to spain for the same money. End of story.
Shamrock7seal you are dissolutioned beyond believe, and its likely you only added that last bit to proke an argument. I will answer it simply by asking how many flights Bournemouth has today in comparison to Southampton? How many different destinations? How many based aircraft? I could go on but the fact is one of Europe's biggest regional airlines has its biggest base here and with the recent order Southampton could become a major European player if BAA invests when needed.
Shamrock7seal you are dissolutioned beyond believe, and its likely you only added that last bit to proke an argument. I will answer it simply by asking how many flights Bournemouth has today in comparison to Southampton? How many different destinations? How many based aircraft? I could go on but the fact is one of Europe's biggest regional airlines has its biggest base here and with the recent order Southampton could become a major European player if BAA invests when needed.
BOH to PAD and NTE and LMG and all these tiny airports will only be relying on outbound demand from BOH - no wonder they didn't work
For BOH-PAD the demand was both ways as PAD is the nearest airport in Germany to the main bases for British Forces Germany. However the demand reduced with the reduction in British forces stationed in Germany.