BA Direct Entry Pilot.
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: United Kingdom
Indeed, it is horses for courses.
With regards to BA, I don't reject your claims entirely, but I want to clarify a few things -
1. 50% of time away from home is quite some way from the truth (even for super junior pilots), unless you want to be away that much.
2. There are hundreds of destinations on the BA network, so it's unlikely you'll get bored of the same hotels. Besides, if you are making the most of exploring the world you are hardly staying in the hotel anyway. Getting bored of a city takes some time indeed, let alone hundreds of cities. There are many more than one lifetime's worth of things to enjoy on the network.
3. I would argue that Point 2 above, alongside the fact we can keep our career professionally interesting by changing fleets every 5 years, means that a career at BA is much less likely to become repetitive than at a LoCo.
4. Like you, I am mid thirties with kids. Personally, spending some time away from home enjoying my career, as well as working less hard than in my previous LoCo life, allows me to really enjoy my time with my family as I am healthier and in a better frame of mind. It's personal, but many BA colleagues I talk to share the same point of view.
5. Whilst I wasn't a captain, I still had to absorb a 40% pay cut when I left my LoCo job. So I was in the same boat. It's a tough call, but it's only money. You can't take it with you. I've lost track of the amount of times I've been on a trip thinking that money can't buy the "free" experiences on offer down route.
It's far from perfect, but I love it.
Each to their own, as they say.
With regards to BA, I don't reject your claims entirely, but I want to clarify a few things -
1. 50% of time away from home is quite some way from the truth (even for super junior pilots), unless you want to be away that much.
2. There are hundreds of destinations on the BA network, so it's unlikely you'll get bored of the same hotels. Besides, if you are making the most of exploring the world you are hardly staying in the hotel anyway. Getting bored of a city takes some time indeed, let alone hundreds of cities. There are many more than one lifetime's worth of things to enjoy on the network.
3. I would argue that Point 2 above, alongside the fact we can keep our career professionally interesting by changing fleets every 5 years, means that a career at BA is much less likely to become repetitive than at a LoCo.
4. Like you, I am mid thirties with kids. Personally, spending some time away from home enjoying my career, as well as working less hard than in my previous LoCo life, allows me to really enjoy my time with my family as I am healthier and in a better frame of mind. It's personal, but many BA colleagues I talk to share the same point of view.
5. Whilst I wasn't a captain, I still had to absorb a 40% pay cut when I left my LoCo job. So I was in the same boat. It's a tough call, but it's only money. You can't take it with you. I've lost track of the amount of times I've been on a trip thinking that money can't buy the "free" experiences on offer down route.
It's far from perfect, but I love it.
Each to their own, as they say.
Joined: Feb 2013
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 154
Likes: 7
From: London
There will never be a consensus on this because everyone has their own personal lifestyle preferences and ambitions.
I left easyjet 7 years ago and am now mid 30’s, long haul BA, with a young family at home. Personally I cannot think of anything more fatiguing than flying short haul day trips, especially multiple earlies, and then going home to young children every single day. That has got to be seriously hard work. I go down route and get a couple of good nights kip, see and do things I’d never otherwise get a chance to and when I get home, generally I have a good stretch of time off which is 100% focused on family stuff. If one day my priorities change when the kids are older, I’ll bid back to short haul. That variety and flexibility is one of the biggest advantages of working for BA in my opinion. Whatever fleet you join on, you are not committing yourself to one particular lifestyle forever. And this is where people frequently get obsessed with the wrong thing. A 5 year initial freeze shouldn’t put people off considering the next, in some cases, 30-35 years of their career.
Ultimately though how can anyone say with any confidence that they are happier or less happy than they would have been had they taken a different decision. I haven’t worked as a part time easyjet captain, or in the charter world, or on private jets so I can’t know for sure I wouldn’t be happier doing that. You just make the best call you can at the time based on the most information you can get your hands on. Second guessing it down the line isn’t likely to bring you much happiness.
The fact remains not many people ever leave BA whereas the queue to join is usually around the block. You can’t escape the conclusion that there must be something in that.
EDIT: crossed with the post above which covers some of the same points.
I left easyjet 7 years ago and am now mid 30’s, long haul BA, with a young family at home. Personally I cannot think of anything more fatiguing than flying short haul day trips, especially multiple earlies, and then going home to young children every single day. That has got to be seriously hard work. I go down route and get a couple of good nights kip, see and do things I’d never otherwise get a chance to and when I get home, generally I have a good stretch of time off which is 100% focused on family stuff. If one day my priorities change when the kids are older, I’ll bid back to short haul. That variety and flexibility is one of the biggest advantages of working for BA in my opinion. Whatever fleet you join on, you are not committing yourself to one particular lifestyle forever. And this is where people frequently get obsessed with the wrong thing. A 5 year initial freeze shouldn’t put people off considering the next, in some cases, 30-35 years of their career.
Ultimately though how can anyone say with any confidence that they are happier or less happy than they would have been had they taken a different decision. I haven’t worked as a part time easyjet captain, or in the charter world, or on private jets so I can’t know for sure I wouldn’t be happier doing that. You just make the best call you can at the time based on the most information you can get your hands on. Second guessing it down the line isn’t likely to bring you much happiness.
The fact remains not many people ever leave BA whereas the queue to join is usually around the block. You can’t escape the conclusion that there must be something in that.
EDIT: crossed with the post above which covers some of the same points.
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,226
Likes: 114
From: UK
I agree with the majority there Northern Monkey nice post.
Again though, FO's who go to BA I can see that as a step up. As a Captain who goes to BA, unless you return quickly to your previous employer, after 12 months or so in BA you can no longer claim to have 'acted as a Captain in the last 12 months' and go elsewhere as a Captain. You're now stuck as an FO, and therefore with BA you're in possibly the best place.
I still want to know which LoCo paid EllanVannin over £100k a year as a FO. Running the numbers with BA, I imagine a year one P60 to read in the region of 70k.
Fact is, I still don't know what to do. I've been offered nothing, but am in the pool for Easy DEC and BA. I'm 99% sure I'm going to Easy, but will always wonder what if, if I turn down BA.
Again though, FO's who go to BA I can see that as a step up. As a Captain who goes to BA, unless you return quickly to your previous employer, after 12 months or so in BA you can no longer claim to have 'acted as a Captain in the last 12 months' and go elsewhere as a Captain. You're now stuck as an FO, and therefore with BA you're in possibly the best place.
I still want to know which LoCo paid EllanVannin over £100k a year as a FO. Running the numbers with BA, I imagine a year one P60 to read in the region of 70k.
Fact is, I still don't know what to do. I've been offered nothing, but am in the pool for Easy DEC and BA. I'm 99% sure I'm going to Easy, but will always wonder what if, if I turn down BA.
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: United Kingdom
Hi VJW,
I worked for easyJet Switzerland on a "legacy" contract.
The money was very good, but the lifestyle was pretty brutal. Especially on late shifts. My wife and I used to pass like ships in the night on late shifts. It was my wife who pointed out that I might as well be away from home on a long haul trip, as I was basically absent anyway.
I worked for easyJet Switzerland on a "legacy" contract.
The money was very good, but the lifestyle was pretty brutal. Especially on late shifts. My wife and I used to pass like ships in the night on late shifts. It was my wife who pointed out that I might as well be away from home on a long haul trip, as I was basically absent anyway.
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: London
Rumours from flyertalk forums.....
BA have bought 3 used 77W.....possibly from TAM
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...acker-126.html
Anyone know roughly how many crew BA have per 777? Would that equate to about 40-60 pilots?
BA have bought 3 used 77W.....possibly from TAM
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...acker-126.html
Anyone know roughly how many crew BA have per 777? Would that equate to about 40-60 pilots?
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Well that rumour will at least provide a bit of light relief from the “mine is bigger than your’s ” rumour running elsewhere about BA getting more 380s..(apparently somebody in cabin crew working on a flight got tipped the wink about that deal by somebody v senior in Airbus.......Those sort of conversations happen all the time in Club apparently 
)
Anyhow where was I? 3 more 777Ws....really really like the rumour but it certainly wasn’t doing the rounds when I was at work earlier.
)Anyhow where was I? 3 more 777Ws....really really like the rumour but it certainly wasn’t doing the rounds when I was at work earlier.
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: London
Well there was something online awhile ago about the first bunch of Singapore Airlines A380s....Dr Peters (lease)....rumours were BA was looking at those rewired versions...
Ah here we go, it was on flightglobal
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...pore-a-443294/
Ah here we go, it was on flightglobal
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...pore-a-443294/
Joined: Apr 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 2,647
Likes: 307
From: In front of a computer
Retrojet
Sorry - I wouldn't get your hopes up. These are direct replacements for the 3 oldest 'frames in the fleet which are due to leave over the next couple of years. There was mention of this plan in the Capital markets presentation a few weeks ago...
Would that equate to about 40-60 pilots?
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Problem is whilst there might be a basis in fact ( usually starting with somebody running a feasibility) I think those rumours can become circular...the extra 380 rumour also has been running eslewhere, not just on pprune or flyertalk but there's still nothing concrete. On an in house forum it started last week but in that varient it was triggered by someone claiming he had heard a story from a senior cabin crew member who had served Mr XXX who had told him that , etc etc...
As for specifically the 777W rumour, all I can say is that in all honesty that one wasn't circulating even amongst the BA 777/77W community in the last 24 hours so forgive me if I for one take it with a pinch of salt, at least for now...
That said over the years rumours have always been that BA would take more 777Ws if they could get them, much more so than 380's.... so if you want to go with a rumour I'd go with the 77W one.
( Tin hat on, retires to safe distance........................, and add's rider that with it being BA anything could happen tomorrow..))
Edit to add: ETOPS that belatedly rings a bell and would make a bit more sense - unlike fleet expansion I doubt a one for one (or three for three swap) would raise much comment if/when that happened..
As for specifically the 777W rumour, all I can say is that in all honesty that one wasn't circulating even amongst the BA 777/77W community in the last 24 hours so forgive me if I for one take it with a pinch of salt, at least for now...
That said over the years rumours have always been that BA would take more 777Ws if they could get them, much more so than 380's.... so if you want to go with a rumour I'd go with the 77W one.
( Tin hat on, retires to safe distance........................, and add's rider that with it being BA anything could happen tomorrow..))
Edit to add: ETOPS that belatedly rings a bell and would make a bit more sense - unlike fleet expansion I doubt a one for one (or three for three swap) would raise much comment if/when that happened..
