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Old 6th Jun 2017, 11:45
  #3701 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 744
Wiggy surely it can't be coming as a surprise to people that there will be less roster control under JSS. Regardless of how its been sold, JSS is just a preferencing system, no more, no less. As you're not going to be able to see the lines in advance, it is my understanding that there will be close to zero control like we get now under Bidline. The other problem is that once the union agreements have taken their toll JSS will not function as it is supposed to. We'll end up with Carmen MkII where nobody is happy.
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Old 6th Jun 2017, 23:28
  #3702 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: London,England
Posts: 1,286
Yep, those who voted for it after believing the union hard sell are in for a very nasty shock when they see how much control they have lost and how much the company have gained One of the best rostering systems in the world has been chucked out for a few scraps and Alex Cruz has been handed exactly what he wanted, huge mistake.
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Old 7th Jun 2017, 06:59
  #3703 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,526
Wiggy surely it can't be coming as a surprise to people that there will be less roster control under JSS.
Agree with you and Max, certainly it should be no surprise at all to those who have seen various "innovations" in our scheduling over the years...
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Old 8th Jun 2017, 20:07
  #3704 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: DXB & FL 410
Posts: 922
Emirates profits have nose dived Ethihads investments have all failed loosing them billions and Qatar are just plain mental whereas BA/IAG make money and lots of it
Correct - EK's profit nosedived from 7.7 billion last year to 2.5 Billion this year.

This woeful profit of 2.5 Billion is still 1 Billion more than IAG's. Not bad for a single airline against IAG's many airlines.

Good luck with the applications everybody.
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Old 8th Jun 2017, 20:54
  #3705 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: England
Posts: 1,754
Yeah not bad when you own the friggin oil supply
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Old 8th Jun 2017, 21:52
  #3706 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: My views - Not my employer!
Posts: 989
Craggenmore...

Having just checked those figures, I agree that EK's profit was 2.5 Billion. Just check the currency units though, does make one heck of a difference...
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Old 8th Jun 2017, 23:38
  #3707 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 515
Whoops

Dirham fail. Doh!
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Old 9th Jun 2017, 07:40
  #3708 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 236
An 85% drop in profits is fairly dramatic no matter how you twist it. Considering they have had an airport built for them (actually 2), most of their aircraft gifted to them, no unions, unbelievable amounts of slave labour, cheap oil and no social taxes, frankly there is no excuse for this not being the most profitable airline in the world!

I agree though they produce a good product.
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Old 12th Jun 2017, 16:54
  #3709 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 21
Madness

Originally Posted by RexBanner View Post
Wiggy surely it can't be coming as a surprise to people that there will be less roster control under JSS. Regardless of how its been sold, JSS is just a preferencing system, no more, no less. As you're not going to be able to see the lines in advance, it is my understanding that there will be close to zero control like we get now under Bidline. The other problem is that once the union agreements have taken their toll JSS will not function as it is supposed to. We'll end up with Carmen MkII where nobody is happy.
Ditching Bidline for a preference system is stupid. I would be interested to know the rational behind any decision to do that.
Phil.Capron is offline  
Old 13th Jun 2017, 08:06
  #3710 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 195
Originally Posted by Phil.Capron View Post
Ditching Bidline for a preference system is stupid. I would be interested to know the rational behind any decision to do that.
The rationale was a dipsh*t membership, a convincing BACC and very close ballot results.
It's only the Roster production side. Current Ops processes remain as before. So roster stability still in place.
Right Engine is offline  
Old 13th Jun 2017, 08:42
  #3711 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 339
It's not a preference system.
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Old 13th Jun 2017, 08:57
  #3712 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 744
Jb5000, yes it is. Are we going to be able to see each individual line we are bidding for pre roster release a la Stage 1 of Bidline? The answer is no. So basically JSS is the equivalent of being on a Blind line expressing preferences at Stage 2.
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Old 13th Jun 2017, 12:26
  #3713 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 339
No it's not. You are bidding for specific trips, types of trip and days off.

The system generates many (hundreds of thousands..) of lines that satisfy your criteria and when those junior to you have bid it whittles down your lines until you have one possibility remaining at which point it locks in.

If one bid group can't be satisfied it then moves further down your bid groups until one can be so it's possible to rank your bids in decreasing importance.

It's not a preference system at all. As you might have guessed, I think it'll be way better.
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Old 13th Jun 2017, 13:50
  #3714 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 1,079
That's how preference bidding systems work. You put your top preference in, if you can't get it, it gives you your next preference, and so on.
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Old 13th Jun 2017, 13:55
  #3715 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 339
By that definition stage 1 of current bidline is a preference system then.
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Old 13th Jun 2017, 16:17
  #3716 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 1,079
With the exception that today you can see entire the line of work you want. With this new system you can't. No seeded blind lines either. It also means no one will know what they are doing until 2 weeks before the start of the month, quite different to today. The rules driving the preferences are hidden and given BACCs track record the control of those will cede to the company over the coming years. It all favours BA.

For those who know Carmen, it's a storm heading our way.
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Old 13th Jun 2017, 17:37
  #3717 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Europe
Posts: 123
EK Profits

Originally Posted by Craggenmore View Post
Correct - EK's profit nosedived from 7.7 billion last year to 2.5 Billion this year.

This woeful profit of 2.5 Billion is still 1 Billion more than IAG's. Not bad for a single airline against IAG's many airlines.

Good luck with the applications everybody.
I understand EK profits were just over US$300m from the airline business.


Emirates airline profits plunge 82.5% in past year | UAE News | Al Jazeera
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Old 14th Jun 2017, 07:45
  #3718 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: London
Posts: 96
Originally Posted by no sponsor View Post
It also means no one will know what they are doing until 2 weeks before the start of the month
While personally I'm disappointed to see the end of bidline, I believe the above point to be incorrect. I'll wait for someone who has the actual documents to hand to confirm this but I'm pretty sure one of the benefits of JSS was final rosters published earlier than is the case today.
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Old 14th Jun 2017, 08:04
  #3719 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,526
I'm pretty sure one of the benefits of JSS was final rosters published earlier than is the case today..
As in final final rosters? I think that's the theory, but I wonder if the latest ballot result has put a hole in that for the shorthaulers?

All a far far cry from the days of having the luck/seniority to pick up and see your "full" tripline 4 weeks plus ahead of the month in question, but OTOH no doubt an improvement for Blindline holders who got their rosters relatively at the last minute... so as it stands at the moment definitely a benefit for some.
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Old 14th Jun 2017, 09:14
  #3720 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Button Moon
Posts: 306
Originally Posted by no sponsor View Post
With the exception that today you can see entire the line of work you want. With this new system you can't. No seeded blind lines either. It also means no one will know what they are doing until 2 weeks before the start of the month, quite different to today.
So just as it is for those of us on spending our lives on Blind Lines then! Not so different for many of us.

We're doing Reserve every other month on my fleet and get to find out what we're doing at 8pm the night before for half the year. I voted to keep Bidline and FPA (the loss of which, in combination with becoming a short haul only fleet last year, has been financially devastating) but here we are, democracy has spoken. Apparently.
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