BA Direct Entry Pilot.
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How exactly do you define this? That's a bit disrespectful isn't it?
With regard to the actual process itself. I'm not even knocking the 'aptitude' side of it nor the 'essay questions' - I've passed them twice, they seem to agree with me!
It's just the way BA go about their business, for instance:
This was my experience, twice. And I'm sure there are thousands of guys reading this thread while constantly logging on to the BA website because they received a generic email saying:
"Congrats you got through stage one, pick a date for stage 2, but wait there are no dates, but don't worry we will release them soon, but we can't tell you when, or when you need to check, or how many there will be, so just spend every 10 minutes every day looking, and if you are flying the day we release them, well tough luck but they will be gone by the time you land"
And if you are lucky to be in front of computer on the day, get to stage 2 and pass it, the next email comes:
"Congrats you got through stage two, pick a date for the SIM, but wait there are no slots, but don't worry we will release them soon, but we can't tell you when, or when you need to check, or how many there will be, so just spend every 10 mins every day looking, and if you are flying the day we release them, well tough luck but they will be gone by the time you land"
Wow must really be lucky, I'm at my computer again! Go to the SIM, and get another email:
"Congrats you passed the SIM, we would like to welcome you to BA, but wait, there are no firm jobs for you, because it takes pilots so long to get through our recruitment process, we have to recruit so far in advance we don't actually know our requirements when we open recruitment, we just sort of wing it. But don't worry, there will be a seat for you to fill on one of our fleets soon, can't tell you when though, but should be within the next 12 months, so if you wouldn't mind terribly putting your career on hold while we figure out what's going on that would be great"
12 months later:
"Hi us at BA again, sorry we have not been in touch we've been busy brainstorming, networking, touching base & conferencing ideas about what our recruitment plan is. Our official policy is to make guys do the whole drawn out process again, we have thought about making it a bit more streamlined, however we are BA, this is how we have always done it, and even though it doesn't work, we are gonna do it this way anyway. But we are gonna do you favour, we are gonna extend our policy to 18 months & keep you hanging that little bit longer because we are gentlemanly like that. Be in touch soon, cheerio!"
6 months later :
"Hi, us at BA again! This big recruitment picture is god awfully tough to work out, but we are getting there slowly, however things move quickly in aviation and BA doesn't, so I'm awfully sorry to tell you we have done nothing but waste your time, and we will now pretend we have no record of you, so if we ever do work out this big picture, you will have to go through it all again, but we don't mind, it's been so long since you did the tests, you've probably forgotten all the answers, anyway all the best"
3 months later:
No email from BA, why would they. But a text from a colleague "Mate BA just called, they miscalculated their numbers, I start next week because I didn't get a SIM slot till 3 months after you did so I'm still in the pool and that whole 3 months means I'm still BA material and you are not."
Repeat the above for 100's of pilots.
Now I'm not suggesting BA recruitment do the above on purpose, that's life and you should just pull up your socks and get on with it, and I'm definitely not the only Ppruner with a BA sob story. But I hope it goes someway to showing others why ex-pool Pilots feel frustrated with the process and why there is an overwhelming feeling of more luck than skill needed, above the normal "Well I didn't pass the aptitude test, so they must be stupid" comments.
Last edited by FlyingTinCans; 11th Jul 2014 at 13:16. Reason: Terrible spelling and sentences that didn't make sense
Join Date: Jan 2005
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I concur with Flyingtincans. The whole process can be agony; especially when you push yourself all the way to the top and get cast aside. You then watch pay points change, pilots from another airline get absorbed (a legal requirement) and numerous FPP cadets fill spaces. There is doom and gloom surrounding any future DEP requirements, you are told that you would have to reapply and sit the whole process again, but only if deemed eligible. However BA don't foresee DEP requirements until late 2015; then what? A dozen bus rated guys get offers at the turn of the year and recruitment opens again in the summer! This happens and happens again even though the pilot recruiters appear embarrassed about it when asked. Other people simply walk through with no issue whatsoever. I, however, remain reluctant about putting myself or my family through that episode again. Not sour grapes, just frustration speaking. Plus, at my age, it just wouldn't be worth it anymore.
Join Date: Jun 2011
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You then watch pay points change, pilots from another airline get absorbed (a legal requirement)
If you really want to work for BA go and get yourself a 320 rating rather than whinging about the selection, then you can get a head start - If thats where you want to work.
Join Date: Feb 2008
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If you can pass the rating? Really? Are you trying to somehow suggest that BA's training is so inadequate that professional, experienced pilots regularly fail to convert on to a different type? Spare us the nonsense please. If you've jumped through all the hoops, it's simply not fair to 'wipe the slate clean' and delete the entire hold pool after an arbitrary period of time. It's not the candidates fault BMI got took over and his job offer got delayed.
The people that passed the selection should have had a job offer when there was place for them. Whether it took one, four or five years. That would have been only respectful to people that took the time, effort and energy to go through all that stuff in the first place. It would have only been right to leave it up to the candidate to make the decision whether, after all that time, they should accept a job offer or not.
The people that passed the selection should have had a job offer when there was place for them. Whether it took one, four or five years. That would have been only respectful to people that took the time, effort and energy to go through all that stuff in the first place. It would have only been right to leave it up to the candidate to make the decision whether, after all that time, they should accept a job offer or not.
Join Date: Jun 2011
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Its not the BMI pilots fault he never started with BA !
Im not talking about how good the training is at BA as to if he would pass the TR but as to if he was able to pass the TR. I have known previous colleagues who got into BA but did not pass the 320 TR.
Im not talking about how good the training is at BA as to if he would pass the TR but as to if he was able to pass the TR. I have known previous colleagues who got into BA but did not pass the 320 TR.
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Yesterday I did my assesment and got a positive reply within two hours. Can anyone tell me anything about the personal interview and the group exercise? I would really appreciate any help. Feel free to post it here or send me a private message.
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
Join Date: May 2001
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Recently did the tests and despite 2 weeks of preperation, I felt I performed quite bad. The maths test time pressure was incredible and the paper we had quite tricky compared to the questions mentioned on here (tricky given the time). The first capacity test is the same one that BA have been using for years, which seems to get more and more difficult with age! This time around I got more misses than hits. This is the same test I've passed twice in the past. The second one was enjoyable and relatively easy compared to the first. Verbal Reasoning test I found bearable but I prepared for it quite well. Expecting a negative next week.
Good luck the rest of you. A special thanks to Dornier228 and a-ricky-town.
Good luck the rest of you. A special thanks to Dornier228 and a-ricky-town.
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Balvenie
You obviously didn't bother reading my post properly and took what you wanted from it. Completely misinterpreted by yourself. I take it you must have skipped verbal reasoning on your way into the holy grail?
I have no desire to get myself a 320 rating unless a future employer decides it is necessary. Then it is up to them to provide and in turn up to me to pass. Presently, I no longer have the desire to to be assessed for BA again so in that context I no longer wish to work for them. Due to my age, my current position and many other factors, I no longer feel BA offers what it once did (as stated in my previous post). A lot changes in 3 years.
I never described the pay point change as MY paypoint. It's something that happened after I passed selection and in turn made things a little more unattractive. Neither did I suggest that the bmi pilots shouldn't have been 'tuped' across. I don't get where the anti-bmi sentiment comes from? Yes it contributed to the death of the pool, but business is business and the law surrounding mergers & acquisitions is there to protect. Simply coincidental fate.
Your response was akin to that of a scolded child lashing out at something they had no desire to understand. I merely suggest the process is frustrating and can leave you with zero reward. I'm not the only person to admit this. It is demanding, stressful and costly. It carries quite a bit of emotional baggage. Nothing prepares you for the elation of achieving something well sought after, only to be dropped with little chance of return. You throw the dice, you take the chances. You know a hold pool position isn't a job offer but 100s of other DEPs were hired, so you'll get your chance too; right? Yet there's a million and one variables that you may have to contend with. It isn't straightforward.
You obviously didn't bother reading my post properly and took what you wanted from it. Completely misinterpreted by yourself. I take it you must have skipped verbal reasoning on your way into the holy grail?
I have no desire to get myself a 320 rating unless a future employer decides it is necessary. Then it is up to them to provide and in turn up to me to pass. Presently, I no longer have the desire to to be assessed for BA again so in that context I no longer wish to work for them. Due to my age, my current position and many other factors, I no longer feel BA offers what it once did (as stated in my previous post). A lot changes in 3 years.
I never described the pay point change as MY paypoint. It's something that happened after I passed selection and in turn made things a little more unattractive. Neither did I suggest that the bmi pilots shouldn't have been 'tuped' across. I don't get where the anti-bmi sentiment comes from? Yes it contributed to the death of the pool, but business is business and the law surrounding mergers & acquisitions is there to protect. Simply coincidental fate.
Your response was akin to that of a scolded child lashing out at something they had no desire to understand. I merely suggest the process is frustrating and can leave you with zero reward. I'm not the only person to admit this. It is demanding, stressful and costly. It carries quite a bit of emotional baggage. Nothing prepares you for the elation of achieving something well sought after, only to be dropped with little chance of return. You throw the dice, you take the chances. You know a hold pool position isn't a job offer but 100s of other DEPs were hired, so you'll get your chance too; right? Yet there's a million and one variables that you may have to contend with. It isn't straightforward.
Last edited by Callsign Kilo; 11th Jul 2014 at 23:33.
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Bmi did not have any P2F pilots. Yes they ran a training program but these pilots were not employed by bmi and once their training was complete they had to seek employment elsewhere. The program was stopped in 2010 / early 2011 long before BA took over.
Fair or not the recruitment process is what it is.
Fair or not the recruitment process is what it is.
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So many people on here seem to write bad about airlines and hr departments
This site is to give help and give advice
Does anybody have an idea of what the latest BA tests have in them this month
Can any body write some questions down of what they remember please.
Guys lets all help each other get our dream jobs wherever they are.
Thanks
This site is to give help and give advice
Does anybody have an idea of what the latest BA tests have in them this month
Can any body write some questions down of what they remember please.
Guys lets all help each other get our dream jobs wherever they are.
Thanks
Last edited by unlucky; 12th Jul 2014 at 15:04.
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Bmi did not have any P2F pilots. Yes they ran a training program but these pilots were not employed by bmi and once their training was complete they had to seek employment elsewhere
These the guys that paid £60k+ to Cpt C for a TR and line training? Sounds like P2F to me! If they weren't employed to fly bmi planes, what would you call these pilots?
Didn't BMI then employ some of these folk just a few months before the BA take over? Same guys now flying ba mainline..
The programme was stopped in 2010 / early 2011 long before BA took over
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The point I am making ref the P2F is that no pilot was on a P2F course during or shortly before the take over and then merged into BA under illusion they were an employee when in fact they were P2F. All pilots who were part of the merger were fully employed bmi pilots. Yes bmi ran a P2F scheme for a limited number and a limited time.
Did bmi have ex P2F pilots who then subsequently got employed by bmi later? Yes they did. Some were on the 737 in the mid 90s and are now captains and yes I think 2 possibly 3 of the pilots on the scheme on the airbus gained employment with bmi after serving time at other airlines.
The program stopped end of 2010 very early 2011 but the merger did not get announced till late 2011 and confirmed in April 2012. I think the few your refer to who were taken on months before the merger were DEP and that equates to one very capable pilot. I also don't think the P2F scheme was anything like 60k.
Good luck to them, right place right time and I would suspect hard earned. Either by work or by cash whichever is your viewpoint
Did bmi have ex P2F pilots who then subsequently got employed by bmi later? Yes they did. Some were on the 737 in the mid 90s and are now captains and yes I think 2 possibly 3 of the pilots on the scheme on the airbus gained employment with bmi after serving time at other airlines.
The program stopped end of 2010 very early 2011 but the merger did not get announced till late 2011 and confirmed in April 2012. I think the few your refer to who were taken on months before the merger were DEP and that equates to one very capable pilot. I also don't think the P2F scheme was anything like 60k.
Good luck to them, right place right time and I would suspect hard earned. Either by work or by cash whichever is your viewpoint
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Other people have answered that question for me, so I won't bother repeating what's already been said.
With regard to the actual process itself. I'm not even knocking the 'aptitude' side of it nor the 'essay questions' - I've passed them twice, they seem to agree with me!
It's just the way BA go about their business, for instance:
This was my experience, twice. And I'm sure there are thousands of guys reading this thread while constantly logging on to the BA website because they received a generic email saying:
"Congrats you got through stage one, pick a date for stage 2, but wait there are no dates, but don't worry we will release them soon, but we can't tell you when, or when you need to check, or how many there will be, so just spend every 10 minutes every day looking, and if you are flying the day we release them, well tough luck but they will be gone by the time you land"
And if you are lucky to be in front of computer on the day, get to stage 2 and pass it, the next email comes:
"Congrats you got through stage two, pick a date for the SIM, but wait there are no slots, but don't worry we will release them soon, but we can't tell you when, or when you need to check, or how many there will be, so just spend every 10 mins every day looking, and if you are flying the day we release them, well tough luck but they will be gone by the time you land"
Wow must really be lucky, I'm at my computer again! Go to the SIM, and get another email:
"Congrats you passed the SIM, we would like to welcome you to BA, but wait, there are no firm jobs for you, because it takes pilots so long to get through our recruitment process, we have to recruit so far in advance we don't actually know our requirements when we open recruitment, we just sort of wing it. But don't worry, there will be a seat for you to fill on one of our fleets soon, can't tell you when though, but should be within the next 12 months, so if you wouldn't mind terribly putting your career on hold while we figure out what's going on that would be great"
12 months later:
"Hi us at BA again, sorry we have not been in touch we've been busy brainstorming, networking, touching base & conferencing ideas about what our recruitment plan is. Our official policy is to make guys do the whole drawn out process again, we have thought about making it a bit more streamlined, however we are BA, this is how we have always done it, and even though it doesn't work, we are gonna do it this way anyway. But we are gonna do you favour, we are gonna extend our policy to 18 months & keep you hanging that little bit longer because we are gentlemanly like that. Be in touch soon, cheerio!"
6 months later :
"Hi, us at BA again! This big recruitment picture is god awfully tough to work out, but we are getting there slowly, however things move quickly in aviation and BA doesn't, so I'm awfully sorry to tell you we have done nothing but waste your time, and we will now pretend we have no record of you, so if we ever do work out this big picture, you will have to go through it all again, but we don't mind, it's been so long since you did the tests, you've probably forgotten all the answers, anyway all the best"
3 months later:
No email from BA, why would they. But a text from a colleague "Mate BA just called, they miscalculated their numbers, I start next week because I didn't get a SIM slot till 3 months after you did so I'm still in the pool and that whole 3 months means I'm still BA material and you are not."
Repeat the above for 100's of pilots.
Now I'm not suggesting BA recruitment do the above on purpose, that's life and you should just pull up your socks and get on with it, and I'm definitely not the only Ppruner with a BA sob story. But I hope it goes someway to showing others why ex-pool Pilots feel frustrated with the process and why there is an overwhelming feeling of more luck than skill needed, above the normal "Well I didn't pass the aptitude test, so they must be stupid" comments.
With regard to the actual process itself. I'm not even knocking the 'aptitude' side of it nor the 'essay questions' - I've passed them twice, they seem to agree with me!
It's just the way BA go about their business, for instance:
This was my experience, twice. And I'm sure there are thousands of guys reading this thread while constantly logging on to the BA website because they received a generic email saying:
"Congrats you got through stage one, pick a date for stage 2, but wait there are no dates, but don't worry we will release them soon, but we can't tell you when, or when you need to check, or how many there will be, so just spend every 10 minutes every day looking, and if you are flying the day we release them, well tough luck but they will be gone by the time you land"
And if you are lucky to be in front of computer on the day, get to stage 2 and pass it, the next email comes:
"Congrats you got through stage two, pick a date for the SIM, but wait there are no slots, but don't worry we will release them soon, but we can't tell you when, or when you need to check, or how many there will be, so just spend every 10 mins every day looking, and if you are flying the day we release them, well tough luck but they will be gone by the time you land"
Wow must really be lucky, I'm at my computer again! Go to the SIM, and get another email:
"Congrats you passed the SIM, we would like to welcome you to BA, but wait, there are no firm jobs for you, because it takes pilots so long to get through our recruitment process, we have to recruit so far in advance we don't actually know our requirements when we open recruitment, we just sort of wing it. But don't worry, there will be a seat for you to fill on one of our fleets soon, can't tell you when though, but should be within the next 12 months, so if you wouldn't mind terribly putting your career on hold while we figure out what's going on that would be great"
12 months later:
"Hi us at BA again, sorry we have not been in touch we've been busy brainstorming, networking, touching base & conferencing ideas about what our recruitment plan is. Our official policy is to make guys do the whole drawn out process again, we have thought about making it a bit more streamlined, however we are BA, this is how we have always done it, and even though it doesn't work, we are gonna do it this way anyway. But we are gonna do you favour, we are gonna extend our policy to 18 months & keep you hanging that little bit longer because we are gentlemanly like that. Be in touch soon, cheerio!"
6 months later :
"Hi, us at BA again! This big recruitment picture is god awfully tough to work out, but we are getting there slowly, however things move quickly in aviation and BA doesn't, so I'm awfully sorry to tell you we have done nothing but waste your time, and we will now pretend we have no record of you, so if we ever do work out this big picture, you will have to go through it all again, but we don't mind, it's been so long since you did the tests, you've probably forgotten all the answers, anyway all the best"
3 months later:
No email from BA, why would they. But a text from a colleague "Mate BA just called, they miscalculated their numbers, I start next week because I didn't get a SIM slot till 3 months after you did so I'm still in the pool and that whole 3 months means I'm still BA material and you are not."
Repeat the above for 100's of pilots.
Now I'm not suggesting BA recruitment do the above on purpose, that's life and you should just pull up your socks and get on with it, and I'm definitely not the only Ppruner with a BA sob story. But I hope it goes someway to showing others why ex-pool Pilots feel frustrated with the process and why there is an overwhelming feeling of more luck than skill needed, above the normal "Well I didn't pass the aptitude test, so they must be stupid" comments.
Life takes it's turns and doors open and close but BA recruitment policy and planning does not shower the company in glory!! Not professional or fair or capable or honourable and occasionally quite underhand asking candidates to hush hush to achieve a goal. That attitude wouldn't stand up in their own recruitment process!!
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Life takes it's turns and doors open and close but BA recruitment policy and planning does not shower the company in glory!! Not professional or fair or capable or honourable and occasionally quite underhand asking candidates to hush hush to achieve a goal. That attitude wouldn't stand up in their own recruitment process!!
It reflects BA well 
This is not a criticism of any individual in the recruitment team - nor necessarily the wider BA Mgmt team. But the size of BA, the various departments and processes mean the above experience is typical.
As an example I could try and describe the time and efforts to move one clearly abandoned car from the crew car park (which is over-subscribed as it is). Years this has been going on, and I think it is still there
NOD
.....And as for telling the tale of that (infamous) car, don't try.......if you tell that story to anyone who has never worked for BA "they'd never believe you" (spoken with a Yorkshire accent...
)
If you cannot cope with a seemingly illogical and drawn out recruitment process, then by default it has achieved it's aim It reflects BA well
.....And as for telling the tale of that (infamous) car, don't try.......if you tell that story to anyone who has never worked for BA "they'd never believe you" (spoken with a Yorkshire accent...
)
I was in Munich checking my texts during a turnround and one was a text to contact my wife who said Meadowbank had rung asking if I would coming over from Berlin for an interview. . I'd got one more sector Munich- Tegel so I landed in Berlin and deadheaded on the BA.
I did day 1 at Meadow Bank, and at the close of play, I was told there was an empty slot on day 2 the next day which would save me coming back from Berlin. What was there not to like about that. At the end of Day 2, the Captain and Human remains guy just made things very simple - subject to the medical (the next day) I would get an offer by the weekend and could I give notice to my company straight away. Yes I said, with the offer letter in my hand I would but not until. That was Thursday and the offer arrived on Friday. I was in Cranebank four weeks later and type rated on the Classic about ten weeks after joining. The -400 followed about 12 months later as promised. It seems things have changed a bit since then.
All I can say is get in as soon as possible, no matter on what type, and get on the Seniority List.
I did day 1 at Meadow Bank, and at the close of play, I was told there was an empty slot on day 2 the next day which would save me coming back from Berlin. What was there not to like about that. At the end of Day 2, the Captain and Human remains guy just made things very simple - subject to the medical (the next day) I would get an offer by the weekend and could I give notice to my company straight away. Yes I said, with the offer letter in my hand I would but not until. That was Thursday and the offer arrived on Friday. I was in Cranebank four weeks later and type rated on the Classic about ten weeks after joining. The -400 followed about 12 months later as promised. It seems things have changed a bit since then.
All I can say is get in as soon as possible, no matter on what type, and get on the Seniority List.
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Ahh, the days before online applications, recruitment profiles & automated emails. Much more personal. Imagine having to phone someone to invite them to an interview/assessment! :-)
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NOD it appears I dodged a bullet then!!!!
As one door closed, another opened and so far I appear to be a very lucky boy!
Guaranteed thou, everything will get worse but hopefully more slowly where I am but then again.... Who knows!!
There's a voice that keeps on calling me
Down the road, that's where I'll always be.
Every stop I make, I make a new friend,
Can't stay for long, just turn around and I'm gone again
Maybe tomorrow, I'll want to settle down,
Until tomorrow, I'll just keep moving on.
La la la laaaaaa....
As one door closed, another opened and so far I appear to be a very lucky boy!
Guaranteed thou, everything will get worse but hopefully more slowly where I am but then again.... Who knows!!
There's a voice that keeps on calling me
Down the road, that's where I'll always be.
Every stop I make, I make a new friend,
Can't stay for long, just turn around and I'm gone again
Maybe tomorrow, I'll want to settle down,
Until tomorrow, I'll just keep moving on.
La la la laaaaaa....