PAL Pilot Exodus

[Eight Ball]

Even before I joined this Company I have looked at it with reverence. When I first left Philippine shores in the mid eighties, I stayed abroad for more than a month. Since this is my first time away, I really got terribly homesick. I maintained my connection with my country via San Miguel Beer and PLDT. Until one day while traversing the expressway of this foreign land, I saw the tail of a PAL B747. And I thought then "home is just a planeride away".

okay - I see where you're getting at

If PAL should wish to get back to its former noble pioneering place in the airline industry, it should undergo another rehabilitation.

okay - how ? any suggestions and would management listen ? From what I've gathered so far, they seem to not listen to anyone. They love hearing their own voices.

The Filipino planeriding public will always look at PAL as part of its heritage - an institution close to their hearts.

Of course it is, but part of it seems to reflect a dark side especially to the workers. Just my observation from what I've read here and what I hear from employees and pilots.

I too would want PAL to be the best in the world - but as the saying goes
"how can you soar like an eagle if you work with monkeys ? "

Sorry, didn't mean to be nasty.

[parsifal]

Eagles and monkeys

The eagle may just have to eat the monkey for nutrients, then gather strength, then soar to the sky as it should naturally and normally does.

In the days to come I will come up with a Marshall Plan. In the meantime , it is best to be ponderous this Christmas and try to get some satisfaction in what we still have. This is one good way of blotting out the dark thoughts that inhabit our minds. Careful in what we utter. Words do have a way of coming back to our faces.

God bless us all this Christmas!

[mandaragit]

Kanya-kanya muna

I respect your point of view, Bansai. And you have very profound and valid reasons for harboring ill feeling for LT but not for PAL. That is what matters most to me. LT is not PAL, in the same manner that GMA is not the Philippines.

I had been consumed with ill will and bitterness for the past nine years. I even wished for the collapse of this airline notwithstanding the fact that I am a shareholder. Up to now, I haven't been able to get my equity share in the retirement Fund. I have nothing to show for the years at PAL except memories of the AVRO, F-50 and B-737. But somehow somebody nudged me and reminded me about life moving on. So I did.

PAL is a microcosm of our government and society. Government leaders corrupt our way of life. LT, in the same token, corrupt our attitudes and livelihood. Some Filipinos migrate to other countries in surrender. We, pilots, expatriate ourselves to foreign airlines. It is a picture of defeat. But I cannot see any other options. Maybe if we can be one again....

Kanya-kanya is what LT wanted for us to feel and act. Division. No Union.

I hope we can find some strength to battle our weaknesses in the years to come. Merry Christmas, friend!

[semper fi]

widebody command??

BY 2012 THE AVERAGE AGE OF A WIDEBODY CAPTAIN WILL HAVE GONE DOWN TO 28-30 YEARS OF AGE. SO THEY CAN NOW UPGRADE THEIR EX
AB INITIO/SECOND OFFICERS/MIN. TIME NARROW BODY PILOTS TO THE LEFT SEAT WITHOUT THE PUBLIC BEING ANY WISER.

WHY FLY A 380 WHEN EXPERIENCE NOT REQUIRED?

[mjz]

hey everyone... better watch out...better not cry...better not pout.... am telling you all why... 2008 will be a prosperous year for all of us... lots of opportunities and good offers for all of us.... so, let's all be merry HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYONE !!!!!

[kapalmuks]

Tribute to Peps Lozano

Friends i like to pay tribute to a great man who passed away recently.
He is Peps Lozano, ex-ALPAP president, ex-PAL flt ops VP & ex-B747 chief pilot.
He was a true gentleman & respectable management pilot.
In 1998 during the ALPAP strike he was in mgt & eventually asked to resign because only he had the guts to tell in the mgt meetings in makati the real situation of the pilots. Noone wanted to listen & a PAL lawyer accdg to my information gave him away.
This man Peps Lozano is of a rare breed.
Anybody who had the pleasure of working with him can attest to this.
Mabuhay Captain Lozano!!!!

[Go.ahead]

Round Table Discussion

Heard through the grapevine that 747Capt RP (fitting initials) is going to have a panel with PAL management set for him in Makati regarding his resignation from PAL sometime this week. I do hope these would know what the pilot's situation is, since most of the pilots at PAL really are waiting for the right opportunity to come to them before bolting out and LT aside, I don't want to see this company go down.

I admire him for having the guts to do what he thinks is good for his career.

P.S. He reads this thread.

[planestupid]

All Pinoy Pilots

Any pilot that would like some ideas when it comes to finding work. Please pm me and I will email you some great opportunities. I want to encourgage everyone to think about working abroad. The opportunities for 2008 for working in fantastic workplaces with first class CRM and first class PAY is limitless this year. The shortage of pilots worldwide will be worse than last year and worse again next year.

DON'T GET STUCK IN PAL before the rush is over! You and your FAMILY will regret working for LT. He will be the one to get rich while you retire with nothing. USD10k a month is a normal salary for pilots around the world.

Reasons to leave:
1. Great money
2. Good schedule
3. First class CRM
4. LT will hurt if enough Pilots leave

[kapalmuks]

makati harassment panel?!

i bet you this makati panel will serve as a harassment board for this b747 pilot RP. I think this board interview will not be the objective fact finding body that will like to see what the real situation is with the pilots.
we have a saying in tagalog when translated goes "it is very hard to wake up someone who is pretending to be asleep."
PAL's bottom line is (pun intended) is that labor should be cheap. that is how LT became to be the rich man he is. PAL knows very well that it is economics why pilots are leaving. So what is the makati panel for? they know the reason from the very beginning.
the reality is they do not want to address the issue because LT's philosophy is Filipino labor should be cheap!!
but this b747 capt is worth more than what PAL pays him. this guy has the skill, intellect & the personality to be paid $10,000++ per month.
i bet this makati panel will dwell on what PAL can do to this b747 capt if he pushes thru with his plan of leaving e.g. lawsuits.
RP if you are reading these treads do not fear because you have what it takes to succeed outside of PAL.
let those pilots with lesser skills & ability stay in PAL: they deserve what they get paid.

[planestupid]

10,000 good reasons!

I know 10, 000 good reasons for you to leave PAL. Yes... the name is the good ole GREENBACK!
LT has 5000 good reason for you to stay! (Widebody capts) . He doesn't calls you jeepney drivers for nuttin!

That was me being synical!

Cessna... you seem to have a level head on your shoulders. I agree! We should be encouraging people to seek greener pastures by showing them that it is really is greener on the other side. But people still stay.
After 98 the heart was torn from the PAL pilot. (one could say balls!...not me though) I am sadened that I see our friends suffer with low wages and bad conditions.
Come on guys... applications are free. Nothing to lose.
here is a short list.
Etihad - needs pilots desperately
Emirates needs 500 pilots in next 2 years
Jade Cargo - FO salary over USD10k a month - has 3 brand new 744s on the ground in Shenzhen due to lack of pilots! Remember the brand new car smell? Then think of the RPC8168 and the cigarette smell after Capt H has flown it!

PLEASE TAKE A LOOK... DON'T BE FOOLISH!

[kapalmuks]

c1052: it was a paradoxical statement i was driving at & i do not intend to undermine the abilities of those left behind (not all at the least).
my point is the way they get paid in PAL is deserving of those with lesser skills & abilities.
as plane stupid said: Come on guys... (this is meant for those with good skills...those who have less can settle with the PAL pay.

[kapalmuks]

this is time for the dirty tricks dept of LT business empire again. these american businesses are a headache to El Kapitan Swapang. he is reported to even finance protest rallies by leftist groups in roxas blvd in front of US embassy against purported abuses of American interests. look whose talking.
the pulling out of phil troops in iraq which resulted in the US pulling of some financial support for the phil gov't was a big opportunity for El Kapitan Swapang. he went straight to GMA to be the official go between of the Phil govt & Chinese govt. many dubious contracts like the manila to clark train line were signed immediately following this. the Phil govt is so stupid to believe this greedy man (or they are happy bec money flows everytime he passesby).

[St. Ex]

Off Topic, A340 overshoot at RPLL 06

Early this morning, caused a temporary runway closure. Does anyone have details or has LT's highly efficient media control successfully blocked off any news?

[kurimaw]

A340 overshot?

sir...


i haven't heard that news today...

but i'll try to get some info inside LTP tomorrow..

[bertyboy]

what would be easier, PALAV, CEB, or General aviation for me to become a airline pilot?

[kapalmuks]

bertyboy: there is no easy way to being an airline pilot. it is a lifetime's commitment.
to give you an idea: pal av school-you get into pal. CEB-you work with cebpac, gen av- you can work anywhere but less guarantee of employment as pal-av & ceb-av.
worldwide the demand for pilots will be more & more in the coming years (much much more as it is now) so it is a wise choice career.
but as i mentioned be prepared to commit your life. it is still the most exciting career i know.

[kapalmuks]

bad news of ATO incompetence

US FAA finds RP unsafe port of origin, downgrades rating


By Veronica Uy, Tarra Quismundo
INQUIRER.net, Philippine Daily Inquirer
MANILA, Philippines -- (UPDATE 2) The United States’ Federal Aviation Administration has found the Philippines to be an unsafe port of origin, downgrading the country's rating in its international air safety assessment.
The FAA included the Philippines in a list of 21 countries that failed to “provide safety oversight of its air carrier operators in accordance with the minimum safety oversight standards established by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO).”
In its new Flight Standards Service-International Aviation Safety Assessment (IASA) released January 8, the FAA downgraded the country’s rating from category 1 to category 2.
Countries that fall under category 1 are those which comply with ICAO aviation safety standards, while those that fall under category 2 do not, the FAA said on its website.
"The downgrading means the ATO (Air Transportation Office) has no sufficient qualified personnel and equipment. The FAA also cited that ATO regulations date back to [a law] passed in 1952, which is not updated," said ATO officer-in-charge Danilo Dimagiba.
"But we are rectifying it right now and we have five ICAO experts here to assist the local boys to comply with pending requirements of the FAA. We can [have the downgrade lifted] within the year," added Dimagiba when reached by phone Monday afternoon.
FAA's IASA program assesses "a country's ability, not the individual air carrier, to adhere to international standards and recommended practices for aircraft operations and maintenance."
Aside from the Philippines, Bangladesh, Cote D’Ivoire, Ghana, Guyana, Indonesia, Ukraine, Serbia and Montenegro (formerly Yugoslavia), and Nauru fall under Category 2 -- locally-licensed airlines operating in the US -- in the two-class grouping.
Carriers from these countries will still be allowed to operate in the US at their current levels but under heightened FAA surveillance.
“Expansion or changes in services to the United States by such carriers are not permitted while in category 2, although new services will be permitted if operated using aircraft wet-leased from a duly authorized and properly supervised US carrier or a foreign air carrier from a category 1 country that is authorized to serve the United States using its own aircraft,” the FAA said.
The technical evaluation checks on a country's airworthiness, maintenance, inspection, licensing and certification standards and practices, and looks at whether civil aviation personnel are trained well enough to ensure that all aircraft, airlines, pilots and other airmen that operate in the country comply with international standards.
During a safety audit sometime July last year, the FAA found that the Philippines’ airworthiness below ICAO standards and pilot inspectors lacked training and refreshers, and that there was "no regulatory guidance" for airmen licensure examinations.
Manila International Airport Authority General Manager Alfonso Cusi meanwhile said the rating does not render the Philippine airports unsafe as the assessment does not apply to airport safety and security.
The Philippines was rated ICAO-compliant, or Category 1, in the last FAA assessment in 2002, but it came with a warning that the country might fall short of international standards, Dimagiba said. The country passed in FAA's initial assessment in 1995, but fell to Category 2 shortly after. It regained Category 1 rating in 1997.
Dimagiba said the rating would have no effect on air travel between the Philippines and the US in general, but flights of flag-carrier Philippine Airlines in the US might have to contend with limitations.
FAA regulations provide for limits on US operations of airlines licensed in Category 2 countries. Of Philippine-licensed carriers, only PAL has flights in the US.
"PAL will be affected ... they can no longer have additional flights to the US and whenever their plane lands in the LA (Los Angeles) for instance, there will be an FAA inspection of the aircraft," said Dimagiba.
He said the FAA evaluation would even help ATO push for pending legislation to turn the ATO into an authority, enjoying fiscal autonomy from government. The bill creating a Philippine Civil Aviation Authority is pending in the Senate, Dimagiba said.
When asked how the FAA rating would affect carriers and travellers, Rebecca Thompson, spokesperson of the US embassy in Manila, said the report is directed at the local civil aviation authority, not at the local carriers or the travellers who take the local carriers.
In a phone interview with INQUIRER.net, she confirmed that the FAA rating would limit the expansion of operations of the local carriers from the Philippines in the United States.

[ads1963]

Look here: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=308528

[eight16kreug]

PCAA

"He said the FAA evaluation would even help ATO push for pending legislation to turn the ATO into an authority, enjoying fiscal autonomy from government. The bill creating a Philippine Civil Aviation Authority is pending in the Senate, Dimagiba said."

Watch out! The PCAA chief is going to be none other than Hati Ko if LT has his way.

[St. Ex]

One limitation resulting from the downgrade to Category 2 that Dimagiba failed to mention is that no other new operator may open routes to the U.S. This means that PAL, while being limited to their existing number of flights will remain as the only operator in the Philippines allowed to fly to the U.S. Here's the section that states this limitation:

“Expansion or changes in services to the United States by such carriers are not permitted while in category 2, although new services will be permitted if operated using aircraft wet-leased from a duly authorized and properly supervised US carrier or a foreign air carrier from a category 1 country that is authorized to serve the United States using its own aircraft,” the FAA said.
Under the second group of countries, or those which do not have existing operations to the US at the time of the assessment, their carriers will not be permitted to start service to the US while in category 2 status, the FAA said.


Smells fishy to me. A stroke of genius?

While it seems at first that PAL, being the only local airline with operations to the U.S. are the ones affected by the downgrade, they are now practically guaranteed to have exclusive access to this lucrative route.