Indian Aviation Vacancy Information

[silver-raptor]

What pains me even more is that 75% of Indian CPL holders are foreign trained.

But the govt. hasnt done ANYTHING for the 25% India-trained pilots. Its very sad.

Juz like the govt. is kicking out expatriates, shudnt the INDIAN CPL holders be given a preference.

[silver-raptor]

There are cadet pilot programs all over the net, including this website.

And I am very tempted, if only I had 50 lacks to waste :X.


I juz want a stable career, m 20, m young, I have time on my side.

I am willing to fight my way through. If people have a problem with tht then we cant help it.

[soaring.high]

@ Silver-Raptor,
Well isnt the government doing what it can do? If you might have noticed all the airlines are asking for Indian CPL,RT or FRTO and Indian Class-I medical.Would not you call it giving a preference to Indian licence holders? You decided to stay here in India and train here some others decided to go abroad come back and get their licences converted to Indian CPL or ATPL.Why should you be given preference if you have an Indian CPL and the other aviator who went abroad came back got his licence converted and now has an Indian CPL?Apparently you and him both are at the same level.We all are Indians please dont differentiate between us.Be rest assured no foreign licence holder is going to get a job ahead of Indian Licence holder for the right seat atleast.Its time to unite and stay united.Cheers!!!

[silver-raptor]

I politely disagree.

People who wasted a lot of Indian foreign currency should be given lesser preference in my opinion

[soaring.high]

@ Silver-Raptor,
"Are there no jobs in africa\pacific, where Indians ca get jobs??"
This is what you quoted in a post.Tell me why companies or airliens situated in africa or pacific give you a preference and pay you their currency? If you are willing to work for free even then why the companies situated in africa/pacific hire you ahead of the citizens of their own respective countries who would also probably offer to work for free ?

[shanx]

@Silver-raptor

What pains me even more is that 75% of Indian CPL holders are foreign trained.

But the govt. hasnt done ANYTHING for the 25% India-trained pilots. Its very sad.

Juz like the govt. is kicking out expatriates, shudnt the INDIAN CPL holders be given a preference.

Silver-raptor, while I fully understand your frustration and perhaps exhasperation with the current situation, Im afraid what you've said above can at best be described as naivety.
Again, no offense to you absolutely.

Unfortunately, a lot of people come to terms witht the HARSH REALITIES and vagaries of this industry only AFTER they are already inside the industry and after investing a good fortune.

I do not wish to even start any debate or discussion on flight training standards in Indian flying schools Vs flying schools in the USA, Canada, Australia etc.
It would only result in mindless arguments and mud slinging.

Civil Aviation in India atleast, like politics, fashion/glamor, and the film industry are all CLOSED INDUSTRIES.
That is a fact. Which means Favoritism, Nepotism, "Jugaad" etc are the RULE ... whereas acheivements through hard work, patience, TALENT, MERIT etc are mere EXCEPTIONS.
I know a lot of members in this forum would disagree with this, as each is entitled to his opinion.

Why else do you think almost every pilot (junior or senior) is related to or is a very very good/close friend of a TRI/TRE, Ops Manager, Commander, someone in the Airline's senior management, or some politician or other bigshot ??

The answer is .. because that is EXACTLY the way the industry works, and will always continue to do so. Just like in politics, fashion, film industry, .. heck .. even medicine !
In India almost every Doctor's son or daughter is doctor or surgeon !!!

Now, am I implying that someone outside with no connections with the industry, no pulls, no political friends, no "JUGAAD" can never ever become an airline pilot in India ??
NO! ... BUT ... the chances of such a person getting an airline or corporate pilot job (freshers especially), VERY VERY HEAVILY DEPEND ON THE FOLLOWING :

1. LUCK (UTMOST IMPORTANT)
2. TIMING ... if the industry is booming, you stand an excellent chance .. if not, then there's absolutely NOTHING that you can do to get ahead of the others with jugaad, influence, big money, political connections etc.
(Trust me, I know people with A320 or B737 type ratings and roughly 200 hours on type who are without a job right now .. YET ... some big shot kid with big "jugaad" and just a CPL and 200 hours has easily managed to walk into an airline ... even in not so good times.)

[shanx]

CONTD --

@silver-raptor

But the govt. hasnt done ANYTHING for the 25% India-trained pilots. Its very sad.

I just wanted to write a bit more .. more specifically on that point you made above.

The Government (or DGCA's) job is primarily to act as a REGULATOR.
They are not NGO's or Good Samaritans to ensure that every CPL holder gets placed somewhere or the other.

Again ... a reality check...

There are millions who are hungry, poor and unemployed in India ... the Govt. while trying it's best, has still not been able to provide enough jobs for the unemployed youth who are below poverty line ...it's an extremely uphill task for a govt. heading a country with such a HUGE population ........ WHY ON EARTH WOULD THEY BE BOTHERED ABOUT A MINISCULE PERCENTAGE OF YOUTH IN THIS COUNTRY WHO RISKED OR BURNT, OR FLUSHED DOWN 25-30 LAKH RUPEES ON PILOT TRAINING WITHOUT CONSIDERING ALL THE RISKS AND REALITIES ???

And secondly ..

Airlines, Corporates and Charters etc are PURELY BUSINESS CONCERNS ...

Their sole intention is to GENERATE PROFITS.
They are NOT bothered about generating employment. That is NOT their job or duty. They are just business firms.


Not intending to demotivate or demoralise anyone ... but just thought of writing a little bit of the tip of the iceberg called REALITY.

[soaring.high]

I completely agree with your statement Shanx.Very well said.
And you are right, We should not start a debate over the topic:
"Flying and Training standards in India VS The Rest of the world"

[flyboy_nz]

Silver, I have friends who are in the same position as you. I am sure you do too. How about Instructing? If not, then what about working some where else, not necessarily as a pilot, but working in a call centre? I know it's not the best option, but it will keep you busy and bring in some money.

[A340AM]

Very Nicely countered Shanks!!!that was a very lowly hit by sliver , as a foriegn trained cpl holder im very happy wid my training nd i worked hard for my license nd im very sure the guys training in india also do d same , there r flawed /jugaadu schools evrywer , ( 2 a very high extent in india also), but that doesnt mean u start becoming so naive nd talk such bull****!!!

[optimus.Prime]

@ shanx,
very well said....have you ever tried your hand at being a lawyer?

@ silver-raptor,
As someone said above, lets not try and distinguish between a choice some of us made (flying in india or abroad) and lets not turn this so-far meaningful thread into a free-for-all-verbal-brawl!

As though we haven't encountered enough of difficulties(Read : DGCA) trying to get to where we are now in the first place (Read : Indian CPL Holders), we dont need to distinguish amongst ourselves and emerge out with a new "Shiv Sena for Indian-Trained Commercial Pilots"

[silver-raptor]

I still dont agree, Indian pilots and Indian citizens with foriegn licenses are 2 separate categories.

I believe, sum1 who has converted his CPL shud b put in a category BETWEEN Indian pilots an expats.

[soaring.high]

@ Optimus.Prime,
Nicely framed Optimus "Shiv Sena of India-Trained Commercial Pilots". Cant hold my laugh back!!!
P.S : I hope they (SSOICP-Shiv Sena of India-trained Commercial pilots) are not planning a protest at the venues of up coming DGCA exams!!!

[shanx]

@Optimus.Prime

Bang on ! Although I did not intend to go much deeper into what silver-raptor said, that was precisely what I had in mind ...
This disturbing mindset that we're seeing .. regionalism, "groupism", ...
if nothing else seems to workout, then try to categorize yourself into something which is "supposedly" a MINORITY and then create a ruckus and demand or protest for your "rights".

Some harsh words, Silver-Raptor !! The Indian government is NOT "kicking out" expats.
Expats have not invaded our country and snatched away our (freshers) jobs.

If you want to fight for a change or protest against something, at least make sure it is something reasonable or legitimate.

1. Medicals : A member in this forum had earlier mentioned this. See the number of Indian pilots whose careers have come to a crashing halt or whose dreams have remained dreams because of the ridiculously stringent medical standards.

2. Syllabus of the CPL/ATPL subjects : A lot of archaic and obsolete stuff which needs to be discarded.

3. Validity of the ATPL written exams : What is this magical validity period of 2.5 years ? Wouldnt it be extremely beneficial for the unemployed CPL holders in India right now if we had this system of "Frozen ATPL", like in the EU and certain Middle Eastern countries ?
Especially since we do not have a large GA sector (like in the USA for example), for rookie pilots to build valuable time before they are ready for the biggies.
It would also be an excellent way for unemployed CPL holders to spend some time productively, while waiting for some opportunities to come up in aviation.

4. Examination system : What the heck are we doing in this 21st century with papers, xerox copies, triplicates, attestations ?? And exams for flight crew and AMEs etc being held only 4 times a year ! The unemployed (and employed and aspiring) CPL holders could demand that the DGCA revamp the whole examination and licencing system and bring it at par or on the lines of the FAA. ie. computerized/online exams.

... I could go on and on ...

As one of my instructors told me during IFR training ... "It is very easy to lose your cool and panic, but it requires a calm and composed mind to try and maintain heading and wings level when caught in some cr@ppy weather ! "

[soaring.high]

President Of SSOICP (Shiv Sena Of India-Trained Commercial Pilots) - Silver - Raptor !!

By the way Silver you have not answered to the questions I asked. Either you have not read those questions or you have carefully chosen not to answer them.Some of the questions are as follows(from the previous posts):

"Are there no jobs in africa\pacific, where Indians ca get jobs??"
This is what you(Silver-Raptor) quoted in a post.Tell me why companies or airliens situated in africa or pacific give you a preference and pay you their currency? If you are willing to work for free even then why the companies situated in africa/pacific hire you ahead of the citizens of their own respective countries who would also probably offer to work for free ?
And this is what you quoted in your last post

"I still dont agree, Indian pilots and Indian citizens with foriegn licenses are 2 separate categories.

I believe, sum1 who has converted his CPL shud b put in a category BETWEEN Indian pilots an expats"
Adding one more question relating to your last post.
Would you ask the CAAs of Africa and Pacific to put you somewhere IN BETWEEN local pilots and expats? (U will be converting you licence there thats why)
--> I again request you to not to differentiate between low time CPL holders(Trained in India and Abroad).ITS TIME TO UNITE AND STAY UNITED.Please understand that we are surfing the rough waters.U have your throttles set to Reverse Thrust position while the rest to us have our throttles in full forward position!!! At least bring it to zero thrust position if not forward!!

[silver-raptor]

I believe that local piltos should be given a higher preference compared to outsiders.

[soaring.high]

@Shanx,
Again what you said is bang on target and you deserve an applause. If we want to fight lets fight against the system rather than fighting amongst our selves.
I have a friend who was declared permanently Unfit at the time of Indial Class-I. He has flown for more than 250 hrs and has a foreign CPL.Holds a Class-I medical of that country and is still valid. The civil aviation authority of that country issued him Class-I which means they approve that the person is fit to fly and perform his duties fully and his physical fitness will not restrict him from doing that.How can Indian civil aviation authority decide that the person is not fit to fly when they are also following the ICAO guidelines?(That country also follows ICAO guide lines).
I may be wrong but I believe that the standards of Indian Class-I medical (Civil) are set on Air force Class-I medical bases.Authorities need to realise that what we are going to fly is civil aviation aircraft and not SU-30s or MIRAGE-2000s.No high G meanuvers and no steep banks(exceeding 25 degrees).I hope the authorities understand these facts or we make the authorities understand the fact as soon as possible so that we can save atleast a few careers from getting over prematurely.

[optimus.Prime]

@silver raptor,

I believe that local piltos should be given a higher preference compared to outsiders

.
Though some of us have "Converted" our licenses, after having flown in a "Foreign" country, we haven't been able to get a citizenship from the same!(Though some of us may have tried incredibly hard to accomplish that feat.....if you guys know what I'm saying)
So I guess we are as Local as you!.... Believe it or not!

Also the licenses that have been issued to us by the chaps up in the DGCA, fails to mention if it is a "Converted" License or otherwise!.....So I dont think one can really differentiate...

[soaring.high]

@ Silver Raptor,
Please Define the following :
A . Local Pilots (2 Marks)
B. Outsiders (2 Marks)
I will be able to know if I am a local pilot or an outsider from your definitions.So kindly define those words breifly even though they worth 2 marks!!!

I believe that local piltos should be given a higher preference compared to outsiders.

And if this is what your statement and mentality is..You have no right to ask for a job in Africa/Pacific.

[silent_scream]

Gents ! Cut it out. This is called hijacking the thread.