Cathay Pacific Cadet Pilot Programme
Join Date: Aug 2009
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funny u guys mention this
so many wanna bes and cadets stress over this. - but the truth is, it doesnt matter what fleet u r on as an SO. never handle or fly the plane...
when you are sitting in the cruise...it really doesnt matter...
i guess maybe different fleets have different hand mics....lol
so many wanna bes and cadets stress over this. - but the truth is, it doesnt matter what fleet u r on as an SO. never handle or fly the plane...
when you are sitting in the cruise...it really doesnt matter...
i guess maybe different fleets have different hand mics....lol
Join Date: May 2002
Location: up here, everyone looks like ants!
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It's simple really:
Choose the most irrational conversion from an experience, preference or current fleet perspective...
That's what you'll get.
Expressing an interest in any particular type guarantees it's exclusion.
Want "le grande plastique" to visit dear old mum in YSSY? Faggetaboudit. 777 for you.
B744 to get those YVR flights to polish off your float rating? Bus for you my boy.
Get the idea?
Choose the most irrational conversion from an experience, preference or current fleet perspective...
That's what you'll get.
Expressing an interest in any particular type guarantees it's exclusion.
Want "le grande plastique" to visit dear old mum in YSSY? Faggetaboudit. 777 for you.
B744 to get those YVR flights to polish off your float rating? Bus for you my boy.
Get the idea?
Join Date: Jul 2011
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US pilot
I have 1800 tt and 200 multi and have a few questions if anyone can help to clarify. I have a US-NY interview in AUG 2011.
1)Will my CX SO time will be recognized in the US or other countries if for some unfortunate reason I am furloughed or have a family emergency and need to leave CX before I receive a type rating?
2) At what level do you get typed, Jr FO or FO?
Also, as for the 6 year training contract/loan. Some posts mention a 3 month notice is acceptable as a way out. Which is accurate or was this a practice they allowed before 2011?
Finally, does CX do a credit check like some govt contract us carriers (fed ex). I had a bankruptcy 6 years ago and there are some companies that cant hire me as a result within 7-10 years of filing.
1)Will my CX SO time will be recognized in the US or other countries if for some unfortunate reason I am furloughed or have a family emergency and need to leave CX before I receive a type rating?
2) At what level do you get typed, Jr FO or FO?
Also, as for the 6 year training contract/loan. Some posts mention a 3 month notice is acceptable as a way out. Which is accurate or was this a practice they allowed before 2011?
Finally, does CX do a credit check like some govt contract us carriers (fed ex). I had a bankruptcy 6 years ago and there are some companies that cant hire me as a result within 7-10 years of filing.
Join Date: May 2003
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Love the utter BS on this forum by CX pilots.
1) the P2X is all of a P1 command type rating except for the circuits at the end, and you can have that accepted as a P1 rating on your licence in some countries, Australia for instance.
2) Agreed you never get a sector but you are in the sim at least every second month and would therefore get more sectors/landings than the majority of Relief Commanders on the 744 or 777 fleets.
3) It's not cool to accept this icadet job on it's reduced COS but it's OK to work on G days for 2.5% or take a Freighter Command that gets you left seat on a 744 for 60% what the company would be paying a pax skipper to do the job.
Oh yeah, thats completely different................
Kettle pot black
1) the P2X is all of a P1 command type rating except for the circuits at the end, and you can have that accepted as a P1 rating on your licence in some countries, Australia for instance.
2) Agreed you never get a sector but you are in the sim at least every second month and would therefore get more sectors/landings than the majority of Relief Commanders on the 744 or 777 fleets.
3) It's not cool to accept this icadet job on it's reduced COS but it's OK to work on G days for 2.5% or take a Freighter Command that gets you left seat on a 744 for 60% what the company would be paying a pax skipper to do the job.
Oh yeah, thats completely different................
Kettle pot black
stillalbatross,
It seems the utter BS is coming from you after your last post.
A P2X rating is not accepted as a P1 endorsement in Australia and never has been.
Previously (up until approx. 18 months ago) a P2X rating could be transferred to an Australian license as a P2 rating (ie. co-pilot). I have been told that CASA will no longer accept a P2X to transfer to Australian licenses. I am unsure of the rest of the world but I would guess as it is a simulator only rating, no licensing authority would accept it.
Many of the releif commanders on the 777 and 747 stay quite current. I rarely ever see any that are uncurrent due to the large amount of regional sectors available on the 777, and many shorter freighter sectors available to 747 guys.
If you think it is better to be in the simulator conducting circuits, against doing an actual sector in the real aircraft, then maybe it would be better for you to stay home full time playing MS Flight sim.
The package for iCadet is not very good at all, so you are correct in the first part of your statement.
It is not OK to work on G days ( I never have and never will ).
Freighter commands are no longer available and all commands are now in seniority. The pay rate was approx. 80% of what a pax captain would earn.
If you wish to pontificate about CX pilots or others on a forum, make sure you know the facts and not just spew drivel and lies.
It seems the utter BS is coming from you after your last post.
1) the P2X is all of a P1 command type rating except for the circuits at the end, and you can have that accepted as a P1 rating on your licence in some countries, Australia for instance.
Previously (up until approx. 18 months ago) a P2X rating could be transferred to an Australian license as a P2 rating (ie. co-pilot). I have been told that CASA will no longer accept a P2X to transfer to Australian licenses. I am unsure of the rest of the world but I would guess as it is a simulator only rating, no licensing authority would accept it.
2) Agreed you never get a sector but you are in the sim at least every second month and would therefore get more sectors/landings than the majority of Relief Commanders on the 744 or 777 fleets.
If you think it is better to be in the simulator conducting circuits, against doing an actual sector in the real aircraft, then maybe it would be better for you to stay home full time playing MS Flight sim.
3) It's not cool to accept this icadet job on it's reduced COS but it's OK to work on G days for 2.5% or take a Freighter Command that gets you left seat on a 744 for 60% what the company would be paying a pax skipper to do the job.
It is not OK to work on G days ( I never have and never will ).
Freighter commands are no longer available and all commands are now in seniority. The pay rate was approx. 80% of what a pax captain would earn.
If you wish to pontificate about CX pilots or others on a forum, make sure you know the facts and not just spew drivel and lies.
Forward CofG
I was actually informed by CASA Canberra office in 2003 when my job security at CX looked fragile due to SARS that my HK P2X rating couldn’t be converted to an Aus P2 rating. I don’t know where “stillalbatross” has got his info from but it is wrong and I suggest he contact CASA for the facts. As for the US, they don’t have P2 ratings. You are either rated i.e. P1 or you aren’t. A P2X doesn’t qualify you for a P1 rating on a US licence. You can though be non-rated and act as a co-pilot on US registered aircraft.
I was actually informed by CASA Canberra office in 2003 when my job security at CX looked fragile due to SARS that my HK P2X rating couldn’t be converted to an Aus P2 rating. I don’t know where “stillalbatross” has got his info from but it is wrong and I suggest he contact CASA for the facts. As for the US, they don’t have P2 ratings. You are either rated i.e. P1 or you aren’t. A P2X doesn’t qualify you for a P1 rating on a US licence. You can though be non-rated and act as a co-pilot on US registered aircraft.
Join Date: Jul 2011
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heard a lot of negative about CX.
But as somebody who has actually experienced furlough first hand ,coming from good ol US of A, not a surprise, I can tell that there is no package out there that can compensate for job stability. And that's one thing cx has, at least so far so good.
But as somebody who has actually experienced furlough first hand ,coming from good ol US of A, not a surprise, I can tell that there is no package out there that can compensate for job stability. And that's one thing cx has, at least so far so good.
Forward CofG & 404 Titan
CASA should not distinguish between "P1/P2" ratings obtained overseas, they are all classified as "overseas aeroplane endorsement" under CAO 40.1.0 Paragraph 6.9.
CASA does not have a 528 for an endorsement, it has a syllabus of training as per 40.1.0 Appendix 3. Any type rating in HKG covers all the syllabus items for the issue of a command endorsement in Australia. When converting an endorsement, if you put a little more effort in an comply with CAO 40.1.0 para 7.2.3 (ca), i.e. training records, how they are at least equivalent to 40.1.0 Appendix 3, and a copy of the CX AOC, and contact information (email address) of how this can be verified, you can get a full command endorsement.
The difference between a P1/P2/P2X ratings in HKG is not in the training, it is what is done in the 528 test. The P1/P2 rating have a base training component, Australia does not require any base training for the issue of an endorsement. If all the training is covered in a simulator, that is satisfactory for CASA.
I would dare say the reason for your rejection is the question being asked, and the information being presented, and not knowing the rules yourself.
Dangerman12
Yes, it is recognised by ICAO as co-pilot time.
Edit : Fixed CAO Paragraph referance to CAO 40.1.0 para 7.2.3 (ca)
CASA should not distinguish between "P1/P2" ratings obtained overseas, they are all classified as "overseas aeroplane endorsement" under CAO 40.1.0 Paragraph 6.9.
CASA does not have a 528 for an endorsement, it has a syllabus of training as per 40.1.0 Appendix 3. Any type rating in HKG covers all the syllabus items for the issue of a command endorsement in Australia. When converting an endorsement, if you put a little more effort in an comply with CAO 40.1.0 para 7.2.3 (ca), i.e. training records, how they are at least equivalent to 40.1.0 Appendix 3, and a copy of the CX AOC, and contact information (email address) of how this can be verified, you can get a full command endorsement.
The difference between a P1/P2/P2X ratings in HKG is not in the training, it is what is done in the 528 test. The P1/P2 rating have a base training component, Australia does not require any base training for the issue of an endorsement. If all the training is covered in a simulator, that is satisfactory for CASA.
I would dare say the reason for your rejection is the question being asked, and the information being presented, and not knowing the rules yourself.
Dangerman12
Yes, it is recognised by ICAO as co-pilot time.
Edit : Fixed CAO Paragraph referance to CAO 40.1.0 para 7.2.3 (ca)
Last edited by swh; 24th Jul 2011 at 08:35.
swh
here is a link from CASA licensing section. It is for overseas aircraft endorsements.
http://www.casa.gov.au/wcmswr/_asset...ndorsement.pdf
If you look under the section for Group/Class Endorsements you can see an applicant needs to have command time or have completed a proficiency check.
Otherwise a Co-pilot (P2) endorsement is provided.
I was told by a friend who recently tried having his P2X rating transferred to his license that CASA will no longer allow this, although CASA's website does not specify any info on a rule change (that I can find).
here is a link from CASA licensing section. It is for overseas aircraft endorsements.
http://www.casa.gov.au/wcmswr/_asset...ndorsement.pdf
If you look under the section for Group/Class Endorsements you can see an applicant needs to have command time or have completed a proficiency check.
Otherwise a Co-pilot (P2) endorsement is provided.
I was told by a friend who recently tried having his P2X rating transferred to his license that CASA will no longer allow this, although CASA's website does not specify any info on a rule change (that I can find).
swh
I actually did provide a copy of my training records/syllabus and the HKCAD test form but was informed by CASA in 2003 that the HK P2X isn’t a recognised rating and therefore isn’t transferable. I am more than familiar with CAO 40.1.0 par 6.4 having been a CFI/ATO with testing approvals to CPL and MEIFR with a previous employer. Maybe CASA were wrong but they unfortunately had the last word and weren’t budging in their decision at the time. Once I had a P1 rating though six months later it wasn’t an issue.
I actually did provide a copy of my training records/syllabus and the HKCAD test form but was informed by CASA in 2003 that the HK P2X isn’t a recognised rating and therefore isn’t transferable. I am more than familiar with CAO 40.1.0 par 6.4 having been a CFI/ATO with testing approvals to CPL and MEIFR with a previous employer. Maybe CASA were wrong but they unfortunately had the last word and weren’t budging in their decision at the time. Once I had a P1 rating though six months later it wasn’t an issue.
Forward CofG
There is a subtle difference. That document is for the conversion of a rating to the equivalent Australian endorsement.
from CAO 40.1.0 para 7.2.3
"(c) the person seeking the endorsement must hold an overseas aeroplane endorsement that CASA is satisfied is at least equivalent to the class endorsement sought;"
The process I outlined is for the issue of an Australian endorsement on the basis of training conducted overseas. This would be like going to Alteon overseas to do the training and have the endorsement issued in Australia, except in this case, CX is the TRTO.
"(ca) the person seeking the endorsement must give to CASA the following:
(i) documents from the training provider that show that he or she has completed all the training and testing required for the issue of an overseas aeroplane endorsement that CASA is satisfied is at least equivalent to the class endorsement sought;
(ii) documents from the relevant authority that show that the organisation or individual who conducted the training was approved by the authority at the time of the training and assessment for the issue of the overseas endorsement;
(iii) information that will enable CASA to verify the documents provided;"
That is how I had two of my overseas endorsements put onto my Australian licence. CASA has different requirements for the issue of an endorsement than some other overseas contracting states, as long as you have completed the recognised training that CASA requires in CAO 40.1, and have it documented, and that can be verified, no reason why CASA will not issue the rating.
You just need to know what you are asking for, and what information to provide. If you go in with you overseas licence only, the process of para (c) needs to be followed.
404,
I did not give them my licence, just the training records. I was able to demonstrate that the training met the requirements of CAO 40.1. FYI a number of the sim instructors have also been able to do the same for rating they do have on a HKG licence, some do not even have a HKG licence.
There is a subtle difference. That document is for the conversion of a rating to the equivalent Australian endorsement.
from CAO 40.1.0 para 7.2.3
"(c) the person seeking the endorsement must hold an overseas aeroplane endorsement that CASA is satisfied is at least equivalent to the class endorsement sought;"
The process I outlined is for the issue of an Australian endorsement on the basis of training conducted overseas. This would be like going to Alteon overseas to do the training and have the endorsement issued in Australia, except in this case, CX is the TRTO.
"(ca) the person seeking the endorsement must give to CASA the following:
(i) documents from the training provider that show that he or she has completed all the training and testing required for the issue of an overseas aeroplane endorsement that CASA is satisfied is at least equivalent to the class endorsement sought;
(ii) documents from the relevant authority that show that the organisation or individual who conducted the training was approved by the authority at the time of the training and assessment for the issue of the overseas endorsement;
(iii) information that will enable CASA to verify the documents provided;"
That is how I had two of my overseas endorsements put onto my Australian licence. CASA has different requirements for the issue of an endorsement than some other overseas contracting states, as long as you have completed the recognised training that CASA requires in CAO 40.1, and have it documented, and that can be verified, no reason why CASA will not issue the rating.
You just need to know what you are asking for, and what information to provide. If you go in with you overseas licence only, the process of para (c) needs to be followed.
404,
I did not give them my licence, just the training records. I was able to demonstrate that the training met the requirements of CAO 40.1. FYI a number of the sim instructors have also been able to do the same for rating they do have on a HKG licence, some do not even have a HKG licence.
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Dangerman:
That is for the issue of a HK ATPL, they count them as half rate. I am pretty sure no where else does and certain that the UK (JAA) do not count any of them. I investigated unfreezing a JAA ATPL but was told I do not have the multi crew hours required as the P2X rating is not recognized so any hours flown using it are not valid.
That is for the issue of a HK ATPL, they count them as half rate. I am pretty sure no where else does and certain that the UK (JAA) do not count any of them. I investigated unfreezing a JAA ATPL but was told I do not have the multi crew hours required as the P2X rating is not recognized so any hours flown using it are not valid.
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Fwd CofG,
So you've never seen TL on a 777 roster? Never gone 60 days before getting a sector? When the next ER turns up will that make the ratio of longhaul to shorthaul on the fleet increase or decrease? Are we short of RQ on the fleet due increasing longhaul or way overmanned?
Not sure about 2011 but from memory plenty of guys in 2001-02 sent all their type rating info to CASA and got a P1 for their troubles. Long and drawn out process but it was endorsed on their licence.
I'm not saying the sim is better, just that the amount of time in the front seat for take off and landing may not be as different as some make out. Plenty of guys have done max 16 sectors a year while RQ on the 744, 777 will head the same way.
All commands are now in seniority but you gave up some incremental rises as a result. Brilliant. And 20% less? Only? You are happy with up to 20% less money for the same job? This will help our COS go in which direction?
Did you ask an A scaler about your package before you joined (if you're not an A scaler), would he have said the money's ****e, don't take it?
if you're a B scaler on here you have no right to slag off the new joiners on C scale, you did exactly the same thing.
Who in their right mind would join without a travel allowance? B scale
Who in their right mind would join without the P fund indexed? B scale
Need I go on? Guys join knowing what they are getting, let them be.
So you've never seen TL on a 777 roster? Never gone 60 days before getting a sector? When the next ER turns up will that make the ratio of longhaul to shorthaul on the fleet increase or decrease? Are we short of RQ on the fleet due increasing longhaul or way overmanned?
Not sure about 2011 but from memory plenty of guys in 2001-02 sent all their type rating info to CASA and got a P1 for their troubles. Long and drawn out process but it was endorsed on their licence.
I'm not saying the sim is better, just that the amount of time in the front seat for take off and landing may not be as different as some make out. Plenty of guys have done max 16 sectors a year while RQ on the 744, 777 will head the same way.
All commands are now in seniority but you gave up some incremental rises as a result. Brilliant. And 20% less? Only? You are happy with up to 20% less money for the same job? This will help our COS go in which direction?
Did you ask an A scaler about your package before you joined (if you're not an A scaler), would he have said the money's ****e, don't take it?
if you're a B scaler on here you have no right to slag off the new joiners on C scale, you did exactly the same thing.
Who in their right mind would join without a travel allowance? B scale
Who in their right mind would join without the P fund indexed? B scale
Need I go on? Guys join knowing what they are getting, let them be.
Join Date: Jul 2000
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Years ago I got a P2 rating from CASA but it stated.
I was just trying it on to see what happened was a waste of money, I'm surprised CASA doesn't do the same thing just to collect the cash.
Perhaps since JM aka TSS
got there he sees P2X for what it really is.
May not be at the controls for takeoff or landing
Perhaps since JM aka TSS
got there he sees P2X for what it really is.
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?? :confused:
ok does the hongg kong pilot licenses works in the other country? if i am the first officers of cathy ok and i want to go to the air quantas or the etihad airlines or the air emirates or the british airlines is the hong kong pilott licenses works in these airlines? ok thanks
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yeass it vorks man, u fly da 777 solo first go and when u roll on da runway u go put da full powa and then u fly in the air like a car with wings.
But maybe over seas coz u have da hongg kong pilot licences maybe u get direct captain man, no poofy copilot in there
But maybe over seas coz u have da hongg kong pilot licences maybe u get direct captain man, no poofy copilot in there