BA CC industrial relations (current airline staff only)
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10,000 members at £16 per month per member = £160,000 per month
£160,000 per month x 12 = £1,920,000 per annum
10,000 may be on the high side now but £16 per month is accurate.
I was being conservative at £1.5million income
£160,000 per month x 12 = £1,920,000 per annum
10,000 may be on the high side now but £16 per month is accurate.
I was being conservative at £1.5million income
Last edited by Rover90; 20th Feb 2011 at 23:30.
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It is my understanding that a branch can claim an amount of member subs. The last time I spoke to an officer on this, the figure was 5% of subs. However, I can't see it in the Unite rulebook, which just says a proportion.
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Does this mean that the Cabin Crew pay in almost £2,000,000, which goes straight to Unite, then if BASSA want any money they have to ask Unite and the most they can get is £100,000?
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Litebulbs I have the utmost respect for you and feel that you have much to bring to this issue.
BASSA collect £1.5million+ in subs from circa 10,000 members
A fixed proportion of the individual members subs are passed on to UNITE and also to their political fund, unless the member has opted out of this. There is no clear indication as to how much BASSA retains and that is something that needs clarifying. I think that the General Secretary of BASSA personally retains the 5% but the branch finances are more difficult to delve into due to a complete lack of verified accounts.
I do think that members are entitled to more detail of where their subs are going and how they are being applied.
BASSA collect £1.5million+ in subs from circa 10,000 members
A fixed proportion of the individual members subs are passed on to UNITE and also to their political fund, unless the member has opted out of this. There is no clear indication as to how much BASSA retains and that is something that needs clarifying. I think that the General Secretary of BASSA personally retains the 5% but the branch finances are more difficult to delve into due to a complete lack of verified accounts.
I do think that members are entitled to more detail of where their subs are going and how they are being applied.
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I really am on a hiding to nothing in this discussion. The only way my position could possibly win is if not one penny is paid to any Bassa official for anything. If it turns out it is £100 or £100000, there will still be those that will question the figure.
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Rover
I will leave that job to others with a bigger agenda. If the Bassa membership and the relevant Unite officers are happy with the situation, then that is up to them. I get good value for my subscription. I hope that the Bassa members feel the same way.
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Litebulbs
I will leave that job to others with a bigger agenda. If the Bassa membership and the relevant Unite officers are happy with the situation, then that is up to them. I get good value for my subscription. I hope that the Bassa members feel the same way.
Whilst I'm not a (former or present) BASSA member, I would want full accountability for my subscription, particularly given (IMHO) the autocratic and self serving actions of Mr Holley and Miss Malone.
Given that it is a legal requirement to produce audited accounts on demand to BASSA members, surely it's best to now just get the facts out in the open and let members see them for themselves, as is their right? I wouldn't describe this as a witch hunt, more a demand for clarity from an organisation that has rather earned a reputation for being shambolic and reckless with the interests of it's members.
I totally respect your view of BASSA Litebulbs, and a review of the accounts will give you the evidence to maintain or modify that view. If BASSA are found to have acted responsibly and within the law, then you can proceed with confidence. If there is any evidence that BASSA have been reckless or even dishonest with your money, then surely you would want to know?
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Litebulbs
You've hit the nail on the head!
The Bassa members are happy because they have no knowledge of how their money is being used and probably assume there is a huge fund built up to wage war on their behalfs.
The Bassa officers are happy either because they love their roles and get immense satisfaction fighting BA on behalf of their members or because they are being looked after very well financially.
If the Branch accounts were made openly available, there would remain no doubts about how the members money is being spent.
No one would worry if union officials took a "fair" payment for the time they actually spend on Union business or if they were reimbursed for justified "out of pocket expenses" incurred. Likewise there could be no suspicions that anything underhand was going on.
A continued silence can only provoke and amplify the doubts many are having. Irrespective of what Bassa are legally required to do regarding requests for accounting information, now is the time that a fearless union should publish the figures to stop the questions.
All the while that doubt hangs over the unions probiety, the membership will leak away and will distract people from understanding exactly what is the Union are protecting its members from. Frankly, I doubt many people have a clue what the disbute is now about, and even fewer have any idea what Bassa want to achieve settlement.
You've hit the nail on the head!
The Bassa members are happy because they have no knowledge of how their money is being used and probably assume there is a huge fund built up to wage war on their behalfs.
The Bassa officers are happy either because they love their roles and get immense satisfaction fighting BA on behalf of their members or because they are being looked after very well financially.
If the Branch accounts were made openly available, there would remain no doubts about how the members money is being spent.
No one would worry if union officials took a "fair" payment for the time they actually spend on Union business or if they were reimbursed for justified "out of pocket expenses" incurred. Likewise there could be no suspicions that anything underhand was going on.
A continued silence can only provoke and amplify the doubts many are having. Irrespective of what Bassa are legally required to do regarding requests for accounting information, now is the time that a fearless union should publish the figures to stop the questions.
All the while that doubt hangs over the unions probiety, the membership will leak away and will distract people from understanding exactly what is the Union are protecting its members from. Frankly, I doubt many people have a clue what the disbute is now about, and even fewer have any idea what Bassa want to achieve settlement.
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BlueUpGood - am an the same shoes as you; not ever being a member of Bassa, although I am a member of Unite.
Bassa have 28 days to comply and until that time has passed, they have done nothing wrong. If they do comply, then no doubt we will all be having the debate on the numbers. If the Bassa branch are paying £50K to its secretary and depending on the detail of the ET, it could be money well spent.
Bassa have 28 days to comply and until that time has passed, they have done nothing wrong. If they do comply, then no doubt we will all be having the debate on the numbers. If the Bassa branch are paying £50K to its secretary and depending on the detail of the ET, it could be money well spent.
BASSA charge a sum over and above the Unite members subscription rate. DH gets his percentage of the Unite subs personally and the additional amount goes into the branch fund which is held by him.
Most officers of Unite don't understand this fact themselves as it is now quite unique in that organisation.
Woodley gave BASSA a written undertaking prior to the merger of TGWU that their 'methods of operation' would remain post merger.
I know for a fact that the accounts are never made available to the members under any circumstances. The branch auditors are a couple of safe hands chosen by DH.
Your knowledge of union matters is excellent Litebulbs however BASSA is not run like any other branch in the union.
BASSA has a long history of mis-management of funds that stretches back to the breakaway in 1989.
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vctenderness
No doubt if BASSAwitch is unsuccessful in gaining the accounts in question, then the Certification Officer will no doubt be the next port of call. I am sure that the branch in question will know this.
In my opinion, there will not be any irregularities, just debate on the merit and reasonableness of fund allocation. However, I have been wrong quite a lot recently.
In my opinion, there will not be any irregularities, just debate on the merit and reasonableness of fund allocation. However, I have been wrong quite a lot recently.
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Sorry Litebulbs, but that comment makes me really angry. Why should a lay rep earning a good salary from the company take ANY salary from the union. It would be right and just for out of pocket expenses and/or loss of earnings due union business to be recompensed, but not a penny more.
I was a senior APEX rep (now part of UNITE) and in seven years I never took any money (nor did any other rep in our branch) from the union.I took on the role, because I wanted to represent the views of my colleagues and to support them at disciplinaries to the best of my ability.
It is ourageous for you to suggest that it would be ok for DH or any other rep to be paid £50,000.
I was a senior APEX rep (now part of UNITE) and in seven years I never took any money (nor did any other rep in our branch) from the union.I took on the role, because I wanted to represent the views of my colleagues and to support them at disciplinaries to the best of my ability.
It is ourageous for you to suggest that it would be ok for DH or any other rep to be paid £50,000.
I get paid if I attend on a day off on a company called meeting. Is that wrong?
Statement On British Airways Ballot
"Failing a willingness by BA management to take its employment relations seriously and start negotiating, we would anticipate giving the company formal notice of this fresh ballot within the next ten days or so."
Len McCluskey
General Secretary
Unite the union
February 8 2011
"Failing a willingness by BA management to take its employment relations seriously and start negotiating, we would anticipate giving the company formal notice of this fresh ballot within the next ten days or so."
Len McCluskey
General Secretary
Unite the union
February 8 2011
Litebulbs
I will leave that job to others with a bigger agenda. If the Bassa membership and the relevant Unite officers are happy with the situation, then that is up to them. I get good value for my subscription. I hope that the Bassa members feel the same way.
- To produce annual accounts.
- Disseminate that information annually to it's members.
- Give access to it's accounts within 28 days of a request from any Unite member.
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Abby Road
The request has been made by an ex member. If after 28 days, the information is not forthcoming, then I expect that the issue will be taken further. As I see it, the branch in question is still within the law.
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Well, where is the fresh ballot then? Where??? Len promised! Nearly 2 weeks ago? 