British Airways vs. BASSA (Airline Staff Only)
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What impact is the strike having
There are quite a few threads on BASSA/Crewforum who seem to think that this strike is having a far greater impact than it is. They really believe that Willie's suggestion that the strike is a failure this week at the IATA conference is just more BA spin.
Well, DH today has mentioned in his daily rant that at "Day 20 - the strike has already cost BA £140 million alone". Considering the 3 day strike in '97 cost BA £120 million (if my memory serves me?) then the evidence speaks for itself............this strike is almost seven times LESS effective. So why not just end it now?
Well, DH today has mentioned in his daily rant that at "Day 20 - the strike has already cost BA £140 million alone". Considering the 3 day strike in '97 cost BA £120 million (if my memory serves me?) then the evidence speaks for itself............this strike is almost seven times LESS effective. So why not just end it now?
"Tory MP accepts damages from union in BA dispute"
Well, here is another drain on Unite's dwindling coffers. And it is likely that there will be similar claims against Unite from other sources, given the level of tripe they have published about BA and those who support BA. Well done Unite! 
Tory MP accepts damages from union in BA dispute - National News - Peterborough Today
Tory MP accepts damages from union in BA dispute Published on Mon Jun 07 18:42:03 BST 2010
Mark Pritchard, Conservative MP for The Wrekin, has accepted undisclosed damages from the union Unite over "hurtful and untrue" comments made about him on its website, his lawyer have announced. Solicitor-advocate Simon Smith said Mr Pritchard had also accepted a formal apology and reimbursement of all his legal costs "in respect of a libel complaint made against the union behind the BA strike".
The complaint arose out of a bulletin published on the website on March 17 entitled "Come Clean Willie - how many more Tory MPs have their snouts in BA's trough".
It commented on a question raised in Parliament that day by Mr Pritchard, saying he had "viciously and disgracefully" attacked BA cabin crew and also suggested he had been bought by BA.
In an apology which will appear on the union's website, Unite states: "In fact, we are happy to clarify that Mr Pritchard's question in Parliament concerned only the leaders of Unite and made no attack at all on BA cabin crew. "Furthermore, the suggestion that Mr Pritchard had been bought by BA was entirely false and we sincerely apologise to him for this."
In a statement Mr Pritchard said: "Unite's comments were hurtful and untrue. I have accepted their apology. "BA cabin crew are some of the best in the world. I have flown with BA for nearly three decades. I will continue to do so for private and business purposes along with flying other UK carriers."
Copyright (c) Press Association Ltd. 2010, All Rights Reserved.
Mark Pritchard, Conservative MP for The Wrekin, has accepted undisclosed damages from the union Unite over "hurtful and untrue" comments made about him on its website, his lawyer have announced. Solicitor-advocate Simon Smith said Mr Pritchard had also accepted a formal apology and reimbursement of all his legal costs "in respect of a libel complaint made against the union behind the BA strike".
The complaint arose out of a bulletin published on the website on March 17 entitled "Come Clean Willie - how many more Tory MPs have their snouts in BA's trough".
It commented on a question raised in Parliament that day by Mr Pritchard, saying he had "viciously and disgracefully" attacked BA cabin crew and also suggested he had been bought by BA.
In an apology which will appear on the union's website, Unite states: "In fact, we are happy to clarify that Mr Pritchard's question in Parliament concerned only the leaders of Unite and made no attack at all on BA cabin crew. "Furthermore, the suggestion that Mr Pritchard had been bought by BA was entirely false and we sincerely apologise to him for this."
In a statement Mr Pritchard said: "Unite's comments were hurtful and untrue. I have accepted their apology. "BA cabin crew are some of the best in the world. I have flown with BA for nearly three decades. I will continue to do so for private and business purposes along with flying other UK carriers."
Copyright (c) Press Association Ltd. 2010, All Rights Reserved.
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sorry!
Just spoken to a colleague... she brought back a flight the day after the "breather day". She left LHR on a strike day. When they boarded the aircraft for the return sector, they were all shocked to find that all tea and coffee bags had been torn, sugar sachets torn and emptied, eye wash removed, liquor bars were virtually empty (including back-ups) and threatening notes hidden in the jumpseats.
"BA backers or labour withholders." Lets use this forum for debate on specifics.
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As pressing as the need may be to resolve this, I don't think the company will dismiss any strikers who have participated in industrial action under the current ballot.
However, if there is a ballot for further industrial action, I expect some shots across the bows from BA as to whether CC have protection from unfair dismissal. If the company has given clear written warnings that they don't think that clock has been reset on the 12 week protection period, then they may feel justified in dismissing strikers (with all the adverse PR that will involve) on the basis they have an albeit untested argument for doing so.
However, if there is a ballot for further industrial action, I expect some shots across the bows from BA as to whether CC have protection from unfair dismissal. If the company has given clear written warnings that they don't think that clock has been reset on the 12 week protection period, then they may feel justified in dismissing strikers (with all the adverse PR that will involve) on the basis they have an albeit untested argument for doing so.
Been trying to find older posts regarding a poll on the BASSA website. 'Apparantly', some 80 per cent would rather see the company fold than to accept the proposed T&C's.
For curiosity, I'm trying to ascertain the veracity of such a poll and the numbers in order to put this into perspective. Sadly (luckily, I guess) I'm not privy to the forum. Also, of course there would be a percentage whose vote would only be to tow the BASSA line. Can anyone elaborate?
Returning to 'sacking the strikers', I really can not see how we can move on when we have D.H implying a guerilla warfare. It would only need to be a minority that will be enough to affect our future bookings and the long term viabilty of the Airline. Hence, my question re the BASSA forum.
These minorities are those that stick their fingers up to the overwhelming public, the company and everyone else that do not agree with their seventies style garbage.
I state again, I can not see how we can move on with those hell bent on causing us harm.
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Looks like a few vacancies at LHR
BA pilots post shocking, foul-mouthed rants on Facebook over cabin work after breaking strike - mirror.co.uk
Sorry to burst everyone's bubble but CRM going to an all-time low. Enjoy the read.
BA pilots post shocking, foul-mouthed rants on Facebook over cabin work after breaking strike - mirror.co.uk
Sorry to burst everyone's bubble but CRM going to an all-time low. Enjoy the read.
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WW
Sorry to burst everyone's bubble but CRM going to an all-time low. Enjoy the read.
If that's what's occurring, quite clearly BA will take action, just as they are with other similar cases.
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Unpleasant reading but little to do with CRM. This shows once again what a disparate bunch of people we have on both sides of the locked door.
I've actually been encouraged reading this forum that non-strikers and strikers have been engaging in honest debate. Only the most extreme elements don't want to see a strong company going forwards. Much as the agitators would like to see otherwise, I still see positives from many of the postings here.
I've actually been encouraged reading this forum that non-strikers and strikers have been engaging in honest debate. Only the most extreme elements don't want to see a strong company going forwards. Much as the agitators would like to see otherwise, I still see positives from many of the postings here.
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WWW
Are you ever going to post something that contributes to the debate WWW? You never answer genuine questions from people who come from all sections of BA. I rarely post here but have asked you various questions that I genuinely wanted to know the answer to but you have not once replied or contributed to the debate. You just seem to want to poison relations between crew and other sections, in particular the hated pilots. No wonder peoples patience eventual runs out.
As for the Facebook comments reported in the newspaper that you so kindly posted. If true they are disgusting, and at the very least poorly thought out and will probably cause the persons involved serious problems.
Notice that the general reaction from most normal people when shown this will be annoyance at these individuals for posting such idiotic comments on Facebook, and yes, I suspect that will include most pilots. This is because most BA staff are rational, thinking people. They won't jump to defend the indefensible because of primitive tribal loyalties. Compare that with your position on most matters. Even with just a moments reflection surely you can see that your very poorly judged vendetta against BA, Pilots, WW, the world simply isn't rational. Judge things on the merit of each case. Judge people as people not because they have a different profession to you.
We have to try to understand, to build bridges and to make the first steps.
Will you do the same?
As for the Facebook comments reported in the newspaper that you so kindly posted. If true they are disgusting, and at the very least poorly thought out and will probably cause the persons involved serious problems.
Notice that the general reaction from most normal people when shown this will be annoyance at these individuals for posting such idiotic comments on Facebook, and yes, I suspect that will include most pilots. This is because most BA staff are rational, thinking people. They won't jump to defend the indefensible because of primitive tribal loyalties. Compare that with your position on most matters. Even with just a moments reflection surely you can see that your very poorly judged vendetta against BA, Pilots, WW, the world simply isn't rational. Judge things on the merit of each case. Judge people as people not because they have a different profession to you.
We have to try to understand, to build bridges and to make the first steps.
Will you do the same?
Last edited by cotswoldchap; 8th Jun 2010 at 08:32.
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WW
Forgive my cynicism, but I find the idea of a number of pilots posting this kind of rubbish somewhat hard to believe.
Why would they use Facebook as a forum to do so knowing full well the consequences for cabin crew who fell foul of BA regs?
Why would they openly use their names for easy identification?
This has a whiff of BASSA "guerilla tactics" about it. Smear VCC, smear pilots. Seems a bit obvious to me.
On the other hand IF it turns out to be true, the stupidity is staggering and I hope BA will deal with them in the same way that other inappropriate Facebook posters have been.
As an aside this has absolutely no bearing on CRM.
Forgive my cynicism, but I find the idea of a number of pilots posting this kind of rubbish somewhat hard to believe.
Why would they use Facebook as a forum to do so knowing full well the consequences for cabin crew who fell foul of BA regs?
Why would they openly use their names for easy identification?
This has a whiff of BASSA "guerilla tactics" about it. Smear VCC, smear pilots. Seems a bit obvious to me.
On the other hand IF it turns out to be true, the stupidity is staggering and I hope BA will deal with them in the same way that other inappropriate Facebook posters have been.
As an aside this has absolutely no bearing on CRM.
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Names are named, and BA will start disciplinaries. It's almost perfect actually, because if BA go through the process and sack them, then everyone will see that BA are being fair and even-handed in the disciplinary process, and will wonder what the disciplined strikers got up to, that BA aren't allowed to tell us.
Come on Duncan, why don't you list the charges against your former colleagues?
But I can't see BALPA threatening to strike to protect these pilots, any more than I can see the Mirror doing some similar homework on BASSA members to try and stitch up strikers.
Come on Duncan, why don't you list the charges against your former colleagues?
But I can't see BALPA threatening to strike to protect these pilots, any more than I can see the Mirror doing some similar homework on BASSA members to try and stitch up strikers.
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GR8...
It might not be cynicism but stupidity as these pilots posted with their names and surnames...
I cannot believe you comment something like that in front of pure evidence.
Take your time to think...
It might not be cynicism but stupidity as these pilots posted with their names and surnames...
I cannot believe you comment something like that in front of pure evidence.
Take your time to think...
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If it turns out that these alleged comments are true, the pilots in question will undoubtedly go through an identical disciplinary process to the cabin crew. It can't be any other way and would be an indication to the "wider world" (and in particular to those on their own planet 
) that the cabin crew in similar situations are also being treated fairly and within the rules.
i.e. Striking to get the threat of disciplinaries lifted is a non-starter (or, no DH, you can't have your job back).
In addition, now that we have established that fifteen days of strikes in order to get staff travel reinstated have not worked either, what is the strike about now?
) that the cabin crew in similar situations are also being treated fairly and within the rules.i.e. Striking to get the threat of disciplinaries lifted is a non-starter (or, no DH, you can't have your job back).
In addition, now that we have established that fifteen days of strikes in order to get staff travel reinstated have not worked either, what is the strike about now?
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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WWW,
If it turns out that the Facebook comments by pilots are true, do you advocate that they are disciplined in accordance with normal BA procedures?
If so, why should the cabin crew undergoing disciplinaries for similar "offences" not be treated the same way? Remember, the strike you so love is taking place in part to ensure that cabin crew are released from the disciplinary procedure.
If not, why should they be treated differently to cabin crew?
If it turns out that the Facebook comments by pilots are true, do you advocate that they are disciplined in accordance with normal BA procedures?
If so, why should the cabin crew undergoing disciplinaries for similar "offences" not be treated the same way? Remember, the strike you so love is taking place in part to ensure that cabin crew are released from the disciplinary procedure.
If not, why should they be treated differently to cabin crew?
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Well the comments were boorish and ignorant and they'll probably be disciplined for then. However I didn't see any targetted, specific threats against named colleagues, which is where these fools differ from the facebook fifteen.
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WW
Please read my post fully. If, indeed they posted with their full names it is, as you say, stupidity. All too convenient for Bassa to bash pilots and VCC.
As Bassa have a history of missinformation I would caution against gloating too soon.
Please read my post fully. If, indeed they posted with their full names it is, as you say, stupidity. All too convenient for Bassa to bash pilots and VCC.
As Bassa have a history of missinformation I would caution against gloating too soon.
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Striking British Airways cabin crew to meet MPs
BBC News - British Airways cabin crew to meet MPs
They apparantly will be telling MPs how they are working in a 'climate of fear!!'
Thought it laughable initially, but thinking about it, they are correct!
They're going to fear that they can not get their own way all the time, they will fear that they have a CEO with the workforce behind him saying 'no more'!
They fear that public support is ever hardening against them.
They fear their militant 'no no no approach' will be challenged.
My only fear at the moment is exactly what they may be saying to the MP's as they are so desperate for backing.
They apparantly will be telling MPs how they are working in a 'climate of fear!!'
Thought it laughable initially, but thinking about it, they are correct!
They're going to fear that they can not get their own way all the time, they will fear that they have a CEO with the workforce behind him saying 'no more'!
They fear that public support is ever hardening against them.
They fear their militant 'no no no approach' will be challenged.
My only fear at the moment is exactly what they may be saying to the MP's as they are so desperate for backing.
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Not the most intelligent thing to post on Facebook. Unfortunatly, I believe, that the Mirror found out about these comments shortly after they came to BASSA's attention. Part of DH's Guerilla war? A deliberate attempt to smear VCC's? Or just a coincidence?
Its sad that it has come to this. Comments that are probably born out of frustration at the length of industrial action with no clear end in sight. I suspect that these people were reported to BASSA by their own Facebook 'friends'.
This will only have an effect on CRM if people let it. You don't have to like the crew you fly with to exercise good CRM. This is a fact often lost on people. CRM is not about group hugs and constantly beating around the bush to avoid offending people. It is Crew Resource MANAGEMENT. It requires people to be mature (on both sides of the door), to communicate, listen, and respect one another. In an ideal world we would all come to work, forget about the IA and just get on with the job. That's not always possible though.
We are all adults (apparently) and should be able to work together. There may be tension and bad feelings because of all the IA but this shouldn't effect the ability to exercise CRM for your own saftey, that of you fellow crew and ,of course, the passengers we carry.
Its sad that it has come to this. Comments that are probably born out of frustration at the length of industrial action with no clear end in sight. I suspect that these people were reported to BASSA by their own Facebook 'friends'.
This will only have an effect on CRM if people let it. You don't have to like the crew you fly with to exercise good CRM. This is a fact often lost on people. CRM is not about group hugs and constantly beating around the bush to avoid offending people. It is Crew Resource MANAGEMENT. It requires people to be mature (on both sides of the door), to communicate, listen, and respect one another. In an ideal world we would all come to work, forget about the IA and just get on with the job. That's not always possible though.
We are all adults (apparently) and should be able to work together. There may be tension and bad feelings because of all the IA but this shouldn't effect the ability to exercise CRM for your own saftey, that of you fellow crew and ,of course, the passengers we carry.