British Airways vs. BASSA (Airline Staff Only)
Join Date: May 2005
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And the airline must be allowed to protect itself, it's shareholders and non striking staff by any legal means possible. Anybody would think that BA wrote these laws. The government put them in place and BA are using them accordingly.
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If we flight crew were to take the ultimate sanction, i.e. go on strike (which would ground the airline, unlike this one)
Please Note: My views are personal and do not represent those of any other individual or organisation.
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Nevermind
If I may jump in here.
One would assume that BALPA would be far less prone to gaffes than BASSA/UNITE.
The fact that this strike is immoral, ludicrous and clearly political with near on zero support, furthermore, with staff backing the CEO, ratches up strength of feeling to address it.
If it's legal, they have the law on their side. If not, watch this space.
One would assume that BALPA would be far less prone to gaffes than BASSA/UNITE.
The fact that this strike is immoral, ludicrous and clearly political with near on zero support, furthermore, with staff backing the CEO, ratches up strength of feeling to address it.
If it's legal, they have the law on their side. If not, watch this space.
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swalesboy
Can you define the protection they seek?
What are they using it for? Negotiations. Spinning it out while VCC keep it all going?
Flight Crew could ground the airline. For our protection.
I do not in any way agree with the mindless reasons for the strike, but leaving out the issues, it's doesn't bode well for any union if this is allowed to be deemed illegal. Why do you think Unite are fighting it so hard?
Not for 9,500 cc, that for sure. They have 6 million members.
Can you define the protection they seek?
What are they using it for? Negotiations. Spinning it out while VCC keep it all going?
Flight Crew could ground the airline. For our protection.
I do not in any way agree with the mindless reasons for the strike, but leaving out the issues, it's doesn't bode well for any union if this is allowed to be deemed illegal. Why do you think Unite are fighting it so hard?
Not for 9,500 cc, that for sure. They have 6 million members.
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post 3567
Juan, you say you will accept change, but not without negotiation. How many times are we going round this buoy, BASSA have proved after 14 months of negotiation that that can not accept any type of negotiation other than "NO".
I am backing BA
I am backing BA
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Nevermind.
Not quite sure what you mean but I am merely pointing out to people who continuely go on about their legal right to strike (not insinuating that you are one of them) that BA has a perfectly legal right to do everything legally possible to protect itself.
Not quite sure what you mean but I am merely pointing out to people who continuely go on about their legal right to strike (not insinuating that you are one of them) that BA has a perfectly legal right to do everything legally possible to protect itself.
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It's about time they learnt how to conduct a ballot for industrial action whilst meeting all of the legal criteria involved. UNITE are one of the biggest unions in the UK, don't you think that they ought to be able to run a strike ballot without c**king it up time after time? There has never been an issue with the right to strike once a legal ballot has been undertaken, it's just that UNITE cannot or will not get the strike ballot right. It's a long time now since a union convener could call all of the brothers out on a show of hands - and they still hate that loss of power.
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swalesboy
By protecting itself I think it's merely prolonging the battle. I imagine in order to get to June 12th - without VCC help they couldn't do that. There is no way that you can legally delay forever, despite BASSA's best attempts to help them.
If people feel aggrieved to the point that they want to strike, they should be allowed to do so.
As I've previously posted, if I felt their cause was just, no way would I be VCC.
Like BALPA's decision to stay neutral in this strike, I am just considering what is best for us in the long run, because if BA could legally block forever, we have no nuclear option ourselves (or any trade union for that matter)
While we all do have the right to strike, then it helps us laugh a little bit at those deluded people who say they'll be using the tactic on us next.
Our reps have been great these last few years, but we still retain the nuclear option if required.
By protecting itself I think it's merely prolonging the battle. I imagine in order to get to June 12th - without VCC help they couldn't do that. There is no way that you can legally delay forever, despite BASSA's best attempts to help them.
If people feel aggrieved to the point that they want to strike, they should be allowed to do so.
As I've previously posted, if I felt their cause was just, no way would I be VCC.
Like BALPA's decision to stay neutral in this strike, I am just considering what is best for us in the long run, because if BA could legally block forever, we have no nuclear option ourselves (or any trade union for that matter)
While we all do have the right to strike, then it helps us laugh a little bit at those deluded people who say they'll be using the tactic on us next.
Our reps have been great these last few years, but we still retain the nuclear option if required.
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Volunteer cabin crew: the way forward?
British Airways currently employs a fairly large reserve of volunteer cabin crew, who have been seconded from their "day jobs" to fill the gaps left by strikers.
Let us assume that a proportion of currently striking cc may be managed out of the company (please note the italics) at the conclusion of the strike.
What do contributors think about the idea of transferring some (or even all) of the current volunteers to full-time flying jobs?
One at a time, please.
Let us assume that a proportion of currently striking cc may be managed out of the company (please note the italics) at the conclusion of the strike.
What do contributors think about the idea of transferring some (or even all) of the current volunteers to full-time flying jobs?
One at a time, please.
Join Date: May 2010
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Well a couple of things to ad.
Many of the VCC are already in the "talent pool" "hold pool" for full-time contracts (including myself) so I would imagine there is potential to offer contracts after this episode reaches its conclusion.
There is "talk" that VCC's are to be offered 1 trip every 2 months and work in their normal role as well but that could just be "talk"
Many of the VCC are already in the "talent pool" "hold pool" for full-time contracts (including myself) so I would imagine there is potential to offer contracts after this episode reaches its conclusion.
There is "talk" that VCC's are to be offered 1 trip every 2 months and work in their normal role as well but that could just be "talk"
For the ground volunteers that have the done the vcc courses and kept BA flying -YES!!!!!
For the temp cabin crew that have kept BA flying - YES!!!
For the pilot volunteers - please let me back into my cosy flight deck. Prep for each flight has been like a route check, having to study SEP and AVMED!!
For the selfish and completely anti-BA strikers - Bye bye, and here's your P45!
For the temp cabin crew that have kept BA flying - YES!!!
For the pilot volunteers - please let me back into my cosy flight deck. Prep for each flight has been like a route check, having to study SEP and AVMED!!
For the selfish and completely anti-BA strikers - Bye bye, and here's your P45!
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Selfish Sporran ???...the strikers are VERY pro BA and are doing their all to stand up to the bully walsh, get rid of him and then get this company back where it belongs - No1 worldwide airline.
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VCC as cabin crew
It is unlikely that many VCC would take up permanent positions of cabin crew for the simple reason that they would almost certainly suffer a cut in salary which, in some cases, would amount to tens of thousands a year. This is what happens when people voluntarily move jobs as they would then work according to the pay scales, terms and conditions of their new job. It's only those who are in a redeployment situation, meaning CareerLink, who would not suffer as they would get a pay differential, being their current salary less the top of the main crew salary scale.
Of course, cabin crew get allowances which would help to make up the difference, but many VCC would still be out of pocket.
Having said all of that, some VCC would become cabin crew as they want the lifestyle.
Of course, cabin crew get allowances which would help to make up the difference, but many VCC would still be out of pocket.
Having said all of that, some VCC would become cabin crew as they want the lifestyle.
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Selfish Sporran ???...the strikers are VERY pro BA and are doing their all to stand up to the bully walsh, get rid of him and then get this company back where it belongs - No1 worldwide airline.
And if Willy Walsh keeps the confidence of the board and the airline's big investors he will and should continue as CEO.
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Not to mention walking off aircraft full of customers, demanding 18 hours off on shorthaul after 12:30 day delayed due to factors outside of the company's control, ridiculous turnrounds in shorthaul, stupid rules when 'shuttling' in longhaul (7 day rather than 6 day NAS) insisting on 2 local nights after a long-range diversion (Prestwick fiasco!!) to name but a few.
How does any of that pathetic behaviour make us No1???
Wake up Juan, you are completely deluded. There is a REAL world outside your BASSA bubble.
How does any of that pathetic behaviour make us No1???
Wake up Juan, you are completely deluded. There is a REAL world outside your BASSA bubble.
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Let us not forget that now the strike continues, those that have chosen to go on strike will now have lost their staff travel permanently.
BASSA/Unite have mentioned that they were to do another ballot. As this ballot runs for about 4 weeks, the result will be well past the 12th June deadline for the company to be able to sack their members.
Everyone knows that BA have cancelled flights but on the revised schedule most of the flights have got away (with the addition of some re-instated services)
Eddy/Litebulbs and others, keep your posts going in what would otherwise be a onesided debate (don't always agree with you though!)
BASSA/Unite have mentioned that they were to do another ballot. As this ballot runs for about 4 weeks, the result will be well past the 12th June deadline for the company to be able to sack their members.
Everyone knows that BA have cancelled flights but on the revised schedule most of the flights have got away (with the addition of some re-instated services)
Eddy/Litebulbs and others, keep your posts going in what would otherwise be a onesided debate (don't always agree with you though!)
Join Date: Jul 2002
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VCC
Just catching up on the posts, someone asked "why are the VCC not being used"
My theory. Willy need a large workforce to action his masterstoke, he will keep his power dry and ramp up the sevices, 65% this 5 days, 80% next five days, 90% final three days using as many regular crew as possible, as crew that have gone on strike will not be available for thier next trip, even with good turn outs VCC will be needed to maintain these flight levels.
VCC are still being trained at a rate, even some course dates set as far out as July. This is because he wants to get to 100% after the strike using VCC and leave the strikers at home, watch this space I expect to see "new fleet" recruitment very, very soon.
Nevermind, there is some good news for the strikers, I hear Emirates are recruiting 3000 crew this summer, anyone checked the terms and conditions
Im backing BA
My theory. Willy need a large workforce to action his masterstoke, he will keep his power dry and ramp up the sevices, 65% this 5 days, 80% next five days, 90% final three days using as many regular crew as possible, as crew that have gone on strike will not be available for thier next trip, even with good turn outs VCC will be needed to maintain these flight levels.
VCC are still being trained at a rate, even some course dates set as far out as July. This is because he wants to get to 100% after the strike using VCC and leave the strikers at home, watch this space I expect to see "new fleet" recruitment very, very soon.
Nevermind, there is some good news for the strikers, I hear Emirates are recruiting 3000 crew this summer, anyone checked the terms and conditions
Im backing BA
Juan Odeboyse,
You really should try taking off your bassa glasses. You see things TOTALLY differently to the vast majority of us. As has been said before 'There are none so blind as those who cannot see', but for most of the bassa militant brigade that should read 'There are none so blind as those who can see perfectly well but refuse to open their eyes'!!
The strikers are very pro .................... themselves!
NOT BA, NOT their colleagues, NOT all the other BA employees. They only care about their own little world and refuse to join the real world.
The real world that has seen many thousands made redundant.
The real world that has seen many thousands take a reduction in wages.
The real world that has seen many thousands lose their pensions.
The real world that has seen many thousands having to make compromises in order to keep their jobs.
The bassamentalists would not recognise the real world if it sat on their faces.
They did not need to inspect the financial figures, but then all the lemmings at that racecourse meeting voted for no negotiations!!
They have listened to the complete tosh spouted by the bassa shower and seem unable to come to a rational decision. The 'vote for strike to teach WW a lesson' has obviously worked well - NOT!
I am certain that WW had no intention of breaking any union when this debacle started. However, I now hope he really sticks the boot into bassa and sorts them out once and for all.
In my nearly 15 years in the company I have only ever seen bassa as a negative and destructive influence, still thinking that BA is a nationalised industry and that we are all DUE a living.
Wakey wakey - this is 2010.
This dispute is about management being able to manage the business. That is their job - not the role of bassa, or any other union for that matter. Unfortunately your greedy bassa reps have tried to make the dispute personal because ALL they are interested in is preserving their status and way-of-life at the expense of ordinary cabin crew.
You really should try taking off your bassa glasses. You see things TOTALLY differently to the vast majority of us. As has been said before 'There are none so blind as those who cannot see', but for most of the bassa militant brigade that should read 'There are none so blind as those who can see perfectly well but refuse to open their eyes'!!
The strikers are very pro .................... themselves!
NOT BA, NOT their colleagues, NOT all the other BA employees. They only care about their own little world and refuse to join the real world.
The real world that has seen many thousands made redundant.
The real world that has seen many thousands take a reduction in wages.
The real world that has seen many thousands lose their pensions.
The real world that has seen many thousands having to make compromises in order to keep their jobs.
The bassamentalists would not recognise the real world if it sat on their faces.
They did not need to inspect the financial figures, but then all the lemmings at that racecourse meeting voted for no negotiations!!
They have listened to the complete tosh spouted by the bassa shower and seem unable to come to a rational decision. The 'vote for strike to teach WW a lesson' has obviously worked well - NOT!
I am certain that WW had no intention of breaking any union when this debacle started. However, I now hope he really sticks the boot into bassa and sorts them out once and for all.
In my nearly 15 years in the company I have only ever seen bassa as a negative and destructive influence, still thinking that BA is a nationalised industry and that we are all DUE a living.
Wakey wakey - this is 2010.
This dispute is about management being able to manage the business. That is their job - not the role of bassa, or any other union for that matter. Unfortunately your greedy bassa reps have tried to make the dispute personal because ALL they are interested in is preserving their status and way-of-life at the expense of ordinary cabin crew.
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It's obvious WW's plan is not working as planned. Why else would he go to court again trying to get an injunction as he only a few days ago said BA would manage with a 15 day long strike? Getting too much pressure from the shareholders? The board? Or, it's just not working?
If it hadn't been for our spineless colleagues (blacklegs) who are insisting on going into work including these VCC, this would have been over a long time ago.
Nobody will be striking after June 12th when the mandate is no longer valid. Some are probably cheering for us to lose our jobs. They can't sack you for going on strike in good faith.
Because BA did not even bother to mention it to BASSA at an NSP meeting. There's your reason.
If it hadn't been for our spineless colleagues (blacklegs) who are insisting on going into work including these VCC, this would have been over a long time ago.
Nobody will be striking after June 12th when the mandate is no longer valid. Some are probably cheering for us to lose our jobs. They can't sack you for going on strike in good faith.
Back to being the world's number one airline? How come we don't serve hot towels in WTP?.... because BASSA blocked it.