British Airways - CC Industrial Relations Mk VI

[keel beam]

Who is deceiving who?

If ever there was a timely article that could be related to this dispute.

I like this bit:

"Deception is reinforced when hope and conviction overpower evidence and clarity, and bolstered by any system in which the boss is always right. But there is no form of deception more powerful than a willingness to deceive yourself."


Full article here.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/com...cle7014065.ece


The sad thing about this dispute is that it is/was avoidable. The only thing left will be a bad taste in the mouth and a number of people without a job.

[Andy_S]

Originally Posted by spock33

I don't see the union backing down at this late stage

I think you need to differentiate betwen the union and it's membership. The union (BASSA) may indeed be unwilling to back down, but a lot of the movers and shakers in BASSA and their parent union UNITE are full time union officials or BA part timers with independent incomes and union expenses. They have the luxury of being able to strike without having to worry about their next mortgage payment, and a number of them have their own personal political motives to indulge.

The $64,000 dollar question, as you put it, is how resolute are the rank and file? I got the feeling that a lot of CC who voted for industrial action in last years ballot were genuinely shaken when they were told they were to strike for 12 days. That's a lot of salary when you have financial obligations to meet. Faced with significant loss of wages and the permanent withdrawl of staff travel it's going to be interesting to see how many of them actually walk out (assuming another 'yes' vote). Of those who do, how many will have the nerve to see it through to the bitter end if BA can continue to operate a significant number of flights with the help of WW's mini-army of volunteers and the press and general public cheering them on? Whatever BASSA / UNITE may wish, if the 'yes' voters get cold feet then there's not a great deal the union can do about it.

[Snas]

Andy

I could not agree with Andy more......

..and for what it is worth (probably very little) I'm going to take a punt on a 72% yes vote.

[HiFlyer14]

Oh this is good for a Friday night laugh down the pub.

Taken from CrewForum - the administrator there "EasyTiger" doing his reporting duties from the court hearing.

But please...a cabin crew witness for Unite to verify how difficult the crew complements are who ......hasn't flown since October!!!!

The beers are on me.....!

The barrister made play of Nigel's current ill-health and that he had last flown before the imposition (in October) and so had no experience of it and couldn't comment on the impact crew were feeling on board. Nigel calmly replied that he had 22 years' flying experience and knew intimately the responsibilities attaching to the different grades and positions.

I am BA cabin crew and the above represents my own view and not that of BA.

[Snas]

This Nigel and Malone - how many reps are actually on the sick?

Could they not find a "worker" to give evidence?

[AtlasDrawer]

volunteers to act as SCCMs

Just like to pick up on something that was spoken about a few pages back. A poster (sorry can't remember whom) asked the question:

'How do main crew feel about the fact that volunteers are being trained to act as SCCMs?'

Surprised, was my initial reaction as I thought that you needed a minimum of one year cabin crew experience to act as an SCCM at any airline. But I don't know for sure what the CAA have said about this, I guess it must be ok or BA would not be doing it, right?

I can see why BA are doing this (getting vols to act as SCCMs) as they have no clear way of finding out exactly how many SCCMs they will have to work during the strike, and as I guess many crew members may vote yes, and be resolute UNTIL the day of the strike comes and eventually decide to come into work.

So , on the day, if I find I have a volunteer acting as a SCCM on a flight I operate, I shall fully support them and help in any way I can.


Any one else like to share their views?

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[Thunderbug]

AtlasDrawer

The folks who are doing the extra SCCM training do have the required experience as stipulated by the CAA. They have all been cabin crew at some point in their careers.

And there are surprising quite a few who qualify (and their previous experiences doesn't seem to have put them off volunteering!)

T'Bug

[AtlasDrawer]

Thunderbug

Thanks for the info, did not realise

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[ottergirl]

24-06

There seems to be a lot of euphoria around that worries me and I wonder how regular crew who are intending to work during any potential period of IA feel about this. Although I will be working and this is because I have a contract with BA that I do not intend to break, I'm not sure that I will be rejoicing, in other words, I do not see the context and the operating flights that will result being quite the 'party' that some of the posters here see it. What are you views fellow cabin crew?

I'm with you 24-06. I will be working because that is what I have reluctantly chosen having weighed up both sides. It will be with a heavy heart though and will certainly not be a 'party'. Its likely that most crew will be feeling guilty and worried in equal parts.

I also think it is somewhat naive to think that all our customers will be grateful and won't mind not having any catering! Experience tells me that not all the travelling public are that public spirited and we may be in for some horrible days! If it can be my fault that its snowing, foggy, french atc is on strike or that the aeroplane is broken then I'm sure the lack of food could be my fault too! Rational behaviour is not a prerequisite of booking BA!

No cause for rejoicing!

[Litebulbs]

If the court decision is that the imposition is contractual, would you accept that BA have breached the same contract that you will not break?

[LD12986]

I also think it is somewhat naive to think that all our customers will be grateful and won't mind not having any catering! Experience tells me that not all the travelling public are that public spirited and we may be in for some horrible days! If it can be my fault that its snowing, foggy, french atc is on strike or that the aeroplane is broken then I'm sure the lack of food could be my fault too! Rational behaviour is not a prerequisite of booking BA!

I think this will depend in part on how BA manages expectations. UK passengers will be aware of the risk IA and will be relieved that their flight is operating. As long as passengers are given sufficient notice about the lack of hot food and vouchers for the restaurants in the terminal it should not be too bad.

[Ten West]

Ottergirl:

I think I'd just be chuffed that the flight is going at all! Remember the relief when the 12 days of Christmas was scrubbed at the last minute?
The pax will understand the background to the temporary service standards and I think you'll be fine.

Sure, there will be one or two idiots who'll have a gripe and a pop, but you'd get them anyway. With some people, whatever you do will never be good enough.

I reckon it'll go better than you anticipate.

[AtlasDrawer]

now here's a question

So just a question I'd like to throw out there:

What happens when the strikers are let back to work, and make life pretty unpleasant for us non-strikers/vols?

I hope there is a plan for that too, or someone I can get help from or advice. Because on other forums, indeed one poster on here alluded to it - that there may be some kind of 'comeback' on us who decide to operate. That is the main thing that I think is deterring lots of people. I know of someone who had their car tyres slashed and car scratched and that was back in the 1997 dispute.

Gulp...

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[Snas]

I find it amazing that people who believe in the right to strike dont believe in the right not to strike!

[bitsnpieces]

AtlasDrawer,

In an email today from BF, he stated that any form of bullying/harassment will be dealt with quickly and could result in dismissal.

Hope this helps ease your worries.

[AtlasDrawer]

Snas

I find it amazing that people who believe in the right to strike dont believe in the right not to strike!

That's what I believe, it's a free country after all, right?

However, it's the comeback that worries me.

Bitsnpieces:

I have kept a copy of the BF email should I need it for further reference! Thanks..

But I'm still going to go into work, nevertheless, after all, I would be letting the bullies win if I did not and I can't do that.

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[Diplome]

Well, this is interesting.

As a SLF who is rather intriuged regarding the issues presented regarding this situtation, but concerned about the extreme negativity being undertaken by some individuals...

I sent off an email to a member of the press the other day regarding the pornographic material placed upon a website with keywords associating itself to BA and PCCCC, ..that the site was registered to a BASSA representative and no denial had been received regarding BASSA's participation, and the name and shame campaign.

An email arrived in by inbox this evening...though I'm in the midst of a terrible bout of the flu. I will try to gather myself tomorrow to respond...but I'm not sure the BASSA = Porn? issue is quite passed

I certainly hope, if there is no denial received, the kitchen remodeling business is good.

[AtlasDrawer]

As a SLF who is rather intriuged regarding the issues presented regarding this situtation, but concerned about the extreme negativity being undertaken by some individuals...

I sent off an email to a member of the press the other day regarding the pornographic material placed upon a website with keywords associating itself to BA and PCCCC, ..that the site was registered to a BASSA representative and no denial had been received regarding BASSA's participation, and the name and shame campaign.

Diplome, this is the crux of the matter I am getting at. Good on you for alerting the press to it. I am really hoping that something is done, and is seen to be done about stuff like this. Fancy having your name in text that is being sent around work - neither do I! What can BA do about these malicious texts that are going around, I have not had one (yet).

I have never been so disappointed in my colleagues in all my life.

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[bitsnpieces]

AD,

I am led to believe that there are a lot of investigations going on in the background at the moment. I don't know any details of this, although the police is allegedly involved. I received an email yesterday with a list of volunteers from another department. As and when I see these people, I will let them know and shake their hand as well as saying thank you and well done for volunteering. I will also offer any help I can if they have any questions about anything.

The next few weeks will be difficult unfortunately. I don't tend to talk much about the situation while at work, I just listen. If anyone tried to bully me, I would report it, whether via my manager or the other various ways where we can remain anonymus.

[AtlasDrawer]

Bitsnpieces

I don't tend to talk much about the situation while at work, I just listen. If anyone tried to bully me, I would report it, whether via my manager or the other various ways where we can remain anonymus

And I intend to do the same, guess we have to fight fire with fire!

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