British Airways - CC Industrial Relations & Negotiations
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I'm mystified - why has there been no ballot since Unite and BASSA said strike action was "inevitable" if imposition was allowed to stand?
Perhaps BASSA have their thinking caps on.
Apart from the current postal strike causing disruptions, they may be thinking if they have a ballot now, this would include all the cabin crew that want VR. This would dilute a yes vote.If the union wait until the VRs are gone, then have the ballot, the ratio would be more favourable for a yes vote (not guaranteed of course)
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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The "imposition" of new terms only affects new entrants. Existing members are not affected.
You may want to check that with BA as that sounds like imposition to me........
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Contrary to the opinions expressed by some, UNITE, GMB and BASSA are all firmly standing together. We refuse to allow British Airways to be dragged under by "Lemmings".
Oh the irony....
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This is what a particular BASSA member thinks of AMICUS members:
"For those BASSA members attending the meeting I would ask that you please be gentle with any CC89 members whom you come across. You'll recognise them as they may seem a bit confused and "lost".....
You see they are not used to attending Branch meetings because the Cabin Crew '89 constitution does not include regular meetings...... Meetings can be called by a request from a number of members or at the whim of the committee. I understand that there is an annual meeting but it's hardly a regular discussion forum is it?
So, please be gentle with the little lambs.... who knows, they may even enjoy the democratic experience and join BASSA so they can attend our quartely meetings....."
"For those BASSA members attending the meeting I would ask that you please be gentle with any CC89 members whom you come across. You'll recognise them as they may seem a bit confused and "lost".....
You see they are not used to attending Branch meetings because the Cabin Crew '89 constitution does not include regular meetings...... Meetings can be called by a request from a number of members or at the whim of the committee. I understand that there is an annual meeting but it's hardly a regular discussion forum is it?
So, please be gentle with the little lambs.... who knows, they may even enjoy the democratic experience and join BASSA so they can attend our quartely meetings....."
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Contrary to the opinions expressed by some, UNITE, GMB and BASSA are all firmly standing together. We refuse to allow British Airways to be dragged under by "Lemmings".
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Imposition
Now they have reduced the cabin service in tourist on short haul routes to a drinks + biscuit service only, that surely mean less crew are needed to provide the reduced service. A reduction in service must surely mean a reduction in crew. I cannot see that is imposition of a reduced crewing level. If the cabin service remained the same and they reduced the crew level then that might be a different matter.
I travel frequently as a pax and do not think they have reduced the number of crew since they reduced the cabin service.
On flights of 2 hours, they have nothing much to do as the drinks service takes very little time, then they try and sell tax free goods that does not seem to take very long. I consider they have so many crew that there is nothing for them to do for more than half the flight time. 3 of them to do just a drinks service in a tourist cabin of 78 seats. I would have thought one could easily have done that in 2 hours.
On the subject of cabin crew tidying up the aircraft on turn rounds, no they do not do that like other cabin crew do who work for other airlines, cleaners come on and do that.
Now they have reduced the cabin service in tourist on short haul routes to a drinks + biscuit service only, that surely mean less crew are needed to provide the reduced service. A reduction in service must surely mean a reduction in crew. I cannot see that is imposition of a reduced crewing level. If the cabin service remained the same and they reduced the crew level then that might be a different matter.
I travel frequently as a pax and do not think they have reduced the number of crew since they reduced the cabin service.
On flights of 2 hours, they have nothing much to do as the drinks service takes very little time, then they try and sell tax free goods that does not seem to take very long. I consider they have so many crew that there is nothing for them to do for more than half the flight time. 3 of them to do just a drinks service in a tourist cabin of 78 seats. I would have thought one could easily have done that in 2 hours.
On the subject of cabin crew tidying up the aircraft on turn rounds, no they do not do that like other cabin crew do who work for other airlines, cleaners come on and do that.
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Interesting to note that it was announced today that the UK economy shrank by 0.4% between July and September, making this the longest UK recession since records began. So much for BASSA's claim that the recession is "rapidly disappearing".
I also see from the press that Iberia is undergoing a radical restructuring with all short and medium haul routes being moved to an entirely new airline with new working practices and T&Cs.
I also see from the press that Iberia is undergoing a radical restructuring with all short and medium haul routes being moved to an entirely new airline with new working practices and T&Cs.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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On flights of 2 hours, they have nothing much to do as the drinks service takes very little time, then they try and sell tax free goods that does not seem to take very long. I consider they have so many crew that there is nothing for them to do for more than half the flight time. 3 of them to do just a drinks service in a tourist cabin of 78 seats. I would have thought one could easily have done that in 2 hours.
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via the Press Assoc. (extract)
"BA cabin crew to attend meeting
(UKPA) – 3 hours ago
An emergency meeting of British Airways cabin crew has been called to decide whether to fight plans to cut jobs, freeze pay and introduce worse wages and conditions for new staff, it has been revealed.
Thousands of workers are expected to attend the meeting, at Sandown Racecourse in Surrey, on November 2, two weeks before the cuts come into effect"
"BA cabin crew to attend meeting
(UKPA) – 3 hours ago
An emergency meeting of British Airways cabin crew has been called to decide whether to fight plans to cut jobs, freeze pay and introduce worse wages and conditions for new staff, it has been revealed.
Thousands of workers are expected to attend the meeting, at Sandown Racecourse in Surrey, on November 2, two weeks before the cuts come into effect"
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If this is what CC are told to think, it's no wonder....
Bealine, your post made very little sense to me and I doubt I'm alone.....there's so much bothering me about what you wrote that I'm not sure where to begin...
...just plain ill-informed and untrue - how have your union allowed you to believe/peddle this blatant lie? Do they disseminate ANY factual information to the 'troops'?
a) BA management turning up late for meetings?
-Purlease! BASSA wrote the book on unprofessional non-negociation.
b) I would imagine that WW would want complete autonomy and control from here on in....also we don't REALLY know that his subordinate managers' salaries are "grossly inflated"....in fact, when this is all over and the shareholders see how many hundred million pounds these managers can save the company each year just by bringing the cabin crew working practices more into line with other National carriers, I would imagine no-one could question their pay.
c)Even the pilots have not been able to have the threat of compulsory redundancy removed from the table, and they played the game, negociated in an adult manner & delivered required cost-savings from an already lean and slender, efficient, hard-working, dedicated, benchmarked, professional workforce.
d) don't make me laugh! Someone call Amnesty International!!! Get the UN on the phone!! ....they're unavailable? How about the RSPCC?!
A cry for fewer middle managers instead of addressing your department's incredible inefficiencies?
-WW got rid of swathes and swathes as soon as the downturn began in an effort to reduce costs....the fact that Cabin crew "costs" have STILL not been addressed so far down the line that you've forgotten about earlier restructuring says something indeed.
This is tosh. BASSA, CC89 and UNITE are clearly having trouble seeing eye-to-eye, as evidenced by the recent notable absence of either a ballot for strike or the usual unfounded, untrue, rabble-rousing rhetoric......and just remind me who is it that's the lemmings again?!
lemming |ˈlemi ng |
noun
a small, short-tailed, thickset rodent related to the voles, found in the Arctic tundra.
• a person who unthinkingly joins a mass movement, esp. a headlong rush to destruction : the flailings of the lemmings on Wall Street.
ORIGIN early 18th cent.: from Norwegian and Danish; related to Old Norse lómundr.
The "imposition" of new terms only affects new entrants. Existing members are not affected
As the Trades Unions can actually agree to about 80% of the company's demands for cost-savings, we believe that we are close to agreement - if only our management would (a) turn up to meetings at the agreed times and (b) be empowered to make decisions without having to run off and ask permission from the Royal Mail managers BA have appointed at grossly inflated salaries! (c) Remove the threat of compulsory redundancies altogether.(d) treaet the staff as human beings.
-Purlease! BASSA wrote the book on unprofessional non-negociation.
b) I would imagine that WW would want complete autonomy and control from here on in....also we don't REALLY know that his subordinate managers' salaries are "grossly inflated"....in fact, when this is all over and the shareholders see how many hundred million pounds these managers can save the company each year just by bringing the cabin crew working practices more into line with other National carriers, I would imagine no-one could question their pay.
c)Even the pilots have not been able to have the threat of compulsory redundancy removed from the table, and they played the game, negociated in an adult manner & delivered required cost-savings from an already lean and slender, efficient, hard-working, dedicated, benchmarked, professional workforce.
d) don't make me laugh! Someone call Amnesty International!!! Get the UN on the phone!! ....they're unavailable? How about the RSPCC?!
A cry for fewer middle managers instead of addressing your department's incredible inefficiencies?
-WW got rid of swathes and swathes as soon as the downturn began in an effort to reduce costs....the fact that Cabin crew "costs" have STILL not been addressed so far down the line that you've forgotten about earlier restructuring says something indeed.
Contrary to the opinions expressed by some, UNITE, GMB and BASSA are all firmly standing together. We refuse to allow British Airways to be dragged under by "Lemmings".
lemming |ˈlemi ng |
noun
a small, short-tailed, thickset rodent related to the voles, found in the Arctic tundra.
• a person who unthinkingly joins a mass movement, esp. a headlong rush to destruction : the flailings of the lemmings on Wall Street.
ORIGIN early 18th cent.: from Norwegian and Danish; related to Old Norse lómundr.
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When to the VR bods leave?
"Everyone who has applied for voluntary redundancy will be able to leave between th30 November and 15 December 2009" - From Bill Francis's statement, th6 Oct!
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Thank you for the clarification KB.
So industrial action before the Christmas peak would seem less likely? Or at least suicidal if balloted. But I suppose that hasn't stopped the posties.
I suppose time will tell.
So industrial action before the Christmas peak would seem less likely? Or at least suicidal if balloted. But I suppose that hasn't stopped the posties.
I suppose time will tell.
Junior trash
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Surely by delaying until after the VRs have gone BASSA will be deemed to have accepted the changes. I cant see the Courts telling BA to re-recruit to recover the lost staff.
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Why do they keep meeting at racecourses in Surrey? Are those the only places they know how to get to, apart from the airport? Silly me! They hardly ever go to the airport either - well not LHR, at any rate. 
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I can see that, until there is an agreement, this thread will run and run. It is also quite clear that some people who haven't a clue about what is going on within BA management or within the Trades Unions are trying to point score merely by shouting down others.
Mandyconn's post just about sums it all up - her post is not so very different from most of the conjecture hitherto on this discussion (just a bit fruitier) so I will just treat all the negative posters with the contempt they deserve.
Mandyconn's post just about sums it all up - her post is not so very different from most of the conjecture hitherto on this discussion (just a bit fruitier) so I will just treat all the negative posters with the contempt they deserve.
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Moderated posts
Can I ask the moderators to add any scanned/checked posts to the very end of the thread and not back where they were originally posted please?
I posted number 2231, which was then looked at for a while by the moderators, but by the time it showed up it was already some way back in the thread history and anyone regularly keeping up with the thread would probably have missed it.
Not that it's the greatest post ever...I mean, it's definitely up there, but you know, nowhere near as entertaining as Mandycon's post that just got vetoed by the moderators saying how impressed she was by the size of slickster's....errr.... trousers!
Let's keep it (relatively!) civil people!
I posted number 2231, which was then looked at for a while by the moderators, but by the time it showed up it was already some way back in the thread history and anyone regularly keeping up with the thread would probably have missed it.
Not that it's the greatest post ever...I mean, it's definitely up there, but you know, nowhere near as entertaining as Mandycon's post that just got vetoed by the moderators saying how impressed she was by the size of slickster's....errr.... trousers!
Let's keep it (relatively!) civil people!
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Why do they keep meeting at racecourses in Surrey? Are those the only places they know how to get to, apart from the airport? Silly me! They hardly ever go to the airport either - well not LHR, at any rate.