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QF mandates Vaccine

Old 19th Sep 2021, 23:38
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Wiz -
but i DO insist that of you don't, you don't put yopurself in a situation where YOUR choice endangers me and others.
Pre covid the flu killed thousands of people each season. My 84 yr old mum would probably fall off the perch if she caught the flu. I would get the flu jab every year. Never heard a mass cry in the public for everyone to get vaccinated to save other people for catching the flu...........

Look - make the Vaccine available to everyone, come a set date eg 1 Jan 22, if you are not double vaccinated and don't wish to be, then so be it. Open up the economy again. Forget about vaccine passports - they are an administrative nightmare and simply don't work. Don't stand for employers mandating vaccination passports. A vaccination passport is just window dressing PR spin for businesses. Finnair has dropped em. I think Lufthansa too but I am not sure.

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Old 19th Sep 2021, 23:48
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
Look - make the Vaccine available to everyone, come a set date eg 1 Jan 22, if you are not double vaccinated and don't wish to be, then so be it. Open up the economy again. Forget about vaccine passports - they are an administrative nightmare and simply don't work. Don't stand for employers mandating vaccination passports. A vaccination passport is just window dressing PR spin for businesses. Finnair has dropped em. I think Lufthansa too but I am not sure.
Who are you talking to exactly? Nobody gives a flying toss what you think should be done. Policy has been made, the conversation is over and the world is moving on.

You are yelling at clouds. Get vaccinated or enjoy your hermit life. Nobody cares.

In other news, this website is hilarious. Darwin in action, its a beautiful thing.

https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/




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Old 19th Sep 2021, 23:55
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Originally Posted by das Uber Soldat
Who are you talking to exactly? Nobody gives a flying toss what you think should be done. Policy has been made, the conversation is over and the world is moving on.

You are yelling at clouds. Get vaccinated or enjoy your hermit life. Nobody cares.

In other news, this website is hilarious. Darwin in action, its a beautiful thing.

https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/

WOW - just wow. No need to guess about your background. "Das ist verboten!!!!" Good argument you provided there. Well done.


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Old 20th Sep 2021, 00:01
  #504 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
WOW - just wow. No need to guess about your background. "Das ist verboten!!!!" Good argument you provided there. Well done.
Good argument? What argument? I'm mocking you, no argument needs to be made. The 'argument' ended a long time ago when the worlds non-idiots took the advice of the worlds scientific community, got vaccinated and immediately and massively reduced their risk from COVID.

But please, don't let me interrupt you from telling us all about 'what should be done', to such great effect. No doubt Governments around the world hang on your every well informed word.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 00:05
  #505 (permalink)  
 
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Pre covid the flu killed thousands of people each season. My 84 yr old mum would probably fall off the perch if she caught the flu. I would get the flu jab every year. Never heard a mass cry in the public for everyone to get vaccinated to save other people for catching the flu...........
I think you have missed the message repeated thousands of times that the whole point of lockdown and vaccination was to reduce the mortality and severity of covid to flu levels, not to eradicate it. Covid can not be eradicated, but we have managed to control it so far to keep the death rate just above annual flu rates with lockdown, and now vaccines will take over as the primary control as things open up. 2019 was a bad season for flu in Australia and around 900 died from it, in a season with little to no intervention. 2020 led to 900 deaths of covid WITH controls and intervention, that number would be at least 3 times higher with no controls in place, possibly factors of ten as the aged care sector was not prepared for it at the time. If covid can be kept to flu levels or less, hospitals can cope, if not, good luck, you have the USA situation.

Thankfully the same precautions that limit covid almost stop flu dead in it's tracks so we don't have two viruses attacking our respiratory system at once, (they are different viruses by the way).

Last edited by 43Inches; 20th Sep 2021 at 00:15.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 01:49
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https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/. …..Amazing

There is also an article on the ABC site today describing what its like in ICU full of COVID patients.

Make sure you post a video when it gets round to you Muttley. It will be must watch.

Not being ghoulish , just like your explanation of what’s happening in real time.

Last edited by Grumpy retiree; 20th Sep 2021 at 02:13.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 02:28
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
Wiz -

Pre covid the flu killed thousands of people each season. My 84 yr old mum would probably fall off the perch if she caught the flu. I would get the flu jab every year. Never heard a mass cry in the public for everyone to get vaccinated to save other people for catching the flu...........
Except she'd likely die of pneumonia not influenza, statistically speaking.

I think people get frustrated with those that talk down vaccine mandates because the arguments against them are simply so weak. Present a coherent argument which overturns the tsunami of scientific evidence and ongoing research and people will listen. "I simply don't want to and reserve to the right to do what I want" just doesn't cut it. But you still have the choice of restricting yourself to those professions that don't require vaccination, just like you don't have to travel to countries that require prior vaccination.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 02:45
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I'm not a fan of vaccination passports, it achieves not much tangible other than to push a few to get vaccinated, and maybe to maintain vaccination. With regard to a company mandating it, that is tangible, the cost of sick leave of an unvaccinated staff member is exactly relatable to the efficacy of the vaccine. If the staff member is 80% less likely to get symptomatic covid, that's 80% less chance of having 2 weeks+ sick leave to pay out. Then there's the recovery cost of a crew getting sick on a layover, possible law suits if someone gets sick on a flight etc etc. There is direct measurable cost saving to the bean counters for vaccinated vs not, and you can't argue with that.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 03:01
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I remember reading previously someone who wasn’t getting jabbed said of the QF Mandate, ‘it’s advice not policy’…well it is now….anti vaxxers are in for a fight I guess.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 03:42
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
Wiz -

Pre covid the flu killed thousands of people each season. My 84 yr old mum would probably fall off the perch if she caught the flu. I would get the flu jab every year. Never heard a mass cry in the public for everyone to get vaccinated to save other people for catching the flu...........
.
Can you name a year since 1919 where flu killed 600 000 Americans?
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 03:49
  #511 (permalink)  
 
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43 Inches -
I'm not a fan of vaccination passports, it achieves not much tangible other than to push a few to get vaccinated
Hoorayyy my point exactly.

With regard to a company mandating it, that is tangible, the cost of sick leave of an unvaccinated staff member is exactly relatable to the efficacy of the vaccine. If the staff member is 80% less likely to get symptomatic covid, that's 80% less chance of having 2 weeks+ sick leave to pay out.
Same applies with the flu does it not? By your argument- moving forward - companies sure mandate vaccinations for the flu as well as Covid.




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Old 20th Sep 2021, 04:06
  #512 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
43 Inches - Hoorayyy my point exactly.


Same applies with the flu does it not? By your argument- moving forward - companies sure mandate vaccinations for the flu as well as Covid.
Covid-is-not-the-flu.

If this were bubonic plague, you'd be cool with flying with someone who might give it to you?
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 04:35
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Same applies with the flu does it not? By your argument- moving forward - companies sure mandate vaccinations for the flu as well as Covid.
I'm not arguing that point, just stating that's how a company looks at it. Flu jabs are not as reliable as the Covid jab is proving to be, many still get symptomatic flu, just at a lower severity, which means they should be staying home anyway to avoid passing it on. But, hey, who knows it may become a requirement as flu is a significant cost to most companies, that's another bridge of many other bridges to consider.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 04:38
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WIZ - I-KNOW - You are blurring the lines. 43Inches was saying that mandatory vaccinations from a company was to reduce sick days and by that argument, Flu vaccines should be mandated.

Wiz are you being deliberately thick?
If this were bubonic plague, you'd be cool with flying with someone who might give it to you?
If I had been vaccinated against bubonic plague, then I wouldn't care if I was flying with someone who wasn't vaccinated.


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Old 20th Sep 2021, 05:02
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Originally Posted by Wizofoz
Covid-is-not-the-flu.

If this were bubonic plague, you'd be cool with flying with someone who might give it to you?
Thats the point of being vaccinated - so I don’t get it.

The BS about it not being a selfish act is just that! Vaccines are for YOU to stay safe. Like a seatbelt.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 05:27
  #516 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
WIZ - I-KNOW - You are blurring the lines. 43Inches was saying that mandatory vaccinations from a company was to reduce sick days and by that argument, Flu vaccines should be mandated.
But as with anything, it's a matter of degree- the impact of Covid on a company is much bigger than the flu. You are using a "slippery slope' argument, badly.

Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
Wiz are you being deliberately thick? If I had been vaccinated against bubonic plague, then I wouldn't care if I was flying with someone who wasn't vaccinated.
Then you're a fool. No vaccine is 100% effective, so you should very much care about flying with someone who is much more likely to have it and give it to you (who can then pass it on to others-elderly relatives, imuno-suppressed children) than someone who has been responsible. If we go the "Doherty" model and simply let the virus go, I will strenuosly object to flying with anyone unvaccinated.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 05:51
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The major problem with un-vaccinated people is that given enough of them they provide a petri dish for the virus to spread. The more a virus spreads, the more it replicates, the more chance of mutation that defeats the vaccine, and we start from square one all over again. Even if a vaccine is not 100% effective it provides significant slow down of the process. So vaccination has a part to play in the individual to protect them, and in the herd to prevent rapid transmission and mutation. Or we could just do what nature does, wolves apparently are very good 'medication' for herd animals, they have been proven to reduce disease in wild deer and swine population as they kill off and eat any infected slow and struggling members of the herd before they infect the others, just a thought.

Maybe we should reintroduce large wolf packs into low vaccination areas, those that can run fast enough can reach safety, those that can't well, circle of life stuff.... It would make good television anyway, narrated by Attenborough.

And just to be clear, before vaccines pandemics/epidemics would run for years. The Spanish flu of 1918 ran for 3 years, eventually infecting 1/3rd of the world and killing 50 million and covid is about the same virulence with about 4 times the morbidity.

Last edited by 43Inches; 20th Sep 2021 at 06:13.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 06:01
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
Wiz are you being deliberately thick?
Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc
If I had been vaccinated against bubonic plague, then I wouldn't care if I was flying with someone who wasn't vaccinated.
You are aware that no vaccine has 100% efficacy right? Given that no doubt "you've done your research" and now are more knowledgeable than the worlds scientific community, the fact you're asking if another poster is being 'deliberately thick' whilst demonstrably failing to understand even the most fundamental workings of a vaccine is just.. well. Its just great. Highly entertaining.

I put it to you you're either lying to win a meaningless internet argument, because nobody in their right mind vaccinated or not is going to sit next to someone with the hyper contagious black bloody death if they have even a 5% chance of contracting it. Or, you're thick. Deliberately so. Spectacularly so.

I honestly can't tell! Fantastic.

Originally Posted by SpecialOptomist
The BS about it not being a selfish act is just that! Vaccines are for YOU to stay safe. Like a seatbelt.
And yet its illegal not to wear a seatbelt....

I suppose its never dawned on the 'I've done my research' brigade that there is more than one dynamic to the argument of the vaccine protecting other people. Right now, people in the USA are dying not because they have COVID, but because they can't get treatment for conventional illness due to the fact ICU beds are saturated around the country, needlessly, because of anti-vax terminally stupid soon to be statistics.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...hospitals-icu/

And this is in a country that has 29.4 ICU beds per 100,000 people, vs Australia who have just 9.

tHe vaCcINe iS oNLy fOr YOuR saFetY.

Man I really need to update my bids for the Qantas deadline. When is it again? November?



Last edited by das Uber Soldat; 20th Sep 2021 at 06:26.
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 06:31
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Some of the posters here might want to read some FIR NOTAMs of various countries around the world and ask themselves how any airline can send unvaccinated crews there, and that’s withiut weighing up the issue of increased chances of unvaxed crew member getting sick and then getting the whole crew stuck for 14 days (or 21 in some parts) or just what restaurant you might be allowed to eat at…
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Old 20th Sep 2021, 06:37
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Rex Airlines announces compulsory Covid-19 vaccination for frontline staff

Time to change the thread title? For, among others, all pilots, cabin crew and check-in staff. Your namesake Capn Rex! Though I notice that in between all the questions you are asking of others, you didn't get around to answering mine regarding your questions about reinfection with covid - if you've survived one car accident, would you recommend getting in another one as the first one didn't kill you? We'll see if any of the more outspoken regional pilots (as opposed to those who are - or pretend to be - mainline pilots on here) are prepared to put their money where their mouths are too, and go to "non customer-facing roles, where available."
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