Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

All borders to reopen.

Old 24th Aug 2020, 08:05
  #1021 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 1998
Location: The Swan Downunder
Posts: 1,138
Received 89 Likes on 53 Posts
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
Well this has got me so furious, I have actually written to the Governor of Victoria, the Honourable Linda Dessau AC
to express my views and asking her to sack the government with immediate effect. If Kerr can do it you can do it.
Good idea garlic with kababs tonight.
I can just imagine what you wrote, you're probably on the national terrorist list now then.
Xeptu is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 09:24
  #1022 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 440
Likes: 0
Received 45 Likes on 22 Posts
Originally Posted by Stickshift3000
The State of Emergency provisions under Vic's Public Health & Wellbeing Act allows directions to be made to reduce public health risk (such as: wearing of a face mask in public places, etc).

It can only currently be in place for a 6 month duration (that date is coming up very soon); the Vic government is proposing to make it a maximum of 18 months. Passing this bill would result in government spending less $$ drafting new legislation every time the State of Emergency lapses.

This is completely unrelated to the border closure (by NSW).
You are being very kind saying it is saving drafting cost; Andrews is never scared of spending a dollar if it suits him. It gives the government the power to declare laws without putting them before parliament. It allows the government to suspend laws without reference to parliament. It means parliament may not sit until some time next year. It is a dangerous precedent and very un-Australian.
1A_Please is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 12:20
  #1023 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 1998
Location: The Swan Downunder
Posts: 1,138
Received 89 Likes on 53 Posts
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
Good advice, I'm reading up on some good books doing up a Boeing 707-436 1:144 BOAC and a stack of exercises and I'm sleeping ok.
Thanks thisishardtochoose and xeptu. Good health to all.
You're welcome mate.
Xeptu is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 13:09
  #1024 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Tent
Posts: 924
Received 33 Likes on 16 Posts
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
Good advice, I'm reading up on some good books doing up a Boeing 707-436 1:144 BOAC and a stack of exercises and I'm sleeping ok.
Thanks thisishardtochoose and xeptu. Good health to all.
If you want the really good food - top range organic with advice in Victoria.

My sister has done it on scale for 30+years on a pro basis,
wholesale and retail not just in Australia.

Keep calm and pm if needed.
Bend alot is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 13:16
  #1025 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sydney
Age: 61
Posts: 496
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
From the outset, this has been one very strange virus. Most infectious diseases are most virulent where they originate, and become pprogressively less dangerous as they spread. The opposite is true for COVID with China (apparently) having very small numbers per capita relative to the rest of the world. Decidedly asymmetrical.

I wonder.

The median age of death (all causes) in Australia is about 81. The median age of death for Australians who died of COVID is 83. So COVID is more skewed towards the elderly than is all cause mortality.

Approx 5% of the Australian population is older than 80. That compares with about 1% older than 80 in China.

So just how noticeable would COVID be in a country with only 1% older than 80? Is China really free of COVID? Or does it simply fly under the radar with so few older than 80? Especially when the party line is that it is under control. Maybe some elderly Chinese are dying of "old age", while younger Chinese are simply getting a "cold." I am not sure how much testing they are doing for COVID in China. Maybe they have decided to "eradicate " it and get on with business.


On a related point, this article makes you wonder about the wisdom of wide societal lockdowns.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/covid...rtin-kulldorff
slats11 is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 14:51
  #1026 (permalink)  

Evertonian
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: #3117# Ppruner of the Year Nominee 2005
Posts: 12,610
Received 113 Likes on 66 Posts
"Hello. On behalf of Chairman Dan, we'd like to thank you for calling the Peoples Democratic Republic of Victoria.
Our line is busy at the moment, however, a Comrade will speak to you soon as your call is important to us.
If you wish to report a breach of COVID restrictions, please press 1.
If you'd like to report the incorrect or lack of mask usage, please press 2.
If you'd like a mandatory Vaccine injection, please press 3 & ask for Scott.
If you'd like to leave Victoria, please hold the line and one of our Socially Inclusive Security staff will be with you shortly."

Buster Hyman is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 22:23
  #1027 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sydney
Posts: 671
Received 158 Likes on 65 Posts
Originally Posted by Buster Hyman
"Hello. On behalf of Chairman Dan, we'd like to thank you for calling the Peoples Democratic Republic of Victoria.
Our line is busy at the moment, however, a Comrade will speak to you soon as your call is important to us.
If you wish to report a breach of COVID restrictions, please press 1.
If you'd like to report the incorrect or lack of mask usage, please press 2.
If you'd like a mandatory Vaccine injection, please press 3 & ask for Scott.
If you'd like to leave Victoria, please hold the line and one of our Socially Inclusive Security staff will be with you shortly."

Too much Sky News?
Ladloy is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 23:34
  #1028 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Cab of a Freight Train
Posts: 1,233
Received 132 Likes on 67 Posts
Clive Palmer's case returns to the Federal Court at 1415 AEST today. Stay tuned!

He's arguing under s.92 of the constitution though, so even if he loses, there's still scope for another challenge under s.117. The interesting bit though, according to WA's CHO:
Originally Posted by The ABC
WA's Chief Health Officer Andrew Robertson told the Federal Court there was little public health justification for keeping WA closed to the five other states and territories that had eliminated coronavirus.
KRviator is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 00:54
  #1029 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Up The 116E, Stbd Turn at 32S...:-)
Age: 82
Posts: 3,106
Received 57 Likes on 25 Posts
"Eliminated' or just not enuf testing performed as yet..... I wonder....??
Ex FSO GRIFFO is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 01:19
  #1030 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Most locked down city in the world
Posts: 546
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
last night I said a coup, a Warsaw uprising well reading todays newspapers I'm not far off the mark.
Darren Hinch's Justice party was going to back it last night, this morning doesn't look like he going to cross the floor.
Dan needs 4 to cross the floor for another 12 months of this nonsense. Only 1 at this stage Animal party.
He needs another 3 and I don't think he's going to get them.
Relax Buster we still got a little bit of democracy left before the hammer and sickle flag goes up.
What happens in 3 weeks will be interesting though.

Turnleft080 is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 01:24
  #1031 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sydney
Age: 61
Posts: 496
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
"Eliminated' or just not enuf testing performed as yet..... I wonder....??
I reckon they understand this virus pretty well. Getting on with business and picking fights in all directions, while we are trying to find our way out of this social and economic mess.
slats11 is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 01:38
  #1032 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Australia
Posts: 358
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
What happens in 3 weeks will be interesting though.
In 3 weeks?

You simply let the State of Emergency lapse for a single day (State Mask Off Day?) then it can be reinstated for a further 6 months... Vic government knows this.
Stickshift3000 is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 01:53
  #1033 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Most locked down city in the world
Posts: 546
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Stickshift3000
In 3 weeks?

You simply let the State of Emergency lapse for a single day (State Mask Off Day?) then it can be reinstated for a further 6 months... Vic government knows this.
What happens in 3 I meant, do we stay in a state of disaster or do we downgrade to a state of emergency. Do we stay at stage 4 or downgrade to stage 3.
I heard from ministers on radio (forgot their names) even if we had zero cases stage 3 would be the lowest. Incredibly amazing.

Let me pour more fuel over the fire. Gil Mclachlan should fire a warning shot off Spring street stating 'if you win an extra 12 months of SOE then no
football for the whole state next year'. Not one game. Gil has no choice.

Last edited by Turnleft080; 25th Aug 2020 at 06:40.
Turnleft080 is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 11:54
  #1034 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: YMML
Posts: 77
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
What happens in 3 I meant, do we stay in a state of disaster or do we downgrade to a state of emergency. Do we stay at stage 4 or downgrade to stage 3.
I heard from ministers on radio (forgot their names) even if we had zero cases stage 3 would be the lowest. Incredibly amazing.

Let me pour more fuel over the fire. Gil Mclachlan should fire a warning shot off Spring street stating 'if you win an extra 12 months of SOE then no
football for the whole state next year'. Not one game. Gil has no choice.
You do realise that Dan is only trying to extend the TOTAL LIMIT of SOE which is 6 months currently. This in no way shape or form means that we will be in these restrictions for the whole period of extra 12 months. Just like now SOE can only be extended in blocks of 4 weeks each.

I hope this makes sense, MSM and the opposition party have done their absolute best to avoid this particular detail.
thisishardtochoose is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 13:17
  #1035 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Most locked down city in the world
Posts: 546
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by thisishardtochoose
You do realise that Dan is only trying to extend the TOTAL LIMIT of SOE which is 6 months currently. This in no way shape or form means that we will be in these restrictions for the whole period of extra 12 months. Just like now SOE can only be extended in blocks of 4 weeks each.

I hope this makes sense, MSM and the opposition party have done their absolute best to avoid this particular detail.
Yeah got it, though it's like no one is on the same page. To many ego's and they are all trying to be the lead actor in a movie.
Speaking of movie's the whole government should watch Apollo 13, and see how a group of people on the ground deal with stress
in trying to save a spacecraft. Remember the line work the problem, failure is not an option. Well the government is failing the
state with no limits no objective. Suppression or elimination. Victorians want to know the limits, the objective so we can plan ahead.
Maybe they should do a CRM course learn to keep everyone in the loop. Learn to be a leader not a dictator. Learn the Swiss cheese effect.
The holes all lined up with hotel quarantine.

Turnleft080 is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 13:31
  #1036 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,082
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
And yet in NSW no "State of Emergency" required as the provisions contained therein (VIC) are available for general use regarding matters of public health without any further formality.

"The New South Wales Government doesn't even need to declare a state of emergency to deal with a public health issue.

The state's Health Minister, Brad Hazzard, can make any direction he needs to reduce or remove the risk of COVID-19 in an area, to segregate or isolate people, or to block access to any part of NSW."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08-...tions/12592714
currawong is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 14:03
  #1037 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Most locked down city in the world
Posts: 546
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by currawong
And yet in NSW no "State of Emergency" required as the provisions contained therein (VIC) are available for general use regarding matters of public health without any further formality.

"The New South Wales Government doesn't even need to declare a state of emergency to deal with a public health issue.

The state's Health Minister, Brad Hazzard, can make any direction he needs to reduce or remove the risk of COVID-19 in an area, to segregate or isolate people, or to block access to any part of NSW."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08-...tions/12592714
Struth, almost sounds like my plan B I wrote #776.
Turnleft080 is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 16:35
  #1038 (permalink)  

Evertonian
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: #3117# Ppruner of the Year Nominee 2005
Posts: 12,610
Received 113 Likes on 66 Posts
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
Remember the line work the problem, failure is not an option.
There's also a great moment where Gene Kranz admonishes the NASA Director saying "With all due respect, sir, I believe this is gonna be our finest hour."....yeah, nah....
Buster Hyman is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2020, 01:22
  #1039 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sydney
Age: 61
Posts: 496
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
A very strange virus at a very odd time

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/08/t...il&login=email

COVID PSYOPS
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psycho...United_States)

Having inflicted this on the world and then sent the world into a tailspin, China is getting down to business and aggressively pushing its international agenda

It does seem strange that early efforts to influence the world focussed on Italy. But then of course, China recognised the huge number of residents from Wuhan who were working in Italy - with multiple daily direct flights between Wuhan and Milan.

https://thediplomat.com/2020/03/chin...nd-propaganda/
With friends like this, who needs enemies

Last edited by slats11; 26th Aug 2020 at 01:47.
slats11 is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2020, 04:13
  #1040 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Cab of a Freight Train
Posts: 1,233
Received 132 Likes on 67 Posts
So, after downloading, printing and reading through the full judgement in Palmer v Western Australia (No4) today, several things are apparent from Justice Rangiah's judgement.

Firstly, and most importantly, it appears Justice Rangiah found essentially in favour of WA in as much as their "hard border" is the singular most effective way to prevent the importation and consequent spread of Covid-19 into WA. Other measures, he wrote, were not as effective as the border closure, even though it had limitations in providing exemptions for certain people. These comments appear to reinforce WA's stance that they will not remove their "hard border" to any state until there is zero community transmission, which the judgement defines as "two incubation periods" totalling 28 days. The reason for that is to prevent "Border hopping" ie NSW-NT-WA when NSW-WA is currently prohibited.

The hearing was conducted with the agreement of all parties as to whether the border restrictions were currently justified (at the time of the hearings) - not whether they were justified when implemented. Notably the hearings were conducted 27-31 July, almost smack in the middle of the Victorian outbreak, and it is notable reading through the judgement that that outbreak - and the flow on one in NSW attributed to it - appeared to heavily influence both the experts opinion and the Justice's thinking.

The judgement was only concerned with the public health aspects of the case - there was no discussion able to consider the social, economic or constitutional aspects of it. That'll come later with Clive going to the High Court to continue his s.92 challenge, though I can foresee that being a bit harder now the Federal Court has found the Border Closures, essentially, justifiable.

The other notable thing from reading the judgement was it appeared - to me at least - to focus almost entirely on the absolute worst-case outcome should Covid-19 1. Be imported into WA and 2. be allowed to run rampant with community transmission. This is despite the judgement also finding WA has strong surveillance and testing systems, and has been successful in containing outbreaks in the past. (Pg. 67 [296]) which would appear more reasonable given what has gone on elsewhere, in NSW and Qld for example.


Food for thought should Clive lose his s.92 case and you want to go to WA anytime until a vaccine is found.......
KRviator is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.