Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

Qantas Recruitment

Old 7th Jun 2018, 01:48
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Originally Posted by Seagull201
Looking at the big picture, once this QF academy starts and is up and running, producing 100 cadets a year.
I see a number of these cadets going straight to the B7378 as F/O's, others may go to the Dash 8 or as Second Officers.

Jetstar cadets are going straight to the A320 as F/O's, i see QF doing the same.
From a pure observer's point of view, i see this happening without any doubt.
I was always under the impression that the flying school was for qlink?

All media pics iíve Seen have featured dash 8ís and thatís the impression I got from the qlink CP at the qantas roadshow?
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 01:52
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Originally Posted by dragon man
Really, hardest working? 900 hours in 12 months not enough?
dragon man are you talking about the 737 op because hardest working doesnít just come down to flying hours. I have a friend at network. Their monthly roster stands at 74 flying hours to 155 duty hours. Donít think there is that kind of gap on the 73. Personally I look at duty as opposed to flying as itís the duty that means Iím away from home.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 02:00
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Not one RAAF applicant that I know of who applied in the latest round got asked to complete further testing. Perhaps there is more to this rumor of some deal between RAAF DP and Qantas HR.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 02:14
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Originally Posted by Slezy9
Not one RAAF applicant that I know of who applied in the latest round got asked to complete further testing. Perhaps there is more to this rumor of some deal between RAAF DP and Qantas HR.
Or maybe the ones you know of just didnít meet the standards, attitudes or experience that is being sought. Why do you assume that your RAAF mates should automatically get accepted into selection, when the standard is so high that thousand hour turboprop captains are getting knocked back? Being ex-RAAF doesnít automatically equal ďgreat airline pilotĒ.

Maybe recruiting are focusing on applicants with current jet airline experience? It looks like recruits are spending very little time as an SO or even none at all, so they want candidates who can easily transition into an FO role. From what Iím hearing in this time of supposed HR driven ďyes menĒ being favoured, the candidates who have been selected in the last two years are actually considered very competent and they arenít the ones having issues with their FO training.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 02:30
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Jc31 - spending the day at a fully equipped mine site in private accommodation with great meals , pool , gym , foxtel and internet will be a hard sell against 4 or 5 sector days etc. The Learmonth day is not so rosy but alas that's Network.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 02:36
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Originally Posted by GoldCoastTobacconist
Jc31 - spending the day at a fully equipped mine site in private accommodation with great meals , pool , gym , foxtel and internet will be a hard sell against 4 or 5 sector days etc. The Learmonth day is not so rosy but alas that's Network.
donít know what mine sites youíve been to but Iíve never seen one as amazing as that! The dash guys are doing 4/5 sector days. Those guys donít get enough credit. That kind of flying is hard!
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 02:49
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Sounds more likely that applicants will be vectored towards the under crewed subsidiaries, for a minimum return of service, before being able to move across to the parent. Might actually make sense......or itís all completely random.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 06:17
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Originally Posted by Slezy9
Not one RAAF applicant that I know of who applied in the latest round got asked to complete further testing. Perhaps there is more to this rumor of some deal between RAAF DP and Qantas HR.
Iíve been told by someone on the inside that there is truth to this rumour. RAAF pilots arenít the only ones being held back by such an arrangement. There have been a number of discriminatory practices by HR that could open themselves up to litigation, but I doubt anybody would call them out on it and burn that bridge.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 08:26
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Aghh this all really cracks me up. I have flown all around the world, of all nationalities and sexes. No set race or sex makes a good pilot, it purely comes down to the skill and outlook that makes a good pilot

Yet here in the land of equality skills take a back seat. We have experienced Captains getting turned down and although I know that there are plenty of more experienced people then myself out there (In my 30's and a few thousand hours on the B737-800) I also got a thank you but no thank you email from QF.

This in the face of them setting up a flight school due to them saying they have a lack of pilots, doing a roadshow around the country and although I hate to say it because I would like to believe we are all looked on at our skill and experience level, their being a number of very young female second officers being employed.

Unfortunately I have given up on the QF Dream and I believe that's actually a good thing, I would prefer to work for a company that values experience and skills and not ticking off a HR column for specific demographics.

And before the negative comments role in, some of the best pilots I have ever flown with are female, but equality should be about EVERYONE getting a fair go, not disregarding candidates on what sex they are.

All the best everyone, keep the blue side up.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 08:33
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dragon man

As said earlier, it's not always about flying hours. Regional flying is always limited by duty hours, as very few sectors are greater than one hour. Can only speak for the props (and when I left late last year), but Eastern and Sunstate pilots were pretty much flying 19 or 20 days out of every 28, and averaging four sectors per day. I keep in touch with many of the crew and little has changed. Something else to remember is that the increased workload that the 737 crews are flying is relatively recent. The type of workload that I described earlier started making it's appearance around four years ago at the link, it was common when I left. Ever since the idiots that run the place decided that they only needed 8 pilots for each aircraft (4 Capts, 4 FO's.).

And don't forget the pay. A 10 year Q400 captain has a base around 130k. Allowances (even with the increased workload) are probably only another 25k on top of that. So quite a bit less than a 737 FO.

Looking at the big picture, once this QF academy starts and is up and running, producing 100 cadets a year.
I see a number of these cadets going straight to the B7378 as F/O's, others may go to the Dash 8 or as Second Officers.

Jetstar cadets are going straight to the A320 as F/O's, i see QF doing the same.
From a pure observer's point of view, i see this happening without any doubt.
I've seen a lot of your comments. I'll be kind and say that you're being a little naÔve if you believe this.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 08:41
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Originally Posted by dr dre


Or maybe the ones you know of just didn’t meet the standards, attitudes or experience that is being sought. Why do you assume that your RAAF mates should automatically get accepted into selection, when the standard is so high that thousand hour turboprop captains are getting knocked back? Being ex-RAAF doesn’t automatically equal “great airline pilot”.

Maybe recruiting are focusing on applicants with current jet airline experience? It looks like recruits are spending very little time as an SO or even none at all, so they want candidates who can easily transition into an FO role. From what I’m hearing in this time of supposed HR driven “yes men” being favoured, the candidates who have been selected in the last two years are actually considered very competent and they aren’t the ones having issues with their FO training.
I don't think he is implying that a RAAF pilot is any better at all or automatically worthy of a gig with QF.

There have been rumors for some time of a plea deal between Government and Airlines with regards to pilot recruitment and retention. It's not unreasonable to link no one getting offers (many with thousands of hours on big jets) and a very steadily declining RAAF pilot group to link the two of them together. There's no need to be so defensive. I'm really not sure why pilots feel the need to fight each other.

If it is indeed true, I wouldn't be surprised.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 09:28
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Hot off the rumour mill. The fuel price has them on a cost cutting campaign. They are burning the midnight oil at the moment to come up with a plan to call the 787 a 747 replacement and therefore avoid a RIN. Do I believe it? Yes, they have no scruples or morals.
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 09:40
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'replacement'? Sounds like a half assed rumour to me, that's IA terminology, ain't it?
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Old 7th Jun 2018, 10:43
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Originally Posted by dragon man
Hot off the rumour mill. The fuel price has them on a cost cutting campaign. They are burning the midnight oil at the moment to come up with a plan to call the 787 a 747 replacement and therefore avoid a RIN. Do I believe it? Yes, they have no scruples or morals.
In the other thread we spoke extensively on the impact of fuel. Fuel prices are 21% higher than 12 months ago.
Qantas due fleet composition are more exposed than those carriers who re-equipped a decade ago. Qantas could well whipsaw (if the idiot analysts ever bother checking the numbers)

Sources inside Qantas quietly suggested while little Napoleon was busy spending shareholder money funding/pushing his personal social view in the Same Sex Marriage 'discussion', alleged elements of Senior Management were very concerned with the term structure in the Oil and thus Jet fuel market.
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Old 8th Jun 2018, 01:20
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Originally Posted by QldPilotGuy
Aghh this all really cracks me up. I have flown all around the world, of all nationalities and sexes. No set race or sex makes a good pilot, it purely comes down to the skill and outlook that makes a good pilot

Yet here in the land of equality skills take a back seat. We have experienced Captains getting turned down and although I know that there are plenty of more experienced people then myself out there (In my 30's and a few thousand hours on the B737-800) I also got a thank you but no thank you email from QF.

This in the face of them setting up a flight school due to them saying they have a lack of pilots, doing a roadshow around the country and although I hate to say it because I would like to believe we are all looked on at our skill and experience level, their being a number of very young female second officers being employed.

Unfortunately I have given up on the QF Dream and I believe that's actually a good thing, I would prefer to work for a company that values experience and skills and not ticking off a HR column for specific demographics.

And before the negative comments role in, some of the best pilots I have ever flown with are female, but equality should be about EVERYONE getting a fair go, not disregarding candidates on what sex they are.

All the best everyone, keep the blue side up.
here here, it's unfortunate that it has come to this. Equality is meant to go both ways.
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Old 9th Jun 2018, 00:47
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In the allocations released yesterday, Melbourne 737 F/O is now junior to Perth and Adelaide. Looks to be a huge amount of movement through Melbourne with people shuffling 737-330-787 and changing seats versus minimal movement in Perth or Adelaide.

I donít have an updated seniority list but those 737 Melbourne spots are going to people with less than 12 months in the company. Sydney isnít far behind either. Good time to be a new joiner if you donít particularly want to sit in the back seat and ride the party bus
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Old 9th Jun 2018, 04:00
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Keg

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Originally Posted by Transition Layer
In the allocations released yesterday, Melbourne 737 F/O is now junior to Perth and Adelaide.
I think youíll find not enough S/Os are bidding for ADL or PER so Qantas cut the cloth to match the bids. A few months back a colleague was told he was a shoe in for a PER command. The lack of S/Os bidding for F/O PER means that is no longer the case. And he missed out. Qantas wants to keep Captain and F/O numbers the same in PER but they canít get the PER base to the size they want due to lack of F/O bids. The flying still needs to be crewed so the end result is bigger bases where people are bidding to go and Qantas will have to wear increased accommodation costs in PER.
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Old 9th Jun 2018, 04:02
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Originally Posted by WillieTheWimp
If a new joiner was to start at mainline, what kind of progression in base and rank could one expect including the less popular bases (not sure which one, however I assume it is PER). What is the likelyhood of being offered a FO slot on day one? I have heard rumours of this happening but is there any first hand information out there. Appreciate any insight...
Not day one. Normally day two or three. (Thatís serious by the way). Of course with the recent promulgation of training slots that may decrease for the next few months. Iíd expect them to start offering PER 737 F/O in the first week again from about the end of this year or early next year.
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Old 9th Jun 2018, 05:31
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Originally Posted by Keg


I think youíll find not enough S/Os are bidding for ADL or PER so Qantas cut the cloth to match the bids...Qantas wants to keep Captain and F/O numbers the same in PER but they canít get the PER base to the size they want due to lack of F/O bids.
Gíday Keg,
Hadnít considered that scenario. Perhaps itís time to start recruiting directly for Perth 737 F/O positions then. Surely a LoA or whatever the equivalent is these days could be put together to allow direct entry F/O spots under certain conditions (Condition #1 would be no current QF Pilots can be bidding for that base and category.)
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Old 9th Jun 2018, 08:05
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Unfortunately LoAís arenít permissible anymore and Qantas are not seeking to amend the SH EBA to allow for it in this current round of bargaining.

Seems short-sighted as there should be a way to allow for it without upsetting the already employed pilots.
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