Southampton-3

[TCAS FAN]

I also wonder if perhaps they were holding off to see if SOU got rid of their performance limitations and potentially increased their opening hours. Now that neither of those things have really happened despite the runway extension, Jet2 have made a decision and plumped for BOH as the better candidate on the south coast.

If you look at the destinations, many are beyond economically viable loads from SOU, even with the Neo. It appears to be merely a case of the increased options available with BOH’s longer runway.

[Sharklet_321]

Jet2 may well operate a double BOH and SOU base in the future. There is no reason why Jet2 can't put two A320's into SOU when they are delivered and operate to some of the places that are more economically viable from SOU's runway.

I would be very surprised if easyJet did not respond defensively by opening a SOU base now with 2 or 3 A320's and serving some obvious routes that BOH are not doing such as Croatia, Poland, Austria, etc.

This may mean AGS needing to unlock the flood gates and allowing easyJet to do AMS, CDG, EDI, JER too.

[SWBKCB]

Is there any evidence that EZY regard SOU as a significant market to take such action? And what's this about AGS 'allowing' EZY. If they wanted to, they could be operating those routes now

[shamrock7seal]

If I was easyJet I would want to defend my LGW operation and consolidate there. SOU is a costly airport to operate from (having no other sources of commercial revenue) BUT easyJet Holidays do seem to compete well with Jet2 Holidays at other bases. Look at BRS for example.

Jet2 does not operate from LGW so easyJet has a strategic advantage there. Is there any advantage to easyJet purposely loosing £m's by basing aircraft at SOU in order to defend LGW? Crazier things have been done so perhaps one should never say never.

Replicating what they do at SEN at SOU? They operate from SEN because they do not serve STN in any significant way, so we can't really draw comparisons there.

[Sharklet_321]

I'm sure they are not actively encouraging easyJet on to AMS because of the harm it may do to the relatively new and recently expanded KLM service to AMS. Airports always try and control what airlines do through their airports with incentives or lack thereof. I can guarantee you that nobody wants a repeat of the Flybe debacle. Different airlines on different routes has been the way they have shaped the airport post COVID and its served them very well thus far.

[wanna]

This may mean AGS needing to unlock the flood gates and allowing easyJet to do AMS, CDG, EDI, JER too.

Could those routes sustain a large Easyjet presence without the current carriers scaling back or even stopping the services? Southampton is close enough to London its a good overspill, but its also close enough to London that your competing with those airports catchments too, especially easyjet to Jersey. 3 x ATR flights a day from SOU v 3 or more Airbus flights a day from LGW and a similar number from LHR.

Jet2 is a good fit for Bournemouth and is no doubt looking to compete heavily with TUI. Would a similar operation even make sense from SOU? Doubtful. Bournemouth offers bucket and spade / leisure and Southampton offers Business / Commuting and a small amount of Leisure. Both airports compliment with a similar 'central' catchment with BRS / EXT to BOHs west and LGW and LHR to SOUs north / NE.

[rustythumb]

Since Covid, the business market isn't what it once was. Not sure the demand is there in quite the same way.

[FRatSTN]

If I was easyJet I would want to defend my LGW operation and consolidate there. SOU is a costly airport to operate from (having no other sources of commercial revenue) BUT easyJet Holidays do seem to compete well with Jet2 Holidays at other bases. Look at BRS for example.

Jet2 does not operate from LGW so easyJet has a strategic advantage there. Is there any advantage to easyJet purposely loosing £m's by basing aircraft at SOU in order to defend LGW? Crazier things have been done so perhaps one should never say never.

Replicating what they do at SEN at SOU? They operate from SEN because they do not serve STN in any significant way, so we can't really draw comparisons there.

EasyJet are operating leisure oriented routes out of SEN because they can no longer compete with the frequency offered at STN, and SEN is seen as a differentiator in that market. Their retrenching against Ryanair as a low-cost competitor made their STN base stagnant for years before closing it during Covid. Now EZY have gone down the package holiday avenue, where Ryanair is less of a threat, and left a void that allowed Jet2 to expand there on a huge scale.

They chose to consolidate at LTN/LGW only to prove they then couldn't cope with the LGW operation last summer, neither can they hold on to the LGW slots they leased, so are now forced to cut their market share in London whilst competitors are growing. EZY will need to find a way to address that and find a way to differentiate. SEN or SOU are both viable candidates for that - They could both act essentially as a London overspill.

[vectisman]

EasyJet also have to return a further 140 weekly Gatwick slots to BA next year. That is equivalent to 10 round trips per day.

[rustythumb]

Jet2 may well operate a double BOH and SOU base in the future. There is no reason why Jet2 can't put two A320's into SOU when they are delivered and operate to some of the places that are more economically viable from SOU's runway.

Doesn't look like this will be a consideration, it looks like Jet2 have demarcated a pretty large catchment area between BRS and STN for BOH to serve.

https://www.ttgmedia.com/news/jet2-boss-rules-out-gatwick-launch-and-says-no-more-new-bases-after-bournemouth-45518

[RW20]

So Jet 2 have all the ingredients at BOH to be a big success,a suitable runway for all destinations,no opening time restrictions,a vast holiday catchment area,a progressive management team. I can't believe that Easy at SOU will be able to complete with Jet2,Ryanair and Tui, or even want to.

[Pain in the R's]

Southampton builds a runway extension and is left with a few crumbs. It was not what I was expecting.

[SouthernAlliance]

So Jet 2 have all the ingredients at BOH to be a big success,a suitable runway for all destinations,no opening time restrictions,a vast holiday catchment area,a progressive management team. I can't believe that Easy at SOU will be able to complete with Jet2,Ryanair and Tui, or even want to.

Flying from SOU with the easyJet brand is still a very attractive option to many and do not underestimate this. Question is however will they expand?

[cavokblues]

As big a boost as it is for Bournemouth, the frequencies offered by Jet2 from there aren't massive.

Still plenty of potential growth for easyJet out of Southampton. I don't see it necessarily as one or the other....yet. However, I'm not sure they can afford to give Jet2 too much of a head start as they're a very canny, very well run operation and will no doubt will flood the local radios etc with marketing campaigns.

[rog747]

Easyjet do sell package holidays but they do not have the loyalty nor the brand power of TUI and Jet2 Holidays, but they are a good solid flight product.
so,
Easyjet may respond to Jet2's new BOH base with more leisure routes from SOU, but they can only be flown to destinations that will not be limited by SOU's runway performance, which could eliminate the Canaries, Cyprus, Turkey and the Greek Islands.


Ryanair of course do not sell traditional Package Holidays (in the true sense of the word).
That is the difference at BOH.

TUI Holidays and Jet2 Holidays (now the UK's #1 Holiday Operator) at BOH will be competing for the package holiday market (which is strong here in this area).
Folk will not now have to trek to LGW or to BRS.
EXT with TUI is a pretty small base with just one 737, but used to be much busier in the past.

[SouthernAlliance]

Easyjet do sell package holidays but they do not have the loyalty nor the brand power of TUI and Jet2 Holidays, but they are a good solid flight product.
so,
Easyjet may respond to Jet2's new BOH base with more leisure routes from SOU, but they can only be flown to destinations that will not be limited by SOU's runway performance, which could eliminate the Canaries, Cyprus, Turkey and the Greek Islands.


Ryanair of course do not sell traditional Package Holidays (in the true sense of the word).
That is the difference at BOH.

TUI Holidays and Jet2 Holidays (now the UK's #1 Holiday Operator) at BOH will be competing for the package holiday market (which is strong here in this area).
Folk will not now have to trek to LGW or to BRS.
EXT with TUI is a pretty small base with just one 737, but used to be much busier in the past.

Staying positive for the airport there are still plenty to go for from existing Orange bases, Nice, Bordeaux, Lyon, Barcelona, Lisbon, Malaga, Naples, Milan, Berlin and Manchester. All have a decent mix of sun, city culture and ski and would be a welcome alternative to bucket and spade from BOH, could do well!

[The Nutts Mutts]

It's still a big blow for SOU though- I know that Jet2 were one of the airlines they were actively courting for operations from the new extended runway.
To finally get the extension in place only to see Jet2 set up a base down the road at their local rival airport is going to sting a bit, particularly if Jet2 are saying that they've now closed their coverage gap along the south coast- it looks like SOU has, once again, missed the boat.

It's a great little airport to fly from but it really is a case study in stagnation and missed opportunities. I've got no doubt it'll continue to plod along serving a few domestic and European routes but I think that'll be all. Whereas down the road at BOH they've expanded their cargo operation, increased scheduled flights and now gained another based operator with a large and loyal following. This is all in addition to their large number of ancillary aviation services, again something that SOU lacks (apart from Signature and Jetworks) due to a shortage of available space, compounded by poor decision-making and a lack of investment over the years.

[Markushillman]

It's still a big blow for SOU though- I know that Jet2 were one of the airlines they were actively courting for operations from the new extended runway.
To finally get the extension in place only to see Jet2 set up a base down the road at their local rival airport is going to sting a bit, particularly if Jet2 are saying that they've now closed their coverage gap along the south coast- it looks like SOU has, once again, missed the boat.

It's a great little airport to fly from but it really is a case study in stagnation and missed opportunities. I've got no doubt it'll continue to plod along serving a few domestic and European routes but I think that'll be all. Whereas down the road at BOH they've expanded their cargo operation, increased scheduled flights and now gained another based operator with a large and loyal following. This is all in addition to their large number of ancillary aviation services, again something that SOU lacks (apart from Signature and Jetworks) due to a shortage of available space, compounded by poor decision-making and a lack of investment over the years.

Think it rather helps who the operator/owner of the airport is.

[SKOJB]

Think it rather helps who the operator/owner of the airport is.

Spot on. AGS seem uninterested in growth and developing a pro-active approach to airport ops and customer experience, also borne out by the same grumblings of people associated with ABZ/GLA. Rumours of a sale would back this up!

[Albert Hall]

I think they have their heads firmly buried in the re-financing needed to roll over the debt in AGS Group, and would not be at all surprised to see the group broken up. The interesting question is what happens to Aberdeen and Southampton under that scenario. Unlike Glasgow, they're both sub-scale for MAG. Maybe a sweep from someone like AMP, with no cross-over between existing investments at Newcastle and Leeds.

[LTNman]

Spot on. AGS seem uninterested in growth and developing a pro-active approach to airport ops and customer experience.


I can’t agree, as the company has spent millions extending the runway. They wouldn’t have done this unless they were not committed to substantial growth. The problem is that the airlines are not playing ball.

[RW20]

I can’t agree, as the company has spent millions extending the runway. They wouldn’t have done this unless they were not committed to substantial growth. The problem is that the airlines are not playing ball.
The airlines are not playing ball,because of the much talked about restrictions on runway performance and Airport opening hours

[LTNman]

That’s the problem but that is out of the control of AGS. Clearly they thought that a runway extension would be enough and would light the blue touch paper. Maybe they were actually wasting their money?

[cavokblues]

There is ample room at Southampton for an orange airline to grow. Whilst I agree the hours may prevent a based aircraft, if they had 2-3 weekly flights from some of their Med bases, Southampton would see a substantial growth in pax numbers.

Whether they have the appetite for it is another thing. They may feel their aircraft are better utilised elsewhere.

[vectisman]

As usual this thread is full of negativity. I am beginning to think some of you guys actually wet your pants with excitement when the news is not so good.

[SO24]

Hi all, I’m a new contributor with around 30 yrs in the aviation industry, Hampshire born/bred & lived away & overseas for many years but always followed the local aviation scene here with great interest so I hope my comments are relevant & interesting to all. Though without the Jet2 news is a game changer for BOH, my 1st airport of choice has always been SOU given my home location & it’s exemplary access links (I was home via train within 20 mins of arriving from AMS in rush hour again yesterday). I was amazed & delighted to see the runway extension at SOU approved after many years of conjecture, COVID and the environmental sensitive debates that often overshadow the aviation industry these days, but anything that negates a slog up the M3 to board a plane at silly o clock - especially for a short haul flight - makes sense to me. Having said that, the remaining operational constraints at SOU together with the Jet2 development bring the AGS partnership with EZY into laser like focus, and the key more than ever to SOU’s long term future. I completely agree with a previous post that an operation on the scale planned by Jet2 is outside the scope of SOU’s current operational capabilities anyway. However with the day-trip business market largely gone since COVID, servicing VFR and leisure business at competitive rates on an attractive route network will be the key to survival. I had to fly to GLA last Sept before EZY came into the route and had to pay £380 return for the privilege so I welcome EZYs increased frequencies this year and wish them all the best. Though the regional carriers have been SOU’s bedrock in the past, no-one should be afraid of competition in a free market & you're in the wrong business if you are. Ultimately the consumer will decide. If I were EZY and AGP, I would now be stressing their USP ie that EZY are the only carrier to operate low cost/competitively prices sun flights from SOU (I’m excluding BACF due their fare offering) which as all previously stated is a major plus. IMHO they are generally held as the attractive face of LCCs without the cynicism of RYR and I’ve always enjoyed flying with them. Their plans for S25 from SOU will now be critical, as stated there are many other Euro cities that could be potentially served on a ‘W’ pattern, so hopefully some managed growth within SOU’s capabilities will follow. One other observation - having flown from BOH several times in the past couple of years, they will need to up their landside operational game considerably to cope with this huge and sudden influx - the management of retail facilities has been appalling, and I can see gridlock from the A31 on days when there are 20 737MAX departures unless they are planning a major investment in local public transportation. And with the additional summer holiday traffic to the coast, it could take as long to get there as to LHR/LGW - certainly from mid-Hants anyway. It will be an interesting year!

[rog747]

Holiday airlines flying to most of the more popular and lucrative sunspots like the Greek Islands, Canaries, Madeira, Turkey, Luxor, Red Sea, and Cyprus using the biggish planes like the A320N/737-800 and MAX-8 are not able to go anywhere near Southampton on those Routes for obvious reasons of the SOU Runway and operating limitations.

To say that the airlines are not playing ball, is frankly not their fault surely?
Jet2 nor TUI have A320's in their fleets to be able to even attempt to plan to operate from SOU on some of those routes.
Easyjet do, but at this time they do not seem willing to make SOU a UK base, and their package holidays brand are nowhere near upthere with Jet2 or TUI's sales reputation and organisation.

Sadly we no longer have 737-300/400 or 700 series on tap, nor the venerable 757 - all of which could usually lift off a full load from SOU for the likes of Madeira or Tenerife.

Even SEN Southend had limitations on payloads but did once offer Corfu and the Canaries.

So for SOU it is what it is...so unless they can in time, overcome the Runway and Obstacle clearance limitations I cannot foresee much changing unless Easyjet really does commit at SOU to be a viable base.
There is no one else right now.

[DC3 Dave]

As usual this thread is full of negativity. I am beginning to think some of you guys actually wet your pants with excitement when the news is not so good.

I think you may have a point. Since late 2020 there has been over 3000 posts on this thread compared to fewer than 700 in the same period on the Bournemouth thread.

[RW20]

Holiday airlines flying to most of the more popular and lucrative sunspots like the Greek Islands, Canaries, Madeira, Turkey, Luxor, Red Sea, and Cyprus using the biggish planes like the A320N/737-800 and MAX-8 are not able to go anywhere near Southampton on those Routes for obvious reasons of the SOU Runway and operating limitations.

To say that the airlines are not playing ball, is frankly not their fault surely?
Jet2 nor TUI have A320's in their fleets to be able to even attempt to plan to operate from SOU on some of those routes.
Easyjet do, but at this time they do not seem willing to make SOU a UK base, and their package holidays brand are nowhere near upthere with Jet2 or TUI's sales reputation and organisation.

Sadly we no longer have 737-300/400 or 700 series on tap, nor the venerable 757 - all of which could usually lift off a full load from SOU for the likes of Madeira or Tenerife.

Even SEN Southend had limitations on payloads but did once offer Corfu and the Canaries.

So for SOU it is what it is...so unless they can in time, overcome the Runway and Obstacle clearance limitations I cannot foresee much changing unless Easyjet really does commit at SOU to be a viable base.
There is no one else right now.
That's it in a nutshell, not the best of situations for SOU, can the airport sustain losses year in year out?

[EXEL1966]

I love it that this thread on some days has more movements than the airport itself :O

Constantly reading unfounded speculation, rumour, dreamland wishful thinking and then when nothing happens the outpouring of negativity. It's all pretty much self induced!

BOH simply has a far superior infrastructure and it's likely to get better whilst SOU has very little room for any serious and worthwhile expansion to it's. Location, Location, Location !

[Sharklet_321]

Highly likely that Jet2 will expand at BOH beyond 2 aircraft. Their BRS base was launched with 3 aircraft and is now 8. Their BHX base was launched with 4 aircraft and is now 14. All their other bases were launched with a fleet that is now bigger than it was in the initial year of operation.

However despite that, easyJet continued to open a base at BHX with 3 aircraft. It is probable that they will do the same at SOU. They have a considerable number of slots at LGW that they need to hand back in 2025. This frees up aircraft that could be deployed to SOU.

On the other hand, their CEO strangely explained just a few days ago that he was keen to get an ‘in’ at Heathrow which would be detrimental to any U2 SOU operation being just 60 minutes drive up the road.

AGS have an opportunity to help easyJet make the right call as it seems they are open to different possibilities, including not shying away from competition.

[SotonFlightpath]

I'm going to remain (insanely) positive in that I still have a hunch that EZY will open a small two-aircraft base at SOU in the relatively near future.

If one looks at the provisional timetable shown for Jet2 at Bournemouth next year, if one excludes the fact that some of the destinations are beyond the reliable range achievable from SOU, similar timings to those proposed by Jet2, offering 27 flights a week but to slightly shorter destinations would work even within Southampton's restricted opening hours, ie, two crack of dawn departures and two early afternoon departures. With a few additional flights/routes flown from other EZY bases a comprehensive little network of leisure/city-break/friends-and-family and even occasional business routes could be established and would secure EasyJet's position on the South Coast, with a clear product differential - a slightly posher airline at a slightly posher airport, not much of a difference I know, but enough to have something to latch onto to provide a bit of a USP.

I'm not connected even remotely with the aviation industry, I'm purely a 'local' who has a passing interest in aviation and who uses the local airport when I can. 😊

[rustythumb]

Sounds like Rigby plan to pour money into BOH in order to increase terminal capacity in expectation for 2mppa. Once Bournemouth can prove itself it quite possibly will be the defacto gateway airport for the south coast.

The challenge for SOU is the business market hasn't been the same since Brexit and COVID-19, and the reduced operational hours and load restrictions make it a tougher decision.

SOU may have better road and rail connections vs BOH, but SOU's proximity to London i.e. not being convenient enough to be a 'London' airport and being too near and with too many constraints reduces its chance of being a busy regional e.g. BRS, LBA, puts it in a grey area.

I've said this before, but in the absence of one 'true' south coast airport, I think the best reality is for BOH and SOU to complement each other like Belfast's Aldergrove and City.

However, if the money gets spent on infrastructure at BOH, I can't see any reason why Easyjet wouldn't take a look at some routes that aren't currently offered by a LCC on the south coast.

[Ascupart]

I'm not connected even remotely with the aviation industry, I'm purely a 'local' who has a passing interest in aviation and who uses the local airport when I can. 😊
I am also a local. If you were AGS and took a cold, hard look at your balance sheet and then considered how much money you could make from selling the land (a 'prime' location for an Amazon fulfilment centre or similar) you would have to be tempted. At least that would provide some real jobs for the local economy - 'jam today' and not the 'jam tomorrow' jobs as imagined by Paul Holmes MP (https://www.southamptonairport.com/news/media-centre/2023/uk-aviation-minister-marks-official-opening-of-southampton-airport-s-runway-extension/).

[VLCfkight]

I think Rustythumb's assessment is probably one of the most realistic postings I have seen on this thread for quite a while. I would tend to agree with him that an Orange base at BOH might well be a strong possibility at some point in the future, especially if there us a strong committment to invest in expansion of the terminal facilities. Limited opening hours and a short runway at SOU do not fit in with the longer legs that LC have now begun to operate.

[stewyb]

I see the feeding frenzy has appeared on this thread over the Jet2 announcement. Let’s not forget SOU is still going to reach around 1m pax this year with 8 airline partners and many regionals would be delighted with that. It’s damn obvious that the owners will want more and for the airport to make more money (after all a large investment has just been completed) but this will not happen overnight. I firmly believe easyjet will add further routes in the near future and hopefully a new airline or two will also appear so to speculate as to its future in such a negative manner is foolish at best. SOU will never compete with BOU on holiday business but it can add value to the south coast with a mixture of solid profitable business/ leisure routes and this is what I see continuing to happen, just not at the pace some posters would like. It will only take the relatively small growth mentioned above to hit break even (1.2m) and the airport quickly becomes a viable business again. Some patience and perspective is required as both south coast airports have different USP ‘s and are playing to their strengths/weaknesses.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

I see the feeding frenzy has appeared on this thread over the Jet2 announcement. Let’s not forget SOU is still going to reach around 1m pax this year and many regionals would be delighted with that.
Isn't the issue that SOU cannot make money at 1M pax per year? So it's structural / financial issue as well. There was a time when they could and did make money at a similar or lower throughput? But as the days of high cost suited and booted regionals vanish from memory, they need high volume leisure to get them back into the black and put the business on a stable footing? So with the current cost base and commitments, if they don't make that volume, there's no path to profitability, and that high volume leisure market now has three strong competitors down the road at BOH. So in effect, it's easyJet or bust, and I would suspect easyJet are holding out until they get an outstanding deal to make it worth their while, as SOU needs EZY way more than EZY needs SOU? Tough gig.

[stewyb]

Isn't the issue that SOU cannot make money at 1M pax per year? So it's structural / financial issue as well. There was a time when they could and did make money at a similar or lower throughput? But as the days of high cost suited and booted regionals vanish from memory, they need high volume leisure to get them back into the black and put the business on a stable footing? So with the current cost base and commitments, if they don't make that volume, there's no path to profitability, and that high volume leisure market now has three strong competitors down the road at BOH. So in effect, it's easyJet or bust, and I would suspect easyJet are holding out until they get an outstanding deal to make it worth their while, as SOU needs EZY way more than EZY needs SOU? Tough gig.

Correct and I have clearly highlighted the need for 1.2m p/a sooner rather than later to positively affect financials. We don’t know what the airport and its owners are working on to get to this initial figure so guess it’s a wait and see . Yes, LCC options have reduced although not sure Jet2 etc were ever a reality for the airport and its now for AGS to find a suitable solution because clearly the clock is ticking

[LTNman]

Where has this 1.2m figure for profitability come from?

[stewyb]

Where has this 1.2m figure for profitability come from?

Been documented on numerous occasions by the airports representatives in business plans/council meetings

[Ascupart]

Where has this 1.2m figure for profitability come from?
The airport. (https://meetings.eastleigh.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=267&MId=7119&Ver=4)

"John Lauwerys asked if, as per the evidence submitted through the planning stage for the runway extension, the airport would continue to run at a loss until passenger numbers reached 1.2 million. The Head of Planning and Development for AGS Airports Ltd confirmed this continued to be the case."

[LTNman]

Interesting set of latest published accounts that predate the runway extension. Debt facilities with an outstanding balance of £757m are due to be paid in full on 18th June but there are material uncertainties over refinancing with a significant doubt about the companies ability to continue as a going concern.

Later in the accounts the directors state they are optimistic about refinancing.

[mrshubigbus]

One thing that really matters on shorter holiday routes that seems to have been totally overlooked is the shorter summer seasons. while the Canaries, Eastern Med and Egypt are virtually year round, any shorter French / Spanish leisure routes are limited from April till October which would make a year round base all the more difficult with its shorter runway and opening hours. SOU has always been a traditional "regional" base for as long as I can remember and that's where the airport's transport links work so well. If they allow their "traditional" carriers, Loganair, Eastern, Blue Islands, Aurigny, KLM, Aer Lingus etc to be walked all over by Easyjet, then that must surely be a huge risk for the airport to take. It's one thing the airport wishing to expand but they must do it very sympathetically to their existing carriers unless they are happy to loose them. After all, most offer double daily services to other business centres. The current status quo between BOH and SOU has always existed since the days of the Dan Air Link City services out of BOH. Since then it's always been a split market, holidays from BOH, Business form SOU. My view is that this difference will always remain and hence both airports will continue to do what they do best on the South Coast. Two airports serving very different markets. SOU is the London City / Belfast City Airport whilst BOH is the holiday hub. That's not to say that SOU won't do short hops to warmer climes as they already do. Look at the BA flights on the Embraer 190s over the last couple of summers which has worked perfectly for the LCY fleet on W patterns. I don't see that changing massively in the future.

[SO24]

Agree with stewyb and the latest threads - let Bournemouth have their ‘day in the sun’ (pun intended!) but it’s not all about the sun routes. Per my last note EZY’s key USP is that it’s the only LCC in SOU, and the generally favored one at that. Their announcement last Spring to fly domestically from SOU would seem to show they see potential from here away from the sun routes as well - so, within their other network commitments there’s no reason they couldn’t look at shorter hops to eg PAR, AMS, NCE or central/Eastern Europe as well as a few more Med schedules in the future. They wouldn’t need to move to BOH to do that & could operate such a network more easily avoiding the night curfew at SOU. Most people I speak to still prefer SOU over BOH due to the far easier accessibility, and BOH will have to have some pretty radical ideas to avoid gridlock around the airport at certain times in S25 with a local council that’s broke alongside. And that means zero prospect of anything other than courtesy buses down winding country lanes. There’s plenty of demand for regional routes from SOU if they’re competitively priced - KLM are shortly going to 3 a day & could easily take say a 3 x weekly additional service from EZY as many KLM pax are transfer. The PAR service desperately needs a decent reliable carrier & SOU will always sit at the centre of a bigger catchment area for this traffic. If AGS run out of ideas then a sale to a more creative owner wouldn’t be the worst scenario, and there’s still the Solent Freeport element for the longer term which will add to the inward investment opportunities the airport brings.

[DC3 Dave]

There is a lot of talk here of all the disadvantages at SOU and why that means the airport cannot be the success that many hope for. IMO focusing on the negatives will get you precisely nowhere.

Look at LCY. How long a list of disadvantages do you need? Runway, obstacles, crosswinds, often visibility issues when there is little wind, special training, limited aircraft, limited operational hours, no certainty of future political support, you could go on and on. It has of course one huge advantage and that is why airlines find a way of operating from there despite everything.

OK the knockers will scoff. SOU is hardly LCY
they will cry out and that is true but you build on what you have going for you and it not the case that the airport is without its own advantages.

[VLCfkight]

Problem on this thread is that a few voiciferous supporters of SOH assumed from the outset that a few extra metres of tarmac would bring airlines flooding to the airport. Their expectations were, IMHO, unrealistic. Amongst the many words posted here since Jet2 announced their BOH base, there have been some posts that set out what SOH can really anticipate in the future, while the expectations of others is clearly 'pie in the sky'.

[shamrock7seal]

DC3 Dave, Both LCY and SEN have London on their doorstep and London in their name. It serves not only the 9m residents but also the countless inbound business travellers (LCY) and leisure traffic. No marketing campaign will ever be able to position SOU as an alternative to the London area and certainly not to people coming in from overseas.

SOU is here to serve Southampton & the immediate region. Does it have a big enough wealthy catchment to emulate LCY?

[SKOJB]

DC3 Dave, Both LCY and SEN have London on their doorstep and London in their name. It serves not only the 9m residents but also the countless inbound business travellers (LCY) and leisure traffic. No marketing campaign will ever be able to position SOU as an alternative to the London area and certainly not to people coming in from overseas.

SOU is here to serve Southampton & the immediate region. Does it have a big enough wealthy catchment to emulate LCY?

Rubbish, it’s here to serve a much wider catchment which covers 3.5m population within 60 minutes of the airport and is one of the wealthiest areas in the U.K.

[Sharklet_321]

3.5m perhaps for a low cost carrier yes but for a regional carrier no the catchment will be much more concentrated

[SWBKCB]

Rubbish, it’s here to serve a much wider catchment which covers 3.5m population within 60 minutes of the airport and is one of the wealthiest areas in the U.K.

Similar comments are often made on this thread, but then aren't reflected in the flights available. SOU has a long list of routes that have been tried and dropped.

[FrequentlyFlying]

EZ looking to refocus if looking at LHR into a more premium product which I genuinely think there is a market for., LHR proximity to SOU isnt helpful. The question is, has the last year of EZ been about toe dipping or managing current excess capacity best? I’m thinking of their brief touch down in BOH in the not so distant past. Was never about permanence. Ryanair are untouchable as the discount airline, Jet2 basically are blanket covering the package holiday market and will only get bigger, so what’s left? The return of city breaks and regional flying ? It’s a tough market, trains are greener. I hope who ever manages SOU manage to find the answer, the airport is compact and easy to access, it’s really more bus station than international airport, it needs a purpose of existence beyond being a non essential option for regional travel. BOH have realised bucket and spade maximises its potential at the same time as the U.K. has returned to package holidays. My fingers are crossed someone has an answer in the current management.

[055166k]

Odd! easyJet Geneva Southampton lands at Southampton......about 5 minutes later easyJet Geneva Bournemouth lands Gatwick (diversion)??? Bit windy at Bournemouth.......but why not Southampton???

[LW940]

Odd! easyJet Geneva Southampton lands at Southampton......about 5 minutes later easyJet Geneva Bournemouth lands Gatwick (diversion)??? Bit windy at Bournemouth.......but why not Southampton???

Could be due to LGW being a crew base? If that’s the case surprised they didn’t use BRS; although with them not attempting a landing at BOH, it could be medical related?

[The Nutts Mutts]

The strong winds are coming from a southerly direction today so at SOU the runway will be pointing pretty much into wind whereas at BOH there will be strong crosswind.

[Le Tirer]

METAR for 11:20 shows wind at BOH 180 degrees 19 kts gusting 46kts. Almost straight across runway 26.
SOU at 11:20 160 degrees 12 kts gusting 23 kts. Much less windy and little crosswind on runway 20.

I'm sure the wind at BOH was the cause of the diversion. Why it diverted to LGW and not SOU is another question.

[055166k]

Thanks to all.......in fact the same airframe reg has just filed Gatwick Bournemouth.

[kcockayne]

Problem on this thread is that a few voiciferous supporters of SOH assumed from the outset that a few extra metres of tarmac would bring airlines flooding to the airport. Their expectations were, IMHO, unrealistic. Amongst the many words posted here since Jet2 announced their BOH base, there have been some posts that set out what SOH can really anticipate in the future, while the expectations of others is clearly 'pie in the sky'.
How very true. You could take this statement about Southampton & apply it to Guernsey - where a vociferous “extend the runway” crowd expect “boom time” if the airport becomes able to support unrestricted use of 737s & 320s. This would be to ignore the fact that Guernsey’s population is 65,000. Quite considerably less than the hinterland of Southampton ! Sorry for drifting away from the topic of Soton; but its situation has some relevance elsewhere.

[Irishshamrock]

The longer the runway at Southampton, the more pointless it becomes as it puts it in direct conflict with Heathrow. The height at which aircraft can approach Southampton is even restricted as a result of its unfortunate geography. In most countries a one hour drive up the road is considered acceptable drive time to a local airport. Heathrow is Southampton's de facto local airport. The City of Southampton itself must benefit from the proximity of Heathrow, just look at the cruise port and the accessibility from London and how it is thriving. This is nor mere coincidence. As long as Heathrow remains up the road, Southampton will be capped. Southampton's sweet spot is exactly as other posters have intimated - a small regional high frequency affluent type airport. Like London City, Like Belfast City. It is not a Luton or a Bristol and never will be. I would argue the airport would make more money by focusing on this strategy instead of the low cost airlines which don't pay airports anything!!

[Jerbourg]

SOU is here to serve Southampton & the immediate region. Does it have a big enough wealthy catchment to emulate LCY?

SOU could also benefit from Channel Islanders using the airport to connect onwards - not everyone wants to use London airports...

[andymartin]

Why don't they just tarmac SOU over and use it for long term parking for the ever increasingly busy BOH?

[TCAS FAN]

…..

BOH simply has a far superior infrastructure and it's likely to get better whilst SOU has very little room for any serious and worthwhile expansion to it's. Location, Location, Location !

SOU wins that one hands down, close to two motorways, its own railway station with a two/three minute walk to the terminal and just over a hour to/from London. Compare that to BOH, out in the sticks and often a pig to get to by road during the summer due to holiday traffic.

[Irishshamrock]

SOU wins that one hands down, close to two motorways, its own railway station with a two/three minute walk to the terminal and just over a hour to/from London. Compare that to BOH, out in the sticks and often a pig to get to by road during the summer due to holiday traffic.

TCAS FAN - the proximity to London is possibly the main reason all the advantages of SOU are not being realised. Heathrow is local to Southampton - just 60 mins drive time!

[Asturias56]

Quite a few people would be happy to see both sold off if only to stop the ridiculous sniping on here between the two sets of fan boys.

[LTNman]

SOU wins that one hands down, close to two motorways, its own railway station with a two/three minute walk to the terminal and just over a hour to/from London. Compare that to BOH, out in the sticks and often a pig to get to by road during the summer due to holiday traffic.

Yet one is prospering and one isn’t despite an investment. Just goes to show that location, location, location seems to count for very little when there are other factors at play.

[RW20]

Yet one is prospering and one isn’t despite an investment. Just goes to show that location, location, location seems to count for very little when there are other factors at play.

Yes the location and transport links are superb at SOU,but if you can't attract airlines due to airport and operational restrictions then they are of no advantage.
​​​

[Sharklet_321]

Yes the location and transport links are superb at SOU,but if you can't attract airlines due to airport and operational restrictions then they are of no advantage.
​​​

I would agree with the suggestion above in a previous post that the location of Southampton is negatively impacted by being so close to Heathrow.

[stewyb]

Please stop now, this thread is becoming unreadable!

[ATNotts]

Its like Aston Villa fans sniping at Birmingham City fans.

[Sharklet_321]

Confirmation bias at play - on both sides perhaps

[rog747]

Apart from a little playground bickering on here (giggles) it must be said that the reason SOU has had far more comments than BOH on Pprune is that there is simply more news!
(both positive and negative) >>>
Flybe - closed down, Flybe V2 stop-start, Covid, Runway extension planning delays, tree obstacle planning issues, airport operational restrictions. BA Cityflyer stop-start, then their new routes canned before start up etc etc. Runway Extension finally opens. Lack of local advertising of new airlines and routes...Dramas with Eastern and Loganair. New Ops Director comes, then leaves...
Southampton transport connections, and being impacted by both Heathrow and Bournemouth.
I could go on and on.

With Jet2 and TUI both going head to head at BOH next summer with 4 or 5 based 737-800's there selling package holidays (plus Ryanair strongly increasing their schedules/routes and it's based aircraft) leaps BOH into a league of the likes it has never seen before.

BOH in summer 2025 will be 'Holiday Airport Central', and that's what they do.

We are where we are now at with SOU and what happens next, is pivotal for the future of the airport.

[Sharklet_321]

Where is Rivet Joint when you need them?

[SO24]

Room for both….

[LTNman]

In hospital recovering from shock after having delusional thoughts over the last couple of years that haven’t come true. Get well soon Rivet Joint, as I miss your insults to posters on this thread that don’t share your narrative.

[rog747]

In hospital recovering from shock after having delusional thoughts over the last couple of years that haven’t come true. Get well soon as I miss your insults to posters on this thread that don’t share your narrative.

LOL, I've seen far worse flying across the boards from posters on Jet Blast, and on the 'Downunder' threads!
He's a pussycat compared to some of them :)

[Sharklet_321]

LOL, I've seen far worse flying across the boards from posters on Jet Blast, and on the 'Downunder' threads!
He's a pussycat compared to some of them :)

He or she… do we know?

[Sotonsean]

Why don't they just tarmac SOU over and use it for long term parking for the ever increasingly busy BOH?

With a question mark attached to the end of your sentence your clearly asking a "question".

A ridiculous one at that. Best keep those thoughts to yourself rather than pose them here on the SOU thread.

[Sotonsean]

In hospital recovering from shock after having delusional thoughts over the last couple of years that haven’t come true. Get well soon Rivet Joint, as I miss your insults to posters on this thread that don’t share your narrative.

Nicely put :ok:

[SotonFlightpath]

The longer the runway at Southampton, the more pointless it becomes as it puts it in direct conflict with Heathrow. The height at which aircraft can approach Southampton is even restricted as a result of its unfortunate geography. In most countries a one hour drive up the road is considered acceptable drive time to a local airport. Heathrow is Southampton's de facto local airport. The City of Southampton itself must benefit from the proximity of Heathrow, just look at the cruise port and the accessibility from London and how it is thriving. This is nor mere coincidence. As long as Heathrow remains up the road, Southampton will be capped. Southampton's sweet spot is exactly as other posters have intimated - a small regional high frequency affluent type airport. Like London City, Like Belfast City. It is not a Luton or a Bristol and never will be. I would argue the airport would make more money by focusing on this strategy instead of the low cost airlines which don't pay airports anything!!

Yes, Heathrow is very close I pop-up there to pick-up friends relatives from time-to-time. I live approximately 6-miles north of SOU airport and the drive from home to Heathrow is usually around 50-55 minutes, that's home to the short-stay car parks.

In fact, I remember reading an article about the Southampton-born musician Craig David in an American magazine and it stated that he hailed from the 'London coastal suburb of Southampton!'

[SWBKCB]

a small regional high frequency affluent type airport. Like London City, Like Belfast City. It is not a Luton or a Bristol and never will be. I would argue the airport would make more money by focusing on this strategy instead of the low cost airlines which don't pay airports anything!!

But can they make money with this strategy?

[EXEL1966]

SOU wins that one hands down, close to two motorways, its own railway station with a two/three minute walk to the terminal and just over a hour to/from London. Compare that to BOH, out in the sticks and often a pig to get to by road during the summer due to holiday traffic.

Yes it has motorways and a train station, but I don't see many aircraft being able to make use of those ;-)

BOH wins by a mile because it has airport infrastructure, a longer runway, superior ILS, larger aprons, hangarage, maintenance facilities, better operating hours and importantly further room to expand air/non-airside facilities and it works better that it's further away from LGW/LHR.

[Sotonsean]

Yes, Heathrow is very close I pop-up there to pick-up friends relatives from time-to-time. I live approximately 6-miles north of SOU airport and the drive from home to Heathrow is usually around 50-55 minutes, that's home to the short-stay car parks.

In fact, I remember reading an article about the Southampton-born musician Craig David in an American magazine and it stated that he hailed from the 'London coastal suburb of Southampton!'

I'll give you a few more examples.

Norwegian Cruise Line, Oceania Cruises, Regent Seven Seas Cruises and Princess Cruises all list Southampton as "London Southampton" as a departure point on the their relevant website for international markets.

I had an interaction with a very irate passenger a few years ago who was furious that it took over an hour by coach from LHR to the ship. She assumed Southampton was London.

I live in a suburb of Southampton approximately 3 miles SE from SOU. From my driveway to LHR Terminal 5 it usually takes me approximately 55 minutes. This would be for an early morning departure leaving home around 4.30 am. Any later the journey time would be far longer, especially during the peak traffic hours which can extend throughout the day.

In saying that LHR is always my first preference with LGW a close second and STN a strong third. Its sad to say that although I'm local and a great fan of the airport but I've only flown in or out of it seven times in my entire life. Four of those were long before the current terminal even opened,

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

But can they make money with this strategy?
Yes, BUT they'd need to dump the current aspirational growth strategy and accept they need to be a niche, relatively high cost operation. It's very tough to shrink to success as most managers only know "go for growth" but actually the most long lived businesses have "right sized" brutally when times get tough. Loganair for example, has grown and shrunk on a cycle over many years but just celebrated 60 years of operations. If SOU were to focus on ATRs and similar sized aircraft and a successful FBO on the side, they'd need to slash costs out of the business and that's before you get to the debt they're carrying in extending the runway and infrastructure. Could SOU do it? Depends on whether they could service the existing debt in shrinking to profitability, it's very hard to do. You can see why they're gambling on a push for high volume leisure. Worst case is that they never get volumes high enough to make money because of the competitive environment and growth at BOH.

Not having a go at anyone, it's not a great place to be in. easyJet have to make a real base of this if SOU's strategy is to pay off.

[Sotonsean]

Well said Skip :ok:

[SO24]

Having spent some 8 years talking about, negotiating & finally completing the runway extension (against all odds given todays green agenda), I can’t see SOU suddenly backtracking & ‘shrinking’ their way to success. As already stated, the scope of the Jet2 business was always too big for SOU given still inherent range limitations in the airports’ operational capability. However it does mean the management will need to work much harder to attract carriers other than EZY. No reason I can see why they couldn’t re-visit previous partners such as Volotea, Vueling for W routes from their extensive European bases? Maybe not likely, but the last week has certainly been a wake-up call. And per my previous note, there are many Euro cities not currently served from either SOU or BOH to choose from. So far, the Jet2 routes practically mirror those served by the current BOH carriers, though it seems they have more expansion planned post 2025 so the clock is certainly ticking - the FlyBe demise should be a summary lesson to all about the over reliance on one partner in any business…..

[Irishshamrock]

Well said.

easyJet would be good on Paris, Madrid, Oporto, Rome, Berlin, Nice, Milan, Prague, Warsaw etc - routes that are not currently served and position SOU as complimentary to BOH and not in direct competition with them

[Rivet Joint]

So I wanted to leave a few days for the bottom feeders to have their day in the sun.

Firstly, you have to congratulate the operator of BOH as their performance of late has been surprising to say the least. However, there are two big cautions I might add.

Firstly, their terminal, transport links etc simply won’t cope with the additional jet2 base so standby for lots of disgruntled customers and articles in the papers. I am not familiar with how jet2 operates but the size of the operation relative to the facilities as they stand today seems like a big clanger to me. This is going to cause a lot of work for their ops team. I see mention of the terminal being increased etc but as we all know planning takes around 2 years and then a further 2 years for construction etc.

secondly, BOHs performance lately does not follow the normal business development path. Out of nowhere we have seen the two existing operators grow quite a big and a new one come in with a sizeable operation all in a short period at an airport that has historically just been a small bucket and spade airport for the large retired population. Put simply, it seems suspect which usually points to distortion of the system. As I have mentioned a number of times now this illogical growth points towards huge incentives being offered in an attempt to bury your competitor if they are becoming a threat. We all know the fable of the foolish man that built his house on sand.

Turning to whether this is good or bad news for SOU, it’s hard on the face of it to see it as anything other than bad news. But let’s look at the facts.

Firstly, could Jet2 have chose SOU instead. Was this a SOU v BOH battle that SOU lost? No. When it was announced that (rather oddly) they had not chosen to take any A320s to the late 2020s it was clear Jet2 was not going to be an option for SOU until at least the end of the decade. 737s will unlikely ever be a thing at SOU which isn’t a problem at all. But at the moment Jet2 couldn’t operate at SOU and wanted a base on the south coast so had no choice but to pick BOH.

Now that we have established SOU was never an option at this moment in time. How is this going to affect SOU? A key thing that everyone seems to be overlooking is that 14 out of the 16 routes announced by Jet2 are already served by FR/Tui. So this isn’t really an increase of destinations served but increased frequency of existing routes. Only 3 of the routes announced are also operated at SOU and Easy is such a strong brand and SOU so much easier to get to that it shouldn’t really have much affect on SOU for those routes. Lastly, something that people also seem to overlook is the fact that SOU is unlikely to ever be a package holiday focused airport like BOH, EMA etc. I don’t recall it ever historically being one and I think the modern generation are more focused on seeing culture on city breaks and using AirBnBs than frying like a pig all week at the hotel pool and being chained to their food/drink offering. This is why I think Easy are hand in glove with SOU as they could provide flights to places of culture for the well off local clientele. All airlines will need to grow outside of London again and Easy is not going to move in at BOH like some crazy people are suggesting on the BOH thread. So SOU it is.

In conclusion congrats to BOH, but I think an implosion is in its future. As for SOU, fingers crossed Easy keep building their presence as it will be a big success if they do.

[SWBKCB]

If you ignore the usual RJ digs, there are some good points well made, particulalry around the need for BOH to exand their physical infrastructure - hopefully there is a plan in place ready to be rolled out.

and I think the modern generation are more focused on seeing culture on city breaks and using AirBnBs

they could provide flights to places of culture for the well off local clientele.

but these are the sorts of comments that are often made about the clientele in the SOU catchment area - may well be true, but is there any evidence that there has ever been any impact on the routes operated from SOU?.

This has always been the condundrum with SOU - great transport links, prosperous catchement area, poor route network with a range of attractive destinations tried and dropped.

[Rivet Joint]

Most easyJet Europe bases are at airports with restrictive operating hours. If they make bases work at these airports with time restrictions, so why not at SOU?
Below is a list of the EJU bases and shows the time that the last EJU based aircraft lands.

ORY - last based EJU flight lands at 22:30
NTE - last based EJU flight lands at 22:30
AMS - last based EJU flight lands at 22:35
BCN - last based EJU flight lands at 22:50
NCE - last based EJU flight lands at 22:55
NAP - last based EJU flight lands at 22:55
BER - last based EJU flight lands at 22:55
LYS - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
BOD - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
OPO - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
BSL - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
GVA - last based EJU flight lands at 23:10
CDG - last based EJU flight lands at 23:25

This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.

[SWBKCB]

I think most people would class you as a bottom feeder but there we go.

The increase in personal insults in these threads is getting a bit tedious.

[LTNman]

This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
Interesting list but SOU closes at 23:00 so half of those flights are on the wrong side of 23.00 and the ones that are not only allows for up to 30 minutes of delay.

[Rivet Joint]

Merriam-Webster defines the term bottom feeder as an opportunist who seeks quick profit usually at the expense of others or from their misfortune.

See above posts with no constructive criticism and posted with glee with the intention to antagonise. A statement of fact rather than an insult in my case. I will not be giving any of them the attention they crave and hope the other genuine posters do the same.

[RW20]

This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
If Easy thought there was reward in any of your listed destinations then they would have been at the front door when the runway extension was completed.
They have dipped there toe in SOU,nothing very exciting,in fact underwhelming , unless there is some startling announcement for 2025 for SOU in the coming weeks then I don't see Easy as a long term prospect, what happens then is in AGS hands!

[Markushillman]

The increase in personal insults in these threads is getting a bit tedious.

Please accept my apologies, I also get tired of them but unfortunately bit at RJ's usual digs for once, which was poor form. Post shall be removed.

But I stand by one of his points Bournemouth will have a plan for this level of expansion and wont just implode, the rigby group/rca seem to have their heads on straight and the aviation division is profitable for them. In my opinion I feel Southampton may need new owners looking at Aberdeen as well. Of course we await to see If easy do expand or base but that seems to be the only option at the moment, and always a bit risky to pin your hopes on just one option.

[Irishshamrock]

easyJet will need an incentive to operate from SOU just as much as Jet2 will need one from BOH.

In business, it’s always wise to seek more than one quote from a supplier or in this case an airport. I would be very surprised if easyJet were not pitching the two against each other in order to obtain a better deal at SOU. If they aren’t then how do they keep their costs in check?

[SouthernAlliance]

A bit of good news seems the first easyJet to ALC tomorrow is sold out.

[shamrock7seal]

Good news indeed!

Seems that Ryanair flights from Bournemouth to Alicante pretty much sold out for the entire week next week too - I guess Easter holidays?

[EXEL1966]

This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.

Which is why SOU would be no good with similar timed schedules as It can NEVER extend past 2300, not even for a minute so just a few minutes delay would render over 80% of those flights as non-entities. Most of those would need to be established by 2245-2250 to stand any chance of being accepted.
End result would mean regular diversions, particularly in the peak season.

[055166k]

Heathrow operates with stringent night period restrictions. Airlines adapt. Airports worldwide manage successfully.

[SotonFlightpath]

This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.

Well that’s what I was thinking in an earlier post I made. Granted, some of the longer-distance destinations will never be viable from SOU, but if one looks at Jet2’s timings for their proposed new routes, we can see that there will be 27 weekly flights, so that’s two out and back rotations per aircraft on six days a week, and one double rotation and one single on the remaining day.

All of the flights are early morning and early/mid afternoon departures. If EZY were to base two aircraft at Southampton, and utilise them on routes to destinations such as Palma, Alicante, Faro, Malaga, Ibiza, Corsica, Paris CDG, Barcelona, Rome, Corfu, Copenhagen, Budapest, Edinburgh, Manchester, Jersey, Nice, Isle of Man etc, just as an example, all of these could be operated within SOU’s opening hours. If Belfast, Glasgow and Geneva could continue as presently utilising aircraft from those bases, I’m sure it would be successful.

It would need a serious, and I mean serious, marketing and promotional push, no make that a blitz, by the airport well before the services begin to build awareness, but it could be done.

[SouthernAlliance]

Well that’s what I was thinking in an earlier post I made. Granted, some of the longer-distance destinations will never be viable from SOU, but if one looks at Jet2’s timings for their proposed new routes, we can see that there will be 27 weekly flights, so that’s two out and back rotations per aircraft on six days a week, and one double rotation and one single on the remaining day.

All of the flights are early morning and early/mid afternoon departures. If EZY were to base two aircraft at Southampton, and utilise them on routes to destinations such as Palms, Alicante, Faro, Malaga, Ibiza, Corsica, Paris CDG, Barcelona, Rome, Corfu, Copenhagen, Budapest, Edinburgh, Manchester, Jersey, Nice, Isle of Man etc, just as an example, all of these could be operated within SOU’s opening hours. If Belfast, Glasgow and Geneva could continue as presently utilising aircraft from those bases, I’m sure it would be successful.

It would need a serious, and I mean serious, marketing and promotional push, no make that a blitz, by the airport well before the services begin to build awareness, but it could be done.

Unfortunately this is not the narrative that most on this thread wish to hear. I do however agree with your thoughts and I’m sure is eminently doable.

[TCAS FAN]

I love it that this thread on some days has more movements than the airport itself :O

………

I think you are confusing SOU with SEN!

[shamrock7seal]

Heathrow operates with stringent night period restrictions. Airlines adapt. Airports worldwide manage successfully.

Heathrow isn’t a low cost carrier hub - and that’s another reason why

[Sotonsean]

I think that RJ was released from hospital far too soon unless he just decided to leave on his own accord to the detriment to everyone else 🤔

The days before the "great" return were so pleasant.

I usually read absolutely every post from start to finish but on this occasion I just couldn't bare it.

And the term "bottom feeders", the arrogance behind that comment is unbelievable.

[adfly]

Starting with the bad news, the 3rd daily Amsterdam flight starts today, but the early evening flight has been cancelled, it was due to be operated by Eastern... I really hope they start to pull themselves together sooner rather than later.

And the good, easyJet to Alicante starts today, with the outbound flight being fully booked, and surprisingly the inbound looked to be about 50% full. Of course, it is the Easter holidays but it is good to see nonetheless. The next couple of flights appear to have 100+ seats reserved, and assuming that passengers who've not paid to choose a seat are not showing, it suggests that they are also well filled.

In further good news, easyJet have bought the start of their Faro route forward by 2 weeks. It will now begin on 23rd May.

[rog747]

Latest news is that Easyjet just announced they will open a 2 aircraft base at SOU from summer 2025 with similar current route offerings and to include Manchester, Jersey, Corfu and Lanzarote - yay! at last something new for us at SOU.

[willy wombat]

And today’s date is …..

[rog747]

And today’s date is …..

Ah yes, but are you really sure that I have not pulled your Willy ???.....lol

[Ascupart]

And the good, easyJet to Alicante starts today...
Looking on Flightradar it seems the flight was delayed, leaving SOU at 22:44 and arriving 01:53. A shame as this was the first flight.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x613/easy_5f79c2957b6b76ff8d0da37668cc106e2c9683f8.png

[LTNman]

The reason

We’re sorry that your flight has been delayed.
This is because we are awaiting confirmation of final flight paperwork before we can depart.


Not good when I suspect there were just an handful of departures at around that time. Seems the airport could not cope with just one full Airbus at check-in?

[Stevooo]

The reason



Not good when I suspect this was the only departure at around that time. Maybe the airport could not cope with a full Airbus at check-in?

Is that true? They didn’t start boarding until 10:15pm so final paperwork wouldn’t be until they had all boarded. Note: there was a very large thunderstorm in the Southampton area from 8:30pm till about 10pm last night. Weather related delay?

[SouthernAlliance]

Reason was heavy rain and thunderstorms in area, but don’t let that stop more nonsense reporting concerning SOU!

[LTNman]

So that affects the final flight paperwork, that’s a new one on me.

[SWBKCB]

So that affects the final flight paperwork, that’s a new one on me.

If you've been involved in flight turnrounds, you'll know there are a myriad things going on at the same time which can impact a departure, and when trying to identify what actually delayed the flight sometimes you take pot luck in picking a reason (which can depend on where you are sitting - airlines blame airports, airports blame airlines).

Also, what are you defining as departure - doors closed, off gate, take off? Could have been closed up waiting for the weather to improve for all we know.

Chose what you want to suit your own agenda

[Pain in the R's]

It didn’t seem to affect the other departures that all left within half an hour. Maybe with a full load the aircraft could not take off from a very wet runway due to SOU short runway?

[stewyb]

Electrical activity, all ramp agents removed for safety

[rog747]

Electrical activity, all ramp agents removed for safety

Indeed, we have seen some rather fierce cracking lightning storms cross over West Dorset the past couple of days - Not seen forked lightning like that for some time.

Was about to be boarding an Air 2000 767 in St Thomas, Caribbean to fly home to LGW, and the usual afternoon TS's and rain deluge came over the airfield and that saw all ground handling and pax boarding stop until it passed over.

[rog747]

Local'ish news is that TUI have announced today they have added a second based 737 at EXT Exeter for Summer 2025.

The Travel Agents are well happy.

[stewyb]

Good news that the first two EZY ALC departures have been full loads

[RW20]

Good news that the first two EZY ALC departures have been full loads

One would hope that at Easter Holidays this would be nothing less then full!
If SOU is to move forward into 2025,and especially with Jet 2 announcement at BOH,Easy need to announce expansion on the limited 2024 programme from the airport.

[SWBKCB]

One would hope that at Easter Holidays this would be nothing less then full!

That didn't take long.... :ok:

[Irishshamrock]

SOU up for sale?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/companies/southampton-airport-owner-could-be-sold-by-investors/ar-AA1l0wad?apiversion=v2&noservercache=1&domshim=1&renderwebcomponents=1&wcseo=1&batchservertelemetry=1&noservertelemetry=1

[ATNotts]

SOU up for sale?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/companies/southampton-airport-owner-could-be-sold-by-investors/ar-AA1l0wad?apiversion=v2&noservercache=1&domshim=1&renderwebcomponents=1&wcseo=1&batchservertelemetry=1&noservertelemetry=1
The most important character in your headline on that post is the question mark!

[SWBKCB]

Class bit of journalism - something might happen (my emphasise)

The owner of Southampton Airport could be sold by investors, reports claim. Investors in AGS Airports, which operates Southampton, are seemingly considering selling their stake in the company.

Unnamed sources quoted by Reuters claim the company may follow in the footsteps of infrastructure investors around Europe. But AGS state the news is ‘simply speculation’.

Alongside Southampton, the company – owned by Macquarie and Ferrovial - also oversees operations at Glasgow and Aberdeen. Among the largest of the airports that may see a change of ownership as soon as 2024 is Edinburgh, Reuters reports.

The airport’s owner Global Infrastructure Partners (GIP) is working on the sale of its majority stake. This process may value Edinburgh Airport at over 2.5 billion euros, according to anonymous sources. AGS Airports declined to comment on the claims made

[ATNotts]

Class bit of journalism - something might happen (my emphasise)
Did you mean "class" or "crass"?

[SouthernAlliance]

This is from speculation several months back. However wouldn’t be a surprise as AGS are having to restructure their debt mountain and SOU would most likely thrive with a new owner who actually gave it a little more care and attention. Yes AGS did invest in the runway extension but I’m not sure they are committed moving forward with growth etc

[LTNman]

They can see the writing on the wall, as this year they have struggled with the crumbs?

[Asturias56]

It's always likely to be a struggle at SOU - or any other smallish UK airport. And the value of the land for development is just sooooo enticing..........................

[RW20]

It's always likely to be a struggle at SOU - or any other smallish UK airport. And the value of the land for development is just sooooo enticing..........................
The Question is do we need two regional airports within 30 miles of each other?
BOH is expanding rapidly and it has all the ingrediants for further expansion ,except road links.These could be rectified with investment.Then given the value of the land at SOU and it's road and railway links then there is only one answer !

[DC3 Dave]

So there was a time when airlines left Bournemouth for Southampton. Times change. There are ups and downs. Regional flights and pond hopping seem a thing of the past, but they may well come again, I suspect they will.

Southampton has a proud history, surely anyone who loves aviation would hope for better times soon. Why on earth would anyone want to see it fade away.

[Albert Hall]

It would be lovely to be so hopeful but I fear the next discussion may be much less positive. Chickens coming home to roost and all that. I hope I am proven wrong but time will tell.

[CAVOKpilot]

I helped out several years back on a full council
meeting with Eastleigh Borough Council to advocate for the runway extension. I had a discussion with the ops director at the time, and I stick by this now, Southampton continues to miss the opportunity to capitalise on the GA market. I know GA looks dirty when you’re trying to invite the likes of EZY/FR in, but I know of several GA pilots who share the same sentiment. You could fly into SOU and be in the city centre on a bus within 30 mins of chocking on.

[Rivet Joint]

As stated before just a reminder to the sensible posters to not take the bait from those looking for attention from strangers as they have nothing better to do with their lives.

As someone else has said BOH has had its low points and for most of recent history been in SOUs shadow. I standby my suspicion that this unnatural growth is the result of extreme and unsustainable incentives by BOH who probably think it’s worth the risk to ensure SOUs new runway does not become a success.

Also, what do FR, Tui and Jet2 all have in common? They all operate the 737 which is not fit for SOU. Plenty of Airbus operators out there who could operate from SOU.

[SouthernAlliance]

I find it incredibly sad that some on here would rather see it go to the wall instead of supporting a local airport that has been for many decades a great regional departure point for many people, both business and leisure, serving domestic and international travel

[Ascupart]

I find it incredibly sad that some on here would rather see it go to the wall instead of supporting a local airport that has been for many decades a great regional departure point for many people, both business and leisure, serving domestic and international travel
I'm a Sotonian. What I want is a thriving local economy and if SOU can be part of that - great! But if the city (and, let's not forget, Eastleigh) can benefit more from a different usage of the site then we should at least consider that possibility.

But it's too early to be glum, 2024 could be a great year and 2025 should see the airport back in the black. And from there, who knows?

[Asturias56]

The main issue is that the UK has quite a few airports which are convenient but don't make much money. And large tracts of flat land are needed for business & housing. I just can't see that changing

[SWBKCB]

This is all a bit of a leap from a speculative article suggesting that investors in the airport owners might be thinking of selling their shares? And if it's that good an idea - why would they?

[SKOJB]

Just because current investors may potentially sell their stakes, doesn’t mean that other suitors will not be on hand to take on structured debt and work with the airport for the future. Happens all the time in the business world!

[adfly]

Aer Lingus have put Belfast City and Dublin on sale for the winter, each operating 13x weekly.

KLM to Amsterdam returns to 14x weekly, but currently will be using larger aircraft from the start of 2025. Looking at a few dates in Jan/Feb there is the following:

6x E295 (Mon-Fri + Sun morning flight)
1x 737 (Sat morning flight)
7x E190 (Mon-Sun evening flight)

Flights in Nov/Dec are currently still showing as all E175's.

[rog747]

I agree it's too early to be glum, although summer 2024 could be better, will 2025 see the airport back in the 'running' ?

That's very much up to 'use it or lose it'.

Local advertising for what SOU Airport has to offer needs to improve drastically in all areas, and in all mediums of exposure, as does SOU's website.

Both KLM via AMS, and Aer Lingus via DUB offer fantastic Worldwide Interline flight connections, and in DUB you can pre-clear US Customs and Immigration which is a Godsend.

I cannot comment on Eastern Airways recently taking on the Paris–Charles de Gaulle route, except that the timings look pretty naff.
Eastern Airways said that the move will allow for expanded world-wide connectivity through the carrier’s Interline agreement with the Air France-KLM Skyteam Group
(not with those timings it won't)

If Easyjet do not get results this summer then they either won't expand, or worse case they won't be back for Summer 2025.

Jet2 Holidays are currently swamping 'Fly from Bournemouth' to the Public and to the Travel Agents, with Agency roadshows and daily airing peak time TV Ads and on local radio.
Jess Glynne is catchy, Jet2 Holidays are great, their chicken Tikka Masalas are amazing, good vibe, cheap flights friendly crews, they still playing Jess Glynne,
but why?....LOL

[Asturias56]

"I cannot comment on Eastern Airways recently taking on the Paris–Charles de Gaulle route, except that the timings look pretty naff."

Don't worry - they're never on time anyway - even departing is an "aspiration" with Eastern

[Ascupart]

in DUB you can pre-clear US Customs and Immigration which is a Godsend.
I think this is an excellent point. I didn't know this - more people travelling to the US should consider this route, and who wouldn't want to avoid Heathrow.

[BA318]

I think this is an excellent point. I didn't know this - more people travelling to the US should consider this route, and who wouldn't want to avoid Heathrow.

LHR really isn’t that bad. T2 and T5 are great and comparable to most global hubs. T3 is the downside. The advantage of LHR is much better lounges for those eligible.

Global Entry is also a godsend meaning you don’t need to worry about immigration queues in the U.S. and I know more and more people applying for it - even those only going once a year to the U.S. think the fee is worth it for the 5 year validity. Plus you get TSA pre-clear which is also great.

[Rivet Joint]

Aer Lingus have put Belfast City and Dublin on sale for the winter, each operating 13x weekly.

KLM to Amsterdam returns to 14x weekly, but currently will be using larger aircraft from the start of 2025. Looking at a few dates in Jan/Feb there is the following:

6x E295 (Mon-Fri + Sun morning flight)
1x 737 (Sat morning flight)
7x E190 (Mon-Sun evening flight)

Flights in Nov/Dec are currently still showing as all E175's.

Great to hear about the larger aircraft, especially their new E195 E2s. Perhaps the perfect aircraft for SOU? Recently cleared for ops at LCY so performance obviously not an issue. The TUI Belgium outfit have a few being flown to holiday destinations. Porter who are a low cost carrier in Canada have recently ordered 50+ odd and already received half in a year or so.

Perhaps there is an airline in Europe or a new operator out there willing to take a chance on this jet or the A220 to operate from smaller airports like SOU. Why would they do that you might say? Well Porter have gone from q400s to it and are making it work, Breeze are a new low cost airline built around a smaller jet in the A220. Air Baltic out of nowhere are going to operate 50+ A220s.

But why would an existing airline like Easy etc take on another fleet type? Well JetBlue a large low cost operator in America are building a sizeable A220 fleet alongside A320/A321. Many legacy carriers do in Air France, Delta, ITA and Azul.

And the potential clincher? The 737 and A320 are sold out for the rest of the decade and more. Huge growth for air travel predicted. Looks like the E2 and 220 will be the only options.

Disclaimer, this is merely speculation posted on a forum, not something to be taken as a fact. Of course the dream scenario would be for Easy to order the A220 which would be the perfect replacement for the A319. Not all of the routes flown by that plane can be ungraded to the A320. Saying that, if it was going to happen it would probably have already happened by now.

[Harold77]

Disclaimer, this is merely speculation posted on a forum, not something to be taken as a fact. Of course the dream scenario would be for Easy to order the A220 which would be the perfect replacement for the A319. Not all of the routes flown by that plane can be ungraded to the A320. Saying that, if it was going to happen it would probably have already happened by now.

When easyJet were saying they are removing the A319 fleet from its portfolio, it was so they could increase their capacity, hence going for the neo's.

[LTNman]

Disclaimer, this is merely speculation posted on a forum, not something to be taken as a fact. Of course the dream scenario would be for Easy to order the A220 which would be the perfect replacement for the A319. Not all of the routes flown by that plane can be ungraded to the A320. Saying that, if it was going to happen it would probably have already happened by now.


More of a case of clutching at straws. Even if easy did order the A220, which they won’t, looking at the backlog, a new order now would mean a long wait of a few years to take delivery.

[rog747]

Great to hear about the larger aircraft, especially their new E195 E2s.
Perhaps the perfect aircraft for SOU?
Recently cleared for ops at LCY so performance obviously not an issue. TUI Belgium have a few being flown to holiday destinations.
Perhaps there is an airline out there willing to take a chance on this jet or the A220 to operate from smaller airports like SOU?

Would an existing airline like Easy etc take on another fleet type?
JetBlue in America are building a sizeable A220 fleet alongside A320N/A321N

Looks like the E2 and 220 will be the only options.
Disclaimer, this is merely speculation posted on a forum, not something to be taken as a fact.

Of course the dream scenario would be for Easyjet to order the A220 which would be the perfect replacement for the A319.

RV, I enjoy many of your posts and passion (and those posts from others here too).
SOU Airport is a unique topic and it's future is very much pivotal on getting the ''right fits, with the right expansion''

However, we do have a rather large Pratt and Whitney shaped 'Elephant in the Room' as for the foreseeable future, the engine problems of the new Pratt and Whitney GTF's that happen to power the E2, the A220 and many new A320N and A321N, we are seeing one-third of these new jets with P&W GTF engines sitting idle as a recall impact spreads.

These recall problems are currently affecting many airlines Globally until at least the end of 2026 (including KLM, Wizz, JetBlue and AirTransat) with the groundings and mandatory inspections that are needed, and these mods are taking each airframe offline for at least 2 months or more downtime.
Wizz Air recently said it was forced to slash its capacity forecast by 10% as it will have to ground about 45 A320N/A321N aircraft, and Turkish Airlines has 18 of it's 55 A321N grounded.

What with Boeing's many woes across the 737-MAX design and the ongoing QA revelations, and now other recalls with LEAP engine anti-ice overheating, plus the continuing Certification debacle of the larger 737M Dash-10 version, airlines must be pulling their hair out to be able to get products that actually work.

Easyjet wisely bought the LEAP engines for their Airbus Neos, and likewise Jet2 stayed well away from the 737 MAX, buying up the last new 737NG's, and has now gone for the latest A320N/A321N family (with LEAP engines).

[Ascupart]

The latest airport data has been published by the CAA. 58,553 passengers in February.

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/895x542/soton_7dd0d31c02a31b55e4700543a261e3d3af947bf8.png


Looking at February only in comparison to other similar sized airports
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/900x540/feb_c71f1487b9efadf9c451ba4222542f8c11fd8e7c.png

So steady progress.

[SKOJB]

Feb 23 v 24 saw some good growth for SOU. EIR/DUB + 51% and assume as a result of RYR/BOH pulling route this winter, EZY/GVA + 45% (albeit with added capacity) and LM/EZY GLA + 26% (cannot split stats although hear easyJet doing very well). Interestingly EIR/BHD holding firm -1% against EZY/BFS competition (loads 62%-75% A319/320). Not so good is LM/NCL - 19% and LM/EDI - 12% would suggest high pricing & RYR/BOH alternative. Apologies for jumbled message as not sure how to present these stats but I think the takeaway is the airport is showing green shoots with Aer Lingus performing brilliantly and easyjet domestics making a solid start, Loganair hitting slightly choppy waters!

[Diff Tail Shim]

Feb 23 v 24 sees some good growth for SOU. EIR/DUB + 51% and assume as a result of RYR/BOH pulling route this winter, EZY/GVA + 45% (albeit with added capacity) and LM/EZY GLA + 26% (cannot split stats although hear easyJet doing very well). Interestingly EIR/BHD holding firm -1% against EZY/BFS competition (loads 62%-75% A319/320). Not so good is LM/NCL - 19% and LM/EDI - 12% would suggest high pricing & RYR/BOH alternative. Apologies for jumbled message as not sure how to present these stats but I think the takeaway is the airport is showing green shoots with Aer Lingus performing brilliantly and easyjet domestics making a solid start, Loganair hitting slightly choppy waters!
You wasted your time working that out? I would get a life. SOU were so incompetence tonight.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

But why would an existing airline like Easy etc take on another fleet type? Well JetBlue a large low cost operator in America are building a sizeable A220 fleet alongside A320/A321. Many legacy carriers do in Air France, Delta, ITA and Azul.
easyJet policy is following Ryanair in up-sizing the core fleet. The A319s are leaving and more A320Ns/A321Ns are coming. Stated aim is that the A320-200N will be the smallest aircraft type.

[Ascupart]

Feb 23 v 24 sees some good growth for SOU. EIR/DUB + 51% ...
Interestingly, if we just look at the month of February, flights to the Netherlands had some rather lacklustre growth, overtaken by flights to Ireland.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/876x497/irl_9d9eb75f581ccc0934bac3385386dcd9df599886.png

All international since 2021:
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/856x499/all_ae08580eade8ac2a0b3859fd5a4c1a43f5d7871d.png

[The Nutts Mutts]

You wasted your time working that out? I would get a life. SOU were so incompetence tonight.

What happened? Was it ATC, ground handling, terminal staff etc?

[Ascupart]

Feb 2024 passenger figures when expressed as a percentage of the same month in 2019
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/652x410/percent_f13372bc2dcddcf9a20e3a14f4da32b41e5fc4e0.png

[SouthernAlliance]

Feb 2024 passenger figures when expressed as a percentage of the same month in 2019
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/652x410/percent_f13372bc2dcddcf9a20e3a14f4da32b41e5fc4e0.png

Nothing we don’t know already ie Covid/BE. Hence will take longer than most airports to get anywhere near to 2019 figures but it’s improving year on year and going in the right direction. If the airport can get closer to 1m this year and 1.2m (break even) within the next 18/24 months, this will I’m sure be seen as an achievement when considering a totally new business model has had to be developed along with infrastructure changes required to promote this new way of operating.

[andymartin]

Nothing we don’t know already ie Covid/BE. Hence will take longer than most airports to get anywhere near to 2019 figures but it’s improving year on year and going in the right direction. If the airport can get closer to 1m this year and 1.2m (break even) within the next 18/24 months, this will I’m sure be seen as an achievement when considering a totally new business model has had to be developed along with infrastructure changes required to promote this new way of operating.
Do you work for SOU pr team? BOU top of the table, SOU bottom, says it all about the future of SOU.

[SWBKCB]

Chris Tibbett said summer 2024 is about proving the airport has what it takes to supply the holiday demand for local people. He said: “The flights that we have on this summer is really the start of what could be achieved at Southampton Airport.

“We now have six easyJet routes flying directly out of our airport, joining British Airways and TUI who already operate summer sun routes, whilst KLM have increased flying to three times a day with connections to far afield places like Asia. With big airlines like these already on the cards I’m thrilled to say this is just the beginning.”

Airport sponsored article:

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/24246433.southampton-airport-set-flights-greece-italy-malta/

[TCAS FAN]

You wasted your time working that out? I would get a life. SOU were so incompetence tonight.

Presumably you meant to say “incompetent”? Pray explain, from what FR24 shows all scheduled flights arrived and departed.

[SouthernAlliance]

Do you work for SOU pr team? BOU top of the table, SOU bottom, says it all about the future of SOU.

Far from it my friend. Merely pointing out that the airport has suffered a large downturn that has affected many people’s lives detrimentally and is having to build itself back up again.

[Ascupart]

Do you work for SOU pr team? BOU top of the table, SOU bottom, says it all about the future of SOU.
There's a hill to climb for sure, but we've yet to see the impact of new routes. What I find interesting from the table I posted is that some airports are doing better than they were pre-pandemic which indicates that there is a demand for travel. I don't see why SOU wouldn't benefit from that.

[Albert Hall]

Quite an interesting chat with an industry contact recently. One of the big issues at Southampton is the cost of aviation fuel, which is surprising when it's that close to Fawley refinery! It's apparently the most expensive of any decent-sized airport in the country - not far off double that at Bournemouth apparently - and unless you can carry roundtrip fuel into SOU, which isn't easy with the fairly limited runway length, it's incredibly costly to pick up fuel there. Might this be one reason behind the airport's stagnation?

[SouthernAlliance]

Quite an interesting chat with an industry contact recently. One of the big issues at Southampton is the cost of aviation fuel, which is surprising when it's that close to Fawley refinery! It's apparently the most expensive of any decent-sized airport in the country - not far off double that at Bournemouth apparently - and unless you can carry roundtrip fuel into SOU, which isn't easy with the fairly limited runway length, it's incredibly costly to pick up fuel there. Might this be one reason behind the airport's stagnation?

Didn't easyJet do just that the other day with their diverted flight back to BFS. Goes to show it is possible on domestics, not sure for international, but interesting all the same.

[TCAS FAN]

Airport sponsored article:

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/24246433.southampton-airport-set-flights-greece-italy-malta/

Oh dear here we go again, after the previous regime realised their mistake and stopped saying it, the new one does exactly the same “aviation director Chris said will increase the number and size of plane now able to take off from Southampton”. Nothing bigger than what could pre-extension already use the airport is going to be appearing.

Just adding more fuel to the anti-airport lobby bonfire.

One would have thought that an Ops Director would have sufficient technical expertise to not make such a basic mistake.

[kcockayne]

Oh dear here we go again, after the previous regime realised their mistake and stopped saying it, the new one does exactly the same “aviation director Chris said will increase the number and size of plane now able to take off from Southampton”. Nothing bigger than what could pre-extension already use the airport is going to be appearing.

Just adding more fuel to the anti-airport lobby bonfire.

One would have thought that an Ops Director would have sufficient technical expertise to not make such a basic mistake.
Not in my experience of some Ops. Directors !

[TCAS FAN]

Not in my experience of some Ops. Directors !

Nor mine, a long past predecessor at SOU got her 02 and 20 mixed up, and had a survey done on the opposite end of the runway to what was required. That one promptly ended up under the carpet!

[Sharklet_321]

New route to Caen starting in June by Chalair ATR-42 twice per week

Credit to seanm on X

[Sotonsean]

New route to Caen starting in June by Chalair ATR-42 twice per week

Credit to seanm on X

That's a nice and unexpected addition to SOU.

I've often wondered if Chalair would ever consider starting a Caen to Southampton route, and here we have it.

Would be nice if an operator could resume a link from Southampton to Rennes as it was a popular route with Flybe.

SOU now has 20 destinations from 9 Airlines. Most regional airports would love the thought of having 9 airlines. You would imagine, though, that most regional airports with 9 airlines would produce far more than 20 destinations. SOU should in reality be serving more than 20 destinations with 9 airline's.

If I remember correctly the highest amount of destinations served from SOU at any onetime was about 38 and from a much lesser amount of airline's.

[MARKEYD]

I really don’t want to rain on the parade but it’s a little bit late to start a brand new route to somewhere that most people in the UK don’t know about and even where the place is and secondly who the heck is this airline ??

[Sotonsean]

Further to the above post's regarding the French regional airline Chalair announcing a seasonal service between Caen and Southampton.

Service commences on Friday 28 June 2024 and operates until 22 September 2024. Flights will operate twice weekly on a Friday and Sunday with an ATR 72.

​​​​​Friday schedule.

CE1431 CFR 10.00 SOU 09.45
CE1432 SOU 10.30 CFR 12.15

Sunday schedule.

CE1431 CFR 16.45 SOU 16.30
CE1432 SOU 17.15 CFR 19.00

Caen is a lovely city with lots to see and do, great food and loads of history. Close to Bayeux and the Normandy beaches. A great weekend getaway made even easier with this new direct link between the city and Southampton. Equally great for Caen and northern Normandy for an air connection to London via SOU.

Hopefully in the future we will see further French regional airports being added or resumed from Southampton.

Caen CFR was never flown by Flybe from Southampton, although it was previously served by a small French regional operator in the late 1980s, the name of which I can't remember.

[vectisman]

I really don’t want to rain on the parade but it’s a little bit late to start a brand new route to somewhere that most people in the UK don’t know about and even where the place is and secondly who the heck is this airline ??
You say you don’t want to rain on parade and then do exactly that!

[SKOJB]

You say you don’t want to rain on parade and then do exactly that!

Don't worry, to this poster if it’s not BOH it’s not worth worrying about.

[Rivet Joint]

Don't worry, to this poster if it’s not BOH it’s not worth worrying about.

Beat me to it. A very sad individual. Imagine being so angered by an inanimate object.

Good news we have a new airline and route. Shame it’s not somewhere a bit more south like Bordeaux as the second home market was quite a big thing for BE that hasn’t been replaced. You can get the ferry to Caen and other areas of northern France just down the road in Portsmouth as well. Hope it proves to be a success though.

[stewyb]

Beat me to it. A very sad individual. Imagine being so angered by an inanimate object.

Good news we have a new airline and route. Shame it’s not somewhere a bit more south like Bordeaux as the second home market was quite a big thing for BE that hasn’t been replaced. You can get the ferry to Caen and other areas of northern France just down the road in Portsmouth as well. Hope it proves to be a success though.

Hopeful that easyJet will do Bordeaux summer seasonal as not sure BA will be back next summer with Bergerac

[Pain in the R's]

Beat me to it. A very sad individual. Imagine being so angered by an inanimate object.
.

It is a shame that you find it impossible not to insult anyone that might be described as having an alternative view. Remember it is just an airport so stop getting angry.

[Rivet Joint]

Hopeful that easyJet will do Bordeaux summer seasonal as not sure BA will be back next summer with Bergerac

Fingers crossed. You would like to think as they grow they will serve at least one French regional route. They have quite a big presence at Bordeaux and SOU use to have many routes to the towns around the Dordoyne region. The second home market must be strong in that area.

[Sotonsean]

Fingers crossed. You would like to think as they grow they will serve at least one French regional route. They have quite a big presence at Bordeaux and SOU use to have many routes to the towns around the Dordoyne region. The second home market must be strong in that area.

DORDOGNE even :ok:

List of former French 🇫🇷 destinations previously served from SOU.

Angers
Avignon
Bastia
Beziers
Biarritz
Bordeaux
Brest
Cherbourg
Clermont-Ferrand
Deauville
Dijon
Dinard
Grenoble
La Rochelle
Le Touquet
Limoges
Lyon
Nantes
Nice
Paris Orly
Pau
Perpignan
Rennes
Rodez
Rouen
Toulouse
Tours

Current French 🇫🇷 destinations served from SOU.

Bergerac
Caen
Chambéry
Paris CDG

A lot of catching up to do regarding many of those former French 🇫🇷 destinations previously flown from SOU. Although compared to other similiar UK regional airports, four French 🇫🇷 destinations is not too bad.

Hopefully easyjet at some point, might consider the following French 🇫🇷 destinations for SOU.

Bordeaux
Lyon
Nice
Paris, either CDG or ORY
Toulouse

Just to add, the amount of second home owners in France 🇫🇷 has severely dropped over the last few years so the demand is not what it used to be for the majority of French regional routes.

Have a good weekend everyone including RJ who's still recuperating by the sounds of it.

[stewyb]

DORDOGNE even :ok:

List of former French destinations previously served from SOU.

Angers
Avignon
Bastia
Beziers
Biarritz
Bordeaux
Brest
Cherbourg
Clermont-Ferrand
Deauville
Dijon
Dinard
Grenoble
La Rochelle
Le Touquet
Limoges
Lyon
Nantes
Nice
Paris Orly
Pau
Perpignan
Rennes
Rodez
Rouen
Toulouse
Tours

Current French destinations served from SOU.

Bergerac
Caen
Chambéry
Paris CDG

A lot of catching up to do regarding many of those former French destinations previously flown from SOU. Although compared to other similiar UK regional airports, four French destinations is not too bad.

Hopefully easyjet at some point, might consider the following French destinations for SOU.

Bordeaux
Lyon
Nice
Paris, either CDG or ORY
Toulouse

Just to add, the amount of second home owners in France has severely dropped over the last few years so the demand is not what it used to be for the majority of French regional routes.

Have a good weekend everyone including RJ who's still recuperating by the sounds of it.

wow that’s a long list! Not sure however if all those were profitable for BE. EasyJet to Nice, CDG and Bordeaux (away bases) would do well in my opinion with of course CDG being year round. Also importantly no duplication with BOH.

[RW20]

It's always been a problem with Rivet Joint,if you have a view different to his then the personal insults follow.
Lets not be carried away with the Caen announcement, any new route from SOU is good news,but the list of French destinations that had been quoted that Easy might go for is pie in the sky.
SOU needs new Sun routes and increased frequency for a sustained future,competition is tough with Jet 2 down the road starting ,it seems Easy is the only airline at present that is committing in a limited way to provide some sun routes,2025 is going to be the tell-tell year for the airport.

[Rivet Joint]

wow that’s a long list! Not sure however if all those were profitable for BE. EasyJet to Nice, CDG and Bordeaux (away bases) would do well in my opinion with of course CDG being year round. Also importantly no duplication with BOH.

Totally agree. No need to serve anywhere near that list of destinations any more. It’s an impressive list though.

Easy to Bordeaux, Paris and Nice would probably cover the majority of peoples needs. Let’s not forget at reduced airfares compared to what BE charged.

[SWBKCB]

How many of the airlines that operated the long list still exist?

[stewyb]

It's always been a problem with Rivet Joint,if you have a view different to his then the personal insults follow.
Lets not be carried away with the Caen announcement, any new route from SOU is good news,but the list of French destinations that had been quoted that Easy might go for is pie in the sky.
SOU needs new Sun routes and increased frequency for a sustained future,competition is tough with Jet 2 down the road starting ,it seems Easy is the only airline at present that is committing in a limited way to provide some sun routes,2025 is going to be the tell-tell year for the airport.

Agreed RW20 that 2025 will be a pivotal year although I don’t see Nice/Bordeaux being pie in the sky. Quite the opposite, these French regionals have always sold well from SOU and in addition to some easyJet summer sun are exactly what the airport should be targeting. Sun routes will always be limited by the fact that EZY med bases only total 5 (including Faro/Barcelona in this) so the hope must be that these weekly frequencies will be increased to add a little more capacity. It will then start to look a great deal more promising and all of which is not unrealistic. However what I don’t foresee is Greece, Turkey etc being added any time soon.

[Sotonsean]

Having previously listed the former French destinations previously flown from SOU I thought that I would add all of the other destinations that were previously operated from SOU.

I previously listed these destinations in a post from a couple of years ago.

AUSTRIA 🇦🇹
Innsbruck
Salzburg

BELGIUM 🇧🇪
Antwerp
Brussels

BULGARIA 🇧🇬
Varna

CROATIA 🇭🇷
Dubrovnik
Split

CZECHIA 🇨🇿
Prague

GERMANY 🇩🇪
Berlin
Dusseldorf
Frankfurt
Hamburg via Antwerp
Hannover
Munich
Paderborn

GREECE 🇬🇷
Mykonos
Skiathos

IRELAND 🇮🇪
Cork
Galway

ITALY 🇮🇹
Alghero
Milan Bergamo
Milan Malpensa
Verona

MALTA 🇲🇹
Malta International

NETHERLANDS 🇳🇱
Rotterdam

SPAIN 🇪🇸
Barcelona
Ibiza
Lleida
Mahon
Murcia
Tenerife

SWITZERLAND 🇨🇭
Bern
Zurich

UNITED KINGDOM 🇬🇧
Birmingham
Bristol
Cardiff
East Midlands
Exeter
Gibraltar
Humberside
Inverness
Isle of Man
Leeds
London Stansted
Liverpool
Newquay
Norwich
Plymouth
St Mary's
Teesside

Current destinations flown from SOU.

FRANCE 🇫🇷
Bergerac
Caen
Chambéry
Paris CDG

IRELAND 🇮🇪
Dublin

NETHERLANDS 🇳🇱
Amsterdam

PORTUGAL 🇵🇹
Faro

SPAIN 🇪🇸
Alicante
Malaga
Palma

SWITZERLAND 🇨🇭
Geneva

UNITED KINGDOM including the Channel Islands 🇬🇧
Aberdeen via Newcastle
Alderney 🇬🇬
Belfast City
Belfast International
Edinburgh
Glasgow
Guernsey 🇬🇬
Jersey 🇯🇪
Newcastle
Stornoway via Glasgow (edit)

​​I'm sure many reading this will be fully aware of the current destinations flown from Southampton but I wanted to add them to give a better comparison to the previous ones.

[stewyb]

Not forgetting Stornoway via GLA

[Sotonsean]

How many of the airlines that operated the long list still exist?

Air France
Aurigny
British Airways
Eastern Airways

Although obviously the majority of those former French 🇫🇷 destinations were previously operated by Flybe.

[Sotonsean]

Not forgetting Stornoway via GLA

I overlooked Stornoway. I will edit my post to include it.

[DC3 Dave]

UNITED KINGDOM 🇬🇧
Aberdeen via Newcastle
Alderney
Belfast City
Belfast International
Edinburgh
Glasgow
Guernsey
Jersey
Newcastle


I hate to do this and maybe it is time for me to get a life but can I point out that the Channel Islands are not part of the UK.

[Sotonsean]

I hate to do this and maybe it is time for me to get a life but can I point out that the Channel Islands are not part of the UK.

I worked for British Channel Island Ferries for eight years, and I am fully aware of that fact. But for arguments sake, it was easier to include them under the United Kingdom. The same applies to the Isle of Man which I also listed under the United Kingdom banner.

Edit..regarding my previous post. I have added flags attached to the destinations in the Channel Islands.

[DC3 Dave]

I worked for British Channel Island Ferries for eight years, and I am fully aware of that fact. But for arguments sake, it was easier to include them under the United Kingdom. The same applies to the Isle of Man which I also listed under the United Kingdom banner.

Edit..regarding my previous post. I have added flags attached to the destinations in the Channel Islands.

I appreciate your efforts. I promise not to be such an a-hole for a couple of days at least.

[RW20]

I think Turkey is operational out of range even with the extension ,however I think SOU management need to focus on Corfu,MaltaGenoa as they are not hugely developed from BOH. As stated before not being able to base A/C at SOU due restrictions is always going to hold back the airports development.

[Sotonsean]

I appreciate your efforts. I promise not to be such an a-hole for a couple of days at least.

A couple of days is only two days. Can you at least make it a few days which is three day's or at the very least even more, maybe a week. But of course I am joking with you. But keep on track as I will be counting the days.

[Sotonsean]

I think Turkey is operational out of range even with the extension ,however I think SOU management need to focus on Corfu,MaltaGenoa as they are not hugely developed from BOH. As stated before not being able to base A/C at SOU due restrictions is always going to hold back the airports development.

"As stated before"

That's a huge understatement as it's included in almost 90% of your posts.

Genoa is a great city indeed, but with British Airways, EasyJet, and Vueling ceasing flights from London to the Italian city over the last couple of years, I certainly can't see it being offered from Southampton.

Corfu and Malta, I'm in total agreement as both destinations are within reach of SOU.

Any discussions regarding destinations in Turkey 🇹🇷 should be instantly closed down due to the fact that the country is way beyond the operational limits of SOU.

[rog747]

Nice to see Caen added.

Daft commnet by the new Ops bloke re ''bigger planes'' LOL.

The majority of those former French leisure and ''second homer'' destinations as mostly previously operated by Flybe, were seasonal (Summer only)
In the Winter season some Ski resort airports are very popular as we currently see with Lyons and Chambery, and to nearby GVA.
Grenoble is another one.

Other routes notably missed are Verona WEDS and SUN (Summer) Flybe flew it twice weekly and Inghams Lakes and Mountains Holidays filled the planes.

Corfu (and Malta) could work if flown on a W pattern - say BRS-CFU-SOU-CFU-BRS, plus both Aegean, Sky Express and KM Malta Airlines fly a number of summer charter flights (with A320)

Skiathos and Mykonos were both a missed opportunity; Flybe's JSI charterer were a nightmare, and BAs JMK began in the throes and woes of the Pandemic.
Had they been properly marketed and the routes handled far better then they would have been winners.


If TUI Holidays had some guts and push then they could offer way more from SOU than just 2 flights a week to Majorca.
Any TUI expansion at SOU would not IMHO, impact their BOH expansion and could well set them apart from Jet2's start up at BOH by offering more holidays from 2 local airports.

Trouble is, and here's the thing, (which applies to both SOU and BOH) apart from winter flights to the Canaries and weekend SKI flights then the rest is all summer only.

[Asturias56]

because that's when the good people of the Southampton/Bournemouth area want to fly?

The whole area is (relatively) well off financially - but it's very much leisure based, and Euro-centred

[Sharklet_321]

For all those who have said the 737-800 can’t operate from SOU, an Enter Air 737-800 operated in and out effortless today. Albeit on a short hop.

[rog747]

For all those who have said the 737-800 can’t operate from SOU, an Enter Air 737-800 operated in and out effortless today. Albeit on a short hop.

never said it couldn't it's done it in the past but not with an economic core charter load to the likes of the Mediterranean Greek Islands or the Canaries but fine for football charters or short hops perhaps with no luggage so you answered your own question


Enter air have also flown into Gibraltar 🇬🇮 but with a limited load a sports team

GIBRALTAR cannot accommodate regular loaded 737 800 operations
The old classic versions could though no problem

[sewushr]

'short hop' is a bit of an under-statement lol

[Sotonsean]

Regarding the Enter Air Boeing 737-800 that arrived at SOU today.

It arrived from Brussels, and after a couple of hours on the ground, it later departed for Brize Norton.

Does anyone have any other information regarding these flights?

This morning, Saturday, 20 April 2024, there was an EasyJet A319, EasyJet A320 plus the Enter Air Boeing 737-800 on the ground at the same time. Hopefully someone took a photo of that.

[jensdad]

As always, Sotonsean, an interesting post, but in the interests of objectivity I'll point out that comparing the destinations that have ever been served from an airport with the destinations served at one moment in time (i.e now) is probably always going to make things look bad now - the equivalent lists for Heathrow would probably show something similar. I agree, though, that SOU has taken a hit in a way many UK airports haven't.

[Irishshamrock]

I’m hearing a 3 aircraft base from March/April 2025 is on the cards. Mutterings in the crew room.

It apparently includes night stopping for the SOU based crew at AMS, MAN and BCN. There wouldn’t be overnighting aircraft in SOU.

[LTNman]

Regarding the Enter Air Boeing 737-800 that arrived at SOU today.

Hopefully someone took a photo of that.

Southampton is not a great airport for taking photos of some of the stands so this is the best I got.
https://i.postimg.cc/kGhznSjc/Enter-air.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

So today I called into SOU twice via train. After taking out a mortgage for the fare lets just say SOU with never benefit from London passengers using the airport as an alternative unless they are wealthy and don't mind a long train journey.
https://i.postimg.cc/MHBDyn06/Sou1.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://i.postimg.cc/RV8ZqGXx/IMG-2770.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
I watched the easyjet depart using just half the runway, once it disappeared into the blue yonder the only sounds came from birdsong from the car park roof. As for the terminal, it is a delight and reminds me of Inverness.
https://i.postimg.cc/8z7CwLJm/South-3.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Just 14 check-in desks plus 3 self service from Easyjet.
https://i.postimg.cc/nz2ZnL9L/South-4.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://i.postimg.cc/rpqPMN1S/South-5.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://i.postimg.cc/L6dHphXm/IMG-2773.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
So plenty of space with few passengers. Not what Southampton fan boys want to hear but from a passengers point of view it doesn't get much better than this. 10/10 for me.

Finally, I am sure the last time I called into the airport, part of the first floor was land side. This would be 30 plus years ago.

[Sharklet_321]

Is this how they’re proposing to get around the airport operational hours?

I would be surprised if they do AMS-SOU due lack of available slots. Is the airport that stupid to allow them to compete against KLM:ugh:

[Sotonsean]

I’m hearing a 3 aircraft base from March/April 2025 is on the cards. Mutterings in the crew room.

It apparently includes night stopping for the SOU based crew at AMS, MAN and BCN. There wouldn’t be overnighting aircraft in SOU.

Well that sounds expensive and in my opinion a ridiculous situation if true. Without aircraft overnighting in SOU would it really be a base as you have suggested. Does MAN even have the spare overnight stand capacity for another three A320s.

On the other hand hopefully these "mutterings" you have come across have some form of truth behind them.

Obviously if true it would absolutely fantastic news for SOU. But with AMS well covered by KLM from SOU, I would prefer them not to compete on the route. BCN would be a very welcome return to SOU. Hopefully MAN will be served as it's the missing link in domestic routes from SOU.

But we know what "crew rooms" are like. So until anything comes from these "mutterings," I'll remain silent on the matter.

[Sotonsean]

Well Well Well, the 'infamous' LTNman was visiting SOU today and he never gave anyone on here a heads up. Shame as we could have all had the opportunity to have met you in person. The "real life" LTNman in person, a lost opportunity for sure.

But on behalf of myself and others on here we're pleased that you enjoyed the wonderful experience of Southampton Airport.

But don't use too much of that well earned pension of yours on expensive train journeys :)

[SouthernAlliance]

Can we assume this basing rumour is easyJet as an airline has not been mentioned?

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

I’m hearing a 3 aircraft base from March/April 2025 is on the cards. Mutterings in the crew room.

It apparently includes night stopping for the SOU based crew at AMS, MAN and BCN. There wouldn’t be overnighting aircraft in SOU.
Do easyJet have any other bases with no night stopping aircraft? Any AMS/BCN aircraft would surely be operated by EJU (Austrian AOC) and not EZY (UK AOC)? Isn't that bending the post Brexit rules as UK crews can't cross fleet the Austrian AOC?

[Cazza_fly]

Do easyJet have any other bases with no night stopping aircraft? Any AMS/BCN aircraft would surely be operated by EJU (Austrian AOC) and not EZY (UK AOC)? Isn't that bending the post Brexit rules as UK crews can't cross fleet the Austrian AOC?

Incorrect and bending no "rules". A G- reg is more than welcome to park overnight in AMS or BCN. Just as an EU reg overnight in many UK airports. There is a bigger world out there than the EU you know. What do you think BA do all over EU destinations? The only thing is that it will fly back to a UK airport, wherever that may be in the schedule.

[MidlandsWanderer]

I’m hearing a 3 aircraft base from March/April 2025 is on the cards. Mutterings in the crew room.

It apparently includes night stopping for the SOU based crew at AMS, MAN and BCN. There wouldn’t be overnighting aircraft in SOU.

Why would a low-cost airline like U2 then go ahead and operate routes in the must expensive way possible? It makes no sense especially considering they have bases at AMS/MAN/BCN. Far more likely for these routes to be operated by AMS/MAN/BCN crews.

As for the comment about the airport "allowing" Easy to compete against KLM, it's not the airport's decision.

[FRatSTN]

Indeed if this was EasyJet and this were to happen it makes little sense. You'd surely instead operate W patterns using AMS crew, say AMS-SOU-IBZ-SOU-AMS, in order to serve other non-base airports. Then you'd operate ALC, PMI etc. inbound from those bases as they do now, albeit maybe on higher frequency.

The added flexibility though with overnighting SOU crew in say AMS is you can then dedicate that aircraft to SOU for the entire day and make an afternoon crew change in SOU, which you wouldn't be able to do on a W pattern. That said you've then got an additional aircraft parked overnight in say AMS, or MAN that isn't then serving those airports any additional capacity during the day, which is little incentive to them.

[rog747]

Great photos LTNman,
glad you had a good sunny day and captured shots of the Terminal, and the Enter Air!

Enter Air have been doing stuff for both the MoD and HM Govt.
They have been flying out of EXT weekly to Tirana to return failed asylum seekers.
Not sure what it was doing at SOU though - It had flown OST- BRU for Brize via SOU.
It then flew Brize back to CDG as a 'P' flight, and is now off to sunny Chania today.

Yes, the SOU airport is a dream to arrive at by Train or park your Car, toddle across the road and check in without fuss and get away PDQ.
I love using the airport as much as I can.

This weekend re ''slow trains'', SWR had alot of engineering work that closed the line west of SOU and RRB (buses) ran for Bomo, Poole, Dorch, and Weymouth.
That meant trains into SOU were not running that 'fast' on the Mainline.
Yes, train fares are hiked for both SOU stations (Commuter route) and thus to/from London it's not easy to find cheaper tickets.
If you have a Railcard then the fares are less 35%, plus it is worth using the 'Split Ticket' websites and you can often save a chunk there.

Re the said rumour about a 3 aircraft Base at SOU for S25 (AMS, BCN, MAN?) but how can you have a Base with no aircraft ''Based there''.
You can have a Crew Base I suppose...
As AMS is well served by KLM, then having another AMS-SOU is a puzzling one, but if the airline (we assume it is EZY?) wants to fly the route then that would tie in nicely doing a W pattern, AMS-SOU-BCN-(or to MAN)-SOU-AMS but that would most likely give you crap times for one of the routes.
So who (what type of Passenger) would EZY be aiming at?

You can IIRC, see those sort of W's at SEN Southend with EZY this summer which have no EZY aircraft based there.
SEN's EZY routes are: Alicante Amsterdam Paris–Charles de Gaulle
Seasonal to:
In Summer: Faro Málaga Palma de Mallorca
In Winter: Geneva Grenoble
Balkan Holidays BH Air have a new charter SEN-Burgas (begins 17 June 2024)
Rumour is the new KM Malta airlines may restart the SEN-Malta flights.

[Jamesair1]

Do easyJet have any other bases with no night stopping aircraft? Any AMS/BCN aircraft would surely be operated by EJU (Austrian AOC) and not EZY (UK AOC)? Isn't that bending the post Brexit rules as UK crews can't cross fleet the Austrian AOC?

The closest parallel I can think of is NCL with EZY operating multiple daily flights to BFS and BRS and this summer to PMI and ALC and from Sept to AMS.. All flights are operated by incoming aircraft.

[ATNotts]

Do easyJet have any other bases with no night stopping aircraft? Any AMS/BCN aircraft would surely be operated by EJU (Austrian AOC) and not EZY (UK AOC)? Isn't that bending the post Brexit rules as UK crews can't cross fleet the Austrian AOC?
EZY were doing that for some years at BHX until the 3 aircraft base opened in March this year.

[FRatSTN]

Newcastle has had no EZY based crew since they closed the 3 aircraft base during Covid, likewise BHX had no crew base before they opened the 3 aircraft base recently. In both cases these airports are a dot on the map (ie not a base) with aircraft and crew based elsewhere and no night stopping crew whatsoever. What's been discussed regarding SOU isn't remotely similar.

They can of course simply operate incoming aircraft on EJU from their EU bases into the UK as is common practice.

[SKOJB]

There was a poster on the airport FB group a few weeks ago suggesting that an easyjet base was to be announced and they had heard this from crew at LGW who were being transferred down to SOU, we shall see!

[Sharklet_321]

So a few sources seem to be corroborating this rumour.

If this is indeed true it would be fantastic news for the region. Three fully utilised SOU based aircraft could be around 2m passengers a year which catapults the airport into major regional status if this was to come to pass. In additional to what the airport is currently doing that could mean a 2.5m - 2.7m passenger throughput in the 2026 calendar year.

Will airport infrastructure cope with that? Car-parking will need expanding and surely they will need to make some fast improvement to the capacity of the departure lounge. In Flybe days it was constant but only 78 max seats per departure whereas with this scenario it’s potentially bunched departures with 186 * 3 (or more) departures at once.

[darren1]

I'll bite. So if this rumour does become a reality, what routes could we see? I take it BA Cityflyer would be long gone by next year? Is this just a wild rumour because LS have announced something very well in advance from BOH?

[shamrock7seal]

If they keep the routes to 3 hour range or less, that should narrow the focus.

[ShedDriver]

Regarding the Enter Air Boeing 737-800 that arrived at SOU today.

It arrived from Brussels, and after a couple of hours on the ground, it later departed for Brize Norton.

Does anyone have any other information regarding these flights?

This morning, Saturday, 20 April 2024, there was an EasyJet A319, EasyJet A320 plus the Enter Air Boeing 737-800 on the ground at the same time. Hopefully someone took a photo of that.

Search for airside ops manager Jeremy Edmunds on LinkedIn, he's posted three great pictures of the aircraft lined up. Unfortunately I can't post them here yet due to insufficient posts.

[DC3 Dave]

So a few sources seem to be corroborating this rumour.

If this is indeed true it would be fantastic news for the region. Three fully utilised SOU based aircraft could be around 2m passengers a year which catapults the airport into major regional status if this was to come to pass. In additional to what the airport is currently doing that could mean a 2.5m - 2.7m passenger throughput in the 2026 calendar year.

Will airport infrastructure cope with that? Car-parking will need expanding and surely they will need to make some fast improvement to the capacity of the departure lounge. In Flybe days it was constant but only 78 max seats per departure whereas with this scenario it’s potentially bunched departures with 186 * 3 (or more) departures at once.

I think you need to do your maths again. Good news if true, but calm down, calm down.

[SKOJB]

I think you need to do your maths again. Good news if true, but calm down, calm down.

3 aircraft base with say 15 routes would equate to more like 500k approx.

[DC3 Dave]

3 aircraft base with say 15 routes would equate to more like 500k approx.

If we take our friend’s optimism then sprinkle on a little reality, then 3 186 seat aircraft operating at a healthy 90% l/f 18 sectors per day for 364 days a year will give you a little under 1.1 million pax p.a.

But you have to factor in it is unlikely all 3 aircraft will be fully utilised throughout the entire winter (or even the summer). Then there are the inevitable cancellations, diversions etc.

So in my view, 850k would be pretty damn good.

[Sharklet_321]

Oh dear :D I realise the error I made - 1m passengers indeed, not 2m

[DC3 Dave]

Oh dear :D I realise the error I made - 1m passengers indeed, not 2m

Still one almighty boost.

[SKOJB]

Still one almighty boost.

Indeed and importantly the airport would very soon reach break even of 1.2m. However in my opinion at least one, if not two aircraft would initially be the A319.

[Asturias56]

" Three fully utilised SOU based aircraft could be around 2m passengers a year which catapults the airport into major regional status if this was to come to pass."

the trick is the phrase "fully utilised" - that's a very big step up in available seats.

[SKOJB]

" Three fully utilised SOU based aircraft could be around 2m passengers a year which catapults the airport into major regional status if this was to come to pass."

the trick is the phrase "fully utilised" - that's a very big step up in available seats.

maximising aircraft utilisation would surely come from the addition of domestic departures to NCL, EDI and MAN, along with AMS and CDG. The KLM and Loganair services could be significantly impacted.

[Sotonsean]

Search for airside ops manager Jeremy Edmunds on LinkedIn, he's posted three great pictures of the aircraft lined up. Unfortunately I can't post them here yet due to insufficient posts.

Thanks for the reply and the link, much appreciated.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x600/1713608919665_195cdfbcca17218cbda518d42dc6cef6b7623ad8.jpeg

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x600/1713608919365_aa67f76dbc52b5cadd628b93b3f7de2bb13e7069.jpeg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x370/1713608919218_861659db3fdeb3b83a2dc87373d9d6af2c5d7fc2.jpeg

Excellent photos, gives a great impression of what the future may look like at SOU.

[TCAS FAN]

Thanks for the reply and the link, much appreciated.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x600/1713608919665_195cdfbcca17218cbda518d42dc6cef6b7623ad8.jpeg

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x600/1713608919365_aa67f76dbc52b5cadd628b93b3f7de2bb13e7069.jpeg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x370/1713608919218_861659db3fdeb3b83a2dc87373d9d6af2c5d7fc2.jpeg

Excellent photos, gives a great impression of what the future may look like at SOU.

Hopefully even better than this,only 3 of 4 Stands occupied.

[speedrestriction]

There was a poster on the airport FB group a few weeks ago suggesting that an easyjet base was to be announced and they had heard this from crew at LGW who were being transferred down to SOU, we shall see!

What they were suggesting is untrue. The crew would find out at the same time as the public if that were to be the case.

[Asturias56]

"maximising aircraft utilisation would surely come from the addition of domestic departures to NCL, EDI and MAN, along with AMS and CDG. The KLM and Loganair services could be significantly
impacted."

Agreed - Loganair won't go head to head with EasyJet

[Ascupart]

There was a poster on the airport FB group a few weeks ago suggesting that an easyjet base was to be announced and they had heard this from crew at LGW who were being transferred down to SOU, we shall see!
There was a recent article in the Daily Echo (sponsored by the airport) entitled "Southampton Airport could be set for flights to Greece, Italy, Malta" - I wonder if this was teasing a new EasyJet base?

[willy wombat]

While I admire the optimism and enthusiasm of many of the posters, I wouldn’t read anything at all into crew room rumours.

[SWBKCB]

Or airport puff pieces. What matters is what EZY make this summer. Nothing will be finalised yet for next year.

[stewyb]

Whilst never say never of course to any future basing and that is surely the airports end goal, it’s more likely in the short term that we will see some added easyJet routes for W23/24 (CDG, MAN) and S25 (AGP, BCN, BOD, NCE) as examples from away bases. Would imagine easyJet will build up to around a dozen away based routes just as they did with BHX before potentially committing further. Also wouldn’t be surprised to see EZY GLA go double daily.

[RW20]

Whilst never say never of course to any future basing and that is surely the airports end goal, it’s more likely in the short term that we will see some added easyJet routes for W23/24 (CDG, MAN) and S25 (AGP, BCN, BOD, NCE) as examples from away bases. Would imagine easyJet will build up to around a dozen away based routes just as they did with BHX before potentially committing further. Also wouldn’t be surprised to see EZY GLA go double daily.
Stewyb ,No one can knock your optimistic view for the airport ,but Easy need to see the loads for the S24 from SOU (hopefully good) to see if there is a long term future at the airport. With the rapidly expanding BOH operation I'm sure there is room for maneuvering with destinations within SOU operational capabilities.
Its critical that SOU management get on the case and promote the airport more.

[stewyb]

Stewyb ,No one can knock your optimistic view for the airport ,but Easy need to see the loads for the S24 from SOU (hopefully good) to see if there is a long term future at the airport. With the rapidly expanding BOH operation I'm sure there is room for maneuvering with destinations within SOU operational capabilities.
It’s critical that SOU management get on the case and promote the airport more.

Of course the future will depend on how S24 pans out but with several easyJet routes now in place, my simple take is there must already be an appetite from both sides to expand operations so long as certain measures are being met. Something surely has to stick at some point and let’s hope this is the case with the airport enticing EZY because alternative options begin to look increasingly thin. Cautiously optimistic that’s me:ok:

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

Also wouldn’t be surprised to see EZY GLA go double daily.
Some context :
Return seats available per day with various models :
Loganair
5 x Daily J31=190 seats
5 x Daily J41=290 seats
3 x Daily ER4=294 seats

flybe
4 x Daily Q400 = 624 seats

easyJet
Only 2 x Daily A319 = 624 seats

That's a different world IMHO, if they can do this, it's evidence that the future would be much more easyJet and less Loganair.

[SouthernAlliance]

We have heard snippets on here that easyjet GLA is going well with decent loads so a double daily in the future could be an option. The extra daily rotation with a 319 would be the seat equivalent to LM x 3 daily summer timetable

[SWBKCB]

We have heard snippets on here that easyjet GLA is going well with decent loads so a double daily in the future could be an option. The extra daily rotation with a 319 would be the seat equivalent to LM x 3 daily summer timetable

Doubt EZY have an aircraft sitting waiting to put on SOU-GLA, so where would the extra capacity come from, and would it make more money on SOU-GLA than on what it is currently doing? May work in Winter, but year round?

[SouthernAlliance]

Stewyb ,No one can knock your optimistic view for the airport ,but Easy need to see the loads for the S24 from SOU (hopefully good) to see if there is a long term future at the airport. With the rapidly expanding BOH operation I'm sure there is room for maneuvering with destinations within SOU operational capabilities.
It’s critical that SOU management get on the case and promote the airport more.

Worth noting with any easyjet operation at BOH, them and their 3 main competitors would be fighting over limited apron space, terminal capacity (of which it will already be very snug), car parking and airport advertising. At SOU easyjet would almost have free rein to use all these exclusively. Could be a deal clincher with minimal operational impact from competing airlines. Of course the right incentives need to be given in the first place to make anything happen

[vectisman]

Loganair are to terminate Glasgow to Southampton from 10th May according to @SeanM1997

[willy wombat]

Everything after May 10th showing as “sold out” so probably true. I await comments from all those posters who happily proclaimed that there was plenty room for LM and EZY on SOUGLA.

[SKOJB]

Everything after May 10th showing as “sold out” so probably true. I await comments from all those posters who happily proclaimed that there was plenty room for LM and EZY on SOUGLA.

Hardly surprising with the seat pricing LM charged and easyJet has clearly taken the market share on this route in a short space of time

[SWBKCB]

Hopefully EZY stick around

[The Nutts Mutts]

So that's one flight per day compared to three or four. Terrible for connectivity- so many business travellers used those Loganair SOU-GLA flights (including myself).
I'm seeing this as a blow for SOU and the region. That's not me being anti-SOU or negative, but as someone who lives locally and travels a lot I'll really miss the option of business-friendly flights from SOU to GLA and I think others will too.

[cavokblues]

I presume Easy will make the daily flight year round? Currently from 1st November it drops to 2 x per week.

[SKOJB]

I presume Easy will make the daily flight year round? Currently from 1st November it drops to 2 x per week.

think easyjet has just copied over last winters schedule to next winter. Predict this to change and continue a daily service

[Albert Hall]

It gets worse this winter unless easyJet react to this - they have only two weekly services on sale on Thu & Sat for GLA-SOU.

How long after this before easyJet open up on EDI-SOU as well though, and then that's Loganair gone from SOU completely? If you see that it's this "easy" to dislodge them, why would you not keep on going?

[willy wombat]

It will largely depend on what little gaps in the GLA fleet’s program EZY need to fill. GLASOU will never be a core route for EZY.

[SKOJB]

It will largely depend on what little gaps in the GLA fleet’s program EZY need to fill. GLASOU will never be a core route for EZY.

If they are filling planes then why stop?

[willy wombat]

Surely it’s good news for SOU. Loganair offer high frequency high fares that suit the business person who wishes to travel there and back in a day and their employers are picking up the air fare. 49 seats on a E145 is probably 80% filled by business users as the leisure traveller is just unwilling to pay the huge ticket costs. EZY with its limited frequencies will be used primarily by friends and family being flexible with dates and times, thus both airlines have their niche and will operate side by side. My thoughts although maybe wrong!
Not so much maybe wrong as definitely wrong.

[Albert Hall]

If you look at what they do on GLA/BHX in the winter, it's absolutely dire - nothing that could be classed as a workable schedule for business travel or commuters. If SOU/GLA ends up the same in the long run then it will just switch off a load of business travel from SOU.