TUI airways-2
IMHO, the IT/Charter business model hasn't really evolved sufficiently since it's heyday in the 1970s in order to cope with the current demand for airspace capacity. Having a large number of assets all flying the same route from the UK regions within a couple of hours of each other on change over day hardly helps with flow management.
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Vokes55
In fairness to JonnyH, such statistics are not readily published for public viewing. Unless he has inside knowledge and access to that data, in any case he's unlikely to want to share it here. Likewise taking a few sample flights from one day that we know had wider network issues is hardly representative to your argument either.
It can't go unnoticed TUI have operational issues this summer with some of their third party operators. My biggest question is still how on earth they expect to deliver 1.1 million extra seats next summer. Will they be getting that many new aircraft and crew by then, or more reliance on third parties?
In fairness to JonnyH, such statistics are not readily published for public viewing. Unless he has inside knowledge and access to that data, in any case he's unlikely to want to share it here. Likewise taking a few sample flights from one day that we know had wider network issues is hardly representative to your argument either.
It can't go unnoticed TUI have operational issues this summer with some of their third party operators. My biggest question is still how on earth they expect to deliver 1.1 million extra seats next summer. Will they be getting that many new aircraft and crew by then, or more reliance on third parties?
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I’ve never denied there are issues, but this notion that they’re somehow worse than other airlines is pure fallacy based largely on emotive opinion with a sprinkling of anecdotal evidence.
My point is that all airlines have issues because all airlines share the same congested airspace and the same congested airports. They fly the same aircraft which suffer the same technical problems and face the same parts shortages. They’re bound by the same FTLs. You’ll see long delays with TUI because they delay instead of cancelling. They remain at the top of departure and arrival boards long after the cancelled flights have been wiped off. And for some reason, completely unbeknown to me, they seem to have a loyal following of spotters on pprune with nothing better to do than tracking the location of every single aircraft and posting here whenever one does something unexpected.
In the real world, away from the echo chambers of Twitter and Pprune, the number of delayed flights and dissatisfied customers is a tiny percentage of the total and certainly nowhere near last year. Probably something that can be said about all operators.
And yes, Jet2 have delays too. Plenty of them.
My point is that all airlines have issues because all airlines share the same congested airspace and the same congested airports. They fly the same aircraft which suffer the same technical problems and face the same parts shortages. They’re bound by the same FTLs. You’ll see long delays with TUI because they delay instead of cancelling. They remain at the top of departure and arrival boards long after the cancelled flights have been wiped off. And for some reason, completely unbeknown to me, they seem to have a loyal following of spotters on pprune with nothing better to do than tracking the location of every single aircraft and posting here whenever one does something unexpected.
In the real world, away from the echo chambers of Twitter and Pprune, the number of delayed flights and dissatisfied customers is a tiny percentage of the total and certainly nowhere near last year. Probably something that can be said about all operators.
And yes, Jet2 have delays too. Plenty of them.
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I’ve never denied there are issues, but this notion that they’re somehow worse than other airlines is pure fallacy based largely on emotive opinion with a sprinkling of anecdotal evidence.
My point is that all airlines have issues because all airlines share the same congested airspace and the same congested airports. They fly the same aircraft which suffer the same technical problems and face the same parts shortages. They’re bound by the same FTLs. You’ll see long delays with TUI because they delay instead of cancelling. They remain at the top of departure and arrival boards long after the cancelled flights have been wiped off. And for some reason, completely unbeknown to me, they seem to have a loyal following of spotters on pprune with nothing better to do than tracking the location of every single aircraft and posting here whenever one does something unexpected.
In the real world, away from the echo chambers of Twitter and Pprune, the number of delayed flights and dissatisfied customers is a tiny percentage of the total and certainly nowhere near last year. Probably something that can be said about all operators.
And yes, Jet2 have delays too. Plenty of them.
My point is that all airlines have issues because all airlines share the same congested airspace and the same congested airports. They fly the same aircraft which suffer the same technical problems and face the same parts shortages. They’re bound by the same FTLs. You’ll see long delays with TUI because they delay instead of cancelling. They remain at the top of departure and arrival boards long after the cancelled flights have been wiped off. And for some reason, completely unbeknown to me, they seem to have a loyal following of spotters on pprune with nothing better to do than tracking the location of every single aircraft and posting here whenever one does something unexpected.
In the real world, away from the echo chambers of Twitter and Pprune, the number of delayed flights and dissatisfied customers is a tiny percentage of the total and certainly nowhere near last year. Probably something that can be said about all operators.
And yes, Jet2 have delays too. Plenty of them.
The point is still valid, however, that they have got all of these plans for 2024 and beyond yet 2022 and the start of Summer 2023 have been shambolic and they’re suffering the same serious issues which do not seem to be improving and they do not have a resolution to these problems either clearly. Many of these issues are not being felt by their competitors and if they are, they’re not where near as bad as they are for TUI.
FWIW, irrelevant of cost, they should be keeping their two 767s in service after this summer.
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Anyone who has access to the Airport Community app and can see performance at (e.g.) Manchester can easily compare the two and see that even though Jet2 have their share of delays, they're consistently outperforming TUI in OTD terms.
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I also believe throughout my dealings with them they have a real strong customer service culture embedded, something I sadly believe Tui (not just the airline) have lost and it takes time to rebuild that culture.
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You’re using one airport. The one that fits your narrative. Here is multiple airports that aren’t even weather related in the last 24 hours.
ABZ - TFS flight delayed by 24 hours. Not weather related.
BFS - TFS flight delayed by 24 hours. Not weather related. DLM flight delayed (currently 5 hours). Not weather related.
NCL - AYT. Flight delayed by 15 hours. Not weather related.
LGW-PFO - not weather related. G-VYGK subbed in.
Add this to countless other delays over the month. Aberdeen, for example, is on time less than a third of the time. TUI had a 60% chance of delay last summer and I’d be surprised if it’s any lower this summer.
I’ll put some stats together in due course for this month overall.
As others have mentioned, there are issues with crew. Tech issues and no aircraft or crew to move around.
ABZ - TFS flight delayed by 24 hours. Not weather related.
BFS - TFS flight delayed by 24 hours. Not weather related. DLM flight delayed (currently 5 hours). Not weather related.
NCL - AYT. Flight delayed by 15 hours. Not weather related.
LGW-PFO - not weather related. G-VYGK subbed in.
Add this to countless other delays over the month. Aberdeen, for example, is on time less than a third of the time. TUI had a 60% chance of delay last summer and I’d be surprised if it’s any lower this summer.
I’ll put some stats together in due course for this month overall.
As others have mentioned, there are issues with crew. Tech issues and no aircraft or crew to move around.
...Today at Manchester: Tui OTD 35%, Jet2 38% - such a massive difference!!
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My preference will always be British Airways and I've had cancelled flights with them but I still remain loyal to the airline. But if there is a far cheaper flight I will always take that option first regardless of previous issues with that said airline.
Once a year traveller's are always the hardest to please and in the majority of cases the hardest to deal with 😉
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Despite my username I have no connection to Tui - I have flown three times this Summer, twice with Jet2 and once with Tui (sadly with the experience of a shed of a Sunwing a/c interior). My Tui flight was delayed 90 mins (no big deal). I will frankly now always pick Jet2 over Tui as my confidence in them handling things right when things go wrong is because of the sheer number of their own people they have at U.K. airports.
I also believe throughout my dealings with them they have a real strong customer service culture embedded, something I sadly believe Tui (not just the airline) have lost and it takes time to rebuild that culture.
I also believe throughout my dealings with them they have a real strong customer service culture embedded, something I sadly believe Tui (not just the airline) have lost and it takes time to rebuild that culture.
Basic to the extreme! Back to Jet2!
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Reports of broken seats and wall panels, overhead bins broken and to top it off 15-20 passengers a flight not getting they’re pre- booked and paid for extra space seats . Also hear from staff crew late at turning up causing delays. The only good thing is Tui are doing the ramp maintenance for them to keep them airworthy.
Yet Tui seem quite happy to keep using these 3rd party airlines even more strange when Tui have their own 738s sitting on the apron serviceable but not in use