MANCHESTER - 8
I think one or two of you are mistaking me for saying that Manchester has nothing going for it. It does, in fact it has a hell of a lot that is why I said I am proud of the City. However, whilst i truly believe it is on a par with Barcelona, Milan and Munich, it certainly isn't on a par with a City such as London or New York which i regard as powerhouses. By the way I don't particularly like London.
Wanna be there is correct in asking what do we regard as a power house. In my opinion a power house is something that differenciates a City, something that the City is renowned for in economic terms and not stadia, arena's and such which many other Cities around the world also has.
Wanna be there is correct in asking what do we regard as a power house. In my opinion a power house is something that differenciates a City, something that the City is renowned for in economic terms and not stadia, arena's and such which many other Cities around the world also has.
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Captain America was filmed for a month on Dale Street in Manchester and finished last week, I know some was filmed in Liverpool but Manchester Northern 1/4 was chosen for it`s lookalike streets to parts of New York in 1940`s
Captain America Filming in Manchester|Blog about the Filming of Captain America Movie in Manchester's Northern Quarter well worth a look, a bit off track but
what the hell!
Ian B
Captain America Filming in Manchester|Blog about the Filming of Captain America Movie in Manchester's Northern Quarter well worth a look, a bit off track but
what the hell!
Ian B
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Aaaanyway,
1)I see the 'united' continental B757 has been in today. Is this the first UK visit, or even more so, the first european outing since the conversion to the new airline?
2) Ive read elsewhere that DL may send to A330 on the ATL-MAN run next year. This is partly because loads/cargo have picked up, and some B767-400's moving to JFK and A330's moving to ATL.
3) It is long rumoured CX will come to MAN, and again Ive read that CX is about to add 4 weekly HKG-XXX-CDG and return flights on the A343. Some say DME, some say FCO. But given DME is already an open route, FCO being off the great circle route and we were so close to having a HKG-DME-MAN on an A343, could MAN be the intermidiate stop?
I dont know about yields, but there are certainly enough pax heading off that way. (the CAA last counted 138000 pax heading MAN-LHR-HKG per anum)
1)I see the 'united' continental B757 has been in today. Is this the first UK visit, or even more so, the first european outing since the conversion to the new airline?
2) Ive read elsewhere that DL may send to A330 on the ATL-MAN run next year. This is partly because loads/cargo have picked up, and some B767-400's moving to JFK and A330's moving to ATL.
3) It is long rumoured CX will come to MAN, and again Ive read that CX is about to add 4 weekly HKG-XXX-CDG and return flights on the A343. Some say DME, some say FCO. But given DME is already an open route, FCO being off the great circle route and we were so close to having a HKG-DME-MAN on an A343, could MAN be the intermidiate stop?
I dont know about yields, but there are certainly enough pax heading off that way. (the CAA last counted 138000 pax heading MAN-LHR-HKG per anum)
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nope, no, never, not at all!
Spanners, what are you saying no to? A CX route to MAN, MAN being an intermediate stop or a HKG-DME-MAN routing as you highlighted that bit of my text too.
With regards to the HKG-DME-MAN route I posted, I agree that one will never happen again as DME is well established now and very unlikely to be split again, I was commenting on the fact they announced and put it up for sale before it was cancelled due to govt permission not being granted not so long ago (2007-8??).
Spanners, what are you saying no to? A CX route to MAN, MAN being an intermediate stop or a HKG-DME-MAN routing as you highlighted that bit of my text too.
With regards to the HKG-DME-MAN route I posted, I agree that one will never happen again as DME is well established now and very unlikely to be split again, I was commenting on the fact they announced and put it up for sale before it was cancelled due to govt permission not being granted not so long ago (2007-8??).
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of the 138K that travelled MAN-LHR-HKG a good percentage flew CX, CX will not jeopardise services out of LHR no matter what. 
So do not expect a CX pax service out of MAN in the near/medium term.
So do not expect a CX pax service out of MAN in the near/medium term.
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The Sheeple will follow us to LHR ...
If Cathay don't want to "jeopardise" LHR services that is their own commercial choice to make. But I used CX on a number of occasions when they operated MAN-originating services. However, I avoid LHR like the plague, as do many experienced travelers from the regions. Now I use EMIRATES FROM MAN via DXB for HKG. Not everybody will slavishly follow an airline to the inconvenient hub of their choosing. I will choose my own preferred route to HKG, thanks very much Mr Cathay - and LHR ain't it!
If CX stick to LHR only they will keep the mugs who know no better and some desperate bargain-basement fare hunters. However, they forfeit the savvy travelers who are familiar with the attractive alternatives from MAN (including many high yield frequent fliers). The best way to protect your market is to provide a service which customers consider the most attractive available. Changing at LHR (even when your Shuttle isn't cancelled) doesn't score well.
If CX stick to LHR only they will keep the mugs who know no better and some desperate bargain-basement fare hunters. However, they forfeit the savvy travelers who are familiar with the attractive alternatives from MAN (including many high yield frequent fliers). The best way to protect your market is to provide a service which customers consider the most attractive available. Changing at LHR (even when your Shuttle isn't cancelled) doesn't score well.
Last edited by Shed-on-a-Pole; 15th Oct 2010 at 11:22. Reason: line added
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If CX stick to LHR only they will keep the mugs who know no better and some desperate bargain-basement fare hunters. However, they forfeit the savvy travelers who are familiar with the attractive alternatives from MAN
That Cathay have sunk a small fortune in building a OneWorld hub with their partners QANTAS and BA at T3. That millions are being spent providing world class lounge facilities for premium travellers and that a decision must be made on how best to get a return on that investment. T3 is an old building of course but over time the whole airfield is being rebuilt from the ground up. T5 done, T2 on it's way and T3 being re-aligned once Pier 7 comes down. Now that's a fair bit of money going into the UK economy in troubled times. Just bear that in mind please.
tbh as much as I love MAN, a lot of supporters are L O C A L s in every sense of the word. Good grief this thread is unique on here reading more like Manchester's place in the world and less like what's going on at MAN which is what we're keen to read about and support. I also resent being addressed as a sheep, it's just a baad argument!
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 15th Oct 2010 at 14:06.
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Good grief this thread is unique on here reading more like Manchester's place in the world and less like what's going on at MAN which is what we're keen to read about and support.
Putting the relentless MAN vs LHR arguments aside, will we see a Chinese Gov reaction to the recent Taiwan agreement, whether that be Beijing and/or Hong Kong services? I do recall that we were on the CAAC expansion plans before the industry took a downturn.
Could the most recent rumour of a CX return actually be generated from an urgency from mainland China not to concede East Asia market share?
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Hi Skipness!
Good to spar with you again! May I politely point out that my posting does not call anybody a moron - that is your word. I can assure you that I do not "sneer" as I board Emirates or any other carrier, but I do thank the heavens that I don't have to endure a Heathrow transfer. I am delighted that CX and co are spending so much to improve LHR (it needs the investment) as I have friends who live in the South East and LHR is conveniently placed for them. So I hope they enjoy their improved airport experience.
As for being a L O C A L, I am the kind of local who has flown as a passenger on some 1400 flights covering around 400 airports in 80 or so countries, several of which are not mainstream names. So I guess I am just a "blinkered provincial" for wishing to avoid the dire OneLondon Alliance transfer procedure at LHR. But I accept that I am more than happy to be associated with the Manchester area, so I shall take the "local" tag as a great compliment. Everyone is local somewhere.
And by the way, MAN services support a "hell of a lot of jobs" in the UK too. Manchester is actually in the UK. Our tax pounds end up in the same pot as those earned at Heathrow. A customer is not unpatriotic in booking a convenient MAN departure over an inconvenient LHR one (cancelled Shuttles permitting). Do you seriously believe that we should put up with the LHR transfer process for the good of the UK economy?!!! Give us a break, please!
SHED.
P.S. Skipness - good to see that you edited out the word "moron" at 15:06!
Good to spar with you again! May I politely point out that my posting does not call anybody a moron - that is your word. I can assure you that I do not "sneer" as I board Emirates or any other carrier, but I do thank the heavens that I don't have to endure a Heathrow transfer. I am delighted that CX and co are spending so much to improve LHR (it needs the investment) as I have friends who live in the South East and LHR is conveniently placed for them. So I hope they enjoy their improved airport experience.
As for being a L O C A L, I am the kind of local who has flown as a passenger on some 1400 flights covering around 400 airports in 80 or so countries, several of which are not mainstream names. So I guess I am just a "blinkered provincial" for wishing to avoid the dire OneLondon Alliance transfer procedure at LHR. But I accept that I am more than happy to be associated with the Manchester area, so I shall take the "local" tag as a great compliment. Everyone is local somewhere.
And by the way, MAN services support a "hell of a lot of jobs" in the UK too. Manchester is actually in the UK. Our tax pounds end up in the same pot as those earned at Heathrow. A customer is not unpatriotic in booking a convenient MAN departure over an inconvenient LHR one (cancelled Shuttles permitting). Do you seriously believe that we should put up with the LHR transfer process for the good of the UK economy?!!! Give us a break, please!
SHED.
P.S. Skipness - good to see that you edited out the word "moron" at 15:06!
Last edited by Shed-on-a-Pole; 15th Oct 2010 at 14:44.
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Yes "mugs" and "sheeples" is complimentary towards people but "morons" is just baad. (did it again).
Can we move on please? What's happening with Viking Hellas? Are they going tango uniform?
Can we move on please? What's happening with Viking Hellas? Are they going tango uniform?
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"mugs" - sadly, not everybody in this world is deserving of compliments!
"sheeple" - a term used in my posting to illustrate the opinion of certain remote airline executives towards their customers (i.e. they will accept being herded through LHR). I went on to point out the error of that assumption. Well-informed customers will book the journey which best suits their own needs, not those of an airline executive with a flawed business plan and crossed fingers.
Perhaps as you say the point has been made now. And besides, I can't take any more baaaaad jokes!
SHED.
"sheeple" - a term used in my posting to illustrate the opinion of certain remote airline executives towards their customers (i.e. they will accept being herded through LHR). I went on to point out the error of that assumption. Well-informed customers will book the journey which best suits their own needs, not those of an airline executive with a flawed business plan and crossed fingers.
Perhaps as you say the point has been made now. And besides, I can't take any more baaaaad jokes!
SHED.
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Good grief man, you're actually saying that people who book with British based BMI and BA are too dumb to make an informed choice?
That's pretty condescending I think. If it was a case of once bitten twice shy then the Heathrow services of both carriers would have closed long ago as passengers flocked to worship in the aisles of other airlines.
That'll be BMI then? Though now under the wings of Lufthansa, we're seeing better things.
Is a Singapore B77W as far as Munich before getting chucked off again that much better if you're changing at Changi?
That's pretty condescending I think. If it was a case of once bitten twice shy then the Heathrow services of both carriers would have closed long ago as passengers flocked to worship in the aisles of other airlines.
not those of an airline executive with a flawed business plan and crossed fingers.
Is a Singapore B77W as far as Munich before getting chucked off again that much better if you're changing at Changi?
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Good Grief, Skipness! You're putting an awful lot of words into my mouth there! I think you'll find my postings don't say anything of the sort! Condescending comments? They might have been if I'd made them!
I use BMI myself on MAN-LHR. However, my destination on such occasions is LONDON. I gave up on the BA Shuttle after they cancelled on me once too often. "We suggest you make your way back home, Sir", they said. "I'm trying to," I replied, "I paid you to fly me there!"
I note also that there are destinations to which a LHR connection is the only practical option (HKG *not* being one of them). The MAN-LHR flights have a role to play servicing these.
Regarding some people who book MAN-LHR to connect onto routes which are better served by alternatives from MAN, I consider them "less well informed". You may call them "too dumb" if you wish, but I don't expect them to have an encyclopedic knowledge of world airline timetables so I'm a bit more forgiving. I am less forgiving towards certain professional travel agents who book unsuspecting passengers on these routes for reasons other than the customers' best interests. I refer to their victims as "mugs" - because they have effectively been mugged and usually don't even know it. However, I certainly won't criticize "unpatriotic" travelers who book a route which bypasses the hassles of LHR and represents the optimal routing for their own needs.
As for the business plans of BMI and Singapore Airlines, I never mentioned them. ("That'll be BMI then?" - errr, no!). If you wish to comment on them further, the discussion board is yours - man!
Cheers, SHED.
I use BMI myself on MAN-LHR. However, my destination on such occasions is LONDON. I gave up on the BA Shuttle after they cancelled on me once too often. "We suggest you make your way back home, Sir", they said. "I'm trying to," I replied, "I paid you to fly me there!"
I note also that there are destinations to which a LHR connection is the only practical option (HKG *not* being one of them). The MAN-LHR flights have a role to play servicing these.
Regarding some people who book MAN-LHR to connect onto routes which are better served by alternatives from MAN, I consider them "less well informed". You may call them "too dumb" if you wish, but I don't expect them to have an encyclopedic knowledge of world airline timetables so I'm a bit more forgiving. I am less forgiving towards certain professional travel agents who book unsuspecting passengers on these routes for reasons other than the customers' best interests. I refer to their victims as "mugs" - because they have effectively been mugged and usually don't even know it. However, I certainly won't criticize "unpatriotic" travelers who book a route which bypasses the hassles of LHR and represents the optimal routing for their own needs.
As for the business plans of BMI and Singapore Airlines, I never mentioned them. ("That'll be BMI then?" - errr, no!). If you wish to comment on them further, the discussion board is yours - man!
Cheers, SHED.
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Spannersatcx,
Whilst I understand you work for CX, how are you so sure CX wont open a MAN route in the medium term?
The transfer at LHR numbers have been hovering around 138000 for a couple of years now, and were no far off that when they 'launched' HKG-DME-MAN.
As more people become savvy to the fact there are more options than LHR, CX and oneworld will stat to loose pax through filtration.
As well as those travelling on BA/bmi to LHR, you have those going through DXB, AUH, DOH, FRA, AMS, CDG, ZRH and to a lesser extent SIN.
Another point to consider MAN has now been included in the UK/Taiwan agreement, and with a large amount of pax heading that way it could be another hole CX will bleed pax through.
Add to this oneworld carrier are now gaining ATI, it means there could be more pax travelling through LHR from the likes of ORD and other ports without a direct connection (I know ORD isnt the best example but just trying to illustrate a point).
Surely it would be better to run some of the extremly high Northern customers through MAN and save the LHR services for the south east and other connections.
Even if the pax are lower yielding, a 2 class service could work, and with such a large cargo operation im sure the belly can stem any losses?
Looking at it logically, Its not as crazy as you think.
Whilst I understand you work for CX, how are you so sure CX wont open a MAN route in the medium term?
The transfer at LHR numbers have been hovering around 138000 for a couple of years now, and were no far off that when they 'launched' HKG-DME-MAN.
As more people become savvy to the fact there are more options than LHR, CX and oneworld will stat to loose pax through filtration.
As well as those travelling on BA/bmi to LHR, you have those going through DXB, AUH, DOH, FRA, AMS, CDG, ZRH and to a lesser extent SIN.
Another point to consider MAN has now been included in the UK/Taiwan agreement, and with a large amount of pax heading that way it could be another hole CX will bleed pax through.
Add to this oneworld carrier are now gaining ATI, it means there could be more pax travelling through LHR from the likes of ORD and other ports without a direct connection (I know ORD isnt the best example but just trying to illustrate a point).
Surely it would be better to run some of the extremly high Northern customers through MAN and save the LHR services for the south east and other connections.
Even if the pax are lower yielding, a 2 class service could work, and with such a large cargo operation im sure the belly can stem any losses?
Looking at it logically, Its not as crazy as you think.
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When I first read about the number of pax travelling via LHR to HKG I passed it on higher up the tree and that's the answer I was given.
MAN-SVO-HKG never happened for the reasons we know about, we used to code share with aeroflot, we don't now as we put our own a/c on the route and it got sent to DME instead.
The price of MAN-?-HKG was pitched far higher than MAN-LHR-HKG, so the savvy punters would of done that unless they preferred the convenience of travelling from MAN-?-HKG.
A lot of it is a cultural thing as well, CX being very snobbish and preffering to put a/c into capital/major cities (waits for the flak). The proverbial hit the fan when we pulled out of Zurich.
We were hoping for the 3 M's to be new routes, Milan, Moscow and MAN, but it was only the 2. Unless you count the Miami freighter service of course.
We wait with baited breath.
MAN-SVO-HKG never happened for the reasons we know about, we used to code share with aeroflot, we don't now as we put our own a/c on the route and it got sent to DME instead.
The price of MAN-?-HKG was pitched far higher than MAN-LHR-HKG, so the savvy punters would of done that unless they preferred the convenience of travelling from MAN-?-HKG.
A lot of it is a cultural thing as well, CX being very snobbish and preffering to put a/c into capital/major cities (waits for the flak). The proverbial hit the fan when we pulled out of Zurich.
We were hoping for the 3 M's to be new routes, Milan, Moscow and MAN, but it was only the 2. Unless you count the Miami freighter service of course.
We wait with baited breath.
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Betablockeruk....
You know where u get all the proper news and views on the other better forum.....Better leave Mr Skipness and his Snobby Cronies to this load of crap!!!!!!!
You know where u get all the proper news and views on the other better forum.....Better leave Mr Skipness and his Snobby Cronies to this load of crap!!!!!!!
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Emirates MAN-DXB
Since the introduction of a daily A380 on the 1st September, the passenger numbers increased from 48,173 in August to 48, 890 in September. That is an increase of 717 in the 30 day month which equates to an average daily increase of 4.87%.
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CX to MAN
MAN would be better served with a *A or Skyteam member. Oneworld/CX is poorly served in the Asia market. CA to PEK, MU to PVG or CZ to CAN offers some interesting opportunities.